# Lionel 313 Bridge parts and questions



## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

Hi to all,
I always wanted to get a Lionel 313 bascule bridge for our layout but knew it wouldn't be in the family budget. My son actually spotted one in the display case at Goodwill . Got it for $15.00! Needs a lot of work but I enjoy a challenge. Two items that I'm hoping the forum might be able to help me with are ,(see photos.)

The rod that connects the gearbox assembly to the top of the bridge (pencil points to part) is broken at the top. Is this part available as a reproduction or original or is this something that I may need to fabricate?

The bridge base assembly is broken but I believe I can get it back together. One of the outside rails is missing .(Is this part something that can be found? I could probably make this up out of a couple of pieces of track if needed.

On a lot of the photos I have seen of these ,this one is a prewar unit grey painted bridge, there is a long black U shaped channel with a connector. Do I need this part to operate the bridge? If so I could make up something .I believe it's just a switch /contact to cut the power so I'm hoping it may not be needed. 

Couldn't find a parts diagram anywhere. Cant even find a wiring diagram to rewire it. If anyone has any information or restoration tips to get this up and running it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks to all in advance.
Dad Roadie


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

dad roadie said:


> Hi to all,
> I always wanted to get a Lionel 313 bascule bridge for our layout but knew it wouldn't be in the family budget. My son actually spotted one in the display case at Goodwill . Got it for $15.00! Needs a lot of work but I enjoy a challenge. Two items that I'm hoping the forum might be able to help me with are ,(see photos.)
> 
> The rod that connects the gearbox assembly to the top of the bridge (pencil points to part) is broken at the top. Is this part available as a reproduction or original or is this something that I may need to fabricate?
> ...


Real quickly I am on my way out the door.

You don't need that black U frame to use it, a lot don't use it as you see it when the bridge is up. Doesn't look too realistic.

Here is Jeff's part list for the 313. Page 3 scroll to the #313. If it is not there give Jeff a call, he will help you out if he can.
http://www.ttender.com/partslist.html

Olsen's site only has a part number page, and it is for a Post war 313, 
http://pictures.olsenstoy.com/searchcd31.htm?itm=282

I have a 313 thread, but it won't help you much.
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=2753

Somewhere I think there is a wire diagram I will see if I can find it when I get a chance.
Maybe someone will post it before then.

My repair book has a wire diagram on how to hook up the bridge to the track.
I will scan and post but it might not be till friday.
Again maybe someone can beat me to it.

There may be one online somewhere.

Here is the wiring diagram as it appears in Toy Train Repair Made Easy:










The one I can scan in my book is easier to understand.
Take in account this is for a post war version.

Got to go.........:smokin:


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*Thank you!*

Big Ed,
Thanks for the reply and the links! Any help is greatly appreciated. I'm hoping to get this up and running again. Has anyone restored one of these ? Anything to keep a watch out for?
Dad Roadie


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*repair help and base question lionel 313*

I wanted to thank Big Ed again for replying and hope to get a couple of questions answered from others. This forum has been a great resource in getting our trains running again. I hope that I might be able to repay someday as I learn more about this great hobby.

Could anyone that owns one of these and has restored a basket case unit give me some ideals of the best way to get to the control link between the gearbox and the top of the bridge ? Mines broken at the top. I'm ordering a new one from Jeff at the Train tender . Any thing to be careful of during disassemble of the rest of the bridge?? I couldn't find any kind of parts breakdown anywhere. I'm going to need to do a complete tear down.

My bridge base is very warped on the spring side. I can submit a picture if needed. Has anyone had any luck straightening one of these out? Mines a little to far gone to sand or shim I believe. I was thinking of making a clamping base set out of wood and slowly adding pressure to it over the summer in small increments to try to straighten it out. I know the base is going to be very prone to breaking. Any other ideals would be welcome or is it a lost cause.

Also is there anyway to turn off the AD Choice pop up? I don't know why it comes up only on my thread. I don't want to force people to read ads if they don't have to unless there is a good reason . 
Again thanks to all and I will try and load some photos this weekend.
I'm hoping to rebuild this in time for The Christmas layout this year.
All the Best!
Dad Roadie


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

dad roadie said:


> I wanted to thank Big Ed again for replying and hope to get a couple of questions answered from others. This forum has been a great resource in getting our trains running again. I hope that I might be able to repay someday as I learn more about this great hobby.
> 
> Could anyone that owns one of these and has restored a basket case unit give me some ideals of the best way to get to the control link between the gearbox and the top of the bridge ? Mines broken at the top. I'm ordering a new one from Jeff at the Train tender . Any thing to be careful of during disassemble of the rest of the bridge?? I couldn't find any kind of parts breakdown anywhere. I'm going to need to do a complete tear down.
> 
> ...


I forgot all about the scan, sorry.
I found this it is about the same thing as in the book,


































I found this too,










There is very little, in fact nothing on a complete disassembly.

I think one of our members may have done some, I got to remember which one.
I never did anything to my 313.

Note, for the small print, hit the control key and then tap the + sign to make the print larger, then hit the - sign to go back to normal.

I will go see if I can find the member.

Another note is that the bridge takes a special rail pin, if you don't have them, I think Jeff does.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Maybe try to PM the Original poster of this thread,
mcshabs

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=21056

he has not been here for a while, he might have email notifications set up. 
There are some crummy pictures in that thread that I tried to take of the rod, can't see much from them.

He must have had his apart, but after I answered in the thread, he never even said boo on the site again.hwell:
I guess he didn't like my pictures or instructions on how to post a picture.

I can't find anything on the net about tearing down a 313.:dunno:

I think there is someone else who has worked on this bridge, but I can't find who.

I am going to see if I can get some better pictures to post. 
Big race day today, back to back Indy 500 then the Coke 600. :thumbsup:


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I forgot to add, install this for your browser, https://adblockplus.org/
It comes up for chrome, look to the right of the install for chrome and pick whatever browser you're using.
ad block plus, I do not see a single ad.

If your on tap talk your on your own.


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*lionel 313 photos*

Thanks Big Ed for all your help on this!
I have included some photos. As you can see I have my work cut out for me but I like a challenge! Any ideals about the warp on the base? I can drill the holes in the corners as suggested but I'm worried that it may snap the base. I did take the tension off the spring to hopefully ease the pressure on it till I get all my information together. I'm really hoping to get this up and running again.
All the Best!
Dad Roadie


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## teledoc (Oct 22, 2014)

Not much to add in dis-assembly/re-assembly, but make sure to take plenty of photos during tear down, and re-assembly. It will prove invaluable when trying to put it back together. Place parts in small baggies and mark them as what parts are what. You have a challenge ahead but know with patience, it will be worth it. There are a few of us who enjoy resurrecting derelicts from the supposed trash heap.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I looked at my 313 to see if I could take some better pictures.
I can't unless I take it apart, right now that is not going to happen.
It is hard to even get a look up there.
It works. So I don't want to tear it apart. 

I did find this over in OGR, download the link and save. ( the link is in the thread there.)
It is about the most I can find on instructions for this bridge.
It has some assembly pages explaining the parts with more detail than my book does.
Towards the end it has a few pictures I never saw before.
It might help you a little.


Service and Repair of the Lionel 313 Bascule Bridge

If I find anymore I will add here.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I just saw your pictures, could you make them larger?

I wonder what happened to that base to do that?
I wonder if you could find another instead of trying to fix it.

Post better pictures if you can of the damage, larger.

I would bet our T man could fix that up.
*T Man?*

The motor should clean up, does it show any signs of life?
Have you tried it yet?


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*Thanks again and to the base!*

Thanks Again Ed!
Your help on this has gone way above anything I would have even thought of.
I hope I can repay the debt sometime.
I actually just brought home an aluminum plate that's just a little bigger than the warped base on the 313.
My hope is to dis-assemble the 313 to take the tension off and then clamp the warped base to the aluminum plate . I'm planning on adding tension to the parts using screws through the Lionel base mounting holes in small increments during the summer to hopefully keep the base from cracking.
*If anyone thinks I'm heading for disaster please let me know.[/B] 
Has any other forum members had any luck straightening one of these out? 
I have added a photo again to help.
Thanks again to all!
Dad Roadie*


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Did you download that link on the other site?

It has disassemble and assembly info I have never seen anywhere else.

It also states in there that if the bridge sits for a long time without being used it is best to loosen up on the tension spring to prevent warping of the base.
It also says not to tighten that spring too much as it cause a strain on the motor.

E bay has a couple of them for around $35 bucks plus shipping.

See if this link works,
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1550-Lionel...125?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d58b5ec9d

Otherwise just search Lionel 313 parts, there are 2 in there.

See how this came out after a re-size, you need to make your pictures larger somehow.










I think the e bay link is working?
Picture a little better but you really can't see the warping from the shot.
I will go check out your other pictures.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

This one shows the damage better,


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Might as well throw a larger one in of the motor?

Looks like it needs a LOT of cleaning, I wonder if it was under water at one time or just in a damp environment?

Can't hurt to spray it down with WD 40 and let it start working on it.

I use this stuff, a great product. I deliver to them, our trucks get to deliver to them twice a week. I was given a free can, I am looking for more.:thumbsup:
http://www.criticalcleaning.com/products/product?Category=lubricants&Item=A194

It did wonders on this save, link below, good stuff.:smilie_daumenpos:
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=15024


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*better photos*

Hopefully these are better photos
As you can see its pretty bad.
Any ideals on straightening this out would be great!
Thanks in Advance
Dad Roadie


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I didn't see that bend in your other pictures, I thought you were talking about the broken span.

First, I would unhook the tension spring.
As far as straightening it I thought maybe someone here would add some thoughts.
Heck some here have straightened out cast metal, this should be a lot easier to straighten then cast if it is metal.
I would think that taking it completely apart is needed. Then use heat? I would have to look at mine but without running down to the dungeon to look, I think that is metal right?

If you do take it all apart, take a whole bunch of pictures so when you put it back together you have them for reference.

Read that link, it has assembly instructions/tips in it.
Did you download it?


I ran down the dungeon to look, that is cast huh?
It looks easy to get the towers off, just twist (very carefully) the 4 tabs on the base of the towers and that base will be free. The less twisting on the tabs you do, the better it is they will break off.

You might be able to use pressure over time to re straighten it. Very slowly over the course of a week or two to you apply pressure with clamps to re straighten. 

I will look for the thread on bending out a cast piece.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I found this, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=16318&page=2

Scroll to post #64 it shows how he straightened a cast locomotive.
Somehow you could apply the same principal to straighten your base?
Just clamps and pressure, adjusting the clamps over a period of time will re straighten it.
But the key words are over a period of time, you got to go slow or it might snap.

*The main thing is to go real slow over time it straightens out. And no heat on the cast, ( I think)*.

I have never tried to straighten out a bent cast piece yet.

I think there is another thread for this too?
I believe Servoguy has done this? Or maybe it was the T man?

Hell, I thought *someone *would offer a little help for you, I guess not?:dunno:

I am out the door, I will search more later.:smokin:


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*Thanks again and to the base! reprise*

Ed,
Again thanks for the help. I will try and make a photo journal of the progress. 
I really hope someone that has done this sort of thing in the past will offer some suggestions but I'm not sure if that will happen. I'm really concerned about breaking the base
Again Thanks ! It's sounds like you are an extremely busy person and it's really nice of you to take the time to offer your help and moral support. That's what this hobby is all about.
I hope as I learn more I will be able to repay.
All the Best!
Dad Roadie


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*well heres what happened!*

To All,
Well I took the plunge and disconnected the spring (no problem, Straightened the 8 tabs holding the superstructure to the base. (again no problem) the bridge separated from the base very easily with no prying needed (Thats good except the base came off in 2 pieces!). It cracked along the outside small rail. I would imagine when I took the tension completely off the spring it was too much and caused it to break. As a suggestion to anyone trying to do this take the tension off in very small steps. I'm still going to try and repair the base using the aluminum plate .The break is long an clean hopefully I can get creative and figure out something. 
If anyone is interested in the outcome let me know and I'll post some pictures if it works.
All the Best!
dad roadie


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

dad roadie said:


> To All,
> Well I took the plunge and disconnected the spring (no problem, Straightened the 8 tabs holding the superstructure to the base. (again no problem) the bridge separated from the base very easily with no prying needed (Thats good except the base came off in 2 pieces!). It cracked along the outside small rail. I would imagine when I took the tension completely off the spring it was too much and caused it to break. As a suggestion to anyone trying to do this take the tension off in very small steps. I'm still going to try and repair the base using the aluminum plate .The break is long an clean hopefully I can get creative and figure out something.
> If anyone is interested in the outcome let me know and I'll post some pictures if it works.
> All the Best!
> dad roadie


It probably was cracked in the first place.
Maybe use some liquid metal along with the plate?
JB weld makes a whole bunch of different types, good stuff.

Do us a favor (well I should say do me a favor):dunno:
Take pictures of everything you do.
Especially the arm you're going to replace. Take a bunch of them.
We (you and me) and maybe Teladoc hwell: will then have them on the site for record.

I can't even see up in there, I would like to see how it is hooked up.

Can't find much more information on the net, just what I found so far.

Thanks.


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## dad roadie (Dec 1, 2012)

*Thanks again !*

Hi Ed,
Just started to try and bring everything back to level. I made a clamping fixture out of a sheet of aluminum with clamps holding the 3 low corners and a long bar clamp across the warped part. Been slowly applying pressure over the last 2 nights and so far so good. Once I get the warp out I'm hoping to make a new base out of the aluminum plate to mount underneath the broken one and put it together along the broken area with JB weld. Your right it's good stuff. I will keep you posted of my progress. Again thanks for the help! I was kind of disappointed in the lack of responses. Maybe it's just because I'm a new be to all this and not part of the circle yet. 
Dad Roadie


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

dad roadie said:


> Hi Ed,
> Just started to try and bring everything back to level. I made a clamping fixture out of a sheet of aluminum with clamps holding the 3 low corners and a long bar clamp across the warped part. Been slowly applying pressure over the last 2 nights and so far so good. Once I get the warp out I'm hoping to make a new base out of the aluminum plate to mount underneath the broken one and put it together along the broken area with JB weld. Your right it's good stuff. I will keep you posted of my progress. Again thanks for the help! I was kind of disappointed in the lack of responses. Maybe it's just because I'm a new be to all this and not part of the circle yet.
> Dad Roadie


I don't think it is because of that. I think no one has really fooled around fixing this bridge.

But as far as making suggestions on how to fix the warped and broken metal I thought for sure "someone" would speak up (type) up some advice.
Go figure?:dunno:

Go slow with the clamps, better to take a little more time, then cause more damage.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Greetings!

Just last week I bought one of my all-time favorite Lionel accessories, a pre-war 313 Bascule bridge. I myself, buy toys in need of refurbishing/restoration. 

This bridge, is one of the worse case condition projects I've had to work on in a while. The bridge framework was partially crushed, 
the upper cross braces missing, the cast deck, bent/warped and as I got more into it, found the motor in the house was missing the drive gears from the bridge. I've found two different examples. 

I found images where the drive gear was on the outside of motor in the little house and another where the drive gear was just outside the house. The later must have been a very early prewar. 
The wiring from the brush plate to the motor, one was disconnected and one was missing. Then there is the multi-wire, thin metal contact assembly with fiber spacers in between. Fun. 

For any structural repair work, you MUST disassemble the entire thing. Buy some 3M post-It notes and a roll of masking tape.

Take photos of the entire process, label the notes with the part your removing and describe the part(s) removed - A screw, lever, etc.,. that it came off of and place the part(s) on the note.

Wiring: 
Take a note, draw the contact(s) it came off of, use masking tape and label the wiring your about to desolder in order, where it came off of and where it goes to. 

Anyway, I've repaired all the metal issues. After 6 hours of painstaking tweaking of the thin metal, flattened, squared and straightened the structure.

The cast metal base, do not use heat. YOU can do this by hand. I know, I did it to the base of my bridge. A little at a time, don't try to do too much too soon or you will be sorry. 
Among my many professions, as a prototype model maker, I've worked with die cast metal and you can distort it. 

For those who thought about refurbishing your deck where the rails are attached to. Its not metal, its plastic. Early stamped mold so don't think about trying to strip it with media. It will be destroyed. 
If you thought about repainting, I'm going to be doing that soon. I'm going to try a small area using red scotchbrite first and painting, to see if it sticks. As for the rails, mine were extremely rusted. I detached and soaked for 4 days in red apple cider vinegar. 
It literally ate the rust, followed up with fine steel wool. Unfortunately, its pretty much raw steel at this point and has already oxidized a rusty patina. I hope to attempt to put on a polishing wheel soon and if all else fails, media blast the underside first and see what's left. In the end, mine will be a display on a dead man's track on the layout. Too much of its driving functions are missing.

If you thought of using existing straight rails from single track, its not made the same way as a piece of straight track is made when it comes to its underside - Attaching "ties" vs. the deck rails. 
There are flat metal tabs beneath the deck rails coming down and crimped into the mounting locations on the deck. Look at a piece of straight track then look at the underside of rails on the deck. Not the same.

I've already taken over 60 photos. Its all dismantled, parts in plastic zip lock bags and ready for stripping and paint.

If you have questions about the metalwork, feel free to shoot me a response and I'll do my best to walk you through it.

Rudy


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Good advice post some photos! Evaporust is the thing to use on the rust. Im not crazy about using steal wool on tbe rails, usally a green scothbrite will work I dont have a media blaster, but grj strips his plastic trains, not sure what he uses as media . You can always use easy off oven cleaner, spray on part to be stripped, put in a plastic container, cover with a plastic bag, in few hours most paint will wash off with water. The longer its in the more it strips. There is a protective coating on the rails, the heavy abrasive will remove it. Good luck, and we want before and after pics


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Hello, 

Thank you for your response! I'm a bit rusty on some of this - 
"No pun intended". So, what is this Evaporust? I have not heard of 
this product. Is it in a paste or a spray? Where can it be purchased? 

After you mentioned it, I do remember a protective coating on the rails however, the rails on the deck were so heavily rusted, the coating would have been long gone and my options at the time were few. 
At least until now, as I hope to learn more about Evaporust. In regards to the steel wool, not knowing about the product (Evaporust) it was the only thing I could think of that would assist me with loosening the rust after the apple cider vinegar soak. 
Yes, green scothbrite would have worked well also. It's been years since I worked on track so I have no excuse for what I used; plenty of experience stripping metal, but very little stripping painted plastic, with the exception of using lacquer thinner. 
With that said, it can be used on many of today's modern polymers. Easy off oven cleaner? I wonder if its less caustic than lacquer thinner? Regardless, my biggest concern about using any chemical cleaner, is the age of the plastic, not knowing the polymers used to make it back in the 1940s, could it melt, soften and or distort? It's a risk I really do not want to take unless someone out there has used it on the deck and was successful.

All of the photos taken thus far are still on my phone which, is currently charging. The first chance I get, I will download what I started with and as I go, post updates.

Thanks.

Rudy


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Evaporust is a liquid, you soak the the peice in it. Its sold at home depot, harbor freight, etc. It can be reused and or dumped down the drain. Its not harmful like the old navel jelly or smelly like vinegar. And it works, be aware it will strip blueing of of metal too. But thats easy enough to fix. Make sure all you fibers from the steel wool are off the track, they sometimes can harm engines. I use easy off on all the old Lionel plastic stuff, never had a problem. Its works well and is easy I never used it on the bridge but on lots of other post and pre war stuff. Try it on a small spot to test it? Oh, and welcome, ask questions . Thats why were here!


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Forgot to add, lots of us buy beat up stuff to fix up. So , lots of experience here with painting, fabricating, where to buy parts and get diagrams of stuff, so if you got questions someone will have an answer you can click on peoples names and then find the posts they made if your interested in stuff. Also the search works OK, just use the advance search. Have fun


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## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

rudy's railroad said:


> Greetings!
> 
> Just last week I bought one of my all-time favorite Lionel accessories, a pre-war 313 Bascule bridge.
> 
> Rudy


You pick that up on Plainfield? @ that auction place?

I was just in there Tuesday...just missed it I guess.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

*Got it!*

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Good evening, 

To answer the question from the most recent post, I purchased the bridge at a train show in Wyoming, MI last Saturday, not at an auction. Refer to the attached photographs of the "purchased condition", its disassembly, metal rework, hand sanded, media 
stripped and "primered" condition. I attempted to polish the rails with a buffer. The rust proved to be too much for the metal. I ended up media blasting each entire rail and applied a sandable primer. Once I sand them as smooth as possible, I will attempt to apply an aluminum coating to give them a presentable look. The pair of plastic uppers on found on top of the towers where the pivot arm goes to are plastic. I scotchbrited them and then primered. Everything cleaned up exceptionally well. I hope to paint everything early next week. 

I have many more "Initial" photos however, these were the most "applicable" photos to get my point across for the refurbishing of the bridge. Now with the photos attached, all of you are now up to speed with my project Lionel prewar bascule bridge. 
As I progress with this, photos will be added. 

Thank you for your interest!

Rudy


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Looking good not half as bad as I pictured it! You can embed the photos into the link to show up without clicking on them. Go to edit, go advanced, click om the paper clip icon, theres an insert all , hit that and your good I probably didn't explaine in well but try it , if you wait. Easier to see your stuff. I never used a media blaster, it looks like it did a good job stripping it. The bends were bad, but very fixable. The track was rusty.....


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## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

Nice find - regardless of where. Coming along at a good pace. Thanks for sharing the pictures. 

Can't believe I missed a local show though. Although S is usually quite scarce @ these things, at least lately.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

sjm9911 said:


> Looking good not half as bad as I pictured it! You can embed the photos into the link to show up without clicking on them. Go to edit, go advanced, click om the paper clip icon, theres an insert all , hit that and your good I probably didn't explaine in well but try it , if you wait. Easier to see your stuff. I never used a media blaster, it looks like it did a good job stripping it. The bends were bad, but very fixable. The track was rusty.....


After I clicked on edit, none of the "other" features showed up 
(advanced, paper clip icon, insert all), so I apparently can't do what you suggested.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

rudy's railroad said:


> After I clicked on edit, none of the "other" features showed up
> (advanced, paper clip icon, insert all), so I apparently can't do what you suggested.



There is what is called a message interface option, *this has 3 options, no matter which one you are in you should see a advanced edit option after you click edit. Click edit then LOOK real slow, it is not hiding it will be in plain view.*

Then go check the following, you are better off using the enhanced interface full fledged WYSIWYG editing choice anyway, see what one you are using. If it is the basic or standard set it up for the enhanced option.


(a copy and paste that I keep handy.)

If you can't see the paper clip try this.

click user CP (up top)
then click edit options
in the last box down is the Miscellaneous Options box, in it is the Message Editor Interface box. You will see a drop down list with three options.
1/Basic
2/Standard
3/Enhanced

In the Message Editor Interface drop down box pick the enhanced interface full fledged WYSIWYG editing choice.

Then, *don't forget to click SAVE*. 


But whatever editor you are using you should see "go advanced" after you click "edit". 
Look real good maybe your are going too fast?
I think you are missing it?

I changed my interface to the basic and went to edit something and even in the basic editor I was able to see "go advanced" after I clicked "edit".

*Let me know what editor the site had you in.*
The enhanced is the best. Sometimes one is in the basic and it limits some things.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

See, ed explains it better.... I tried


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Sorry gents,

I have no feature to select "advanced" beyond edit.
I assume its one of two things: If it's a forum option, I haven't been granted the privilege because I only have eight posts.

or

It's s a "Microsoft" option under the edit key at the header.
I don't have a personal PC, I have a Power MAC (Apple).

I clicked edit, went to the user CP and selected the enhanced setting and still no paper clip.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Ah, you might need like 10 posts to post pictures. I don't know, there is something in place for pms, so it might be the same.


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## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

rudy's railroad said:


> Sorry gents,
> 
> I have no feature to select "advanced" beyond edit.


That's odd.

When you click the edit button you don't see this?








Once you have the advanced option, the paper clip







should be available?

Lastly, once the clip is selected,







you can insert one at a time as I have done here, or insert all, and they are placed sequentially.

weird


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

FINALLY!

Thank you so much gents for helping me figure this out.

Rudy


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Here we go.

Much better. Whew!
See page 3 for the photos.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Here are the photos I took Friday evening after stripping off all the rust. I hand sanded the plastic parts and applied a filler/sandable primer to all.I will tackle the finish sanding and paint next week.
View attachment 171634


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View attachment 171650


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

sjm9911 said:


> Looking good not half as bad as I pictured it! You can embed the photos into the link to show up without clicking on them. Go to edit, go advanced, click om the paper clip icon, theres an insert all , hit that and your good I probably didn't explaine in well but try it , if you wait. Easier to see your stuff. I never used a media blaster, it looks like it did a good job stripping it. The bends were bad, but very fixable. The track was rusty.....





sjm9911 said:


> See, ed explains it better.... I tried


But I did not explain what you explained?
I explained the advanced interface in the Editor box in the CP.

You explained the insert good enough, no need for me to explain it again. :thumbsup:
Some won't see the paper clip option until they pick the enhanced editor option.
Thank you for correctly explaining the insert part sjm9911.

Rudy.......maybe you did need the ten posts?
What editor were you in when you went into your CP?
The Basic?


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Big Ed said:


> But I did not explain what you explained?
> I explained the advanced interface in the Editor box in the CP.
> 
> You explained the insert good enough, no need for me to explain it again. :thumbsup:
> ...


Hello,

I was in "the basic". Didn't know any of these features until I just posted a few days ago. So a newbie to the forum but not to trains. I look forward to visiting with all you gents in the future. 

This evening, I couldn't wait to do the majority of my "finish work" on the bridge. The final straightening and painting. Now we have to be patient. I'll allow a good 2 weeks for the paint to cure before I start to reassemble.
View attachment 172081


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Looks great I like that green too! Carefully put in the tabs after painting as sometimes if the paint is dry but not cured you can smear it. Good job so far, and I still dont own one.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

After review of my layout this evening, the area I planned on putting the bridge, I underestimated the space needed. 
It appears the time has come where I will have to start disconnecting and removing some of my AF Mystic stations from "passenger row". It is here where I have (7) Mystic stations including two of them with cranes and (2) AF water towers that will need to come off just to create a "dead mans track" to display the bridge. 

Aughh! I'm not looking forward to that. 
I've always wanted this piece and even though it will not be functional, it still will be a cool display. 
I think I'll keep the motor out of the bridge house since its non operational and wire up a light in it as well as the 
light on top of the bridge.

Rudy


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Lol, you buy stuff that you dont have room for really? Never did that before! My whole layout needs to be ripped up to get everything in start a new thread, post picturesof the layout! I love the mystic station, only have one , just with the lights. If I ha 7 on my layout I wouldn't be able to run trains! I think some have sound the mostly dosent work now, some kind of record type player? I dont remember. I have the water tower too American flyer had some nice accessories!


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

What brand paint did you use?
That green matches the original color nicely.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Never did that before! My whole layout needs to be ripped up to get everything in 

start a new thread, post picturesof the layout! 

I have my layout in the layout thread labeled as: Pre and postwar Lionel and American Flyer layout.

I love the mystic station, only have one , just with the lights. If I ha 7 on my layout I wouldn't be able to run trains! 
I think some have sound the mostly dosent work now, some kind of record type player? I dont remember. 

Of the ten Mystic stations I have, (4) are the talking stations. 
All have the lighting and the talking stations have the motor but that's all. No speaker, no record.

I have the water tower too American flyer had some nice accessories![/QUOTE]

I have (7) of the No.596 water towers and (6) No.750 girder bridges with the house on top.



sjm9911 said:


> Lol, you buy stuff that you dont have room for really?
> 
> I bought the bridge for a number of reasons:
> I always wanted one.
> ...


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

View attachment 178585


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View attachment 178633

Slowly, I'm re-assembling the bridge. The rails are totally shot. This will be a non-functional display.
Since the original wiring was pretty much toast, I desoldered them. After the paint on the base dried, it unfortunately darkened, nothing like the freshly painted view. 
Now, two totally different colors. Alias, not as correct as I would have wanted, but I'm not going to spend any more time or money making it perfect esthetically and not be functional. I've stripped, primered and have painted the motor house and I'm in the process of making a roof for it. The window panes will be the only thing left that I'm not refinishing. I used a cleaner wax on them and they turned out beautifully. Here's what I have done thus far.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Looks good , maybe you can replace the rails? Try to use a regular track section? I like the color.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

View attachment 178641


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View attachment 178657
Here are (3) additional photos:
In photo 1, one of the upright structures with spring that will allow the bridge to pivot up and down.
Photo 2, after measuring the motor house length and roof pitch, I cut piece of aluminum and will start shaping the new roof.
Photo 3, shows t bridge frame with hand made crisscross support wires, a modified missing cross over and a newly wired light for the upper cross beam canopy light.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

sjm9911 said:


> Looks good , maybe you can replace the rails? Try to use a regular track section? I like the color.


Thanks. Trust me, I looked into that early on. As I stated early in the thread, regular "straight" track is not made the same as the rails that are in the deck of the bridge. The deck has metal tabs that come straight down in various locations that have an angled bend on both sides that secure to openings on the underside of bridge. A straight piece of track does not have tabs coming down from the underside. The "ties" slide onto the "U" shape sides of the track. The rails on the deck do not have the "U" shape sides. It sure would have been nice to simply cut and fit sections of straight track in place. No such luck.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

I see it, wish I had one to come up with a work around, big ed might I was thinking bent tin can in the same set up wedged into an o gauge track. But, I might have had one to many glasses of wine its easier to trouble shoot if I actually had the peice to look at. Just a shame all that work you did for a non working model.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

sjm9911 said:


> I see it, wish I had one to come up with a work around, big ed might I was thinking bent tin can in the same set up wedged into an o gauge track. But, I might have had one to many glasses of wine its easier to trouble shoot if I actually had the peice to look at. Just a shame all that work you did for a non working model.


It's no problem and totally understandable. Up until the time I bought it I thought the very same thing.
It wasn't until I was knee deep in rust when I realized it. I love projects, challenges too. For as long as I've been looking for one to refurbish and for the reasonable price, 
if it works, great. If not, oh well. I'll make it look nice regardless. Since I'm at a standstill working on the motor house and roof (the last piece to install), if I could find a closer matching paint without spending a lot more, I would dismantle what I have on the base to repaint it. It's just been a hard color to match.

Have a good night.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Why do you say that the rails are shot? 
They don't look bad to me, are they secure in the roadbed? All the tabs went back without breaking?

You painted them? 
I don't think that will work? I am not sure but the paint might stop the train from picking up the power?

The deck assembly is part number 313-18
The long rails are 313-20
The short rail number is 313-51

Call Jeff, http://www.ttender.com/index.htm
He might know where you can get them, he might even have them.

$35 bucks buy it now on e bay?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1550-Lionel...me-New-LTI-prewar-postwar-parts-/401111181516









If you want it I would jump on it quick.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Big Ed said:


> Why do you say that the rails are shot?
> They don't look bad to me, are they secure in the roadbed? All the tabs went back without breaking?
> 
> You painted them?
> ...


Big Ed,

Thank you very much for all of your input. Although all of the tabs are intact and did not break after I removed and re-attached them to the rail deck, many are rusted through on top in several locations. Yes, I did paint them because I knew it would be dangerous to electrify them causing a short. The motor is missing all of the drive gears to lift the bridge. This is strictly a very nice, non-functioning display from an early pre-war favorite of ours. I've seen the deck on ebay and thought seriously about buying it. Again, it's no longer worth me putting any more money into it since its incapable of functioning, based on what I have. The paint color for the base initially matched the deck on the bridge when I first painted it, but as it dried, it got darker and does not match the color of the rail deck, let alone the N.O.S. deck. The motor house turned out great and I'm about to post photos of the roof I just made. It's a lean-to roof, media blasted and have applied a sand able primer which I will work on tomorrow night and then paint. 

Rudy


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

View attachment 178801


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View attachment 178817
Hand made roof for bridge motor house.
See the attached:


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

View attachment 179482


View attachment 179490
Greetings Gents!

I just finishing my hand made lean-to roof for the motor house on my bascule bridge project. Since I'm refurbishing it for my taste, I drilled a hole in the center of the roof for a chimney. The sand able primer has been scuffed up to a smooth finish with red Scotchbrite and painted a nice red gloss enamel. So I'll wait a week for the paint to cure on the roof and I will be finished. I still need to do my final assembly though this week. I also need to figure out where on my layout it is going to go.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

You know some of the liquid metal works real good?
I wonder if you could put a coat over the rails?

The gears? 
Your gears in the gear box look good, Jeff lists this,

313-91 2nd Intermed assy (313 gear box) 6.00 
313-94 1st Intermed assy (313 gear box) 6.00
I wonder if one of those is the gears your missing.
If so it is only $6 bucks.:dunno:

Have you called Jeff?

I guess you saw Olsen's part number list? 
http://olsenstoy.com/cd/accs\acc313.pdf

I don't think you ever answered about what paint the green was. Strange that it darkened up after drying but I think it still looks good.:smilie_daumenpos:

Saw an original roof on e bay form $5 bucks, but I think you like making up the parts.

Seems a shame that you did all that and it will just sit there not operating. 
Did you pay a lot for it? How much do you have into it now? For a few more bucks you might be able to have a working 313.

Buy another junk bridge CHEAP? But make sure the rails and gears are good?


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Your roof looks good, but did you know that the roof that came with it slides on and off?
You should have bent the lower part?

Like this, 









The yellow and red look like good matches?:thumbsup:

Tell me, the whole wire hookup block (where you hook all the wires to) is that new? or did it come with the bridge?


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

View attachment 179609


View attachment 179617


Big Ed said:


> You know some of the liquid metal works real good?
> I wonder if you could put a coat over the rails?
> 
> The gears?
> ...


Hi,

To quote myself from the previous post:
"Since I'm refurbishing it for my taste, I drilled a hole in the center of the roof for a chimney". I saw the roof online. 

Is this roof correct? No.
Does it slide on? No it does not.

I have a bigger problem now. While assembling the bridge, I did not realize the one pivot on the spring side at the top was not completely down and when I tightened the spring to allow the bridge to lower, the pivot pressed up and broke apart the plastic structure that holds it in place.

I have about $60.00 in the thing thus far and about 30 hours messing around with it.
So now I need to find at least one of these upper plastic supports. Anyone out there know where I can buy one cheap?


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Were is the other peice? Jb weld it together?


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Or get the plumbers epoxy and rebuild it? It's like clay and can maybe be molded?


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Big Ed said:


> *What brand paint did you use?
> That green matches the original color nicely*.





Big Ed said:


> You know some of the liquid metal works real good?
> I wonder if you could put a coat over the rails?
> 
> The gears?
> ...





sjm9911 said:


> Were is the other peice? Jb weld it together?


It does look like the piece would sit back on nice with some plastic weld.

*I guess the color of the green is top secret?*:dunno:


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Big Ed said:


> It does look like the piece would sit back on nice with some plastic weld.
> 
> *I guess the color of the green is top secret?*:dunno:


Sorry guys,

It was 3:00AM when I finished trying to put this together and I was tired and frustrated and punchy in my responses and didn't answer all of your questions. 
I found the broken pieces a short time ago. The broken item is plastic and I was able to glue them back into position. I may have to dab a little filler on a few spots, scuff up and paint so not as bad as I thought.

No secret color - Rustoleum Grass Green. All in all, it really doesn't look bad together and honestly, I really have no where on my layout where the track has power to put it anyway. 
I figured out where on the layout I want it to go. I'll be removing (3) Mystic stations, a 596 water tower and a 494 beacon, then lay a deadman track with bumpers on each end. My plan is to remove the motor from the house, put a hardwood floor and light in it, then string lights up the structure so its lit along with everything else on the layout. It will look nice when I'm finished so function is not important to me. So please stop trying to talk me into making it operate. It's not going to happen.


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## teledoc (Oct 22, 2014)

The repair looks pretty good, and filler should take care of it. Of course we are going to have to get you indoctrinated in the many uses of JB Weld. It's magic stuff, once you get used to using it. A lot depends on which one you use, as they have a quicker curing version, and one that takes longer. After the repair with JB Weld, it is stronger than the rest of what you fixed. I have replaced marker lights on 1615 switchers (3), and a few other mishaps from abuse, and you would be hard pressed to know it was fixed.:thumbsup:


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Rustoleum grass green got it, Thanks.
It has some of my companies chemicals in it as we have an average of 7 loads of solvents delivered to them a week. 50,000 gals average a week.

" It will look nice when I'm finished so function is not important to me. So please stop trying to talk me into making it operate. It's not going to happen. "
Sorry, somehow I got the impression that you wanted this working.hwell:
No more talk of making this operate. Never....ever!:smokin:

But do a search for JB weld products, they make different types for all kinds of repairs. I think it would have been better to use then "glue". Sand-able and paint-able.
But I guess since it will be just sitting and not running the glue will hold it together. It would work on filling the crack in while adding strength, but since you don't need the strength I guess any plastic filler would work too. 
Like SJM said also check out Evaporust, if you do restoring of rusty parts on anything this works good. Save the used dirty Evaporust, use it over and over till it stops working. When it stops working get rid of it. Non toxic they say, nothing harmful used to make it.

One last suggestion then?
A copy and paste from another post in this thread,

If the bridge sits for a long time without being used it is best to loosen up on the tension spring to prevent warping of the base.

Keep the spring loose.

Did you use black primer? Maybe if you used a lighter colored primer would have kept the green lighter, like it was before it dried?
I still think it looks good.:smokin::thumbsup:


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Big Ed said:


> Rustoleum grass green got it, Thanks.
> It has some of my companies chemicals in it as we have an average of 7 loads of solvents delivered to them a week. 50,000 gals average a week.
> 
> " It will look nice when I'm finished so function is not important to me. So please stop trying to talk me into making it operate. It's not going to happen. "
> ...


Gents,

Thank you for your responses and suggestions.
All have their merits and will be taken into consideration moving forward on all of my future projects.

Looking back, I can somewhat laugh (and cry) thinking about my primer job and the JB Weld. I wondered after I used the 
sand able black primer on the base if in fact it would darken my paint job? Low and behold Big Ed, it did just that. What was I thinking! 
As for the JB weld, I have a brand new pack of it, hanging on my pegboard right in front of me at my work bench here in the man cave workshop and it didn't
dawn on me to use it. Also Big Ed, thank you for the tip on reducing the spring tension when I'm finished. Early Friday morning before I started putting the bridge back together, I thought about taking off the few items I had already attached to the base, stripping it and just repaint without the black primer. Looking back, this was one more of those "shoulda, coulda woulda" moments. Sigh.....


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

All good, it's hard doing some of the simplistic stuff sometimes. One of my tinplate 258s had to be painted and re stripped 3 times. I thought I was home free after all the repairs and banging out of dents. It makes you appreciate it that much more when it's finished.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

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Well,

After all that has happened, since I have to take the motor off the base and release more tension off of the spring, I won't be happy until I at least try one more time to get this paint color at least closer to what it should be and not applying primer after I strip it- Again. Also, respray scuffs in paint from aluminum painted surfaces during my debacle So now, I'm starting almost over. Note: Although the pictures of the base look close to correct, its not. Earlier photos taken in a different light shows what it actually looks like. Wish me luck.


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

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Gents,

Well, I stripped the base and re-painted with no primer. 
We shall see how it looks in a week or so after it cures. I also resprayed the scuffs in paint on the bridge supports and hope to do the bridge sides soon. 

Refer to the attached photos of the repair work performed to the bridge swing pivot housings. After applying filler, sanding, applying sand able primer and re-sanding, I applied a finish coat of primer and I'm giving it time to cure before I paint them tomorrow.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Looks like New glad you found a good fix for it!


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## rudy's railroad (Nov 14, 2015)

Gents,

Beginning this evening, all photos of my project Lionel prewar No.313 posts will be on a its own page, start to finish including my adaptation on how to repaint the base and lighten the color.

Hope to see you soon.

Rudy


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