# Reasons for why Bachmann ducks?



## Cprail43

*Reasons for why Bachmann sucks?*

I hear a lot of complaints about Bachmann's products. Now, my layout is basically all bachmann. I've only had two complaints about them. 1, they have useless couplers installed on their starter sets. 2, some of their engines lack detail. Those are my only complaints.

But maybe you could help me see the dark side of bachmann. And tell me what is next resort. Athearn? Kato? What's your opinion? I'm all ears!


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## NUTNDUN

I wouldn't say Bachmann ducks. I think they have good products and they have bad ones but I also believe all manufacturers are that way.

I have two Bachmann Spectrum Dash 8's that do not run the best. The detailing isn't bad on them but even running a decoder with bemf it takes quite a few speed steps to get them moving. Probably if I spent some time and cleaned up the gears and broke them in with some sort of compound it would run easier. I just don't feel either one is worth spending the time on right now.

My coworker just got a Bachmann dcc/sound steam loco. I don't remember the exact model. It was a 2-6-0 setup. It ran quite nice on speed step one and also had nice detailing and the sound was pretty good. I think she said they paid $175 for it. I don't know that I would have spent that much on it but it is probably worth it considering prices for other brands with sound and dcc installed.


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## NIMT

Bachmann's downfall's in my eyes!
Cheap couplers, Easy change out to Kadee's
Cheap decoders on 90% of there engines, there are many options for decoders to change to! The reason this is not a full out failure is some of there engines/locos come with Tsunami decoders, while they are not 100% full function decoders they are very good decoders!
There DCC controllers are...Well worthless! Some say they are great starter controllers I just don't see it!
Bachmann Spectrum line is a lot better quaility and they make engines that look and run very well. 
As far as engines/locos go, buy a Athern or Kato and you'll experiance the differance, It's night and day over standard Bachmann!


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## cv_acr

Bachmann's Spectrum series locomotives are actually pretty respectable.

Their freight cars are a joke.


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## Cprail43

NUTNDUN said:


> I wouldn't say Bachmann sucks. I think they have good products and they have bad ones but I also believe all manufacturers are that way.
> 
> I have two Bachmann Spectrum Dash 8's that do not run the best. The detailing isn't bad on them but even running a decoder with bemf it takes quite a few speed steps to get them moving. Probably if I spent some time and cleaned up the gears and broke them in with some sort of compound it would run easier. I just don't feel either one is worth spending the time on right now.
> 
> My coworker just got a Bachmann dcc/sound steam loco. I don't remember the exact model. It was a 2-6-0 setup. It ran quite nice on speed step one and also had nice detailing and the sound was pretty good. I think she said they paid $175 for it. I don't know that I would have spent that much on it but it is probably worth it considering prices for other brands with sound and dcc installed.


Yeah ikr. I have a Bachmann EMD DD40AX and a GP35 in cprail paint. The GP has faced disassembly, 2 falls, and even got stepped on!! It still works like new. That's why I don't understand why so many people dislike bachmann.


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## gc53dfgc

cv_acr said:


> Bachmann's Spectrum series locomotives are actually pretty respectable.
> 
> Their freight cars are a joke.


Have you seen any of their silver series? While not the most detailed, they still roll well, have metal wheel-sets, and some of the cars have good detail.


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## Cprail43

gc53dfgc said:


> Have you seen any of their silver series? While not the most detailed, they still roll well, have metal wheel-sets, and some of the cars have good detail.


Oh yes! Most of their freight is very detailed. I have two cylindrical hoppers(black CP rail and Rainbow edition CN). They roll beautifully. They sometimes roll away when I put the on a siding! Yes you definatly hit the nail on that note. 

They're priced very well too. You can't pass that sometimes


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## gc53dfgc

basically, anything that is older Bachmann is close to useless, but that is the same with a lot of the companies unless you go with the high end ones of the day, but that just comes with technology.


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## Cprail43

gc53dfgc said:


> basically, anything that is older Bachmann is close to useless, but that is the same with a lot of the companies unless you go with the high end ones of the day, but that just comes with technology.


Can't forget their set items. The couplers only have plastic strips for springs. Last at least a week.


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## NIMT

Cprail43 said:


> I have a Bachmann EMD DD40AX.


Get a new Athearn DDA40X then you'll see the real differance!


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## tkruger

I had one of there steamers 2-6-2 Prairies. Worked great at first but did not hold up over time, even though it had proper maintenance. The motor started and other drive components started to show wear. I have much older Mantua locomotives that saw much more use (and were already bought used) and out lasted the Bachmann steamers. Note that this was not the pancake motor Bachmann. 

As for the Silver Series cars they are hit and miss. Several of them are just the cheaper cars with metal wheels and knuckle couplers. I have a Silver Series gondola and two flats that come from the same molds as their cheaper line.

I have had two Spectrum locomotives. Both are pre-DCC days. One had a grinding noise from day one. Was told to break it in and it would go away. After a few hours of running in a circle it was louder. Had a switcher that the wheels would not stay in gauge on one of the trucks. In both cases Bachman told me it would be $15 to send in and have repaired and shipping was my responsibility. I can understand shipping being my issue but why the charge for warenty repairs? I have not bought Bachmann power since.

Most of my diesel fleet is Athearn Blue Box. With the exception of a few small switchers. My Steamers are Mantua or Riverosi with the exception of an old Revel and an John English. My Electrics are GK1 and Riverosi models.


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## tkruger

Sorry, duplicate entry.


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## RT_Coker

*But Be Aware...*

I have many Bachmann products, and have had very few problems overall. But the technical support is ...

So far I like my Bachmann-Dynamis DCC System. It is a good deal at the $71.00 price. 

But Be Aware that this product does not work well with the E-Z Command 5 Amp Power Booster and E-Z Command DCC Automatic Reverse Loop Module. The Dynamis manual uses the words "can be used with" very loosely. The Dynamis was apparently NOT design to be used with these products. The Bachmann/USA forum can NOT be trusted to provide accurate information on the problems or use of Dynamis. User information posted on this forum about problems/issues with Bachmann products (and practically Dynamis) is subject to becoming "either missing or off limits" for reasons that are outside of its "Code of Conduct".

Bob


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## Hold'ErNewt

To me, it seems Bachmann gets more reliable the larger the scale. Their N scale trains are practically worthless (but maybe it's just their steam engines in particular). I don't hear as many issues with their larger scales. I've never had any issues with my G scale steamer, but it doesn't see nearly the track time of my Aristocrafts.


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## Cprail43

NIMT said:


> Get a new Athearn DDA40X then you'll see the real differance!


Actually, I might plan on going with a kato AC4400CW. Hopefully I can see a difference from their. If not, I'll go into a athearn gp35. The DD40AX is too expensive for me.


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## NIMT

Cprail43 said:


> Actually, I might plan on going with a kato AC4400CW. Hopefully I can see a difference from their. If not, I'll go into a athearn gp35. The DD40AX is too expensive for me.


That will do it also! The Kato's are very nice runners too!


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## sbeck80

I've actually had a little bit of experience with different brands lately. 

1. Had an older Bachmann Spectrum 8-40CW. What a pile of garbage. Sent it back in to Bachmann as it broke along with $25 and they replaced it with a brand new DCC model. Massive improvement from the one I sent in. Much better detail, better runner, lighting, etc. I think their DCC chips stink though - I ended up removing it in favor of the dummy plug and finding it ran much better on DC than with their decoder installed.
2. Bought an Athearn Genesis SD70ACe as a "desk queen" (everyone who works for a railroad has to have at least 1 model on their desk, right?). Quality, details, paint, etc. are all the best I've ever seen. Incredibly impressed at the detail. I almost feel bad that it won't see any run time, but it really is too good looking to not have on display.
3. Received a 2008-ish Athearn genesis SD70M (recently installed sound too - thanks NIMT!). Quality and details are not quite as nice and up to the SD70ACe's details, but still very impressive and way better than Bachmann. Really strong runner too, again - much better than Bachmann.
4. Got an older 2002-ish Kato SD90. Details are good, but falls in the middle of the range in my opinion. Obviously an older model, but great that it has led's installed and is a very solid runner.

So....details, quality, pulling power, etc. my ranking goes:
1. Athearn Genesis
2. Kato
3. Bachmann

Can't speak for Atlas as I've never had one.


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## sawgunner

sbeck80 said:


> Can't speak for Atlas as I've never had one.


here is how an older Atlas pulls




I've had numerous Bachmann's in the past in cluding 2 of the DDA40X those pulled very well however the large gashes front and rear kill the models looks.

any other of the newer Bachmann's i have not had and probably won't.

I've had new Athearn's and BB ones and they are great for pulling on both counts obviously the looks are better above blue box. also stupidly easy to work on.

Atlas, I've had a few the older ones are lacking in detail but the newest ones are nice and are good pullers

Kato I've only had one an SD80MAC very nice detail (you have to add it off of the pieces hiding under the model in the box. for doing it for the first time takes a couple hours and you'll be cussin'.

good puller and the LED's were a plus


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## sbeck80

sawgunner said:


> here is how an older Atlas pulls
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've had numerous Bachmann's in the past in cluding 2 of the DDA40X those pulled very well however the large gashes front and rear kill the models looks.
> 
> any other of the newer Bachmann's i have not had and probably won't.
> 
> I've had new Athearn's and BB ones and they are great for pulling on both counts obviously the looks are better above blue box. also stupidly easy to work on.
> 
> Atlas, I've had a few the older ones are lacking in detail but the newest ones are nice and are good pullers
> 
> Kato I've only had one an SD80MAC very nice detail (you have to add it off of the pieces hiding under the model in the box. for doing it for the first time takes a couple hours and you'll be cussin'.
> 
> good puller and the LED's were a plus


That's the biggest thing that bugs me about Athearn - those stupid little bulbs. It really can't be that much more work for Athearn to put in led's, so why continue with bulbs that burn out so quickly?? 

I like Bachmann rolling stock - the Silver Series stuff is good. I don't think I'll be buying any more Bachmann engines though now that I've experienced Kato and Athearn. 
And I actually like a lot of the Model Power rolling stock too - easy enough to swap out metal wheels and couplers, and they look pretty decent too.


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## sawgunner

ya those bulbs are dumb but then again would you rather have the one large bulb that use to connect to the contact bar across the top of the motor and light up everything but the headlights? LOL


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## Cprail43

sbeck80 said:


> I like Bachmann rolling stock - the Silver Series stuff is good. I don't think I'll be buying any more Bachmann engines though now that I've experienced Kato and Athearn.
> And I actually like a lot of the Model Power rolling stock too - easy enough to swap out metal wheels and couplers, and they look pretty decent too.


I totally agree. Like I said earlier, I own two Silver Series cylindrical hoppers. And I recently bought a Model Power CN boxcar. Rides beautifully! Can't say the suck, can you!


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## gc53dfgc

RT_Coker said:


> I have many Bachmann products, and have had very few problems overall. But the technical support is ...
> 
> So far I like my Bachmann-Dynamis DCC System. It is a good deal at the $71.00 price.
> 
> But Be Aware that this product does not work well with the E-Z Command 5 Amp Power Booster and E-Z Command DCC Automatic Reverse Loop Module. The Dynamis manual uses the words "can be used with" very loosely. The Dynamis was apparently NOT design to be used with these products. The Bachmann/USA forum can NOT be trusted to provide accurate information on the problems or use of Dynamis. User information posted on this forum about problems/issues with Bachmann products (and practically Dynamis) is subject to becoming "either missing or off limits" for reasons that are outside of its "Code of Conduct".
> 
> Bob


I have to counter you on this. I own both the Dynamis and the ez-command 5 amp booster. They both work perfectly fine together if they are turned on in the right sequence, which should be booster first then the Dynamis. This keeps the system from detecting a short as the more powerful booster comes on if the Dynamis is powered up first.


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## Mr.Buchholz

I love Bachmann locos and rolling stock. Yes, I have had the odd one that had a crap coupler or two, but I just replaced them with brand new Kadees. Otherwise, no problems.

I only ran into issues when I started buying (and stopped rather quickly) some Tyco rolling stock, and two locos (all of which are long gone now). I find Tyco products are pain in the waiting, especially some of the locos.

-J.


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## N scale catastrophe

At the risk of repeating myself... I wouldn't go so far as to say it is a bad product, just that you get what you pay for. I started out with 2 Bachmann engines, they were fine. Just didn't realize that fine wasn't what I wanted until I got my Athearn. If you buy a Bachmann engine make sure it is a new model and be ready to have spotless track and to do some fairly heavy maintenance work on the engine itself. As long as you know what you're getting into they are a fine product, just go in with open eyes.


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## Big Ed

title, Why Bachmann Ducks. 

When will someone correct this?


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## New Berlin RR

ive had both good and bad with Bachmann (or Botchmann as some call them), there freight cars are ehh a mix, the engines hit or miss really, I have had super runners and others that wern't that great but hey all MFGs have there bad batches and good batches...defects and all...


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## x_doug_x

I went through 2 pages here. Bachmann's older stuff was of very low quality and lasted no time at all. Bachmann knew they had to do something to confront this issue. Their newer locomotives have better drive assemblies that last longer than the older. The sets also went up in price compared to what they were. Any of the 80s or 90s bachmann steamers won't hold up very long. bachmann's replacement policy is pretty good though. You can trade older locomotives with issues in on newer locomotives with no issues and add a little cash.


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## Massey

I have had really good and really bad from Bachmann. Mostly the bad was also the cheap and... well... ya get what ya paid for.

I have a Class J from the old pancake motor days that has not seen the rails due to a buggered up motor... No biggy I used it as a display only. I did have (notice I said "did") a newer Spektrum Class J and while it pulled nice and looked great it had one major flaw. The drawbar between the tender and engine. The bar was designed to allow the tender and engine to run really close together like the prototype does and it allows the tender to pull away from the cab in corners. This system works great but it does not allow for any up and down movement. I used to run this train on a modular layout and for those of you who have run on a modular layout you already know there are bumps and dips all over the place. The engine would lift the tender off the rails all the time. There simply was not enough allowance for up and down movement. Now I have a BLI Class J with a standard pin and bar type drawbar and my days of lifting the tender off the rails is gone. 

I have owned a couple of Spektrum steam engines and have loved them all. They have great detail and they have all run great. Only minor tweaking has ever been needed. 2 of these engines are 2-8-0 Consolidations that were part of starter sets, both engines still run great. One of them unfortunatly has met Mr.Floor from a few feet up and was also handled by my kids before I could get it out of his hand... Trains only fly on TV Tommy!! (he had just seen Back To The Future 3) OH and that 2-8-0 still runs great but I am missing the compressor.

Massey


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## Hold'ErNewt

big ed said:


> title, Why Bachmann Ducks.
> 
> When will someone correct this?


It used to be more correct, it changed a couple days ago.


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## Cprail43

big ed said:


> title, Why Bachmann Ducks.
> 
> When will someone correct this?


Sorry about that. Didn't spellcheck properly.


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## Big Ed

Hold'ErNewt said:


> It used to be more correct, it changed a couple days ago.


Do you mean it was correct and "someone" changed it?
I thought when he first posted it was correct.



Cprail43 said:


> Sorry about that. Didn't spellcheck properly.


No problem, makes me chuckle when ever I read it.


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## Conductorjoe

I always explain it like buying a new car. You can buy an economy car or you can buy a BMW or a Corvette. Same thing with Models.The downfalls of Bachman are, lack of fine detail, lack of pulling power, lack of pickup power at low speeds and the noise factor.
Nothing wrong with Bachman other than that. They have served the industry well for the newcomer or beginner for many years. They are also good for kids . You dont exactly want to give a child a $100 Kato engine.
It just depends on what you want to spend. Its like anything else. "You get what you pay for".


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## Cprail43

big ed said:


> Do you mean it was correct and "someone" changed it?
> I thought when he first posted it was correct.
> 
> 
> 
> No problem, makes me chuckle when ever I read it.


I get the feeling that maybe I put in "sucks", but my phone's spellcheck might have replaced it to "ducks". It's happened before with this word.


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## Cprail43

Conductorjoe said:


> I always explain it like buying a new car. You can buy an economy car or you can buy a BMW or a Corvette. Same thing with Models.The downfalls of Bachman are, lack of fine detail, lack of pulling power, lack of pickup power at low speeds and the noise factor.
> Nothing wrong with Bachman other than that. They have served the industry well for the newcomer or beginner for many years. They are also good for kids . You dont exactly want to give a child a $100 Kato engine.
> It just depends on what you want to spend. Its like anything else. "You get what you pay for".


Agreed. Children might drop that pristine Kato. Never give a kato to children under 14! They make beautiful engines. I cry when I hear something's wrong with kato!


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## RT_Coker

*"good for kids"???*



Conductorjoe said:


> I always explain it like buying a new car. You can buy an economy car or you can buy a BMW or a Corvette. Same thing with Models.The downfalls of Bachman are, lack of fine detail, lack of pulling power, lack of pickup power at low speeds and the noise factor.
> Nothing wrong with Bachman other than that. They have served the industry well for the newcomer or beginner for many years. They are also good for kids . You dont exactly want to give a child a $100 Kato engine.
> It just depends on what you want to spend. Its like anything else. "You get what you pay for".


Unfortunately, it is not good for kids to be turn-off to model railroading by the poor (or nonexistent) technical support from Bachmann and its forum! Just read some of the related post on the Bachmann/USA forum. But you must be quick and get to them before they mysteriously disappear!

Bob


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## Hold'ErNewt

big ed said:


> Do you mean it was correct and "someone" changed it?
> I thought when he first posted it was correct.


I thought so too. I think it's been changed.


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## Conductorjoe

RT_Coker said:


> Unfortunately, it is not good for kids to be turn-off to model railroading by the poor (or nonexistent) technical support from Bachmann and its forum! Just read some of the related post on the Bachmann/USA forum. But you must be quick and get to them before they mysteriously disappear!
> 
> Bob


Oh i know what youre sayin. I only have Atlas and Kato Locos. in N scale.I have always told anyone that asked me personally to start with Athearn and then Atlas in N scale but not everyone wants to spend the $.


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## raleets

RT_Coker said:


> Unfortunately, it is not good for kids to be turn-off to model railroading by the poor (or nonexistent) technical support from Bachmann and its forum! Just read some of the related post on the Bachmann/USA forum. But you must be quick and get to them before they mysteriously disappear!
> 
> Bob


RT,
By some chance are you also in the tire business?


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## StevenIsBallin

I got a bachmann spectrum 4-8-2 Light Mountain Steam Locomotive earlier this month and I am impressed with how smoothly it runs at low speed and how quiet it is. Granted its my first engine since I just started so I dont have any experience with other brands but just figured Id give my 2 cents.


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## Cprail43

StevenIsBallin said:


> I got a bachmann spectrum 4-8-2 Light Mountain Steam Locomotive earlier this month and I am impressed with how smoothly it runs at low speed and how quiet it is. Granted its my first engine since I just started so I dont have any experience with other brands but just figured Id give my 2 cents.


Spectrums are the advanced engines by bachmann. It's their "lets make some money" engines. Don't have one yet, but I believe these are the real deal bachmann products.


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## broox

i picked up a 2-10-0 spectrum the other day. looks quite detailed. has dcc and tsunami sound installed. got it for $130pp
the downside?
i dont have track laid...
and i dont get my Zephyr for a couple of weeks!


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## Prospect193

I have a Spectrum 2-6-6-2 C&O articulated Loco with Vandy Tender. I installed a Soundtraxx Tsunami TSU-750 and it absolutely rocks!!! Crawl speed is amazing and with the Tsunami the sounds are simply awesome.

Cheers
Pat


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## RT_Coker

raleets said:


> RT,
> By some chance are you also in the tire business?


No, not in the tire business, I am in the re-tire-d business.
Bob


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## Cprail43

Think I found my next engine.

http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/89806-SD40-CPR-5501-p/ath-89806.htm

15 today as well!!!


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## Conductorjoe

Nice.........Ive always thought of adding one from that scheme to my collection, but my wants list is very long


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## Cprail43

Conductorjoe said:


> Nice.........Ive always thought of adding one from that scheme to my collection, but my wants list is very long


Same here. A few engines I'd like to get would be an AC4400CW, an SW1200 switcher, and possibly a Canadian Pacific SD40-2F. A full cowl body engine only bought by cp.


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## New Berlin RR

I have the engines I wanted...well most...now I just need to try and put DCC in them....


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## Cprail43

New Berlin RR said:


> I have the engines I wanted...well most...now I just need to try and put DCC in them....


I try to find engines with preinstalled dcc


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