# Noisy locomotives



## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

Recently built a new train platform in my garage. 4x8 using Altas HO-6 layout. Using a Bachmann EZ Command controller. Works well. Purchased a Bachmann GP38-2 with DCC & sound. Also a Bachmann GP38-2 DCC only. Both run very well. Also ran well as a consist. The Dcc only was noisy (vibration,rattling), very annoying. The other is as quiet as a mouse. Don't care for the engine sound though-tinny. I sent the DCC only back to modeltrainstuff and they sent a new one. Same general sound (maybe slightly less) but ran well. Then I tried to set up a consist like I did with the old one. The new loco was spinning its wheels but the "quiet one" just sat there. Sent the "new one" back and received a refund. 
The folks at Klein are very customer oriented, makes you want to do more more business with them, which I did. Ordered a BLI RSD15 the other day. Will order a NCE Power cab soon.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

When you get your NCE power cab you'll have the
capability of tweaking the loco decoders to make them
run smoother and work better as a consist. Something
the Bachmann EZ does not do.

Don


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

*New controller*

Thanks for the reply. Being brand new to DCC, I did not know that the EZCommand did not do this. Instead of spending $115 for EZ, I could have bought NCE Power cab For approx $155, saving myself $$$$. Live and learn I guess. 
Also I tried recently to run in DC mode-no luck. It did this originally. My loco will run DC on my old power pack. So I guess that function is gone. Am curious to see how the new BLI will run in consist mode. May have to play with the speed settings. It should be fun (I hope).


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

The great thing about the NCE is its very easy to use and the instructions are written clearly. Setting up a new loco on the system is a walk through with simple yes/no questions. Extra lighting functions are available when using NCE decoder too, but they don't take a lot of handling- the wires can pull out of the board.


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Cycleops said:


> The great thing about the NCE is its very easy to use and the instructions are written clearly. Setting up a new loco on the system is a walk through with simple yes/no questions. Extra lighting functions are available when using NCE decoder too, but they don't take a lot of handling- the wires can pull out of the board.


The NCE products are well designed and easy to use as said before. As said before the decoders with the wires soldered to the decoder directly do have an issue with the wires breaking, the wire is very thin. Some of the decoders are also offered with a 9 pin socket attached to the board and a harness to attach to the locomotive. I prefer these as there is no worry about the wires breaking, the harness allows for the decoder to be easily swapped, the decoder can be plugged into DCC Ready locomotives etc.


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## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

Generatorman, you mentioned it not running in DC mode. Were you trying to use the DCC system to run a DC locomotive? While some DCC systems have a mode that says it will run a DC locomotive (ones not equipped with a decoder) its generally not a good idea as its does put a strain on the electric motor. Its best to only run DCC equipped locomotives on a DCC system. Some decoders do allow you to use DCC equipped locomotives on a DC only system, that's OK. Also DCC equipped locomotives can be set to not run on DC only via a setting (CV) programmed into the decoder.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

It's touch and go trying to run a DC loco on an AC
DCC track. It is very easy to burn out the motor. Keep
in mind the motor tries to revolve one way then the
other as the current alternates. Being unable to 
do that, it quickly overheats and that's it. You should
never allow a DC loco to sit idle on a powered DCC track.

You can use a Double Pole, Double throw (DPDT)
switch and be able to power your tracks with EITHER
DCC or DC.

Many times annoying noise from a loco is the shell
vibrating against the frame. You can take the shell
off and see if the noise goes away. Sometimes a shim
can tame it.

Don


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

Rec'd my new BLI RSD 15 today (3 axle trucks). Looks great-neat sounds. But, derails on some switches. Also derailed on rerailer. Also changes loco 3 to 1 on my EZ Command controller. Sometimes lights flash- as in short. Have to reset controller. There is a stud hanging down above the front left truck ???. Looks like a bell shape at the bottom.
I'm wondering is this is a factory defect. Can't imagine what this is for-I might have to call BLI on Monday. Supposed to operate on 18" radius, but maybe not . Seems to not like some switches. Am using standard Atlas snap switches. My whole layout is 18" radius.
I do not know how to attach picture of stud yet, but will find out.
My original GP38-2 (2 axle) still runs great-no problems.
Figured out how to attach photo-although upside down-sorry


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

generatorman said:


> Rec'd my new BLI RSD 15 today (3 axle trucks). Looks great-neat sounds. But, derails on some switches. Also derailed on rerailer. Also changes loco 3 to 1 on my EZ Command controller. Sometimes lights flash- as in short. Have to reset controller. There is a stud hanging down above the front left truck ???. Looks like a bell shape at the bottom.


First time I've heard of a bell end on a BLI.


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

*2 axle or 3 axle trucks on 18" radius*

Have returned my new BLI RSD15 today. Modeltrainstuff rep suggested "minimum 18 radius advertised means you should have 22". Now I'm confused. Should I stay with 2 axle trucks like my Bachmann GP38-2, or was the BLI RSD15 derailment problem an indication of poor design or track clearance problem?

I'm using Atlas snap switches and all 18" curved track. All based on Atlas HO-6 "the trunk line" layout with a slight siding change.

Since I've started this layout I have returned 3 locos with varying problems. Mytrainstuff has been wonderful trying to please its customers, but I'm afraid I may have tried their patience one too many times. So, I still need another loco with DCC and sound. Any suggestions would be appreciated.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Yes, any time there is a short, momentary or otherwise,
the Bachmann main EZ DCC controller will reset the loco
address to 1. Annoying to me. For that reason I
never assign 1 to any loco. The Bachmann wired
handheld doesn't reset though. 

All new locos and decoders come default to 3.
I immediately assign a new number to every new loco. That
way you won't be changing a decoder unintended.

I don't know the BLI, but nothing should be so low
on a truck that it snags turnouts, crossings or
rerailers.

Don


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

Sorry for my earlier flip answer. Three 'faulty' locos does sound like a lot. If you sent them all back for the same reason you have to ask yourself what else could be going on here. 18" radius turnouts are very tight for a three axle truck but they should be able to handle it. That leaves the track, I've always use Peco turnouts and they're bullet proof but I see posts about problems on the Atlas ones you're using. The only way to find out is to get your eyes close to the problem to see what is happening.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Some claim to have good operations of some larger
locos on 18" radius curves. Others have had problems.

Atlas snap switches and 18" curves are going to serve
you better with 4 wheel truck locos and no more than
70 ft passenger cars.

Most of us try for at least 22" radius curves using
Flex track. And for smooth running through turnouts
use Peco Insulfrogs. 

Don


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

*New Loco*

As soon as I get a store credit for the returned BLI, am going to order a Atlas Master Line Gold Line series GE Dash 8-40BW (DCC & Sound) This one has 4 axles so hopefully will run fine on my layout.

I laid a 18" section on one of the switches. Seems to me the Atlas switch has maybe a 22" turnout (although not marked) which should work fine. My original GP38-2 still runs perfectly, even pushing 7 cars in reverse through all the switches (inside and outside Loops)

Have attached pic of my layout


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

The Atlas snap switches are actually closer to 17.5r than 18r. Also when a manufacturer says minimum 18r it means if everything is 100% perfectly laid. 

Older locomotives 18r was the standard. For the newer longer ones 22r is becoming the standard.


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## ggnlars (Aug 6, 2013)

First thing I would do is get a gage. Factory turnouts are notorious for out of gage locations in critical places. If you look on the Internet, you will find a number of articles on how to improve them. Then you have the DCC freindly issues. 
Remember these parts will have variation, so some will be better than others. 
I suspect the C-C truck loco is just more sensitive to the issues. 
Your dash 8 might also have issues because of it length. 
My feeling is that if the unit is supposed to run on 18 inch radius, it will. The desire for more realistic looking models has led to the sensitivity that is haunting you. Thus, the track work for 18 inch curves and number 4 turnouts has to be nearly flawless. Going to 22 inches and number 6 turnouts helps, but takes more room. 
The other consideration is that most modern rolling stock models being made today are intended for 22 to 24 inches or higher. It is something to think about when you select what to buy. Kato has some recent Amtrack HO models that will run on 15 inch curves, so there are some things available. In the US, the prevailing thought is for large radius curves, etc. This is mainly because trains look toy like on sharp radius. This is true, but the larger radius takes more space. The interesting thing here is that geometry will show that you get more straight section with the sharpest radius. Clearly you can't have square corners, but are 24 inch or larger really required? Kato's customers want 15".

Back to the original post. There is no reason why a no sound DCC version will be noisier than a sound version of the same release model. What is likely happening is something either came loose or was not where it was supposed to be in the first place. 
These models are not run until you take it out of the box. They are put together some where in China, shipped in containers across the Pacific, worked through the docks on the west coast, and shipped to the importer and then to either the stores or the end customer. 
I see a number of new engines in a year. Today, most are really well packed. At least half have parts floating in the package or inside the engine. Often the engine will not run. Either something has lodged where it binds the drive or a wire has come lose or broken. 
I never send the unit back. Usually with 15 minutes effort the problem can be identified and solved, leaving a perfect unit. 

I know, you spent close to $200 for a model that comes broken. The QC varies from one importer to another. However, the factories and path to you are nearly the same. Keep in mind that the odds of the replacement unit also having a problem are high. Likely a different issue, but a problem none the less. These are the realities of limited production fringe products like model trains.
Don't get me wrong, the models produced today are really fantastic. But they also have more opportunities to have flaws. The buyer today is less tolerant of these flaws for many reasons. To keep from going in circles, you sometimes have to fix the flaws yourself.

Your last choice of an Atlas unit was your best selection, I find them to be one of the importers that has fewer issues, but the do/will have some.
Good luck,
Larry
www,llxlocomotives.com


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

generatorman said:


> Thanks for the reply. Being brand new to DCC, I did not know that the EZCommand did not do this. Instead of spending $115 for EZ, I could have bought NCE Power cab For approx $155, saving myself $$$$. Live and learn I guess.
> Also I tried recently to run in DC mode-no luck. It did this originally. My loco will run DC on my old power pack. So I guess that function is gone. Am curious to see how the new BLI will run in consist mode. May have to play with the speed settings. It should be fun (I hope).


I did the same thing.bought a ez command, thinking this is great. I won't need another ever. WAS I WRONG! 2 months later, with the helpful advice from cycleops, I owned a nce power cab, and never wanted another. When you get yours, you will love it!!!


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

*Thanks*

Wish to thank all of you for your helpful posts to my original message.
Very helpful to a newbie (72 yrs old).
Will receive my NCE power cab today. Looking forward to doing some adjustments to sound. Also will order Atlas master line gold Ge dash 8-40BW BNSF (DCC & sound) since my refund has been posted to my debit card.
Thanks again:appl:


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

generatorman said:


> Wish to thank all of you for your helpful posts to my original message.
> Very helpful to a newbie (72 yrs old).
> Will receive my NCE power cab today. Looking forward to doing some adjustments to sound. Also will order Atlas master line gold Ge dash 8-40BW BNSF (DCC & sound) since my refund has been posted to my debit card.
> Thanks again:appl:


Good for you.welcome to the wonderful world of nce power cab. It's a blast to work with. 
🚥 🚂🚂🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

My new power cab is great to play with. If I had known better it would have been my first purchase. Have sent my original gp38-2 back to Bachmann (idling sound only-nothing else)(was running perfectly until after I changed acceleration and braking cvs-which worked fine). Later on it went kaput. 
My new Atlas dash 8 40cw (4 axles) runs great after adding a short straight piece of track to one switch. Have changed hi speed cv to slow it down. Both locos are very different in operation. When I get another loco I will try to consist. Should be interesting.


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## generatorman (Apr 7, 2016)

*New Loco and dirty wheels*

I received a new?? Atlas master gold GE dash 8-40bw (sound & DCC) from modeltrainstuff. 
Put on track and tried to run. Went a short distance and stopped. Checked wheels (very dirty) cleaned and tried again. Ran longer but still stopped sometimes. Cleaned wheels again. Now ran ok. Just for good measure I cleaned track (not very dirty)and wheels again. Running fine now. Wondering if this was a demo or something. Not what I expected with a new loco (especially at this price).

Very challenging hobby so far.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

New locos are often contaminated by lubes and dirt at the factory, or less often on a display shelf at a store. It's pretty common to have to give them a good cleaning prior to operating.

DCC is much more finicky about dirt than DC is.


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