# Atlas Connector wiring***



## Single Driver Steam

I wired up my entire 3x6 layout along with a pair of Atlas 205 connectors for use as blocks on 4 turnouts on my layout. I know the standard method is to run only a positive or negative wire to use for the blocks, but because I'm using electrofrog turnouts and have to insulate specific rails, these blocks do not share a common rail. 

Instead I ran a positive and negative feed to the connector and for each block ran the corresponding positive or negative feeder as needed. That said, I had a hard look at my setup and began second guessing if I crossed my positives and negatives. The Atlas instructions do not specify which connector aligns with which, so I'm assuming if I have red on the right and black on the left, the same would apply to each block, but I would like to confirm with the pros here before I switch any of these blocks to the live position and possibly short circuit my layout.


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## gregc

suggest you check with a voltmeter


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## Dennis461

Single Driver Steam said:


> I wired up my entire 3x6 layout along with a pair of Atlas 205 connectors for use as blocks on 4 turnouts on my layout. ...


You need to help us out before we can analyze.
Are you wiring up 'blocks' or 'turnouts'.
1. If blocks, did you isolate both rails at each end of the 'block'.

Have you checked out the Atlas 205 connector wiring instructions?


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## Single Driver Steam

Dennis461 said:


> You need to help us out before we can analyze.
> Are you wiring up 'blocks' or 'turnouts'.
> 1. If blocks, did you isolate both rails at each end of the 'block'.
> 
> Have you checked out the Atlas 205 connector wiring instructions?


I'm wiring blocks, not turnouts. Only 1 rail is isolated as I understand that's all that is required to effectively kill power to that siding (and tested this prior). The reason I mention the turnout is because rather than isolate one consistent rail (positive or negative) across the layout, I need to isolate based on the correct track alignment beyond the electric frog point. So 2 block tracks have the positive rail isolated while 2 others have the negative. 

I'm confident I wired the tracks themselves correctly. What I need to confirm is if I wired the block ports on these Atlas connectors correctly. As you can see in the photo, I ran a main bus line to the right hand side of the connector with red on the right and black on the left while facing directly towards that port from the right. I'm assuming the block ports (there's 2 per block switch) would have red also on the right and black also on the left...but which way? Left and right based on how you're viewing in the photo above?


And gregc would I be able to check with the voltmeter without setting the block track to live? I'm afraid to activate in case I have crossed the polarities and can short my layout (will this still occur if I remove all the trains from the layout?)


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## gregc

Single Driver Steam said:


> The reason I mention the turnout is because rather than isolate one consistent rail (positive or negative) across the layout, I need to isolate based on the correct track alignment beyond the electric frog point.


this doesn't sound right.

if you're looking at a bunch of parallel tracks that have no loops or loopbacks (reversing sections) the farther rail on each track should all have the same polarity. At a turnout, if the farther rail on the point side of the turnout is positive then the farther rail on the non-diverging and diverging tracks are positive.

if the frog is powered, you need to isolate the frog and the frog needs to be separately powered depending on turnout position. Not sure if this is what you mean by electric frog point




Single Driver Steam said:


> And gregc would I be able to check with the voltmeter without setting the block track to live? I'm afraid to activate in case I have crossed the polarities and can short my layout (will this still occur if I remove all the trains from the layout?)


since you've isolated the rails on either side of the block, i don't see why you can't power the rail.

with the voltmeter across the rails, you should either see voltage (could be plus or could be minus) if wired correctly. If wired incorrectly, you've wired the rail positive when it should have been negative, the voltmeter reads zero because both rails are the same polarity (positive).


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## Dennis461

I think you have the two INPUT wire backwards on the right side of the picture.

The 205 has input on left or right, straight through. 

And since you mixed up the isolation gaps, you have a short circuit.

My advice is to isolate both rails, wire it up using two wires.

Post your track plan ( a clear view not scribbled mess )and I'll mark it up for you


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## Single Driver Steam

Dennis461 said:


> I think you have the two INPUT wire backwards on the right side of the picture.
> 
> The 205 has input on left or right, straight through.
> 
> And since you mixed up the isolation gaps, you have a short circuit.
> 
> My advice is to isolate both rails, wire it up using two wires.
> 
> Post your track plan ( a clear view not scribbled mess )and I'll mark it up for you


I appreciate it! I have attached the track diagram showing the blocks 1-4. As you can see, I had to alternate isolated rails on these sidings based on the frog points. I circled the approx. location where the feeder running from the Atlas connector is attached to the rail.










I also included an image of the electric frog points as it seems to me that these are not used as commonly as insulated frog points (I use these points because my small wheelbase 1830s HO trains do not conduct electricity well and the insulated points resulted in stalls). The illustration should explain why I do not have the option to isolate based on a common rail around the layout and at the mercy of the point directions.


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## cv_acr

Dennis461 said:


> I think you have the two INPUT wire backwards on the right side of the picture.
> 
> The 205 has input on left or right, straight through.


This part of the setup doesn't matter. Whether attached from the right side or left side for convenience, it's entirely the same.


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## DonR

After seeing your track layout I can better understand
what you are saying.

However, you are complicating a simple wiring
scheme.

I understand the need for insulated joiners in
the Electrofrog rails. But you can still have
the 'common rail' system. Simply run a jumper
around the places where the insulated joiners
are used in the BLACK rails.

However, you also need to place insulated joiners in the RED
rails between blocks. You would have a RED track drop
from each block to the Atlas block controllers.

Don


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## Dennis461

cv_acr said:


> This part of the setup doesn't matter. Whether attached from the right side or left side for convenience, it's entirely the same.


Not entirely the same unless one knows what he is doing. I remember a Three stooges skit where Moe says put these sign on the left and these signs on the right. Curly takes the signs and turns around....


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## Dennis461

OP

Still need more detail.
And I'll repeat my self.
*Swap the two INPUT wires to the controller*

What brand turnout, model number. Please be specific.
If these are 'power routing' they will negate the 205 operation.

One section looks to have no power to the Black rail.

AND
WE NEED AN ATLAS 205 CONTROLLER OWNER TO CHIME IN.
IS MY SKETCH CORRECT FOR POLARITY


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## Single Driver Steam

Dennis461 said:


> OP
> 
> Still need more detail.
> And I'll repeat my self.
> *Swap the two INPUT wires to the controller*
> 
> What brand turnout, model number. Please be specific.
> If these are 'power routing' they will negate the 205 operation.
> 
> One section looks to have no power to the Black rail.
> 
> AND
> WE NEED AN ATLAS 205 CONTROLLER OWNER TO CHIME IN.
> IS MY SKETCH CORRECT FOR POLARITY



These are mostly Peco #6 electrofrog points (left hand and right), with one #4 Peco electrofrog wye split. I did not include any of the feeder wire connections on my layout diagram as these are powered directly from the main bus line and do not factor into the Atlas connectors at all (also wanted to keep the diagram clean and to the main point!). 

I would absolutely love to know the Atlas 205 polarity as their instructions pertain to only common rail wiring. Here is the diagram featured on the back of the package featuring how to wire a block track on the top illustration:


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## Lemonhawk

According to the above diagram for the "controller" Dennis461 you have the red and green inputs swapped. Thanks SingleSteam for the nice diagram of how the Atlas "controller" switch works! We needed that!


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## cv_acr

Dennis461 said:


> Not entirely the same unless one knows what he is doing. I remember a Three stooges skit where Moe says put these sign on the left and these signs on the right. Curly takes the signs and turns around....


Maybe i misread what you said in the first post, I thought you were saying he should connect them to the left side instead of the right, which would make absolutely no difference.

If they're swapped top and bottom, yes, that will make a big difference.


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## Stan D

I'd love to be able to delete a post of mine. Why is this forum different from others?


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## Magic

SDS since you are only using the spur tracks to park locos on you don't need to put any power to the spurs at all, 
the power routing turnouts will power the track for you.
Set to straight the the spur track will be dead, the locos will not move.
When set to the spur the turnout will apply the proper power to the spur track.
True the polarity on the frog will change but it will not short or power the loco as both spur rails will have the same polarity.
Electricity will only flow from + to -, not + to +. 

This is all you need.








If you want to run power to the spur tracks you will need to insulate both rails and then run power to the spurs on both rails.
Using the Atlas switches you would run the power the same way 
the Atlas diagram does in the second diagram for accessories, 
keeping the red wire to the red tracks and the black to black. 

Magic


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## DonR

Magic

The OP is using Electrofrog turnouts, which requires
insulated joiners in both frog rails. I note you have
run wires to 'jumper' these points with which I agree.

However, Electrofrogs are not power routing. It would
be necessary to 'jumper' the insulated joiners to the
spurs, just as you did with the main. There would be
no power to the spurs without the 'jumpers'.

Don


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## Single Driver Steam

So I threw my hands up in the air, said to hell with it, and actually threw open a few of these switches to test live. The result - nothing works except the main oval of track. No damage is done to locomotives, controller, etc. Anything sitting on a siding simply won't move no matter how I swap the positive and negative connections on the connector itself.

I also added a second insulation joiner to completely isolate the siding and fed positive and negative to it. Absolutely nothing works. Here are all the combinations I've tried:

















































I probably shouldn't have activated the switch swapping charges around so many times, but my patience with this has worn pretty thin. I'm about ready to find other switches to use for blocks on my sidings. My turnouts are not power routed, so I would only need switches just to activate a parked train when I want it to enter the main oval. 

Also, can anyone recommend a relatively inexpensive voltmeter? How do I get a track reading, add the two prongs to the rail?


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## MichaelE

Why not just use toggle switches?


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## Single Driver Steam

MichaelE said:


> Why not just use toggle switches?


I think I will. I have an extremely low opinion of these Atlas connectors now. I've tried so many electrical variations and troubleshooting that I'm convinced they are not functioning correctly. 

Can anyone recommend a specific make/model toggle switch, I'm also only interesting in a SPST (single pole single throw) basic on/off as I'll only run one train from one transformer at a time? Not sure how I'd wire them up. I'd need a positive and negative input and the same charges output to the sidings.


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## gregc

Single Driver Steam said:


> I've tried so many electrical variations and troubleshooting that I'm convinced they are not functioning correctly.


have you tested them with a voltmeter? or at least a 12V bulb?


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## Dennis461

Now you are making too many changes at once. The Peco Electrofrogs ARE power routing devices . So mixing those with the Atlas 205 is part of your problem. Gap both rails, run TWO wires to the 205. Make sure the 205 actually has power into it. Send me a bus ticket to NY and I'll come fix it
Harbor Freight has cheap multimeters

Dennis in Atco NJ.


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## Dennis461

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MovdBg_ZcvQ


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## Single Driver Steam

I tried insulating both rails, running positive and negative feeders to the 205, then the same charges to the block track. The engine will not move at all. I position it beyond the insulated joiners just at the turnout and it runs onto the oval track just fine. 

Tomorrow when I have time I'll run down to home depot and pick up a voltmeter/multimeter. Might as well at this point as I'm completely stumped.


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## prrfan

Single Driver Steam: It is very possible that you have some bad connectors. Atlas had a problem with these a few years back and they were out of production for a while. 
I don’t know how many bad ones got out on the market. 
I used the Atlas wiring book to build a layout with them but I had to buy them used off eBay since new ones were unavailable.


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## Lemonhawk

I found these on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/CENTER-MINIA...T+bat+handle&qid=1554345627&s=gateway&sr=8-10
I like bat handle switches! You only need SPST switches if you just using them to remove power to a siding!
https://www.amazon.com/SPST-MINIATU...T+bat+handle&qid=1554346019&s=gateway&sr=8-18


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## Magic

DonR said:


> Magic
> 
> The OP is using Electrofrog turnouts, which requires
> insulated joiners in both frog rails. I note you have
> run wires to 'jumper' these points with which I agree.
> 
> However, Electrofrogs are not power routing. It would
> be necessary to 'jumper' the insulated joiners to the
> spurs, just as you did with the main. There would be
> no power to the spurs without the 'jumpers'.
> 
> Don


Don I believe Electrofrog turnouts are power routing based on 
this from DCCwiki.com and other sites.
"The Peco Electrofrog switch was designed in the days of analog operation (DC) with the ability to power sidings depending on which way the points were aligned. Drive a locomotive into the siding and then set the points for the mainline route. We could rest assured that the locomotive wouldn't creep away on us - assuming there were no additional track power feeds to the siding. The turnout would function as an electrical switch in addition to its duty as a track switch."

If you put insulated joiners on the diverging rails you would defeat the power routing and will need feeders to the spur.
If SDS would wire the layout up the way I diagrammed above it should work like he wants.
Run the loco onto the short spur "parking" track, set the turnout to the main line and the turnout will cut power to the spur.
No switches or power feeders needed.

Could be the OP has some bad Atlas switches, which really sucks.

To SDS a simple 12 volt automotive test light would test for power, put the clip on one rail and touch the light to the other.
If it lights the bulb you have power.

Magic


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## DonR

Magic

I don't have any Electrofrog turnouts, never actually
seen one, but, consider, the METAL frog is physically
and electrically connected to the FROG RAILS. It changes
'polarity' as do the frog rails, when points are thrown. You must
use insulated joiners between frog rail and connecting
track else there would be a short circuit on divert frog rail when
points (and frog rails) are set to straight. Thus NO power
CAN be transferred no matter the point position. It
is blocked by the insulated joiners. The connecting tracks to the frog rails would actually require a track drop if power 
were desired.

However, if the OP was not utilizing the Common rail
system, and there were no track drops from spurs, thus
no need for the insulated joiners, 
yes, you could say the Electrofrog was 'power routing'
since the frog would transmit the correct polarity when
points set to divert. It would send incorrect polarity when
set to straight, but it would be the same polarity as the non
frog rail thus nothing happens.

Because of the Electrofrog insulated joiner requirements the otherwise simple 'common rail' Atlas system is made more complicated, which is what is causing the OPs grief.

Don


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## Dennis461

DonR said:


> Magic
> 
> I don't have any Electrofrog turnouts, never actually
> seen one, but, consider, the METAL frog is physically
> and electrically connected to the FROG RAILS. It changes
> 'polarity' as do the frog rails, when points are thrown. You must
> use insulated joiners between frog rail and connecting
> track else there would be a short circuit on divert frog rail when
> points (and frog rails) are set to straight. Thus NO power
> CAN be transferred no matter the point position. It
> is blocked by the insulated joiners. The connecting tracks to the frog rails would actually require a track drop if power
> were desired.
> 
> However, if the OP was not utilizing the Common rail
> system, and there were no track drops from spurs, thus
> no need for the insulated joiners,
> yes, you could say the Electrofrog was 'power routing'
> since the frog would transmit the correct polarity when
> points set to divert. It would send incorrect polarity when
> set to straight, but it would be the same polarity as the non
> frog rail thus nothing happens.
> 
> Because of the Electrofrog insulated joiner requirements the otherwise simple 'common rail' Atlas system is made more complicated, which is what is causing the OPs grief.
> 
> Don


At the risk of hijacking the post.
Don, insulating gaps are only needed if there is a power feed on the 'other' side of the points.

Leave the gaps out, do not connect power to 'other' side of the diverging route and you have full control of the siding.

Send a loco down the siding, switch the turnout to MAIN, and the loco stops moving because the siding now has two rails with the same polarity.


Look at my video in post #23.


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## DonR

Yes, Dennis, you are right. That's what I was trying
to say in my last post. With a dead end spur, that has
no track drops, the Electrofrog could 'act' as a 
power router by eliminating the insulated joiners.

Don


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## Magic

The same holds for Insulfrog turnouts as well, put power to the spur or diverging rails and you defeat the power routing feature.
Only difference is with Insulfrog is that there is no charge to the one rail and with Electrofrog there are two rails of the same polarity.

Now that this thread has been hijacked I hope the that SDS gets it figured out and lets know how he is doing.
He's using very small locos and Electrofrogs were a good choice. 
He has done his research and once he gets a way to test the power routing and switches he'll figure it out.


Magic


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## DonR

Magic

The OP's problem is that he is not getting
power to his tracks thru the Atlas controllers
and the 'common rail' system.

He is buying a multimeter to track down the
problem.

Let's hope that solves the problem.

Don


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## Magic

He has tried both ways and has had no luck.
He has an open someplace in the circuit, either a bad wire connection or bad switch.
No doubt he will track it down with the multimeter.

Magic


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## Single Driver Steam

I went out and bought a Commercial Electric digital multimeter but will admit to not being sure how to use it. I know that improper handling of electricity can kill, so I am approaching with a heightened level of caution. 

From what I can tell, I would first test the multimeter with a 9v or 1.5v battery to be sure everything works as expected. Then I would take the two prongs and touch the two rails I wish to test with the power pack OFF. Only when the two prongs have made contact with the two rails and have been "introduced to the circuit" can the power pack be turned on and voltage introduced. Is that correct? 

Am I able to hold the two handles on the probes as electricity is introduced or do I have to go back out and buy alligator jumper wires so this can be performed entirely hands free?


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## gregc

model train voltages are not dangerous. think of all the kids who have been exposed to the metal track. you can put you hand across the track.

you can attach the probes at any time. You don't have to attach them and then turn on power.

I would start with the terminals on the power supply, then the side terminals on the atlas connector and then a pair of the top terminals with the slide switch in both positions.


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## Dennis461

Post a good picture of meter front or supply us with the model number

Lesson #1 

Look for this symbol Ω or the word OHMS on the front.
I'll assume it has a rotary dial on front.
Turn dial to lowest setting in the Ω region.

You should have the black test lead plugged into the COMMON hole/connection The RED lead plugged into the V/Ω hole/connection .

Turn meter on.
Touch two leads together.
Observe reading on display.
Should change to read 00.00 or 000.1 or 00.8; some very low number.


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## MichaelE

But don't measure resistance in a live circuit. You will blow the internal fuse or trip the circuit breaker. Those usually reset themselves after a short time.


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## DonR

As I recall, you are running a DC layout.

Therefore, to make voltage tests set the meter
to DC. If there is a voltage range selector set it
to 0 to 15 or so volts.

(if you are running a DCC system, set the meter
to low voltage (14 or so volts) AC.)

Neither are dangerous currents.

Don


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## Single Driver Steam

Welp, thanks to the multimeter test my fellow modelers here suggested, I believe I have determined the problem running power to my blocks. From my amateur eyes, it appears that there was *no electricity* being routed to the atlas connectors at all. 

First, here is the multimeter I bought the other day. 








Next, I turned on the transformer and added track power.








I confirmed that the multimeter was set to DC voltage and that when my positive and negative prongs were added to the rails I was getting an accurate reading (the throttle opened halfway gave me a DC voltage reading of about 8).








Finally I connected the prongs to the two feeder connections that route power from the main bus line to the Atlas connectors. This gave me a DC voltage reading of "0". 









So with my current setup, the two feeders running to the Atlas connectors are split from the bus line using suitcase connectors. I am wondering if I should maybe use a different means of splitting the wires? Maybe use a barrier strip with jumper cables running from one connection to another? (I use a barrier strip to actually terminate the bus line at the far end of the layout. The multimeter shows a voltage reading when I connect the prongs to any part of the spade connector, screw, or backplate on the terminal block piece making me believe this is a more robust solution)


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## Dennis461

Now you are making progress. Suitcase connectors are not your friend. You can try opening them up and repair or trash them. I'd trash them. 
P.s. it may only be one bad connection. Either one open will produce a zero voltag reading at the Atlas connector input.


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## gregc

Single Driver Steam said:


> Finally I connected the prongs to the two feeder connections that route power from the main bus line to the Atlas connectors. This gave me a DC voltage reading of "0".


i hope it's obvious that you can identify which connection to the Atlas connector is bad by probing one connection at a time, for example, by touching one probe to the negative on the supply and the other probe to the positive connection on the Atlas connector (with power on).



Dennis461 said:


> Suitcase connectors are not your friend.


many model railroads are reliably built with suitcase connectors when properly installed using proper wire sizes.

you might just need to press the connector a little tighter.


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## Single Driver Steam

The Atlas connector story comes to a happy conclusion.

While suitcase connectors may be reliable (I should know I use them to distribute power to the mainline feeders from the bus wires, the one track that was running fine), I decided to go ahead and trash the ones that were causing my electric headache and swapped them out with a terminal strip out of an abundance of caution. 

























Having addressed the electricity issue, I wired up the Atlas connectors and tested using the multimeter revealing a surprise. Fortunately my problem was solved and the Atlas connectors work just fine, all connections received power and the block switches enable track power as expected. The one thing I did not expect is that the positive and negative output on each switch was arranged opposite of how I first set these up. 


















Moral of the story, multimeters are a modelers best friend! Such a handy tool makes troubleshooting simple. Thank you to all who helped me on this thread. 

One unrelated technical question arose from this test session with my engines developing static electricity as they ran but I think I’ll save that for a new thread.


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## gregc

were both connections bad or just one?


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## Single Driver Steam

gregc said:


> were both connections bad or just one?


Both connections were bad. The barrier strip solved the problem and now all blocks work.


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## Magic

Good to see that you got this all sorted out and your trains are running.

Magic


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## Dennis461

Sweeet!

I can't wait to read your next mystery novella about static electricity.


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