# Moving your layout around



## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Hey guys it has been awhile since I have been this here. I have been moving and all that good stuff. I finally had the time to set up my train stuff in the basement. It is just a table with 2" foam on top. I am going to connect the tables so that I can easily take them apart when I move again, but I'm not sure how I should do the wiring. I am thinking under the table and then use connectors or something from table to table, so I can just unclog the, when I move. Is their any other way??


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## Bkubiak (Oct 20, 2013)

Aminnich said:


> Hey guys it has been awhile since I have been this here. I have been moving and all that good stuff. I finally had the time to set up my train stuff in the basement. It is just a table with 2" foam on top. I am going to connect the tables so that I can easily take them apart when I move again, but I'm not sure how I should do the wiring. I am thinking under the table and then use connectors or something from table to table, so I can just unclog the, when I move. Is their any other way??


my club has a huge modular layout that can be moved quickly from place to place, all the track is set up to connect via a bridge track from table to table and all the wiring is below with small plugs to connect module to module. If you are gonna have just two, possibly three tables it should be a cinch to do.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Where can I get these plugs


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## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

Anderson Power Pole connectors (30 amp or 15 amp). They are genderless connectors and use a crimp tool. I first heard of them on Model Railroad Hobbiest, i think on one of the TV shows on modular railroads.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Consider multi connection barrier terminal blocks. One on each table, a cable connects the tables. They are inexpensive and easy to connect.

You could also use the same blocks to connect tracks, turnout motors and
other accessories on each table.

Here are pictures of some that are available. They come with various
numbers of connections.

http://www.electrical-connectors.org/power/barrier-terminal.html

Don


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

DonR said:


> Consider multi connection barrier terminal blocks. One on each table, a cable connects the tables. They are inexpensive and easy to connect.
> 
> You could also use the same blocks to connect tracks, turnout motors and
> other accessories on each table.
> ...


I really like this idea.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

You could use Fahnstock clips. The stripped end of one wire is more or less permanently screwed to one end of the clip, the other has a clip and loop on it. Press down the clip, pass the stripped end of a second wire through the loop, and release the clip. Holds the wire firmly and makes a great connection, but it's just as simple to pop the second wire back out to disconnect it. Another nice feature is that the gauge of the two wires doesn't matter.

They are available on Amazon.com.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I'm going to use the multi connection barrier terminal blocks because this way I can better organize my wiring. Thanks for the idea tho


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

The only question I have is, can I use any gauge wire? Can I use two different gauges on different terminals?


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*Industrial controls distributer may be able to help?*



Aminnich said:


> Where can I get these plugs


what your looking for is a business that distributes industrial controls, They most likely will be able to help you. When wiring, the wire gauge, is determined by the expected current,found in the wire using "OHMS law". And a MULTIMETER preferably a digital one.
Good luck, tr1


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## highvoltage (Apr 6, 2014)

Aminnich said:


> The only question I have is, can I use any gauge wire?...


When passing current the short answer is bigger is better, up to a point. If you're pulling 10 amps at 18 volts as little as .1 ohm will drop about 1 volt. So, it depends on your layout and the number of connections you're going to have.

Here's a website to help you calculate wire resistance:

http://www.cirris.com/learning-center/calculators/133-wire-resistance-calculator-table



Aminnich said:


> ...Can I use two different gauges on different terminals?


You can, but why would you? Again, resistance is your enemy. Voltage drop will increase in the smaller wire.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

All very correct, but it's an HO layout. The current draw is
not all that great and distance is limited for the typical track plan. Small gauge
wires are usually sufficient, maybe a little larger for
buss use.

Don


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Im not sure what gauge wires im using yet. But I'm planning on a larger bus wired with probably 22 gauge wire for feeders. And for the turnouts im probably using 22 gauge.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Would these be sufficient for what I need them for?? 
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00G9IEMJM/ref=pd_aw_sim_422_11?ie=UTF8&refRID=1ZNKPJKKHTYM479P7AH1


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Wire gauge*

aminnich;
I would go bigger on the bus wires(main long ones.) 22 ga. is fine for short(usualy 6" or less)
track feeders; from the rails down to the bus wires. I would also recommend 18ga. or bigger for the turnout wires.(except for the short feeders used just to get under the table, and connect to the larger wires there. This may seem like a really big wire for operating a switch machine. However those little twin coil machines attached to the turnout( I'm assuming that's what your using) draw an awful lot of current for the very short time they operate. With a wire run of 10' or even less, the resistance of the wire becomes a factor when you need a big burst of current now.
At some point you will most likely want to switch more than one turnout with the same button. Big wire helps make this possible.
Terminal strips are an excellent idea. I use them on my own layout to keep wiring neat, and provide test points for troubleshooting when something goes wrong. Notice I say "when; not "if"! Murphy's law applies just as much to model railroading as it does to any other activity!

Good luck!

Traction Fan


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Wow thanks that was a lot of helpful information! Im a little worried because I want to put my control area at one end of the table (2 4x8s), so the distance from the opposite side is quite the distance and im afraid it won't get the power it needs to run properly


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Turnout wires*

Aminich;

You are quite welcome. That's what this forum is designed for. If anyone has a question, 
he/she will get an answer. Often several answers that conflict with each other! That's just the nature of we humans. If you have your control panel at one of the narrow ends of your 
combined 4'x16' layout; then a turnout at the far end would potentially have a total wire run
length of 32' to operate either of the two coils. This is because the current must go out and
back. The center wire on the switch machine is a common(to both coils in that machine) return wire. When you "fire" one coil, to throw the turnout, the current goes out from one of the power pack's accessory terminals-through the length of one of the coil wires-through the coil itself-and back through the common return wire to the other accessory terminal of the power pack.
By the way, the burst of electricity to any switch machine should be kept to one second or less. Leaning on the control button for, say forty five seconds, will damage or destroy the coil.
There is a device called a, "capacitive discharge system" that will prevent this kind of burnout. It will also come in handy when you discover "route control" (firing all the coils needed to get your loco into track#3 of a freight yard simultaneously.
If you know a resistor from a capacitor or diode, and how to solder, you can build such a system. I think DonR, on the forum, has built his own and he can help you when you are ready to. Such systems are also available commercially from walthers.com.

Regards;
Traction Fan 

P.S. You may want to reconsider placing your control panel at a far end, vs. the middle, of your layout. sixteen feet is a long way to look and see which way a turnout is thrown, whether a car is coupled properly, Etc.
Just a thought.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Thanks again for your giant post!! I know I have it that the furthest turnout is about 12ft away, but that is still a pretty good distance. Im not very knowledgeable when I comes to elevtrical stuff, so that's why im a bit worried. If I just run a heavier guage wire to the far turnouts, would that be ok. Also for the bus wire, before when u only had one 4x8, I used an old extension cord as the bus wire and it worked out pretty good. Do u think I could do the same thing for a bigger layout like what im doing??


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

The typical electrical extension cord would be fine
for your buss wiring. It is a heavier gauge than most
of us use.

A 12 ft wire run is not that far. You can use the same wire
for the distant turnouts as you use for those nearby.

Don


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Wire, and other, worries*

Aminich;

First don't be too worried about making mistakes. We all have, and continue to, do so! We just find new kinds of mistakes to make. Building a layout is, and ought to be, a learning experience. If worrying about getting "everything perfect"(no one ever does) keeps you from trying, you won't give yourself a chance to learn. 
As for wire size, Don's right about the extension cord. They usually have 16ga. wire which is 
plenty big for any model railroad application. I would use the same size,and color code, (ie.red black green or whatever you choose) for all turnouts. This will make it easier to keep track of the wiring, and trace problems when they happen. 
I tend to lean toward the most reliable materials and methods, often choosing to build in extra capacity rather than just enough. This has helped when I added something later.
I'm a retired service tech. I have spent enough time trying to trace poorly marked wiring to
develop an obsession about neatness and reliability. Except for the feeders, I would keep the wires big. At some point you may decide to use DCC for controlling your trains. This uses large bus wires. It also greatly simplifies wiring and allows you to operate more than one train on the same track. Now might be a good time as you will never have fewer locos to convert. 
Whatever you decide to do, go ahead and try something. If you don't like it, you can always try something else later.

Good Luck;

Traction Fan


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I guess I didn't mention that. Im running a DCC system.


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Dcc*

Aminich:

Good for you! DCC will let you get the most out of your model railroad. The wiring for DCC is very simple. Two big bus wires running under the table and small feeder wires down from the track, in several places, and connected to the bus wires. That's it for running trains. You will still need to run wires to the turnouts, unless you're going to use stationary decoders to operate the turnouts.
Sounds like you're off to a good start. Ask, if you need help. We'd be glad to.

Traction Fan


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

The barriers pictured seem to be fine quality, and a bit
more costly I suppose from the typical terminal strips.

To determine the number of terminals you'll need at
each table, you'll need to plan your wiring.

One pair for your DCC track Buss.
One pair for any building or other scenic lighting.
One terminal for the turnout Common.
One pair for EACH turnout. Red & Green (since you'll have a varied number
of turnouts on each table, you'll need more terminals near
your control panel and they'll diminish in number as you get
to the farthest module).
I would also add 2 or 3 pairs for future wiring needs.

Plan to number the wires with the numbers that wrap around
the wires. Also number the terminals on each strip. And, the
ultimate, keep a log of those numbers describing what each
wire does. This might help when you again move and
disconnect your modules and go to reconnect them later.

By all means use cable ties to keep the wires neat.

Don


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I picked up some suitcases for wiring today, but the store didn't have any terminals, going i get them online. Also, the turnout machines I have have three wires.... Is this just because they are old??? I was debating on spending the money to get the tortoise switch machines, but they r going to get expensive, so I'm waiting on those..


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Yes, one of the 3 wires on each turnout is COMMON. You can
tie all of these together on a buss so that you need not run a wire
from your panel to each one. That will cut down on the
number of terminals you need. You would need the red and
the green for each turnout tho.

If you have a Radio Shack nearby they have barrier terminals.

Don


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## traction fan (Oct 5, 2014)

*Barrier strips*

Aminich;

You can order terminal strips, and just about anything electric you might need(wire, switches, Etc.) from allelectronics.com. On your first order,or before if you ask them, they will send you a free catalog of all the many parts they carry.
Your turnouts don't have three wires because of their age. If that were the case, many of us on this forum would have three wires coming out of our bodies! 
The real reason is that they are twin coil machines. Each coil inside has two wires. Two of them are connected in common(as both Don and I have explained). This was done to cut down on the number of wires to each turnout. Don's good suggestion of connecting all the common wires to the same bus will reduce it by one more wire each.
In case you're wondering, Tortoise, and several other brands can get by with only two wires because they use DC current to operate ONE motor. (instead of TWO coils). The DC current can be reversed to run the motor backwards, which throws the turnout the opposite way.

Traction Fan


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Sorry, I want to make sure I buy the right stuff... What gauge bus wire should I use? Feeder? Turnout? Im making a purchase in alleletronics.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Here's a PDF that is all inclusive about wiring for DCC.

It gives suggested gauges and other tips
that might help you get started right.

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0LE...ring.pdf/RK=0/RS=zc5dXFsTdh2vGbqESkIoqLlkRoM-

Allen Gartner is perhaps the leading expert in wiring
for DCC. He has a website also.

http://www.wiringfordcc.com/

Don't let some of the instructions scare you. Many are intended
for very large layouts. Just check out the down to earth
simple parts for now.

Don


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Thanks a ton guys!!! You guys r great!!!


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