# Horn-Hook Uncoupling



## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

What can I use to uncouple the trains that have horn-hook couplers? I don't know how to install knuckle couplers on them, but I also don't want to retire them because these trains cost me money.


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## waltr (Aug 15, 2011)

Try a small flat bladed screw driver. Insert and twist.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

Take one of those toothpicks with the colorful celophane fright wigs that they use in sandwiches, place the point between the two knuckles and gently twist clockwise...works on both types nicely BTW. You can get them by the box at most any food market or Walmart for a buck or two.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

Well, there was something I saw under the "Resources" tab in the Horizon Hobbies website.
http://mrr.trains.com/How%20To/Articles/Prototype%20Information/2010/02/Locomotives%20and%20rolling%20stock.aspx

If you look at the section that goes under "couplers", it talks about how there is this special thing that you can put in between the track to uncouple horn-hook couplers. Anyone know if they are still around?


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

shaygetz said:


> Take one of those toothpicks with the colorful celophane fright wigs that they use in sandwiches, place the point between the two knuckles and gently twist clockwise...works on both types nicely BTW. You can get them by the box at most any food market or Walmart for a buck or two.


would you post a pic please? I dont remember what they look like lol


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

jjb727 said:


> would you post a pic please? I dont remember what they look like lol


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

http://www.micromark.com/uncoupling-tool-for-ho-and-on30-scale-trains,7613.html











Or you can experiment and make your own.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

big ed said:


> http://www.micromark.com/uncoupling-tool-for-ho-and-on30-scale-trains,7613.html
> 
> 
> View attachment 17475
> ...


oh, for this, I have a plastic yellow one that I bought from the walthers website


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

Changing out couplers isn't that hard. Post some pics of the coupler boxes on your current cars and I'd be willing to bet we could help you convert them. Knuckle couplers are worlds better than hook/horn.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> Changing out couplers isn't that hard. Post some pics of the coupler boxes on your current cars and I'd be willing to bet we could help you convert them. Knuckle couplers are worlds better than hook/horn.


you pics of all of the horn hook rolling stock i have?


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

big ed said:


> http://www.micromark.com/uncoupling-tool-for-ho-and-on30-scale-trains,7613.html
> 
> 
> View attachment 17475
> ...


lol this picture would help more if it was a video and it was shot from a bird's eye view


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

There are really only a few styles of coupler boxes and Kadee makes conversions for just about (if not) all of them. Group them by type (visually) and take pics of each style.

Some mount on the body and some mount on the trucks. Changing couplers isn't hard. Once you convert them you won't be disappointed.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> There are really only a few styles of coupler boxes and Kadee makes conversions for just about (if not) all of them. Group them by type (visually) and take pics of each style.
> 
> Some mount on the body and some mount on the trucks. Changing couplers isn't hard. Once you convert them you won't be disappointed.


I tried doing it to the locos, but it didnt work so well. The couplers got all stiff and wouldn't retract back to the center like they should.


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

Don't tighten the screws all the way down. You can also improve the performance with a little dry graphite lube. Were you using the style with the wisker springs or the spring boxes? There are also different lengths, it's possible the one you were using was binding on the coupler box and you need a longer style neck on the coupler.

Here is Kadee's conversion list. 

http://www.kadee.com/conv/holist.pdf


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## Mr.Buchholz (Dec 30, 2011)

Hook/horn = pain. Knuckle = good.

-J.


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## gustovski (Jul 7, 2011)

Mr.Buchholz said:


> Hook/horn = pain. Knuckle = good.
> 
> -J.


what he said! nuf said


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> Don't tighten the screws all the way down. You can also improve the performance with a little dry graphite lube. Were you using the style with the wisker springs or the spring boxes? There are also different lengths, it's possible the one you were using was binding on the coupler box and you need a longer style neck on the coupler.
> 
> Here is Kadee's conversion list.
> 
> http://www.kadee.com/conv/holist.pdf


idk, i just know they were kadee #148


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

What I'm saying is that the #148 might not be the right one for your application.


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## gustovski (Jul 7, 2011)

just get the starter set from kd youll get almost every thing you need
just top it up as you convert your rr cars


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> What I'm saying is that the #148 might not be the right one for your application.


then what would? see, Im a beginner and I know nothing about the 40 different kinds of couplers that kadee manufactures (yes, I was being sarcastic, not really 40  )


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## gustovski (Jul 7, 2011)

as i said if you get the starter set you get a nice range of couplers and some usful tools for the job


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

jjb727 said:


> then what would? see, Im a beginner and I know nothing about the 40 different kinds of couplers that kadee manufactures (yes, I was being sarcastic, not really 40  )


Without pics of the car you're trying to convert - it's impossible to tell you. Do you know the manufacturers of your cars? The chart (see link) I gave you tells you which couplers to use with which manufacturers/types of cars.


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

jjb727,
Kadee makes a lot more than 40 couplers!
Like Scott said, You will have to read the conversion chats in order to pic the right couplers for every car! And a picture is worth a thousand words!

gustovski also made a great suggestion!:thumbsup::thumbsup: The starter sets are great for helping you setting them up right!


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

Alright, thank you all! I am a beginner and I think this will be a lot more time consuming than i thought, so Ill just scrap the whole project. But again, thank you all!


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

Seriously? You're giving up Model Trains because changing couplers would be too time consuming?


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> Seriously? You're giving up Model Trains because changing couplers would be too time consuming?


No no, just the horn hook coupler thing i was asking about lol.


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

Once you figure out which coupler you need (which really is probably as simple as posting a picture on here) it only takes a couple minutes to change out a coupler.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> Once you figure out which coupler you need (which really is probably as simple as posting a picture on here) it only takes a couple minutes to change out a coupler.


problem is, i have some rolling stock that I don't know which brand it is because some are purchased as "used" from retailers that buy collections.


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

That's why you should post a picture of the coupler areas of those cars. The guys on here are pretty good at identifying what you would need. It's really not that hard and the performance benefits are worth it.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

jjb727 said:


> Alright, thank you all! I am a beginner and I think this will be a lot more time consuming than i thought, so Ill just scrap the whole project. But again, thank you all!


I use both...there are ones that retain their value by simply leaving them as is. Others I keep that way for nostalgia's sake. I've been at this hobby almost 40 years now and there isn't a car or loco I can't figure out, sometimes I just like sticking with what's already there, there is no shame in keeping them that way. I have several transition cars, ones equipped with knucks on one end, hooks on the other. They take care of any mismatches.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sstlaure said:


> That's why you should post a picture of the coupler areas of those cars. The guys on here are pretty good at identifying what you would need. It's really not that hard and the performance benefits are worth it.


Alright, cool. Thanks


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

I have a lot of rolling stock with horn-hook, so do you need pics for all of them...and the locos?


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## [email protected] (Jan 30, 2012)

I'm glad somebody asked this question. I wiggle and jiggle until they let loose...or I use the 32 oz Ball Peen


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> I'm glad somebody asked this question. I wiggle and jiggle until they let loose...or I use the 32 oz Ball Peen


lol. well, im going to work on this project at a later time, because I am still working on the plans for my shelf layout around my room.


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## Kwikster (Feb 22, 2012)

jjb,

Just remember it's your train. You're the engineer, conductor and brakeman. If you're going for realism, the knuckles are the ticket. Otherwise, like Shay says, make up a transition car or 2 for the simplicity. Back when I had HO set up, it was all hornhook, it was all I had.

Carl


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

Kwikster said:


> jjb,
> 
> Just remember it's your train. You're the engineer, conductor and brakeman. If you're going for realism, the knuckles are the ticket. Otherwise, like Shay says, make up a transition car or 2 for the simplicity. Back when I had HO set up, it was all hornhook, it was all I had.
> 
> Carl


Well, the good side of a shelf layout (especially at the height I'm installing it at), is that you can't really see the couplers, so that kind of erases the need for going 100% prototypical. I am going 90% freelanced here.


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

For me, I like to couple/uncouple cars and move them around. The functionality of the knuckle couplers is what I really like.

In most cases the coupler is held in with a small plastic tab, or there is a snap on cover over the coupler box and the coupler pivots on a small boss.

You want to make sure the pivot hole in the coupler is the same size as the pivot pin. (Easy to identify visually.) You also want to make sure the coupler head is completely clear of the edge of the coupler box (i.e. doesn't bind.)

If the coupler box is held together with a screw, simply loosen that screw and it should come apart. don't overtighten this screw as it can bind the coupler.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

thanks


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

Ok, so I had to find this thread to revive it. i did it in order to show these damn Scene Master knuckle couplers that are a pain in the butt to install. Any alternatives?


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

ezmates or kadees with talgo truck adapters


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sawgunner said:


> ezmates or kadees with talgo truck adapters


i need pictures, if possible, please!


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

here ya go! do you need some? i have plenty of them!

















*without the adapter in *








*with the adapter in*


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

thanks!


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

What about these guys?


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

not quite sure of the coupler pocket on those. might be the same as the freight cars which will use the same adapter. or you may have to take the cover plate off the bottom of the truck to release the coupler if it is in a sealed pocket to which you would use an ez mate or a kadee whisker coupler


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

yes I do! If you could give me some, I would highly appreciate it!


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

jjb727 said:


> yes I do! If you could give me some, I would highly appreciate it!


PM me your addy and i'll send them out to ya


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sawgunner said:


> not quite sure of the coupler pocket on those. might be the same as the freight cars which will use the same adapter. or you may have to take the cover plate off the bottom of the truck to release the coupler if it is in a sealed pocket to which you would use an ez mate or a kadee whisker coupler


The hole in the coupler is larger than the ones for rolling stock.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sawgunner said:


> PM me your addy and i'll send them out to ya


Do I need different couplers than the ones I showed?


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

ok that will take a normal kadee whisker or an ez mate. i'll send a few ez mates to ya as well


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sawgunner said:


> ok that will take a normal kadee whisker or an ez mate. i'll send a few ez mates to ya as well


And do you happen to have EZ mates for a Norfolk Southern GP50 (DC version)? I am missing the coupler and the part that holds it in place. Let me know, thanks!


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

brand new set of ez mates just got put in your package. are you missing the pocket cover? what about the screw? i can have both for ya i have a crap load of bachmann and lifelike parts at my disposal


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

yeah, the screw too. I dont know how it fell out. Thanks a lot for your help!


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

sawgunner said:


> brand new set of ez mates just got put in your package. are you missing the pocket cover? what about the screw? i can have both for ya i have a crap load of bachmann and lifelike parts at my disposal


Damn! Not even I have that much replacement(s) inventory lol. Thanks alot!


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

i'll take pics of my "inventory"


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

awesome!


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

Anyone need Hook horn couplers? there free and I will even pay the shipping.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

i need the ones for diesels like the ones i showed in my pics


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

I can not tell which ones you need. can you post a clear picture of one? 
As to the uncoupler thing i use an wooeden shiskabob stick. same as tooth pick just longer.


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

hahaha i have horn hooks for days and days! i'll send those as well


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

thanks!


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## Lee_R (May 30, 2012)

I really wish I'd have found this thread before I did THIS! :laugh:










Not to worry though, I'm going to drill the holes out larger on the truck and cover, insert one of my treasured IHC Magic Mate couplers, run a screw up through it, and (lightly) put a nut on top. A little bit of Loc-Tite on the nut, Robert's your parent's sibling! Besides, even if I'd had an unopened, NOS supply of Tyco horn/hook couplers, I still would have had to pry the housing apart, I just wouldn't have had to toss the pin. And yes, I tried the MM coupler with the included insert, the darn thing just liked to stick in the "open" position. And going the screw/nut route allows for adjustment, cleaning, and any repairs if needed.

Now, when I get around to working on some other engines, I "may" come tapping on some of you guys' doors, but we'll have to see how bad the damage is first! :laugh:


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

Lee do you need some talgo's as well?


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## Lee_R (May 30, 2012)

I still don't have news on the shipping of the rest of my stuff, and I should probably find out what kind of condition "that" is in, before saying yea or nae. The only other loco that needs new couplers, we've already got a possible plan in place for. I should be hearing on that, sometime this week. 

Now, if that magic parts bin of yours happens to have some Tyco wheel covers for a C-430 (silver), and/or a Tyco F7/9 (black)..... :laugh:


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

Lee_R said:


> I still don't have news on the shipping of the rest of my stuff, and I should probably find out what kind of condition "that" is in, before saying yea or nae. The only other loco that needs new couplers, we've already got a possible plan in place for. I should be hearing on that, sometime this week.
> 
> Now, if that magic parts bin of yours happens to have some Tyco wheel covers for a C-430 (silver), and/or a Tyco F7/9 (black)..... :laugh:



hehehehe you know it does hehehehe


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## New Berlin RR (Feb 11, 2012)

Hey saw question, what do the talgos really do? what are they intended for? I got a few trucks/couplers that I don't have them on and they seem to work just fine...


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

they hold the kadee or ez mate coupler snugly in place. without them your couplers can move all around to include pulling completely out of the pocket and thus you get what they call in the real world a pulled or broken knuckle issue


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## New Berlin RR (Feb 11, 2012)

ah so should I be putting them on my trains if they seem to fit fine?


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

if they are like the truck i posted to show how they went then i would suggest it


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

so helpful! i like that!


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