# Tender Pickup



## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

Just picked up a used Mantua 4-6-2 loco with tender pickup. It runs then stops then runs and stops.....
You get the idea, I opened the tender and there were only a couple wires in there and seemed ok. I added some wieght, 4oz and that seemed to help but I am still getting intermittent running.
I am not familair at all with tender pickups, so what can I do or try to get this running smooth?

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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Clean the wheels. You might have a spot of heavy corrosion on a wheel somewhere.


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

If we knew why the behavior is taking place, we'd know what to do in order to correct it. It could be dirty wipers, bent wipers, snagged wipers, dirty wiped surfaces, broken wire harness from wiper to motor, bad solders, dirty tires, dirty rail, uneven rail, rail power not evenly distributed across rails and around the track system, voltage drop-out due to resistance or distance problems, and even a wonky motor. It could even be a piece of grit getting between two gear teeth.

You had a reasonable and time-honored guess to add more weight. That has worked in many instances. Since it was only partially successful, perhaps another factor I mentioned is also at work...well, not perhaps, almost certainly.

Get out your meter and begin to test continuity. Inside the engine, rail to wipers, rail to harness closer to the motor, rails themselves, rails under the locomotive and tender where the stall takes place...and so on. Apart from that piece of grit or metal, it has to be electrical continuity...or that bad order motor.


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## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

Track is fine with voltage and no other locos have an issue. I did notice if I tilt tender to the left where metal wheels are it runs and runs smoothly. This keeps me thinking its the tender pickup/wiring and not another issue. Also if I nudge the lower wire it will run smooth also.

On the bright side, I found out this things a smoker!











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## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

Is it set up to pick up both rails from the tender or one side on the tender and one on the engine? Besides cleaning the wheels, hows the connection between the tender and the engine?


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## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

Lemonhawk said:


> Is it set up to pick up both rails from the tender or one side on the tender and one on the engine? Besides cleaning the wheels, hows the connection between the tender and the engine?


Hell if I know...
I would guess 1 side on tender as there is metal wheels only on 1 side of tender.

Again, I would guess that connection is good because when I tilt the tender it runs flawlessly.

This maybe an issue as well I left out. My track is not secure yet and it has inclines/declines and there is slight flexing in the track as the loco runs. Other locos have no issue but they are substantially lighter.

Im about to add more wieght to see if there any difference and maybe see if I can adjust that 1 wire.

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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

*Keep at it, Mantua made some good stuff*

Try this it worked for me...
Remove tender wheel sets, pay attention as to which side gets the electrical pickup before disassemble.
Clean ALL the oil and crud out of the truck sides where the metal axle rotate.
Put it back together

If you have a air compressor, you may be able to clean without dissassembly.

Also, I believe the metal truck pivots on the metal frame, clean that spot up also.

Is the connecting wire in good shape, not loose?
p.s It is Mantua NJ near where I live. I remember going to the 'factory' when they were shutting down to buy trans.


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## J.C. (Dec 24, 2016)

/


Trentonmakes said:


> I did notice if I tilt tender to the left where metal wheels are it runs and runs smoothly. This keeps me thinking its the tender pickup/wiring and not another issue. Also if I nudge the lower wire it will run smooth also.
> 
> 
> Sent from my LG-K550 using Tapatalk


so the problem lies within the wire you can move , might be broken in insulation of a bad solder joint on either end or if wire connects directly to motor brush the brush might be worn or spring is weak but this is grasping at straws .


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## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

Cleaned all I could and added another 4 ounces to tender. Same result.

Found out the screw holding that wire is stripped or the hole is stripped and doesnt hold tight. 

I did manage to get it snug and was able to make several passes along the layout but dod not seem to be running at full power even though I was at full throttle.

I'll have to figure out what to do with that screw or change it out to one i can rethread the hole with.


Thank you for all the helpful responses


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

*your hole is screwed?*

I believe that hole has a bottom, too long of a screw hits bottom before the wire lug gets tight. Some previous owner must have kept turning and stripped the hole. drill and tap on the other side of the frame.


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

..or that motor is.


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## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

mesenteria said:


> ..or that motor is.


What makes you think its the motor?

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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

Its intermittent and/or failing rotation. Maybe it gets warm and then shorts, or it gets stickier. Worn brushes, weak magnets...I'm just guessing.


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

You should pull it apart clean re-oil the drive axles. I bet there is hardened grease in there. A drop f oil on motor bearings too. I've never had a weak magnet on Mantua or Varfney open frame motors. Has anyone else found this?


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

I agree with where most of the advice is heading. Clean and lubricate everything. Don't decide it's clean; actually clean it. Brand new stuff right from the factory often has unbelievable amounts of crud on it (and in it).


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## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

CTValleyRR said:


> I agree with where most of the advice is heading. Clean and lubricate everything. Don't decide it's clean; actually clean it. Brand new stuff right from the factory often has unbelievable amounts of crud on it (and in it).


Thats the plan this weekend...thanks again guys!

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## Trentonmakes (Mar 5, 2018)

WHOOOOOOAAAAAA

Tore into the loco a bit and cleaned things up with isopropyl alcohol. There was lots of dried grease and wet oil on wheel bearings and shaft. Went thrpugh about a dozen qtips cleaning it out.
Hopefully this does the trick!

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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

I think a little naptha (lighter fluid) would go a lot longer in cleaning up old and dried up oil and grease than alcohol will.


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

...or paint thinner, lacquer thinner, acetone, varsol, turpentine.........Goof Off (spendy), probably even WD-40.

Of course, paper towels or painting sheet strips are cheap and will save all those fumes if you can get most of it off that way first.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Agreed. Goof-Off is nothing more that naptha though. I used to sell it, among other auto supply needs and parts.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

mesenteria said:


> ...or paint thinner, lacquer thinner, acetone, varsol, turpentine.........Goof Off (spendy), probably even WD-40.
> 
> Of course, paper towels or painting sheet strips are cheap and will save all those fumes if you can get most of it off that way first.


I have seen WD-40 damage painted plastic, so use that with care. Personally, I have never used or needed anything stronger than denatured alcohol.


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

goof-off melted my plastic loco cab


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

I keep naphtha and Isopropyl alcohol around for solvents, one or the other is usually effective. The alcohol is more likely to damage paint I've found, so care should be exercised in it's use.


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