# Differences in DCC Sound Locomotives



## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

I'm completely confused / stumped on the differences between the DCC sound locos that you purchase ready to run. I.e. whats the pros and cons of Walthers Proto Soundtraxx Tsunami vs Bachmann Sound Value SoundTraxx vs Kato ESU Lok Sound. I'd love a consise table to lay out their features, pros and cons. Also will any of these 'drive' better than another one such as at low speed. 

Note: I do like the detail level on Walthers Proto and would be willing to go to any other company with similar detail.

Thanks a million.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

Seems like LokSound gives very very good motor control, thoughts?


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## Mark R. (Jan 26, 2013)

Loksound pretty much wins the bet with superior motor control. Their sounds are also a few steps ahead of the competition as well, not to mention how the sounds function. The Loksound decoders in OEM engines are the exact same full-featured versions that are available as an individual purchase - they are not some stripped down version like the Soundtraxx Sound value.

Mark.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

Gotcha. Guess I should pony up the difference and get Loksound over the competition.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

I have several Tsunamis and they are great. The Bachmann sound value locos feature a cut down version with fewer features but should sound similar if not the same. General consensus seems to be Loksound have better motor control, but for me the Soundtraxx models are very acceptable. The ESU horns sound better but I've heard their motor sound described as crap! I've just orders one so ill let you know my verdict in due course. In the meantime you can check out some comparisons on youtube and see what you think. In actuality the difference is minimal.

BTW ESU and Lenz both offer great non sound decoders with excellent motor control. Lenz have a neat 'switching' feature, by pressing F3 the motor speed is halved.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

Cycleops said:


> I have several Tsunamis and they are great. The Bachmann sound value locos feature a cut down version with fewer features but should sound similar if not the same. General consensus seems to be Loksound have better motor control, but for me the Soundtraxx models are very acceptable. The ESU horns sound better but I've heard their motor sound described as crap! I've just orders one so ill let you know my verdict in due course. In the meantime you can check out some comparisons on youtube and see what you think. In actuality the difference is minimal.
> 
> BTW ESU and Lenz both offer great non sound decoders with excellent motor control. Lenz have a neat 'switching' feature, by pressing F3 the motor speed is halved.


That's interesting on the Tsunamis / LokSound.

I'm looking at either:

http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/Intermountain-HO-49106S-01-F3A-GN-p/imr-49106s-01.htm

-or-

http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/Walthers-Proto-HO-EMD-F3A-SF-p/920-41276.htm

Wondering if there really isn't that much difference in motor control and / or motor control. Thanks for all the info. Really appreciate it.

Anyone else want to weigh in between the two?


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## Mark R. (Jan 26, 2013)

Cycleops said:


> .... In actuality the difference is minimal.
> 
> BTW ESU and Lenz both offer great non sound decoders with excellent motor control. Lenz have a neat 'switching' feature, by pressing F3 the motor speed is halved.


Save that opinion until you have one of each to compare - I think you'll find a HUGE difference. 

ESU has that same "switching" feature as well.

The biggest difference between the two sound-wise is how the sounds are controlled. For one example, when you quickly shut down the throttle, the Tsunami sits there while the engine continues to notch down to idle - Loksound goes right straight to idle. Loksound's sound to movement is spot on.

Mark.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

Thanks for the info Mark. Just watched a review of a P42 which is offered in both. Loksound sounds better and was told to be smoother at slow speeds. 

Here's the video 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqUwPYc3Gb4


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## Brakeman Jake (Mar 8, 2009)

I purchase the locomotive I want and install a Tsunami myself...it involves a little work and cost more also but I don't get the frustration I read all the time about the crippled Soundtraxx decoders manufacturers install to appeal to uninformed modelers.

These aren't Tsunamis,though made by Soundtraxx.Reliability isn't the issue though,they just don't do all the nice things full featured Tsunamis do and are a deception to modelers who try to have them match the performance of other Tsunamis they already own or have seen....they simply won't do it.

I've read great comments about Locksound decoders but also read that they need their own programming hardware (Lockprogrammer) to configure them.That may be acceptable for a fleet but quite costly for a single engine.

BLI's Paragon 2 are nice and program with regular programming hardware.I've had two that I liked.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

Brakeman Jake said:


> These aren't Tsunamis,though made by Soundtraxx.Reliability isn't the issue though,they just don't do all the nice things full featured Tsunamis do and are a deception to modelers who try to have them match the performance of other Tsunamis they already own or have seen....they simply won't do it.


Well, you cant expect an economy version to be the same as the full featured product, that's just not reasonable. Same as when buying a car, a base model wont have the features a top of the range version will have. In the case of sound decoders were discussing here the cut down version will still sound very similar to the stand alone product so representing good value for money imho.


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

I look at it this way and this is just my opinion. The decoder with the best sound and motor control is only the best for some people. The one with the worst sound and motor control may be the best for others. There is a third pair of factors that is huge when considering all of these, price and budget. If you have X dollars and want sound then the Bachmann with the econo version of the Soundtraxx decoder may be best for you if you can accept the limitations. This may not be acceptable for those that can afford the other. 

I look at it as the one that gives the best performance and quality within your budget is the best for you provided that you can accept any draw backs that this may bring.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

That's very true tkruger. What do they say? Horses for courses.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

I'm torn between these too. Like the look of the proto but like the motor ability of the loksound with IM

https://www.modeltrainstuff.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=IMR-49106S-04&CartID=7

http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/Walthers-Proto-HO-F7A-GN-p/920-40704.htm


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

smarcus3 said:


> I'm torn between these too. Like the look of the proto but like the motor ability of the loksound with IM.


Write the references on two pieces of paper, put in hat, close eyes and pull out one. Whatever you get you'll not be disappointed!


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

smarcus3 said:


> I'm torn between these too. Like the look of the proto but like the motor ability of the loksound with IM


No looser there. I like the paint on the Intermountain better but that is only because I am not a fan of the silver trucks. Then again I have other Walthers models and they perform great.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

Gotcha. Thanks for all the input. I do like the Walthers detail a bunch.


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

This topic is kinda tough. Sound, and what's better.? I find everyone has differences in how they like sound. For me I like clear sound ( good high notes ) , and I also like bass. ( the low frequency note ). That said , I have tsunami locos that sound pretty good, and I have a broadway limited paragon 2 sound loco, that I find is extremely good in the sound department . I love the high and low notes the paragon 2 locomotives put out. However this is just my opinion, ( it's what my ears hear, and want to hear ). And then there's motor control . I find both tsunami and the paragon 2 ( broadway limited ) decoders do very well in this area . Now I'm sure there are many other decoders out there that are great too. These are the only 2 decoders I've worked with so far. Hope this helps a tad bit. Oh and let me add the broadway limited locos have excellent detail. Good day, and happy railing ....


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

alaska railroad said:


> This topic is kinda tough. Sound, and what's better.? I find everyone has differences in how they like sound. For me I like clear sound ( good high notes ) , and I also like bass. ( the low frequency note ). That said , I have tsunami locos that sound pretty good, and I have a broadway limited paragon 2 sound loco, that I find is extremely good in the sound department . I love the high and low notes the paragon 2 locomotives put out. However this is just my opinion, ( it's what my ears hear, and want to hear ). And then there's motor control . I find both tsunami and the paragon 2 ( broadway limited ) decoders do very well in this area . Now I'm sure there are many other decoders out there that are great too. These are the only 2 decoders I've worked with so far. Hope this helps a tad bit. Oh and let me add the broadway limited locos have excellent detail. Good day, and happy railing ....


Appreciate the input. I've been looking at Broadway Limited as well. Definetly love the detail and the radio chatter on their Paragon2. Very very cool for sure.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

The only problem with sound is that once you've experienced it its very hard to go back to silent railroading!


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

While I have a BLI Paragon3 loco, I haven't gotten the receiver/sub woofer for it yet. I went a train show yesterday and BLI had a booth there with that system setup. The sound definitely can be felt as well as heard. Far better than what can had from just the loco. Since it covers frequencies below 600 hz, it is much more realistic. As more of their upgrade decoders become available, I will be retrofitting the rest of my BLI locos.


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

JerryH said:


> While I have a BLI Paragon3 loco, I haven't gotten the receiver/sub woofer for it yet. I went a train show yesterday and BLI had a booth there with that system setup. The sound definitely can be felt as well as heard. Far better than what can had from just the loco. Since it covers frequencies below 600 hz, it is much more realistic. As more of their upgrade decoders become available, I will be retrofitting the rest of my BLI locos.


Yes, i see broadway has the paragon 3 rolling thunder locos now. I would like to hear this some day. I'm sure it will be great. I hope it sounds outstanding for you. ☺


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

I decided to go with a BLI Paragon3 Loco. I'll let everyone know what I think. It was dumb expensive, but wanted to get one which I wouldn't want to replace later.


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

smarcus3 said:


> I decided to go with a BLI Paragon3 Loco. I'll let everyone know what I think. It was dumb expensive, but wanted to get one which I wouldn't want to replace later.


Nice,good luck.did you also purchase the sub woofer system for it ?
🚥 🚂🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

Just the receiver only as I work as a speaker project manager so I've got plenty of subwoofers lying around.  

The thing that sold me with that one was it has great looking smoke + Sound + Sub which makes the price more palatable. Retrofitting a Paragon2 --> 3 costs ~$125 so just wanted to go for it off the bat. I'll be sure to take a video of it and show with and without subwoofer though the only way I can record video is with my phone or my D7000 which may not be able to pickup the low frequencies but I will test prior to posting.


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

smarcus3 said:


> Just the receiver only as I work as a speaker project manager so I've got plenty of subwoofers lying around.
> 
> The thing that sold me with that one was it has great looking smoke + Sound + Sub which makes the price more palatable. Retrofitting a Paragon2 --> 3 costs ~$125 so just wanted to go for it off the bat. I'll be sure to take a video of it and show with and without subwoofer though the only way I can record video is with my phone or my D7000 which may not be able to pickup the low frequencies but I will test prior to posting.


I agree with the smoke, sound, and the retrofitting you mentioned. I am going to have to witness the paragon 3 some day in person, I think it will be awesome. ( Good day and happy railing .)


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

alaska railroad said:


> I agree with the smoke, sound, and the retrofitting you mentioned. I am going to have to witness the paragon 3 some day in person, I think it will be awesome. ( Good day and happy railing .)


Gotcha. Glad I wasn't the only one with that mindset. Just seemed stupid to get a $120 sound steam loco then wanting steam paying $200 for it then wanting more and paying for it again. Just easier to do it once even if its a larger initial cost but cheaper in the long run. 

I'm really hoping it is awesome, got my fingers crossed.


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## alaska railroad (Oct 20, 2015)

smarcus3 said:


> Gotcha. Glad I wasn't the only one with that mindset. Just seemed stupid to get a $120 sound steam loco then wanting steam paying $200 for it then wanting more and paying for it again. Just easier to do it once even if its a larger initial cost but cheaper in the long run.
> 
> I'm really hoping it is awesome, got my fingers crossed.


Totally agree . Plus it's ready to run, you don't have to spend time making it into the loco you wanted in the first place. For me I'm always afraid of breaking something taking locos apart. They are so extremely fragile . Expecially locos with such high detail.


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## santafealltheway (Nov 27, 2012)

alaska railroad said:


> Yes, i see broadway has the paragon 3 rolling thunder locos now. I would like to hear this some day. I'm sure it will be great. I hope it sounds outstanding for you. ☺


just get the reciever and a sub woofer from a thrift store.

the one they sell is REALLY stupid. You could get an old sony for 8 bucks.


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## smarcus3 (Feb 15, 2016)

santafealltheway said:


> just get the reciever and a sub woofer from a thrift store.
> 
> the one they sell is REALLY stupid. You could get an old sony for 8 bucks.


I'd never buy theirs since I develop speakers for a living.


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