# HO?



## Carman (Mar 28, 2009)

What attracts you to HO scale?

Kyle


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

WOW!!! What a question!

I was raised with HO. Probably the availability of so many engines and cars, price, and the fact that I can still get a lot of track down in a small space, like an extra bedroom or a confiscated garage or basement.

i do have a G-Scale layout in the yard, and I just purchased a lot that contained a bunch of O-gauge cars, track, and engines. But HO will always be the mainstay of the collection.

Bob


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## MacDaddy55 (Aug 19, 2008)

*The Time,Space Continuim excelerated!*



stationmaster said:


> WOW!!! What a question!
> 
> I was raised with HO. Probably the availability of so many engines and cars, price, and the fact that I can still get a lot of track down in a small space, like an extra bedroom or a confiscated garage or basement.
> 
> ...


I believe that "The Master" Has heet a hooomerun like de Babes Rooth!!! Carman do you have kids....like small cuddly ones who just love playing with things like ....trains!? HO is the perfect size for kids, easy to put on track, tough enough to take a hit, and priced just right if that "hit "is a haymaker! I have nothing against any other scale.....I'm just a TRAIN HO!!!:laugh::laugh:


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## Lester Perry (Nov 7, 2008)

Originally the availability of stuff. Even though the road I model had very little available it was no better in other scales. I had to paint my power for the most part. I also had to paint caboose's. That was good in hind sight. I can now get almost anything I desire commercially. I am considering going back to painting again. Now as I am getting older 0 scale looks interesting, but I am too deep in HO to change now. I am hoping to add to my layout this summer, Time will tell.
Les


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Yeh, Les, I'm modeling 6 different roads on my layout, including your beloved C&O. All passed within a few miles of my home back in the day. If you think C&o is tough, try Monon or Wabash!! NKP is not much easier.

Bob


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## Lester Perry (Nov 7, 2008)

Stationmaster how long have you been modeling those roads. I don't know about the others but C&O until about 15 years ago was not available. I was told that CSX would not release the rights to the name or logo, That went for Chessie and CSX also. I wanted a long coal drag but until what I call recently I couldn't do it. I now have around 150 C&O coal cars. A 35 car coal train is normal for my layout, but don't be surprised to see 50 or more. I have pulled 101 coal cars plus a caboose. Just so I can say I can do it. When I have open house I usually have 75 car coal and about 40 - 50 freight running.
Les


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Although Ido have quite a bit o C&O, much pre-1970. I've found that rolling stock is not that bad to find. Engines, on the other hand, can be an adventure. Even teh Chessie System tagged products seemed to be ll B&O. 

I think that Monon and Wabash are much harder to find. With the restoration of a couple of Berkshires, the NKP has come to be a bit easier find. For a *LONG* time, I was buying undecorated stock and applying decals. the difficulties I was having was one of the biggest reasons I purchased a decal program for my computer and started making my own decals.

I do find the whole scenario a bit hard to understand since C&O was a big coal drag road and many like to model "coal roads". But, you may be correct in stating the deal with CSX. But, Conrail owned some of the C&O rights along with CSX. Clinchfield was another hard one and still is.

One thing I have noticed while traveling and visiting various hobby shops in other regions is that roads found in those alien regions are more apt to carry the "fallen flags" of those areas. I visited a shop in St. Louis a few months ago and found nothing but western roads. No NW, NYC, or Pennsylvania, ACL at all. But if you wanted Santa Fe, Southern Pacific, or BNSF, you were definitely in the right place there.

Bob


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## Lester Perry (Nov 7, 2008)

Bob I have had no problem finding power for last 10 years as Proto made GP7&9 in C&O. They also made a couple of steam. Bachman makes a few steam now and Hornsby makes the H8. I am sure there are more, I just can't think of them off hand. I believe it is Atlas makes GP35.
Les


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Back in the day, AHM made the BL2. Intermountain made the F-units with the bow wave. Walthers(Blue Box) had a couple of GP7's. Steam has usually been pretty easy. Rivarossi came out with the Allegheny 2-6-6-2 a few years back. IHC had 2-8-0's and 2-6-0's for some time now. Stewart made some RS's and Varney had a 2-6-0 and a 2-8-0 wearing the C&O badge.

You need to invest in the decal program. I think it ran about $40 from Walthers. Paper isn't cheap though, but not out of reach. The packets come in 4-packs, I believe. And if you buy undecorated cars, many times they are cheaper than the decorated ones. The savings on the cars, usually a buck or two, offsets the cost of the paper and program if you have a number of cars. The big deal si getting the car info and tagging info correct.

Bob


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## Lester Perry (Nov 7, 2008)

OK Bob I am interested in the program. You seem pleased with yours, how about some guidance here in this. I have 2 of the Alleghenies. Also have done some painting and decaling but not needed of lately. Here are a few of my paint jobs




























I have painted more but that is all of the pics I have of them. Last but not least .This is a Mantua Mikado that I modified to make it look more like a C&O I cut off the headlight a put a new one on the pilot. Added the flying pumps, feed water heater, number boards and bell to the front. 










Added the compressor to the side. Painted and decaled it and that number is legitimate. Also gave it a Vanderbilt tender. 










I have done 2 of these but they no longer see any running as I have gone DCC and these don't have decoders yet.


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Nice job on the Mikes. The added detail of the flying pumps and compressor is a nice touch. You do fine work. I don't think that you need too much of my help. My forte is module building.

I save my "pages" and just print out sheets. I have them saved by era>roads>car style. I just go into the "sheet" and change the road number/car ID number.

I tried a program that I would actually "draw" the stuff up full size and scale it down. Didn't work all that well. It was self conceived and had a couple of glitches. I suppose that I could fix them, if I ever got ambitious.

I will admit, some colors are hard to duplicate. Dulux gold is a bear!!! That is the color of my NKP engine logos and numbers.

Bob


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## B.C.RAIL (Sep 1, 2008)

HO scale is so common and easy to model and doesn't take up too much space.
It's just what I started with..and continued with. I wouldn't want to go smaller or bigger.

And fallen flags are hard to find and more expensive. Like bcrail.  it's so hard to find any bcrail anywhere near my budget.  And PGE.


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## B.C.RAIL (Sep 1, 2008)

And more more thing...If I wanted to buy a engine..It would only be avaiable in DCC..which is very frustrating because they wont have it in just DC. grr.


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## msantti (Jul 13, 2009)

I had HO years ago. My dad, my brother, and myself used to run on a 4x8 table and had alot of fun.

Started in N scale about 10 years ago as I did not have much space. Its a great scale but always yearned to go back to HO.

Finally am somewhere with more space and have a 12x8 table so I am going back to HO.

Bought some Atlas True Track and am going to get up and going this weekend hopefully.

I had Kato N scale and I am selling a bunch of it right now. Considered Kato HO but went with True Track so I hope I made the right choice. The price is good. Had Atlas track years back and it worked well.

I like HO because the size is nice. Not too big, not too small. Lionel is nice but not particularly cheap and you really need space. At least 12x8 which I have but more is really needed for something interesting. Tee Fast Track is not cheap.

Like some have said, the availability of stuff is quite good.


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## chessie14 (Jun 15, 2009)

Perhaps its because I'm from Baltimore, but all the roads that you have mentioned have been on a layout in either my fathers basement or mine since the early eightys. I guess being local to a road name it's much easyer to model that particular road. But I think that was already verbalized here... oh well I second that...


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## cidjackaries (Jul 23, 2008)

I'll jump in. My grandfather had a HO layout, and when I was young I got my first three Ho models (one Amtrak Engine, One budd car, one Dome car) which I kept with me waiting for the day I could build a layout, which I did a few years back. Now those same cars will run on my new layout with my huge lot of Amtrak cars. Sadly though, that Amtrak Engine I got on my 5th B-day is now a Dummy Engine.


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## KogentaByakko (Jul 5, 2009)

I was told the HO scale is a good starter more than other scale size, so hell, I start to use HO scale layout for a year.


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## Lester Perry (Nov 7, 2008)

B.C.RAIL said:


> And more more thing...If I wanted to buy a engine..It would only be avaiable in DCC..which is very frustrating because they wont have it in just DC. grr.


If you are dead set on DC just remove the decoder,But another option is to get an inexpensive DCC set up. Just wire it in as a second power pack. You might like it once you have used it. I would venture to say you will, especially if the engine has sound.


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Lester Perry said:


> If you are dead set on DC just remove the decoder,But another option is to get an inexpensive DCC set up. Just wire it in as a second power pack. You might like it once you have used it. I would venture to say you will, especially if the engine has sound.


Another option is to get the DCC ready engines. When I was arguing with myself over whether or not to change from DC to DCC in the early stages of my layout's construction. I went ahead and installed a plug type "harness only" on many of my engines.

When I finally took the plunge, the conversion was then too easy, "plug and play". Even the old "amp hog", belt drive Athearns seem to run better with DCC. The layout is DCC but has power districts if I ever sell it to someone that is a non-DCC operator.

I will be first in line to testify that DCC is the only way to go. And I mean that. So much easier than looking to see if a section of track is powered or unpowered. It doesn't matter. The control cab takes care of the engine at hand and any possible cornfield meets. And the "Master Off/On" switch kills the whole track if there is a runaway.

I believe someone makes a DCC system for under a $100 now. Far more inexpensive than my Digitrax.

Bob


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## B.C.RAIL (Sep 1, 2008)

I have pondered about DCC. I bought a few Athearn 'Quick Plug Equipped' engines.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

I do both N and HO but HO is my primary modeling scale. It's the one I was introduced to from the beginning. Old school HO is especially appealing to me for its rather husky, unapologetic look and open frame motors.

As for DCC...



...I had a decision to make when I left the club. After over two years as shelf queens I said enough was enough.


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## Lester Perry (Nov 7, 2008)

Look it isn't that big of a price jump from a good MRC DC power supply to a cheap DCC system. It hooks up to your layout just like DC with one exception you will need a program track which is simple. I don't think you will be sorry.


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## kakashie455 (Jun 15, 2009)

stationmaster said:


> WOW!!! What a question!
> 
> I was raised with HO. Probably the availability of so many engines and cars, price, and the fact that I can still get a lot of track down in a small space, like an extra bedroom or a confiscated garage or basement.
> 
> ...


same as you on how i got started yeah!!


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

I like HO for 2 simple reasons. One...I can't imagine working on smaller locomotives. Even HO can be difficult at times to work in the small spaces. Two...it doesn't seem to be any cheaper to go with N scale, so I figure why not get more bang for the buck! I made the move to DCC roughly a year ago or so, and I have not regretted it. The switch to DCC was simple and easy...like others said, you basically just switch out the DC controller for a DCC one. I didn't have to do anything different with the wiring at all! I liked DCC so much that I converted many of my DC locos, and I may still convert a couple more!


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

My reason for not choosing DCC was purely economics...I actually enjoy DCC ops much more than I do DC. However, I committed myself to doing this hobby as inexpensively as possible so that I'd have more monies to go elsewhere beyond my little apartment. Unless I happen upon a DCC system pining away in a junkbox at a yard sale or flea market for less than twenty bucks, it's not likely I'll be going into it anytime soon.


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Hey Shay...

I am also VERY cheap! For that reason I went with the Bachmann E-Z Command DCC system. I believe I got it for $83 before tax. I thought that was a good price for a DCC system that, although simple, seems to work quite well. The locomotives are slightly more expensive in DCC vs. DC, but I have been pleasantly surprised to see that Bachmann offers DCC on board for anywhere between $40 and $55. I enjoyed running in DC as well, but the ability to creep along in DCC can be awful nice. Either way it is a great hobby!


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## mike6206 (Jul 13, 2009)

No DCC here as well! I only have a 5' x 11' layout with a double track mainline going into a tunnel at the lower end. I figure that unless I was going to add a yard operation or something that gets more complicated, it's an unneeded expense. I also have locos from the pre-DCC era that work nicely and I don't have the time to DCC them. DC with the Quantum Engineer for my sound stuff works for now.


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Hey Mike...

That makes sense. Most people will say the biggest advantage of DCC is being able to run multiple trains at the same time...all independent of each other. Well, to do this, one needs a pretty good-sized layout. Even with a big layout, I have found I cannot safely operate more than 3 trains at a time anyway. I had an awful lot of fun in DC, and would have no problems going back to it!


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Including my yards and industrial switching, I have had 12 engines running at once. Everyone brought a controller and we "played" all day.

My layout is larger than average though. Almost 2100 feet of track down, including the yards and switching areas. And it can be larger. All modular. And it's still growing. Yard "ladders" are 6 feet long. it's been 12 years in construction.

DCC is the only way to go. The layout started to be built with power districts, but I went to DCC in the middle of construction, so it is DCC with (8)power districts.

I would advise anyone building a layout now to go DCC. Price are much lower than when I converted. For less than $100 you can have a DCC layout. And decoders have come down in price significantly. You don't have to buy Tsunami's with sound.

Bob


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Bob...

There is no doubt that there is something to be said for DCC. I really wish all HO trains came in DCC, as they run well on DC layouts anyway. I don't mind putting in a DCC decoder if it is DCC Ready, but it can be a bigger job to convert older locos to DCC when you have to put in the wiring harness. I recently converted 4 old Athearns to DCC, and the wiring harness was not necessarily difficult to install, but I wouldn't really say it was easy either. I prefer to buy DCC already on board. I wouldn't really think it would cost the manufacturer that much more to equip locos with DCC anyway.


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

I agree. A "plug and play" type system should be instituted in the manufacturing of ALL engines. Products like P2K have a "light board" anyway. What could it cost to change that process?

I have changed many of my Blue Box locos also. I have a bunch of OLDER belt drives to change yet. I would imagine that I will be using O- or G-scale decoders on those amp hogs.

Bob


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## MacDaddy55 (Aug 19, 2008)

*Call Me Ishmael!!!*

DCC has become the new focal point of Model Railroading bringing more realism to layouts,dioramas and basic setups across our hobby. With that new technology comes the end of an era or better yet "The Elephants Graveyard" of Model railroading. A new era of obsolete transformers,track,rolling stock and engines. Like Capt. Ahab I have vowed to seek the White Whale of HO equipment that needs a place to call home. My Son asked me if I wanted a new DCC engine for my birthday and I declined. My reasons are simple. There is a vast sea of Garages,yard sales,swap meets and exchanges waiting out there with open doors for someone like me. Nothing against DCC...I'm running a small layout that does not require multiple yard switchers, fast freight or passenger trains for realism.....its how you present it that counts. So welcome in the DCC era and watch out DC cuz I am looking for that proverbial White Whale of HO heaven(at half the cost:laugh::laugh::laugh. Nuff Said....Thank You!:laugh::laugh:


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## tankist (Jun 11, 2009)

mac, all that separates you from dcc is 30$ worth of decoder so whats the fuss? just like why run intel dual core if the quad available  ?


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

The jump from DC to DCC really was not much money at all. I got my DCC controller for $83 before tax. I have seen where you can buy DCC locos for $40. DCC has come down enough in price where most people can acquire it if they choose.


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Just a little shock treatment for you all. When I first starting converting to DCC, decoders, some anyway, were selling for $70. I just bought twelve for $75 shipped. The guy didn't need them. I sure do. No sound, but who cares?

Bob


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## MacDaddy55 (Aug 19, 2008)

*Don't Get Me Wrong!*

Guys I'm just too old school for my own good.....:laugh::laugh::laugh:!! Besides theres just something about foraging through old relic model train stuff that compels me to uohold those time honored traditions. when the first blossom on the cherry tree comes.....its Sailing Time....GARAGE SAIL THAT IS!!:laugh::laugh: kEEP IT REAL BABY!!


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Hey Mac...

I actually have it where I can run both DC and DCC trains on my layout. It is kind of nice to have the best of both worlds! The old school trains actually run nice after being converted to DCC...better than in DC I would say. Keep in mind that there are a lot of analog locos that cost more than my cheap DCC controller! Happy railroading!


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

MacDaddy55 said:


> Guys I'm just too old school for my own good.....:laugh::laugh::laugh:!! Besides theres just something about foraging through old relic model train stuff that compels me to uohold those time honored traditions. when the first blossom on the cherry tree comes.....its Sailing Time....GARAGE SAIL THAT IS!!:laugh::laugh: kEEP IT REAL BABY!!


We're kindred spirits, MacDaddy:thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

I actually have it so I can run both DC and DCC on my layout...is nice to have the best of both worlds! I think the DC trains ran better after converting them to DCC. There are a lot of DC trains that cost more than my cheap DCC controller!


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

stationmaster said:


> Just a little shock treatment for you all. When I first starting converting to DCC, decoders, some anyway, were selling for $70. I just bought twelve for $75 shipped. The guy didn't need them. I sure do. No sound, but who cares?
> 
> Bob


In his best old codger's voice...

_"Ah 'member when the old GE Astrac system was out...by crackey, you could run 5 different trains on it...if they ran a'tall... THAT was real DCC...twern't 'til 19-ot-80 sumpin' when you could fit 'em inside the loco you wanted to run...by crackey...that was real railroadin'..."_


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

I guess a moderator has to approve my posts...I give up! Now all my messages will come at once! UGH!


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

:newbie: :newbie: :newbie:

Time to post up I guess.


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## Boston&Maine (Dec 19, 2007)

mr_x_ite_ment said:


> I guess a moderator has to approve my posts...I give up! Now all my messages will come at once! UGH!


I only deleted one of the doubles, so now that you have ten posts you should not run into this feature


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Thanks Boston&Maine...

I didn't realize there was a grace period for a newcomer when it comes to posts. I understand now, and should be good from this point forward...thanks!

Chad


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## scale-male (Feb 12, 2010)

I think like a lot of people my dad and I worked on HO scale when I was growing up. I really enjoy working on the O scales but when space is at a premium. I know about over 80% of the people I meet in the train store are HO fans.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Scale-male, welcome to the forum! You'll find a lot of HO people here. As you said, it's a popular scale. glad to have you.


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## scale-male (Feb 12, 2010)

Thanks Reckers,
I may have more questions than answers right now but hopefully will learn..


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Bring 'em on. These guys love questions!


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## Mit (Feb 12, 2010)

i grew up with an HO scale train. Also making things from scratch HO is the lowest scale i do and still be able to handle the stuff i make. In my area little is available and HO and n is about all u can find w/o mial order or traveling 120 miles to nearest retailer.


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## B.C.RAIL (Sep 1, 2008)

Talk about reviving an old thread.

Welcome Scale-male and Mit, to the forum.


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Someone dug deep into the wine cellar for this one. Sometimes a good thing..

Bob


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Would that wine happen to be Night Train?


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

Reckers said:


> Would that wine happen to be Night Train?


Nope.....Annie Greensprings. Remember that acetone/formaldehyde laden stuff? Whew!!! Nasty. Worse than Boone's Farm......

Bob


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## glgraphix (Dec 21, 2008)

LOL, I like O, but when it comes to size and detail, I dont think my decision to go HO was a bad one, lol.
My Dad had HO when I was a kid, I had O-27. But I always loved "dad's" stuff.

Now my boys have O-27, and I have HO. Guess the apple doesnt fall far from the tree..

Kevin


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## TONOFFUN80 (Jan 9, 2010)

HO just seems to fit my life better


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## B.C.RAIL (Sep 1, 2008)

As I always say. What ever floats your boat.


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## mkschram (Feb 8, 2010)

My decision to go with HO was made for me. My kids gave me a set for christmas a couple of years ago. I took it as a hint that they would be interested in working on a layout with me. I like the HO because the size is just right for the space that I have and also the wide variety and availability of stock and accessories.


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## stationmaster (Dec 7, 2008)

A bit off topic, but I knew a guy that had an N-scale layout in a closet, an O-gauge running around the ceiling in his family room, and one huge HO layout in his basement. I guess he just couldn't make up his mind.

I grew up with HO. Just like people that grow up with Chevrolets, Pontiacs, Oldsmobiles,Fords, Mercurys, or Chrylser products, they still seem to buy what they know most.

Bob


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## modeltrainhead (Nov 15, 2009)

my name too is kyle i was raised with HO popular, perfect size ECT.


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