# Layout question



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Hi all! I have just got back into this hobby after being away from it since I was a little tyke. This is my first post here, so let me begin with this whopper. To start off with I got a 4 x 8 table to work with. I got the beginner set from Conrail (Walthers DC) and I have Walthers train line DCC on the way. Both come with the Bachmann easy track which I like so far but I see some people have had trouble with it. So I may upgrade as time goes on. 

I am trying to model my layout off from Rigby Yard in South Portland, ME. What I am having trouble with is being able to connect the double wye to come out right. I have a picture of Rigby yard to show what I mean. I plan on getting the turntable and going from there. 










I plan on making as large of a double oval I can on the 4 x 8 table and have the turntable in the middle on the right hand side as close to the double oval as I can and have all the feeder tracks run into the double oval as close as I can get to the real thing. I realize with only a 4 x 8 it will be challenging and I probably won't be able to get every piece of track that's in the yard. But I want to get it as close as possible. 

Anyway...here's a link so you can see the entire layout of Rigby courtesy of Google maps...

https://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF...i=FrGLU8TrE6mysQSx34BQ&sqi=2&ved=0CMkBEPwSMBA

Any ideas/thoughts or telling me this is completely impossible or even if I should use a different brand of track to make this happen would be helpful! Thanks in advance!


----------



## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

Nothing wrong with yard work or ambitious plans.

I'd suggest this bit, just east of the yard.








Those spurs serve or at least did serve various industries in the area...the reason yards exist in the first place.

Without places to go...purpose...I find yards become staging for tail chasing. Not that there is anything wrong with that either, it's your RR. But for me, I find the purpose to be more enjoyable.

YMMV


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Thank you for your input! I like the idea of having a purpose. I know I saw one layout that had a place for the train to load and deliver coal. The possibilities are endless but I do like the working layout plan!


----------



## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

It is going to be very difficult to make that double wye work
in HO on a 4 X 8 table. I assume you have found that the
upper tight curve is your problem area. It must be wide
enough radius to handle whatever loco and cars you intend
to use on it. That means you need about the entire
width of your table. In addition, both the upper and lower tails will
have to be long enuf to handle the longest train you intend
to use it.

To make it even more difficult you are using EZ track. About
the only way you can do it is with flex track.

I have one thought to make that wye work but it is far different
from the actual yard. The access to the wye from the top CROSSES
the access from the bottom instead of curving around. It makes possible
turning a loco or short train though. 

By the way, you will need a Reverse loop controller to power
your wye. Remember, any time a loco can turn around and
go the other way, your tracks will be a short circuit unless you
isolate sections and control the phase (polarity) with a special
controller.

I love yards and wyes. They make train running more fun, especially
if you also have a number of industry spurs.

Don


----------



## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

DonR said:


> I love yards and wyes. They make train running more fun, especially
> if you also have a number of industry spurs.


I'm with you on wyes. Certainly interesting. Yards I can take or leave. If space is a premium I prefer hidden staging and assuming the yard exists "over there".


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

OK...I think I finally came up with an idea. Since the biggest rail related industry here in Maine is oil I want to model my layout after the tank farm. Obviously a 4 x 8 isn't going to be big enough to do the entire thing. But I think I can make a scaled down version of the tank farm work. Here is a pic of the area I am looking at. I believe this is the same section of track the Amtrak Downeaster travels on so I can incorporate that into my design in the future...










I have also read some other ideas like using the tops of spray paint cans for the tank farm as opposed to buying pre-made tank farms. Maybe a combination of both! Gives me something to work with anyway! 

Any ideas or suggestions?


----------



## raleets (Jan 2, 2011)

Tops of spray paint cans will work, but there's LOTS of other options. I suggest you take a slow stroll thru your corner supermarket or Wallymart. You'll discover cans that you never knew existed that would make excellent oil tanks, etc.
Have fun,
Bob


----------



## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

The spray can tops do make ideal tanks. There are tanks
of various sizes in your pic. The larger ones could be
made from coffee cans (do they still use these?) or a cut
down oil can. The more squat ones could be fashioned of
Tuna or Sardine cans. You'd have to glue some material
to the top to give it the smooth look.

There is usually a very elaborate pipe and pumping apparatus
next to the tracks for loading and unloading tank cars. I
don't see it in your pic. It may be out of the frame.

Don


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

DonR said:


> The spray can tops do make ideal tanks. There are tanks
> of various sizes in your pic. The larger ones could be
> made from coffee cans (do they still use these?) or a cut
> down oil can. The more squat ones could be fashioned of
> ...


Are you talking about all this piping?


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Petertherock said:


> Hi all! I have just got back into this hobby after being away from it since I was a little tyke. This is my first post here, so let me begin with this whopper. To start off with I got a 4 x 8 table to work with. I got the beginner set from Conrail (Walthers DC) and I have Walthers train line DCC on the way. Both come with the Bachmann easy track which I like so far but I see some people have had trouble with it. So I may upgrade as time goes on.
> 
> I am trying to model my layout off from Rigby Yard in South Portland, ME. What I am having trouble with is being able to connect the double wye to come out right. I have a picture of Rigby yard to show what I mean. I plan on getting the turntable and going from there.
> 
> ...


That double Y can be accomplished with a couple of #6 or #8 turnouts. You can have two ovals on the 4x8 with the outside oval and 22" curves at each end and 18" curves for the inside track. A crossing to get from one oval to the other will also be accomplished with a couple of #6 or #8 turnouts on both sides of the table. Take the yard lead off the inside oval about 18" back from the curve and build the yard in the middle of the table. After the turntable and the double Y is installed then you can see what room you have left for other structures and industries. You may have to cut some track to get the double y in there. 4x8 is plenty of room for a very busy railroad. Just sit and think about it and try different things with the track BEFORE you nail it down. Keep the pictures coming and have fun. Pete


----------



## wingnut163 (Jan 3, 2013)

the piping; you could use old round ball point pens for them.


----------



## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

Or plastic drinking straws.....


----------



## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*oil reinery piping representation possible methods?*



wingnut163 said:


> the piping; you could use old round ball point pens for them.


 Another method or idea for making pipe representations is to use of course, straws
or wooden dowels and then there is plastic from old plastic model parts/kits/pieces would make fine representations of piping. 
The trouble with oil refinery/storage is it just takes up too much valuable real-estate
on a model railroad. Regards,
tr1


----------



## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Petertherock said:


> Are you talking about all this piping?


No. That piping seems to connect the tanks to what appears to
be a tanker truck filling terminal and to other facilities.

I didn't see in that pic the facilities for loading or unloading
liquids from railroad tank cars.

I hope this long link will work.

https://www.google.com/search?q=rai...productline%2Fsafe-walk%2F1ramps.html;640;480

This is obviously a very large facility. You would want a much small
version of it for your layout. It would be a reason to have tank cars
in your trains.

If it doesn't Google Railroad Tank car loading racks.

Don


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Is it normal for someone to have an idea of what they want for a layout and then have second thoughts and may want to do something completely different? Anyway...if I do go with the tank farm idea here are some pics of the piping it appears they use for the rail cars...


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Petertherock it's perfectly normal to make changes as you go along. As a matter of fact it's not normal to not make changes. Thing is that you should drawyour layout out on graph paper to see if it will fit the table. Then make the changes as you build it. You'll be making changes after you build it too. There is nothing normal about building a railroad,model or for real. Pete


----------



## mustangcobra94 (Apr 28, 2014)

ha ! that's what I always do. I get half way done then change my mind or see something some else has and then rip the layout apart and do it over.


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Well, here's a rough draft of what I came up with. I went with the Rigby yard theme. It's not really close to the actual yard...but I think I will have fun with this...


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

That looks like a lot for a 4x8 but it appears to fit ok. One suggestion- where you have the crossover from the outside track to the middle track you can only go off the outside track. Put another crossover on the opposite side so you can go back onto the outside track. Also the yard area above the turntable probably won't work very well. The extension at the lead in is too short for more than a loco and a short car. That needs to be reconfigured while thinking about how you will move the cars around the yard to make up new trains. Pete
All in all it looks like fun but don't hesitate to make changes if you feel it's needed. pete


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

norgale said:


> That looks like a lot for a 4x8 but it appears to fit ok. One suggestion- where you have the crossover from the outside track to the middle track you can only go off the outside track. Put another crossover on the opposite side so you can go back onto the outside track. Also the yard area above the turntable probably won't work very well. The extension at the lead in is too short for more than a loco and a short car. That needs to be reconfigured while thinking about how you will move the cars around the yard to make up new trains. Pete
> All in all it looks like fun but don't hesitate to make changes if you feel it's needed. pete


OK...I made some changes...Fixed up some of the issues. I also have some room left if I want to put some businesses in. There was a coal loader/unloader I saw that looked interesting. So there are some things I could add in there for scenery and stuff.


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Another interesting plan. Looks more workable than the other one. What radius are the four curves at the left end? Pete


----------



## wcsjr1 (Dec 10, 2012)

If you haven't already purchased/built your table you might try a used ping pong table off of Craigslist. Mine was listed for $20 but it was in worse shape than they thought so offered it for free for hauling it away. You can easily get two ovals using 22" curves and have more room for your yard. I did not pattern my layout after anything just tried to cram in as much as I could. It is still a work in progress. I don't find current pictures but now I have three outer loops with the track to the turntable and to the yard coming off of the inner passing lane that in this picture goes to the turntable by adding a few more #4 turnouts. I use two double controllers to operate the three loops and the yard.


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Here's what I came up with for a final layout...I figured it out based on Atlas's web site it's about $540 worth of track...so it will take me a while to get that together!


----------



## jesteck (Apr 15, 2014)

You might be able to save yourself a fair chunk of change by using flex track throughout instead of all of those sectional curves and straights. Gives you more design flexibility, too. Track plans are suggestions; they aren't etched in stone. Turnouts are another story; some are better than others, some worse- far worse. My personal preferences are Atlas flex track and PECO insulfrog turnouts; I'm sure others will disagree loudly. Hear them all out before you decide. After all, it's what you will be running ALL your trains on for a long time, whether they are a Tyco toy train set with horn-hook couplers for 80 bucks or a more advanced consist with $300 and up engines and $50 cars. In the long run, track and turnouts will be your smallest investment and have the greatest impact on your enjoyment. Choose them carefully and well.


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Good advice there. Pete


----------



## Northern Route (May 12, 2014)

Just a thought, you have an Atlas turntable shown on your layout. I am guessing it is for turning the switcher, If you are planning to use the Atlas turntable and it looks like you have room for a little larger turntable, I suggest using a Walthers 933-3171 turntable kit w/o motor. It is only 3 inches in diameter larger and you won't have to listen to the motor and drive train and wait forever for it to turn and stop at every setting to turn the engine around. Plus it looks a whole lot better and you can motorize it if you want, and there is a lot pricier DCC version also.


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Here's my final (maybe) draft of the layout I want. I am thinking of using Atlas Tru-track system. 










On the right hand side is going to be the ocean...kind of modeled after the South Portland, Maine tank farms. As you can see the tracks are bridges on the right. On the left hand side I am thinking of some kind of coal industry. Also including a tunnel on the left corner just to make it interesting!


----------



## mustangcobra94 (Apr 28, 2014)

sounds like a good plan. I like all the bridges on the right. good luck!!!


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

Thanks...I just think the triple oval would be too much for a 4 x 8 table while leaving room for scenery stuff.


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

I just ordered the track. I will be using the Atlas Tru-track system. I can't wait to get started! I think some of the track is on back order so I may have to wait a little while but at least it's ordered!


----------



## mustangcobra94 (Apr 28, 2014)

never seen anyone use tru-track let us know how it turns out and post some pics of it.


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

No problem...I went with the Atlas tru track over the Bachmann snap track because I like with the Atlas you can take the road bed off and just use the track if you want. Not that I will take the road bed off but it's nice to have the flexibility.


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Are you sure about the name "tru-track"? Isn't that the wooden track bed with the rails nailed to it? Pete


----------



## Petertherock (May 29, 2014)

norgale said:


> Are you sure about the name "tru-track"? Isn't that the wooden track bed with the rails nailed to it? Pete


You're right...it's indeed "true-track."

http://www.atlasrr.com/trackmisc/hotruetrack.htm


----------



## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

Ok the wooden track bed is by Tru-Scale. Atlas' track is True- Track. Had to go look that up. Pete


----------

