# Have my mind set on a new loco



## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

I will be purchasing a new locomotive in the near future. I am not quit sure on which one yet, but here is what I have in mind.

1. Athearn SD70ACE
2. Kato SD70MAC
3. Intermountain ES44DC
4. Broadway Limited AC6000

I am kinda rullingout the athearn as for I had lots of problems with them in the past and leaning towards the broadway limited, I have two of them and they are excellent locos. Here's my dilemma, I have never owned or had my hands on a Kato or Intermountain. Should I stick with my gutt feeling and purchase the broadway limited or go out on a limb and give the Kato or intermountain a whirl.
What's your opinion ?


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## mackdonn (Sep 26, 2012)

Only thing on your list I have owned is the Athearn.....so I cant say yay or nay to any of the others.....But I too am not that fond of the Athearn other than the looks....


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## spicercars (Sep 12, 2012)

Kato all the way. I have had all of them at one time and now all my engines are Kato and I love them. Best running engine I have ever had.


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

I have the BLI and the KATO. If you don't mind some very delicate and tiny handrail work, the KATO is great.

I have Athearns and at least one of them is superior to both the KATO and the BLI.


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## trainguru (Jun 28, 2011)

Welcome to MTF BNSF 1. I would go for BLI, if I had the money, but none of those boring diesels. I'd go for a Baldwin Centipede Diesel! -


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

1. Athearn SD70ACE- This is one fine example of Athearn at it's best.
It not only looks good but runs good too. Buy a simple DC version and put a Soundtraxx TSU-AT1000 Tsunami sound decoder in it then it will sound great too! it a drop in board.

2. Kato SD70MAC- Well you can't go wrong with a Kato. Install a Soundtraxx TSU-KT1000 for sound, again drop in board.

3. Intermountain ES44DC- Nice but can be a little harder to keep running good and smooth. This is a hard wired decoder swap to a Soundtraxx TSU-1000 sound decoder.

4. Broadway Limited AC6000- I'm not a fan, nice look but a little tough to work on, and maintain. You will have to go with their sound and DCC for this model, I think they are using QSI.


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

trainguru said:


> Welcome to MTF BNSF 1. I would go for BLI, if I had the money, but none of those boring diesels. I'd go for a Baldwin Caterpillar Diesel! -


Didn't you mean the Baldwin "Centipede"?


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## trainguru (Jun 28, 2011)

Fixed alread; thanks! And welcome too Sasha, to MTF!


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

*Thank you!*

Thank you so much! I love this place!


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## Grbauc (Dec 13, 2012)

BNSF 1 said:


> I will be purchasing a new locomotive in the near future. I am not quit sure on which one yet, but here is what I have in mind.
> 
> 1. Athearn SD70ACE
> 2. Kato SD70MAC
> ...


well get the new athearn ES44AC coming this summer. I just put my order in for one There using the Tower55 molds with new Athearn motor with more upgrades to the tooling going to be awesome. Release date is June i think. 

Broadway limited is top notch imop but there all so close anyway you go you should be happy. I'm not disappointed in any of my many loco's. 

I really love the price of intermountain and detail is darn good. Best deal imop on them hard to beat intermountain price and detail. 


The engine is so smooth on kato's engines but they are not committed to HO there heart is in N Scale and the AC4400 and SD40-2 are not has detailed has some of the newer engines out there from other manufactures but darn there engines run smooth. Another nice thing about kato is there Sound ready units if you buy one of there's without Sound they have speaker spot read for plug n play if you want to install your own sound. 

I really love the look of SD70Ace's MTH is not in your list but pick up one of them there couplers (some people hate there couplers) and sound systems is top notch detail is awesome to.....
I've not had issue with my athearn besides the cheap lights and rails but the newer ones Genesis seem better then the slightly older Genesis engines. 

Buy a MTH or snipe some Intermountain ES44AC off ebay. I got two CSX ES44AC for 152.50 each with DCC/Sound thats two for the retail price of one broadway..
I assume your looking for the best Flag BNSF on current stuff. The best looking is the SD70Ace in the Heritage lll colors imop hard to beat that. 


Last but not least if i had to pick between the two options Kato and Intermountain id go with the Intermountain for price and better detail. Kato detailing seems to be not nearly has progressed has the Other HO manufactures. My 2cents


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## mackdonn (Sep 26, 2012)

Grbauc said:


> I really love the look of SD70Ace's MTH is not in your list but pick up one of them there couplers (some people hate there couplers) and sound systems is top notch detail is awesome to.....
> I've not had issue with my athearn besides the cheap lights and rails but the newer ones Genesis seem better then the slightly older Genesis engines.
> 
> Buy a MTH or snipe some Intermountain ES44AC off ebay. The best looking is the SD70Ace in the Heritage lll colors imop hard to beat that.


I'm with you Grbauc!!! The MTH SD70Ace is top notch in my book. It also comes with an extra set of couplers to switch out the proto automatic couplers (I did). Or you can install your own (I did that as well) On Ebay brand new in the box they are going for around $230 DCC w/sound. Thats lower than MSRP. I also saw a few BLI AC6000's going for $190.


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## NUTNDUN (Nov 27, 2012)

I don't think the Paragon 2 Broadway Limiteds are QSI. I think they sound to good and the motor control is terrific. I have no experience with QSI sound decoders though so I am just basing it from what I have read on other opinions so you might want to take it with a grain of salt.

I really like the BLI AC6000 I have. I also just got two Kato's with ESU Loksound. I just got them yesterday so it is too soon to say too much but overall first impression is I like them. The drives on the Kato are definitely top notch like you always hear.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

i actually have the athearn sd70 ace. I must say i think its very nice, the detail is top notch, it runs great. I cant wait to get my helix up so i can see what she will do on a grade!!!!

My decision was somewhat simple. I model modern day, canadian national/escanaba & lake superior rr. I didnt want to buy just any road name loco, so my choices were somewhat limited. 

I do not have any complaints about my athearn. But remember it only takes one bad apple for a person to think that this or that locomotive is crap because of different reasons. It doesnt mean they are all junk, just like cars, sometimes there is a lemon in the batch!

When your spending over 200 bucks or close to it for a dcc loco, make sure you do your homework and research...

I will be buying more locos it may be another athearn, or something different.

Everyone has a different point of view, so keep this in mind when you are listening to peoples reviews


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## mackdonn (Sep 26, 2012)

If you can go to a hobby shop that has them in stock. And ask to hold them in your hand. You can feel the weight difference between the Athearn and MTH. Remember more weight=more pulling power. Below is a picture of my Athearn Genesis SD70Ace (rear) and MTH SD70Ace (Front) just so you know I'm not pulling your leg when I say I have the exact same models by different manufactures. It's easy for me to judge motor control and over all performance. And my comments are limited to only the SD70Ace....Athearn may be better on other models but for now I'm with MTH (thats if you can overlook the DCS decoder that puts some limits on what you can do IE; advanced consisting)


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

Don't the MTHs have those funny little rubber bands on some of the wheels? Doesn't that take away from the overall electrical pickup surface? I would like to go back to Arnie's Trains and see if they carry MTH locomotives in HO scale.


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## mackdonn (Sep 26, 2012)

Sasha said:


> Don't the MTHs have those funny little rubber bands on some of the wheels? Doesn't that take away from the overall electrical pickup surface? I would like to go back to Arnie's Trains and see if they carry MTH locomotives in HO scale.


Nope......not on the SD70Ace.....maybe on the steamers??? I dont know..


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## Rusty (Jun 23, 2011)

Do you dislike atlas silver or gold locomotives?


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

I guess I'll have to reconsider MHT for my roster. So far, all of my trains have all-wheel drive and all-wheel electrical pickup. I want to keep it that way.


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## Grbauc (Dec 13, 2012)

*modern consist*

I suppose if i was to have just one engine the weight and pulling power would come in to play. The pulling power of a BWL over a MTH or Athearn kato is ture, but i and prob most people run two or three engine consists when pulling long heavy trains. So if i was to only have one engine in my fleet yea BWl. 

I wish they made more then just the AC6000 and SD40-2 just like kato i wish they made more then just the SD40 and AC4400 has far has modern locomotives go.

Athearn are the biggest representation in my fleet cause i can Get rtr Gp50 60 SD 38's 40's 60's AC4000 ---Genesis> GP's50,60 SD's 40's 70ace's and soon Gevo's AC44ES all in modern Heritage III scheme or better know swooshhhhh paint.

I really do think there all so close that it comes down to personal preference depending on money you have to spend and what you want to do with them only you can decide that. 

I think its awesome that we have so many choices and that there are many manufactures fighting to get are money. It makes them fight and we the consumer get better and better products.. Win win


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## norgale (Apr 4, 2011)

mackdonn said:


> If you can go to a hobby shop that has them in stock. And ask to hold them in your hand. You can feel the weight difference between the Athearn and MTH. Remember more weight=more pulling power. Below is a picture of my Athearn Genesis SD70Ace (rear) and MTH SD70Ace (Front) just so you know I'm not pulling your leg when I say I have the exact same models by different manufactures. It's easy for me to judge motor control and over all performance. And my comments are limited to only the SD70Ace....Athearn may be better on other models but for now I'm with MTH (thats if you can overlook the DCS decoder that puts some limits on what you can do IE; advanced consisting)


Mac those sure are good looking engines. Love the color scheme. Good find. Pete


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

Rusty said:


> Do you dislike atlas silver or gold locomotives?


No I do not dislike atlas. I own a gold dash 8-40c. I personally feel that the broadway limited that I own is far superior.


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

mackdonn said:


> I'm with you Grbauc!!! The MTH SD70Ace is top notch in my book. It also comes with an extra set of couplers to switch out the proto automatic couplers (I did). Or you can install your own (I did that as well) On Ebay brand new in the box they are going for around $230 DCC w/sound. Thats lower than MSRP. I also saw a few BLI AC6000's going for $190.


 I have seen a couple MTH. And it looks and runs great. I can tell that they are of great quality. The problem is the whole DCS thing. I like to run long trains and my layout has a rulling 3% grade so I lash up 2 locos in an advanced consist so the mth won't work for me.


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## mackdonn (Sep 26, 2012)

BNSF 1 said:


> I have seen a couple MTH. And it looks and runs great. I can tell that they are of great quality. The problem is the whole DCS thing. I like to run long trains and my layout has a rulling 3% grade so I lash up 2 locos in an advanced consist so the mth won't work for me.


It will work IF you use old style consisting (cheap way as I do), change them to the same address, or buy a DCS controller to do the software upgrade (expensive), or send them off to have the upgrade done(about $30 per loco). I have a 3% and a 4%. 

One engine can handle them fine and you can hear the engine rev as it hits the grade but 2 or more there is no increase in revs and it looks better IMO....


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

mackdonn said:


> It will work IF you use old style consisting (cheap way as I do), change them to the same address, or buy a DCS controller to do the software upgrade (expensive), or send them off to have the upgrade done(about $30 per loco). I have a 3% and a 4%.
> 
> One engine can handle them fine and you can hear the engine rev as it hits the grade but 2 or more there is no increase in revs and it looks better IMO....


Ok I will keep that in mind. Thanks for the info.


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

BNSF 1 said:


> I will be purchasing a new locomotive in the near future. I am not quit sure on which one yet, but here is what I have in mind.
> 
> 1. Athearn SD70ACE
> 2. Kato SD70MAC
> ...


Thank all of you for your insights. I decided to go with the kato SD70MAC with loksound. I just ordered it tonight and can't wait to get my hands on it. Although this is my first experience with kato and loksound. I am sure I will be satisfied.


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## blackz28 (Jan 6, 2013)

i gotta go with MTH SD-70ACe i have the rio grande 'heritage unit' its the balls !!!


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

I was thinking about the MTH SD70ACe for my fleet, but I read that it has those little rubber band wheels for traction. The reason I won't go that way is because I want all-wheel electrical pickup. It's a shame, too, because those MTH models have great detail!


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## blackz28 (Jan 6, 2013)

rubberband wheels?? lol no it an all wheel pick up , where did you hear diffrent ??


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## mopac (Feb 24, 2011)

Quote-It's a shame, too, because those MTH models have great detail! 
__________________

I have to agree Sasha. Those MTH look great. Diesel or steam. I am not messing with DCS. Its a shame. I only have one what I would call a premium engine. Its a BLI and I love it. Just no problems at all. All my other engines are athearn BB or proto or rivarossi. I am a little deprived here, I don't even have an atlas. I do want to get some katos and atlas some day. BNSF 1 you
made a great choice and hope it all works for you.


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

blackz28 said:


> rubberband wheels?? lol no it an all wheel pick up , where did you hear diffrent ??


Do you have the model in your possession yet? I pretty certain I read it somewhere, but that may have been for their "O" scale models. That's why I didn't state it, I merely asked the question.


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## blackz28 (Jan 6, 2013)

Sasha said:


> Do you have the model in your possession yet? I pretty certain I read it somewhere, but that may have been for their "O" scale models. That's why I didn't state it, I merely asked the question.


yes i have the H.O. scale ACE in front of me thats why i said that ,


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## Sasha (Jul 8, 2012)

My mistake then. Now I'm REALLY interested in MTH. I'll have to check what other models they offer in HO scale.


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## Grbauc (Dec 13, 2012)

Sasha said:


> Do you have the model in your possession yet? I pretty certain I read it somewhere, but that may have been for their "O" scale models. That's why I didn't state it, I merely asked the question.


I have several MTH SD70ACe's and NO they DO not have rubber wheels i promise.
they are top notch. The only Hitch is there DCS system but they Have said that they know DCC is big with modelers and that they are adding more sounds extra's to this cause they know many use it.
Broadway >>>Is the top of the line to me( negative is there lack of options)

MTH>>> is next there quality is awesome they push the envelope for new options

Athearn>>> They play follow the leader on new options Not market pushers IMOP. There detail and Quality is top notch just behind Broadway.

Intermountain>>> great price and detail is good, best deal for the Price Ebay sound dcc new $165-185 easy to find these deals. 

Kato>>> Smooth engine sound top notch knock (there not committed to HO) Nscale is there thing. IF you want a AC4400 or Dash 9 older SD70's 80's 90's go with them. Newer engines ES44AC Gevo's, SD70ACe's AC6000 they don't make them.

Atlas/proto 2000/Bachmann>>> Nice sound good detail For the used prices of these Good deal on Dash 8's on ebay for sound units. Not the detail of the other guys. (proto 2000 upgrading to DCC on there units is a pain) not sure on there newer stuff.

This is my list for new diesels 
That said i really think there all close enough that there is no bad choice were pretty lucky has modeler with the quality and options we have. It will be getting better with the Athearn ES44AC release this june Compition is good i wish Kato and MTH would make a ES44AC now.


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

mopac said:


> Quote-It's a shame, too, because those MTH models have great detail!
> __________________
> 
> I have to agree Sasha. Those MTH look great. Diesel or steam. I am not messing with DCS. Its a shame. I only have one what I would call a premium engine. Its a BLI and I love it. Just no problems at all. All my other engines are athearn BB or proto or rivarossi. I am a little deprived here, I don't even have an atlas. I do want to get some katos and atlas some day. BNSF 1 you
> made a great choice and hope it all works for you.


Thanks, I will be posting feedback as soon as it arrives.


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

Two days left till my kato sd70MAC arrives. I can hardly wait. I will be posting feedback as soon as I break-it in.


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

And its Soundtraxx Decoder is sitting right here!


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## BNSF 1 (Dec 27, 2012)

NIMT said:


> And its Soundtraxx Decoder is sitting right here!


Nimt if I can't live with the installed lok sound, I will be contacting you. 

Thanks,


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