# Lionel Tinplate 610 & 612 -- Early Style



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

When it rains it pours, I recently purchased these two gems from an antique dealer of all places. Fixed up they will go with my 249E.
As of now I am not sure what I have. It may be an Ives off spring when Purchased by Lionel. It has 8 wheels compared to the common 4. It has the color insert like the 629 and 630. It has 6 windows instead of 4. This can be explained with the two four wheel trucks and both are lighted. 
The interor and bottom is dark green a common color with a maroon insert. The back balcony shows traces of gold. However the exterior is wiped clean. 
The bottom frame is green and shows peeling where it meets the side edge. I am shining it up the observation car. 

I would like to ask what I should do about color? I do not want to change the maroon insert.The metal will shine real bright. I could go with a green roof and leave the sides metal or do the opposite. Dark green coaches just don't excite me.The green I have now is too seasonal. I could do a black roof too. Green would be original. A sand or beige would work.
If I get energetic I could add steps and a center tank.











For the comedians NO Partridge Family decor PLease.
I did find this site

















The interior roof is also dark green.
The inserts will stay maroon and the doors are non hinged.
The trucks have no journals. The doors do not have any steps and there is no center tank on the frame.
So far I think the cars are about 1924,25. They are Lionel O gage.
The dimensions are 8 and a quarter inches by 2 and three quarters inches.









I am still searching images I found decals on E bay so I need to verify the coach numbers.
*THE ANSWER
Lionel 610 Pullman and 612 Obsevation. This version is an early one from 1915 to 1925.* Since it is lighted it dates to 1923 to 1925 in this style. For the sides, Pullman was stamped on the bottom. NY City Lines on the top. SIte
I checked the catalog and it is listed on page 13 with a 154 engine. Amazing what you find when you know what you are looking for. 
I am going to go with original amd get the right paint. The tank amd steps will be with ceramic magnets so no new holes will be drilled.
Thanks to envfocus of CTT forum.:thumbsup:


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*Clean*

Progress is slow because of the nice weather. Spring is here. I cleaned the exterior rust off. The scotchbrite and rubbing compound did the trick. A nice smooth surface.
The frame to the 610 Pullman was a challenge. One corner and the top came loose and had to be soldered. The roof piece has no play so the the joining took a few tries to get it right. The top piece I used the torture tourniquet to align the top. I used some steel spring clamps for the bad corner. The weller solder gun did the rest.
I need to look the dark green paint. Mixed paint for 12 oz is going for 30 on ebay with shipping. I don't need to paint a bus. The stamps will cost 35 too.
I am reading on waxing tinplate cars and am looking for suggestions. THe clear sealer worked fine on my dub pieces but I want to look at other options for these cars.


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*Paint*

Painted today. Started with a gray primer,black flat, and a dark green enamel. Three coats of paint. I used a heat gun to warm the cans to the touch. I heated the items after sprayng. I got good adhesion and quick drying. The green is a Kilns Hunter Green. It was a tad more olive than the the Rustoleum.



















Inside,underside, and the inserts were left original.
I cleaned the wheels and painted the trucks a gloss black. Assembly tomorrow except I have to paint the gold.


----------



## Boston&Maine (Dec 19, 2007)

Looks pretty good T-Man :smilie_daumenpos:


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Thanks!
I want to look into a an acrylic floor wax to coat the maroon panels before I install them. I have a lead on stamps . Mostly I am lettiing the paint cure the longer the better. So far I am happy with the results.


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*Couplers*

Moving forward, I won a lot, of couplers on ebay. Used so they should fit in with a little cleaning. Now I have to wait for them.


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

I got the couplers in. The holes were worn. So, I slightly enlarged a 3/16th washer by adding a slot from a worn dremel wheel. I used the Future FLoor NonWax on the maroon insert. Assembly is next.


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*Getting there*

I inserted the celluloid strips to the interior. I had to use some RTV to keep it down. Some had minor tears and I didn't want to break the small tabs. Just a dab on the tab did the trick. 
Then I went on to install the lighting. I used some Radio shack standard sockets and bent them up to fit. This will give the coach on overhead light that doesn't show. I am running them on the track now and still have some ground issues. I may go with a wiper on the axle.


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*Done, Sort of*

The project to date. Looking Good. I inserted a plastic bag under the engine to light the cars. I let three of these baby go on e bay . I shoulda bid on em but I refrained. Vent Vent I feel better now. They got teamed up with the 249E. An engine 10 to 15 years younger.











The 249e with A 265T Tender.


----------



## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

T-Man,

Per my thread and questions earlier today on my interest in Lionel 609 & 611 passenger cars ...

This project thread here is GREAT! Exactly what I was hoping to find ... a first-hand look "under the hood".

Your isolated pics of the maroon window/door panels are very informative ... So, all windows and doors on each side are from a common (rather large) insert panel. Good to know that it can be removed and painted (though you left yours orig) as needed, without having to tape-off when installed on the main cab.

I'm also happy to see/learn that the roof easily comes off with just one center screw. Piece of cake!

Were you able to remove the balcony before the green respray?

Excellent work on your end (I LIKE the green!) And a HUGE thumbs-up thanks for sharing all of this very detailed info with everyone ... a big help to us nit-wits!!!

TJ


----------



## Stillakid (Jan 12, 2010)

T-Man, every time I go thru this posting, I feel an, "Itch" coming on


----------



## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Stillakid said:


> T-Man, every time I go thru this posting, I feel an, "Itch" coming on




At least you just got an itch.

I keep hearing voices telling me it's OK to buy more.:laugh:


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

tjcruiser said:


> T-Man,
> 
> Per my thread and questions earlier today on my interest in Lionel 609 & 611 passenger cars ...
> 
> ...


TJ ,I did not remove the balcony. I had to touch up from spraying.Thinking back I am not sure it was removable. 
This project was a lot of fun and to find it in that condition was quite uncommon. My main message is that just about anything can be improved upon and that it becomes more personalized to you. It takes some effort to have the right stuff and patience but again it it is not rocket science and the more you practice the more you want to do. For the rest of you ,if you itch you scratch!!


----------



## imatt88 (Jan 31, 2010)

T-Man,

Nice job!:thumbsup: I love the "in-progress" pictures. Helps guys like me with very little train experience to follow along and see how things work


----------



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

My point exactly! A lot of forums will tell you how, or show the result but not the process. The digital age has arrived.

The biggest surprise has been the information I have learned in helping other members, just that, has carved my niche into the hobby.

To coin it into a philosphy. Get the train out of the closet. Find out what it is and get it running. Decide, what you can do to enjoy it. Learn more and develope skills. Then teach me something.

Now I have realized I can't do everthing, and I have to keep track of what I have done and information I have gathered.The most frustrating is knowing I did something but don't have the information at my fingertips. So when I do a thread I try to include the pertinent information so it is there. Aside from can't do everything, I can't remember all the particulars either. Just this project here is a year old already.

Most important is to have and enjoy it.


----------



## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Very impressive, Bob. I love the sequential pictures---it's like watching a movie of your progress. Thanks for going to all the trouble to document and photograph the process.


----------



## Stillakid (Jan 12, 2010)

Bob, I am so gonna be asking tons of questions


----------

