# New Update --> Light Capacitor and Sound Capacitor.. (Stay Alive)..



## ED-RRR

*All Hecklers Are Welcomed:* 
(Many hundreds of different viewers are also reading your "Postings")..
I see that most of you enjoyed adding many, many pages (My Previous Thread) just talking back and forth about me *[ED-RRR].. *
How are you helping "Beginners" in model railroading in this "Forum" ??
While most of you enjoyed just talking back and forth about useless garbage,
I did some in depth research and also had direct *"E-mail" *communications with *Mark Gurries (NMRA DCC Clinic)* and his friend *Dave Parks (Electrical Engineer)..*

*Another Previous Thread:*
There was a big discrepancy between Copyright and Copywriting..
*Copyright:*
The exclusive legal right, given to an originator or an assignee to "Print", publish, perform, film, or record literary, artistic, or musical material, 
and to authorize others to do the same.
*Copywriting:*
Is written content conveyed through online media and print materials. 
Copy is a content primarily used for the purpose of advertising or marketing.
This type of written material is often used to persuade a person or group as well as to raise brand awareness.

*(#1)*
There are many "Electrical Engineers" in this "Forum" when it comes to "Electronics"
- But -
I it looks like "Some" of you do "Not" know the basics of "Electric Motors"..
"Motor Phasing" only applies to "Type" of "Electric Motor" and "Nothing" to do with 120/240V-AC home power supply "Phasing"..

*(#2)*
[HO] scale model trains use 12V-DC motors with many "Different Types" of motor magnets and motor wiring.. ("Motor Phasing")..
Brushed DC Motor Technology and History..
http://www.sumidacrossing.org/LayoutElectricity/ModelTrainPower/DCTrainMotors/DCMotorTechHistory/
All original content is © (2016 Copyright) All Rights Reserved.. 

*(#3)*
When it comes to V-DC "Switching" power supplies, why does *Mark Gurries (NMRA DCC Clinic)*
highly "Recommend" not using any "Ground Wires" connected to [DCC] components ?? 
NO EARTH GROUND WIRING
https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/dcc-general-best-practices/booster-connections-power
*Don't connect any part of your DCC system directly to Earth Ground. *
......


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## ED-RRR

*Lighting Capacitor.. (Stay Alive)..*

When it comes to [DCC] manufactures, they will "Not" release any of their "Electronic Schematics" circuit boards..
Can "Only" rely on "Independant" [DCC] NMRA "Engineers"..

*Special Notes:*
- Everything is from actual "Facts" 
- From original [DCC] "Manufactures"
- From [DCC] "Engineers"
- No pictures have been "Altered"

*SoundTraxx "Sound Decoder"..*
Note the "Green" and "Yellow" wire..









*Stay Alive for SoundTraxx Decoders including the Tsunamis and others..*
http://wayback.archive.org/web/20120729061658/http:/www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
The "Green" and "Yellow" wire is connected to the 12V-DC (-) "Black" wire return..









*Special Notes:*
This will provide a "Stay Alive" for --> "OnlY" the motor, sound and lights..
How can a small 220uF "Capacitor" even be a "Stay Alive" for a 12V-DC motor running at 0.5 Amps ??
If using greater than 1,000uF capacitor, you must use a 100 Ohm "Resistor" and "Diode"..









*Question:*
Why does the [DCC] "Processor" controlling the software and CV #'s --> "Not" have a "Stay Alive" power connection ??

......


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## ED-RRR

*Warning.. "Hecklers Posting"..*

Warning:
There will be the same "Hecklers" attacking me *[EDD-RRR]* just for the fun of it..

These individuals will be "Posting" useless "Garbage" without any actual "Technical Information"..
......


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## ED-RRR

*Sound Capacitor.. (Stay Alive)..*

To Be Continued.. --> Speaker Capacitor.. (Stay Alive)..

I will be "Posting" information how "Only" a *"Speaker Capacitor" *(Stay Alive)
is connected to a [DCC] "Sound" decoder..
......


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## wvgca

ED-RRR said:


> *Question:*
> Why does the [DCC] "Processor" controlling the software and CV #'s --> "Not" have a "Stay Alive" power connection ??
> 
> ......


 In the image that you show, the processor does have a stay alive connection


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## redman88

ED-RRR said:


> Note the "Green" and "Yellow" wire..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ......


 


No the way you are writing that is wrong. That implies two separate wires when it is just one wire with two colors


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## Bwells

Ed; I agree as I don't see a 230 or 330 cap lasting very long but I assume it is only for split-second interruptions in the power supply. As you stated, a larger cap may help but it seems there is something that needs to be looked at as far as track: dirty, nonpowered frogs. Correct these and there shouldn't be a problem.


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## johnfl68

ED-RRR said:


> Note the "Green" and "Yellow" wire..


As redman88 has pointed out, the way you stated this would mean 2 separate wires, one of them Green and one of them Yellow.

According to IEC 60446, the correct way that wire should be designated is:









"green/yellow"




> The colours green and yellow on their own are only permitted where confusion with the colouring of the green/yellow protective conductor is unlikely. Combinations of the above colours are permitted, but green and yellow should not be used in any of these combinations other than as green/yellow for the protective conductor.


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## redman88

ED-RRR said:


> *Stay Alive for SoundTraxx Decoders including the Tsunamis and others..*
> 
> http://wayback.archive.org/web/20120729061658/http:/www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
> 
> The "Green" and "Yellow" wire is connected to the 12V-DC (-) "Black" wire return..
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 228905
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question:*
> 
> Why does the [DCC] "Processor" controlling the software and CV #'s --> "Not" have a "Stay Alive" power connection ??
> 
> 
> 
> ......



Can you not follow a block diagram?


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## Bwells

In all fairness, Ed did say green and yellow wire, not wires. I would say green with a yellow tracer or vice versa. No need to nitpick.


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## CTValleyRR

Oh, Goody! Time for another round of my favorite game show: "ED's Electronics -- Fact or Fiction. You Decide!"


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## CTValleyRR

Bwells said:


> In all fairness, Ed did say green and yellow wire, not wires. I would say green with a yellow tracer or vice versa. No need to nitpick.


Yes, he did, but if he wants to write it in a way that is actually helpful, especially to beginners, he should write in standard English without all the unnecessary embellishments that add nothing but ambiguity.


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## fcwilt

ED-RRR said:


> Don't connect any part of your DCC system directly to Earth Ground.
> ......


ER-RRR - Tell us what that means.

As written it is very ambiguous.

Frederick


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## Bwells

"How are you helping "Beginners" in model railroading in this "Forum" ??"

Ed: I highly doubt a "beginner" is going to rip off the shell and solder capacitors to his new loco. I think you are talking to those with some sort of experience and feel there is a need for this. So far I don't but continue.


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## fcwilt

ED-RRR said:


> If using greater than 1,000uF capacitor, you must use a 100 Ohm "Resistor" and "Diode"..


ED-RRR - without consulting MG or any other source tell us why a resistor and diode should be used.

Frederick


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## johnfl68

Note: The next 2 weeks are going to be busy for me, so if you pick categories off the board, you may have to wait for a response until I have time.
.


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## Mark R.

fcwilt said:


> ED-RRR - without consulting MG or any other source tell us why a resistor and diode should be used.
> 
> Frederick


Oh - oh .... I know - I know .... pick me ! 

Mark.


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## fcwilt

Mark R. said:


> Oh - oh .... I know - I know .... pick me !
> 
> Mark.


I see that you and ED-RRR are both showing Ontario.

Are you anywhere near ED-RRR?

Frederick


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## Mark R.

fcwilt said:


> I see that you and ED-RRR are both showing Ontario.
> 
> Are you anywhere near ED-RRR?
> 
> Frederick


Do I have to admit that ? 

Actually Ed is about 175 miles east of me.

Mark.


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## teledoc

You guys do know he won't let it rest, and the back and forth BANTER will begin anew. So the newest question will be, "Can we hit 300 posts again??????" ROFLMAO AGAIN!
Let the games begin..........


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## Mark R.

There's a definitive group here that just plain enjoys a good old train wreck ....

Mark.


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## teledoc

Mark, Tell me about it!!!!!!! The one individual that thinks everyone else on this Forum is beneath his expertise and wealth of knowledge....


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## Mark R.

.... and he wonders why HIS threads get so many views ! 

It's not for the knowledge base, it's for the entertainment.

Mark.


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## time warp

I say MTF should install some bleachers along the DCC forum, we could accommodate more viewers that way.

Some questions, ED.
Your diagrams now show the fistfight capacitors in parallel. Are you now aware of why they need to be wired as such, or have you posted them thinking this proves that you were originally correct?
Are you also now aware of how the output of the capacitors as shown will act upon the corresponding components, relative to current flow?
Are you prepared to furnish Mark G. with your circuits as originally posted, and is he aware that you are altering his material? 
One statement: No matter how uptight you are, You've got to admit the T-shirt is funny!


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## Mark R.

ED-RRR said:


> *Question:*
> Why does the [DCC] "Processor" controlling the software and CV #'s --> "Not" have a "Stay Alive" power connection ??
> 
> ......


Ok - let's answer a question ....

The processor has no need for power back-up during a power loss because all the processor does is "process" incoming information from the controller (through the track). When there is a power interruption from the track, there is no signal for the processor to utilize. 

The capacitor is powering the light and motor drivers and the audio amplifier based on the last command received from the processor. They will continue to do the same command until one of two things happens - the capacitor runs out - OR - the processor regains power from the rails to send a new / different command.

Mark.


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## fcwilt

In the diagram ED-RRR posted all of the function blocks are shown as having "backup power" except for the "clk/ocs" block.

But I wouldn't read too much into that diagram. 

The greatest current draw would be from the motor so including all of the decoder electronics would not make much difference in the length of time things would work without track power.

Frederick


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## Bwells

Guys, give him some slack. He is basically saying to stick a cap between the green/yellow and blue wire. That's all, nothing more, except that damn third connection to the plug. His buddie Mark on the gurney says it induces RF and I wouldn't want Rush Limbaugh playing threw my speakers. I would unmute all and get quadraphonic.


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## time warp

Bwells said:


> Guys, give him some slack. He is basically saying to stick a cap between the green/yellow and blue wire. That's all, nothing more, except that damn third connection to the plug. His buddie Mark on the gurney says it induces RF and I wouldn't want Rush Limbaugh playing threw my speakers. I would unmute all and get quadraphonic.


Is that a DCC statement about an Analog circuit, or an Analog statement about a DCC circuit? And is Quadraphonic DCC sound?
RF is Rat Fink.


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## gunrunnerjohn

ED-RRR said:


> *(#1)*
> There are many "Electrical Engineers" in this "Forum" when it comes to "Electronics"
> - But -
> I it looks like "Some" of you do "Not" know the basics of "Electric Motors"..
> "Motor Phasing" only applies to "Type" of "Electric Motor" and "Nothing" to do with 120/240V-AC home power supply "Phasing"..


However, by your simple statements here, it appears you know even less about phasing and DC motors. :laugh:


> *(#2)*
> [HO] scale model trains use 12V-DC motors with many "Different Types" of motor magnets and motor wiring.. ("Motor Phasing")..
> Brushed DC Motor Technology and History..
> http://www.sumidacrossing.org/LayoutElectricity/ModelTrainPower/DCTrainMotors/DCMotorTechHistory/
> All original content is © (2016 Copyright) All Rights Reserved.


It's funny that I don't see phasing mentioned anywhere in your reference. You have incorrectly apply phasing to brushed DC motor technology, when really phasing comes into play with brushless DC motor technology. For brushed DC motors, we talk about polarity, because that determines which way the motor runs.  Very few, if any, brushless DC motors are used for model trains, though they would be ideal for the application. It all boils down to price, the brushless motor and the controller end up being far more expensive.

Since you seem to be "information deprived", I'll help you out.

An Introduction to Brushless DC Motor Control

Brushed DC Motor Fundamentals



ED-RRR said:


> Warning:
> There will be the same "Hecklers" attacking me *[EDD-RRR]* just for the fun of it..
> 
> These individuals will be "Posting" useless "Garbage" without any actual "Technical Information"..
> ......


See all the _*Useful technical Information*_ posted above to combat your _*Useless and Incorrect Technical Information*_.


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## gunrunnerjohn

Are we having fun yet?


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## CTValleyRR

ED-RRR said:


> Warning:
> There will be the same "Hecklers" attacking me *[EDD-RRR]* just for the fun of it..
> 
> These individuals will be "Posting" useless "Garbage" without any actual "Technical Information"..
> ......


No, actually, ED, I don't do this for the fun of it. I do it to make sure any poor beginner looking here for help understands that he needs to take everything you say with a grain of salt, until someone more knowledgeable than you verifies it. If he can even follow your posts, that is.

Technical information is no guarantee of accuracy. You yourself are fond of throwing out reams of it in an attempt to show how smart you are, and especially to cover previous mistakes. It would be much more useful if you would CORRECT or CLARIFY your previous posts rather than ignoring all comments and posting new information.

Now, should I throw some irrelevant technical information in here to make this a "real" post rather than "garbage"?


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## time warp

I'm really trying to keep up, but my head hurts now. We've gone from three phase heat pumps to unnecessary speaker phasing with series capacitors and now multiphase DC?
I'm going to rewire my layout with 2/0 cable using 3-phase contactors and 120 amp fuses just in case ED's information is correct.


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## feldon30

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Are we having fun yet?


Not really. This type of drama queen stuff is not all that helpful for the forum or the hobby and could drive away people who are just trying to learn something. When someone starts a thread on my forums preemptively saying that anyone who disagrees with them is posting "garbage", it's their last post. Nobody here gets to control what replies are and aren't allowed, except you.


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## time warp

feldon30 said:


> Not really. This type of drama queen stuff is not all that helpful for the forum or the hobby and could drive away people who are just trying to learn something. When someone starts a thread on my forums preemptively saying that anyone who disagrees with them is posting "garbage", it's their last post. Nobody here gets to control what replies are and aren't allowed, except you.


You are spot-on, feldon30. Ed is a thread Destroyer. In my opinion his behavior has compromised the DCC forums because of all the misinformation and bickering. I have a desire to learn more about the ins-and-outs of DCC, as I'm sure many do. I will probably never apply it to my hobby but I have a young son who is growing up in a different world than I did and he will probably become interested in it.
There is no way that I can sort through the refuse pile of crap that surrounds ED's posts. Therefore I believe, and I'm saying this for the second time, that he should be confined to Union Station or run off altogether.


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## fcwilt

time warp said:


> I have a desire to learn more about the ins-and-outs of DCC, as I'm sure many do. I will probably never apply it to my hobby but I have a young son who is growing up in a different world than I did and he will probably become interested in it.


Be glad to help. What would you like to know?

Frederick


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## fcwilt

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Are we having fun yet?


I like this stuff.

Some don't.

To each their own.

I hope to someday see ED-RRR settle down and ask for help.

Frederick


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## time warp

fcwilt, you are one of several on here who have been a tremendous help at least to me. There are some things that I would like to see discussed intelligently as far as DCC goes,but I'm not going to open that up on this ridiculous thread.
I should say that I find the banter and humor to be a lot of fun, and that really isn't my concern. What is my concern is that it is very difficult for someone who is just starting out to understand what is going on in these fist fight threads.
That is the reason that I have a problem with it. My opinion is this; if somebody is thick-headed enough to continue to incite a riot then why should he complain when it gets out of hand? I think that most here have conducted themselves very well in light of the stupidity presented.


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## fcwilt

time warp said:


> fcwilt, you are one of several on here who have been a tremendous help at least to me. There are some things that I would like to see discussed intelligently as far as DCC goes,but I'm not going to open that up on this ridiculous thread.
> I should say that I find the banter and humor to be a lot of fun, and that really isn't my concern. What is my concern is that it is very difficult for someone who is just starting out to understand what is going on in these fist fight threads.


Why don't you start a new topic about a few of the things you would like to know.

That would be helpful to you and others.

Frederick


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## wvgca

fcwilt said:


> I like this stuff.
> 
> Some don't.
> 
> To each their own.
> 
> I hope to someday see ED-RRR settle down and ask for help.
> 
> Frederick



Check the first few posts that he made on here when he first joined..totally different attitude .. and his very first post was asking for help with a turntable ..


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## gunrunnerjohn

feldon30 said:


> Not really. This type of drama queen stuff is not all that helpful for the forum or the hobby and could drive away people who are just trying to learn something. When someone starts a thread on my forums preemptively saying that anyone who disagrees with them is posting "garbage", it's their last post. Nobody here gets to control what replies are and aren't allowed, except you.


Well, I haven't "controlled" anything about what is posted in this thread, anything that is posted is displayed. Truthfully, there isn't a simple solution to the issue, other than simply nuking the whole thread.


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## time warp

Well John, at least by leaving all the posts intact it shows where the accuracy is and reveals the inaccuracies.
Sometimes it gets to be a chore to wade through though! :laugh:


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## Mark R.

But, there IS a simple answer ....

:banplz:

I too thoroughly enjoy a good technical thread on DCC. I participate in many of them on other forums. But here, as long as the drama persists, it almost seems futile ....

Mark.


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## ED-RRR

*(#2) --> School Time For "All" Of Us "Armatures" in [DCC] Lighting & Sound..*

*Mark Gurries* sent me to this website..
http://wayback.archive.org/web/20120729061658/http:/www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm

*Warning: (#1)*
Look at "All" (x4) images how a "Capacitor" is added to the [DCC] "Sound" decoder..

*Warning: (#2)*
Look at "All" (x4) images at the "Bottom" written information..
(Green Line) - Control - signal from EEPRCM to control DC power..
(Blue Line) DC Power - The power that is controlled by CVs values..
Special CV programming #'s are "Required".. 









*Warning: (#3)*
http://wayback.archive.org/web/20120729061658/http:/www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
Here are (x8) different ways how to connect a "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..

*Warning: (#4)*
http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
Here are "Many" more different ways how to connect a "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..

*Warning: (#5)*
Unless you have a "Special Female Connection" (x2 pin) to the [DCC] "Sound Decoder",
special "Advanced" soldering will be "Required" for each "Different" "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..

*[wvgca]: Previous Posting*
You have posted a "Thread" how to make your own "Stay Alive" [DCC] decoder.. (2016)..
This is a very (Very) "Old" [DCC] subject when there are many "Previous" postings many years ago..
Just do a --> Model Trains "Stay Alive" (Internet Search)..
You will find this "Older Picture".. (Example)..









*[wvgca]: Question*
How do you connect a "Home Made" --> "Stay Alive" capacitor to many (many) (many) "Different" types of [DCC] decoders ??
......


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## time warp

To connect 1 stay alive to many many decoders would require a bunch of jumper wires, and the capacitor would have to be extremely large to service that many devices.
Also all the locomotives would have to run in a line or on a bunch of parallel tracks so the wires would reach.


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## Mark R.

ED-RRR said:


> How do you connect a "Home Made" --> "Stay Alive" capacitor to many (many) (many) "Different" types of [DCC] decoders ??
> ......


Technically, there is only *ONE* way to attach a stay alive capacitor. Physically, every decoder *will* be different as to where the attachment points are. A home made stay alive module is no different than a commercial version as to where it attaches to the decoder.

Mark.


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## wvgca

ED-RRR said:


> *Warning: (#5)*
> Unless you have a "Special Female Connection" (x2 pin) to the [DCC] "Sound Decoder",
> special "Advanced" soldering will be "Required" for each "Different" "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..
> 
> *[wvgca]: Previous Posting*
> You have posted a "Thread" how to make your own "Stay Alive" [DCC] decoder.. (2016)..
> This is a very (Very) "Old" [DCC] subject when there are many "Previous" postings many years ago..
> Just do a --> Model Trains "Stay Alive" (Internet Search)..
> You will find this "Older Picture".. (Example)..
> 
> View attachment 229609
> 
> 
> *[wvgca]: Question*
> How do you connect a "Home Made" --> "Stay Alive" capacitor to many (many) (many) "Different" types of [DCC] decoders ??
> ......



First of all, you don't have to have a 'special' X2 pin connector, many just have wire leads out for stay alive connection .., as an example the two leads under my thumb in the bottom image

secondly, the idea of a stay alive is not new, I just did my 'user built' version using more modern technology with super caps, the same as most commercial ones do now

last, a 'home made' keep alive is connected with two wires, in the interest of convention they should be a blue and a black, as shown in the image also, but in parallel, not in series:thumbsup:

From your statements, [and questions], its seems that you have never actually install a modern stay alive unit..


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## ncrc5315

ED-RRR said:


> *Mark Gurries* sent me to this website..
> http://wayback.archive.org/web/20120729061658/http:/www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
> 
> *Warning: (#1)*
> Look at "All" (x4) images how a "Capacitor" is added to the [DCC] "Sound" decoder..
> 
> *Warning: (#2)*
> Look at "All" (x4) images at the "Bottom" written information..
> (Green Line) - Control - signal from EEPRCM to control DC power..
> (Blue Line) DC Power - The power that is controlled by CVs values..
> Special CV programming #'s are "Required"..
> 
> View attachment 229601
> 
> 
> *Warning: (#3)*
> http://wayback.archive.org/web/20120729061658/http:/www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
> Here are (x8) different ways how to connect a "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..
> 
> *Warning: (#4)*
> http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
> Here are "Many" more different ways how to connect a "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..
> 
> *Warning: (#5)*
> Unless you have a "Special Female Connection" (x2 pin) to the [DCC] "Sound Decoder",
> special "Advanced" soldering will be "Required" for each "Different" "Stay Alive" capacitor to a [DCC] board..
> 
> *[wvgca]: Previous Posting*
> You have posted a "Thread" how to make your own "Stay Alive" [DCC] decoder.. (2016)..
> This is a very (Very) "Old" [DCC] subject when there are many "Previous" postings many years ago..
> Just do a --> Model Trains "Stay Alive" (Internet Search)..
> You will find this "Older Picture".. (Example)..
> 
> View attachment 229609
> 
> 
> *[wvgca]: Question*
> How do you connect a "Home Made" --> "Stay Alive" capacitor to many (many) (many) "Different" types of [DCC] decoders ??
> ......


Sorry, but I'm not understanding the first four warnings.


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## time warp

I'm disturbed by warning #5.
What does "special female connection" have to do with electric trains?


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## wvgca

time warp said:


> I'm disturbed by warning #5.
> What does "special female connection" have to do with electric trains?


well, I do know of some 'special females', but try not to have any connection with them, 
apparently they do not respond well to "Command Control' , 
and in my opinion, may very well be wired slightly 'bi-polar' ...
thus ED-RRR'S warning is completely valid :goofball:


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## gunrunnerjohn

wvgca said:


> well, I do know of some 'special females', but try not to have any connection with them,
> apparently they do not respond well to "Command Control' ,
> and in my opinion, may very well be wired slightly 'bi-polar' ...
> thus ED-RRR'S warning is completely valid :goofball:


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## highvoltage

Special Female Connection. That's good. I guess I would rather have that than a Special Male Connection. Not that there's anything wrong in that, just saying.


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## time warp

highvoltage said:


> Special Female Connection. That's good. I guess I would rather have that than a Special Male Connection. Not that there's anything wrong in that, just saying.


 Didn't you get the memo? This is a helpful DCC thread.


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## highvoltage

time warp said:


> Didn't you get the memo? This is a helpful DCC thread.


Uh-oh. Does this make me a heckler?


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## time warp

More like a referee!


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## highvoltage

time warp said:


> More like a referee!


That's an interesting statement. Can't tell if you're serious or not.


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## time warp

Serious? No way! Just poking fun! :laugh:


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## CTValleyRR

highvoltage said:


> Uh-oh. Does this make me a heckler?


It's not the humor, but the lack of technical information that makes you a heckler. Just look at ED's third post on this thread!

Throw in some random technical garbage, and you're GTG!


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## gunrunnerjohn

ED-RRR said:


> To Be Continued.. --> Speaker Capacitor.. (Stay Alive)..
> 
> I will be "Posting" information how "Only" a *"Speaker Capacitor" *(Stay Alive)
> is connected to a [DCC] "Sound" decoder..
> ......


I'm still waiting for this update, I'm figuring that all my education was wasted if this actually works.


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## time warp

I'm surprised you're not seeing the obvious potential here John. You should build a DCC sound update Kit with a series capacitor and include the speaker, wholesale them to ED and he can be the exclusive dealer of his own invention. You get the work plus the markup and he gets the glory!
They'll sell like hotcakes if you put a China sticker on the back. I think it would be awesome!


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## wvgca

time warp ...
simple question ... 
would you want _your_ name associated with anything designed by ED-RRR ??


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## time warp

Gee, Warren. What a party pooper.




NO!


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## gunrunnerjohn

There you go, reason enough.


----------



## ncrc5315

I do have to say, and I mean this in all sincerity, I do learn a lot from these postings


----------



## Bwells

Not his of course but from other members trying to explain to him what is right, RIGHT?


----------



## ED-RRR

*[gunrunnerjohn]: Postings --> Forum Administrator..*

*[gunrunnerjohn]:*


gunrunnerjohn said:


> And all I have is the education, the experience, and the knowledge of how electronic parts function and are used.


*[gunrunnerjohn]:*


gunrunnerjohn said:


> Since I was working in aerospace engineering for years, the answer to that question is simple, it never happened!


*(#1)*
I *[ED-RRR]* have posted that [DCC] information regarding "Electronic Noise" (Radio Frequency) has "Drastically" increased going from old outdated
"Linear" power supplies to "Switching" power supplies..
Actual (100%) proven "Facts" from Mark Gurries (NMRA DCC Clinic)..

*(#2)*
I also posted [DCC] information "Not" to use any "Ground" connections to [DCC]..
Because when it comes to V-DC "Switching" power supplies, 
Mark Gurries (NMRA DCC Clinic) highly "Recommends" not using any "Ground Wires" connected to [DCC] components ?? 
NO EARTH GROUND WIRING
https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/dcc-general-best-practices/booster-connections-power
Don't connect any part of your DCC system directly to Earth Ground. You will damage the DCC product. 

*Fact: (#1)*
Mark Gurries who is a NMRA [DCC] "Electrical Engineer" states that "Radio Frequency" (RF) will effect [DCC] "Electronic Components".. 

*Fact: (#2)*
For the past many years, until only recently, passengers were "Not" allowed to use their "Cell Phones" on "Aeroplanes".. 
This was due to because "Radio Frequency" (RF) could/may affect the planes "Electronic Gauges"..

*[gunrunnerjohn]: Simple Question*
Without a doubt, did any "Radio Frequency" (RF) effect the planes "Electronic Components/Gauges" in older passenger jets
- And -
Does [DCC] "Radio Frequency" (RF) effect how digital systems function ??
..


----------



## ED-RRR

*[teledoc]: Postings --> Forum Moderator..*



teledoc said:


> *You guys do know he won't let it rest,* and the back and forth BANTER will begin anew.
> So the newest question will be, "Can we hit 300 posts again??????" ROFLMAO AGAIN!
> Let the games begin..........


*[teledoc]: Question*
- Why are you stating (*You guys do know he won't let it rest*)..

*[teledoc]: Posting #22*


teledoc said:


> Mark, Tell me about it!!!!!!! The one individual that thinks everyone else on this Forum is beneath his expertise and wealth of knowledge....


*[teledoc]: Question*
Why are you personally attacking me *[ED-RRR] *when I have "Posted" where (100%) of my information is from..
......


----------



## ED-RRR

*Only Actual Posted (100%) Facts..*

*Fact: (#1)*
All of the information posted by me *[ED-RRR]* in *"Only" *this "Thread" is (100%) "True Facts"..
None of the information posted in this "Thread" are my own words and or pictures..

*Fact: (#2)*
There is "No" member in this "Forum" that is a qualified [DCC] "Electrical Engineer"..

*Fact: (#3)*
I "Only" use "Cut-N-Paste" for (100%) "Proof" to back up this, my *[ED-RRR] *"Thread"..
The information I received is from a qualified "Electrical Engineer"..
- Direct contact through (E-mails) with *Mark Gurries* (NMRA DCC Clinic)..
- Being sent to special web sites for more detailed information..

*Question: (#1)*
Why are there so many individuals in this "Thread" determined to prove me "Wrong" ??









When "All" the information is given "Directly" to me *[ED-RRR]* from *Mark Gurries,* who is a NMRA [DCC] "Electrical Engineer"..









*Fact: (#4)*
If you are "Stating" that any part of my *[ED-RR]* posted information in *"Only"* this "Thread" is "Wrong",
you are also "Stating" that *Mark Gurries* information is also "Totally Wrong"..








......


----------



## Mark R.

How come Mark Gurries has no idea who you are ?

Mark.


----------



## CTValleyRR

Lucky for you GRJ locked the other thread, so you can claim that everything in this thread is "100% accurate facts". BTW, you throw that around a lot; is that how you distinguish between your accurate facts and your less accurate ones? 

What a convenient way to move away from your glaring errors and misconceptions in the other thread. 

More to the point, while you sit there, thumping your chest and claiming that we're calling Mark Gurries wrong (we're not, we're saying you don't understand what you C&P from him, but never mind), can you explain the fact that he disavows any knowledge of you (post #86 on the "Curious: making my own DCC Decoder" thread)?


----------



## CTValleyRR

ED-RRR said:


> *Fact: (#2)*
> There is "No" member in this "Forum" that is a qualified [DCC] "Electrical Engineer"...


Because there isn't any such thing. This is just something you've made up to try to justify your incorrect positions. Funny you should throw this out, though. Based on what you have posted to date, YOUR knowledge of these matters is WAAAAY down on the scale. There are both EE's and DCC users on this forum who have forgotten more than you know.



ED-RRR said:


> *Fact: (#3)*
> I "Only" use "Cut-N-Paste" for (100%) "Proof" to back up this, my *[ED-RRR] *"Thread"..
> The information I received is from a qualified "Electrical Engineer"..
> - Direct contact through (E-mails) with *Mark Gurries* (NMRA DCC Clinic)..
> - Being sent to special web sites for more detailed information..


True. The problem is that you don't understand much of what you post, and frankly, the vast majority of it is _correct_, but completely irrelevant. The only time you posted relevant information, you contradicted yourself.



ED-RRR said:


> *Question: (#1)*
> Why are there so many individuals in this "Thread" determined to prove me "Wrong" ??


Isn't it obvious? Because you're a freakin' jackass, that's why.


----------



## CTValleyRR

Mark R. said:


> How come Mark Gurries has no idea who you are ?
> 
> Mark.


So here it is, ED -- address this issue, or quit posting stuff that purports to come "directly" from Mark. You're cribbing it off his website, which is a different matter entirely.


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

ED-RRR said:


> *Fact: (#2)
> There is "No" member in this "Forum" that is a qualified [DCC] "Electrical Engineer"..*


*I checked the curriculum at several well known Universities, including MIT since I have a nephew that is an MIT graduate, and none of them have ever heard of a DCC Electrical Engineer, so I'd like to know where you get that degree. Is that one of those Nigerian degrees you get by mail?



Fact: (#3)
I "Only" use "Cut-N-Paste" for (100%) "Proof" to back up this, my [ED-RRR] "Thread"..

Click to expand...

We're all painfully aware that you use cut-n-paste!



The information I received is from a qualified "Electrical Engineer"..
- Direct contact through (E-mails) with Mark Gurries (NMRA DCC Clinic)..

Click to expand...

Yet he professes not to have any idea who you are. Truthfully, if he's read any of your ramblings, I can see why he'd try to distance himself from them. *


----------



## time warp

Note to self: don't run electric trains on an airplane.


----------



## ED-RRR

*[fcwilt] Postings #13 #15*

*[fcwilt]: Posting #13*


fcwilt said:


> ER-RRR - Tell us what that means.
> *As written it is very ambiguous.*
> Frederick


*Mark Gurries*
https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/dcc-recomended-powersupplies
*WARNING: DO NOT CONNECT AC POWER TO A INPUT INTENDED ONLY FOR DC. 
You will damage the DCC product. * 

*[fcwilt]: Posting #15*


fcwilt said:


> ED-RRR - without consulting MG or any other source* tell us why a resistor and diode should be used.*
> Frederick


A larger "Stay Alive" capacitor does require a resistor and diode..
This has been known for many (many) years.. 









*Fact:*
Each and every "Different" manufactured [DCC] "Sound" decoder (P/N #):
- Has "Different" wiring schematics
- As per *Mark Gurries* (NMRA DCC Clinic) also stated to to me "Directly" (E-mail)
that each "Different" manufactured [DCC] "Sound" decoder requires "Special Wiring" connections to the [DCC] "Sound" decoder
to connect any type of "Stay Alive" capacitor..
......


----------



## time warp

I am sure that Mark is thrilled that you are throwing his name around so liberally and now posting his picture without his knowledge.


----------



## CTValleyRR

ED-RRR said:


> - Direct contact through (E-mails) with *Mark Gurries* (NMRA DCC Clinic)..
> - Being sent to special web sites for more detailed information..


Here's the nugget of truth buried in the BS: ED once attended a clinic taught by Mark at an NMRA event. They exchanged a couple of e-mails, who knows how many years ago.

This allows ED to claim acquaintance. 

You know something, ED? My parents taught theater arts at Penn State University for 35+ years. They know some VERY famous actors and directors. Most of them couldn't pick me out of a lineup if their life depended on it. Does this make me a movie star? I've shaken their hands. Does that make us best buddies?


----------



## wvgca

ED-RRR ...
you seem to be very capable at "cut 'n' paste", but if you are a 'papered & degreed' engineer [no matter the discipline], wasn't there something when you went to university that taught you to question supposed 'facts', and verify them to your satisfaction before spreading these 'facts' ..
The best one that springs to mind to me is you stating that 3 prong plugs can't be used for DCC power supplies ...
As far as I know, an engineer is 'supposed' to know his discipline, and can be held financially accountable for , uh .. his stated 'inaccuracies' ?


----------



## ED-RRR

*National Model Railroad Association (NMRA)..*



gunrunnerjohn said:


> I checked the curriculum at several well known Universities, including MIT since I have a nephew that is an MIT graduate,
> and none of them have ever heard of a DCC Electrical Engineer, so I'd like to know where you get that degree.
> Is that one of those Nigerian degrees you get by mail?
> We're all painfully aware that you use cut-n-paste!
> Yet he professes not to have any idea who you are.
> Truthfully, if he's read any of your ramblings, I can see why he'd try to distance himself from them.


*[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#1)*
Why are you know trying to go "Off Subject" ??

*[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#2)*
Why have you "Not" replied to my question directly to you *[gunrunnerjohn]* regarding "Switching Power Supplies" 
"Radio Frequency" (RF) will effect [DCC] "Electronic Components"..

*[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#3)*
Why are you "Totally" denying that *Mark Gurries* has a "Registered" National Model Railroad Association [DCC] web site ??
https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/nmra-dcc-clinic-pdf-files
......


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

ED-RRR said:


> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#1)*
> Why are you know trying to go "Off Subject" ??


Off topic? Aren't you the one that brought up the "DCC Electrical Engineer" degree?


> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#2)*
> Why have you "Not" replied to my question directly to you *[gunrunnerjohn]* regarding "Switching Power Supplies"
> "Radio Frequency" (RF) will effect [DCC] "Electronic Components"..


I didn't see where you actually asked such a question about DCC to me. You did say...


> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Simple Question*
> Without a doubt, did any "Radio Frequency" (RF) effect the planes "Electronic Components/Gauges" in older passenger jets
> - And -
> Does [DCC] "Radio Frequency" (RF) effect how digital systems function ??..


Since I never run my trains on a plane, I can't say if DCC would affect the instruments. However, having spent many years designing electronics for aircraft, including several air data computers, many cockpit instruments, and a number of fuel systems, I can answer the question about general EMI. The certification tests for any piece of critical avionics equipment is FAR more severe than making a cell phone call next to it. Try direct pin injection of EMI on all the signal pins over a wide range of frequencies. If it can handle that, I doubt a cell phone is going to pose a challenge.

It's very doubtful that any cell phone use on an airliner would affect the operation or navigation of the airplane. The FCC errs on the side of abundant caution. Truthfully, one of the major reasons they don't want you using cell phones on the airplane is the fact that you can hit a ton of cell towers and cause issue with the cellular communications system, not the aircraft electronics.

Is that specific enough for you? I don't have to cut-n-paste my answers, as I've actually been there, done that, and I have the T-shirt! 


> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#3)*
> Why are you "Totally" denying that *Mark Gurries* has a "Registered" National Model Railroad Association [DCC] web site ??
> https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/nmra-dcc-clinic-pdf-files
> ......


I denied nothing about Mark, who I suspect is a very knowledgeable individual. The fact that you can cut-n-paste some of his information does not make you an expert, it makes you a plagiarizer! Try doing something original, you might like it!


----------



## Bwells

Ed, John was questioning your use of the term DCC Electrical Engineer. He said nothing about Mark Gurries and his NMRA clinics. How did you spin that?
BACKGROUND

Mark Gurries is a professional Electrical Engineer (since 1984) and lives in San Jose, California (Silicon Valley). His experience in "Mixed Signal" (Digital and Analog) circuit design with expertise in Power Supply and Power Management design. This background directly applies to DCC technology. If you want to know more about Mark's technical background, go to this link.
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/mark-gurries/27/100/84b 
Mark is a member of both the NMRA, PCR and the OpSig group and attends many NMRA conventions around the country where he presents his NMRA DCC Clinics. He is also involved in his local NMRA Coast Division and PCR events. 
Mark has some history with the development of JMRI Decoder Pro. To learn more, go here: JMRI Decoder Pro History. There is also a New York Times article about DCC that he contributed too along with others from the bay area. To learn more, go here:Newspaper Article About DCC


----------



## CTValleyRR

ED-RRR said:


> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#1)*
> Why are you know trying to go "Off Subject" ??
> 
> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#2)*
> Why have you "Not" replied to my question directly to you *[gunrunnerjohn]* regarding "Switching Power Supplies"
> "Radio Frequency" (RF) will effect [DCC] "Electronic Components"..
> 
> *[gunrunnerjohn]: Question (#3)*
> Why are you "Totally" denying that *Mark Gurries* has a "Registered" National Model Railroad Association [DCC] web site ??
> https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/nmra-dcc-clinic-pdf-files
> ......


Really? Can you even read? If so, you clearly have zero ability to comprehend what you read.

I'll help:
#1 -- The guy bouncing the topic around is YOU, by posting reams of unrelated (although technically accurate) data.

#2 -- Because it's one of the many red herrings you've thrown out. Not relevant.

#3 -- No one ever said that Mark Gurries, who does not know you from Adam, has a website. It is not "registered" anywhere but with the ISP and host. It does reference, and is linked to, the NMRA one, but that doesn't make Mark an "official" DCC NMRA electrical engineer, any more than listing my name in the Electric Boat Management Association directory makes me an officer.

Really. You're just tiresome.


----------



## ED-RRR

*Look Who Is Talking.. (Again - Off Subject)*



wvgca said:


> ED-RRR ...
> you seem to be very capable at *"cut 'n' paste"*, but if you are a 'papered & degreed' engineer [no matter the discipline],
> wasn't there something when you went to university that taught you to question supposed 'facts', and verify them to your satisfaction before spreading these 'facts' ..
> The best one that springs to mind to me is you stating that 3 prong plugs can't be used for DCC power supplies ...
> As far as I know, an engineer is 'supposed' to know his discipline, and can be held financially accountable for , uh .. his stated 'inaccuracies' ?


*"Cut-N-Paste" --> (100%) Proven Facts..*

*Fact: (#1)*
- Do an "Advanced Search" --> *[wvgca]* in this "Forum".. "Threads"..
- There are several technical "Threads" posted from *[wvgca]*..

*Fact: (#2)*
- *[wvgca]* did "Not" state that each his "Stay Alive" capacitor require "Special Wiring" connections..

*Fact: (#3)*
- *[wvgca]* did "Not" state if his (Curious: making my own DCC decoder) did "Actually" work "Correctly" ??
......


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

ED-RRR said:


> *"Cut-N-Paste" --> (100%) Proven Facts..*


WOW, are you off in the weeds! You actually believe everything you read on the Internet? I can see why you're confused!


> *Fact: (#1)*
> - Do an "Advanced Search" --> *[wvgca]* in this "Forum".. "Threads"..
> - There are several technical "Threads" posted from *[wvgca]*..


So what? Your point is?


> *Fact: (#2)*
> - *[wvgca]* did "Not" state that each his "Stay Alive" capacitor require "Special Wiring" connections..


So what? In the discussions, that certainly seemed abundantly clear, at least to the rest of us.


> *Fact: (#3)*
> - *[wvgca]* did "Not" state if his (Curious: making my own DCC decoder) did "Actually" work "Correctly" ??
> ......


Again, so what? Who died and elected you king? He was discussing an ongoing project, are you suggesting he shouldn't post until he has "all the facts"? Sorry, but you don't get to make that call, I suggest you put a sock in it!

You're getting tiresome Ed, I think you should consider finding another place to pontificate, the leash is getting very short here.


----------



## wvgca

ED-RRR said:


> *Fact: (#1)*
> - Do an "Advanced Search" --> *[wvgca]* in this "Forum".. "Threads"..
> - There are several technical "Threads" posted from *[wvgca]*..
> 
> *Fact: (#2)*
> - *[wvgca]* did "Not" state that each his "Stay Alive" capacitor require "Special Wiring" connections..
> 
> *Fact: (#3)*
> - *[wvgca]* did "Not" state if his (Curious: making my own DCC decoder) did "Actually" work "Correctly" ??
> ......


lol,
Yes, i did start some technical threads, 
Yes, the stay alive needs to wired in, no one else seems to consider the wiring 'special' , except for you
Yes, the breadboard version worked correctly, and was verified by a qualified engineer with train experience, he works for CN

No, you didn't answer the 3 prong plug 'earth ground' comment


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

wvgca said:


> Yes, the breadboard version worked correctly, and was verified by a qualified engineer with train experience, he works for CN


Was that a *DCC Electrical Engineer*, or just a garden variety _EE_?


----------



## CTValleyRR

ED-RRR said:


> *"Cut-N-Paste" --> (100%) Proven Facts..*
> 
> *Fact: (#1)*
> - Do an "Advanced Search" --> *[wvgca]* in this "Forum".. "Threads"..
> - There are several technical "Threads" posted from *[wvgca]*..


Not only does he have as much right to post here as you do, his posts are more thoughtful, more insightful, and certainly more accurate than yours. What's more, they contain original research, not frequently plagiarized C&P from others. If some kind of certification were required to post technical information here, YOUR post count would be 3.



ED-RRR said:


> *Fact: (#2)*
> - *[wvgca]* did "Not" state that each his "Stay Alive" capacitor require "Special Wiring" connections..


Because it was pretty clear to anyone who actually READ the thread what was necessary to wire it in.



ED-RRR said:


> *Fact: (#3)*
> - *[wvgca]* did "Not" state if his (Curious: making my own DCC decoder) did "Actually" work "Correctly" ??
> ......


Did it ever occur to you that maybe he isn't done yet? Again, if something had to be proven to work before posting, you wouldn't get past the first checkpoint, because you haven't QA'd a single thing you've posted. Speaking of working, how did your capacitor wired in series work out for you? You did TRY that before you posted it, right?


----------



## fcwilt

time warp said:


> Note to self: don't run electric trains on an airplane.


Now that is funny! :laugh:

Frederick


----------



## wvgca

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Yet he professes not to have any idea who you are. .


That may be quite true .. I have emailed Mark Gurries twice in my life, using my actual name .. which had little relevance to my user name here [which is close to my yahoo email address] ..
Maybe ED-RRR's real name is something like "Ignacius", with something like that, I'd prefer ED as well :thumbsup:


----------



## wvgca

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Was that a *DCC Electrical Engineer*, or just a garden variety _EE_?


 ..
well,he does do lawns, is that close enough ? 
He actually has papers that say "CN Engineer" which is easier to verify than "NMRA DCC Engineer"


----------



## wvgca

ED-RRR said:


> *[teledoc]: Question*
> - Why are you stating (*You guys do know he won't let it rest*)...



Nope, not going to say anything to his one ... t'would be superfluous ..
However I do believe that teledoc has a serious contender for the title 'Master of Research & Useless Information"


----------



## time warp

" qualified engineer with train experience"!!,
I'm still laughing!!!!


----------



## wvgca

gunrunnerjohn said:


> , I think you should consider finding another place to pontificate, the leash is getting very short here.


Disagree .. you have any idea of how much amusement he generates??

And it's won't be easy to find someone that keeps coming back for more ..

just like the battery bunny


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

I am stunned that he keeps coming back for more abuse, you only see that once in a while. Usually, the penny drops after a spell.


----------



## highvoltage

wvgca said:


> Disagree .. you have any idea of how much amusement he generates??


Yes and no. It's getting tedious. It's obvious he needs to seek professional help for whatever he is suffering from.


----------



## Bwells

Should we vote?


----------



## Mark VerMurlen

highvoltage said:


> It's getting tedious.


I agree. At one point it was amusing, but its grown to be tedious and I don't think it reflects well on the forum as a whole. Any value Ed has brought to the forum has been overweighed by the detrimental effects he's also brought.

Mark


----------



## teledoc

Warren, Thanks for posting that response. I suspect there will be another counter response, and time will tell.


----------



## ncrc5315

Bwells said:


> Not his of course but from other members trying to explain to him what is right, RIGHT?


Actually both, as I use "his", as a way to sharpen my trouble shooting skills, by determining what is correct, and what is not, and were the inaccuracy is.


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

teledoc said:


> Warren, Thanks for posting that response. I suspect there will be another counter response, and time will tell.


I suspect there's just room for one more before we run out of space for frivolous replies.


----------



## wvgca

gunrunnerjohn said:


> I suspect there's just room for one more before we run out of space for frivolous replies.


As near as I can tell, ED-RRR has quite a few 'closed' threads ..and he is probably still upset that his 'sticky' fell off somehow?


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

wvgca said:


> he is probably still upset that his 'sticky' fell off somehow?


It was supposed to cover the keyboard, obviously, it didn't do the job.


----------



## johnfl68

Couldn't find any pictures of model trains on a plane.

I did find a Train Plane:









And a Plane on a Train:









And a Train in a Plane:


----------



## CTValleyRR

teledoc said:


> Warren, Thanks for posting that response. I suspect there will be another counter response, and time will tell.


It just illustrates the danger of blindly cutting and pasting "100% accurate facts" that you don't really understand.


----------



## Bwells

John, that train plane is great!


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

I wonder what possessed them to have to fly that train???


----------



## Lemonhawk

I can't imagine why they had to fly the train. Certainly there was a rail link or sea port, must have been a time constraint. I wonder if the trucks were removed and shipped by other means. That would have removed a good deal of the weight. Fascinating pictures.


----------



## ED-RRR

*Now Splitting Hairs --> About [DCC] Electrical Engineer.. (Mark Gurries)..*

*[ED-RRR]: Posting #66*


ED-RRR said:


> [teledoc]: Question
> Why are you personally attacking me [ED-RRR] when I have *"Posted" where (100%) of my information is from..*


*[ED-RRR]: Posting #67*


ED-RRR said:


> Fact: (#4)
> If you are "Stating" that any part of my [ED-RR] posted information in "Only" this "Thread" is "Wrong",
> you are *also "Stating" that Mark Gurries information is also "Totally Wrong"..*


*[gunrunnerjohn]: Posting #72*


gunrunnerjohn said:


> I checked the curriculum at several well known Universities, including MIT since I have a nephew that is an MIT graduate,
> and none of them have ever heard of a *DCC Electrical Engineer*, so I'd like to know where you get that degree.
> Is that one of those Nigerian degrees you get by mail?


*[gunrunnerjohn]: Posting #72*


gunrunnerjohn said:


> *Yet he professes not to have any idea who you are.* Truthfully, if he's read any of your ramblings, I can see why he'd try to distance himself from them.


*[gunrunnerjohn]: Question*
Who are you talking about ??
If you are talking about Mark Gurries, how did you contact him ??
Can you actually "Prove" how you "Directly" contacted Mark Gurries ?? *(I Can)*..

*[Bwells]: Posting #80*


Bwells said:


> Ed, John was questioning your use of the term *DCC Electrical Engineer.* He said nothing about Mark Gurries and his NMRA clinics. How did you spin that?
> BACKGROUND
> *Mark Gurries is a professional Electrical Engineer* (since 1984) and lives in San Jose, California (Silicon Valley).
> His experience in "Mixed Signal" (Digital and Analog) circuit design with expertise in Power Supply and Power Management design.
> *This background directly applies to DCC technology. *
> If you want to know more about Mark's technical background, go to this link.
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/mark-gurries/27/100/84b
> Mark is a member of both the NMRA, PCR and the OpSig group and attends many NMRA conventions around the country where he presents his NMRA DCC Clinics.
> He is also involved in his local NMRA Coast Division and PCR events.
> Mark has some history with the development of JMRI Decoder Pro. To learn more, go here: JMRI Decoder Pro History.
> There is also a New York Times article about DCC that he contributed too along with others from the bay area.
> To learn more, go here:Newspaper Article About DCC


*Electrical Engineer: (Definition)*
An electrical engineer is someone who designs and develops new electrical equipment, solves problems and tests equipment. 
They work with all kinds of electronic devices, from the smallest pocket devices to large supercomputers. 
Electrical engineering deals with electricity, electro-magnetism and electronics.
- Computer Engineer
- Electronics Engineer
- Hydro Electrical Engineer
- Etc..

*Digital Command Control: (Definition)*
The DCC protocol is defined by the Digital Command Control Working group of the National Model Railroad Association (NMRA). 
The NMRA has trademarked the term DCC, so while the term Digital Command Control is sometimes used to describe 
any digital model railway control system, strictly speaking it refers to NMRA DCC.
A digital command control system was developed (under contract by Lenz Elektronik GmbH of Germany) in the 1980s 
for two German model railway manufacturers, Märklin and Arnold (models).

*Fact:*
It is quite obvious that [DCC] protocol was "Designed" by "Electrical Engineers"..
*Question:*
Can "Not" these individuals that "Designed" [DCC] protocol, be called --> [DCC] "Electrical Engineers"..

*[Bwells]: Above Posting #80*
- Mark Gurries is a professional Electrical Engineer
- This background directly applies to DCC technology 

*Fact:*
When it comes to Mark Gurries, he solves all [DCC] problems and tests all [DCC] equipment.
That is why he has a very (very) large NMRA [DCC] "Clinic" web site.. 
Mark Gurries does "Not" directly call himself a [DCC] "Electrical Engineer"..

*Question:*
I have called *Mark Gurries a [DCC] "Electrical Engineer"* for all the extra hard work for his NMRA [DCC] "Clinic" web site.. 
Do you "Not" think that Mark Gurries: 
- "Qualifies" as a [DCC] "Electrical Engineer" ??
- "Respect" him by "Calling" him a [DCC] "Electrical Engineer" ??
......


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## fcwilt

ED-RRR,

Calling MG (or any EE) a [DCC] "Electrical Engineer" is almost an insult.

The knowledge needed to understand and work with DCC systems is just a tiny fraction of what a good EE knows.

DCC systems are really quite simple and just about anyone with a decent knowledge of electronics could design and build one. It certainly doesn't take a EE.

You claim you are only trying to help beginners but the stuff you have been posting is way beyond what a beginner is likely to be looking for.

Why don't you take the time to truly learn how DCC systems are designed, how they work and why.

Then you would be in position to help folks.

Cutting-and-pasting things you yourself don't understand is really a waste of time.


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## ED-RRR

*Warning --> A Heckler Has Now Entered This Thread !!*



fcwilt said:


> ED-RRR,
> Calling MG (or any EE) a [DCC] "Electrical Engineer" is almost an insult.
> The knowledge needed to understand and work with DCC systems is just a tiny fraction of what a good EE knows.
> DCC systems are really quite simple and just about anyone with a decent knowledge of electronics could design and build one. It certainly doesn't take a EE.
> You claim you are only trying to help beginners but the stuff you have been posting is way beyond what a beginner is likely to be looking for.
> Why don't you take the time to truly learn how DCC systems are designed, how they work and why.
> Then you would be in position to help folks.
> Cutting-and-pasting things you yourself don't understand is really a waste of time.


*Warning:*
A "Heckler" has now entered this "Thread" 
that does "Acknowledge" Mark Gurries.. (Why ??).. 
......







!!


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## ED-RRR

*DCC Forum (Digital Command Control) --> (DCC Forum)..*

*[CTValleyRR]:*









*Question: (#1)*
Are you a "Member" of a "Model Train Club Layout" ??

*Question: (#2)*
Where is this "Model Train Club Layout" located ??

*Question: (#3)*
Are you an "Electrical Engineer" when it comes to [DCC] "Operations" ??
- OR -
A "Heckler" that I have seen in "Another Forum" ?? (RE: Can Not Make --> Mechanics Vertical Creeper)..
......


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## time warp

ED the know - it - all, what a blowhard! 
DC C is an extension of Carrier Control, or Carrier Wave control. It's been around for decades! 
Are you unaware of the old GE Astrac systems? Way back there. They were an APPLICATION of an existing technology just like modern Carrier Wave Controls are. That's what you're talking about and you don't even know it.
You've walked into a 88mm howitzer fight with a pea shooter. GO AWAY!


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## wvgca

ED-RRR said:


> *Warning:*
> A "Heckler" has now entered this "Thread" !!


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## gunrunnerjohn

ED-RRR said:


> *Question: (#1)*
> Are you a "Member" of a "Model Train Club Layout" ??


Sure, are you?


> *Question: (#2)*
> Where is this "Model Train Club Layout" located ??


SE-PA


> *Question: (#3)*
> Are you an "Electrical Engineer" when it comes to [DCC] "Operations" ??
> - OR -
> A "Heckler" that I have seen in "Another Forum" ?? (RE: Can Not Make --> Mechanics Vertical Creeper)..


I'm just a straight Electrical Engineer, I didn't have to specialize in one discipline.  I never tried to make a Mechanics Vertical Creeper, and I fail to see what this has to do with DCC, Electrical Engineering, or anything related to the same! You seem to make less and less sense every post! :goofball:


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## teledoc

*For ED-RRR*

ED, The final chapter has finally been written, and the book is going to close for good. You get to read one last PM, with no chance to respond. Enjoy reading it!!!


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## time warp

Hey,CT. You got something on your shoe from post 111, might want to scrape that off.


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## teledoc

*ED-RRR's demise*

For all of the group that have been in this section of the DCC forum, and I hate to take the fun away from all of you, BUT Ed is no longer able to respond or make any more comments.

ED-RRR HAS BEEN BANNED PERMANENTLY FROM THE FORUM.

Hopefully the discussion regarding DCC and everyone's ideas can be continued Constructively, without constant bickering of who is right or wrong, and persistent attacks on all sides of the fence. Enjoy discussing the newest thread, and with hopes that it brings new users who actually want to learn.

And Gunrunnerjohn did not pull the plug on ED. 

Jerry
Teledoc


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## time warp

I've got mixed emotions about ED being banned, but I totally support your decision to do so, teledoc!


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## teledoc

For you sane individuals trying to discuss DCC constructively, the repetitive posts by ED were getting tiresome. His outcome was discussed behind the scenes, with a lot of thought taken into account. He joined the forum in June 2015, and the beginning of the "Cut & Paste" sessions started in Sept. 2015. From that point on, it consistently got worse, to the detriment of any Civil discussions regarding DCC, as beginners would like to learn. ED decided that everyone else's comments or criticisms were wrong or incorrect, trying to add unnecessary facts to back up his posts.

He cannot respond to any comments, from this point forward, and hopefully we can let the DCC topic get back to something interesting that others can discuss, without any distractions. Let it all go...and please refrain from throwing any final jabs at him.


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## gunrunnerjohn

In keeping with that idea, I think I'll close this thread. I think letting it fade away will be good for all. 

Feel free to start a non-polluted thread on the same topic.


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