# Help identifying trains.



## mike302 (Dec 17, 2009)

I was recently given these trains and need help identifying or dating the sets. I know the one is an American Flyer. The others I have tried to look up but cant find any information. Any information about these would be greatly appreciated Thanks in advance Mike.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Mike,

I can't see the pictures----can you repost them, or provide a photobucket address? I run AF, so I might be able to help.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Your pictures links are not showing until I hit quote to reply.

Then I can't open them. 
You did something wrong I think.

Try again.


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## mike302 (Dec 17, 2009)

I just uploaded photos to the gallery. Thanks Mike302


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

The black engine-tender combo appear to be post-war American Flyer: the 3-digit number on the engine identifies it. I can't read the number---tell me what it says and I can give you some info on it. The other items are a lot harder: the yellow train appears to be a metal prewar AF. Look for similar numbers on all of them, or any other identifying info. Keep feeding me info and we'll see if we can track them down!


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## Boston&Maine (Dec 19, 2007)

The "Overland Flyer" wind-up locomotive with tender was made by Hafner... I can not figure out if the North Western passenger car actually goes with it though...


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## mike302 (Dec 17, 2009)

The American Flyer says Reading line 303 on it. The yellow Union Pacific has M-10000. The is a small railroad sysmbol towards the back that says MAR. The Electric Traction trolley has no markings or stampings same with the wind up Overland Flyer NorthWestern.


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## Boston&Maine (Dec 19, 2007)

mike302 said:


> The yellow Union Pacific has M-10000. The is a small railroad sysmbol towards the back that says MAR.


MAR would be short for Marx... Here is a page about the train: http://www.toyandtrainguides.com/marxtin/streamliner/m10000.htm


Some more history:



> Having acquired manufacturing facilities the previous year, Louis Marx offered his first trains under the Marx moniker in 1934. For the most part, what Marx offered the first year were large Joy Line sets in Marx boxes, but one train stood out: the Union Pacific M10000 articulated streamlined passenger set. Lionel and American Flyer also released streamlined passenger trains in 1934, but operating at the inexpensive end of the market, the Marx M10000 sets probably outsold their competition considerably. A 1934 Montgomery Ward catalog shows a Marx three-piece electric M10000 with 12 sections of three-rail track and transformer for $4.98, while the three- piece clockwork set with battery headlamp and 12 pieces of two-rail track retailed for $1.79. These first Marx M10000 sets were tan and cream with red lettering, and what a sight they must have been to little boys of that era.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

The first is a Marx M10003 streamliner. The closest I could find for that trolley is Lionel but not definitively, American Flyer put out some big stuff in their day too and it just seems too realistic to be an Ives. The AF steamer is their model #302 and dates from the late 40s/early to mid 50s.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

The American Flyer 303 is an S scale, made from 1954 thru 1957: I have one at home. It's a smoker and chuffer---in other words, if everything is working properly and you add smoke fluid to the small tube in the smokestack, it sends out puffs of smoke and makes a '"chuff" noise with every rotation of the wheels, while moving. Be careful not to run it without smoke fluid and don't let it sit idle on the tracks with power applied; you can burn out the smoker.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

The last unit, the "Electric Traction" trolley, is a tough one. Can you tell us if it's a clockwork or electric unit? I'm assuming clockwork (should be a key or a hole for a key), but I could be barking up the wrong tree.

B & M, I originally agreed with your assesment that the Northwestern passenger car was an adoptee. However, I found a pic of a "Mafner", different color pattern, that was listed as "Overland Flyer Northwestern Line" : 

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/mafners-overland-flyer-northwestern-line-windup-tr

So it may be an adoptee or we may be looking at a partial set, different year/model/paint job?


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## Boston&Maine (Dec 19, 2007)

Reckers said:


> The last unit, the "Electric Traction" trolley, is a tough one. Can you tell us if it's a clockwork or electric unit? I'm assuming clockwork (should be a key or a hole for a key), but I could be barking up the wrong tree.
> 
> B & M, I originally agreed with your assesment that the Northwestern passenger car was an adoptee. However, I found a pic of a "Mafner", different color pattern, that was listed as "Overland Flyer Northwestern Line" :
> 
> ...


Yea, it must be... The car style matches the ones that you pictured (besides the livery)... Mafner, eh? I guess they did not spell check hwell:


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

The passenger car is an Overland Flyer. If the tender is correct. The trucks match too. They go together. The coupler is weird.

The Trolley is close to a Lionel model type 2 built around 1910. the number of windows, the roof, the word electric, the color. 
In Lionel the length was only 6 inches, the truck design doesn't match. No word traction was listed.The Lionel also had square windows front amd back.

At this time there were some companies that are practically unkown. We only know the common ones.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

I think the trolley is actually a train passenger car, as opposed to an independant street-car type unit. His original pictures started working, for some reason, and there's a vertical pin-type coupler showing I could not see on the gallery pics. The car looks sorta Ives, sorta not Ives, but I can't find anything in Ives that matches and the coupler is not the style of the Ives I can see on sites. I've ridden on real-life excursion cars that are similar to this one.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Think it is standard gage? It appears to have a motor.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

After all is said and done what do you plan on doing with them?
If I may ask.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

T-man, it has some sort of motor to it. Compared to the rest, though, it seems mighty large. I could easily be wrong, but I think it's bigger than Standard.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

You may have something with the trolley. Maybe ask a museum about. Then donate it for the tax deduction. Just an idea.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

T-Man said:


> You may have something with the trolley. Maybe ask a museum about. Then donate it for the tax deduction. Just an idea.


....and I accept S scale donations. Honest. *L*


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## mike302 (Dec 17, 2009)

First I'd like to thank you all for your help. These trains were handed down to me by my dad. The American Flyer was his and the other sets were my grandfather's and his brothers. I am really curious about the history of these trains. I have some more pics of the underneath and inside of the "trolley". Hope it might help. I looked again and there is definetly no markings anywhere. Also the Marx M-10000 looks like it has a batttery slot inside. Could that be? Did these trains run on a battery?


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Nice pictures but it is so old . I have nothing to compare it too. Time frame is 1908 to 1925. Google a few train museums . The Lionels were worth 1000 others were 4000. Probably a company long out of buisness.
Good Luck and Let us Know. 

Electric Traction is a Company in Britain It could be foreign. This is where being a member of a collectors group pays off.

We need a manufacturer to find more info on it.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

The battery slot is likely for the headlight...an interesting touch for a wind-up toy. Your trolley looks like three rail standard gauge---the motor is a fascinating study all its own. A beautiful heritage to hold onto and pass down.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

I'm running out to a Christmas party this morning, but I promise to send you some American Flyer web sites this weekend. If you have any questions about your locomotive, I'd be happy to talk about it, as well. Holding onto a family heirloom is always a great choice, but in the case of that trolley, I'd suggest considering either auction or museum, AFTERyou know what you have. If it's rare, it deserves preservation techniques and an environment you may not be able to provide. In addition, if you're really fortunate, it will pay for getting enough track, etc, to really outfit the rest to pass down thru your family.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

PS: Don't accept just one appraisal of value! Keep 'em honest! And if someone tells you what it is, please come back and tell us. Not only are we interested, but we can check our information sources and see what we can find out. No sense in risking a museum or other buyer low-balling you.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Some American Flyer sites to look at for history and parts:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Flyer
http://www.trainweb.org/crocon/saf.html
http://www.rfgco.com/


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## ross_t (Nov 2, 2018)

Does anyone have a picture of how the wind up motor is attached to the Marx m10000 shell? I have a very clean set, but the wind up mechanism was missing. I bought a used Marc wind up motor, but cant see where it attaches to the shell


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ross,

Up on the main menu, do a Search for M10000 (and M0003, etc.). I think you'll find several thread hits that will have some pics/discussions to help you.

Regards,

TJ


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