# Lionel Pennsylvainia RS 11 9 volt battery



## ironman21 (Mar 5, 2013)

After some awsome help from the guys my RS 11 runs great. I do have one problem and that is the 9 volt battery does not last but maybe a day or so, anyone else esperience this? In addition, when I run the loco with my KW and use the whistle button the train does some pretty strange things, for example it may stop then start back up again, the horn will work even once the i heard what sounded like the conductor which I belive can only be activated through a TMCC system. Needless to say I only run on the CW 80 transformer or simply do not use the whistel button. I was at a train show and asked about this situtation and was told that the older KW could send out a dirty current of DC or there is a frequency issue. I am going to replace the battery and run on the CW and see if the battery last longer it could be that the KW shorts out battery. comments welcome

John


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Actually, the battery running down quickly is a symptom of a bad RailSounds board, that's something that's fairly rare, but I've seen it before. The battery should last almost it's shelf life, I have locomotives that have had the same battery for years. A bad RS board could also explain the random tower-com running conventional.


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## BigAl56 (Dec 14, 2011)

The battery is only there to provide shut-down sound after the power is turned off. I do not use batteries as I do not want the headache of keeping track of them.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Note that he's running conventional, so the battery is used for more than just shutdown sounds.


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## ironman21 (Mar 5, 2013)

The manual indicated that the battery was only for the shut down sequence and momentary loss of track power such as going over a switch. I do not experience any issues with the loco when running on the CW 80 watt power supply, only the KW and only when using the whistle button. I am going to pop in a fresh battery and run the loco exclusively with the CW and see if the battery life is affected and report my findings. Wish the would have made a hatch for the battery for esay access though but I am not complaining I love this engine


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Actually, for conventional mode, the battery will be in use for very slow speed running, as well as any reversals. For command, the batteries are not really necessary, and the description you quoted is for command operation.

I agree that ripping the engine or tender apart to replace the battery leaves something to be desired. FWIW, most Legacy diesels have a hatch that opens for the configuration switches, volume control, and battery replacement.


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## ironman21 (Mar 5, 2013)

That would explain a lot since I do run them very slow at times.


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## Big Mike (Dec 2, 2011)

I have had locos run batteries down very fast also,I even tried rechargeables,still no good ,so I just leave the batteries out, but I am running in command mode. ..............Mike


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Most of my locomotives don't have batteries, but a couple have them. As Mike says, I run in command and there's no real need for the batteries.

Even in conventional, the battery dying in a few days is abnormal.


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## ironman21 (Mar 5, 2013)

I plan on getting into the command control world in the future but for now since I am new to the sport I am looking to build inventory.


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## DieselGen (May 3, 2011)

Would it be possible to use a rechargeable 9v battery if you built an onboard charging system to recharge the battery every time you throttled up the transformer? A rectifier feeding a linear regulator such as an LM7809 set up in some sort of a charging circuit might work.

possible linear regulator - LM7809
http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=lm7809

button rectifier
http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=625-W06G-E4

typical schematic for a linear regulator serving as a charger
http://homemadecircuitsandschematic...3/how-to-make-simple-dc-to-dc-cell-phone.html

The filtering caps would be a few pennies. I have no idea what the curent limiting resistor would cost.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Well, it's clearly possible, though you may want something a bit more sophisticated than that as the charger. The folks that make the BCR actually have an optional module that charges it for Lionel locomotives. The advantage of the BCR is it never goes bad.


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## Big Mike (Dec 2, 2011)

So john,just using a BCR would not work,unless like in the MTH locos that have a way to charge it from the rails, or a charge port as the P-S2's have,right? ...............Mike


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

MTH PS/1 or PS/2 locomotives have a built-in charger for their batteries, that's why the BCR works in those. If you look at the price list on J and W Electronics the Product Pricing Link, they mention a Lionel charger. I believe the charger has to connect to track power internally and then it'll charge just like the MTH.


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## Big Mike (Dec 2, 2011)

now thats cool! :thumbsup: .............Mike


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Solves the problem of the battery ever going bad and leaking.


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## DieselGen (May 3, 2011)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> MTH PS/1 or PS/2 locomotives have a built-in charger for their batteries, that's why the BCR works in those. If you look at the price list on J and W Electronics the Product Pricing Link, they mention a Lionel charger. I believe the charger has to connect to track power internally and then it'll charge just like the MTH.


Wow, that's it. I bet that 9 volt thing is full of ultracaps.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Well, you don't have to bet, I've taken one apart. I actually roll my own, attached is a PDF about the process for both the 9V and 3V BCR clones. Here's some pictures and the complete document. For the 9V models, I encase them in heat-shrink when I'm done with the fabrication.

View attachment BCR Replacement.pdf


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## ironman21 (Mar 5, 2013)

Ok it has been 2 weeks since I put a new battery in the RS 11 and ran it using the CW 80, the battery just died as opposed to running on the ZW which only lasted a day or so. I have no clue why but in any case I have removed the battery and will not replace it as I do not want to continiously keep removing the shell, it is a recipe for disaster! I will live with the limited functions until I go for command and control/


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

I have very limited experience running RailSounds in conventional mode, so I don't know about battery life. I will say that I have some engines that have had a battery in them for several years, and the batteries are still alive. Obviously, there is little to no current draw when not powered, and very rarely does the battery get called on in command mode.

I can't believe that it's normal operation for the battery to die in a week or two running conventional, I'm sure I would have heard the howls of protest in various forums.


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