# Tworail's Marklin HO Layout



## tworail

OK going to join the HO scalers here finally with some construction project this winter.

I already have the lumber so there is no backing out, and most of the track is in the mail 

Anyways I like this plan because of all the different levels, but one thing it did not have was a hidden station, so I added that. It does also not have an area for loco service but I think I can live with that for now.

Here is the artist rendering from the book:










Here is my modified plan:










The plan is to use M tracks and a 6021 for digital control and later computer added.

Only concern is putting in the river as the first reversing loop (and hidden station tracks) must be UNDER the river bed. I guess the river will have different elevated sections as well to cover the tracks below. I figure I need about 3.5" of clearance, maybe 4" to have trains, track and 3-4mm of cork roadbed underneath.

Thanks for any comments or suggestions.


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## Reckers

Very ambitious....I'm impressed. Please keep us up with you via photos as it progresses.


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## Reckers

2 x 4, if you use the metal things. Simpson Strong-Tie is the product name, and they're used in home construction. I'm running out to a concert in just a few minutes, but I'll detail it tomorrow for you. Suffice to say that it's a sheet of plywood for a top, braces (2x4) below it to make it rigid, and then 4 2x4 legs. Give it a plywood lower shelf with braces and some wheels, and you can move concrete blocks with it. I'll get with you tomorrow to flesh it out.


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## Reckers

Okay, fleshing it out. Keep in mind this is simply my suggestion---I don't want to suggest my way is the only way.

(4) vertical 2 x 4's make the legs, with the 2" side facing the front (8') length
(2) sheets of plywood make the top and the shelf---shelf about 1' off the floor. I used 3/4", but you could go thinner.
each long (8') side has (2) 2 x 4 horizontal rails, one flush with the top, one just under the shelf.
each short side has similar rails.
Simpson makes simple (one-sided) lumber-hangers and complex(two-sided). Use whichever the store has and whichever you prefer. You need a box of 1" deck screws and a small handfull of common nails; the nails simply secure the top and the shelf from sliding, so they can be small and 1" long.
Finally, you will use cross-members to support both the top and the shelf. This takes a different kind of metal hanger, one at each end of each cross-member. 










I found an exact duplicate, less the cross-members and shelf, on google; apparently I'm not very original:











As you can see, the metal corner brackets cradle the rails on each side of each vertical 2x4, allowing you to keep them exactly where they belong while you shoot screws to secure them.

You will, however, need either a jig saw to notch the corners on the shelf, or a circular saw to shorten the plywood for the shelf to get it to fit (cut off 3.5 inches from the entire short side so it can slide between the legs).

If this wasn't clear enough, hit me with a question and we'll chase this puppy some more. Best of luck, and remember the carpenters' mantra: Measure twice, cut once.


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## tworail

What I might do is build something like that, framing only, then have the layout sit on top. I have some more pictures to upload I finished all the base benchwork but it needs some supporting work now. I was going to put a rectangle of 2x2 spruce on the bottom to brace it and create a stronger structure, then build the table above to fit into that, sitting on top.


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## tworail

What wood did you use specifically for your 2x4s?


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## T-Man

For 12 feet I suggest some kind of shelf in the center to give you 4 legs maybe 4 by4 or 4 by 6 area. The legs at the corners.
For 2 by 4 legs go with a 2 by 4 crossover to connect.
Height should be about 30 to 33 inches total because of the long reach. Like a counter top.Be sure to add the rollers to that too.
I prefer a pressboard to plywood, if you are covering everything in foam then it doesn't matter. Pressboard is easier to nail screw or drill.


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## tworail

I'm in the middle of creating a 4x8 brace of 2x2s that is underneath the 1x4 frame. 

I will then make the 4x8 table, with no top (as in no plywood top). The layout will sit on top of the frame of the table. I think I will put 6 wheels on it.

So far it's looking good, I've been flying by the seat of my pants but having some fun.


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## Reckers

Definitely the best plan---use the lumber you have and tweak it to perfection. *S*


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## tworail

OK, weekend update  Got the base bench work all done, whew.

I didn't have any specific plan in place when I did this... just sorta followed my nose. It actually turned out really well for a newb.










Decided to put the cross members in on 16" centers, pretty standard I guess. You need room to get in there and drill. So for 144" there is 10 cross-members 8 inside, 2 outside.










Here is the inner support scheme I came up with - definitely not an original idea.










I cut 2x2s to use as guides, which makes the installation of these braces really quick.










Chopping station. I rescued the Dewalt from a friends cottage yesterday.. the cottage is on a island, and the engine in the boat wouldn't start, so I had to row there and back, about 2 miles. YAY. 










More progress.










I think that's where I left on on Saturday night. Just had the top and end to put on. It turned out pretty square in the end, not many fitment issues or major 'oh sh*t' moments.










Was foggy this morning, it deserved some recognition.










What I think is a ruffed grouse trapped on the deck. Naturally he could not figure out the glass, and spent alot of time flying into it before I got him all the way around and off the deck.










All cross bracing and everything complete. On the ground it's fairly rigid, standing up it's naturally flexy.










So here is the brace I am putting on to pull things together, and the table top frame (still needs to be built) will go in there. 










So I did a test fit - without too much hassle a 4x8 sheet of plywood fit right inside, which is exactly what I wanted.










I didn't want to screw the 2x2 brace to the 1x4 pine, so I created an alternating frame around the whole thing, and screwed it in with 3" screws. That made it pretty strong.










Frame complete, ready to drop the brace on.










All done! 










I threw the whole thing up on some sawhorses - yes they are very high at this point. But will allow me to put in the mobile table frame underneath and play around with it.










Not bad for a weekend's work.


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## tankist

looks good. very good wodworkign actually.

why did you decide to cut the "inside" pieces so short. id think if you kept them full length you'd have more rigid construction i'd think.


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## tworail

tankist said:


> looks good. very good wodworkign actually.
> 
> why did you decide to cut the "inside" pieces so short. id think if you kept them full length you'd have more rigid construction i'd think.


Thanks. Not sure which ones you mean though?

I realized later on with the pine construction it's not the strongest out there when assembled, but once I add the ply wood levels it should be better. Sort of like the sum of all the pieces will make it strong, there is no one component that handles the full load. That's my hope anyways 

I can always add or move around the braces between the main boards ( the ones centered on 16") to give more strength where I need it.


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## tankist

see attached. what i mean that the ones i marked in yellow do not contribute to longitudinal strenght as much. they do help the construction hold its shape but only 2 of the blue beams provide rigidity in that dimension here. of course as soon as you put plywood on top things will stiffen considerably.








thats my frame below.i used 2x4's that i already had... all 7 beams are complete length. but then again i completely bent on sturdiness and usually over do things.


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## tworail

Yeah I see what you mean. I think it's a compromise in that type of construction, I was trying as much as possible to balance weight/strength as I might have to move it one day.


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## tworail

I'm sort of unsure as to what to make the final height of the layout to be at. I'm a tall person, so I hate stooping and all that. I would like to sit on a stool maybe when at the layout, something high up.

So maybe 42" or something. Tankist what height did you put yours at?


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## tankist

40 inches from the top of foam surface (i'm 6'0"). i didn't really shoot for particular height it just leveled like this. sometimes i wish it would have been higher, sometimes lower, i guess it is just right then LOL


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## T-Man

Tall Eh.
Mine is at 34 inches but I have to reach four feet. One side I has a two foot back drop. Stretch! The center is mostly decor . Higher is better for viewing if you can get away it.
I want to know how you are going to feed wires. That is quite a cross section of lumber. Seems like a lot of drilling.


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## tworail

I will be basically be drilling 1" holes in a couple key locations. Also, there is only a bit of the layout that will sit directly on the frame - due to the elevations everything is up a couple inches and more from 0"-12" in height.


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## tworail

OK Reckers, update just for you 

Here is under-table which the main bench work will sit on top of. It also doubles as storage. I might put a second shelf under there but not until I am done most of the work with the layout as I will need to get under there to work on wiring etc. All I need now are some caster wheels, just haven't found the right ones yet. I will also double up the bottoms of the legs with a section of 2x4 as the mounting area for the caster wheels are wide.


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## Reckers

Nice job, tworail....very neat, tight joints. That thing will still be rock-solid 30 years from now!


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## tankist

if might add - 
i just can't see this being 100% stable. once you put the top on and try to move it sideways the construction will wobble since it is only the joints that will resist. those steel thingies do help but they are to short (besides being in wrong plane). no matter how subtle but you will feel wobble when say sanding something or just bumping into 
IMHO you have to have cross-braces.

see attached.
your joins will feel the lever action of entire table.
remember the Archimedes "Give me a place to stand on, and I will move the Earth."


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## tworail

Yeah it probably needs a bit of that.. It's fairly rigid now but I need it open for access purposes - I will be likely sitting on the table part doing the wiring etc up above.

I put two braces underneath the plywood I can sit on it fine


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## tworail

Got some more work done in the last couple days, mostly because Tankist was making me paranoid about the strength of my benchwork  He raised very valid points about the deficiencies of my benchwork which did need to be addressed.










Braced the bottom of the table for more lateral strength. Bottom is pretty solid now, top not so much. But after bolting the top down it seems pretty good. I can move the whole thing on wheels with a couple fingers just pushing from the corner, and there is not much give at all.










I am really not a craftsman nor did I put much thought into the planning process around this, just did what I though would work under the circumstances and material available. I finally located some casters that had a threaded bolt attached to them, so the nut is sunk between the 2x4 legs and held in place with some Liquid Nails type adhesive.










I bought a bunch of pressboard to try out instead of plywood.. Initially I like the idea of using it but it's just not the same as wood. I think I may use it for scenery bases for the town and other areas, and stick to tried and true plywood for the track roadbed. Here I am just plotting my lines for 1 of the 2 return loops.










And here is my helper for the day to help with the professional lines 










Got the top bench on to the rolling table after reconfiguring some of the support scheme I had invented for it. Right now it's very rigid screwed into the 2x4 framing of the table bottom enough that I can stop worrying about it. Things did turn out pretty level and I was able to fix any glaring errors on my part by adjusting the casters.










A mock up on some pressboard of DR BR69 and car set of the 'Young DB'.










Reverse loop that started with the pressboard cut out.










I was so confident by this point I started mocking up the station area to be cut out. I would still like to have the station tracks a bit longer but I feel it would compromise the flow of the layout too much so I am going to leave it as is. I had resigned myself to running shorter trains a while ago with this plan due to R1 curves - kinda like 18 degree radius... Which is fine with me.



















Plan has been modified with new shadow station. This fixes many problems with the initial plan and allows more dramatic heights of the various upper levels. The only foreseeable problem might be access to the hidden station to fetch and fix derailed cars, but that is the only negative at this point.. Whereas before there was quite a few problems with putting the hidden station where is was, namely the grade down from the station, the river area, etc. Now the hidden station is at 0 elevation, and even with the river going on top I have tons up space between that and upper levels.


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## Cradle

awesome project, cant wait to see more updates


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## tworail

Thanks, things have been a bit slow with the holidays and all so there won't be much updates until January.


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## tankist

looks good.
and i love your use of specialty turnouts. for me model railroading is mostly about turnouts


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## Reckers

I love the car and marker arrangement. *L* I've been sitting here, pondering different ways of ensuring clearance when I do a layout next year---even brought a section of track into work to play with! Great-looking layout, too!


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## tworail

OK, it's been a month and I have barely made any progress. But I did get the base for the hidden station finalized, cut out and corked over. So far I'm happy with it, and I think part of that satisfaction comes from not rushing anything here. Snails pace = good work


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## Reckers

What is that expanse of flat area you've created? Is that the station and rails?


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## tankist

seems like you stapled the cork, is this so? if it is, why not glue?


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## tworail

The cork was glued with contact cement and temporarily stapled until it dried, then I was able to trim things up nicely. 

Reckers, the expanse is the shadow station. This will be the area that will allow me to park trains (won't be visible when layout is done as it's on the bottom) and from there trains will start and stop according to the automation I am setting up. Idea is I can sit back and watch trains enter and leave the main station on the mid level, and they will do the same thing at the shadow station - think of it as point B, whereas the main visible station is point A.


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## Reckers

Got it. Thanks for explaining.


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## tworail

OK after much fiddling and sourcing various pieces of stock I have gotten my 'wiring bus' completed. Now I can get to laying some TRACK! Well... waiting on a shipment of wire and other odds/ends but should be here Wednesday. Hopefully I can have the shadow station wired up and installed, then I can get on with the rest.

Sorry the camera really sucks down there, I should have probably waited until morning with more natural light.


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## dozer

So, curiousity is getting the better of me. I'm wondering, why the open girder construction top and why not just a flat ply top? Makes me wonder if I could have done something different on my layout that could have worked out better lol..


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## tjcruiser

I'm a bit late to the discussion party, but I just had to say ...










That is the coolest little gizmo I've seen in a while. I was looking at the photo showing the work-in-progress track/roadbed layout, thinking to myself, "I wonder how he got the roadbed curves so fair and smooth? Plotter? Splines?"

Well ... mystery solved ... Sharpie rides again!

Very clever ... very clever ...

TJ


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## tworail

Thanks!  Had to get creative there 

As far as open girder.. because the site has 4-6 levels (depending on how you count the shadow station) you need open girder in order to be able to build 'up' for example all the supporting framework for the different levels needs to be sturdy and the best way is to have it built off the open girders. Covering it in plywood would make construction and access difficult, as you need it open as possible to do the wiring etc.

Once I have that part going you will see why open girder is necessary for this type of layout.

Hope this helps


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## mkschram

Okay, I am impressed! Great job on the layour so far, tworail. I can't wait to see the finished product.


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## lama67

Hi, beautifull project. Do you have some Photos of your layout?


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## gunrunnerjohn

I don't think *tworail *is around anymore, we haven't seen him for quite some time.


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## joed2323

I dont think the recent poster realized how old this post was, tworail last posted over 2 years ago...

Now that gunner stated he has been gone for some time now i wonder if tworail is still kickin stones down the tracks??


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## Big Ed

gunrunnerjohn said:


> I don't think *tworail *is around anymore, we haven't seen him for quite some time.


*tworail?*

Who is that? 

*B&M *Who is that?

The biggest Model Train Forum mystery.
I hope they didn't end up with "Jimmy".


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## buickestate

wow looking good, and I love the fact that you are using marklin! I can assume that you are going with a euro theme?


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## joed2323

Lol. The op is gone and his tread is still getting hits, wow!


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## gunrunnerjohn

buickestate said:


> wow looking good, and I love the fact that you are using marklin! I can assume that you are going with a euro theme?


I assume the OP is long gone, so he won't answer.


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## tworail

gunrunnerjohn said:


> I assume the OP is long gone, so he won't answer.


I'm never too far away 

With a farm, new baby and a full time job I just don't have much free time for trains these days.. but winter is coming so that usually means there is a little more 'ME' time :thumbsup:

With regards to the layout, it's long been dismantled, in pieces in the barn. Not sure if I will resurrect it. I'm also more into G scale these days.


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## buickestate

does this mean there's going to be a marklin ho barn sale coming up?


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## tjcruiser

STOP THE PRESSES!!!

The Prodigal Son returns!!!

Glad to hear life's treating you well, TwoRail ... we're still kickin' along here in your absence, but it's always good to have you checking in!

All the best,

TJ


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## gunrunnerjohn

Who is that masked man?


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## Big Ed

tworail said:


> I'm never too far away
> 
> With a farm, new baby and a full time job I just don't have much free time for trains these days.. but winter is coming so that usually means there is a little more 'ME' time :thumbsup:
> 
> With regards to the layout, it's long been dismantled, in pieces in the barn. Not sure if I will resurrect it. I'm also more into G scale these days.



OK, which one of you Mods wrote that?


Tworail?
No excuse....no excuse.
Now we can call off part of the search and rescue teams scouring the Islands in the Caribbeans. 


Congratulations on the new one.
G scale, we have members asking about G all the time, they could use some of your knowledge on them. 

A farm?:thumbsup: Toss those G and do what Choo Choo did.:thumbsup:
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=8730


Now.........WHAT HAPPENED TO B&M?The Super Mod? Is he still down on the island?


Now I can finally stop asking what happened to Tworail.:appl:
I bet the mods will love that.


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