# Is it important to have matching loco and cars (railroad co specific)?



## drabina (Mar 19, 2013)

I have no idea if I have phrased the title correctly. What I would like to know is, if it is important to match loco and cars to run under a specific railroad company name. I am working on a fictional layout with a small town, one station and one industry. The layout is so small that it is going to have only one loco with 3 cars for the industry and 2 for the station.

I am new to this hobby so when I am looking at the cars, I am going for the look and not a specific railroad company name. Am I asking for a ban from the forum from the hobby purists? 

Thanks.


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## raleets (Jan 2, 2011)

The very short answer is NO. When you watch a real train going down the line you will see cars from many, many different roads not just from the "local area"
However, in the model railroading world there is one basic rule that you must ALWAYS follow:
Rule #1 - It's YOUR railroad. You can do with it whatever the heck you want.
Rule #2 - Refer to Rule #1

Nuff' said,
Bob


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

not important to match. now if your doing a passenger train that is of the railroad you are doing then ya i would match those, unless of coarse it's a tourist railroad to which they use whatever they can get their couplers attached to.


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## raleets (Jan 2, 2011)

Yep, I forgot about passenger trains.  I'm running a 13-car Amtrak consist and all the cars match perfectly (Phase II).
Otherwise, you can be as creative as you desire. :thumbsup:


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## Carl (Feb 19, 2012)

It seems that all railroads are a mix. Amtrak does run only Amtrak passenger cars.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

In general, the locomotive and caboose will match, but the rolling stock for freight trains can be most anything and still be prototypical. For passenger trains, it's a bit more rigid, but I've seen some mixing of types go by. Specifically, the Amtrak stuff I've seen several styles of passenger cars on the same consist. They were all Amtrak cars, but not all the same type.


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## raleets (Jan 2, 2011)

Yep #2.........I'm running two freight trains. One is a CN with a CN caboose.
The other is a Conrail with a Conrail caboose. Silly me, I'm just fussy!
I also have a little D&GTW steamer with all cars matching, including the caboose.
But, back to Rule #1..............:laugh: :laugh:


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## drabina (Mar 19, 2013)

Thanks for all the replies. Good to know that I can mix and match the cars. Makes my rolling stock selection a bit easier.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

drabina said:


> I am new to this hobby so when I am looking at the cars, I am going for the look and not a specific railroad company name. Am I asking for a ban from the forum from the hobby purists?
> Thanks.


Do what you like it is your RR! 
Don't let anyone tell you different.

Have you been banned from another site for asking this?

Some sites are funny like that, this one is not.
Heck someone once said that a site told him to come here for answers because his questions were to basic/simple and not worth the time for them to answer.
Sites like that I don't need. :thumbsdown:

We might laugh a little at some questions, but none are stupid here.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Come on Ed, that's not likely. What kind of lame site would ban someone for asking a perfectly legitimate question?

You're right about one thing, sites like that I don't need either!


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## ktcards (Sep 22, 2012)

Back in the day, I've seen mixed Pennsylvania passenger trains. Some were maroon colored cars while others were the more modern stainless steel cars all mixed together in the same train.
As for freight there could be any road name mixed in just the engine, and if you have one, the caboose share the same name. Rolling stock was shifted from road to road depending on the destination of the freight they carried, and many of the boxcars were privately owned by investors and leased to the railroads as needed.

Ray


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Come on Ed, that's not likely. What kind of lame site would ban someone for asking a perfectly legitimate question?
> 
> You're right about one thing, sites like that I don't need either!



It could happen.

If he asked and they ridiculed him about it and he answered !%$#*@^# back I would imagine someone would ban him.
I know you would if he cussed you out. 

So....Master John, it could happen.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Do what you like and want, it's yours after all! Don't be worried what others think, just have fun! Grj what other site did they ban Ed from?!?!


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Let's see, tomorrow the list will include MTF, don't know about the others.


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## drabina (Mar 19, 2013)

Thanks again for all the replies. No, I wasn't banned from another forum. I am new to the hobby and was curious if there are any rules that most of you follow that I may not be aware of.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

drabina said:


> I am new to the hobby and was curious if there are any rules that most of you follow that I may not be aware of.


Goodness, when we start getting that picky, just take me out back and shoot me!


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

ktcards said:


> Back in the day, I've seen mixed Pennsylvania passenger trains. Some were maroon colored cars while others were the more modern stainless steel cars all mixed together in the same train.


But they would all be PRR.

Except in _specific_ exception cases of pool trains where multiple roads provide equipment, or leased equipment to cover a shortage, etc., passenger trains would be equipment from all one road.

After Amtrak first started, you'd see equipment from all over mixed into the same train, but that equipment had all been transferred to Amtrak by the original roads, and it took a while to repaint it all.



ktcards said:


> As for freight there could be any road name mixed in just the engine, and if you have one, the caboose share the same name. Rolling stock was shifted from road to road depending on the destination of the freight they carried, and many of the boxcars were privately owned by investors and leased to the railroads as needed.
> 
> Ray


This is called interchange.

If a boxcar of stuff is loaded in California on the BNSF with a destination in New York on CSX, BNSF hauls the car as far as they can, and then hands off the entire car to CSX to complete the journey, rather than unloading the stuff and reloading it into a CSX car. In this fashion, freight cars from many different railroads will end up in a single train.

Cabooses will not transfer from one railroad to another; they would only be used on trains of their own railroad. (Exceptions to this would be uncommon and very specific situations. For example, I've seen a photo of a CN caboose on the Algoma Central Railway; this was dated less than a year before CN built half a dozen steel cabooses for the AC, so this must have been provided as a demonstrator.)

Locomotives will exchange between railroads a bit more than cabooses; there are several specific cases. One is "run-through power", where an entire train from one railroad gets interchanged to another, engines and all. A crew from the railroad B takes over, and it becomes their train, not one from railroad A anymore, even though it has their engines.

(This looks similar from trackside, but is quite different in practice, to "Trackage rights", where Railroad A has an agreement with Railroad B to pay for use of a portion of their tracks, and a Railroad A train with Railroad A crew runs over Railroad B.)

Another variation of run-through power might see Railroad A and B have an agreement to pool power on a specific train. So this train would typically have a mix of engines from A and B.

On these run-through and pool situations, the "foreign" power is only to be used on these specific trains.

Now, at certain regular intervals, an accounting is made for how much power is spending how much time on other railroads, and any significant imbalance is repaid, usually by Railroad B provided one or more of their engines to Railroad A for a specified period of time. This is known as "horsepower-hours (or HPH) repayment". To greatly simplify, let's say that during a certain period, 10 engines from railroad A spent one day each on Railroad B, and 2 engines from Railroad B spent 2 days each on railroad A. The net result is that railroad B owes 6 "engine-days" to railroad A. So they provide 2 engines for 3 days to repay the imbalance. These engines are for all intents and purposes, Railroad A's to do with as they please for those 3 days. This is where things get particularly interesting, as an engine from Railroad C on Horsepower-Hour repayment to Railroad A could end up on that run-through train on Railroad B. 

The last case of course is Railroad A directly renting or leasing an engine from Railroad B or one of the big leasing companies to cover a power shortage. Here money changes hands directly and these engines don't count towards HPH.

Probably a lot more than you wanted to know, but now you understand the basics of how and why freight cars and engines from other railroads can be seen on a train.


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## Don Trinko (Oct 23, 2012)

I'm in the " it's your railroad...." camp. This is a diverse hobby. Me; I like to watch the train go round and round making various noises. Don


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

All of my trains match. I do not mix them.


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

They are all HO.

Other then that I mix them any way i want.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Let's see, tomorrow the list will include MTF, don't know about the others.


You better have a good reason, or else I will sue you.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

big ed said:


> You better have a good reason, or else I will sue you.


Hold on, I have to make a tweak of the board rules so I'm covered. :laugh:

You can't fight City Hall.


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

Anyone that ridicules anyone else on their own fantasy version of a railroad needs to get the stick out of their........

If it feels good, then do it. Real RR companies even borrow/lease engines from other companies. I see BNSF & UP engines mixed with CSX, and NS with CP all the time here in MI.

I buy what *I* think looks cool.


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## dannyrandomstate (Jan 1, 2012)

That's the beauty of the hobby. You can do what you please. It's not a garden party. 

"But it's all right now 
I learned my lesson well 
You see you can't please ev'ryone so 
You got to please yourself"


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

drabina said:


> Thanks again for all the replies. No, I wasn't banned from another forum. I am new to the hobby and was curious if there are any rules that most of you follow that I may not be aware of.


The only rule I see is that the mods are always right,  
if you agree with them all the time you should be fine. 

But them again, you do have a constitutional right to disagree, just disagree in a calm manner. 

How come such a small RR?
What are you planning a 2'x2' table?
What scale are you going to use? N scale?


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

big ed said:


> But them again, you do have a constitutional right to disagree, just disagree in a calm manner.


Obviously you haven't visited the Forum Rules link lately. A small clip FYI. 

*As a privately owned and financed forum we are not subject to "Freedom of Speech" legislation.*


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

That's why he said to do it in a calm manner. See big eds rule #1 the mods are aalways right!


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

All so in the rules somewhere.

"Administrators or Moderators of The Model Train Forum reserve the right to adjudicate, and take ANY actions we deem appropriate,............ An Administrator's decision in any matter referred to him/her is final. "


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

That brings me to rule #2 see rule # 1.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Are we having fun yet?


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

*More from the rules*

"Off-topic posts are inevitable and can be fun but these should be kept to a minimum so as not to cause too much distraction or disrupt the flow of the threads. "Hijacking" a thread for another purpose is not acceptable and any such posts will be deleted without notice or explanation."


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## Gansett (Apr 8, 2011)

Just want to thank Chris for his info filled post before Maxwell swings his silver hammer and the thread goes <poof>

"If a boxcar of stuff is loaded in California on the BNSF with a destination in New York on CSX, BNSF hauls the car as far as they can, and then hands off the entire car to CSX to complete the journey, rather than unloading the stuff and reloading it into a CSX car. In this fashion, freight cars from many different railroads will end up in a single train."

Question, how does the car get back to BNSF? Could NS pick it up with a load for Fla? Does BNSF get a rental/use fee? Who pays for any required maintance?

How did RR'S keep track of their rolling stock prior to computers?


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

A long... long... time ago, I worked for IBM, and one of my accounts was Reading RailRoad. At that time, the RR was charged a days rent for any other company's cars that were on it's rails at midnight each day. So, there was obviously an effort to move the empties onto someone else's rails before midnight, sometimes it was quite a scramble! 

Taking this to it's logical conclusion, eventually they'd make their way back to the owning RR I would guess.


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

JackC said:


> Question, how does the car get back to BNSF?


When unloaded NS sends it back in the reverse direction towards the railroad that owns the car. *It's possible that it's not BNSF (see next question). It could also be a free-running "pool" car like Railbox. In which case NS can send it anywhere.



JackC said:


> Could NS pick it up with a load for Fla?


Unless the car is a specially equipped car assigned to a particular service, NS can definitely load it with something headed in the general direction of home. Sending it to Florida (the opposite direction) would be discouraged.



JackC said:


> Does BNSF get a rental/use fee?


Yes. This used to be a per diem, based on who held the car at midnight. Today this is called "car hire" and is hourly.



JackC said:


> Who pays for any required maintance?


BNSF. From what I understand, the AAR has an agreed upon table of standard rates for regular running repairs. NS would perform light repairs to keep the car running and send the bill to BNSF. Anything outside of the standard would probably have the car sent home for repair or be handled on a case by case basis. The Official Railway Equipment Registers always had notes at the bottom of each railroad's equipment listing indicating where to address bills (or payments) for repairs.



JackC said:


> How did RR'S keep track of their rolling stock prior to computers?


A small army of clerks and a lot of paper. And your most current complete information might be lagging several days if not weeks behind. Certainly "real time" was not an expectation back then.

Many decisions were made on a much more local basis, and car utilization would have been a lot lower than today with all the precise nation-wide tracking.


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## drabina (Mar 19, 2013)

Wow, that whole conversation turned out to a great resource of information on how the RRs operate their business. More than I was asking for but thanks for the detailed explanation guys.


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