# Trucks and Couplers



## jfrye (Feb 4, 2015)

Im new to the site here. So a little history before I get to the questions. I currently have an old train set from the 70's. It has a few Tyco cars, with 1 of 3 working locomotive. It was my dads when he was little, and passed down to me about 20 years ago. I dug it out a few days ago, after it sitting in the closet for probably 15 years. It brought back memories, and I have decided that I want to get more in depth in this hobby.




These are currently the trucks/couplers that are on all of the freight cars. I was wanting to start changing out the plastic wheels to metal ones. I also read that Kadee couplers are the way to go. But with the current trucks/couplers being one peice, with little pins that "snap" into the freight cars, I was hoping someone could point me in the direction of a tutorial on how to change all this stuff over.

Here is an image of the current trucks/couplers.










It appears though, that most of the trucks now attach like the following picture.









I read that these trucks attatch with #2 or 2-56 screws, but will those just thread into the holes where the older style "snap" in?



Also, when going to the metal wheels, does it matter which ones I choose? I have no decided yet if I will use Code 83 or Code 100 track, but if the wheels matter I will wait to buy those until I have chose the track code to use.


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

Most high quality metal wheels have the RP25 profile, so you should be good with any rail size you use. Now, wheel diameter should be paid attention to......older rolling stock used 33" wheels.....larger, more modern cars such as grain hoppers use 36" dia wheels.

Don't have an answer for the truck attaching........but those all-in-one trucks gotta go.....


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## wvgca (Jan 21, 2013)

you can still use those trucks if you choose to , just cut off the coupler shank so it looks the same front / back .. then add kadee or similar couplers on the the body, a height gauge will come in handy ... you can then change out the wheelsets later on as budget allows .. with either normal .100 width or newer style .088 or semi scale width .. if your track work is half decent there should be no problems with the semi scale sets, try converting a couple of cars and test them first..if you want to update the trucks, the easiest is to glue in a short length of styrene pipe into the holes where the snapin pins go now, to reduce the size for 2-56 screws, and lightly sand old and new flush ..cost for kadee couplers under $2/ car, metal wheels [in bulk] around $3 /car, same for trucks [bare] depending on brand and style..my era is 1890 so I use mostly tichy glue together archbar trucks, but decided on intermountain .088 wheelsets, they are plain back and I 'should' have rib back for my era, but didn't care for the kadee rib back metal wheels.. personal choice..rolling stock that seldom moves just got upgraded couplers mostly, plastic wheels do come in different qualities, found some with brass / steel axles and brown wheels that work better than most plastic, no idea of brand..


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

I have converted several Tyco cars. I generally replace the plastic wheels with metal ones. I keep the same trucks. The original Tyco ones seem to work well with the new wheels unlike the Life Like ones that tend to not allow the metal wheels to spin freely. I have found it is cheapest to buy metal wheels in bulk packs of 100 or more.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

When you go to buy the replacement couplers look for
the Kadee #148. This is the easiest to assemble and
install. It uses tiny wires on the shank for lateral
centering. You'll absolutely need the Kadee coupler
alignment 'tool'. Get the insulated on you can use
on a 'live' track.

If #148 is not available you can use their # 5 which
uses a brass 'box' with springy sides to center the
coupler. It works as well as the 148 but is more
tricky to assemble.

The Kadee tool has three important vertical alignment
factors:

1. Shows if car body is at right height for attaching the
draft box.
2. Shows if installed coupler is correct height.
3. Shows that the 'hose' is at correct height, so it doesn't
snag on turnout points.

Don


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## jfrye (Feb 4, 2015)

May sound dumb, but if all new trucks, couplers and wheels are replaced, is it required to have the different size wheels?

I just want to do it right the first time, so if buying the two different size wheels is necessary then I'll make sure to do that.

As for inserting the pipe to take the 2-56 screws, what size would I need? 

And what's the difference in all these trucks? Some look like the mounting hole sits lower to the rails, while some look like they sit up higher, closer to the car.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

In general, most freight cars run on 33" wheels and
most passenger cars use 36" wheels. The longer
heavier freight cars,if over a certain tonnage, will
also use 36" wheels in many cases.

You can clearly tell them apart when compared 
next to each other.

I don't know the diameter of the hole that Tyco
used. When I had to replace a truck because one
of those barbs broke off and the truck would no
longer stay on the car, I simply sanded down a
small dowel I had on hand.

It's very important when changing to screw on
trucks that you get the hole in the dowel exactly
in the center else the car will not run in a straight
line.

Don


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Unfortunately, doing it right the first time may mean that you have to get rid of the garbage trucks. By the time you've replaced everything that's wrong with them (truck mounted hook horn couplers, plastic wheels, plastic king post with clips) you may as well replace the entire truck.

Like Don, I have had some success drilling out the plastic king post and replacing it with something better. I used small carriage bolts with a dab of Loctite to keep the nut from coming off. But that's a lot of hassle for a substandard truck.


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## jfrye (Feb 4, 2015)

I was wanting to replace the trucks anyways. In my set I have now, I can't use half of the cars bc the tabs on the trucks are broke. I'm not using these cars in the new setup, but they would be good ones to practice on. 

So yes, I am wanting to learn how to replace trucks, wheels, couplers everything. I just wasn't sure how to attach the new trucks when all they have is a hole in the center, and not the snap in tabs that I currently have.


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

I find Accurail trucks are nicely detailed, and don't cost an arm & a leg....

http://www.accurail.com/accurail/parts.htm


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## Mr. SP (Jan 7, 2015)

*Trucks & Couplers*

In the case of Tyco and Bachmann it will be necessary to fill in the hole where the truck snaps in with styrene rod that should be cemented in place. Then drill and tap for a 2-56 screw
I use ONLY Kadee couplers and trucks


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## wvgca (Jan 21, 2013)

here's a link to a conversion guide for exactly what you are thinking of doing... from making tracks, who also happen to sell [at a great value] the parts you need to do this... this is where i buy my kadee couplers, and intermountain wheelsets..
http://ezbizwebsite.com/SupplementalInfo/Modeling/Rolling Stock/Toy to Model Conversions.pdf


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## rvnmedic6869 (Oct 29, 2019)

The 


wvgca said:


> here's a link to a conversion guide for exactly what you are thinking of doing... from making tracks, who also happen to sell [at a great value] the parts you need to do this... this is where i buy my kadee couplers, and intermountain wheelsets..
> http://ezbizwebsite.com/SupplementalInfo/Modeling/Rolling Stock/Toy to Model Conversions.pdf


The link is outdated, but if you click on the "check for original reference" or something like that. It triggered a great app called the "Wayback Machine". It searched for a couple of minutes and then on the search line two bright lines appeared. I clicked on one and it then found this original PDF, I was able to save it and print it. 

I'm starting back with HO from 50 years ago and made the mistake of buying ten Tyco UP boxcars (new). I could use them connected with their horn hooks and have a car with the horn hook on one end to add these to the end of a consist. Or, go to the trouble of converting all of them to Kadee couplers and trucks,
Cheers, Bob


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

Why change them? Build a train layout first. Hook everything up and see if you like things. I have many train cars with those trucks, they work fine in a long freight train with good track work. And by the way, you may spend more money upgrading instead of buying new.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

*ALSO IMPORTANT* : If you don't change out the wheels the ones in top pic have extremely deep, out of scale flanges we call pizza cutters. You can not go code 83 track with these wheels as the flanges will collide with the simulated spike heads... Either go code 100, or replace wheels with RP25s for c83..
If you go c100 make sure the switches have metal, *powerable* frogs..If plastic, trains may stall out over them...And avoid the old Atlas c100 track with the black plastic ties..Their matching switches (TOs) *are* plastic frogs...and the tie dimensions are out of scale (if that matters to you)..


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

If these new posts are intended to help the OP, then you definitely missed the train. This post is from 2015, and the OP hasn't been back since 3 days after he posted this...


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

*We can thank* *rvnmedic6869 for setting us up resurrecting an old thread.

Now in case I forget I took the bait, can we lock the thread ( I don't need any more senior moments)? *


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

telltale said:


> *ALSO IMPORTANT* : If you don't change out the wheels the ones in top pic have extremely deep, out of scale flanges we call pizza cutters. You can not go code 83 track with these wheels as the flanges will collide with the simulated spike heads... Either go code 100, or replace wheels with RP25s for c83..


That's not universally true. I have ME code 70 track that even the oldest of my Tyco cars can roll smoothly on. On the other hand, my Tyco 0-4-0 from the 70's has pizza-cutters that will ride slightly on the ties (enough that you can feel it when sliding the loco, but not hear it when it's running). You really have to test cars on a case-by-case basis to know what will work and what won't.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

*S*, that's because ME spike heads are scale size .. I was talking Atlas which has out of scale, large spike heads and tie plates on their flex..Oddly enough, though, Atlas *sectional* track has near correct size plates and spikes. I believe the flex needs the heavier ones to withstand the outward pressure against them when *their* flex is bent...🛤🌄🌵


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

Ah ok, probably a big difference. I'm surprised anyone still uses Atlas, it's not like their product is substantially cheaper than the quality products from other companies.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

It may be due to how their flex bends automatically to a perfect curve..With ME don't you have to give it special attention to do that ? And if Atlas flex is say, $6.00 each now, I'd take a guess ME must be nearing $8.00, no ? And I believe ME switches must be hovering around $35..when Atlas are $25..These may be the factors....


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

Well whenever I order a 6-pack of ME flex track, the price is between $30-$34 for standard gauge or $36-$38 for dual-gauge. Shipping adds another $8 or so, which can put the cost up to around $7 per track. But if you weren't counting shipping in the cost of the Atlas track, then that means the ME track is in the same price range as Atlas.

Recently (in the last 5 years) I've only ordered one Shinohara #6 turnout which cost $20 from ebay (new in package). I've hand-laid every other turnout since then so I'm not really familiar with the pricing. Before that the last time I bought a turnout it was an Atlas snap-switch and only cost $15 including the solenoid.

[EDIT] Actually I just found my last order of 12x pieces of ME standard gauge from modeltrainstuff. Including shipping, the total came to $70.76, so about $5.90 per piece of flex track.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

telltale said:


> It may be due to how their flex bends automatically to a perfect curve..With ME don't you have to give it special attention to do that ? And if Atlas flex is say, $6.00 each now, I'd take a guess ME must be nearing $8.00, no ? And I believe ME switches must be hovering around $35..when Atlas are $25..These may be the factors....


ME flex track, code 83, available today at MicroMark for $35 for a 6 pack ($28.50 if you order 3 or more packs).

And comparing a ME turnout to an Atlas one is like comparing a Ferrari to a Kia.

Yes, you have to shape it... but that's one of the things I like about it: it stays where you put it.


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## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

OP is dated Feb, 2015?


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

LateStarter said:


> OP is dated Feb, 2015?


Well, yes, it is, and I posted that a when someone made the rookie mistake of resurrecting it, but people seem inclined to post anyway, so why not participate.


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## beepjuice (Sep 17, 2014)

wvgca said:


> here's a link to a conversion guide for exactly what you are thinking of doing... from making tracks, who also happen to sell [at a great value] the parts you need to do this... this is where i buy my kadee couplers, and intermountain wheelsets..
> http://ezbizwebsite.com/SupplementalInfo/Modeling/Rolling Stock/Toy to Model Conversions.pdf


Another way to fill the hole would be JB Weld, let it dry and then drill the right hole.


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## 65446 (Sep 22, 2018)

No. It's likely for the reason that it *does*, for them, make a smooth curve automatically and goes back to straight automatically.. But I get the idea of ME being moldable and staying that way, leave alone its realistic appearance.


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