# KAdee Coupler qUESTION



## DavefromMD (Jul 25, 2013)

OK, after taking flak  about wanting to use McHenry couplers on my Athearn passenger cars (I chose McHenry because that is what comes on Athearns out of the box), I looked up Kadees. There are more types of those than McHenry! I found a conversion chart and saw to use either #5, #148, or MCS. I also saw the cost of Kadees is not any more than McHenry.

Now my question is - I notice the #5 and #148 come with the full assembly (draft box, coupler, etc). Do I need to replace the whole thing or can I just plug the coupler into the existing box?

I see the 148s have a "whisker" and the #5s do not, so I guess the #148s would be a better solution seeing as they are replacing couplers with a whisker type spring - yes, no?

I also see a #158 "scale" head that a general note seems to indicate it can be used where a #148 can be used. It looks the same. What is a "scale" head?

I'm not as advanced as many on here. I basically set up a layout once a year for a couple of months and run the trains - DC. Pretty much the same setup each year, same village, with minor track layout modifications, so I'm a low cost operation, not real serious. Started when my boys were young, then they took over the tradition, now that they are in college, I am taking it back over.

Thanks all for your suggestions.


----------



## ssgt (Jan 8, 2013)

I would stay away from scale head couplers unless your track work is absolutely flawless ,kadee #5 and #148(or any other "traditional" kadee) would handle slight variations in track level better and not come uncoupled.


----------



## D&J Railroad (Oct 4, 2013)

The 148 should be fine for what you are doing. The #5 has a bronze spring plate that goes with it that you would have to fit into the coupler pocket too. The wiskers would use the same space as the McHenry non-couplers but the coupler would actually hold your train together.
The Kadee coupler is just a little bit bigger, scale wise than a prototypical coupler. For the discerning modeler, this could be troublesome, but for the casual modeler as myself, this isn't even noticable when I'm running my empire.


----------



## morrjr (Dec 20, 2012)

I suggest using the #148 vice the #5 - the combination of the #5 coupler and the spring plate can be too thick to fit properly in some shallower coupler pockets.


----------



## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

I would also advise (if you want your couplers to work as well as they can) to get a coupler height gage. There is variation in mounting heights of couplers between brands/types of cars, etc. and a coupler gage will tell you what kind of coupler you need.

Start with the std 148 & 5 sizes. (Those are right in the middle of the range.) You can get longer or shorter shanks (necks) on the couplers to extend them beyond snowplows, etc. You can also get high or low couplers which move the vertical height of the coupler. 

If you install a #148 (I also prefer the whiskers) and put it to the gage and see that the coupler sits low to the standard, just go with the high couplers to raise it up a little (or shim with pieces of styrene.)

The better they line up, the more reliable they will be. 

Scale head couplers have details just a little smaller than a std Kadee, and as such are more sensitive to variation in the coupler heights between cars. For a vast majority of the people out there they just aren't worth the hassle, but if you're building for ultimate realism, they are great.


----------



## DavefromMD (Jul 25, 2013)

OK, D & J RR - just for a laugh.:laugh:

What is your opinion of EZ Mate couplers that come on the Bachmann Silver series cars?

I do notice that they do live up to their name in that when I have a derailment and then back up to rehook the cars, they do recouple easily. The McHenrys don't recouple quite as smoothly and sometimes take the use of a 5 finger crane. I guess I'll find out about Kadees.


----------



## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

DavefromMD said:


> OK, D & J RR - just for a laugh.:laugh:
> 
> What is your opinion of EZ Mate couplers that come on the Bachmann Silver series cars?


They work OK, but not as good as the Kadees. The price difference you'd save isn't worth it.

There is a reason that Kadees are darn near the standard everything is measured by.

Buy one of the bulk packs of Kadees and update everything. (watch for them to go on sale at Walthers or trainworld - they do go on sale fairly regularly.) Most cars take the #148's and only on a couple occasions have I had to get something else.


----------



## ggnlars (Aug 6, 2013)

Up till now, in HO the best couplers are Kadee's! Because nothing is perfect, you need to check the height with a gage. Things can get warped. This is the reason you need a few under shank (x7) and a few over shank (x2). The bulk will be center shank (5 & x8). You will find that you will use these in conjunction with small washers to get the proper height.
Good luck,

Larry


----------



## ggnlars (Aug 6, 2013)

Up till now, in HO the best couplers are Kadee's! Because nothing is perfect, you need to check the height with a gage. Things can get warped. This is the reason you need a few under shank (x7) and a few over shank (x2). The bulk will be center shank (5 & x8). You will find that you will use these in conjunction with small washers to get the proper height.
Good luck,

Larry


----------



## D&J Railroad (Oct 4, 2013)

DavefromMD said:


> OK, D & J RR - just for a laugh.:laugh:
> 
> What is your opinion of EZ Mate couplers that come on the Bachmann Silver series cars?
> 
> I do notice that they do live up to their name in that when I have a derailment and then back up to rehook the cars, they do recouple easily. The McHenrys don't recouple quite as smoothly and sometimes take the use of a 5 finger crane. I guess I'll find out about Kadees.


EZ Mate, McHenry non-coupler, hook horn all seem to work, most of the time with short, light trains.


----------



## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

E Z mates on Bachmann locos are a tad larger than the #5 and # 148 
Kadees, thus even more out of HO scale. Mine work adequately but
when one fails a Kadee replaces it.

As all of the guys have said...Kadee is the standard of the industry.

Don


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

I have bought bulk packs of Kadee 148's on e-bay, and much cheaper that Walthers. Some even have free shipping.


----------



## wingnut163 (Jan 3, 2013)

every one has said , check the height. true and very important. so let me say, also check the height of the fake hose that is used to uncouple the cars. it can snag on a turnout and derail your car. the height gauge will do both. oh and get the newer one, the old one is metal and will short out the track.


----------



## oldsarge218 (May 23, 2011)

I have been converting all my rolling stock and locos to Kadees. First and foremost, you have to have a height gauge to eliminate any problems. I have found that if the correct coupler is chosen, you will end up with a perfect alignment. If you use the wrong one, you can be as little as a 16th of an inch off, and your consist will break apart on the slightest bump. On nearly all my stock, either the medium (148) center set coupler, or the medium (142) over set coupler will work. Also, in regards to the gear box, I normally change it out to a Kadee. 
God Bless
Bob


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

I snip off the "brake hose" and use the HOG method of uncoupling the cars.


----------



## Smokinapankake (Sep 8, 2011)

I'm an Accu-Mate guy myself. Lots of people like to bash anything other than their sacred Kadees, but in all honesty, if you are careful in setting them up (to a height gage) and meticulous in execution, most anything will work fine.

I prefer to stick with one brand, as well. This minimizes fussiness in operation. 
Many brands will tell you they are interchangeable with any other brand, and that may be true to a certain extent. But if you stick with one brand you eliminate one variable. 

Just my .02.


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

I have had Accumate and McHenry pull apart at the knuckle because of the plastic construction. I have also had the plastic shanked Kadee pull apart. I use only the all metal couplers.


----------



## Smokinapankake (Sep 8, 2011)

Interesting. I wonder how you got the Accu-mate to pull apart. I've used them on up to 12 loco lash ups for several hours with no problems. Non- DCC so was unable to speed match. Of course, I don't have the facilities to run super long trains, either, as I suspect most people don't. 

Everyone's experience will be different, and mine with Accumates has been nothing but pleasant.


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

I had one of those so called brake hoses catch, and the Accumate on the locomotive snapped at the pivot joint. It looked like a real prototype coupler when it broke.


----------



## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

I'd guess that about 97% of my rolling stock has Kadee #5 or #148.

All 7 of my Bachmann locos have the original Bachmann couplers on them.

Most of the time the 2 makes of coupler will hold hands like they should. 
But, as others have
noted, there will be times when the 2 different makes will fight tooth
and nail. Sometimes they will not couple...other times the slightest 
track bump will uncouple.

If you can, stay with one make of coupler.

Don


----------



## Smokinapankake (Sep 8, 2011)

I also don't use the hoses. I uncouple with the handheld tool. Either the Kadee or the Accumate tool seems to work equally well.


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

I use my hand and five fingers. That is my built in uncoupling tool.


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

DonR said:


> I'd guess that about 97% of my rolling stock has Kadee #5 or #148.
> 
> All 7 of my Bachmann locos have the original Bachmann couplers on them.
> 
> ...


I have not had the different makes uncouple, unless there is a bad section of uneven track or the couplers do not match in height.


----------



## ggnlars (Aug 6, 2013)

The "hoses" are part of the Kadee automatic system. These use the magnets that you install in or under the track. 
People do lots of different things with these hoses. There are tools available to increase the bend radius to raise the lowest point. Some cut a small part off near the bottom, others as indicated cut off all for the hose. 
The problem is the low hanging hose catching on the track. This can be because of irregular track or the coupler being low. Even if you set the height with the proper gage, the coupler could have snagged on someting and dislodged it slightly. You might not see this, but the track will. 
All of the solutions give up someting that the Kadee system was designed for. Either asthetically or functionally. You have to decide what is best for your system.
Larry


----------



## fs2k4pilot (Jan 5, 2013)

Actually, guys, for passenger cars, Kadee 146 long shank whisker couplers can sometimes be a better option, because the longer length gives a wider range of motion, which can be very useful for long cars, especially passenger cars. Just mount the draft gear box a bit farther back under the end of the car so that the coupler doesn't stick out any farther than a normal coupler.

I used 146s on a couple of 72' baggage cars, and they work very nicely, even around tight radius curves.


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

Kadee also makes a swing coupler box.

The Pilot also has a good idea. I'll have to try that!


----------

