# American Flyer Couplers Pros and Con



## dadstruck

I have been collecting American S scale trains for about 5 years and have both the link and knuckle type coupler.  I am having trouble with link type being sticky and come uncoupled. Some of the knuckle type have broken locking arms a sticky release mechanism. 
Which is the better coupler? Before I start refitting all my rolling stock.
Thanks Phil


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## flyernut

dadstruck said:


> I have been collecting American S scale trains for about 5 years and have both the link and knuckle type coupler. I am having trouble with link type being sticky and come uncoupled. Some of the knuckle type have broken locking arms a sticky release mechanism.
> Which is the better coupler? Before I start refitting all my rolling stock.
> Thanks Phil


Hi Phil..I have both types also.. The link couplers can be finicky, that's for sure..What you're experiencing with the sticky couplers is somewhat normal.. What I do is soak the moving parts with some penetrating oil and just keep moving them up and down until they free up. Sometimes there is some hardened grease/oil in there, causing them to stick, and not come back down, thus un-coupling. You can always change them to knuckle or buy new ones with new pins and install them..All of my link coupler cars are the ones with the weight on them. Just make sure they work freely, and are in adjustment....The knuckle coupler cars are nice, and I have a lot of them.. I just keep mine oiled, after cleaning out the old grease/oil, if any..Hope this helps... By the way, I'm almost directly across the lake from you.....


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## dadstruck

Thanks I'll give it a try. 
Are there any advantages to using one or the other.
Phil


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## flyernut

dadstruck said:


> Thanks I'll give it a try.
> Are there any advantages to using one or the other.
> Phil


I think the knuckle couplers are probably more reliable. If you're going after originality, then stay with what came with the car.


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## Joe Hohmann

"S" is a second gauge for me, so I don't have much. What I do have is all "link". My motivation is nostalgia/childhood memories. I think the biggest drawback to link, aside from dependability, is that the knuckle couplers give you a MUCH larger choice in engines and cars.


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## longle

flyernut said:


> I think the knuckle couplers are probably more reliable. If you're going after originality, then stay with what came with the car.


I agree with flyernut, if it's original I keep them that way. In fact I always convert them back to link if they have been converted to knuckle in the past. As mentioned above I have found that by soaking the links and cleaning out the gunk in the pin hole, once the links move up and down freely the uncoupling issue disappeared. It's the sticky ones that cause the problem.

What you can do is convert one end of one car which will allow you to combine both types on one train using the modified doublender to connect the knuckle cars to the link cars, or a consist of all knuckle cars to a link loco (and vice-versa).

Larry


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## Aflyer

A trick I learned with link couples came from one of our club members. His wife is into horses, and has these very small elastic bands for use on the horses mane.

What he discovered is you can use the elastic band to hold your link couplers between two cars together.

We hook the rubber band on the pin of the first car, right hand side of car looking forward, then pull the band across the couplers to the left side, looking forward and hook it on the pin of the second car.

In this way I can run my old Aluminum 600 series cars for hours and hours on the club layout and never have a break away.

And as longle stated by converting one end of a car to a Knuckle coupler you can run all kinds of combinations of old and new cars and Locomotives.

I hope my explanation makes sense.
Aflyer


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## AmFlyer

A transition car is a must for anyone with both link and knuckle couplers. Knuckle couplers, while oversize are more prototypical. Once closed they do not spuriously open. I find Knuckles are often misaligned on curves so they miss each other when backing up to couple. They seem to couple reliably with Gilbert engines and transformer control. with new engines and Legacy operation the engine is moving too slow to engage both knuckle couplers. They require a higher speed to force them to latch; this is not the case with the new couplers from Lionel.
Link couplers couple reliably on any curve at any speed. They couple most rolling stock much closer together for a better appearance. Links will uncouple occaisionally during operation with less than perfect track work, long trains or misadjusted couplers. Proper adjustment, while tedious will fix most of this.


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## flyernut

Joe Hohmann said:


> "S" is a second gauge for me, so I don't have much. What I do have is all "link". My motivation is nostalgia/childhood memories. I think the biggest drawback to link, aside from dependability, is that the knuckle couplers give you a MUCH larger choice in engines and cars.


There is a measurement that states exactly what the dimensions should be for correct adjustment, but I can't find it right now. I run my couplers at 7/16 of an inch, from the top of the link coupler to the top of the rail. Instead of measuring, you can eyeball it... The coupler should be level with the top of the rail. If it get's too low, it will not engage another coupler as it will ride UNDER the corresponding pin of another coupler; too high, and of course, it will not engage at all.... All this info is assuming the couplers are free, and swing effortlessly....


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## dadstruck

What penetrating oil are people using to soap the coulpers in. In the past wd-- left a sticky residue in the parts. 
And on a related topic, is it an acceptable practice to use small nuts and bolts or use new rivets to reattach the wheel truck after servicing. I have been drilling and taping the original rivet and using a small screw.


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## flyernut

dadstruck said:


> What penetrating oil are people using to soap the coulpers in. In the past wd-- left a sticky residue in the parts.
> And on a related topic, is it an acceptable practice to use small nuts and bolts or use new rivets to reattach the wheel truck after servicing. I have been drilling and taping the original rivet and using a small screw.


I use 3 in 1, or PB Blaster...the "wetter", the better. I then use alcohol to rinse out the assembly. As for the trucks, if you want originality, then buy yourself the correct rivets and tool. If you don't care, a screw and nut will work fine.. I use the rivets for a factory look.


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## Aflyer

I guess nobody likes my rubber band idea.

Well for us, on a 30 X 50 layout made up of 4 and 6 foot modules and a couple of operating bridges it is the only way to go with Link Couplers. 

Yes I admit it our track work and leveling practices are less than Aerospace grade. LOL

Aflyer


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## AmFlyer

Wow! If I had a layout that large many things about how I operate would have to change. The little rubber bands are great for block trains like passenger cars that are not switched. I like to uncouple and switch consists so banding the cars together does not support how I operate a small layout. Those of us from Pittsburgh call them gum bands.


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## Aflyer

Tom,
Great response, and you are right not much switching going on with our layout.

Our biggest problem is setting up and taking down after a weekend or when we get the chance a couple of weekends.

On the flip side we have great opportunities to run really long trains, like this one at the WGH show in Raleigh NC.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBvU8SrHNf8

Aflyer


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## dicgolfer72

knuckle couplers for me I just had a major crash on my new layout because the link coupler on one of my rolling stock cars detached (after an hour of tweaking it and thinking I finally had it adjuster right)
causing my 312 to fly off the table 
the 312 is now in my parts bin urrggggg needing a the screw that holds the tender on and all the jack plate soldered back to the tender 


just switched to a knuckle coupler 302 and converted the troublesome hopper to a knuckle on the side that was failing 
not a single detach since


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## AmFlyer

Aflyer, that is a long train!


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## flyernut

Aflyer said:


> Tom,
> Great response, and you are right not much switching going on with our layout.
> 
> Our biggest problem is setting up and taking down after a weekend or when we get the chance a couple of weekends.
> 
> On the flip side we have great opportunities to run really long trains, like this one at the WGH show in Raleigh NC.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBvU8SrHNf8
> 
> Aflyer


Nice.. Your rubber band trick also works with the O gauge stuff.


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## Aflyer

Thanks for the replies about the long train. Our webmaster does a great job of creating and posting our videos on Youtube. Just search for ACSG Carolina to find others you may like, even though it is only 101 cars:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fe6mE0xZ-UY


One other problem that sometimes causes the sticky link couplers is the mold release agent, i.e. the dreaded white stuff.

I have sometimes been successful with the hair dryer and q-tips clearing the stuff out so the link works freely.

Aflyer


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## dadstruck

Is there any way cleaning the mold out from between the coupler link and the pin. The coupler is nice, clean and free when it is warm and the mold is removed from the outside, once it cools it becomes tight. Yes, I know the plastic coupler is expanding. Is there any liquids that will remove the mold inside the coupler?


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## Aflyer

dadstruck said:


> Is there any way cleaning the mold out from between the coupler link and the pin. The coupler is nice, clean and free when it is warm and the mold is removed from the outside, once it cools it becomes tight. Yes, I know the plastic coupler is expanding. Is there any liquids that will remove the mold inside the coupler?


Thats a great question, best I have found is just keep changing hair dryer setting from hot to cool and trying the evaporate the stuff.

Maybe someone will have a better solution.

Aflyer


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## Gilbertologist

Aflyer said:


> Thats a great question, best I have found is just keep changing hair dryer setting from hot to cool and trying the evaporate the stuff.
> 
> Maybe someone will have a better solution.
> 
> Aflyer


When they're that ornery I just replace it with another link coupler removed from a junker or use a reproduction. I too like to like to keep the original type of coupler on my engines and cars. I also like the close spacing between cars that the link coupler rolling stock provides.
ACG


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## AmFlyer

The hair dryer is the only reliable way to remove the mold release agent. Wipe it off the exposed part of the coupler. A spray can of compressed air with the extension nozzle at the pin should help get the agent out of the hole when the coupler is heated.


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## flyernut

I use a steel brush on my Dremel to get the release agent off of the coupler... It never comes back...


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## dadstruck

Thanks the 3 in 1 oil worked great, along with the hair dryer and dremel with a wire wheel.
Thank you for all your information .

Phil


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## flyernut

dadstruck said:


> Thanks the 3 in 1 oil worked great, along with the hair dryer and dremel with a wire wheel.
> Thank you for all your information .
> 
> Phil


I know I speak for all of us... You're very welcome, glad we could help...


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## TimmyD

I just found a bunch of valuable information here, I am having some substantial uncoupling of link coupler issues. I intend to make a transition car or two and keep link on link, knuckle on knuckle. Hoping that lubing and adjusting couplers will substantially improve my uncoupling, though I am also running track on a wood floor, not tacked down. It was amazing how much better the trains ran when I had them on the carpet the other day, I did not realize how sensitive they would be to shock loads just rolling down the track!
Thanks,
TimmyD


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## AmFlyer

TimmyD, this is an old thread I had forgotten about. With some practice it is possible to get the links operating perfectly. Some need to be replaced first. If the pin is not tight the coupler can move sideways in addition to up and down. Cars with these couplers will never stay coupled, the pin needs to be knocked out and replaced.
On my permanent layout I run 15 car link coupler freights that do not uncouple. This layout has perfect track work so once the couplers are right all is good. If running on carpet then SHS or FasTrack work better than Gilbert track. I can run short freight trains or passenger trains on Gilbert track that is not fastened down but not longer trains.
I like links for switching because they always couple at any speed, straight or curves.


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## flyernut

TimmyD said:


> I just found a bunch of valuable information here, I am having some substantial uncoupling of link coupler issues. I intend to make a transition car or two and keep link on link, knuckle on knuckle. Hoping that lubing and adjusting couplers will substantially improve my uncoupling, though I am also running track on a wood floor, not tacked down. It was amazing how much better the trains ran when I had them on the carpet the other day, I did not realize how sensitive they would be to shock loads just rolling down the track!
> Thanks,
> TimmyD


Right now I'm running 9 642 boxcars and 1 630 caboose, all with link couplers. No issues whatsoever with un-coupling...however...I've been going through all my link coupler cars,checking for sticking couplers,out of adjustment, etc.There is a measurement from the coupler weight to the top of the rail, but off-hand, I don't know what it is..What I do is to make sure the coupler is parallel to the top of the rail, easy enough to eyeball..I check each coupler by simply flicking it up and down. If it moves freely, goes up and back down on it's own, I say it's good, and on to the next. If, after using the hair-dryer or heat gun trick, and oiling, the coupler is still stiff, the pin needs to be driven out, and a new pin inserted using the correct tool. You re-use the original coupler, but what I do is to sand the coupler on each side of the coupler hole, and I sand the hole out with a rolled up piece of sandpaper. I also use my dremel with a round brush and remove all traces of release agent and funk. I then insert the new pin into the coupler and check for free-play, usually it's spot on, and on to the installation. 2 good whacks with the install tool will almost do the trick, with 1 additional slight blow. (Don't hit it too hard, if it's hit too hard, the coupler can be stiff, and it's back to square 1).That usually makes the pin tight, and the coupler free. Check out the coupler height again, and you should be good to go. I'm in the process of re-doing any trouble-some couplers, and I've used over 40 new pins,lol,( I have alot of freight cars). I also have a set of early New Haven passenger cars,(4), without the weights, and they can be a bugger.


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## TimmyD

flyernut said:


> Right now I'm running 9 642 boxcars and 1 630 caboose, all with link couplers. No issues whatsoever with un-coupling...however...I've been going through all my link coupler cars,checking for sticking couplers,out of adjustment, etc.There is a measurement from the coupler weight to the top of the rail, but off-hand, I don't know what it is..What I do is to make sure the coupler is parallel to the top of the rail, easy enough to eyeball..I check each coupler by simply flicking it up and down. If it moves freely, goes up and back down on it's own, I say it's good, and on to the next. If, after using the hair-dryer or heat gun trick, and oiling, the coupler is still stiff, the pin needs to be driven out, and a new pin inserted using the correct tool. You re-use the original coupler, but what I do is to sand the coupler on each side of the coupler hole, and I sand the hole out with a rolled up piece of sandpaper. I also use my dremel with a round brush and remove all traces of release agent and funk. I then insert the new pin into the coupler and check for free-play, usually it's spot on, and on to the installation. 2 good whacks with the install tool will almost do the trick, with 1 additional slight blow. (Don't hit it too hard, if it's hit too hard, the coupler can be stiff, and it's back to square 1).That usually makes the pin tight, and the coupler free. Check out the coupler height again, and you should be good to go. I'm in the process of re-doing any trouble-some couplers, and I've used over 40 new pins,lol,( I have alot of freight cars). I also have a set of early New Haven passenger cars,(4), without the weights, and they can be a bugger.


Thanks Flyernut! I appreciate the procedure, looks like I have some pins to procure and work to do. Is this the same procedure to fix couplers with side play? It looks like I may be doing rubber bands through the holiday, but hopefully will get my rolling stock in shape soon. This is the procedure that someone was recommending an empty shell casing for, correct? I appreciate your time and your help!
TimmyD


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## flyernut

TimmyD said:


> Thanks Flyernut! I appreciate the procedure, looks like I have some pins to procure and work to do. Is this the same procedure to fix couplers with side play? It looks like I may be doing rubber bands through the holiday, but hopefully will get my rolling stock in shape soon. This is the procedure that someone was recommending an empty shell casing for, correct? I appreciate your time and your help!
> TimmyD


I use a small socket to back up the pin when I punch it out. I suppose a empty shell casing will work. I use a dremel with a cut-off wheel to cut the pin off, and them smooth the remnants of the pin off the truck tongue. I then use a small punch to drive out the last of the pin. I then brush on a little Testors flat black paint where the grinding wheel left it's mark. Let that dry, and put your pin and coupler assembly together, and install on the coupler tongue using the link coupler tool.. I did a nice thread with photos on this procedure, you'll have to look it up here on the S Scale threads.


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## AmFlyer

If you plan to replace link couplers it is best to use the tool set made for that purpose. Port Lines and other suppliers sell them. If the coupler is loose and wobbles side to side I almost always use a new replacement coupler.


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