# Transferring from plan onto plywood



## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

I am wondering if the best way is to use tracing paper or if most just eyeball it using a grid method. I have also seen some using cutouts, is there a standard that most follow by chance? I don’t see much online bout this aspect.

thanks, Gary


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Lots of measuring. 

I started by measuring how far from the edge my trackplan placed the track and went from there. I use a contractor 5' steel rule and a Sharpie.


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## briangcc (Oct 11, 2012)

I had a plan when I started. Then it promptly got modified several times over...mostly due to “what was I thinking here” moments. Although my wife also expanded the layout a few times and I have approval for further expansion...she has a country church she just bought and wants her farm scene increased.

So I’d go with the “plan” being more of a guide than a hard and fast “track goes here” type thing.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Using the trackplan as a 'guide' may produce unexpected results on the other side of the layout.


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## D&J Railroad (Oct 4, 2013)

You'll certainly have to improvise as you work through it, unless of course it's just a 4x8 sheet of plywood.
It's hard to draw in the curve transitions on paper unless you really want those jerky corners like the Christmas tree trainsets do. Same with grade transitions. Ease into them or experience the uncoupling of your rolling stock at the top and bottom of the hill. Snap track is not your friend in these cases unless this is just for the kiddies to play "train wreck" with.
It's all been done before and the method for good track has been well published.


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

Thank you everyone


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

~*Gary*, might I suggest your purchasing a book or two on the subject with titles like "How to Build a MRR", "Model Railroad Benchwork", "HO/N Scale Model Railroading", et al. at a hobby shop or on ebay..
Having these will cut way down on the tediousness of getting your questions clear enough, here, as opposed to in person at a club, say, which is near zero these days w/Covid. ..
~I will say this, though: Before putting tracks on a flat plywood surface do look into 'open-grid' and 'L-girder benchwork' or around the walls/shelfie type layouts...*M*


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## Lehigh74 (Sep 25, 2015)

I’ve seen one or two people that printed their plan full scale and laid it out on their platform. I built my layout using Gargraves flex track and went around the perimeter like Michael keeping the track the desired distance from the edge.

Since you asked about standards, you may not be familiar with NMRA. It’s good to follow their recommendations on distance between tracks and obstacle clearances.






NMRA Standards and Recommended Practices


The NMRA uses five types of Technical Documents to present information. The NMRA, in its standards and recommended practices, addresses only the specific standards and recommended practices for model railroads. These standards and recommended practices do not address any legal requirements. It...




www.nmra.org


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## rsv1ho (Oct 16, 2019)

A lot depends on the size of your layout.

I started out with one of Atlas's plans then quickly changed over to just winging it using the dimensions of my layout as a guide. I knew I wanted three tracks and reverse loops and went form there.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

📌
For me, an adult, this would bore if not frustrate me to death after a while;...not a hill, tunnel, trestle, nary a tangent in main line/spiral after spiral, main yard poor side in relation to panel, getting in the back corner (and good luck with uncoupling ramps back there !)..I do Hope you were successful w/reversing section at yellow station, though. By the 2 early MRC throttles (power packs) I can tell it's an analog DC controlled pike, is why I say that..
I guess those Atlas sliders are block polarity/on-off controls; as train reverses, each block it approaches needs matching polarity (Other buttons control switches [TOs]). 
Oh, how I remember those days and why today's blessed DCC is soooooo much easier to run realistically with.

Yes, clan, I'm aware this can be construed as a snooty, value-judgement post. At least I'm being honest..Call it tough love, M


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

Thank you Lehigh and RSV, much appreciated


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## Chops (Dec 6, 2018)

That’s a banging cool layout, there.


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

Yes, I actually like it as well


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## rsv1ho (Oct 16, 2019)

Thanks T and all.

I didn't post that picture to garner praise or criticism, but rather as an example of what the original poster could do by expanding a plan.

An "adult" here also, 83 and still vertical at last check, the layout is anything but boring. Clearing the track and running an engine or two through all the tracks and reverse loops while throwing the appropriate switches can be quite exciting and if not done properly, tragic. DC/DCC makes it to easy, and I did not want to make the investment to make a couple hundred locomotives compatible. But, I must admit, it would be nice. 

As you can see, I'm not much into landscaping, although that could come. The yellow sliders are for future lighting should I be so inclined. I enjoy buying old locomotives that need repair and fixing them. All locomotives pictured either did not run or ran poorly. Now they all run like they should.

I intend to replace the right vintage MRC with a slightly less vintage MRC "Sound and Power" a recent nostalgia buy from memories of an old layout I once had.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

telltale said:


> Yes, clan, I'm aware this can be construed as a snooty, value-judgement post. At least I'm being honest..Call it tough love, M


Yes, it was all of that. 

I suggest you adhere to the idea that if you wouldn't say it to someone's face, refrain from saying it here. Not everyone views the model train hobby through the same eyes.


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

I love that panel board as well, super cool !


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

telltale said:


> 📌
> For me, an adult, this would bore if not frustrate me to death after a while;...not a hill, tunnel, trestle, nary a tangent in main line/spiral after spiral, main yard poor side in relation to panel, getting in the back corner (and good luck with uncoupling ramps back there !)..I do Hope you were successful w/reversing section at yellow station, though. By the 2 early MRC throttles (power packs) I can tell it's an analog DC controlled pike, is why I say that..
> I guess those Atlas sliders are block polarity/on-off controls; as train reverses, each block it approaches needs matching polarity (Other buttons control switches [TOs]).
> Oh, how I remember those days and why today's blessed DCC is soooooo much easier to run realistically with.
> ...


Nope. No construing necessary. It IS snooty, judgemental, and obnoxious (implying that only a child would enjoy this layout; PLEASE!). You may be honest, but you're way off base. His layout, his rules. If you can't be constructive, just don't comment.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

BigGRacing said:


> I am wondering if the best way is to use tracing paper or if most just eyeball it using a grid method. I have also seen some using cutouts, is there a standard that most follow by chance? I don’t see much online bout this aspect.
> 
> thanks, Gary


BigGRacing;

I highly recommend getting the book "Track Planning for Realistic Operation" by John Armstrong. It is the masterwork on the subject of track planning and covers getting your track plan from paper to plywood, along with many other useful bits of information. Check on www.amazon.com you should be able to pick up a used copy at a low price. However, this particular book is so repeatedly useful as a reference work that you may want to buy a new one. Since you're new, some of the book may not be of direct use now, but you will find yourself going back to it many times, as you learn more.

Traction Fan 🙂


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

Well, Too bad..I gave my honest opinion and proud I spoke my mind instead of being a 'yes man' all the time...
This flat 4x8 thing has been going on too long now...It causes stagnation and eventual disinterest and even abandonment of the hobby, the owner not knowing the virtues of better bench work such as open grid and L girder. 
I wonder if there is anyone else out there honest enough to admit they thought the same thing !


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

Thank you Traction Fan ! I will see if my buddy has it first and if not, I will order a copy. I am fitting and making it work so far....lol


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

And telltale, I haven’t found your layout online to try and get some tips or enjoy the pics, is it available by chance?


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

*Gary*, I had to move 2 times since my last layout...I do have pix.. I will find out how to download them; something I've never done before..I actually bought a Coolpix camera exactly for that...When I do I probably will start a new thread for it instead of in this one as my laziness and other pressing concerns may cause it to be later rather than sooner.. 
But what you have so far looks nice just the same...


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## rsv1ho (Oct 16, 2019)

telltale said:


> Well, Too bad..I gave my honest opinion and proud I spoke my mind instead of being a 'yes man' all the time...
> This flat 4x8 thing has been going on too long now...It causes stagnation and eventual disinterest and even abandonment of the hobby, the owner not knowing the virtues of better bench work such as open grid and L girder.
> I wonder if there is anyone else out there honest enough to admit they thought the same thing !


It's always nice to learn that something you poured three months of your life, money, and effort into stinks.  

Not a problem for me T, it's your opinion. But my layout works for me and I hope that the originator of this thread finds something that works for him. A simple internet search turns up many that will help him turn ideas into something real.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

📌
Thanks *rsv1ho.  *Yes it is just my opinion...And I've already complimented him in #22..
~You see, folks, it's not at all that I'm heartless about what others love about trains...Though it doesn't sound true I love everything trains, save for some non-US types I care not for, 1:1 scale as well as model..
I did, tho, slowly, across decades, became attracted to British model railroading, their OO scale, yet on 'our' HO gaug-ed track; plus their 1:1 scale trackwork, how it's seemingly, or is, more manicured than our's.. But there's a logical explanation for that we need not go into here, but which fascinates me, too..
The words I use which I realize can upset some, are not coming from a vindictive place... It's also tough to create a paragraph in such a way as to not come off that way...But to do that can conger up lying, pacifying, brow beating, even back-handed complimenting...
My, we'll say, brashness, really comes from a deep desire, built of 5-6 decades of failures and successes in the hobby, is just my way of 'telling it like it is' to use an old adage. I'm not putting anyone down..I'm, in my own bittersweet way trying to show some a different way of thinking about what they are trying to capture, how best to do that...
Look, to me there's too much vestigial stuff left in the hobby dating back to the 1940s..Yes, homes were huge then, trains were BIG and heavy..and originally put out on the wooden farm size house floors, pushed, then wind-up, then electric..
Wha Laaah !! Electric trains !!! From the floor they graduated to tables..Somewhere in the 1950s grid type benchwork (like house framing on its side) was introduced to this now HUGE hobby !!! 
I too had my first layout, AF, then HO on the old 4'X8', too; that same one with the figure 8 over itself (6% grade probably !) in middle of bent oval made of brass Atlas Snap Track/MRC PPack.......et al....
But, Oh what I took away from that maddening experience thru becoming a responsible young adult to how it is today !!! 
So when I see someone again repeating the old 'lesson-learners' I get a strong urge to tell them about it...But I still respect the choice they do make, and have always wished only the best to everyone in this,........the world's greatest hobby !!! 
I'm not a naysayer.. I'm just stokin' the fire with bigger chunks of anthracite here in this virtual MRRC. 

Mark 91030 
How 'bout those Dodgers, huh !! 
🏭🛤🌄🌵


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

CTValleyRR said:


> Nope. No construing necessary. It IS snooty, judgemental, and obnoxious (implying that only a child would enjoy this layout; PLEASE!). You may be honest, but you're way off base. His layout, his rules. If you can't be constructive, just don't comment.



The IGNORE button has come in very handy for his juvenile remarks and attitude. Like he's not even here.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

telltale said:


> Well, Too bad..I gave my honest opinion and proud I spoke my mind instead of being a 'yes man' all the time...
> This flat 4x8 thing has been going on too long now...It causes stagnation and eventual disinterest and even abandonment of the hobby, the owner not knowing the virtues of better bench work such as open grid and L girder.
> I wonder if there is anyone else out there honest enough to admit they thought the same thing !


Way to double down on being an arrogant ***. The OP didn't ask for an critique of his design, nor is this an appropriate place to discuss your philosophy of what's leading to the death of the hobby (and you're letting your arrogance and ignorance blind you on that, too, but that's another topic). You want to start your own thread, fine, we'll discuss your holier-than-thou ideas there. But you chime in on a thread about how to transfer a layout design to the actual table top with a monumentally unhelpful, off topic rant, which is insulting to the OP as well, and you're way out of bounds.

Honesty has its time and its place, as do tact, diplomacy, and wisdom. Perhaps you think your age and experience gives you a pass on this, but it doesn't. This is a social interaction, and if you can't handle the basic ettiquette of the situation, perhaps you should shut yourself jn your layout room and have your prototypical rail operations on your perfect layout where your boorish behavior won't bother anyone, and stay off the forums, where your attitude causes nothing but trouble.

For everyone else, I apologize for this off topic post, but I've had enough.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MichaelE said:


> The IGNORE button has come in very handy for his juvenile remarks and attitude. Like he's not even here.


No argument. But you ignore the bully, you just encourage him.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

If every member has him on IGNORE no one will even notice him.

Now where is that can of Troll spray I had?


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

Good points CTV


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

What's wrong with warning adult new comers about the foibles of 4x8 train layouts.. It's a near 80 year old archaic way to do it and can cause those unaware of other methods of benchwork to become disenchanted with trains altogether..
Suggesting open grid and L girder bench alternatives strengthens the continued membership in the hobby..For dads or moms putting out tracks for their youngsters a table is fine. The other methods are better for those serious about continuing in the hobby who are more likely to be concerned with realism in grade %, bridge, tunnel, and scenery formation..
Go ahead, ignore me. Cold shoulder me. I very well know there are members in this forum who totally agree with me. The error you make is accusing me of criticizing the person, not the choice of benchwork that I set out to do, in order *to* bolster his or her continued comfort with the hobby...
How many of you have encouraged someone to convert from early analog DC to DCC for more realistic operation ? What's the difference ?
M


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Yes, it was all of that.
> 
> I suggest you adhere to the idea that if you wouldn't say it to someone's face, refrain from saying it here. Not everyone views the model train hobby through the same eyes.


📌
If you were referring to me, what makes you so sure I* wouldn't* say it to someone's face; the friendly idea I've got that if he were to hold off a bit:
"There are alternatives newcomers like yourself may not be aware of, Drake" (Said I) 
"Oh, yeah, Mark ? What a ya mean ?"...
"We'll.....if, *If* I may continue....."
"Yeah, of course Mark ! Continue "....
"You see, Drake, one alternative to your table plan is, there's what's called 'open grid' benchwork."
"Go on, Mark"..
"Well, Drake it goes like this:........
If you skipped the table idea, open grid allows you to way way easier set the grades that..........etc. etc.. Plus, there are one or two more, such as L girder, shelfie, [yadda yadda yadda], Drake."
"Oh ! Cool Mark !! Wanna come by and help me ? I'm on board !" (standing *face to face* in the club, chatting over our DCC throttles, running trains hither and dither).
"No prob, Drake ! Love it !! See ya here Sat. I'll follow you in my car. "
"Later dude !!"
"Later !!"..........[Cue commercial>

Somptin maybe like dat folks ? For that's all it was and would be, face to face or screen to screen..
Do I get a 10-4 from a n y o n e ? No ? Well, that's sad because I know yer out dair !!!

One last thing before I permanently discontinue in this thread for my own sanity:
I did say the word LOVE bottom of my comment in question...tough 'love'...
Anyone brave enough to say *that *back to me in your next criticism *of* me, no doubt on the way ? ! M


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Thank you for your last two posts. As my math and logic professors used to say: "QED"

That's the shorthand for _quad eat demonstrandem, _a Latin phrase which is generally translated as "Thus it is proven."

You clearly just don't get it, and probably never will. But I'll take your challenge. I LOVE all my fellow human beings, always and forever, you included. Both that doesn't mean that I have to tolerate how they act. If I did not seek to make you a better person, I would be failing in my duty. There is a difference between being physically grown up and being an adult. The latter requires an emotional maturity, sense of responsibility, and understanding of complex interdependancies, that you obviously either never reached, or have lost somewhere. Your grade-school level understanding of these concepts show that. When I made the comment in another thread that you poisoned about it sounding like a playground argument, I wasn't kidding. When your approach to a discussion does not differ from that of an elementary school child, you aren't demonstrating adult behavior, no matter what your physical age. 

No one is challenging (here, anyway) the accuracy of your sentiments or ideas: this issue is the appropriateness of presenting them in the way you did, and in the place you chose to xxpress them.

But for the record, THE BIGGEST barrier to entry into this hobby, far and away, are the obnoxious curmudgeons who belittle the efforts of newcomers as not good enough, not the way "real model railroaders do it, etc". I wish there were fewer of you around.

As I realize from your last two posts that I am wasting my breath, I will leave off now.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

* 📌 
~~~ADDENDUM / AMENDMENT~~~*

To: CTValley & Other RwyCo. Police Dept. 11/01/20 6pm

When I wrote the oh so harsh heartless, cowardly, socially explosive stick of dynamite I assumed due to his photo I was talking to a grown man. Usually little boys who've grown up can take and even expect the slings and arrows of society. So I told the adult gentleman what I though; my honest adult story of how I see it; mainly the way certain choices can dictate certain outcomes and hassles..I 'told it like it is' assuming a big guy like he can withstand the impact, the shock, the idea that there are alternatives !! On top of this I wrote it thinking he hasn't begun yet. Until I saw pix later I'd no idea the OP's cube-like 'continual' already was under construction...
I, in no way, (though you'll still go off cursing me for the Trhump-lying-at-any-cost tactic ) would ever have posed it that way had I know the member was a teen or younger...I was, at time of writing, talking with a man among-st mostly men..What I said about it is exactly what I derive from that type of train layout and proud I said aloud already, already !....
It's your not respecting my honesty; that we all need to puss-y-foot with others in trains at all times or we're bad people who must now be ostracized and called for to be ignored, on out, which is just as cruel, if not more so..
And that's OK. Because:
~ I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and gosh darn it,.......people like me ! ~
(except some of you)
This *is* in fact my final say in this thread..
*M*

PS. I did order a USB cable to download my now-saddly gone open grid apartment, HO switchback bridge route layout pics from my Nikon Coolpix...This of course will be a new thread..when I've come up for air again after the election !!! 😷


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## rvnmedic6869 (Oct 29, 2019)

Ugghh... should have made popcorn and had a bottle of Bourbon before reading this thread.


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## Stejones82 (Dec 22, 2020)

traction fan said:


> BigGRacing;
> 
> I highly recommend getting the book "Track Planning for Realistic Operation" by John Armstrong. It is the masterwork on the subject of track planning and covers getting your track plan from paper to plywood, along with many other useful bits of information. Check on www.amazon.com you should be able to pick up a used copy at a low price. However, this particular book is so repeatedly useful as a reference work that you may want to buy a new one. Since you're new, some of the book may not be of direct use now, but you will find yourself going back to it many times, as you learn more.
> 
> Traction Fan 🙂


ORDERED !! Thank you, sir. Just getting started myself and looking for good sound advice.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

Stejones82 said:


> ORDERED !! Thank you, sir. Just getting started myself and looking for good sound advice.


Stejones82;

You're welcome! Since you are just getting started, you might find the information in these files useful. I wrote them for beginners planning a first layout.

Good Luck & Have Fun;

Traction Fan 🙂


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