# HO Engine Questions



## James (Nov 3, 2015)

Hi all, new here. Decided to go steam, and resarching HO steam engines, I read that you dhould have a good engine. My question is what do you all think about Broadway Limited, Marklin, or Bachman? Do they make good engines? Any other companies would you all might recommend? I'm thinking on doing a 1920's or 1930's theme.

Thanks,
James


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

Picking the 1920s and 1930s means that there are lots of loco options. Anything larger than a 4-4-0 was could be found still active in that period -- although the smaller ones (like 4-6-0 were becoming rare and were probably limited to yard work and short line railroads. On the other end, there were only a few steam locomotive types that were introduced after 1940. So there are lots of models to choose from.

Best internet source of steam info is:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com

It gives some info on the history of each type of loco, a list of what railroads purchased that type of loco and when they were put into service (and LOTS of other details). There is not always info on how long they were used, but you can roughly figure about a 40 year lifespan for a steam loco.

Also on steamlocomotive.com, is a list of manufacturers that made HO model of steam locos and what models they made. This info is not entirely complete, and it is also somewhat dated, but there is a lot of info there.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

All of the current crop of makers produce fine products, even Bachmann who once inhabited the cheap and cheerful end of the market now make some of the best value steamers out there. As far as I know Marklin only produce European outline, expensive but considered by many to be the best. 
Your choice is going to be governed regarding size by space you have available for a layout. A multi wheeled steamer is going to look a bit funny going round a small oval. But there's plenty of choices out there. Good luck.


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

Cycleops said:


> All of the current crop of makers produce fine products, even Bachmann who once inhabited the cheap and cheerful end of the market now make some of the best value steamers out there. As far as I know Marklin only produce European outline, expensive but considered by many to be the best.
> Your choice is going to be governed regarding size by space you have available for a layout. A multi wheeled steamer is going to look a bit funny going round a small oval. But there's plenty of choices out there. Good luck.


So, if one were to do a European railroad and went with Marklin, would a 4 x 8 layout wotk?


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## dave1905 (Jul 7, 2013)

4-4-0's were still in use on branches and lighter passenger service lines in the 1920's and 1930's. 4-4-0's were built up to about WW1 so the would still be fairly new engines in the 1920's. 4-6-0 were very common on branches and in commuter service, especially in the east (the LI and CNJ 4-6-0's lasted until the end of steam). They were built through the 1920's.

2-8-0's were the "GP-7" of steam engines, they could be found everywhere in local, yard and light through freight service. Coal haulers would have legions of 2-8-0's.

By the 1920's the 2-8-2 was very common in through freight service, with 4-8-2's and by the 1930's 4-8-4's and 2-8-4's supplanting them in fast freight service. 

In the 1920's articulated engines would be drag freight engines, designed to slog really heavy trains through the mountains. 

The 1920's would be dominated by engine built before WW1 and the new stuff would be USRA designs. By the end of the 1930's the "super power" steam was coming on line.

Locomotives can last a lot longer than 40 years, they tend to be rebuilt a lot. The practical limit is somewhat moot since any locomotives built after 1900 would only last maybe 50 years because regardless of how serviceable it was, all steamers were retired in the 1950's.


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## EMD_GP9 (Jun 19, 2012)

Hi James.
One thing to be aware of if choosing Marklin is that it is a 3-rail system and not 2-rail as is common these days.
Also the system uses AC current and not DC as (again) is common now.
The effect is that you have to use Marklin track and probably controllers ( there is some compatibility now with DCC in modern Marklin digital) and the choice of locos and rolling stock is limited to their own offerings and a few other european manufacturers that make compatible locomotives and rolling stock.
Some U.S models are made but a very limited range is available and because of the very course wheel standards used most other manufacturers 2-rail rolling stock will work but have trouble with facing points ! Marklin rolling stock has un-insulated axles so will not work on 2-rail tracks.
If you look at the "SCARM" posts on this forum or website you will find a selection of track layouts for various size baseboards for Marklin if you want to go that route and also other layouts that may give you ideas.
No connection to marklin or SCARM.
Hope this helps. 
Colin.


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

EMD_GP9 said:


> Hi James.
> One thing to be aware of if choosing Marklin is that it is a 3-rail system and not 2-rail as is common these days.
> Also the system uses AC current and not DC as (again) is common now.
> The effect is that you have to use Marklin track and probably controllers ( there is some compatibility now with DCC in modern Marklin digital) and the choice of locos and rolling stock is limited to their own offerings and a few other european manufacturers that make compatible locomotives and rolling stock.
> ...


Thank you Colin. You have been a huge help. As cool as doing a European railroad sounds, from what you said that is out of the question now. I will definitely have to check out the layouts. Thanks so much again, Colin.

James


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

I believe that Marklin do also produce a two rail system and locos. You need to check it out. If you want to use their locos with another system rather than their own it's a lot of faffing about and I don't know if you think it's worth it. I also believe their own system is not NMRA compliant so using other makes of engines might be a problem.

Don't worry, if you want to go the European route there are plenty of other makers offering great products.


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

Cycleops said:


> I believe that Marklin do also produce a two rail system and locos. You need to check it out. If you want to use their locos with another system rather than their own it's a lot of faffing about and I don't know if you think it's worth it. I also believe their own system is not NMRA compliant so using other makes of engines might be a problem.
> 
> Don't worry, if you want to go the European route there are plenty of other makers offering great products.


Thank you. Would you know what other makers offer European engines and such?


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## A&NRR (Aug 2, 2015)

What steam engines I have are Broadway Limited which I love, I have one Bachman and had nothing but problems with it. The connection between the engine and tender keeps coming loose and the entire engine sits to close to the track. Every time it crosses a turnout or rerailer it hits the railhead which pushes the engine up and derails. Anyway that's my experiences with steam.


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## Chet (Aug 15, 2014)

I model the transition era, but do have fre locomotives, besides brass that I am happy with. Bachmann makes a good Consolidation (2-8-0) and their little Mogul (2-6-0) isn't a bad little locomotive. I recently picked up a BLI Heave Mike (2-8-2) which is an excellent running locomotive. I doubt that you would want to go with anything larger than that.


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## fcwilt (Sep 27, 2013)

As mentioned Marklin is 3-rail and AC.

For 2-rail and DC/DCC then look at their Trix line which will have similar items.

Both are first rate.


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

Thanks for all the help and information. I'm really leaning towards Broadway Limited for a steam engine. That being said would a Broadway Limited work on a 4 x 8 layout or should one go for a 5 x 10 layout?


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## A&NRR (Aug 2, 2015)

If you have the room go with the 5x10. Just be aware of being able to access the inner most part of the layout. Back when I had my larger layout I had it on 2 ft. wide shelves around the room. I ran 22" radius curves, my Broadway GS-4 daylight had no problem. With a 4x8 layout you basically restricted to 18" radius, which set in an older time period short line It'll look just fine. Due to space issue's I'm currently building a 4x6 layout based on the East Texas logging around Lufkin. Set in the 50's


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

A&NRR said:


> If you have the room go with the 5x10. Just be aware of being able to access the inner most part of the layout. Back when I had my larger layout I had it on 2 ft. wide shelves around the room. I ran 22" radius curves, my Broadway GS-4 daylight had no problem. With a 4x8 layout you basically restricted to 18" radius, which set in an older time period short line It'll look just fine. Due to space issue's I'm currently building a 4x6 layout based on the East Texas logging around Lufkin. Set in the 50's


That sounds really cool what you are doing. East Texas logging around Lufkin is really neat. 

Where I plan on doing the layout is in a spare bedroom with the only things in there are the washer and dryer.


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

I have a BLI 2-8-2 that I bought used. It runs fine on my 18" curves. But it is one of their older models. I can't speak for the newest models.

That being said, if you have space for a 5 x 10 ft layout, go for it. This small increase will give you lots more options in your track layout scheme. By the way, 5' is the widest that you want to go. That leaves a 2.5 foot reach into the center of the layout. That is about as far as most people can reach and perform delicate operations, like track laying or fixing derailments.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

James said:


> Thank you. Would you know what other makers offer European engines and such?


There are many fine manufacturers of European locos and stock, these are a few: Roco, Brawa, Viet, Bemo, Fleischmann, Rivarossi, Lima, Piko and OsKar.

It would be a good idea to buy a digital issue of Continental Modeller:http://www.pecopublications.co.uk/continental-modeller.html its a mine of information on European matters and even covers the US scene.


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## A&NRR (Aug 2, 2015)

James, do you have a certain railroad or location you want to model. I've found that having a certain theme gives the railroad a purpose of being there. Although it's long out of print but I really enjoyed John Olsen's book The Jerome and Southwestern R.R. It was a 4x8 HO scale short line based in the 40's mining town in Arizona. I'm there's pictures of the layout online, Google images maybe. It showed just how much detail can be accomplished in a small space.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

I'll chime in on your size considerations: most locomotives are designed to run on 18" curves. Whether they look good doing it (longer ones have a lot of overhang, and can create lots of friction doing it) and pull cars without problems, is another story.

Best practice is really to go as big as you can. If you can do a 5x10 with 22" radius curves, you will be probably be happier. Keep in mind that your reach is probably going to be limited to about 30", so keep that in mind as you design and build. Moreover, you may want to break out of the "rectangle" mold and string together a series of 2x4 (up to 2x8) modules for a more donut or around-the-room approach. These designs actually give you more layout in the same space (accounting for access aisles).


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

MtRR75 said:


> That being said, if you have space for a 5 x 10 ft layout, go for it. This small increase will give you lots more options in your track layout scheme. By the way, 5' is the widest that you want to go. That leaves a 2.5 foot reach into the center of the layout. That is about as far as most people can reach and perform delicate operations, like track laying or fixing derailments.


Unless, of course, you build it in the middle of the room, where you can access it from all around....


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

CTValleyRR said:


> Moreover, you may want to break out of the "rectangle" mold and string together a series of 2x4 (up to 2x8) modules for a more donut or around-the-room approach. These designs actually give you more layout in the same space (accounting for access aisles).


Good point. I am looking down the road to expand my layout. I originally figured that I could fit a 5 x 12 table into the alcove in my room. Then I worked up a layout that ran around the three sides of the alcove, and got almost exactly twice as much track for the same amount of layout space. Plus, the longer runs are more realistic.

In addition, it is easier to build a modular around-the-wall layout that it is for a modular table layout -- mainly due to the track connections. It is much easier to line up straight tracks than to line up curved tracks at the modular junctions. With an around-the-wall layout, you can make sure that the track is running straight through each junction. With a table layout, it is hard to avoid curved or angled track junctions when building modules -- which leads to more derailments. Just take your table track plan and lay out the module junctions, and you will see what I mean.


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## EMD_GP9 (Jun 19, 2012)

Hi James.
Glad to help.
As mentioned earlier don't be put off modelling a European scene as there are many manufacturers of 2-rail models both DC and DCC .
Cycleops mentioned pretty well all of them but as I mentioned be aware that some manufacturers make Marklin compatible versions of their models so be careful when buying that you get the 2-rail version - the well known auction site here in the UK is flooded with Marklin compatible versions which do not seem to sell so beware a bargain and check the details carefully before buying.
Trix is the 2-rail version of Marklin.
Regards, Colin.


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## santafealltheway (Nov 27, 2012)

*just wanted to chime in on the size of a layout...*

I actually cut my foam base in half long ways, so i could flip it around and easily change things in the middle, before re attaching later.


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

Old_Hobo said:


> Unless, of course, you build it in the middle of the room, where you can access it from all around....


That is what I was thinking. It is/was a bedroom, but now on one wall we have a washer and dryer.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Above?*



James said:


> That is what I was thinking. It is/was a bedroom, but now on one wall we have a washer and dryer.


 James;

If the washer is a front loader, you could build a few inches over the washer and dryer with your modules. Just be sure there is room on either side of the appliances for service access. I'm a retired appliance technician and I have seen far to many machines wedged into inaccessible locations! 

Traction Fan


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## James (Nov 3, 2015)

traction fan said:


> James;
> 
> If the washer is a front loader, you could build a few inches over the washer and dryer with your modules. Just be sure there is room on either side of the appliances for service access. I'm a retired appliance technician and I have seen far to many machines wedged into inaccessible locations!
> 
> Traction Fan


The washer is a top loader and dryer a front loader.


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