# No Clue what to do HELP PLEASE



## wilbwworker

Hello All,
I own a 1940's era Lionel Train set with a ZW transformer. My Dad used it when he was a kid and I used it when I was a kid. I now have two sons a 6 and a 4 year old. I had both an engine and a ZW transformer completely gone through with a fine tooth comb by a local professional. I watched him use both the engine and transformer at his shop after he went through them.

I came home and hooked up my transformer and plopped my engine on it eager to let it run a bit before I let my kids know that is was ready for them. The transformer lit up, but the engine wouldn't move at all. It wouldn't even light up the headlight. I played with the lever on the top that the repair showed me how to use. I put it all the way to the right and all the way to the left but nothing at all happened. Now I JUST watched the thing fly around the track at the repair guy's shop. 

I even put a passenger car with lights on the rail to see if it would light up and it did. So power is getting to the track. 

What the heck am I doing wrong?


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> Hello All,
> I own a 1940's era Lionel Train set with a ZW transformer. My Dad used it when he was a kid and I used it when I was a kid. I now have two sons a 6 and a 4 year old. I had both an engine and a ZW transformer completely gone through with a fine tooth comb by a local professional. I watched him use both the engine and transformer at his shop after he went through them.
> 
> I came home and hooked up my transformer and plopped my engine on it eager to let it run a bit before I let my kids know that is was ready for them. The transformer lit up, but the engine wouldn't move at all. It wouldn't even light up the headlight. I played with the lever on the top that the repair showed me how to use. I put it all the way to the right and all the way to the left but nothing at all happened. Now I JUST watched the thing fly around the track at the repair guy's shop.
> 
> I even put a passenger car with lights on the rail to see if it would light up and it did. So power is getting to the track.
> 
> What the heck am I doing wrong?



there are 2 handles on the Z did you try both?
what color is the light on the Z? blinking red? one green?

how is it hooked to the tracks? by a lockon?

wires hooked up right?

what engine?
did you try moving the lever that reverses it, the e unit?


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## gunrunnerjohn

Does the light in the passenger car vary in intensity as you move the power lever on the transformer?


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## wilbwworker

You guys are quick,

Green light stays on the whole time. 
The red light came on when I increased the power. 
I tried all four power levers and hook ups
I am using a lockon
I moved that darn lever on top of the train that controls the e unit all over the place
I think the light got brighter on the passenger car as I increased the power
Engine is a Lionel 2055 from the 40's
My kids go to bed in a few minutes so I will start working on it again and maybe provide some better answers to your questions


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> You guys are quick,
> 
> Green light stays on the whole time.
> The red light came on when I increased the power.
> I tried all four power levers and hook ups
> I am using a lockon
> I moved that darn lever on top of the train that controls the e unit all over the place
> I think the light got brighter on the passenger car as I increased the power
> Engine is a Lionel 2055 from the 40's
> My kids go to bed in a few minutes so I will start working on it again and maybe provide some better answers to your questions


Unless you got the lens covers mixed up the red light indicates a short somewhere. Any metal touching the track?

that engine has magnatraction make sure you did not pick up any metal around the gears magnatraction will pick up metal

it is probably something simple if it was just running at the shop.

how do you have the power hooked up to the transformer what did you put to what terminal?

I got to ask, one guy had his lockon hooked up wrong. 
after 25 posts we figured it out:laugh:


edit,
are the wheels turning by hand?


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## gunrunnerjohn

I'm with Ed here, sounds like a short somewhere in your track.

Did you check the insulators for EVERY track tie on the center rail?

Have you considered putting the engine on just a couple pieces of straight track and powering it up that way?


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## wilbwworker

I am using a lockon like the guy at the shop showed me. One clip to the middle rail and the other on the outer rail. I have two insluated wires coming off of the lockon. One to the common and one to the .... heck I forgot what he called it...The lower row of connections. 

I have no idea how to check or what an insulator for the center rail is....

I did put it on a brand new piece of track I bought, hooked it up and the same thing happened

How do I check insulators?


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## wilbwworker

The lighs on the passenger car definitely increase and decrease as I increase or decrease the power. I have it hooked up to some brand new track I purchased and it is doing the same thing


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## T-Man

Forget the track take one wire on the outer wheel and the other one on the middle roller between the drivers.


Here is the ZW insrtuctions you may want to copy them

You may want to read this too..
Basic O/027 manual


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## gc53dfgc

or better yet reverse the way you have the wires hooked up to the lockon. It sounds like you have the positive hooked up to where the negative should be and the negative where the positive should be. Positive is for center rail and Negative is for outer rail (does not matter which one). This would make it so the passenger car would still light up as the car does not car wich way the power is flowing but the engine does care.


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## wilbwworker

I did what you said I turned the engine over and put one wire to an outer wheel and one wire to one of the power "pickups" that touch the center rail. 

All that happened was that the red light on my ZW turned on but I couldn't get the wheels to turn.


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## gc53dfgc

wilbwworker said:


> I did what you said I turned the engine over and put one wire to an outer wheel and one wire to one of the power "pickups" that touch the center rail.
> 
> All that happened was that the red light on my ZW turned on but I couldn't get the wheels to turn.


try simply flipping the wires that tough the wheels around and see if that fixes it.


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## wilbwworker

I touched each wheel and both pickups and the same thing happened. I just tried to switching over from using the "Green" light side of the transformer to the "Red" light side. When I hooked everything up and increased the power the red light went on but nothing happened. when I decreased the power the red light went off. The green light stayed on the whole time.

I am completely frustrated....


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## gunrunnerjohn

Since this is A/C, and there is only a single thing connected, the sense of the connections is not significant. There is a short, probably in the engine if you've eliminated the track and transformer.


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## wilbwworker

do you think the problem is the transformer, the engine or more likely .... me??


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## Big Ed

Read the manual on the Z it shows how the transformer works.

You can set up 2 tracks one handle powers 1 engine and the other off the other handle.
You can run them independent of each other.

The red light will ONLY come on with a short, when your running 2 trains with both handles you should only see green.

If your train jumps the rail it will short out stopping the train and the red will come on.

Take a look at the manual and learn about the transformer.

I think you got wires hooked up wrong somehow.
It ran at the shop.

I could be wrong.

That Z will handle running 4 trains.:thumbsup:


edit, what gauge (size) wire are you using?


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## tjcruiser

Wilb, etc.,

You guys are pointing towards the transformer. I'm not so sure about that. I'm suspecting something with the loco itself. Since the headlight isn't working at all, I'm wondering if the main power lead wire from the pickup leaders has broken. It could be something with the e-unit, too ... stuck in neutral or a bend / dislodged e-unit finger. If that were the case, though, I would expect the headlight to work. But he said it doesn't, which points me back to a power lead.

Next step might be to remove the loco shell, and use banana-lead jumpers to run power (from the middle rail) directly to the e-unit (where the power lead is normally soldered on). Another jumper wire from the motor frame back to the outer rail.

Ohh ... here's a question ... is there any sign of life that the e-unit plunger is going up and down with power on/off ???

We'll stick with ya' on this one!

TJ


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## Big Ed

tjcruiser said:


> Wilb, etc.,
> 
> You guys are pointing towards the transformer. I'm not so sure about that. I'm suspecting something with the loco itself. Since the headlight isn't working at all, I'm wondering if the main power lead wire from the pickup leaders has broken. It could be something with the e-unit, too ... stuck in neutral or a bend / dislodged e-unit finger. If that were the case, though, I would expect the headlight to work. But he said it doesn't, which points me back to a power lead.
> 
> Next step might be to remove the loco shell, and use banana-lead jumpers to run power (from the middle rail) directly to the e-unit (where the power lead is normally soldered on). Another jumper wire from the motor frame back to the outer rail.
> 
> Ohh ... here's a question ... is there any sign of life that the e-unit plunger is going up and down with power on/off ???
> 
> We'll stick with ya' on this one!
> 
> TJ



True , the headlight itself will short it out.

First he should verify if he has the transformer hooked up right.

If so then pull the shell and check it out. 
Not that hard,


Didn't you say the shop did all that?


edit,
yes you did,

I had both an engine and a ZW transformer completely gone through with a fine tooth comb by a local professional.


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## wilbwworker

So does # 1 on the lockon go to the Common row or bolts on the transformer or does #2?? I will read the ZW manual tonight and repost tomorrow if I see anything I did blatantly wrong. 

BTW you guys rock. I can't tell you how frustrated I am but I stumbled onto this forum and you all are extremely patient and helpful with a wick noob. The funny thing is I was telling my wife how I used to set up and run this thing all the time when I was a kid of 8 years old. I could trouble shoot it and everything. Now I am all thumbs but I am hoping it comes back to me sooner than later.


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## tjcruiser

I'm not really ZW savvy, but I believe the U terminal is ground to either outer rail, then choose either A, B, C, or D terminal (depending upon throttle) to inner "hot" rail. (All should be 6 to 20 V AC.)

B and C bypass the transformer's internal whistle control. I'd try either of those, first. A and D are routed through the whistle control within the transformer.

Other guys here ... please set me straight if I have any of this wrong.

I assume you're installing the LockOn to the track properly ?

TJ


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## Big Ed

#1 on the lockon goes to the bottom D #2 goes to the U right above the D.

For a second track connect #1 to A and #2 to The U above it.

One side for each handle...(controller) 2 trains two throttles.

U&B for accessories....UC too. (the 2 middle hookups.)

Did you happen to drop or bang anything during transport back from the shop?


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## T-Man

If you think something broke. Look at this piece and compare it to yours.

The light bulb wire may have come loose and is shorting the works out. 

It is probably something simple.


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## wilbwworker

Okay I downloaded, printed and read the instructions that someone was kind enough to post. I am convinced I have a short circuit somewhere. 

T - Man I have no idea what that picture is of. Should I take the engine apart to look at the inside? I am thinking that it may have to do with some of the insulators on the track itself. The original track is 66 years old and I haven't used it in about 30 years or so. The possibility of a problem there is pretty good.

The two pieces of new track I bought should be insulated though right? Do I need to put insulators on new track? Do I need to screw it down to a table before it is "grounded"? 

My kids are awake now (it being 6:00 am on a Saturday and all) so I won't get a shot to look at it again until later on. I need to get this working before I bring them out to my workshop where it is set up. They LOVE playing with it even though they have no idea it (theoretically) could move all by itself without them pushing it. I haven't let them touch it since I brought it back from the shop.

I was uber gentle with it on the way back from the shop so I don't think I dropped it or banged it but who knows.


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> Okay I downloaded, printed and read the instructions that someone was kind enough to post. I am convinced I have a short circuit somewhere.
> 
> T - Man I have no idea what that picture is of. Should I take the engine apart to look at the inside? I am thinking that it may have to do with some of the insulators on the track itself. The original track is 66 years old and I haven't used it in about 30 years or so. The possibility of a problem there is pretty good.
> 
> The two pieces of new track I bought should be insulated though right? Do I need to put insulators on new track? Do I need to screw it down to a table before it is "grounded"?
> 
> My kids are awake now (it being 6:00 am on a Saturday and all) so I won't get a shot to look at it again until later on. I need to get this working before I bring them out to my workshop where it is set up. They LOVE playing with it even though they have no idea it (theoretically) could move all by itself without them pushing it. I haven't let them touch it since I brought it back from the shop.
> 
> I was uber gentle with it on the way back from the shop so I don't think I dropped it or banged it but who knows.



Look at the center rail you will see a cardboard like paper over each tie. Those are the insulating the center rail. They are not talking about the pins.

That picture is the e unit, the lever you were switching back and forth.

Clean the track too, there are threads here how to do it.

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=2433&highlight=cleaning+track

Does it run the way they told you to hot wire it with jumper wires?

Did you look in the gears for any metal?

Do the wheels turn by hand?


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## T-Man

This must be frustrating for you!

It ran at the shop but not now.
It didn't run with my suggestion od using the two wires and have it off the track.

I found the manual for your engine a real beauty. I don't have one but others like it. 

As ED pointed out that picture is your reverse mechanism called an e unit.
In the center is a drum that turns. If it breaks, it shorts out and could smoke your engine. I akways check there first. This device in in the forward part and the LEVER is connected to it. That is why you cannot see it. Normally they are in back and visible from the under side. A loose wires in the front coulc as short the motor.

Simce this is for kids, I suggest you get a cheeper Scout type engine for the kids to use. You have another reason to go back and talk to your LH Shop.

Your track is still suspect? Just place them togther in groups of three or four and move the clip and engine to each one. They can't all be bad. A badly placed screw in the table CANNOT touch a CENTER Rail. That will short it out.

Also bad connections generate lots of heat. You may be able to feel out the bad spot.

The middle rail shows the cardboard insulator. They could be missing on old track or worn out.









If you want to look at everything, that is why I gave you the basic manual.

Normally something goes wrong from an action you accomplished.
The engine worked at the shop and didn't at home. It makes sense that the track was assembled or wired incorrectly. Without pictures or a good sescription doesn't help us help you. The engine should of worked with my suggestion.


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## wilbwworker

It looks like the track is insulated. How do I get at the E unit to check for loose wires? I assume I have to take off the shell. I think I can manage that. I am certain I have a short I just don't know where...... 

The wheels on the engine are free of metal
The wheels on the engine turn freely
I wired it according to the manual so that I didn't have the wires reversed


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## gunrunnerjohn

tjcruiser said:


> Wilb, etc.,
> 
> You guys are pointing towards the transformer. I'm not so sure about that. I'm suspecting something with the loco itself.
> 
> TJ


Well, that's what I said previously. Since the passenger car lights and the lights vary with the transformer setting, I'd be looking at the engine as well.


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## wilbwworker

Okay I have the shell off and I am looking at the E unit. That I have no prior knowledge to draw from I am looking for the obvious stuff. Loose wires and whatnot. I will check back and let you know what if anything I come up with. Would pics of the e unit help?


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## wilbwworker

I took another train that I have... also about 50 - 60 years old and not working and touched the wires from the transformer to the pickups and an outside wheel. It also shows a short circuit. 

I don't see any loose wires at all on the original train 2055 with the shell off. I even took the light bulb out just to eliminate that as a potential completed/shortd circuit and it still showed a short circuit.

At this point and with this much time and money invested I fear I could have purchased new..... I am new to this site but I have been trying to get this thing working for a couple of months now


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> I took another train that I have... also about 50 - 60 years old and not working and touched the wires from the transformer to the pickups and an outside wheel. It also shows a short circuit.
> 
> I don't see any loose wires at all on the original train 2055 with the shell off. I even took the light bulb out just to eliminate that as a potential completed/shortd circuit and it still showed a short circuit.
> 
> At this point and with this much time and money invested I fear I could have purchased new..... I am new to this site but I have been trying to get this thing working for a couple of months now



Is it an old lockon?

Try taking the wires off the lockon and instead temporarily jam the wire on the under side of the track (the new pieces) in the underside groove.
Maybe the lockon is bad?

Put the train on and try it. No need to put the shell on.
While it is on the track move the e unit lever.

I can't understand why it ran a the shop and not home. you said he "completely" serviced the Z and the engine.

pictures? yes the more the better. clear as you can shoot them.

Look where the bulb sits and make sure that gasket on the wire is in place.
Do you have a test light?
Look for other wires rubbing through on metal?

the lever on the e unit needs to contact each position too maybe you bent it a little?


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## Big Ed

T mans........

E UNIT



http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=3040

video,

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=6131

more from t,

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=5845


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## T-Man

Two engines! You need to find the short or post pictures from all the angles.

The drum on the e unit should turn. So with two wires at half throttle touch each side of the e unit with the lever on it's contact point. It should cycle every time it is touched.

Do you have a small transformer instead of the Big ZW?? To test you need very little.


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## gunrunnerjohn

I'm wondering if the ZW has a bum circuit breaker. Since it has two, try the other primary control and see if that allows your train to run normally. It's possible that the power draw from the lighted car isn't enough to force the issue, but the draw of the engine trips the bad breaker.

A bad breaker isn't hard to fix if that's the issue.


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## NIMT

For those that have a working ZW if you take the two wires off of the variable outputs and touch them together do you not get a spark before they trip the overload?, It's not instant? 
A bleeding or bad circuit breaker will open under light load with no sparking. I had an old Lionel transformer that would do exactly that.
You could also test the power supply with a static load (big resistor) to see if it is a bad circuit breaker?


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## gunrunnerjohn

I get a nice healthy spark from the ZW or the KW, so that should work. I also load test with a couple of automotive headlight lamps at 12V. Stick my A/C ammmeter in series with the light and crank up the voltage to test under load.


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## tjcruiser

Wilb,

I asked above, but will repeat, because I think it would offer some clue ...

Now that you know a bit about e-units (per T and Ed's comments above), you might see that the "heart" of an e-unit is a little cylindrical plunger that get's forced up (magnetically) inside a solenoid coil when power is applied to the loco. You can actually hear this happen. Gravity drops the plunger back down when power is dialed down (assuming the train is upright, and not upside down).

As you apply power to the loco (best done directly from the transformer via a wire to the loco center pickup rollers and the loco frame or drive wheels), can you hear or see the e-unit plunger rise up inside the solenoid? If it does (which is good / normal operation), the little "hand" or "pawl" at the bottom of the plunger will turn the e-unit drum (as seen the T's photo in post #22 above) one-eigth of a turn.

Separately ...

You do NOT need a full loop of track to test a loco. In fact, often a short somewhere along the length of the track can cause frustrating problems that are hard to identify. Instead, clip only 2 or 3 sections of track together, with their ends open and unconnected. (You can place a soft towel or rag at the open end of each runway.)

Do you have a multimeter? If so, check to make sure that the center rail on this short section of track is isolated (not connected electrically) to either of the two outer rails. The two outer rails should be connected to each other, but not to the center rail.

When you clip on your LockOn, one wire should run power to the center rail (only), and the other wire should run power to either of the outer rails.

Keep with it ... we'll try to get you running!

Detailed photos of the loco with the shell removed would help. Also, the back of your transformer and how you're running wires to the track.

TJ


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## wilbwworker

Gentlemen,
I have had a breakthrough of sorts. As I took the shell off and began to look at the E unit my father came over to help. We were touching the wires hooked up to the transformer and looking for signs of life from the E unit. My Dad started moving the inside power levers ( the ones that you are supposed to hook accessories up to) We had the engine hooked up to a new insulated piece of track. I put the engine down on the track and then moved the power lever that controls the engine. It started to move down the track and smoke came out of the stack!! It was a bit like the movies Awakenings in my house.


Anyways I could not for the life of me understand why moving the interior power lever on the transformer affected the actual power lever (the outside one) so we started using the multitester only to discover the transformer was putting out about 2 volts. Now I was completely confused. However the loco would move down the track if we manipulated both levers. So I decided to try it out on the big loop I have set up.

I set it all up on the track plugged in the transformer and nothing happened expect for that hum that comes out of the transformer. As I manipulated both levers the same as I did a few minutes ago the transformer started smoking......

SOooooo I am kind of back to square one but I think at least I made some progress. I think the loco is okay but the smoking transformer may be my problem. 

So now my question is this:

Do I bring my recently serviced ZW back to the guy who serviced it? (My thought is yes. He is a good guy, I don't think he did anything nefarious on purpose) Or does this sound like something that is easily fixable like a circuit breaker that I could fix myself.


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## gunrunnerjohn

Sounds like you have the ZW wired incorrectly, or the "servicing" did some creative wiring. It wouldn't be hard to make it work backwards, but you wouldn't want to.


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## T-Man

*Better late than never.*


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## NIMT

OH and I since have not seen anyone mentioned it.
Do Not Hold onto any conductive(metal) portion of the supply wires or E-unit contacts. The collapsing magnetic field tends to give one heck of a Zap upon removal of the electric and the collapse of the magnetic field!


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## tjcruiser

Uhh ... smoke out of the ZW is not a good thing. For sure, bring it back politely to the guy who serviced it. Hopefully, the required fix won't be to difficult / costly. Smoke is not a good sign, though ...

Best of luck ... keep us posted!

TJ


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## wilbwworker

Yeah I didn't think so... I called him and left a message so I am hoping to talk with him tomorrow. Looks like it is going back to him and my train project is delayed again


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## tjcruiser

On any layout, it's not a bad idea to have a 2nd, cheap, smaller transformer for backup, accessories, etc. (Case in point.) You can pick up a simple old-school 45 or 60 watt single output for under $20 on ebay. A workhorse / bulletproof 1033 might cost a bit more than that, but well worth it.

Good luck!

TJ


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## gunrunnerjohn

tjcruiser said:


> Uhh ... smoke out of the ZW is not a good thing. For sure, bring it back politely to the guy who serviced it. Hopefully, the required fix won't be to difficult / costly. Smoke is not a good sign, though ...
> 
> Best of luck ... keep us posted!
> 
> TJ


Did the smoke come out of the ZW or the engine? The "stack" sounds like the engine.


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## wilbwworker

The smoke came out of the stack on the engine and then out of the ZW itself.... You guys are terrific to keep on helping me and I will keep you posted on what happens. 

Either way this seems like a real friendly place so I think I will stay a while


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> The smoke came out of the stack on the engine and then out of the ZW itself.... You guys are terrific to keep on helping me and I will keep you posted on what happens.
> 
> Either way this seems like a real friendly place so I think I will stay a while



A picture of all the smoke would have been nice.


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## gc53dfgc

wilbwworker said:


> The smoke came out of the stack on the engine and then out of the ZW itself.... You guys are terrific to keep on helping me and I will keep you posted on what happens.
> 
> Either way this seems like a real friendly place so I think I will stay a while


I think after all of the trouble this is causeing I would just march down there and have him fix it for free or show you what you are doing wrong.


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## wilbwworker

Yeah I think he will stand by his work. Struck me as an honest man. I am hoping this turns out to be a positive experience. All of this frustration has taken away from what I was hoping to be a real positive experience. Something for my Dad, myself and my kids to work on together. I will be talking to him today for sure.

As for a pic of the smoke, well as you can imagine between deciding whether or not the throw the thing out the window or unplug it.....

The worst part was my Dad was trying to help and started go through steps I had already covered so I had to sit there and let him work through everything I already did. He wouldn't listen to me that I had already done all of that. BUT I didn't listen to him all through my childhood as he often reminds me so he figures we are even.


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## Big Ed

Father like son.

You should tell him he broke it now he has to buy you a new one!:laugh:


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## gunrunnerjohn

Smoke from the ZW is very bad!


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## tjcruiser

wilbwworker said:


> The worst part was my Dad was trying to help and started go through steps I had already covered so I had to sit there and let him work through everything I already did. He wouldn't listen to me that I had already done all of that. BUT I didn't listen to him all through my childhood as he often reminds me so he figures we are even.


"When I was a boy of 14, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be 21, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years." -- Mark Twain


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## inxy

On vintage early 50's ZW the upper row of terminals (common) are all fed from a copper bus bar connecting the terminals and the bar is fed by one wire. The output terminals where you run the wire to the track are riveted to the bus bar and are prone to coming loose from the bus bar by over tightening the terminal nut. On my ZW the bus bar become loose, flexed and bent to ground out one of the speed control levers causing a short and smoking from the transformer. Something to check. Four screw will get the cover off the ZW.

B


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## wilbwworker

I took off the cover and hooked the train back up. Same thing as yesterday. I had a brief moment where the loco worked and then the short circuit light came on and nothing moved or lit up


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## wilbwworker

Well I just got off the phone with the guy that fixed my transformer. I am glad to say that he was exactly the gentlemen I thought he was. I am stopping by tomorrow with the loco and the transformer and we are going to hook it up to his layout and figure out what the issue is. 

He told me he would give me my money back or trade me some working transformers for the ZW if it is broken. He will use it for parts as he repairs a lot of these. He told me I would leave his place tomorrow with a working transformer and loco. Just what I was hoping for. 

As as aside I cannot thank you all enough for hanging with me for 6 pages of posts. I have learned more in two days on this forum than the last 3 months with a book on wiring trains. I know have the manual for both my transformer and both of my loco's and a wealth of knowledge. When I do get up and running I have a good base of background information to work from.

Most importantly my kids are going to be thrilled and I will have found something else to share with them that we can do together. I will keep you all posted on my progress but I am hoping to check in tomorrow with some good news!


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## gc53dfgc

I saw in a tracks ahead program that someone had a controller just like yours and the little roller that rolls across the coil in the controller was becomeing red-white hot and all of the power was going to it. He fixed it by machineing gold rollers for it (because he was a dentist) maybe you just need new rollers for the thing?

Found the episode
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d4SaPWgpmY&feature=channel_video_title

This could be your problem but I am not sure.


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## wilbwworker

Might be I am going to head over to my repair guy's house tomorrow and play with it a little.... I love the ZW as it has some emotional appeal to me being it has been in the family for 60 + years and all but I mostly want the darn thing to work. My two boy's have been super patient watching me work on the train, tracks and transformer and are chomping at the bit to see the full set up work.

If this guy offers me two single train transformers for the ZW he might have a deal.


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## Big Ed

I would want a ZW in return. 
Back in it's day it was the Cadillac of transformers.:thumbsup:

Did you look at the plate like someone mentioned when you had the cover off? 
When you hooked the wires to the back terminals did you crank them tight with pliers? Maybe you bent it?

Though he sounds like a reputable man I would ask him to fix the Z.
You said that he went over everything.

If it was me, I would want the ZW back.


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## T-Man

I believe to rebuild the ZW you get a set of carbon rollers and pins.
The KW may have them too but I never got to it.


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## gc53dfgc

T-Man said:


> I believe to rebuild the ZW you get a set of carbon rollers and pins.
> The KW may have them too but I never got to it.


Or if you want a super effiecent controller that will always be worth something you get some gold rollers and pins.:laugh:


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## gunrunnerjohn

T-Man said:


> I believe to rebuild the ZW you get a set of carbon rollers and pins.
> The KW may have them too but I never got to it.


The KW also has the rollers.


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## wilbwworker

I do LOVE the look of the ZW... I hope he can fix it. I took the cover off and looked at the bar and everything... I can't see or don't know if anything is wrong. Might be my ignorance


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## wilbwworker

Success!.... sort of. Well I brought the ZW and my two loco's plus some other cars I had over to the gentlemen's house who worked on the transformer. He put it through its paces and declared the core gone. When he tested the loco's the same thing happened to him. I was a bit relieved. He offered me two transformer's and my money back. He genuinely felt terrible.

I told him to keep the money as he did put his time into fixing it and I appreciated his honesty and effort. He refused. Long story short I left his house with four transformers:

two smaller ones that still run my loco but he suggested I use for accessories 

two 125 watt transformers that were newer and restored by him

A new coal tender 

a bunch of lock ons

and he offered to fix up my 1666 Prairie

Needless to say I am thrilled. I am working late tonight but tomorrow night my two boys will be playing with the trains!!!


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> Success!.... sort of. Well I brought the ZW and my two loco's plus some other cars I had over to the gentlemen's house who worked on the transformer. He put it through its paces and declared the core gone. When he tested the loco's the same thing happened to him. I was a bit relieved. He offered me two transformer's and my money back. He genuinely felt terrible.
> 
> I told him to keep the money as he did put his time into fixing it and I appreciated his honesty and effort. He refused. Long story short I left his house with four transformers:
> 
> two smaller ones that still run my loco but he suggested I use for accessories
> two 125 watt transformers that were newer and restored by him
> A new coal tender
> a bunch of lock ons
> and he offered to fix up my 1666 Prairie
> 
> Needless to say I am thrilled. I am working late tonight but tomorrow night my two boys will be playing with the trains!!!



As long as you are satisfied that is all that counts.
Do you have a table yet?

_hit happens, it is good that someone stands by his work and makes it right.
Ask him if you can post his place of business here or a phone #, maybe someone else around you needs something fixed too. Strum up a little work for him if he wants it.

I would still want my ZW back. 

But it sounds like he made you a good deal.


For all he knows you could have cooked it somehow.


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## inxy

Where is this store at ? Great to see a satisfied customer. Every once in a while somebody does it right and makes your day. Nice guy !

B


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## Big Ed

inxy said:


> Where is this store at ? Great to see a satisfied customer. Every once in a while somebody does it right and makes your day. Nice guy !
> 
> B




To far for you it is up in Massachusetts.
Unless you have an airplane.


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## tjcruiser

Sounds like a very honest guy. Good for him ... good for you.

Happy ending!

TJ


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## zzlentz

And this is why I joined this particular forum....You guys know your stuff


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## wilbwworker

Well here I am so many months later and $ later BUT. I ended up buying all new track today. About 110 dollars worth to replace the 65 + year old track I was using. The loco (Lionel O gauge 2055 Santa Fe circa 1944) had a rough time picking up the connection at the far end of my loop. 

I decided that after all the time, energy and money I spent on the transformer issues and getting the loco moving that my setup deserved some new track. Soooo I went a little crazy at the LHS but I don't want to drive out there again anytime soon so I made sure I had more than enough for what I am thinking of for a layout.

I put it a small oval together on my den floor tonight just to test everything before I let my two boys set it all up this weekend out in the workshop. I spent an hour just watching it go in a circle. Ran like a top!

I just bought a book on wiring up my track for a larger setup so I am sure to have more questions soon. Thanks again guys. I will have to attach some pics when I get the chance.


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## Big Ed

wilbwworker said:


> Well here I am so many months later and $ later BUT. I ended up buying all new track today. About 110 dollars worth to replace the 65 + year old track I was using. The loco (Lionel O gauge 2055 Santa Fe circa 1944) had a rough time picking up the connection at the far end of my loop.
> 
> I decided that after all the time, energy and money I spent on the transformer issues and getting the loco moving that my setup deserved some new track.  Soooo I went a little crazy at the LHS but I don't want to drive out there again anytime soon so I made sure I had more than enough for what I am thinking of for a layout.
> 
> I put it a small oval together on my den floor tonight just to test everything before I let my two boys set it all up this weekend out in the workshop. I spent an hour just watching it go in a circle. Ran like a top!
> 
> I just bought a book on wiring up my track for a larger setup so I am sure to have more questions soon. Thanks again guys. I will have to attach some pics when I get the chance.


I use 14 gauge for power to the rails. Run multiple hookups around the layout, when you expand the track.

Keep the old track, how bad is it, just clean it up.
I (and others here) have track older then that and it works fine with a little elbow grease.
What model transformers did you end up with?

How much room can you dedicate to the layout?
Where will you set it up basement, attic, garage?


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