# Need help/info on Atlanta 21160



## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

Just got back from a nice small local train show. To my surprise there was
a decent amount of Flyers there. Some real nice bargains also. Seems like
a lot of people are cleaning there attics out and trying to sell what they can.
Anyway bought a nice Atlanta 21160 (Price was a give away) got it home
and did my"number" on it to get to look good. Discovered it was hardly used
and all that was needed was a good clean up. Here is my question:

How do we get the tender (body) off of the frame? There is no screws underneath
and I assuming the body just snaps on the frame. I see there is two tabs in
the front that stick in slots. I do not want to force the back up until I know
more info. Anybody??? I want to tighten up the connectors that are inside 
of the tender. Need Help. Picture is enclosed. Thanks in advance--Larry:dunno:


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## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

Larry...if I remember right there are tabs on both front and rear of the tender. BUT...one pair, the rear, is much shorter than the other. Thats where you pry which will allow that side to release. Then remove the opposite end. Good luck...looks good.

Dave


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

daveh219 said:


> Larry...if I remember right there are tabs on both front and rear of the tender. BUT...one pair, the rear, is much shorter than the other. Thats where you pry which will allow that side to release. Then remove the opposite end. Good luck...looks good.
> 
> Dave


Dave; Thanks will try it. 95% of my flyer is 3 digit so I don't know to much on these
5 diget engines.Larry


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## Nuttin But Flyer (Dec 19, 2011)

Trying to check the drawings for clues but haven't had much luck. Will need to look at one of mine later on and report back, unless you've already figured it out. What Dave says might be right, but I cannot confirm until I look at mine.

The exploded drawing index states that the 21160 is the same as a #307 - but that drawing shows screws used. Well, that's not very helpful.....


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

Nuttin But Flyer said:


> Trying to check the drawings for clues but haven't had much luck. Will need to look at one of mine later on and report back, unless you've already figured it out. What Dave says might be right, but I cannot confirm until I look at mine.
> 
> The exploded drawing index states that the 21160 is the same as a #307 - but that drawing shows screws used. Well, that's not very helpful.....


N/B/F: Thanks for the response; no have not tried it yet; on other projects right now. 
Difinitlely no screws with this one. Let me know if you find out. Just don't know how much
force it takes; don't want to break this as it is "mint" larry


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

daveh219 said:


> Larry...if I remember right there are tabs on both front and rear of the tender. BUT...one pair, the rear, is much shorter than the other. Thats where you pry which will allow that side to release. Then remove the opposite end. Good luck...looks good.
> 
> Dave


More bad luck today tried the above but it would not come off the frame. Any more force
would have broke it. With these ideas that came from Flyer at the last stages is it any
wonder why they went broke? Larry P.S. Have given up on this idea also.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

I don't mess with the 5 digit atlantics.I have a 21105 and a 21160, but they were in perfect working order, and now are packed away. The tender issue is why I don't like them.


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## Aflyer (Nov 10, 2010)

IIskis,
I don't have one of those locomotives, so I just went through the K-Line Complete Service Manual for American Flyer to see what I could find.

The 21160 is not listed separately, but it states in the book to use the diagrams for a 307, so I looked at it, and unfortunately the 307 has screws holding the tender shell to the frame.

I then looked at the 21165 & 21168 which has no written instructions, but in the exploded diagram it shows two tabs on the front of the tender frame & no tabs on the back. Maybe that helps, maybe not. Best I could find.

Aflyer


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## Nuttin But Flyer (Dec 19, 2011)

I found a Pacific tender with what I believe is the same type of setup as you have -- the chassis floor is inserted with what appear to be longer tabs into the plastic tender shell in front while the rear tabs are a bit shorter -- two tabs at each end. Upon inspection, I noticed that on one side of the rear (mine was RH side), the chassis sheet metal floor was "notched" and the resulting tab was bent down or inward into the tender shell slightly, perhaps at about a 30 degree angle. Although I did not realize it at the time, I believe if you get a small bladed screwdriver in there to bend the tab up nearly horizontal and level with the rest of the chassis floor, it should easily slide forward thus releasing the rear two (shorter) tabs from the body so it can be lifted out. As I said, I didn't notice the bent tab at first and I went ahead and forced a small bladed screwdriver in between the chassis floor and the rear of the tender body to pry it free. Luckily it did come free without breakage. The bent tab, when in the bent position described earlier, seems to hold the chassis from sliding against the now unused screw hole support boss inside the tender shell. Bend it up and it should easily slide out, maybe with a bit of coaxing between the chassis floor and rear tender shell. But be gentle. Hope this helps.


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## Nuttin But Flyer (Dec 19, 2011)

I then reinserted my chassis floor in the tender shell and being sure the floor was slid all the way rearward, used a screwdriver and needle-nosed pliers to bend the tab back down to be seated against the screw boss in side the tender shell. This seems to work.


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## Strummer (Jan 6, 2013)

I have not had any problem with the frame removal on this particular tender; you just have to be patient and take your time.
Having said that,I much prefer the earlier 3 digit Atlantics,if for no other reason I like the feel and heft of the die-cast bodies.I wish the C&NW Pacifics weren't plastic...

Mark in Oregon


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

Strummer said:


> I have not had any problem with the frame removal on this particular tender; you just have to be patient and take your time.
> Having said that,I much prefer the earlier 3 digit Atlantics,if for no other reason I like the feel and heft of the die-cast bodies.I wish the C&NW Pacifics weren't plastic...
> 
> Mark in Oregon


Mark: Thanks for the comments. Believe I am as patient as they come; just don't
want to brake that tender plastic. I guess what I'm trying to say I just don't know
how much that plastic will give before cracking?? Larry:dunno:


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

Nuttin But Flyer said:


> I found a Pacific tender with what I believe is the same type of setup as you have -- the chassis floor is inserted with what appear to be longer tabs into the plastic tender shell in front while the rear tabs are a bit shorter -- two tabs at each end. Upon inspection, I noticed that on one side of the rear (mine was RH side), the chassis sheet metal floor was "notched" and the resulting tab was bent down or inward into the tender shell slightly, perhaps at about a 30 degree angle. Although I did not realize it at the time, I believe if you get a small bladed screwdriver in there to bend the tab up nearly horizontal and level with the rest of the chassis floor, it should easily slide forward thus releasing the rear two (shorter) tabs from the body so it can be lifted out. As I said, I didn't notice the bent tab at first and I went ahead and forced a small bladed screwdriver in between the chassis floor and the rear of the tender body to pry it free. Luckily it did come free without breakage. The bent tab, when in the bent position described earlier, seems to hold the chassis from sliding against the now unused screw hole support boss inside the tender shell. Bend it up and it should easily slide out, maybe with a bit of coaxing between the chassis floor and rear tender shell. But be gentle. Hope this helps.


Finally had the time to get back to this problem. I did the above with a small screwdriver
and did manage to get the tender off. I thought I could tighten the small holes that receive the connectors from the engine but really could not do anything with them. I think I solved the problem by pushing the "solder blades" more together and by doing that is now "catches" the prongs from the the engine connector. Not sure how long this will last. It is working for now. Larryhwell:


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## Nuttin But Flyer (Dec 19, 2011)

So it sounds like the problem is the plug prongs from the engine harness sliding into the receptacle on the tender do not make tight contact?

If that is the issue, you might try to slightly bend the prongs to a slight curvature, or toward each other, so they make tighter contact. However, even though I suggested it, I probably would not do it. I once tried to resolve one of these before -- the prongs are quite strong to resist bending and the plastic plug body doesn't take much to break it. It would probably fracture if you try this. New repro plugs are available from Doug Peck through his Port Lines Hobby website (under Steamers, General), he might also have the receptacle for the tender, although it wasn't in the listing. You may need to email him and ask if it's available. Otherwise, I'm not sure much can be done. Maybe you add some solder to the plug prongs to "enlarge" them to tighten this connection??


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

Nuttin But Flyer said:


> So it sounds like the problem is the plug prongs from the engine harness sliding into the receptacle on the tender do not make tight contact?
> 
> If that is the issue, you might try to slightly bend the prongs to a slight curvature, or toward each other, so they make tighter contact. However, even though I suggested it, I probably would not do it. I once tried to resolve one of these before -- the prongs are quite strong to resist bending and the plastic plug body doesn't take much to break it. It would probably fracture if you try this. New repro plugs are available from Doug Peck through his Port Lines Hobby website (under Steamers, General), he might also have the receptacle for the tender, although it wasn't in the listing. You may need to email him and ask if it's available. Otherwise, I'm not sure much can be done. Maybe you add some solder to the plug prongs to "enlarge" them to tighten this connection??


N/B/F: Thanks for the ideas. I wonder if Flyer intended for the prongs to be caught by
the blades of the connectors? For being a mint; hardly used engine the holes are just
to big. GOT TO WATCH HOW WE SAY THINGS HERE AS SOMEONE MIGHT THINK WE GETTING INTO A X-RATED
CONVERSATION! Ha Ha--Larry


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

llskis said:


> n/b/f: Thanks for the ideas. I wonder if flyer intended for the prongs to be caught by
> the blades of the connectors? For being a mint; hardly used engine the holes are just
> to big. Got to watch how we say things here as someone might think we getting into a x-rated
> conversation! Ha ha--larry:d


what?...huh?....where?


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## Nuttin But Flyer (Dec 19, 2011)

Now you did it...woke up Flyernut....


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

Nuttin But Flyer said:


> Now you did it...woke up Flyernut....


 My first good laugh of the day,Don.. Thanks for posting!!!


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## llskis (Apr 11, 2013)

All kindin aside I may have to take N/B/F idea of adding a little bit of solder to the prongs.
Will see if my idea holds 1st. Thanks for the idea's. Larry:appl:


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