# Lubrications



## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

Greetings all,
Over the years of service and repair of American Flyer trains I think that I have dripped, dropped and splashed just about every kind of lubrication and contact cleaner known. After a lot of different inputs on the Lub / Cleaning subject I have settled on using these.










The 630-AA is used for bushings, bearings and gears. The Parma for linkages, E-Units and other light oil requirements. The DeoxIT is used on the E-Unit fingers and drum and any other moving contact surface.

I'm hoping that there are others that produce better results so please chime in.


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Those look fine. I changed from white Lithium to white Teflon, not sure if it is any better.
With the new poorly designed truck pickups on the latest Legacy diesels I now have a need for conductive lubricants for the truck bearings. Carl Tuveson developed a modified replacement that works well but since the current path is through the truck springs, axles and bearings conductive lubes help. I sent all six of my new Legacy diesels to him to be modified so they would run reliably. At least UPS is happy with all the added shipping business.


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## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

Thank you, sorry about the trucks its seems that the legacy folks would want to correct their design and make a kit for their buyers. It's good that you have a fix. And are keeping UPS lubed up.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

A thought on the lubricant issue. Being a retired 35 year GM parts manager, I know of an AC/Delco lubricant called Dielectric Lubricant, PN. 12377900 for a 2 oz. tube. It was designed for a lot of electrical uses, primarily for connectors to ensure good positive conductivity, prevent moisture, oxidation and corrosion It seemed GM engineers deemed it necessary to be put in/on anything electrical. I use is if I want to ensure positive current flow. It is similar to a grease substance. A little goes a long way. I'm sure there are other brands of the same product under the name of dielectric lubricant out there at most any parts store so I wouldn't necessarily say to use only the GM brand. Probably cheaper too. Lubriplate was used in all GM limited slip differential plates to cut down on the wear. Great stuff. 

Kenny


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

That Delco dielectric lube sounds similar to the conductive grease I put on all my track pins and all the clip ons like 696 and 707's to assure perfect conductivity with no corrosion. I hoping for no moisture problems on my layout. There was an accidental wine spill on one of my Christmas layouts!
The Grease I buy is NO-Ox, it is also rated for Cu to Al wire connections. Works great on the track pins etc. I need a very light conductive oil for the Diesel truck bearings. It is made by Bachman.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

When I built my present layout, I put dielectric lube on every track pin and track trips also. Every wire connection under the layout has it too even though most are fastened together with electrical nuts. My layout is in the basement and the humidity level is pretty well controlled but I still coated all electrical connections. Going a little over board, I even use it on all my switch nuts. Just enough to coat. I use Lubriplate 105 Motor Assembly Grease on all my gears. It is a white teflon like substance. Don't let the word "grease" in the name fool you. It isn't a heavy grease at all. I have a regular time table check on all the engines I run. The first thing I always do is remove the grease cover and check that lube. Seems to always be there and no build up. I've used that stuff on countless automotive engines I've built. Never a bearing failure. Actually that is what this lube is made for, engine assembly. 

Kenny


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Wise move Kenny, that layout will work without electrical connection problems as long as you have it.
I never had the 105 that I recall, it was a different number. I currently use the Hob-E-Lube teflon grease, for all I know they could be sourcing it from Lubriplate.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

That's possible. So many manufactures source the same product from the same manufacturer and give it their name. You work in the automotive business as long as I did you learn that. I once toured a starter and alternator rebuilder's facility. As we were shown the process, I noticed at least 6 different brand names on other boxes besides AC/Delco. The day we were there they had just stopped boxing starters for Autozone and were switching over to Delco. The very same starter. Napa boxes were piled behind the workers that were putting the Delco boxes on the line to be filled. Don't get me started on the how good, better, best is determined and what the customer gets when buying any one of those 3 price points. There are other similar stories I could tell about the same product being produced in the same factory but put in different brand boxes. 

Kenny


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Not surprising. I know some of the MB suppliers put the same parts in a Bosch package as the off brand package.


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## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

The same here with the track pins and all other connections. I'm blessed to be upstairs in a bonus room with good temp and humidity. My thanks to everyone for your inputs regarding lub's and tips and tricks. 

Having been in the home appliance repair business I can the same part in 20 different boxes for 20 different vendors. Also prices that should have someone going to where there are bars on the windows and doors. Yes 90 percent of the appliance parts are manufactured under the big " E " vacuum cleaner folks. And the appliances.....well don't believe the name on the model number tag. gurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Doug, you have a nice layout room, large and well lit. Mine is a former bedroom on the second floor but it is only 17'x21'. No matter what we have we always want more space.


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## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

AmFlyer said:


> Doug, you have a nice layout room, large and well lit. Mine is a former bedroom on the second floor but it is only 17'x21'. No matter what we have we always want more space.


Tom thanks that is just what I told my bride.....we need another building, ground level no stairs and 50 x 100'. You know she just said " Yes Dear " what does that mean?


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

Doug Oconnor said:


> Tom thanks that is just what I told my bride.....we need another building, ground level no stairs and 50 x 100'. You know she just said " Yes Dear " what does that mean?


Don't believe her, she's setting you up,lol!!


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## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

Dang you would think after 26 years I would know that, LOL


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## mopac (Feb 24, 2011)

In the past year or two I have started using white lithium grease for gears and synthetic motor oil for
my oil. Both seem to be working fine. Lionel is recommending white lithium for their gears. Some guys
are using red lithium grease.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

mopac said:


> In the past year or two I have started using white lithium grease for gears and synthetic motor oil for
> my oil. Both seem to be working fine. Lionel is recommending white lithium for their gears. Some guys
> are using red lithium grease.


That 105 engine assembly grease I mentioned to Tom is similar to white lithium in consistency. The thing about 105 is, it isn't thick and adheres. That is why it was designed for engine bearing assembly and camshaft coating for start up before the engine's oil takes over. I know a couple of people who use the red lithium and swear by it.

Kenny


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Some of the Lionel operators like the red Lithium grease. I think the white Teflon I am using is just white Lithium with a Teflon additive. Synthetic oil should be ideal. Can you believe I no longer have any motor oil in the garage? My prior high performance cars with the hand assembled engines needed a quart every 600 miles, the engines were assembled "loose." I sold those and bought new versions of the same cars. They now do not require oil between the 6 month service intervals, real progress. No need anymore for antifreeze or motor oil, I think the local Pep Boys misses me.
Unfortunately I now also need a conductive med/light oil for the newest Legacy engines. The good ones are expensive, $20/oz.
Doug, that sounds like a personal problem. In our household we long ago adopted a corporate structure. My wife is the CFO and Treasurer, I am the CEO. Major, life impacting purchases require unanimous approval. Things such as new trains for me or jewelry and ridiculously expensive hand bags for her do not. Seven years ago we made the decision to keep our current house rather than move so I accepted that my train room would be smaller than I really wanted.
I am currently advising a person near me on design of his dream layouts (there will be two with an interconnecting track) and how to work with a custom layout builder. Their solution was to buy a dedicated "train house" about 300 yards from their residence. They are gutting the house, removing interior walls to accommodate the layouts and their displays. That has me thinking....


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

I think the 105 was sometimes referred to as "assembly lube." Never assemble a rebuilt engine without it.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

AmFlyer said:


> I think the 105 was sometimes referred to as "assembly lube." Never assemble a rebuilt engine without it.


Yep so right Tom. In fact right on the tube are the words "assembly lubrication". As I said, in all my years of assembling countless engines, mostly for racing, never had a bearing failure. 

Kenny


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## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

AmFlyer said:


> .
> Doug, that sounds like a personal problem. In our household we long ago adopted a corporate structure. My wife is the CFO and Treasurer, I am the CEO. Major, life impacting purchases require unanimous approval. Things such as new trains for me or jewelry and ridiculously expensive hand bags for her do not.


Ah yes, the required domestic tranquility right up front. Yes it is personal, and now you all tell me all I needed was 105 "Assembly Lubrication" when I started this program up. Maybe its not to late to re-grease.


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Good luck with that! Better to just enjoy the trains.


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## AF-Doc' (Dec 21, 2013)

I jest, my bride is my best friend and loves the trains. She never has had an issue with my diversions.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

Tom you mentioned that you no longer have any motor oil in your garage. Do you remember the round metal topped cardboard oil cans that you had to shove the oil pour spout down into? Well, I still have a case of Pennzoil Racing 80 weight and a case of metal cans of the same oil. You mentioned "loose" built engines. That's where the 80 weight comes in. 

Kenny


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

I well remember those cardboard oil cans. I always changed my own oil and filters, did all my own lubes, coolant changes, stabilizer links, mufflers, tune ups carb rebuilds.
One does not put 80 weight oil in their AMG unless the desire is to void the warranty. A W-30 442 would be different.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

AFGP9 said:


> Tom you mentioned that you no longer have any motor oil in your garage. Do you remember the round metal topped cardboard oil cans that you had to shove the oil pour spout down into? Well, I still have a case of Pennzoil Racing 80 weight and a case of metal cans of the same oil. You mentioned "loose" built engines. That's where the 80 weight comes in.
> 
> Kenny


I still have one of those oil spouts, NOS, in the box, never used....


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

AmFlyer said:


> I think the 105 was sometimes referred to as "assembly lube." Never assemble a rebuilt engine without it.


We used STP as assembly lube in all of our racing engines during my stock-car days.


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