# Nailing track to cork/foam



## danhi (Jan 5, 2016)

What is the suggested tool(s) for nailing track to cork(with 1" foam underneath). My fingers are having a hard time with these small brads.


----------



## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

Nailing?
Use latex caulk... spread it thin with a putty knife. Not so thick that it oozes up around the ties.
Use T-pins or Push-Pins to hold it in curves.
Run a train on it (or roll a few coupled cars) to check for wobbles and kinks.
Weight it down with soup cans and such til it dries.


----------



## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

I start track nails with good needle nose pliers ,then tap them in. Finish up with a small nail set. Some times they'll go in wth just the pliers.


----------



## richs75 (Jan 21, 2016)

I have to go with LateStarter on this one. 

The Peco flex track I used didn't even have the little spike holes like the Atlas track I used 35 years ago. 

I just applied a little caulk, spread it out with my finger and laid the track down. Used push pins on either side of the track every foot or so to hold the track down and in line and let dry. 

I would then trim the flex track ends even with each side of the rail (if doing a curve), remove a tie or two from the end so I can insert joiners on both sections of track, insert next track and solder the joint (if needed). Solder the joint straight first. Then bend the track, lay more caulk and repeat the process with that section of track.


----------



## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

Many in the hobby have begun to use a very thin spread of acrylic latex caulk on top of the roadbed and just press the track lengths into place. I use filled soda and soup tins on their sides laid along the rails to keep them in place for about 10 hours while it cures. If I do need to spike it in place, I use and re-use track nails that Atlas sells. One bag of those is a few short bucks, and if you recover them when the caulking dries, you should have them for decades.

When we say a thin spread of the caulking, I mean about 1/3 mm or 1/64". Or, in Canada, just a skiff...as in a skiff of snow. A dusting. The idea is that you want to be able to slide a knife blade between the road bed and the bottoms of the ties and somewhat easily separate them if you decide that the alignment isn't good there.

Don't try to press those track nails into plywood or MDF. I hear they do very well in Homasote, but you'll bend almost every one the other way. Spruce or pine, not too bad.


----------



## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

I bend one occasionally, but I use plywood or pine boards. Always have.


----------



## D&J Railroad (Oct 4, 2013)

Using nails will tend to pull the rails together when the tie is bent down with the nail. Putting nails into foam isn't a good means of holding the track down. The foam just won't hold a track nail for very long. It may feel like its tight in the tie, but that's the only good holding point. The cork and foam just can't grab it very well. Put a couple track spikes directly into the cork without the track to see how little grip it has.
As far a caulk, use the kind that will stay flexible after it cures. A hard drying caulk will break loose from the foam unless you use something like Gorilla caulk. Be cautious as some caulks will eat the foam away. Petroleum base.


----------



## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

(1) I use pair of small, flat-nosed pliers (not sure of the correct name) to push my track pins in. A medium, flat-head screwdriver should work, too.

I find that the holes in Atlas track are a little too big for Atlas track nails. So the whole track section can shift a tiny amount left or right. To combat this, I drive the nails at a slight angle -- alternating the directions -- one towards the inner rail; the next towards the outer rail.

Sometimes, I lay will drill extra holes and add extra nails to keep a particular section in place.

(2) Yes, track nails hold well in homosote, which is what is I have on my layout. Not sure you can find it any more, and it has disadvantages. But it came on the used layout that I inherited.

(3) One other suggestion. The shiny heads of track nails are annoying to some. I paint them with a flat black paint, and they pretty much disappear. If you have brown ties, you would need a color that matches the ties.


----------



## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

I use DAP Dynaflex 230 as it comes in 5.5 oz tubes (besides the big caulking gun size) because a little goes a long way. I also use milled Homasote for the roadbed from Cascade Supply https://cascaderailsupply.com/. The homosote is also glued with the same caulk to the foam base.


----------



## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

I use Luan on top of 1 inch foam. Then I use cork and little brad for the cork, and very tiny PECO screws for the track.


----------



## Jimganley (May 28, 2016)

After trying the caulk to varying success and the diluted white glue I tried some 3M #77 spray adhesive and it holds immediately only problem is it will take some work to remove the track when the time comes. A bit messy due to the spray nozzle.


----------



## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

The problem with that is that you don't want it to set immediately. You need to be able to adjust the position of the track after the adhesive is down. That's why caulk works so well. But you have to use some nails or pins to hold flex track in place, then weight it while the caulk cures. Canned goods are a commonly used weight.


----------



## Jimganley (May 28, 2016)

If using an adhesive like 77 you need to be ready as you get one shot at it, I put my road bed down with the 3M 77 last night and it came out real good only did 3 feet to try it out, I have tried the school glue (white) but had a problem that it did stick but all the water did not evaporate and I used a cheap caulking and I found spots where it was still liquid (did not dry). Thought about tight bond 3 but that is a yellow although it should not matter if one is carefull when placing the track and not splash, what about using the white glue but just brush it on full strength


----------



## danhi (Jan 5, 2016)

*Thanks!!*

Appreciate all the thoughts, I ended up using a white glue and nails. looks good, hopefully it will last. Dan


----------



## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

I used white glue on my first go around with cork and flex track. Its advantage was that a little water and I could pry it all up, which I eventually did. 2nd time around I used milled Homosote and CV ties that I glued the rails to with Philobond. I used caulk to glue the Homosote down and caulk to clue the ties to the Homosote. The caulk was a lot easier to use and did not seem to transmit sound as well as the hard white glue. I see no advantage to the white glue other than recover of the track some day when you pull it up just by soaking it in water, but this works with flextrack or sectional track, not with CV ties and rail. I think I would be able to recover the rail easily but not the CV ties even if I used white glue.


----------



## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Caulk isn't that hard to remove. I just soak it with some alcohol and that softens it right up. There are even commercial caulk removers, but I don't know how they would work on foam.


----------



## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Regardless of which glue or caulk you use, apply it
very sparingly. The likelyhood that you will want to
make changes in your layout are great. With only a dab here
and there to hold the roadbed and tracks down it would
be a simple matter to take them up. Use stick pins to
hold the tracks until the adhesive sets.

Don


----------



## riogrande (Apr 28, 2012)

I use Atlas track nails to nail cork and track down to either Homasote or OSB wafterboard. I really like this old school method because my cork or track is secured instantly, no waiting for glue to dry. Also, it's easy to pull the nails out with needle nose if revision is necessary - which for me I have had to remove and relay track a number of times. I do not plan on using any adhesives until it's time to ballast.

Oh, and yes, I bend a few nails when nailing into plywood but I still prefer this method by a long shot. I also make sure I nail track down so that the ties are not bend or distorted - and stop nailing so there is a slight gap between the tie and the nail head.


----------



## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Spray adhesive on foam?*



Jimganley said:


> After trying the caulk to varying success and the diluted white glue I tried some 3M #77 spray adhesive and it holds immediately only problem is it will take some work to remove the track when the time comes. A bit messy due to the spray nozzle.


 I think 3M spray77 has a strong chemical (possibly M.E.K.) base. If that's true, I would think it would eat the foam, unless you painted the foam with latex house paint first. By the way, full strength latex house paint itself is a good track adhesive. Rather than track nails on foam, what about using common, straight, sewing pins? Foam still won't hold them like wood, or even Homosote, would hold track nails; but the pins would go deep into the foam. This would certainly hold track in place long enough for a slow setting adhesive to cure.

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


----------



## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Dikes for removing track nails*



riogrande said:


> I use Atlas track nails to nail cork and track down to either Homasote or OSB wafterboard. I really like this old school method because my cork or track is secured instantly, no waiting for glue to dry. Also, it's easy to pull the nails out with needle nose if revision is necessary - which for me I have had to remove and relay track a number of times. I do not plan on using any adhesives until it's time to ballast.
> 
> Oh, and yes, I bend a few nails when nailing into plywood but I still prefer this method by a long shot. I also make sure I nail track down so that the ties are not bend or distorted - and stop nailing so there is a slight gap between the tie and the nail head.


riogrande;

Next time you need to pull out some track nails, you might want to use "dikes" (Diagonal Cutting Pliers) instead of needle nose. I've had success reaching in from the side, with the dikes resting on top of a rail and their tapered, pointed, jaws slipping under the nail head to grasp the top of the nail shank. A simple downward push on the handles, using the rail as a fulcrum, pulls the nail out easily.
To each his own. If you prefer needle nose pliers, that's fine. Just thought you might want to try it. By the way, I've used a pair of bent nosed needle pliers with a 'T'-shaped notch in the inside surface of each jaw, to insert track nails. The head, and upper shank fit in the 'T' notches. With the pliers held closed you can push the nail in without bending it.

regards;

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


----------



## riogrande (Apr 28, 2012)

I don't have any dikes with a fine enough edge to do what you are describing. My Xuron's track cutters would work but I don't use them on anything metal except rail. The needle nose have generally been fine.

I have a small head nail set that works well for driving track nails in. I can push the nails into Homasote by and and if it's plywood, then hammer the nail set.


----------



## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

I spent a few summers helping an electrician and learned a lot about tools and using "dikes" to pull nails was a great tip. That was the one tool that I sent a lot of money on, it was a very universal tool. Being in Ohio naturally the another tip was using the "Kentucky" saw to cut holes in drywall -- ie a hammer! Between the Plumbers and Electricians it was amazing that the house still stood! But the king of the tips was using dikes to pull nails, much better than a claw hammer or the old wrecking bar nail puller since they do not rely on the strength of the nail head!


----------

