# Crossover blues...



## dsertdog56 (Oct 26, 2014)

Hey all!

I'm probably skewed here, but can I hard wire an Atlas crossover on my HO layout? Seems my poor 0-4-0 tank switcher gets stranded on the center frogs unless the engineer goes full throttle with a good start. Yes, it's old school DC.

Of course it's not prototypical and the Yardmaster has a stroke when it's done. The fitters have suggested whiskers like old slot cars, but that might break the budget. 
Suggestions to replace the old beast with one of those new fangled diesels lead to a near brawl in the meeting hall.

Any advice would be appreciated!


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

What switcher are you running? I have several older DC Riverrosi and Mantua switchers that do not have this issue. The key to what I found is to keep everything in top shape. The points need to be clean. Also the wheels clean and everything lubed so there is as little friction as possible in the drive-line. Make sure all of the wheels on your switcher are picking up power. If one is not it will stall. 

What number switch is it? I had #6 and above (mostly #8) prior to changing them out for Piko switches. I had noticed that on the switches the rivets did come loose over time. When this occurred the moving rail sometimes did not get proper power or caused derailments. To tighten the rivet I would take a nail set and tap it into the hole in the center of the rivet, careful not to make it to tight.


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## dsertdog56 (Oct 26, 2014)

Thanks for responding.

It's a Tyco (Mantua) switcher. Everything has been cleaned and shined.

I'm not having a switch/turnout issue. The issue is with an Atlas 25 degree crossover. The center frogs are either non powered or shorted by design. The engine stops dead center on them. I'm checking to see if anyone has powered these and what has to be modded, or if another company makes a powered crossover.

Your advice on the switches will be noted. I'll probably need to do that in the future. Thank you!


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Not familiar with the loco. But;

I trust that all four wheels are picking up power? 

If the loco has a tender install metal wheels and wipers
on it and run very fine flexible wires to the
loco to add to it's power pickup. 

Don


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

Desertdog: you're confusing people with your terminology here, as you're totally using the incorrect term. The term you're using actually means something specific which is completely different than what you're talking about, which is why proper terms are actually important.

A crossover is a pair of switches that allows a train or engine to cross over between two parallel tracks.

You're talking about a crossing, or diamond crossing (or just diamond - after the shape formed by the inside rails in the center of the crossing).

A 0-4-0 is a tiny engine, and such a short wheelbase is entirely sitting on the dead part(s) of the crossing. DC or DCC wouldn't make a difference here.

I don't have one of the Atlas pieces, so I don't know the exact construction there. I will assume that the corners of the frog are at least plastic and insulated; is there metal rail in between the corners? I would imagine that Atlas has internal jumpers to supply power to these sections, but if the problem is that your little engine is sitting so that all 4 wheels (or at least both wheels on one side) are sitting on the plastic parts of the crossing, there's not a thing you can do to the trackwork as it is. Your options would be to replace it with some custom trackwork with more metal in the frog area, upgrade the engine with some sort of additional pickup wipers (shouldn't actually be too expensive) or replace the engine with something a little bigger that won't sit entirely withing the dead spots.


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## dsertdog56 (Oct 26, 2014)

Pardon me folks, Atlas calls it a crossover, I'm merely repeating the term. It is the diamond thingy, or diamond crossing track which four turnouts could be joined to to make a crossover.
If that's the terminology, again, the center frogs on the are metal. I would guess on a one piece style crossover (which I haven't seen in about 3 decades) the center rails or frogs are powered or can be made so. I guess I'll consider some mods to the center. I was trying to determine if these center rails were one piece of rail bent to shape or 4 separate pieces molded into the unit.

Thanks for the corrections and replies.


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## alcoman (Nov 4, 2009)

An 0-4-0 tank gives you very few options for current collection. Short wheelbase and no tender. You could wire it to an idler car that is wired to pick up current, but that sort of defeats any reason to have the small switcher.

Do you have an ohmmeter? Check for connectivity between the metal parts of the diamond. If it used to work but doesn't work now then there may be a corrosion problem. You may want to try adding jumper wires to power the center of the diamond, just be careful not to create a short circuit.


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## dsertdog56 (Oct 26, 2014)

Thanks alcoman.

I'm guessing a lot of folks here have not dealt with this before. 

The inner track of the diamond shows conductivity with all the outer sections. This should be impossible...wouldn't this be a direct short? It seems Atlas designed and built it this way.

I'll probably get another piece and partially deconstruct it. Based on my current findings (no pun intended) it appears I'll need to section the center and add jumpers as you suggested.
Unless Peco/Pico or someone makes a properly built one.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Short steam loco's have tenders that add to the pickup. Modify a car to go with it. The other option is drilling through the plastic to add some exposed wires without causing a short.


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## dsertdog56 (Oct 26, 2014)

Just quick note here... I removed the diamond track from my layout. Ended up cutting two grooves with a dremel tool to separate the diamond electrically. HAd to cut through the metal tracks molded into the plastic. 
As suggested I added short jumpers soldered onto rail joiners. I carefully checked the current flow and it lined.
There was still an issue when I reinstalled the track into my layout. Careful checking and rechecking revealed that the molded frogs lifted the engine off the metal tracks so using the dremel, hobby knives, and files I opened everything up until the frogs were smooth with the top of the metal tracks and the drivers on the loco rode flat all the way through. It works quite well now...my little 0-4-0s waddle on through.

Here's a shot of the bottom of the diamond after soldering.

rr6 by desertguy56, on Flickr


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Well, doggone.

Why didn't we think of that? It has been brought up before.

Thank you for reminding everyone about the need to
add depth to the Atlas crossings, possibly some Atlas turnouts
as well.

Don


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## dsertdog56 (Oct 26, 2014)

I discovered the turnout issue as well. I suspect QC and old molds is the issue here. There were a couple of molded areas with lots of flash over which raised the drivers or in one case nearly insulated them from the track


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