# "It takes a village (of morons)



## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

Model railroad related products I can't buy here.


1) Extruded foam insulation board.

While model railroaders like it as a layout base, and scenery material, its original purpose is home insulation. Apparently the manufacturers, in their infinite wisdom, have decided that a state where temperatures range from120f (desert) to -40f (Sierra mountains) dosen't need home insulation. Therefore the local Home Depot, Lowes. etc stores don't stock it and won't order less than a truckload.

2) Moldable lead. 

Very useful for adding much needed weight to the bottom of cars. Calif. stores, which used to stock it, can't do so anymore. The state has decided for us that it is bad. This may relate to some moron eating it, like those Tide Pod swallowing weirdos on the internet.

3) MEK (Methyl Ethyl Keytone)

The best styrene cement ever. California has effectively, banned it. Someone might not use it right, so let's not let anyone have any.



Welcome to California, the nanny state. Great weather, lousy over regulation. 

Traction Fan


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

So move to Montana.....:laugh:


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

traction fan said:


> Model railroad related products I can't buy here.
> 
> 
> 1) Extruded foam insulation board.
> ...


You can buy strips of lead in various sizes from Mcmaster-Carr. These folks have about anything you might need (sans foamboard insulation, but you never know). I ordered a lot of hard to find hardware and fasteners from this company when my Boeing 727 simulator was under construction.

Fast shipping too.

https://www.mcmaster.com/


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*3 years*



Old_Hobo said:


> So move to Montana.....:laugh:


 I have to wait three years for my wife to retire. Then it won't be Montana but Oregon where the kids & grand kid are. I'll miss the sunshine but not the politics.

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Great company*



MichaelE said:


> You can buy strips of lead in various sizes from Mcmaster-Carr. These folks have about anything you might need (sans foamboard insulation, but you never know). I ordered a lot of hard to find hardware and fasteners from this company when my Boeing 727 simulator was under construction.
> 
> Fast shipping too.
> 
> https://www.mcmaster.com/


Thanks MichaelE. Yes I have used McMaster-Carr. They are excellent.

regards;

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


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## zerodameaon (Mar 10, 2018)

traction fan said:


> I have to wait three years for my wife to retire. Then it won't be Montana but Oregon where the kids & grand kid are. I'll miss the sunshine but not the politics.
> 
> Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


Oregon is hard charging to catch up to us in California. 

As for foam board, check some local hardware stores/lumber yards to your east. It can get cold up by Julian. I live in the Bay Area and we have the same issue but I live in the mountains to the west. Our local hardware store has Thermosheath foam, its not the same as the pink stuff but it is more chemically stable so spray paint does not eat it.


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## BNSF Fan (Feb 27, 2010)

You can get these at HD. Project Panels
FOAMULAR 1 in. x 2 ft. x 2 ft. R-5 Insulation Sheathing

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Project...st:{foamular}:st++cn:{null}++foamular+{brand}


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## Lee Willis (Jan 1, 2014)

Oh man! Oregon. Uhh, you might want to check out the Home Depot and stores there before deciding things will be much better there.

I have a buddy since childhood who just moved to Oregon. He says the weather/air/view is wonderful at times but, "I didn't know it was possible for it to rain, at least a little bit, every single day!


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## Againtrains (Mar 6, 2016)

*Rain*

I would prefer Oregon weather to Michigan weather. At least in Oregon when it rains, it does it and then it's done. Michigan well now that's another story, it can drizzle and rain for days it seems like. Only in Michigan can you wait 5 minutes and weather might change good/bad/or other wise.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

I have news for you about your Oregon weather! If you think that it's going to be less dreary than Michigan, I suggest you recalibrate your thinking! My mother and brother lived in St. Helens, OR, just north of Portland, and I was out there many times over the past 30 years. The western half of Oregon and Washington are in seemingly continuous drizzle from about October to May every year!


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## Againtrains (Mar 6, 2016)

*Oregon/Michigan*

Being that I was a transplanted Yooper( Born in Michigan UP) and grew up part of my life in Salem Oregon. My grand parents had a dairy farm outside of Coos Bay Oregon. I would still take Oregon weather over Michigan. Living between the great lakes causes many weather problems. I have lived in Vermont(great maple syrup) New Hampshire, Upper New York state and now Michigan. I still think the weather in Oregon is better, but that's just me!!


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

I used to vacation in the UP with my then wife at her father's summer home. Just north of Houghton on a side road before the airport entrance. Near Boston Lake, opposite side of the road though.

I loved it up there in the summer. Never spent a winter up there, but have been there when it snowed, and snowed, and snowed.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Big box stores are set up to cater to a mass market.

A smaller lumber yard is much more likely to have insulation board, or order you a reasonable quantity.

As for MEK, you've got to judge your own level of risk. The stuff is really nasty. For me, I think there are perfectly acceptable options for styrene cement which are much less toxic, and I wouldn't use MEK without rubber gloves and a respirator. But as with the lead, see if you can find an online supplier who can ship it to you.


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## Bwells (Mar 30, 2014)

traction fan said:


> I have to wait three years for my wife to retire. Then it won't be Montana but Oregon where the kids & grand kid are. I'll miss the sunshine but not the politics.
> 
> Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


You may want to shorten that time period.

BORDER WALL TO BE LONGER THAN ORIGINALLY PLANNED!


PRESIDENT TRUMP ANNOUNCES SALE OF CALIFORNIA TO MEXICO 
WASHINGTON (AP) – January 2018

President Trump disclosed that he has reached an agreement with Enrique Pena Nieto, President of Mexico, which provides for the sale of substantially all of the State of California to the country of Mexico.

President Trump noted that this deal, which he claims “is his largest real estate deal ever” is a win-win for everyone involved. One of the benefits he says he will highlight during a prime time address from the oval office later will include using the proceeds received by the US from Mexico to: 
1) pay for the Wall (fulfilling yet another campaign promise), a wall which will now include the length of the eastern border of California, 
2) fund all the infrastructure spending in the remaining 49 states and 
3) pay to relocate the 67 Republicans that currently reside in California.

He also noted that Federal money saved from the reduction of California citizens on US social programs will allow those social programs to be cash positive in less than 3 years.

Mexican President Nieto announced that he has already introduced a bill to the Mexican Congress asking to change his country’s name to MexiCal.

Other benefits President Trump intends to discuss during a prime time address will include:
California will now be able to act as a sanctuary state within MexiCal noting that there is much more room for the refugees who will find the climate in the State of California more desirable than the climate in US cities such as NYC, Detroit or Chicago.
The elimination of the existing border between Mexico and California will allow drugs to flow more freely between Mexico and the users in Hollywood. Drug tunnel diggers at the Tijuana border will now be able to use their skills to dig tunnels under Los Angeles to help ease congestion in that city and allow rioters to move about the city’s universities more freely.

The U.S. taxpayer will no longer be on the hook for any future disaster relief required once the next megaquake hits California. The space in the Capitol and other DC buildings vacated by representatives of California will be fumigated and turned into “time-out rooms” for the press as well as Liberty Centers where US citizens can meet with their congressmen to discuss the pursuit of economic freedom.

Nancy Pelosi released a statement stating that she looks forward to making the Mexican President’s life miserable and prefers the year round weather in Mexico City to that of DC. Her office has already announced a schedule of fund raising activities for what is believed to be an upcoming campaign to run for President of MexiCal. Papers released along with Trump’s statement reveal that a newly incorporated real estate company, pmurT, Inc., which was intimately involved in the deal discussions, will receive a broker fee of $25 billion on the California sale. 
An anonymous pmurT, Inc. representative has revealed that the profits on the deal are HUGE and will be used to purchase, develop and convert all abandoned US Federal facilities in California into special high end retreats and resorts which will assist California residents with managing their euphoria and transition into the nanny state they have so long desired to be. The exact northern border of the new MexiCal is still under negotiation.

Apparently the White House is concerned that certain members of congress may be unwilling to give up California’s wine country and are suggesting that the northern border align with the north end of the Golden Gate Bridge. California residents will be issued special blue cards to cross the border into the US so that the total number of California liberals entering the US can be tracked and at any point in time not exceed predetermined levels. Residents that remain in California after the effective date of the sale will not be allowed to seek refugee status in the US in the future.

Mexican President Nieto stated he is thrilled with the deal and is looking forward to declaring Spanish the national language for his newly acquired territory and opening SSL (Spanish as a second language) schools throughout California. He also noted that funding for the transaction would come from the Mexican drug cartels, which have agreed to provide low interest loans to Mexico so long as they are allowed to move their cash out of Switzerland and the Cayman Islands back into Mexico tax free. 

White House representatives refused to confirm rumors that a similar deal may be in the works for the sale of Northeastern states from NY through Maine, to Canada.
President Trump wrapped up his statement stating, “this deal is HUGE and will help Make America, albeit a little smaller, Great Again”


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

And everybody knows it......:laugh:


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## Vincent (Jan 28, 2018)

Bwells, part of the problem is that your post makes sense.

But what makes you think that Mexico will be stupid enough to pay for California?


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

Ah yes, California, the state that attempted to ban the sale of all computer hard drives in the 90's because some politician's secretary was offended by the jumper settings to mark each drive as either a 'master' or 'slave' on a cable that supported two devices. Never mind that the words are technical terms explicitly defining the actual functionality of the devices, some people are just going out of their way to be offended by common everyday items.

And for those who are interested... the State actually tried to enact a law requiring all manufacturers to relabel their devices in a more politically correct manner and very briefly stopped the shipment of all new hard drives into the state (if I recall correctly). Unfortunately for them the home computer market was already in full swing so the demand for new drives was huge, and almost all the drives were being built in other countries who didn't care about the loss of sales from one small area, so California's sputtering about the issue was completely ignored.


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## Vincent (Jan 28, 2018)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> The western half of Oregon and Washington are in seemingly continuous drizzle from about October to May every year!


Good Heavens, Man, that's our rainy season here in Mexico! However, it only rains in the morning and night (usually, anyway).


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## Fire21 (Mar 9, 2014)

Shdwdrgn said:


> so California's sputtering about the issue was completely ignored.


And where is Silicon Valley located?...California! Aren't they glad no further restrictions were placed on them!!

Sometimes it's best to just leave well-enough alone. 

:hah:California


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## SDIV Tim (Nov 19, 2015)

That’s why when you go to Nevada, Arizona and Oregon you buy stuff that you cant buy here and bring them back


Timothy Lewis
Writer, Social Media Director And Human Resources Director at Railroading In America Magazine
Vice President of Lewis Locomotive Works


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## kjhealy (Apr 13, 2018)

*I love Montana*

MEK, insulation board, all the lead you can eat, firearms and ammo all under one roof. :appl:


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## Bwells (Mar 30, 2014)

And where might that be?


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## RonthePirate (Sep 9, 2015)

Want insul board?
Want MEK?
Want no rain for weeks?
Come to Arizona. We have road runners that work as messengers.
Rattlesnakes that act as vigilantes, weeding out the meth dealers.
Humidity of 2%, feels nice outside.

And believe it or not, we're finally going to help out our teachers.
The Governor is signing a bill to get them a 20% increase in four years.
Which is phenomenal.
They're about the lowest paid in the nation, this is big news to them.


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## jackpresley (Dec 19, 2017)

RonthePirate said:


> And believe it or not, we're finally going to help out our teachers.
> The Governor is signing a bill to get them a 20% increase in four years.
> Which is phenomenal.
> They're about the lowest paid in the nation, this is big news to them.


:appl:


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## Vincent (Jan 28, 2018)

And it's DRY heat!


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Suggestions for cement replacements*



CTValleyRR said:


> Big box stores are set up to cater to a mass market.
> 
> A smaller lumber yard is much more likely to have insulation board, or order you a reasonable quantity.
> 
> As for MEK, you've got to judge your own level of risk. The stuff is really nasty. For me, I think there are perfectly acceptable options for styrene cement which are much less toxic, and I wouldn't use MEK without rubber gloves and a respirator. But as with the lead, see if you can find an online supplier who can ship it to you.


CTValley;

What would you recommend as a cheaper alternative to styrene cement? The last bottle I bought was $7 for one ounce! Testors must think they're in the perfume business. 

Thanks;

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

traction fan said:


> CTValley;
> 
> What would you recommend as a cheaper alternative to styrene cement? The last bottle I bought was $7 for one ounce! Testors must think they're in the perfume business.
> 
> ...


I don't. I recommend styrene cement. The one oz square container with the needle applicator. My one tube of the stuff has lasted me for 12 years and some 50 structures.

Or you could buy "Samestuff" from MicroMark -- 4 oz for $17 + S&H, but for me, I would take forever to use all that.

This is another case where I find of the urge to minimize costs results in a penny wise, dollar foolish decision. The perceived high price of the hobby product skews the decision-making. The effort necessary to find such a solution easily outweighs the cost savings. And you can't really monetize the health risks of MEK.

Obviously, everyone's value system is different, but I have found that focusing only on the bottom line (cost) suboptimizes decisions.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

The best liquid styrene weld I've ever used is made by Tamiya. About $4 a bottle and it lasts forever. Capillary action too. It gets into the joints.


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