# The 360 Santa Fe



## T-Man

Don't know much about it. 1950 vintage with dual motors and a horn in the b unit. A reverse unit in the center. So let's take a look.

Rust on the frame and a dirty drum.




























Heat up the iron and remove some wire to get at the frame.










Time to take apart and lube.



















Paint up the frame.


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## x_doug_x

Nice so far.


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## tjcruiser

Hey, I recognize that. Recker's had a project-thread a while back on a AF loco of his that has that same helix armature design. Quite clever, actually, with a smoother power torque distribution throughout its rotation.

Here's that project thread from Reck ... an AF GP-7 ...

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=4785

TJ


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## T-Man

That's the beast!

His pictures put mine to shame. I need better lighting.

Now we know what it is, so IF you ever find one in a junk box for a buck, Get IT!

I cleaned the reverse mech today.










The horns needed attention so I went to epoxy.










Ready for rewiring/reattach the old wire.


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## tjcruiser

Nice job on the frame repaint ... bye-bye rust!


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## T-Man

*Electrical diagram*

For future reference the wire diagram scheme.

This motor has black, red for the coil and green, yellow for the brushes. Facing the connection for tthe engine center.










Facing directly across is black, red for the coil and yellow, green for the brushes. Each motor is isolated from the fram and has power from one rail. The solder point on top goes to the reverse unit to drive the motors.









For these to work as a pair the coils are aligned with the same connections and the brush connections are opposite.


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## T-Man

*Reverse unit connections*

First there is the black wire top left: a feed from a rail. One black wire does a cross connect: green dots. The black wire with red dots goes to the light bulb. The red circle is the red connectins to the motor. Lower left: is the green connections to the motors and the black wire goes to the other rail.












Here you see the two yellow connections to the motors and two black wire feeds (black dot)to the motor coils.










That's all the connections and both motors tested fine and traveled in the same direction and the reverse unit works too.

Assembly and rail test is next.


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## tjcruiser

T-Man,

I've never seen an AF e-unit like that in person. Can you describe a bit more on how it works? Is it a gravity-based solenoid plunger, like Lionel's e-units? If so, I can't quite make that out from your photos ... the photos show something that's more of a horizontal-gizmo design.

Just curious,

TJ


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## T-Man

I got the 322ac reverse mech. It has less wires. The side has a locking arm to prevent a plate from movement. The plate moves with the coil and there is a pawl attached to the plate. The drum teeth are on the side and not in the center as in a Lionel version.

Side and bottom view.









For drum finger there are two boards with two fingers each.
Top Front view opposite the arm and front view.









The white wire is a feed to the rear truck and the black is attached to the forward truck. The four finger contacts are for the coil and brushes.

Just twist the tabs to get the boards out and the whole thing would come apart.


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## tjcruiser

T,

Thanks for that ... clear pics, good description. So, gravity plunger, and "horizontal" config because of drum positioned off to the side.

Interesting, though, that AF gets away with only 2 x 2 fingers, whereas Lionel has 4 and 2 fingers. Hmmm... I gotta think about that one ...

Cheers,

TJ


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## T-Man

It can be confusing. I didn't draw out the diagram. Off hand I think the difference is the coil is isolated from the ground in the AF. The lionel has double fingers for one connection.

Good news the 360 did pass the track test. Just some body work and the truck sides are left.

On a second look the top to conections are for the reverse coil. The black goes to the forward truck and to the engine. The white goes to the back truck and supplies a center finger. This is also the second connection for the reverse coil.
To the right of the black is the red and under that is the yellow. and next to yellow is green. Green/yellow are
for the brushes and red is the return of black to feed the motor coil.


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## T-Man

*In fine working order*










Now for the B unit.

Kinda puzzled on what to do with the horn?


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## gunrunnerjohn

That horn looks a little "beat". Maybe time to install an electronic replacement?


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## tjcruiser

For what it's worth, I blew out the membrane in a stereo speaker during a bash in college years ago. Maybe 6" diameter, or so. A tare through the paper-like membrane cone.

Just for kicks, I tried glueing a few layers of tissue paper over the cracks to see what would happen. To my surprise, if fixed the speaker. Not perfect quality sound, but OK enough to keep me happy ... and the college professors _not_ so happy!

I realize you have a tiny, tiny speaker, but worth a shot, maybe?

TJ


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## gunrunnerjohn

Well, you could also simply replace the speaker, plenty of small round speakers available in almost any size imaginable.


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## T-Man

From what I can tell it vibrates, so Will a regular speaker work?
It may be time to go electronic, I also have to see what parts are availble too. A little glue/paper might be fun too!


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## gunrunnerjohn

I can't tell, but if it's not a traditional coil speaker, you probably can't use a regular speaker. That would seem to indicate you'd have to do what TJ suggested. 

One other route is there are folks that actually replace the cone in speakers, or you could take a stab at it yourself. Find a speaker of the same size and hack the cone out of it and replace this one.


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## Big Ed

Thanks for posting, I never saw the guts before.
Looks Alien, when your used to looking at Lionel.


I hope that this thread helped the S men some.:thumbsup:


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## Reckers

We S men need all the help we can get!


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## Big Ed

Reckers said:


> We S men need all the help we can get!



Remember when you were the only S man here?

It seems that you are back to being the only one here.

Active that is...but I been told that the S men have a full plate at this time of year. And have zero time for trains.

We just have to wait for their off season to hear from them again.hwell:


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## T-Man

big ed said:


> Thanks for posting, I never saw the guts before.
> Looks Alien, ...................:


I actually read it a few times before it sunk in. LOL :laugh:!

Thanks for the horn input. The center appears to be a glob of epoxy sitting on something that vibrates. No magnets. Duh! me I tested it with AC. 

I had to show it cause it is Alien to me. I am sure the Port Line Hobby guy can help me.

Correction: it does have a magnet and makes a little sound on DC.


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## Big Ed

T-Man said:


> I actually read it a few times before it sunk in. LOL :laugh:!
> 
> Thanks for the horn input. The center appears to be a glob of epoxy sitting on something that vibrates. No magnets. Duh! me I tested it with AC.
> 
> I had to show it cause it is Alien to me. I am sure the Port Line Hobby guy can help me.



Would it be possible to just peel off the broken diaphragm ( if that is what it is called) and glue in another?
I never worked on speakers, just a thought.

Yes when your used to seeing Lionel engines, those look strange to me.
But it is nice to see how they were made.
It is nice to see the guts.


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## gunrunnerjohn

Ed did you read my suggestion a few posts above? 



> One other route is there are folks that actually replace the cone in speakers, or you could take a stab at it yourself. _Find a speaker of the same size and hack the cone out of it and replace this one_.


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## Big Ed

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Ed did you read my suggestion a few posts above?


Is that what it is called a cone? Not a diaphragm.
I never screwed around with a busted speaker, I just bought new ones.


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## gunrunnerjohn

Yep, the speaker "cone" is the paper part. I've had several re-cone jobs on antique radios when I wanted to retain the original speaker. It's been about 20 years since I looked into it, so it might be a case of having to do it yourself nowadays.


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## T-Man

I know they have kits for cones. people are into saving their vintage speakers.


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## gunrunnerjohn

I'm guessing that's the first place to look...


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## T-Man

For now, I am working on the B unit trucks, the frame is painted. Port Line Hobby did have a horn listed. I am not sure if it is the right one.


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