# Locomotive ? about numbering scheme



## Kieta (Nov 6, 2018)

I'm new to model trains and have just started my first layout. I'm trying to read up on as much as possible. But I can't seem to differentiate the model numbers for locomotives. 

For instance the Athearn HO 88525 #250, HO 88526 #251 and HO 88527 #252. From the description they all appear to be identical locotives, so what do the numbering scheme represent? Thank you


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Locomotive numbers*



Kieta said:


> I'm new to model trains and have just started my first layout. I'm trying to read up on as much asssible. But I can't seem to differentiate the model numbers for locomotives.
> 
> For instance the Athearn HO 88525 #250, HO 88526 #251 and HO 88527 #252. From the description they all appear to be identical locotives, so what do the numbering scheme represent? Thank you


Kieta;

Real railroads number their locomotives basically to help keep track of them. A large railroad company may well own hundreds of individual locomotives. Unlike automobiles, locomotives don't carry license plates. The number on the side of a locomotive may be used to report it's location and status. A train has a number too, and sometimes the number of the locomotive is used in numbering the train. For example "Train 4755 westbound has just passed Arden junction." The train number may be the number on the locomotive pulling it.

This is a very simplified, and perhaps not very accurate, version of how real railroad's locomotive numbers are determined, and used. Real railroad's numbering systems can be a lot more complex. A given type of locomotive, or a given lot of locomotives purchased by a railroad, may have numbers as well. I think Union Pacific may have called one type of steam locomotives "Four Thousands" and they may have been numbered 4001, 4002, 4003, etc.
I suspect the Athern locomotives you mentioned have their Athern stock number as the first part 88525, 88526, etc. The second part may be the actual number on the side of the model locomotive. One marked 250, another 251 etc. 
Model locomotives tend to use the same mechanism under different body shells, as a way of keeping costs down. The railroad name, and the number may change, while underneath, it's the same model.

Modelers pick their locomotives in various ways, depending on the individual modeler's experience and desire for accuracy. New folks tend to buy whatever looks good to them.
Very experienced model railroaders may buy only models of the locomotives used by their favorite prototype railroad, and/or in their chosen time period. For example I model the Milwaukee Road near Seattle, Washington; in the 1920s and the 1950s. So my locomotives are models of what that railroad used in that time and place. I don't use wood burning 4-4-0 American steam locos from the wild west era, or Amtrak Accella modern locomotives.

hope that helps;

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:

P.S. The files below may help you too. I wrote them especially for new modelers like you.

View attachment Where do I start (revised version).pdf


View attachment Model Railroad Terminology 2.2.pdf


View attachment How to better model railroad the first time. Part 1.pdf


View attachment How to build a better model railroad the first time Part 2.pdf


View attachment How to build a better model railroad Parts 3 & 4 benchwork and more track planning.pdf


View attachment How to build a better Model Railroad part 5.pdf


View attachment How to build a better model railroad the first time 6.pdf


View attachment All AboutTurnouts.pdf


View attachment MODEL RAILROADING ON A BUDGET.pdf


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## PoppetFlatsRR (Jul 29, 2018)

I only wish I had found this site when I first started, so much information and people that will answer your questions. I am going to read all of the listed information, to see if I can correct all of my mistakes. lol

Also, if you are running DCC equipment, you can set your engines up in consists of as many as you want, but the first one and the last one have to be recognized. It is easier to keep track of your consist by the number on the lead engine, at least for me. Say 600 SP is working in the logging area, and 601 is working in the refinery area. They can run on the same track in different directions. Makes it easier to identify which one is which basically. If you watch the real guys running, you will notice the same engine/loco in appearance but all have different numbers. Great question, have fun!


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Kieta said:


> I'm new to model trains and have just started my first layout. I'm trying to read up on as much as possible. But I can't seem to differentiate the model numbers for locomotives.
> 
> For instance the Athearn HO 88525 #250, HO 88526 #251 and HO 88527 #252. From the description they all appear to be identical locotives, so what do the numbering scheme represent? Thank you


Traction fan gave you a great summary of the use of numbers. Hobby manufacturers use numbers too: in the case above, the 885xx is the manufacturer's catalog number, the #xxx is the locomotive number that is painted on the model. Otherwise, they are identical. The manufacturer's catalog number doesn't mean anything to the hobbyist, except to make sure you're getting exactly what you want.


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## J.Albert1949 (Feb 3, 2018)

Back in "the old days", model train manufacturers would usually put out an engine (painted for whatever railroad) _with only ONE number on it._ If you wanted more than one of that particular engine, you had to buy them all with the same road number and then re-number them yourself.

Today when [most] manufacturers bring out new products, they offer more than one engine number for a given road. Thus, you'll see the engine numbers 250, 251, 252. Now you have a choice. Sometimes the details will vary on each number, as well.

The manufacturers assign their own "production numbers/stock numbers" to their models. That's where the "88525", "88526" and "88527" numbers come from.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

PoppetFlatsRR said:


> I only wish I had found this site when I first started, so much information and people that will answer your questions. I am going to read all of the listed information, to see if I can correct all of my mistakes. lol
> 
> PoppetFlatsRR;
> 
> ...


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## PoppetFlatsRR (Jul 29, 2018)

Unfortunately I just jumped in and started building. No real track plan nor an idea of how to use the system when I did hear about it.

The bad thing about it, is spent several months going to train club meetings, thinking I would learn how to do a lot of stuff. Never a class or shop discussing anything going forward, just a bunch of angry old geezers arguing about who did or didn't go to a meeting. I still pay the dues and everything, but never attend a meeting anymore. Too much time wasted.

The really good thing about joining the club was I met the owner of Dynamic Hobbies in Hemet, California. A great guy, who has a large O scale layout in the center of his store. He has helped me tremendously and has helped me correct some of my errors, I think. We have become good friends, and it gives me the opportunity to see the trains I want, and have a person to help with warranty and the like..

I am too far along on my layout to make major changes, but am trying to correct what I can. It will never be a functioning railroad, other than just going around the track. Too many errors in switch location, and in honesty, not a big deal. I am more into the scenery part of the hobby, and what I have done, makes me happy to watch it. 

I am building a new area that will be closer to spec in the next few months. Maybe once I get that going I will need to start over. Some of the original layout will come out. Too many curves and no straights does not work on some of my trains, but have several that navigate it fine. Others not so much. But I have fun, and so far nothing has hit the floor and busted into a million pieces. A positive for me. 

I will take heed on the articles and see how far I am beyond help.!!!!


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

PoppetFlatsRR said:


> Unfortunately I just jumped in and started building. No real track plan nor an idea of how to use the system when I did hear about it.
> 
> The bad thing about it, is spent several months going to train club meetings, thinking I would learn how to do a lot of stuff. Never a class or shop discussing anything going forward, just a bunch of angry old geezers arguing about who did or didn't go to a meeting. I still pay the dues and everything, but never attend a meeting anymore. Too much time wasted.
> 
> ...


Most clubs aren't going to offer a lot in the way of format training -- it's a learn by doing thing. If you want training, your best bet is to find a good sized train show and sign up for some of the clinics that are offered.

However, while some clubs are a bunch of crotchety complainers , many of them are great places to go, and lots of their members are more than willing to help newbies get started.

Just remember that you're never too far in to start over. I'm on my 3rd total or partial rebuild since i got back into the hobby 18 years ago. It's no shame to decide something just isn't working and start over. Most of us have done it,


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## Kieta (Nov 6, 2018)

traction fan said:


> Kieta;
> 
> Real railroads number their locomotives basically to help keep track of them. A large railroad company may well own hundreds of individual locomotives. Unlike automobiles, locomotives don't carry license plates. The number on the side of a locomotive may be used to report it's location and status. A train has a number too, and sometimes the number of the locomotive is used in numbering the train. For example "Train 4755 westbound has just passed Arden junction." The train number may be the number on the locomotive pulling it.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much, that makes so much sense now. And thanks for the links. So much reading to do.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Don't sweat it at all*



PoppetFlatsRR said:


> Unfortunately I just jumped in and started building. No real track plan nor an idea of how to use the system when I did hear about it.
> 
> The bad thing about it, is spent several months going to train club meetings, thinking I would learn how to do a lot of stuff. Never a class or shop discussing anything going forward, just a bunch of angry old geezers arguing about who did or didn't go to a meeting. I still pay the dues and everything, but never attend a meeting anymore. Too much time wasted.
> 
> ...


PoppetFlatsRR;

There is no really "right", or "wrong" way to build a model railroad. Any way you start, you learn something. It sounds like you found the wrong kind of club. I've been in two clubs through the years. The first one was somewhat like the one you describe, more arguing than building.
Fortunately my second club was a lot better. I thoroughly enjoyed 11 years of membership, only leaving the club when I moved to another city. At least you found a friend, and mentor, through your club membership. If you never plan on attending meetings again; you might want to save those club dues for buying trains!  
As CTValley says, most clubs don't do a lot of formal instruction. There are many other ways to learn though. One you have found already, your friend and his shop. Another is a good "How to book." I recommend "Getting started in Model Railroading" by Jeff Wilson. Your buddy can order it for you, or you can order it yourself from, https://kalmbachhobbystore.com/products/books .
As for the files I sent, they basically suggest one way of building a railroad (a shelf layout) but I tried to emphasize, as I wrote them, that there were plenty of other ways, and none were "right", or "wrong" just different, and which kind to build was strictly an individual choice.

If some of your trains are having problems on curves, it may be that the curve radius is too tight for longer cars and locomotives. That's a common problem. Or the wheels or track may be "out of gage." The wheels and the distance between the rails should be measured with an NMRA (National Model Railroad Association) standards gage. This is a very handy tool for any model railroad. They are available in all the popular modeling scales from your friends hobby shop, or www.walthers.com The file below shows the NMRA gage being used to check all the many variables on a turnout. By the way, consider those files as reference material. Read a little bit as you wish. There is no need to treat them as a novel, and read from beginning to end! :laugh:

As long as you're having fun with your scenery, or your layout in general, that's all that really matters.

have fun;

Traction Fan:smilie_daumenpos:

View attachment Improving Atlas turnouts.pdf


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