# Lionel Postwar Classic F-3



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Here is an engine 2333, I bought as part of a set from the 80's. Over the years I tried to run it with little success. Overall the engine wasn't in great condition. What impressed me was that I now owned a piece from the 40's. Yeah the nosed was cracked. The frame was corroded from battery leakage. I noticed the rivets holding the motors together were loose. I wasn't about to part it out I wanted it to run, no not restored but my way.
Th e unit is original. The horn is rusted but I have kept the relay. I rebuilt the trucks. Both motors are running but my expectations fell short. In the end I only went with one engine. Two motors were just too loud from working against each other. I am not into large hauls so one was enough. The single ran so much quieter. I guess this is what my collection is all about. How I find it. How I improve it. Lastly, How I enjoy it!











The trucks and motors were a challenge so look for more on those later.
Bob


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## Boston&Maine (Dec 19, 2007)

I have always liked the looks the F-3 has, then with the Santa-Fe livery on it, just the absolute best there is... I always wondered how old dual engine Lionel engines ran and how much the motors clashed... Good work getting her back up and running


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*Horzontal motor*

Both motors were loose. So I removed the long rivets and replaced them with inch and a half screws. I also found aluminum spaces at the hardware store to fit up the brush plate. This stiffened the motors just fine. The second motor had a problem when runnng. The armature would swing for and aft. I later found out the forward thrust bearing was missing. I did manage to remove the rear gear to get at the armature and placed a spacer to correct the problem.This was only after I bought another motor from Ebay . The new motor came from a 2343 and had a different brush plate. It worked fine. So with three motors I did some testing and determined that they were not close to working with each other. Each had a different starting voltage. The noise during trial runs just seemed to verify my results. So I used one. Now I have two spares. After all of this I would have to say that the only way to use two motors is to start brand new. I would not try finding a second motor for a match up.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*On a Roll*

What your looking at is the bearing and axle used on the F-3. The shaft is for a non powered version because it is not swaged in the center for the brass worm gear.The stock bushing is shown on the bottom. 
What normally happenes over time the bushing wears placing more stress on the gear until it strips out. I had this problem in the front and decided to rebuild both trucks.
I did a little studying and found I needed a 3/16 in and 5/16 out bearing. Yes they make them that small. A commercial outfit won't sell them but hobby centers do. They are mostly used in RC cars.Duratrax is the company name.I found online that Tower Hobbies sells them out of Chicago. They specialize in RC Planes.
Last trick was to remove the wheels. A normal wheel puller will break the rim. My solution was to place the truck in a vise and punch the axle out. I used a piece of one inch banding stock three inches long. This material is more brittle than sheet metal. I cut a slot a quarter of an inch form one side and one and a half inches long to fit the axle.The thickness was just enough to get it under the wheel. I used the three inches to span the vise and support the wheel. Punching it out was quick and safe for the wheel. Also the tool can be used for a spacer when pressing both wheels on, and one side goes in faster than the other. The brass gear had to go on first. For some reason the holes were to small to fit the axle. I had to work them with a dremel to fit. Then the bearings went on and the wheels were last. There is a small play in the bearings.They had to be fitted squarely in the truck. I constantly turned the axle to make sure I didn't have any binding. This was just enough to prevent any sticking. Lastly when working on my better truck the bearing was loose inside. I had to use a spot of loctite. It worked fine. The noise level went down a lot just because of the bearings. So I had bought a set of ten bearings, two brass gears, and a wheel replacement for the one I broke,with that, I rebuilt both trucks.


the bearing updated 1/13












I need to clean my table.hwell:


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*See the movie*

I guess I am into movie making. Notice how quiet the engine is. I need to work the eunit.hwell:


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## igmuska (Nov 21, 2009)

Great train, we also have the F-3 2333(A) in near mint condition. The dual motors are extremely loud, and I strongly emphasize loud. Tomorrow I'll post the photos of it, and its brother, the dummy locomotive and their sister.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Since a 2344 thread is burning up the O scale section, I had to look at my 2333. This is an old thread and now it is time to add a little something. While checking out my screen vent on top I noticed my dirty windshield. I removed it and cleaned it up with tooth paste. Colgate if you need to know. It is still a little yellow over age, but it has helped and I thought I would add this on.


It is just difficult to show it. This is after cleaning. There are marks on the lower side of the windshield from glue I think, but they do not show from the outside. I tried to rub them out but no luck.

on cardboard.










on white foam core





































The last two are add ins. Enjoy.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

T-man I could have used this tread last week! I hate when you're missing a thrust washer and don't know it! Thanks for the info and pic!


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

You should have used toothpaste with whitener.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

That's clever (yet suprisingly simple) how the screen attaches ... looks like two panels from the outside, just one contoured strip on the inside. Neat.

Thanks for the look-see, T!

TJ


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

T-man, I will try the toothpaste. ( maybe with eds whitening idea!). My daughter of a year and one half liked you video( better then my trains I might add.). My 2344 is pretty loud but I never noticed it until you pointed it out. I'm intreaged about the motors starting point being at different voltages. As I don't know much about this stuff were the wires about the same length and of the same Guage, and would this make a difference in resistance? Would that effect the motor start points? Not questioning per say but would like to expand my knowledge of the subject. Thanks. Please excuse autocorect!


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

The wires, no. Just treat the motors equally. They are loud as a pair. I couldn't match the motors one had a problem and the second one didn't match up. I tested them as a pair and decided to go with one.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Ok, thanks. Just trying not to make mistakes in the future. It is a cool Alco. I have the cheaper 70s version one. The red just looks cool.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

You could find threads on F3's . Anything you could find on them would be helpful. Even if you went to other forums. Try CTT. Classic Toy Trains.


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## sjm9911 (Dec 20, 2012)

Thanks T-man, did not mean to side track your thread, sorry.


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## servoguy (Jul 10, 2010)

I have a 2333, 2343, and a 2353. All dual motors. None of them are particularly noisy. All are lubed with motor oil. The 2353 has a lot of usage. The 2333 has two motors picked at random. One motor was gone when I bought it.


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## callmeIshmael2 (May 28, 2012)

Your 2333 is as smooth as silk now. My first big Lionel diesel back in the late 50s was a 2343 ABA that was geared low but loud. I loved that sound; not so much the E-unit buzz. To get an engine from the 40s work and sound like that is quite the accomplishment, something only someone with lots of knowledge and creative engineering ideas would take on. Thanks for sharing this, TJ.:thumbsup:


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Bruce, that is my problem. Noise, HOW much!. I never operated one before this one and judging noise on you tube is not easy. My second motor may have worked but I went with one. The noise was working against each other? Also I do not need two motors. That is my current dilemma. Thanks for your input. This is where operating experience comes in and I have little with the dual motors. I did enjoy adding ball bearings! NO more bushings for this engine. I need to get my ears tuned somehow. 

One question do you like the rivet holding the motor together? I removed mine.


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## servoguy (Jul 10, 2010)

My experience with noisy locos is that they generally need lubrication. And I'm sure you know that to lube a 2343 you must disassemble the gear boxes.


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## Kwikster (Feb 22, 2012)

I would have suggested simichrome paste for cleaning the lens. It doesn't take much, I've used it to remove scratches from gauge lenses on older cars. Don't rub too hard or it will distort the lens.

Carl


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

*What's up*

I tried twice to add pictures to this thread . So I will just post and try again.

























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The dummy A unit is up front and is a 2343. Now I have a pair. The engine is a 2333

Note the difference of the rear decals.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Very nicely "weathered", T!



TJ


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