# Newbie - What's a good locomotive these days



## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

Just getting back into trains. I had some HO and N gauge when I was younger back in the late 80's and early 90's, and now that I've got kids, I figured it's time to get them going again. 

Everyone tells me that locomotives have come a long ways since the 80's and that mine are barley worth having anymore compared to the new stuff, so my question is:

What's considered "the new stuff"? What's different, and how do I know that I'm getting one of the new and improved locomotives when I go to buy one? 

Thanks guys.


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## oldsarge218 (May 23, 2011)

The "new" stuff can be either DC or DCC type locomotives. DC of course run on the same power as your older locos do. The detail has improved dramatically over older locos, depending on how much you want to pay. The DCC type allows you to program a hand held controller to perform a variety of tasks, including sound features, operating switches, operating more than one loco on the same tracks, etc. Check out the DCC site on this forum; lots of good stuff to learn. Welcome to the forum, by the way. 

As far as what is a good locomotive, you will find a variety of answers to that. I have just gotten back into model railroading myself, and I have 3 locos currently, operate just DC, and have spent from $110.00 for one, to $45.00 for another, new. I have Walthers, both of the new ones. Older one is a Bachmann. If you can, go to a railroad club, or a hobby shop, and just talk to them about the differences. Also, you can expect a variety of recommendations from those on this forum. Have fun!


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

If you have a hobby shop nearby check with them. But, the easiest
research is to use Amazon and Ebay. See what is being offered and
at what prices. There are excellent locomotives made by almost
every brand, but there can be losers in their lines also. For the
most part, if you buy from a reputable dealer, be it brick and mortar
or on line you usually get a guarantee to back up the quality of
your purchase.

If possible, study up on (here on the Forum) DCC. It is the
difference in operating enjoyment and fiddling with too many
wires and switches. It is worth the extra $ and is easier
to install and use than your old DC. A good analogy would
be a old dial telephone vs your smart phone.

Don


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## ZebraCakez (Mar 26, 2011)

dagoof said:


> Just getting back into trains. I had some HO and N gauge when I was younger back in the late 80's and early 90's, and now that I've got kids, I figured it's time to get them going again.
> 
> Everyone tells me that locomotives have come a long ways since the 80's and that mine are barley worth having anymore compared to the new stuff, so my question is:
> 
> ...


That is a pretty serious question. The answer could take one many hours to fully research and grasp. The leaps in technology between now and the few decades ago you speak of have been pretty substantial. Furthermore, what one looks for in a locomotive these days is based largely in how one plans to operate it. 

Locomotives are available in three main varieties as far as operating systems: DC, DCC-ready, and DCC-equipped. DC is essentially the same operating system you used in the late 80's. Improvements in tech have been made, but it is in its essence the same as it always has been. Then there's DCC. 

Digital Command Control is the new age in railroading. It essentially assigns each locomotive its own "address" (basically a call number). You then have the ability to give each and every locomotive its own operating commands regardless of its position or that of any other loco. You can make any train do whatever you want it to. You can also take advantage of every single function a loco has, such as numerous lighting and sound capabilities. I strongly suggest you look into DCC if you want to take trains serious at all, it is amazing some of the things you can do. You don't have to go high end for a system, shop around and look. I suggest staying away from the Bachmann systems. I prefer the NCE Powercab for a starter system.

DCC-equipped locos have DCC decoders built into them from the factory, DCC-ready locos come without decoders in them, but a decoder can be added by simply popping off the body and essentially plugging it in. Most DCC locos will run on DC if you really want them to, but non-DCC locos will not run on a DCC layout. Conventional DC locos can sometimes be converted over to DCC, but this can be a hassle depending on the type of locomotive.

Confused yet?

Then there's sound. This is totally personal preference, but I kinda think that for most people its a case of embracing sound systems and never looking back. A good sound system adds more to the experience then I could ever explain, and I personally think that non-sound trains are lacking now, somewhat boring you could say. The catalog of sounds built into some of the better sound systems will really blow an onlookers mind. A good sound system on DCC puts you right in the engineers seat in the cab. Watch some YouTube videos to get a feel for it if you can't get to a real shop or show. Broadway Limited Imports puts out some of my favorite promotional vids of their beautiful locomotives, and there are some great YouTube producers who put out good reviews.

Your going to be blown away when you see some of the visual details that come on some of todays trains. Things that just were not possible in plastic twenty years ago are the norm these days. And the painting/printing you see is equally as amazing (lettering so small it can only really be read under a magnifying glass). 

Modern lighting can be completely prototypical , and very bright. Good thing, as you'll need it if you turn on one of the modern fan-driven smoke units you find in today better steam locomotives.

These are just a few of the things that pop into my mind when I read your initial post, there are all kinds of things I haven't even mentioned. The best thing you can do in the beginning is just wait. Wait and learn. Don't buy until you know what your buying. Learn what you want and like, what you want your train to do, and what you need to get to that point. Don't rush into building a layout. You can't build a good layout that will hold your interest until you know what you like in a layout. Get to a train shop and spend an afternoon checking out everything you can.

Ask questions, do as much research as you can stand, pound that "search" button till your finger is red, and take it all in. Your here on the forum, so you've already gotten off to a good start (the people on here are great and full of experience).

Your late 80's Tyco trains are going to seem like sticks and rocks on the moon the first time you ever see a BLI Paragon2 steamer run in person.


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

Thanks guys. 

Unfortunately, the only hobby shop in my area doesn't seem to care about model trains. They only have a few things back in one corner, and they don't know much of anything. 

I'd like to get a new locomotive that doesn't have to be turned up to 100 to get moving and doesn't sound like a grinding, rubbing mess when it does move, but I don't know how to tell that the stuff I look at online is any different than the crap that I've already got. 

Prices seem to range from $30 all the way to $400 or more, but I don't know how to tell the difference, and I hate the idea of buying the more expensive options based just on an assumption that it's better cuz it costs more. 

I don't think I need to get into DCC to get a good locomotive, but the online stuff mentions "five pole motors", "roller bearings", "skew-wound motors", "dual flywheels", "armature motors", and "multi-link drivetrain". I have no way of knowing which of these things I should be looking for, or even if these features are any different from what I've already got. 

Guess I'll have to keep researching. Any help would be appreciated.


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## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

Athearn Blue Box locomotives are good runners and pullers. They do vary in price, especially on Fee Pay. They can be brought back to life with simple adjustments.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

The most certain way of getting a smooth, walking down the
track, slow speed from a loco is with DCC. Even my much
maligned Bachmann decoders let me run my locos so slow 
that you can see vertical
motion in the wheels when they go over gaps in turnout frogs.

Then, if you get the more advanced DCC systems you can
fine tune them to whatever reaction you want.

I would recommend that you look into buying a used DCC 
set up to get started if money is critical. You would pay
less than what new DC gear would be. You can find such
here on the Forum, on Ebay and especially on Craigslist. (Collectibles or
Toys and Games).

It's unfortunate that your local hobby shop has lost interest
in trains. It does make your job more difficult since you'll
be shopping on line. Our guys on the Forum can be of
help with this. Main thing is for you to decide the scale,
and whether you'll go DCC or only DC and let us know.

Don


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

dagoof said:


> Thanks guys.
> 
> Unfortunately, the only hobby shop in my area doesn't seem to care about model trains. They only have a few things back in one corner, and they don't know much of anything.
> 
> ...


I've had good luck with the Walthers Proto series (Proto1000, Proto2000) Very quiet runners and can be had brand new for arond $50.

The Trainline series don't run as well.

I still keep my older stuff around for the kids to "play" with as accidents will happen (something will get dumped on the floor)

http://www.trainworldonline.com/search.php?bymanufacturer=1294&checkbox[]=119&bycategory=89&x=29&y=2


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## DavefromMD (Jul 25, 2013)

I'm a budget DC railroader - that's where I am in the hobby because I had a lot of stuff from when I was growing up.

I second Athearn Blue Box locos. I run DC and have several. They run well and last forever. They have flywheels that allow them to drift upon stopping with just a standard DC power pack. No immediate stop when you turn off the power. Many are available on ebay. Expect to pay $30 to $40.

A good inexpensive new locomotive is the Walters Trainline. They have flywheels to keep them running smooth on a sectional track layout, but they don't drift when stopped. They stop dead like a non flywheel loco. Older Walters Trainline (from the 90s) do drift when they stop.

You can get DC power packs that have momentum and braking built into the power pack that will give you more realistic slow starts and stops with any locomotive. My advice is to get a good power pack - MRC and Tech are two that come to mind that won't break the budget.

I was in the same position as you years ago. Had trains growing up. Sat stored until I had kids, then got into it again using what I had. 

If you want to get an idea of what is available and prices, go to modeltrainstuff.com and look around. They have the largest selection and the best prices on the web. Their brick and morter store is MB Klein located in Baltimore, Md. They have very knowledgable staff and maybe they would be willing to answer your questions on the phone.

One thing I did discover is that steel wheels greatly improve car performance in both rolling and staying on the track. I upgraded my old Athearn cars to steel wheels. I bought some new cars - Bachmann Silver series and Atlas Trainman are good quality inexpensive cars.

I'm guessing your existing cars have horn hook couplers. New cars will have knuckle couplers. A cheap way around that problem until you convert or get rid of the older cars is create a conversion car for each train - a horn hook on one end, knuckle on the other. Converting some older cars like Athearn is easy - just replace the horn hook with any type knuckle. To convert Lifelike cars the easiest way is to get Lifelike knuckle couplers which are made to replace horn hooks on their cars. Others like Tyco are not so easy. The couplers are fastened with rivets. The untimate in complexity is cutting off the truck mounted couplers and converting to body mounted couplers using Kadee coupler sets. If I were you, I wouldn't go there just yet - there are easier routes or where you are in the hobby right now.

Another thing I did to get newer stuff was to sell off my older stuff. My older stuff was from the 60s and 70s. I checked on ebay and on train forums to find out what was worth selling. I sold those items worth selling or for which there was a market and used that $ to upgrade to newer stuff.


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

My old locomotives from the 80's were Bachmann, and they're garbage now as far as I can tell. They're lurchy, and they sound so scratchy/gravely, that you wonder how they can even move. 

Is the newer Bachmann stuff any better, or are the tech improvements more due to new manufacturers?

I'd love to go all out and get DCC, but at this point, I'm gonna be working with a limited budget for starters.


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## fluff (Dec 22, 2013)

sstlaure said:


> I've had good luck with the Walthers Proto series (Proto1000, Proto2000) Very quiet runners and can be had brand new for arond $50.
> 
> The Trainline series don't run as well.
> 
> ...


same here. I bought 2 santa fe f3's in the 1000 series and they run nice and quiet. these are dc engines and run great together. got them on fee bay, $15.00 and change for one, and $28.00 for the other one. no complaints......


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## oldsarge218 (May 23, 2011)

dagoof said:


> My old locomotives from the 80's were Bachmann, and they're garbage now as far as I can tell. They're lurchy, and they sound so scratchy/gravely, that you wonder how they can even move.
> 
> Is the newer Bachmann stuff any better, or are the tech improvements more due to new manufacturers?
> 
> I'd love to go all out and get DCC, but at this point, I'm gonna be working with a limited budget for starters.


Before you condemn your older loco's to the scrap pile, oil and grease them. You can find examples of how to oil and lube on You Tube. Basically, you want to oil the drive shafts on the motor, and grease the gears. It will make a really big difference. 
You will get many different suggestions as to what type of oil and grease to use. I personally use a light oil, and a grease purchased from a hobby store. (both recommended for locos)
I also put a small amount of grease on the ends of the axels on all my rolling stock.

Hope this helps. Also, there are posts on this forum regarding lubrication, how to, etc.

God Bless
Bob


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

Are you sure it's worth keeping?

I took it apart, and am not impressed. Looks like cheap junk to me.










https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-.../24IR1ij4_ek/w545-h307-no/WP_20140101_003.jpg


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

Not sure what to think of the two N-gauge Locos that I have.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-.../W3fUf29J_Pc/w545-h307-no/WP_20140101_004.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/ydMfszziG7jVFRSOeOWZxk-b10xNR_7ITFt4vOR9nNo=w545-h307-no


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## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

The HO Bachmann is the cheap stuff. The N scale life like should be all wheel drive. Bachmann Steamers can be hit or miss, unless it's a Spectrum.


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

rrgrassi said:


> The HO Bachmann is the cheap stuff. The N scale life like should be all wheel drive. Bachmann Steamers can be hit or miss, unless it's a Spectrum.


Thanks.

That's kind of what I was thinking.

BTW, 
Why is it so hard to find good Steam Locos?


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## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

dagoof said:


> Thanks.
> 
> That's kind of what I was thinking.
> 
> ...


I have no trouble finding them...it's the affording them I have problems with.

Although, I did pick up a Mantua UP 4-6-2 Pacific for $35 on Fee Pay. It needs motor work though. I'm thinking about remotoring it.

The cheap Bachmann stuff is good for training kids to be careful. If they do destroy it, it's not a big loss.


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## trains galore (Jul 22, 2013)

I have found the recent Bachmann stuff is pretty good really, the expensive ones run very smoothly and the cheap ones are pretty good! Personally I love them but I know alot of modellers dislike/ avoid them though, so it's worth seeing for yourself, and definitely some of the older ones aren't that great. It's like any brand really, there are some great models and some not so great ones.
I have some very old hornby stuff and it doesn't work anymore so I can't comment on the quality of the recent models, although they look very detailed/ good runners.


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## ZebraCakez (Mar 26, 2011)

trains galore said:


> I have found the recent Bachmann stuff is pretty good really, the expensive ones run very smoothly and the cheap ones are pretty good!


One of my recent purchases is a Bachmann "SoundValue" 2-6-0 in B&M paint. Man, am I impressed with that Loco. For roughly $100 you get a pretty well made and well detailed steam loco that runs pretty darn smoothly and has sound (it's not a top of the line sound system, but still better then nothing). I believe the "SoundValue" locos are some of the better deals on the market right now.


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

DavefromMD said:


> .
> 
> I second Athearn Blue Box locos. I run DC and have several. They run well and last forever. They have flywheels that allow them to drift upon stopping with just a standard DC power pack. No immediate stop when you turn off the power. Many are available on ebay. Expect to pay $30 to $40.
> 
> .


I'm lusting over those blue boxes too, but I sure can't find any for $30.


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## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Most of my loco's are low priced but the last one I bought new was an Atlas that is now the best loco that I have. Runs smooth and quiet and it's great at slow speed no matter how dirty the track is. Pete


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## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Dagoof what is wrong with the locos that you already have? Looks like you have some good stuff there so why do you want to replace them? If they run they are good to keep. If you havn't used the equipment in a long time you need to clean the wheels on the locos with rubbing alcohol and a qtip and clean the track with a soft towel and the same alcohol. The more you run those trains the better they will perform. Pete


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## flywithcoop (Jul 29, 2012)

dagoof, I recommend you get a mini screwdriver set from home depot or sears and take your old locos apart to see what makes them tick. Possibly all you need is a drop or two of light 3 in 1 oil to make them run better. You have nothing to lose and you will learn how the old DC locos work. Just be observant and take pictures while disassemblung the loco if you are hesitant.


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## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

Cleaning and lubing locomotives it paramount to good, reliable running. Since the are mechanical things, they do need preventative maintenance. I have bought lots of locomotives and "non runners", mainly Athearn and Mantua's. All they needed was a good cleaning and lubing. The cheaper non runners actually needed motors replaced becuase they burned out. The main cause of the burnouts was dry gears or dirt and pet hair binding the motor, causing the overheating and burnt windings.


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## Locodub (Nov 18, 2013)

Most of my locomotives are what I call "set" quality, by Bachmann, Tyco or Life-Like. Only in the past few years have I purchased some higher quality units, but with regular maintenance, those older locos can be useful. My future plans include DCC, and those set locos will not be upgraded for use, but will be used to populate yards, or possibly a loco "graveyard". Higher quality units will lead the trains, the rest can be scenery. Everything can be useful.

Of course my plans may out-pace my abilities, but I'm just having fun planning.


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## THE TYCO MAN (Aug 23, 2011)

The new Bachmann's rock! In HO and in N! I like those along with Mantua, Athearn, Atlas, and Proto series.


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## Howard1975 (Jan 6, 2014)

Hello dagoof, I guess the most important question you can ask yourself is, do you like your older trains? Do they put a smile on your face? After all, this is a hobby, which we all enjoy for our own personal reasons. We can each enjoy this fine hobby, as we please. If you like your trains, there is no need to get sell them, or feel they are "junk" or "worthless" or whatever some people might claim. 

I personally don't care what some people might say, regarding my own equipment, as long as I enjoy my trains. Even if it's a Tyco from the 1970's, or a 3 rail Lionel train, or even playing with the wooden trains (Brio) my two little nieces have. For me, they are all fun in their own way. I care more about it's value for money, reliability, how easy to fix, etc. I've bought locomotives that were over 50 years old, and sometimes all it needs to run well, is proper maintenance and lubrication. 

I don't really care about the brand name recognition, or if it's the most highly detailed, or the greatest and latest, or if it's worth a lot of money and collectible, or most technically advanced, etc. I just want to have fun. I know what I like, and what I don't like. But either way, as long as I'm enjoying myself, that's good enough for me. 

My advice is, Just clean them up and perform whatever maintenance they need to run better. Clean out any gunk, dried out lubrication, cat hair, carpet fuzz, etc from the mechanism. Clean all the wheels on the locomotive, and clean the track. Then make sure the motor is working (not burned out), and the all the gears are in good condition (not cracked). Then add a very small amount of fresh lubrication (grease or oil) as appropriate. Hopefully it will work to your satisfaction now. 

Even if you later decide to sell those trains, any experience you gain from doing maintenance on what you already have, is good to learn. That experience can help you in the future.


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

Well, 

I guess I should update. 

I went to ebay and rounded up a few used locos so that I could see what I've been missing. The results were a mixed bag. 

I ended up with a non responsive N-scale Bachman that looks too big and also an N-scale spectrum that needs repairs, but I also got a couple diamonds in the rough. 

I got a cool little N-scale 4-4-0 American that runs, and a got a Atlas G-40 for 25 bucks that's runs great and looks new. What a difference from my older locos! The Atlas isn't silent, but it runs so smooth and strong and it coasts after you stop. 

I also picked up an HO scale Union Pacific SD70. The seller didn't know the brand and was unclear about it being DCC ready. I couldn't seem to get any signs of life at home, and I was afraid that I had wasted $50, so I looked up the local RR club and took it down to them last night. Turns out it has a decoder, and it runs well. We think it may even have sound, but we're going to have to figure out what's in it for sure and check the programing. Score!


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## Fackler Rebel (Oct 26, 2013)

I have a pretty good load, weight wise, behind my Sante Fe Alco F3, and the growling noise it makes as it gets the load moving reminds me of those big diesel engines I remember from my youth. Has that dumb switch on the cab and doesn't blow horns either, but I get a kick out of it. 

Reb


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## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Dagoof you did well with your purchases. Yo can buy three used locos for the price of one new one at $50 each and the ones that arn't running can be used for parts or maybe you can figure out what they need to get them running. My rule of thumb on repairing used locos is if it costs more than twice what I paid for it it goes into the parts pile. Also when your buying on ebay click the button for "lowest price first". I often find items for half or less than the same item in another listing.
Once you get going with your RR then treat yourself to a new item for a special occassion every once in awhile. Good luck and Happy Railroading. Pete


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## dagoof (Dec 29, 2013)

Now, my only problem is that I've got to come up with a DCC controller so that I can run my new loco. 

Anyone have a good suggestion for a cheap, simple DCC system that I should look at?


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