# layout help. Please help....



## ripit (Nov 28, 2009)

I'm doing this for my kids (3 & 5),and after finding out I couldn't make them a track, I'm lost. 
I recently moved from Irving TX (just outside Dallas, where I could get anything within a few miles, to niagara falls NY, where I have learned , I have to travel 1.5 HR's + to find anything). My first shock, Niagara falls used to have a camera store... Its just been horror since then. I just took a 3 hour road trip with the kids to get them track (they have never had a working train except for 1 day).

I screwed up. so i have 2 complete circles and 2 straight tracks (reralers). I also have a 3 foot flexible track. Is there anything I can do with this to get a second level? I guess I need a switch for that? can I do anything besides a simple circle?

I spent money I didn't have,and made the kids agree to no toys, treats,special things for a while for the train, and to make things worse, my wife brought the kids in the store (while i was busy looking at the track), so they saw the the BIG train track, and they are expecting something special. 

Can I do anything with the parts I have? If not,what do I need minimum (I guess another road trip and I'm guessing a switch which was very expensive at the shop I went to (I'm not sure they were high, i remember looking online way back and they were expensive, right)?


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ripit,

Welcome to the forum. And first and foremost ... brace yourself ... you're in for a COLD winter in Niagara Falls ... no Texas warmth up there!

All kids love trains, and you're doing a big thumbs-up thing by getting your team into them. Be careful, though, about not investing too much $ into fancy stuff, as young kids' hands have a way of poking and prodding a bit not so gingerly at times.

You need to let us know what scale you plan on running. HO? O (like Lionel)?

Given the kid-thing, and some budget-minded thinking on your part, an excellent source for stuff (extra track, switches, etc.) is eBay ... a world of stuff, without having to drive out into those nasty Niagara winters! Lots of very good quality used stuff available, much of it at a fraction of the cost of new stuff.

We can help steer you into a better direction, but give us an idea as to your train scale, what size and foundation (table, etc.) you'll be using to set up your layout, the type of locomotive and number of cars you'll be pulling, type of transformer you have, etc.

Enjoy the ride ... Keep the shovel handy ...

TJ

Edit ... Ahh ... just saw that you posted this in the HO section ... So, HO, I guess. Lots of options/stuff available for you ... costwise, quasi kid-proof, etc.


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## ripit (Nov 28, 2009)

I was thinking I should have mentioned it was ho. I decided against real trains last Christmas and got them this set. 
http://www.amazon.com/Toystate-2558...ef=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1259425704&sr=8-2-fkmr1

somewhere along the way since then, i got a ho trainset off someone at work. It was similar to this one
http://www.amazon.com/Life-Like-Trains-Scale-Santa-Electric/dp/B000TFTPH0
The engine is identical, and it has a model rl-1250 transformer (I know, cheap but it was a start). 

for the board, I have the first train mentioned, mounted to a 4'x8' board with a thomas the train plastic track in the middle. Unfortunately, its eucalyptus board (very strong and thin but wont take a nail). The other tracks are bolted (with tiny size 4 bolts) to the board. I'm in over my head and need to build on this board (money and no help from the wife). A circle or a circle with two straight pieces fits nicely between the two other tracks. I probably have bolts but I cannot find them right now. I have6 3' pieces of cork.
It's 4 in the morning and they are going to wake up wanting at least something after the long rode trip to get track, and then being forced to go to bed immediate by mom.... I'm hosed...


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

With kids it doesn't take much. A circle will do. Use a glue sparingly just to hold the track together. That way it can be changed later. Even elastics work for this. A circle and engins and a gondola t put stuff in will do. DOn't rush it it is not worth it. One step at a time. Just have it run. Check craigslist, completed tables sometimes come up for sale. Although it will cost it will save you time in building. Relax and enjoy.


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## ontario mainline (Dec 6, 2008)

ripit, welcome to New York, LoL. what store did you to for your train stuff ? 
you get a chance. take a drive,to this place.
ridgeroadstation.com

Ron


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ripit,

T-Man's advice is spot on ... don't rush ... relax, have fun in the process of building a layout, and don't set any critical timetable ... it'll all happen at its own pace.

I'm not sure what you meant by "eucalyptus board" ... some sort of thin plywood? 1/4" ??? On my end, I've found that a sheet of MDF (medium density fiberboard) works quite well ... either 1/2" or 3/4" thick, depending upon table supports underneath it. It's readily available at Home Depot, Lowes, etc. for around $20 a sheet. It has a super-flat surface that is dimensionally stable and NOT prone to warping.

By "cork", I assume you mean the pre-cut (beveled edge) strips that are common with HO hobbiests ... split lengthwise down the middle, too. When split in half, these bend and contour quite easily, and can be put down with a few dabs of hot glue. Lay one half first (following your desired track contour), then lay the 2nd, tucking the mating edge in tightly.

Good luck!

TJ


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## ripit (Nov 28, 2009)

Eucalyptus board is often called hardboard. Its the same stuff a lot of pegboard is made of. its about 7$ for a 4' x 8' sheet home depot. It's maybe 3/16" actual thickness and very strong though its also quite flexible. I used 1" x 2" boards on the back to make it somewhat stiff. unfortunately, it had to be mobile (no decent place to leave it setup for now anyway) so I used it due to its lighter weight compared to something like plywood. 

The store I went to was niagara hobby and craft mart. I may check out Ridge Road Station at some point but its 1.5 Hr away so not too soon. 

The cork was the pre split stuff. I wound up starting on it but its not near completion. The kids were disappointed but they will just have to wait. I wound up with a circle elevated over an oval (circle plus 2 straight pieces on the oval). i used flexible track to make the curve to get around the other track, so its just one continuous run. I set up the track but just perched the upper circle on Styrofoam blocks to see if the layout would work. I'll have to get some wood strips from home depot for some basic bridge work. 

So do I mount the upper track to the wood or cork to the wood and track to the cork?

By the way, in a pinch, I used school glue to attach the cork (the clear stuff, its more flexible), and a lot of nails. I had to predrill for the nails to get through the hardboard. I nailed the cork, and then nailed the track al the way through the track, the cork and the hard board. i think they were about 1/2" nails about the right size to snugly fit through the predrilled holes i the track. if the layout works, I may just bend over the nails on the back of the board so they wont pull out.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ripit,

If layout-board portability (lightweight, etc.) is important, and you like working with the thin hardboard, here's something that might intrigue you ... I've never tried it myself, but I think it would work well ...

Glue 2 sheets of the hardboard to either side of a 3/4" or 1" thick foam core. The foam add minimal weight, and the two layers of hardboard (on either side of the core) work together like flanges on an I-beam to add signifcant strenght and stiffness for the overall panel light weight.

Nails through track, cork, into board is just fine ... normal way to go.

In terms of upper track / wood / cork ... it all depends upon what look you're going for. If you want a bridge / trestle look, leave the cork out. Cork is used to mimmick real-life ballast (rock) railbeds. These are not used on bridge/trestle elevated sections. However, if you're intending to build an earth burm or ridge, than ballast (cork) would be just fine.

However ... Rule #1 in model RR always applies, and always overrules any prior comments above:

It's your layout, and whatever works best for you is always a good answer. As long as you're having fun in the process!

Cheers,

TJ


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

I know it is a drive down the thruway but I highly recommend Dispatch Junction in East Rochester and Ridge Road station. Dispatch Junction Has far more HO stuff both new and used. There prices are great and the store owners are more than willing to help.


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## ontario mainline (Dec 6, 2008)

Thank for the heads up there tkruger. I thought Dispatch Junction, was only large scale, like O & S and G.

Ron


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Ripit,

First, welcome to the forum! Second, don't panic---used track can be found pretty cheaply on both Ebay and Craig's list. Also, check the hobby shops and see if they have a bulletin board. The shops that are more train-oriented and less like a box store often do.
Next, look for model railroading clubs in your area: check the internet under model railroading clubs, etc. They'll be a source of guidance and excess track you can probably buy pretty cheaply.

Last, take T-man's advice and take your time: layouts grow best with a little time and planning. Try to get the kids involved, while you wait, in deciding what should be on it and helping you make the stuff. Small cars and trucks, animals, and other accessories can be bought; shoeboxes and some cardboard can be turned into barns and houses with a little glue and paint. Paper towel cores make great silos. The more the kids help build it, the more they'll appreciate it and the time you spent with them doing it.

Best wishes!


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## tankist (Jun 11, 2009)

Elaborate and complex layout is not nessesery with kids. I used to have plain circle when I was little and still had a blast.

To attach track to your board consider gluing it with adhessive caulk.


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## igmuska (Nov 21, 2009)

Personally I like how the HO layout Heart of Georgia uses a single 4' X 8' plywood cut just so the track is optimized for the longest runs possible as well as increasing a layouts modularity and portability. You can even expand on it using another sheet of plywood, lengthening the long straights and increasing possible yard space.

In a couple of days, I am shredding my current layout with its limiting 18" radius curves and SnapTrack turnouts; I want to use flex-track and no. 6 turnouts, probably in Code 100 as I discovered Atlas code 83 track is very fragile.

But as is often said here, it is your train, run it the way that makes you feel happy.


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## ripit (Nov 28, 2009)

*I'm working on it....*

Layout didn't turn out to be such a problem as building it was. I remember the good old days as a young single adult where I had nice tools. Anyway, I got pretty far, day by day, but many of the track connectors have disappeared. When I first started, I fabricated 5 track connectors out of aluminum, but many have disappeared since (long project and the kids being around). I'm now missing 20 or more. Anyay,I got a pic. 

My kids (3 and 5) get in the way more than anything, though my 3 year old loves watching what the tools do and learning. After I get the track down, I planned on letting them build the board (decorations, tunnels, paint and whatever). I'm working with very limited power tools (for wood working anyway). i do mean VERY LIMITED.... I actually have many hand tools for wood working, but dont have a vice much less a work bench.

by the way I have ran the train and it runs most of the track. Unfortunately, i didn't think to tighten the connectors and there are plenty of bad spots. I was really worried abut the irregular climb, but the train seemed to handle it fine..


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## ripit (Nov 28, 2009)

Is there a good way to fix bad track concoctions? I really don't want to rebuild it. I can solder a few of the really bad ones, but how do I do that (without burning the hell out of the plastic ties)? maybe wire on the joint?


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ripit,

I think you'd save yourself a ton of aggravation by simply replacing all of the rail joiners, especially if the ones you have now are bent, twisted open, or even missing. New ones are rather cheap, and easily available at any hobby store or online. Here's a package of 48 joiners for $3.25 from Atlas:

https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/itemdesc.asp?ic=0170&eq=&Tp=

Also, I see that you've mapped our your HO track to rise "full height" (for an overpass) in a half-turn of the track. I'm guessing from your photo that you are using 18" radius track. If that's right, then you have to think about how steep your ramp rise "grade" is, and how that will affect the ability of the train to tow any cars up that hill. You have:

Rise = 3.5" ... a guess.
Run (track length) = one-half of 18" radius circle = 3.14 x 18 = 56"

So, the track "grade", or rise / run = 3.5 / 56 = 6.25% ... that's VERY steep, and likely limiting as to what you'll be able to pull.

Hope this helps,

TJ


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## ripit (Nov 28, 2009)

*It's kind of n hold because I need connectors.*

That actually does help. I never thought the train would make it up that climb (especially since the track is very uneven being cocked up or down a little at the joints). It is 18' radius track. I tried it with one long car. With a little speed it made it fine. stopping in the middle, it struggled and slipped a little but made it. I'm going to make the other side of the circle smother and maybe run the train in the other direction (so it only climbs on the smooth incline). Fyi, the cars are cheap plastic and have no metal base plates or metal parts so they are reasonably light. i can rebuild the other side of the ramp later, but right now, I jut want to get it running. The kids have been waiting long enough. they are 3 and 5 and just don't understand. 

Further, there is only one hobby shop in niagara falls and it has very limited hours (compared to my work schedule). I have repeatedly asked my wife to get them but it doesn't seem to be a priority to her. The old connectors are loose (Its an old used set), the new track I bought contained poor quality connectors that didn't have much tension either. I learned to squish them a little with pliers but a little to late). honestly, I'm thinking about spot welding a fine coper wire between bad track sections. It would just be to much hell to tear it all apart and rebuild it right now. a car battery with fine wire make a great micro welder.

Fyi, the height if the track is 5". I'm guessing I'm in trouble? Thankfully they watch thomas the train lot (and understand the concept of the train has to get a run at the hill). 

I'm probably going to mail order connectors as the wife keeps failing to get them and I'm not up for another road trip to buffalo right now. Anyone knw of any connectors on amazon (I have prime)?


tjcruiser said:


> Ripit,
> 
> I think you'd save yourself a ton of aggravation by simply replacing all of the rail joiners, especially if the ones you have now are bent, twisted open, or even missing. New ones are rather cheap, and easily available at any hobby store or online. Here's a package of 48 joiners for $3.25 from Atlas:
> 
> ...


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Rail joiners, cheaper than Amazon ...

http://www.ehobbies.com/atl170.html?kw=atl170&cmp=amzppc


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