# new to n scale



## little fat buddy (Jan 14, 2011)

hello everyone so ive been in ho for a while but just cant get the layout i want in the space i have so im converting to n scale. but i have a few questions i hope that somone can help me with. 

i have roughly a 3ft x 8ft space to use for this layout. 
what i would like to know is what kind of curve radius i can use an what will opertate on them reliably im into modern stuff like es44acs sd70aces and would possibly like ot run a amtrack passenger train every now and then. im looking at a twice around style layout 

next what is better to do im looking at using katos unitrack but is it better to buy there box sets or peice meal it out. 

for right now thats it though im sure ill have more in the future thanks for everyones time


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## sid (Mar 26, 2018)

i have an 4 x 8 lay out but i dont have the long stuff running on it my big out curve is from kato v6 track . i cant tel you the radiuses cause i dont understand that stuff. a pic of my current lay out. if i remove the centers of the outer circles it will fit a 3 x 8 space


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## BrokeCurmudgeon (Feb 8, 2016)

little fat buddy said:


> hello everyone so ive been in ho for a while but just cant get the layout i want in the space i have so im converting to n scale. but i have a few questions i hope that somone can help me with.
> 
> i have roughly a 3ft x 8ft space to use for this layout.
> what i would like to know is what kind of curve radius i can use an what will opertate on them reliably im into modern stuff like es44acs sd70aces and would possibly like ot run a amtrack passenger train every now and then. im looking at a twice around style layout
> ...


I built a 36"x80" layout on a door blank from Lowes. I live in a small 1 bedroom apartment for seniors and so far, "She who must be obeyed!" hasn't objected to sharing the space. It is DCC and I can run 4 trains at one time. Good luck!


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## GNfan (Jun 3, 2016)

Welcome, and good luck.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Welcome aboard The N-scale express!*



little fat buddy said:


> hello everyone so ive been in ho for a while but just cant get the layout i want in the space i have so im converting to n scale. but i have a few questions i hope that somone can help me with.
> 
> i have roughly a 3ft x 8ft space to use for this layout.
> what i would like to know is what kind of curve radius i can use an what will opertate on them reliably im into modern stuff like es44acs sd70aces and would possibly like ot run a amtrack passenger train every now and then. im looking at a twice around style layout
> ...


 little fat buddy;

With a 3' wide table, you should be able to fit a 16" radius curve. That's what I use as my minimum and it handles everything quite well. I had used a 12" radius minimum, thinking any N-scale loco should be able to handle 11" radius curves, so 12" would be generous, especially since I used 19" radius easements at both ends of each curve. Wrong. I bought two of Kato's beautiful 2-8-2 Mikado steam locomotives, and they did not like to stay on a 12" curve. I tested various radii and found that 16" was reliable for everything, including the Mikados. 
Since you like big long locomotives, and maybe long modern freight cars, the bigger the minimum radius you can fit, the better. Can you widen the table a bit at the ends to accommodate a wider curve? Often extending it an inch or two, only under the curve, helps fit in a bigger curve. 
I recommend flex track rather than sectional track, with, or without roadbed attached. Flex is cheaper and can be used as straight track or any curve you want.
If you do want to use roadbed track, then Kato Unitrack is the best quality brand, and offers more curve radii than other brands.

For more info on track types, layout shapes and a whole lot more, check out the attached pdf files.

Good luck, have fun;

Traction Fan :smilie_daumenpos:

View attachment WHERE DO I START rev 4.pdf


View attachment All AboutTurnouts rev 4.pdf


View attachment 1 How to build a better first layout.pdf


View attachment 2 How to build a better first layout.pdf


View attachment 3 & 4 How to build a better first layout.pdf


View attachment 5 How to build a better first layout.pdf


View attachment 6 How to build a better first layout.pdf


View attachment MODEL RAILROADING ON A BUDGET.pdf


View attachment Model Railroad Terminology 2.2.pdf


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## BrokeCurmudgeon (Feb 8, 2016)

My 36x80 N Scale Layout:


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## little fat buddy (Jan 14, 2011)

traction fan said:


> little fat buddy;
> 
> With a 3' wide table, you should be able to fit a 16" radius curve. That's what I use as my minimum and it handles everything quite well. I had used a 12" radius minimum, thinking any N-scale loco should be able to handle 11" radius curves, so 12" would be generous, especially since I used 19" radius easements at both ends of each curve. Wrong. I bought two of Kato's beautiful 2-8-2 Mikado steam locomotives, and they did not like to stay on a 12" curve. I tested various radii and found that 16" was reliable for everything, including the Mikados.
> Since you like big long locomotives, and maybe long modern freight cars, the bigger the minimum radius you can fit, the better. Can you widen the table a bit at the ends to accommodate a wider curve? Often extending it an inch or two, only under the curve, helps fit in a bigger curve.
> ...



traction fan thank you for all this awesome info i will defintley look at those files an no 3ft wide is as wide as i can go unlessi were to build this as two modules an then two filler peices an connect them all when i wanted to run it whihch though seems like more of a time hassle but i am honestly looking into this option since yes i do like large modern equipment an also like some large steam power thanks again for your advice. and thanks to everyone else for the warm welcome an advice.


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## Fire21 (Mar 9, 2014)

Curmudgeon, that's a beautiful layout! VERY nicely done!


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## sid (Mar 26, 2018)

BrokeCurmugeon hahaha good video . i was looking for the smoke/ steam from that loco hahahahahahahahahahaha


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## BrokeCurmudgeon (Feb 8, 2016)

Thanks to all for the compliments! I was just trying to show what I did with this size layout. I used Kato sectional track and haven't had too much trouble. As with all layouts, I would do some things different if I were to do again. For example a over and under loop. N scale has become difficult for me so I am doing more with my Toy Train S Scale American Flyers. But it is all fun no matter what! Incidentally, my road is FFRTN RR. Or Fat Freddy's Railroad to Nowhere.:laugh::laugh::laugh:


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Sectional benchwork*



little fat buddy said:


> traction fan thank you for all this awesome info i will defintley look at those files an no 3ft wide is as wide as i can go unlessi were to build this as two modules an then two filler peices an connect them all when i wanted to run it whihch though seems like more of a time hassle but i am honestly looking into this option since yes i do like large modern equipment an also like some large steam power thanks again for your advice. and thanks to everyone else for the warm welcome an advice.


little fat buddy;

You are welcome. As you read through the first file, "Where do I start", you will get some info, and my opinion, on the advantages of sectional construction. I strongly recommend it. Apart from a little extra work in initial construction, I see no good reason NOT to build any 4' x 8' or larger, layout in sections. (you said "modules", but I know what you mean) 

Before you start construction, you might want to read through the "How to build a better first layout" files, particularly the "sections 3&4 one." It has sketches showing some of the possibilities available in a fairly small room.
Modelers have a tendency to think in terms of rectangular slab "train tables" with track ovals on top, as the only shape a layout can be. It's not.
Often, when space is limited, a shelf layout will work, even if it is quite long, simply because it is so narrow.
My own layout is a two-level bookshelf type that occupies a couple of the walls of my standard two-car garage. The top shelf holds my collection of train books, the two middle shelves house my railroad, and the shelves below the railroad are used for general storage. This uses the same floor space for three different purposes. However, my wife can still park her big Toyota Rav-4 SUV in the garage. There is also room for two workbenches (His & Hers) an assortment of power tools, and storage shelves for the usual "stuff" that families collect over the years.
The photos show parts of my layout, including a standard 4' x 16" x 16" section, and two sections bolted back-to back with a bigger rounded end section to accommodate turn-back curves on both levels.

An open mind, and careful planning, can often fit more layout into a limited space than looks possible, at first glance.
For instance, if your layout were only 12"-18" deep, it would leave most of the room available for non-model railroad activities. If It could go all the way around the room, then you could fit very broad curves in the four corners of the room. These curves, 24"-36" radius, could handle any N-scale equipment made.

good luck & have fun;

Traction Fan :smilie_daumenpos:


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## little fat buddy (Jan 14, 2011)

okay thanks again an oh i plan to read all of those files i wish it could go around the room but there is 3 doors of various heights and alot of other things along the walls in this room i have to use or i would just do a around the walls layout an yeah i meant to say sectoins lol thanks again.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Don't sweat the modules/sections stuff*



little fat buddy said:


> okay thanks again an oh i plan to read all of those files i wish it could go around the room but there is 3 doors of various heights and alot of other things along the walls in this room i have to use or i would just do a around the walls layout an yeah i meant to say sectoins lol thanks again.



little fat buddy;

Don't worry about the "module vs. section" terminology. There is a technical difference, but it's certainly no big deal. Both those terms are in the "Model Railroad Terminology" file, which is laid out in alphabetical order. You can look them up if you want.
Here on the forum, and in model railroad circles generally, the two words are used interchangeably by a lot of folks. We know what you have in mind, adding a couple of pieces to your layout. That's a good deal if you can work it out.
Your initial plan was to use a 3' x 8' table. If that ends up being the space limit, here's a labor saving suggestion. Many N-scale layouts have been built on hollow-core doors. I've built two of them. A standard door is 80" high. That's only four inches shy of 7'. The doors come in several widths, including 36." So, you could save a lot of table building if you can live with a layout that is 16" shorter than your 8' maximum length. The doors come in various finishes too. Luan plywood was my choice. It accepts track nails well. Masonite is another common finish for the faces of the door. Doors are also available in widths less than 36." Some of the really narrow ones like a 18"-24" "cafe door" might work for a freight yard addition to your layout.

Sorry to hear that you're not able to go all the way around the room. That's a really nice option, if you can do it.
Narrow shelves, with wider sections where your train can turn around, is another good option. My railroad is built this way.
I'm sure you'll figure out something. If you have any questions, just ask.

Have fun;

Traction Fan :smilie_daumenpos:


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