# Aluminium Track, Have we being mislead ???



## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

Around 10 years ago I started making inquiries about a train in the garden. Lots of info available, but down under brass or stainless steel track was far too expensive so had to find an alternative.
Aluminium seemed to be the only suitable alternative so started asking questions. All the advice I got was it would'nt work, expansion too great, too much maintenance etc, etc . But, on a beer income couldnt afford the champaign rails so I tried it. It worked and most of the advice I got why I should not use it was completely wrong. Its cheap, no problem with conductivity, and it does not need all the extra cleaning. ( once every 3 months a very light sand).Now, with part of a wire brush under a cleener wagon I dont even have to sand it anymore.
Anyway, I then found out that a fellow modeller in Sydney, Australia had done it more or less simular to my efforts.
Why am I saying all this you ask, well, with all the negatives I heard its amazing that because of the high cost of copper etc one large model rail supplier is now, or going to, produce new rail in guess what? , yep, aluminium..
Sure it may be better shaped than mine but lets face it, its still aluminium. The stuff so many said would not work...Theres a comment that says it will have a special coating, why, it works perfectly without it.
Its only if you live next door to the salt water will you have problems.
I just hope that some starting up were not put off by the high costs of brass or stailess rail and didnt try aluminium because of the negative comments.

So, if your just starting with your g scale, or even O gauge train in the garden and cant afford the top ready made track and are prepared for a little hard graft, dont be put off by all the negative comments, I suppose mainly by people that have not actually tried it.
Dont get me wrong, I dont intend to put the doubters down but I feel that many have accepted the bad hype from the past, which in the main seems to be unfounded, without actually finding out for themselves. 

The proofs in the pudding , have a look at www.gscaletrains.net.nz.
For something that so many said would not work, watch the short video, look at the picture galleries.
Sure, its more for the rustic look which may not be what you want , but it works.
Tony.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I am glad it worked out for you.
I know nothing about building and maintaining a garden layout.

Do you get much rain? snow? 
Where do you keep the trains out there? 
Do they all have houses to be parked in?
Or do you bring them in when your not running them?

In your a couple pictures it shows a lot of wires why don't you hide them?

When you said look at the video did you mean on the tracks page?

All in all it looks great!:thumbsup:
I wish I had the time and energy to make one.

How do you keep the weeds and plants from over taking your layout?

If I had a garden layout right now it would be buried under 50" of snow.

Great site you got for info on garden trains, I booked marked it.
Thanks for posting.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

Glad to hear it seems to work. Much of the nay saying may come from genuine concerns after the aluminum house wiring fiasco of the 1970s here in America. It wasn't pretty and still haunts us in the trades 40 years later.

From Faqs.org...

_The main problem with aluminum wiring is a phenomenon known as
"cold creep". When aluminum wiring warms up, it expands. When
it cools down, it contracts. Unlike copper, when aluminum goes
through a number of warm/cool cycles it loses a bit of tightness each
time. To make the problem worse, aluminum oxidises, or corrodes
when in contact with certain types of metal, so the resistance
of the connection goes up. Which causes it to heat up and corrode/
oxidize still more. Eventually the wire may start getting very hot,
melt the insulation or fixture it's attached to, and possibly even
cause a fire._


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

To all so far, thanks for the comments, suggestions and brickbats,
to answer some of the questions :
-Rain where I am , yes , plenty of it, mainly on the weekends.
- Snow, once a couple of years ago ( about an inch) - but not normally, only on the hilltops in the middle of winter.
- Where do the trains sleep - Refer the photo gallery on the track page, www.gscaletrains.net.nz 
( place the curser at the top of the photos for description.)
Briefly for the summer the trains are contained in the 20ft long twin tracked train shed . Simply drive the trains in and then back them out when needed. Only take them inside during the winter. Mainly to repair any damage, touch up etc.
- Lots of wires showing, their crafty creatures. They start off hidden but somehow they all creep out for a look. When the weeds get too much I do the weeding again and they get covered, pushed back under again. I will have to be assertive with them. Also, I do bury them but then make another model with something moving, so up they come again so I can use them tap into to get the currant. When I laid the track I used a multi core ( 50 pair) ex telephone cable alongside the track so it has plenty of spare wires. ( taken the hint, hide them, especially the red ones )
- The video of the train running is on the Models page . 
- Weeds , plants etc, that's part of garden railways. Tried weed mat but that was a silly idea as the runners of the weeds go for some distances under the weed mat and pop up down the track. Tried spray but the plants didn't like it, tried to encourage my better half by pointing out the therapeutic benefits of weeding but that is not working either, so its down on the benders for around half an hour each other week. The worst problem is birds and them pecking away at the subsoil for worms and bugs, eating the wild strawberries and disturbing leaves and bark. Still, again birds, bugs and weeds are the "joy" of a railway in the garden.

Other comments from others relate to expansion, corrosion, even fires caused by aluminium . Sure, everything in its place but I firmly believe the negatives have been exaggerated and have put people off. I am 25 km from the sea and no signs of corrosion from salt sea water air. In fact many houses in NZ are right on the seafront and have aluminium joinery. It does get a coating from the salt water in the air but doesn't exactly fall to bits. Wash off once or twice a year and should last a lifetime. ( and that's only a couple of mm thick. For it to completely corrode the aluminium I use for rails , like one suggests, it would take well over 30 to 40 years. If I am still around 'playing" with trains I will be very happy. 

I like the comment about many aluminium fittings are used in rigging or other fittings on boats, they even make dinghies out of the stuff, and they don’t exactly disintergrate when touching launched at the beech.

As far as "fires' go, rather rare. Refer to the Station masters page on the web site my wife has put together, nearly 42 years in the Fire Service, presently specialist fire/arson investigator so I believe have the expertise to assure you that fires in the aluminium tracks, or the electrical connections onto the track are not very likely. 
Most electrical fires, in domestic situations, are caused by things like worn out connections ( copper) in multi box's, but that's another topic.

The reason I have taken this tack is that for years many people have said it wont work, for numerous reasons and I believe many would have been put off by those comments. 
Some years ago my web page was put together to assist those, in the same position as myself ( cant afford to purchase the made up rail so make your own) No advertising on the web, solely at my expense to assist in helping others to partake in the hobby. But time and time again people have come back and said “they have researched on the forums and it wont work. Local person who has a loco, but no track as yet, but when offered that he could use my track to try his loco out said “no thanks, aluminium is too soft and it will damage his locos wheels.

Some of the reasoning for rubbishing the use of aluminium as track is unbelievable. It expands, so what, you allow for that. Its silver, paint it ( as long as you leave the top clear). Cant attach wires to it, try little nuts and bolts. It corrodes quickly, yeah right. 
Most reasons are completely unfounded. 
Other people have done the same as myself, and posted comments long ago, but they also gave up posting comments due to the constant negative feedback.

Well, the last straw is because of costs of brass, copper, stainless steel has skyrocketed all of a sudden a major track making firm is touting aluminuim G scale track like its the best thing since sliced bread. Seams the economic situation has made all the adverse facts disappear!

Up till now really had no firm evidence that "my way" actually worked but with my long suffering wife, Bev, putting together the web page people can now see it does work. Its been down now for 7 years, has not fallen apart, has not rotted away, has not been eaten and best of all trains actually move on it!.

Finally, as more proof, as we live in a wondrous world of marvels, and Google Earth, send me an email and I can forward you the co ordinates to see ( vaguely) my track from outer space. It used to be all you could see was the great wall of China, and Great Barrier reef, but now it includes outside railways.
This is on the basis you don't send a cruise missile to those co ordinates !!!!!
If you wish there’s provision to send an email at the base of some of the pages on my web site. www.gscaletrains.net.nz

In conclusion, it may not be to your liking, but if it makes the difference between someone have something they can enjoy or never doing it surely it should be encouraged, not put down.

To all those out there, like myself, that are willing to pass on the knowledge based on practicable advice and experience good on you, keep it up.

Keep on having fun, its only a hobby and it doesn’t have to have a brand name to be enjoyed.

Tony.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Gents,

I apologize for not scrutinizing every detail above, but I'm wondering if you know what specific aluminum alloy is being used in track?

All aluminums are far from equal ... lots of alloy options, each with its own benefits and shortcomings.

Thanks,

TJ


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

Tj
Wouldnt have a clue.
Its all in racks, pick it out, get sawn in half ( from 5 metre) lenghts, pay for ... dont ask or need any more specifications.
The bauxite is imported into New Zealand, The Aluminium smelter is at the base of the South Island because of the cheap hydro electric power generated from Lake Manapouri, from there is goes out in ingots to be processed to whatever the client wants. I understand they also roll out the aluminium at the mill to the specifications and thickness to what is asked for by NZ companies whether they be retailers or product manufacturers.
Perhaps the stuff we get here is purer than what you get, I have no idea. 
Tony 
I would guess that its the ingots that get smeltered down and mixed with other alloys by manufactures of the products.


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## tooter (Feb 26, 2010)

shaygetz said:


> Glad to hear it seems to work. Much of the nay saying may come from genuine concerns after the aluminum house wiring fiasco of the 1970s here in America. It wasn't pretty and still haunts us in the trades 40 years later.


That it does, shay...

From '65 to '68... 10 gauge solid aluminium wire was used for 20 amp 120 volt household branch circuit wiring because so much copper was being used in shell casings for the Vietnam War. Those houses had 5 times higher rate of electrical fires than copper wired homes, so the program was discontinued.

The weak points were the wire ends wherever they were wound around terminal screws on receptacles, switches, and some lighting fixtures. The fix was retrofitting copper wire jumpers to the screws, and connecting the copper to aluminium wires with wirenuts filled with ALOX, an aluminium oxide grease.


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

I lived in a sub division in AZ that all the homes in it they used a cheap low grade aluminum Buss bars in the main electrical panels. I worked for myself at the time as a re modeler and electrician. I went from house to house over a few years replacing allot of panels, Everyone of them was burnt caused by oxidation at the connection to the breakers. Several had burns in the box that should have caused a fire but they got lucky!
Back on to the train track side of this if corrosion becomes an issue you could use clear coat on Non train wheel to track contact surfaces of the rail. Any electrical connections should be coated with No-LOX or Al-ox to eliminate corrosion and to maintain good connections. Also avoiding any steel to aluminum contact will extend the life of the aluminum.


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

Perhaps its about time some got over what hapened 65-68. Most japenese made cars have alloy wiring from the battery terminals, , also many of the contacts off the loom are of alloy, and you dont see then catching fire every day.
Sure if you have a loose contact, regardless of what material it is there will be a resistance which may eventially result in failure, heat generated, but low voltage (12 to 18v, perhaps 3 amps) on an outside aluminium track is not going to cause a towering inferno.
Cab see the concerns if used for mains house wiring, but if you have the mythbusters program over there I think it would be fair to say that this objection to useing aluminium for G scale track is "busted"
Tony


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## tooter (Feb 26, 2010)

Kiwi said:


> Perhaps its about time some got over what hapened 65-68.


Can't do that, man... it's them post traumatic disorder 'nam flashbacks. 

Kiwi, your posts sound like borderline advertizing... 

...perhaps you should use the For Sale section. 

Greg


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

year right ! Counciling $$$$$$$ fixes everything.
From the comments "they used a cheap low grade alumminum Buss bars in the main electrical panels." I may suggest that it was not actually aluminium but more a alloy with various elements. 
It could be true "you get what you pay for"
Tony


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Aluminum is still used for wiring stuff like A/C, ovens, etc. When properly used and mated with compatible fixtures at either end, it works just fine. Check the lead-in from the power company to your house some day, you'll find aluminum wire, and for mine, that's a 400A feed!


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Nice Garden Railroad you got there.:thumbsup:
Maybe if I ever retire I will try to build a little one.
Garden RR's always intrigued to me.

Maybe the birds think the wires are a tasty worm?
And they keep trying to get a meal, that is why they keep coming up.

Darn squirrels and chipmunks would probably dig up my RR if I had one outside!


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## tooter (Feb 26, 2010)

Hey Kiwi, 

That's some clever handicrafting on your points... :thumbsup:

http://www.gscaletrains.net.nz/images/points1.jpg

Greg


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

Thanks, for anyone who wants to try building your own its not as difficult as it looks.

Tony


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## TulsaFlyer (Sep 21, 2009)

Tony,
It looks like you came up with the same idea as me.
This is exactly how I'm going to do my outside rails.....If I can ever get to it.
I'm thinking about going with radio control instead of powering the tracks though.


Jody


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

Is there any reason you cant have radio control AND use track power.
I have only seen one layout using battery and the loco sort of came off and started to hoe up the ballast. Must do wonders for anything with plastic gears. Mine, track power, once contact with the rails is lost would have stopped but this kept going. 
Reason I ask, is that with all the wrong information out there about excessive cleaning required etc, I have never had a problem but the biggest problem is debri on the line. In addition to the twigs, leaves dropping accross the line while the trains running its amazing what gets thrown up by peoples shoes when the walk close to the track. Your still going to have that, so what is the advantage in having track power ? 


Tony.


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Kiwi,
An easy trick to help keep your wires buried is to stake them down with stuff wire bent in a loop like a Croquet hoop only smaller or cheap tent stakes.


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## Kiwi (Jan 29, 2011)

Sean,
Thanks for that. Already eyed all the wire coathangers in the wardrobe. Problem is , its not my clothes on them.
Model railways can be dangerous and bad for your health!
Tony


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Tony,
How true, How true!


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## Stillakid (Jan 12, 2010)

Tony, here in the states, garden centers sell an item called, "Sod Staples"
They are what nimt.com was describing. The ones I use for our drip irrigation, have a rubber coating and have lasted for several years.

Regards,
Jim


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Jim,
Yea them those thingys!
Thanks, Could not remember what they where called!


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Kiwi said:


> Sean,
> Thanks for that. Already eyed all the wire coathangers in the wardrobe. Problem is , its not my clothes on them.
> Model railways can be dangerous and bad for your health!
> Tony


Coat hangers will rust away, fairly quick. 
Unless you have stainless steel coat hangers?


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