# Feeders?



## JoeG (Feb 3, 2013)

I was wondering how many feeders I would need for this layout? It is a 4X8 HO scale DCC.


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*# of feeder wires depends on # of track sections*

From my researching it is suggested to have feeders soldered to the bottom of each track
section. By the way, it is also suggested too use three foot sections of flex track. Where
possible. Of-course. This will reduce the overall number of joints. That may be needed too also be soldered. Solder the feeder wires approximately in the center of track sections. 
Also, You should try to use nickel silver track on most of your layout to reduce tarnishing
and maintenance problems of brass track. Also, Check out Mark Gurries DCC web sight.
And Good luck.Regards,tr1


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

I would have drops from each main track in the middle at both
the Top and the bottom. Then more drops in each main at
both left and right ends. These would be connected to a buss which is
fed at mid point by your DCC controller. Do Not make a circle
of your buss, it should dead end in each direction.

You may need some additional drops on your spur and
yard tracks depending on the turnouts that you use.
Peco turnouts, for example, are power routing. That means
they turn OFF the power to the diverting track when
the points are set to straight. Most Atlas turnouts are
not power routing.

Don


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## fcwilt (Sep 27, 2013)

Have you or are you going to solder the rail joints?


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## JoeG (Feb 3, 2013)

fcwilt said:


> Have you or are you going to solder the rail joints?


I wasn't planning on soldering the jointer because I would like to be able to remove the track easily incase I change my none about the design due to the fact that this the first layout I have done.


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## JoeG (Feb 3, 2013)

DonR said:


> I would have drops from each main track in the middle at both
> the Top and the bottom. Then more drops in each main at
> both left and right ends. These would be connected to a buss which is
> fed at mid point by your DCC controller. Do Not make a circle
> ...


I would like to use Peco turnouts, however I was wondering if the #4 Peco turnouts are the same size as a #4 Atlas. The reason I ask is because I have done all the preplanning with atlas turnout and if I could use Peco without changing the layout design that would be great.


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## DavefromMD (Jul 25, 2013)

He's what I have on a similar size layout. I, like you use sectional track because I like to change it around occasionally.

I have 2 ovals with an interchange and a couple sidings. Using your layout as a reference, my interchange is at the back where your pond is. My controls are at the right front. I have a power connection to each oval near my controls, one at the left side in the middle of the 180 degree curves, one at the interchange, and one to my sidings. It was a DC layout I converted to DCC. I removed the blocking and kept the connections the same. My remote control switches are wired to my DC power pack. I have no soldered joints. I use Atlas snap switches.

This set up works well for my layout. I run up to 4 trains simultaneously without issue.

I've learned there is much good advice on here, but some of it is way beyond what I want to do and overly complicated for my needs. Don't let that intimidate you or make you think you can't do what you intend without getting into more than you thought. All the folks on here have good intentions and want to help. Just cull the information that fits your needs.


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## JoeG (Feb 3, 2013)

DavefromMD said:


> He's what I have on a similar size layout. I, like you use sectional track because I like to change it around occasionally.
> 
> I have 2 ovals with an interchange and a couple sidings. Using your layout as a reference, my interchange is at the back where your pond is. My controls are at the right front. I have a power connection to each oval near my controls, one at the left side in the middle of the 180 degree curves, one at the interchange, and one to my sidings. It was a DC layout I converted to DCC. I removed the blocking and kept the connections the same. My remote control switches are wired to my DC power pack. I have no soldered joints. I use Atlas snap switches.
> 
> ...


WOW, thats awesome information and very helpful. This site has helped me out a lot over the time that I have been on here. The information is great, yes sometimes more then I need but it is still good to know for future reference. 
Its amazing to me that you can run four engines I was thinking two for mine but hey maybe more now. 
How do your Atlas snap switches work. I don't hear good things about Atlas switches so it makes me nervous spending the money on them?
Thanks for your help!


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## DavefromMD (Jul 25, 2013)

I've had no issues with the snap switches. I power the interchange remotely and the sidings manually. I have 10 and on one of them the one rail on the points is a bit low. I filed down the rail a bit and use it on my sidings. Keep in mind the snap switches are not the same as the #4, #6 etc. The snap switches have the motors attached which is not ideal if going for the realistic look. But I'm not into realistic looking, I like to run trains.

I had concerns about snap switches when I converted to DCC. I kept reading about powered and unpowered frogs, shorts caused by metal wheels at the frogs. I had someone on here reassure me the snap switches will be OK with DCC. 

I've found the rollability of the rolling stock seems to have more to do with how well cars handle switches. When I switched my existing Athearn and older Mantua cars to metal wheels, they rolled much more freely and ran problem free over the switches. The rest of my rolling stock is new Bachmann Silver Series and Atlas Trainman. Nice rolling cars for a decent price.

I usually run 3 trains but can run 4 - 2 on each oval, 8 or 9 cars per freight, 4, 72 foot passenger cars on the passenger train.

My DCC control is the NCE Power cab. I do not have sound. When I run 4 with the passenger train with lighted coaches it draws no more than 1.5 amps. Without the lighted passenger train, 4 trains draw no more than 1 amp.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Joe

The Peco equivalent of the Atlas #4 is not a direct
replacement. The measurements are different. If
you are using flex track and have not yet cut it you
would have no problem. There may be alignment
problems if you use sectional. I would recommend
flex track even if you use Atlas turnouts. Sectional
adds too many more joiners and possible loss
of good conductivity.

The Peco Insulfrog, (recommended) is power routing
and you may need additional drops from the frog
rails to work around the power routing. I do have
to say. You will have an absolutely trouble and
derail free layout if you use Peco turnouts.

Don


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## JoeG (Feb 3, 2013)

DonR said:


> Joe
> 
> The Peco equivalent of the Atlas #4 is not a direct
> replacement. The measurements are different. If
> ...


I have been researching the Insulfrog and I really like how simple it is and how it turns track power off to the area not in use, such as a siding. Thanks for your help.


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## fcwilt (Sep 27, 2013)

JoeG said:


> I have been researching the Insulfrog and I really like how simple it is and how it turns track power off to the area not in use, such as a siding. Thanks for your help.


While that may sound like a good feature it doesn't really help with a DCC layout.

ElectroFrog turnouts with the frog powered are a better choice IMO.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Fcwilt

Dog gone. I just have to argue your point.

I have more than 20 Peco Insulfrog turnouts on my room
size DCC layout. My locos negotiate the insulfrogs with
no problem even at crawl speed. 

Peco Electrofrogs may be helpful if you run small wheelbase
locos with insufficient power pickup wheels, but the regular
all wheel pickup 4 or 6 axle truck locos will sail right through 
with nary a blink of the headlight on Insulfrogs.

Don


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## fcwilt (Sep 27, 2013)

DonR said:


> Fcwilt
> 
> Dog gone. I just have to argue your point.
> 
> Don


You are absolutely correct that many, many locos will do fine on an Insulfrog turnout.

They will also do fine on an Electrofrog turnout.

But for those of us that have some short wheel base units Electrofrog are more forgiving.

http://www.broadway-limited.com/1901bando1929trackinspectionsedandcdccho.aspx


Since there is a very slight downside to Insulfrog turnouts, is there a corresponding downside to Electrofrog turnouts that I have not encountered?


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

I do agree. That 'auto train' would likely sputter
on an Insulfrog turnout.

Actually, I don't think there is a downside to any
Peco turnout. They are as good as you can get.

The Electrofrog is less attractive to me because
it requires the wiring to power the frog. 

Don


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## DavefromMD (Jul 25, 2013)

For what it's worth - I have Atlas snap track switches. The frogs are insulated on these and I have an 0-6-0 Bachmann steam loco that negotiates these switches without issue - even at low speed.


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## feldon30 (Dec 30, 2012)

The gap on Peco Insulfrogs is ridiculously narrow. I guess they did it to be prototypical, but the result is plenty of sparks and shorts on a well-powered layout. Solutions include painstaking filing of the gap to make it wider, or repeated application of nail polish. Unfortunately, Dremel does not make a wheel small enough or narrow enough to widen the gap without demolishing the turnout.

*Why Peco couldn't have made the gap 1/16th of an inch wider and filled it with silvery plastic is beyond me.*


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