# Dug out my DCC controller from 15 years ago, should I still use it?



## yankeejwb (Nov 30, 2021)

After 15 years I finally have space to rebuild my layout! Problem is, when I packed it all up way back when, I'd just bought the MRC Prodigy - not the Advance - and never even really figured out how to use it. 
This week I just got two new locos - a Rapido RS-11 with a LokSound decoder, and a Bachman Mogul with a SoundTraxx decoder. I'm real shaky on the jargon for DCC, and pretty ignorant of it all, so even knowing how to properly search for the right info is a bit daunting. I think those locos should do fine and give me what I want, but it's the controller I'm unsure of. Is it compatible with the locos? Is it hopelessly out of date? 
FYI my layout is really not that complicated. A big dogbone loop with a long passing siding to park a loco on, and probably a small service yard to park another. Some day when I can afford it I'll put in a second main line so I can run two trains simultaneously but for now I'm happy to just run one while the others sit available when I want them, all with the sound options their decoders offer. 

So should I use the MRC I have, or buy something new, and if the latter what would be a good option? 3.5 amps should be fine for me, and like I said, probably won't ever run more than 2-3 locos at once. The layout is an L-shape, 11x11, so not huge. I'd like the simplest wiring/programming set up possible. All turnouts are manual, not planning on a lot of complex operating since I'm mainly a scenery guy and just want the trains running. Any advice appreciated! Thanks!


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

I just bought a used Prodigy, and it works great. Plus, they still sell them new.
Worse case, it may need a firmware update. Don't know if they charge for that.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

The NMRA standards assure you that your old DCC controller will still
work with your new DCC locos. It may lack some features of current
models but the basics are there. Of course, if it's defective
as a result of long storage it may not work. Give it a try.

Don


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## OilValleyRy (Oct 3, 2021)

Aside from not really being able to program more than pre-determined addresses (1-32 IIRC) Prodigy works fine. Adjusting sound volume etc would be a problem. 
My dad has two or three daisy chained together, having one throttle (or cab) for each task… mainline, industrial switcher, etc. There’s a Dispatcher controller too for dedicating DCC turnout controls. A bit odd to some that each operator cannot do it from any throttle, but realistic in a Dispatch sense.
It’s fun, easy, and you already own it. So use it until you decide to upgrade someday, which may not be necessary for you.


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## wvgca (Jan 21, 2013)

sure, why not ???
DCC standards haven't changed at all... and even so the controllers haven't been changing rapidly


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

It should still work. I'm surprised to learn that it has only 33 pre-programmed addresses to use....that's a first for me. Even so, make a list of the addresses you assign matched to the cab numbers of your locomotives, and you'll always have a handy reference in case the decoders get scrambled, or your memory does. But if you can connect it to the rails, power it up, and get one of the locos on Add '03' to move and sound the horn, etc, you know it's working just fine. 

Since you're still new at this, you MUST address only one locomotive at a time. Read the manual, find one on line if you don't have yours, and learn how to assign an address (a name, really) to the first locomotive. After that, you must then get that address active on the throttle or your newly-addressed loco won't respond to any throttle commands. You MUST call it up by name, and only then will it toot the horn and all the other stuff. 

Then, when you go to assign a second locomotive to its address, remove the first locomotive or you'll likely make it adopt the same address at the same time. Now you have two locomotives wanting to react at the same time to the same commands because you gave them both the same 'name'.

Read your manual. You'll have no end of frustration and you'll want to quit unless you put some effort into this. Soon, it will all be in your head and you'll have a lot of fun.


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## yankeejwb (Nov 30, 2021)

So does the Prodigy require a programming track with those decoders, or can I just do that on the main and skip installing the program track?


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

You can use the main, but you will have to program one locomotive at a time otherwise all of them will be programmed with the same cab number and all will respond the same to any command.

After they are individually (separately programmed) you can then put all of them on the rails for individual control of each.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Your old system will work just fine, but as Oil Valley said, I may be lacking some features that will be useful in running sound locos.

If you did decide to upgrade,, the newer Advance2 is a bigger, beefier set for larger layouts. You would be better served by the Express2. There is no need to get a different brand -- MRC units are excellent. I use a Wireless model, my son has the Express2. I'm not sure about the really old stuff, but the first gen Express / Advance (without the "Squared" or 2) can still be used as a throttle with the newer systems.

You might want to pick up a good book on DCC. Here is one many people have found helpful: The DCC Guide, Second Edition (Wiring & Electronics): Don Fiehmann: 9781627001038: Amazon.com: Books


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## J.Albert1949 (Feb 3, 2018)

How about a pic?
I'd like to see what the old Prodigy controller looked like...


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## yankeejwb (Nov 30, 2021)

J.Albert1949 said:


> How about a pic?
> I'd like to see what the old Prodigy controller looked like...


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

Yeah, it definitely has that Year 2000 look to it. I can almost smell the box with that sort-of-carmelly basement smell.


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## yankeejwb (Nov 30, 2021)

mesenteria said:


> Yeah, it definitely has that Year 2000 look to it. I can almost smell the box with that sort-of-carmelly basement smell.


[sniff]
Yup.


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## yankeejwb (Nov 30, 2021)

Well, plugged it in, hooked it up, and we have trains moving! I think I burned a decoder on an old loco I had, but the new ones are ok. Even making a few noises, but unfortunately I think there's going to be some real limits like some of you mentioned. The steam loco will chuff, and I get bell, short and long whistle, but that's it. On the R apido RS-11 I can't get any engine sounds. Just bell, long horn, and I think rail screech (don't know the lingo for it) like when hitting a curve without a lubricator unit). I'm thinking I'm going to scrape together some pennies and get the Prodigy Express, but I'm open to persuasion if a different system would work better. I do like the idea of wireless and app control. Anyone have a suggestion on this?


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Rail squeal. Some decoders, for whatever reason, use F2 for locomotive sound. Try that if you haven't already. I have a Zimo decoder in a TRIX locomotive that uses F2 for sound. Strange. I have Zimo decoders in two other locomotives that use F1 like everyone else does.


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

yankeejwb said:


> Well, plugged it in, hooked it up, and we have trains moving! I think I burned a decoder on an old loco I had, but the new ones are ok. Even making a few noises, but unfortunately I think there's going to be some real limits like some of you mentioned. The steam loco will chuff, and I get bell, short and long whistle, but that's it. On the R apido RS-11 I can't get any engine sounds. Just bell, long horn, and I think rail screech (don't know the lingo for it) like when hitting a curve without a lubricator unit). I'm thinking I'm going to scrape together some pennies and get the Prodigy Express, but I'm open to persuasion if a different system would work better. I do like the idea of wireless and app control. Anyone have a suggestion on this?


Yippy! The odd decoder will go bad, but often all you have to do is to 'resurrect' it. If a decoder worked fine, then six months later you can't get any joy, do a 'factory reset'. Well.....you could do that IF you had a DCC system. The QSI decoders of 10 years ago had a reed switch that you could lift, invert, and then power the locomotive. That reset it. Most modern decoders require you to acquire CV8 and enter a value of '08' in OPS mode, press enter, and the loco should beep and shunt forward two or three times. After that, cycle power to the rails, off, on, and now the decoder should only come alive when you have Address '03' active. Some locomotives, like the BLI series of decoders, do nothing when you power up. You are just about to say 'damn' when you dial in a single speed step on the throttle and it will come alive. I don't like that feature, but I appreciate BLI's reasoning.


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## J.Albert1949 (Feb 3, 2018)

OP wrote:
_"I do like the idea of* wireless and app control.* Anyone have a suggestion on this?"_

Funny thing you asked...

Got a smartphone or tablet?
Either Android or iOS (doesn't matter)?

Then, try this -- it will take only a couple of minutes:
For Android, go to *google play.*
For iOS go to the *App Store.*

Then enter into the search box *"roco z21"*
You will see several apps.
The one to download has a red engine on a blue background.
It's _free._
It won't hurt anything on your phone or tablet.

Just download it, launch it, explore its features.
You can see everything it can do -- running, programming, etc.

If this doesn't appeal to you, just delete it.

But... if you DO find it interesting, then the dcc controller to look into is the Digikeijs DR5000 (costs about $210).








DR5000 - DCC Multi-bus command station


DR5000 DCC multi-bus command station for your model railwayAt Digikeijs, we sell the DR5000 - DCC multi-bus command station for your model railway. The DR5000 - DCC multi-bus command station is the command station with all imaginable bus connectors combined in one single device. The multi-bus...




www.digikeijs.com





This is a truly _"universal"_ dcc controller that has been designed to work with all kinds of input devices -- wired handhelds, wireless, etc. Digikeijs says that it works with all LocoNet and all XpressNet devices (I don't know if this includes the Prodigy controller you have now).

The DR5000 _also has *built-in wifi*_ -- and it works with the Roco z21 software.
And did I mention that the software/controller is absolutely free?

Thus, you can use the z21 software on your phone or tablet to control the railroad via the DR5000.

Of course, the z21 app also works with the Roco z21 controller box (which is what I have). But these days, the Digikeijs DR5000 universal controller looks to be the better option (certainly price-wise).

One thing that needs mentioning:
To set up a DR5000, you need either a PC running Windows or a Mac running bootcamp or windows emulation software.

Hope this helps.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

Y'all make me so glad I dropped DCC ten years ago and went back to my 55 year old MRC Golden Throttlepacks...😁👍


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Shay

These guys are techies...they make DCC sound complex and
it's not...more power to 'em...but, all that most of us need is the
one and only controller and a couple wires
to the track...I ran my room size HO layout with 10 DCC locos 
with the simple and cheap Bachmann EZ system. Most operating
sessions had 2 or 3...2 loco consists shuttling about...while I did
some switching chores with another 2 loco consist. Didn't need
all them blue tooths, smart phones and other high flying gimmicks.
But then, I still use my 1963 beige rotary dial Western Electric
desk phone. 

Don


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## Steve Rothstein (Jan 1, 2021)

yankeejwb said:


> I'm thinking I'm going to scrape together some pennies and get the Prodigy Express, but I'm open to persuasion if a different system would work better. I do like the idea of wireless and app control. Anyone have a suggestion on this?


There are several different ways to do this. As mentioned by @J.Albert1949, one system is the Rocoz21 and the DR5000 command station. He is enamored of that system. I use a Digitrax Zephyr command station but bought an add-on wireless receiver for it. That let me buy a small android tablet and run an app on it that gives me up to six throttles at a time. I used my phone at first, but the screen real estate limited it to two throttles. I have not checked since I am using Digitrax, but I would be very surprised if MRC did not offer that as an option with the Prodigy systems also. It seems to be pretty much a thing all of the manufacturers have or will shortly go to.

I will point out two problems with the digital devices though. The first did not bother me too much, and that is the lack of tactile feedback. If you are used to feeling the knob twist (or keys depressing on a keyboard) sliding your finger is not quite as satisfactory. I prefer the tactile feedback but don't require it, though I know some people who are not comfortable without it. 

The second problem is more of a problem and why I am considering doing away with the tablet. I do not get as much precision out of the sliding throttle as I do the rotating levers on the power packs and Zephyr. The tablet throttle does have an up and down button but they are preset to move in 4% increments so it isn't as much help. I have not yet dug into the app settings enough to see if that is changeable.The precision becomes much more important when you are running multiple trains on a single loop and are trying to keep them spaced without requiring you to constantly fiddle with the throttle.

If those two potential problems do not bother you, you also may become enthusiastic about using an app. If they do, you might want to look for other throttles.

Good luck.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Steve has summed up the drawbacks of using touchscreen devices very nicely. I'm one of those people who likes to eyeball my trains right up to the point they need to stop, after coupling, to pick up cargo, avoid hitting a bumper, whatever. Having to look down at my controller means I'm not looking at my train. That's an absolute show stopper for me.

If it's not a problem for you, then either a native wireless like the Digikeis / Roco hyped by their pitchman J.Albert (and contrary to what he thinks, it's no better than any of the major brands under the hood), or any of the Big 3 (Digitrax, MRC, NCE). All of those have wireless versions and / or WiFi versions (that can be used with smartphones / tablets). Personally, I was a big fan of MRC's DC stuff, so I stuck with the brand I knew. I have not regretted it.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

DonR said:


> Shay
> 
> These guys are techies...they make DCC sound complex and
> it's not...more power to 'em...but, all that most of us need is the
> ...


I do have a Botchmann...er... Bachmann EZ Command that was given to me...with the second command addition. Glad to hear it works and can run ten units. I just have to work up the desire to go under the layout, a very difficult proposition since Covid.


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## vette-kid (May 2, 2020)

shaygetz said:


> I do have a Botchmann...er... Bachmann EZ Command that was given to me...with the second command addition. Glad to hear it works and can run ten units. I just have to work up the desire to go under the layout, a very difficult proposition since Covid.


Should you decide not to do it, I would love to pick up the additional throttle for ez command. I got the main unit unexpectedly, but it works great for my purpose, just need another throttle so two people can play. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## J.Albert1949 (Feb 3, 2018)

Steve wrote:
_"I use a Digitrax Zephyr command station but bought an add-on wireless receiver for it. That let me buy a small android tablet and run an app on it that gives me up to six throttles at a time."_

What's the app named?
Could you post a pic of what it looks like running on the tablet?

One thing I like about the Digikeijs controller is its "universal" design.
That is, it can work with many kinds of other manufacturers' devices, wired, wifi, etc.
LocoNet, XpressNet... doesn't matter.
The input ports are there... just plug it in.

That's also what I like about the z21 control app.
It works with more than the z21 control box.
Works with Digikeijs, and that high-end German system (can't remember the name, I think it starts with an "m").

This is where I think the dcc industry should go... towards hardware "boxes" and control devices/apps (either handheld or through software) that are "interchangeable". Almost "independent of" each other.

_Aside:_
Recall that beautifully-done "Rhine River Valley" railroad, with the video, posted a couple of days back in this thread?








The Rhine River Valley Railroad


Hello @ all, as a new member I like to share what I'm doing the last 6 years mostly by myself. ;) I know it is a bit odd to post a German Theme Layout but I saw a few others here so I thought it is save to do it as well. There is still a long way for me to go and when I did the video today I saw...




www.modeltrainforum.com




If you watched closely, it looks like a Z21 "black box" as the dcc controller that's running the railroad.

Great choice!


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

vette-kid said:


> Should you decide not to do it, I would love to pick up the additional throttle for ez command. I got the main unit unexpectedly, but it works great for my purpose, just need another throttle so two people can play.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


I'm afraid that would be the death of the friend who gave it to me. His bride was not too pleased with him for not selling it. 🥴👍


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## Steve Rothstein (Jan 1, 2021)

J.Albert1949 said:


> Steve wrote:
> _"I use a Digitrax Zephyr command station but bought an add-on wireless receiver for it. That let me buy a small android tablet and run an app on it that gives me up to six throttles at a time."_
> 
> What's the app named?
> ...


The app I use is named Engine Driver. It is an android app and available in the play store. They also support WiThrottle if you use an Apple device. 

I do agree with you that it would make sense for the users if there were better standards so I could use any device on my system instead of just Digitrax, and any app on the wifi network devices. I have always hated when computer companies make little changes so you have to go back to them for parts or accessories. On the other hand, I also understand that it is not nearly as beneficial for the companies since they might lose out on sales of certain accessories. I doubt there are enough sales to justify the cost of developing and updating the accessories if they don't have that captured market. This way they can project a maximum number of sales reasonably to amortize the development costs over. It could also be a nightmare trying to support customers when they say my Digitrax command station isn't working with my brand X wifi receiver. 

But, being a user and not a vendor, I still think it would be nice to see it.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Steve Rothstein said:


> The app I use is named Engine Driver. It is an android app and available in the play store. They also support WiThrottle if you use an Apple device.
> 
> I do agree with you that it would make sense for the users if there were better standards so I could use any device on my system instead of just Digitrax, and any app on the wifi network devices. I have always hated when computer companies make little changes so you have to go back to them for parts or accessories. On the other hand, I also understand that it is not nearly as beneficial for the companies since they might lose out on sales of certain accessories. I doubt there are enough sales to justify the cost of developing and updating the accessories if they don't have that captured market. This way they can project a maximum number of sales reasonably to amortize the development costs over. It could also be a nightmare trying to support customers when they say my Digitrax command station isn't working with my brand X wifi receiver.
> 
> But, being a user and not a vendor, I still think it would be nice to see it.


The fact that all of your DCC components (at least, the ones between the the wall and the bus wires) need to be from the same manufacturer isn't really a big deal. You pick the brand with the configuration you like (for me: hefty hand held with a large knob for throttle control, clear display, numerous, well-spaced buttons), and stick with it. It's not like the manufacturers are constantly coming out with new things that you have to incorporate. I haven't added a component to my DCC system in about 7 years now. All the MRC stuff in the Prodigy, after the initial version, is backwards compatible,, so it all works together (and for all I know, that initial Prodigy would still work as a throttle on the newer systems). When one company does come out with a new device, the others generally follow suit (wifi adapters). I have never had a time when I wished I could use a component from a different brand.


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## yankeejwb (Nov 30, 2021)

Ok, got my bonus check today. Tried to give the local hobby shop (which is about 20 miles away) a shot at selling me one but they're entirely out, no controllers of ANY kind.

Soooooo...Amazon it is. Going with the Express 2. I like the idea of being able to use my old Prodigy cab control if I want, and as I thought about it I really do think the tactile thing will be something I'll want.

Can't wait to discover all the sound and light options on my locos


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## vette-kid (May 2, 2020)

J.Albert1949 said:


> OP wrote:
> _"I do like the idea of* wireless and app control.* Anyone have a suggestion on this?"_
> 
> Funny thing you asked...
> ...


I know I've been kicking this around forever. But will the DR5000 work with any other apps besides z21. All that is on the market now is "z21" on black background and it doesn't seem to be getting great reviews. I've played with it a bit and it is a little "fiddly" to setup and obviously geared toward the European market. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## J.Albert1949 (Feb 3, 2018)

vette kid wrote:
_"All that is on the market now is "z21" on black background and it doesn't seem to be getting great reviews. I've played with it a bit and it is a little "fiddly" to setup and obviously geared toward the European market."_

I don't see where the z21 app is "geared toward" any particular market at all.
It's just an engine controller. When you download and run the demo version, be aware that all the "sample locos" you see are easily removed when you set it up for your own system.

There are TWO z21 apps. Below, the older one is to the left, and the newer one is to the right:








Do you see both of these when you go to either the App Store (iOS) or google play (Android)?

It might be that the older app is no longer "available to" the latest smartphone/tablet versions of their respective operating systems. I don't know that.

I prefer "the old" app (red engine on blue background). I just like the look of the actual engine controller more, with the "steps and spaces" -- but that's a personal preference.

I particularly like the "programming page" of the z21 app(s).
Did you look at that?


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## vette-kid (May 2, 2020)

The fact that they are all European models as samples was my first clue. 

The icon on the right is the only one I see available

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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