# Smoke unit question



## Defender (9 mo ago)

I just bought another steamer a K5 312, should look good by the 283 I have coming too. My question is, can you run the locomotive WITHOUT oil in the smoker???? Will it burn something out? Is there a switch you can turn off? Thanks all.


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Yes, you can run it w/o adding smoke fluid. This engine has likely been run with a dry smoke unit in its past life. What I do is is add a solvent to the smoke unit and let it sit for 8 hours or so, then run it. Many time this will soften the wick to where it will begin smoking. You need to get some smoke fluid. For Gilbert engines either SuperSmoke or JT's Megasteam work fine. There is no on/off switch. 
I recommend not using SuperSmoke all the time in modern Lionel AF engines with fan driven smoke units. Occasional use is ok.


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## Defender (9 mo ago)

AmFlyer said:


> Yes, you can run it w/o adding smoke fluid. This engine has likely been run with a dry smoke unit in its past life. What I do is is add a solvent to the smoke unit and let it sit for 8 hours or so, then run it. Many time this will soften the wick to where it will begin smoking. You need to get some smoke fluid. For Gilbert engines either SuperSmoke or JT's Megasteam work fine. There is no on/off switch.
> I recommend not using SuperSmoke all the time in modern Lionel AF engines with fan driven smoke units. Occasional use is ok.


THANK YOU for the help, much appreciated.


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

I see you purchased one link and one knuckle coupler engine. Do you plan to replace the link coupler on the 312? If you have some link coupler cars it is easy to make a transition car by replacing one of the LC's with a KC, then either engine can pull any of the cars. I have several transition cars so I can pull LC cars with moden Legacy engines that have electrocouplers.


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## Defender (9 mo ago)

AmFlyer said:


> I see you purchased one link and one knuckle coupler engine. Do you plan to replace the link coupler on the 312? If you have some link coupler cars it is easy to make a transition car by replacing one of the LC's with a KC, then either engine can pull any of the cars. I have several transition cars so I can pull LC cars with moden Legacy engines that have electrocouplers.


Yes I am going to convert the link to knuckle. I am told I need a special tool for $20 but wouldn't a Dremel cut off wheel do the same and pop the pin out? Your thoughts?


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Do not try to cut the pin with a Dremel, it it will not free the pin. You need the hollow tube to drive the pin out of the coupler bracket with a small hammer. There is a special split shank knuckle coupler to put a KC on a LC shank. Regular KC's will not work. A special split pin is needed to hold the KC on the LC bracket. The second tool in that $20 set is a hardened steel flaring tool to install new LC's. See Clinic #2 on the Port Lines site for all the details.


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## Defender (9 mo ago)

AmFlyer said:


> Do not try to cut the pin with a Dremel, it it will not free the pin. You need the hollow tube to drive the pin out of the coupler bracket with a small hammer. There is a special split shank knuckle coupler to put a KC on a LC shank. Regular KC's will not work. A special split pin is needed to hold the KC on the LC bracket. The second tool in that $20 set is a hardened steel flaring tool to install new LC's. See Clinic #2 on the Port Lines site for all the details.


Thanks, knew about the split knuckles, thought I could get by with the Dremel, so will buy the tool. Saw a video online on how to do it. Thank you very much. Your help, wisdom and knowledge is greatly appreciated.


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Those online videos are great for first timers. Back in the '60s when I was doing all these repairs for the first time there was no on line.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

Not to argue but a Dremel with a cutting disc works fine, I've been using this method since I started doing repairs, 30+ years.


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

One again we have evidence that flyernut's repair skills are better than mine! I only tried that once, bits of metal dust everywhere and damaged the coupler attachment shank. Got a tool set and never tried the Dremel again.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

AmFlyer said:


> One again we have evidence that flyernut's repair skills are better than mine! I only tried that once, bits of metal dust everywhere and damaged the coupler attachment shank. Got a tool set and never tried the Dremel again.


To each his own my friend, whatever works...


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## mopac (Feb 24, 2011)

I bought the tool set. Never tried the the dremel. To me, cutting the pin would not let the pin release.. It would still need to be punched out. With the tool set a couple whacks and pin is out.
I know flyernut does not reuse a pin but I also know some do.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

mopac said:


> I bought the tool set. Never tried the the dremel. To me, cutting the pin would not let the pin release.. It would still need to be punched out. With the tool set a couple whacks and pin is out.
> I know flyernut does not reuse a pin but I also know some do.


Yep, you still need a punch to knock it out, and I never re-use pins, they're only .50 cents or so so why bother...just me.


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## Defender (9 mo ago)

My 283 arrived in the mail. It looks nice. Cleaned the wheels on the tender and the contacts under the trucks. Made sure the armature turned freely and sprayed the heck out of the reverse unit, however there is a broken piece as shown in the photos. Put it in my craddle upside down and put power to the trucks and it runs, but very noisy. I see the broken piece is a tender weight. Should be able to glue it together. Wish I knew how to load a video here from my phone. I am sure if some of you heard it you would know exactly what the noise is. Is it safe to use Dawn dish soap and a soft paintbrush to clean the outside of the loco and tender?


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

Yep, that is just the tender weight. Never saw one that yellow color before.


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## Defender (9 mo ago)

AmFlyer said:


> Yep, that is just the tender weight. Never saw one that yellow color before.


Thanks, just wanted to be reassured. Where or what do you use for gear grease? Silicone or white lube, wheel bearing?


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## AmFlyer (Mar 16, 2012)

After cleaning all the gear teeth, sometimes not a simple job to get off all the solid buildup, I use a white lithium grease on the gears. A medium weight lube oil on all the axles and linkage pivot points. Same with the rod that drives the smoke unit piston. Some put lube on the sliding edge of the smoke unit piston, I do not.


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## Defender (9 mo ago)

AmFlyer said:


> After cleaning all the gear teeth, sometimes not a simple job to get off all the solid buildup, I use a white lithium grease on the gears. A medium weight lube oil on all the axles and linkage pivot points. Same with the rod that drives the smoke unit piston. Some put lube on the sliding edge of the smoke unit piston, I do not.


Thank you, I have all those products. Appreciate the help.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

I've switched from wheel bearing grease to white lithium grease. I also put a dab on my finger and put it into the smoke piston hole, and rub it around..


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## mopac (Feb 24, 2011)

LOL, I use the white stuff but was about to switch to what flyernut used.
Red and tacky, I guess not now. Thats funny.


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## AFGP9 (Apr 8, 2015)

I use the white lithium as well on the gears, side rods, linkage wheel bolt attachments, and a dab in the smoke piston and use Megasmoke. I put a dab of the white lithium in the smoke piston hole simply because I don't like metal on metal movement with such relatively tight clearance.

Kenny


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