# 0-4-0 mantua



## mark olmstead (Jul 12, 2012)

i was wondering how good these little engines are if done right ? i notice that mine take a lot of power to run and the way i mean is this . i have a railpower 1300 and it needs 60 or more on the dial to run but at times it slows down but dont stop then picks up more speed . deos this mean it needs a good cleaning and grease ? its a alco d30 steam locomotive santa fe # 99 . this is for ho scale . 4x6 with 18'' turns . i have a another 0-4-0 atsf steam switcher and it only take about 30 or less on power on the dial to run real good with no drag or bogg at all. great site for help and advise form you guys and gals too .


----------



## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

Give it a good clean and lube...it'll be fine:smilie_daumenpos:


----------



## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

I have several Mantua locomotives. The open frame motor does draw more amps than the newer can motors. I have no issue running them with that same controller. As Shay stated give everything a good cleaning and lube and you will be good to go. These engines run forever.


----------



## CaveGimp (Sep 13, 2013)

Hello all, I found this site looking on how to clean up a little R&O Mantura 0-4-0 my father handed down to my son and I. I know this is a dumb question, but could you point me to a couple of good sources to learn how to clean and lube this little guy? Maybe tips on what you found works best for this exact engine? The 0-4-0 sat in a box for years and years. I don't think it has been run for 20 years or more. I have worked on cleaning the contact wheels on both the engine and tender and I get the lights to come on and a bit of movement but it isn't ready to run on its own. What I did fine is that when I push down on the tender I seem to make a better connection and the light will get brighter. I tried removing the screw holding the trucks on but it wouldn't budge, I'm sure it has years of corrosion holding the screws tight. Any suggestions to get things to loosen up?


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Here's what I did with an old Mantua. I took some advice from SHAGETZ OOPS, I mean SHAYGETZ sorry, and modified it a little to suit me. This a 2-8-2 but I think it should be the same process.
First I cut some brass stock to fit the trucks and soldered the black wires to them like this.








This train went from me having to push start it half the time to perfect starts at step 1 every time. I have a video I'll upload when I get home. I'm pretty happpy with it and with the progress I'm making with fixing engines. I think this is one of the most interesting aspects of the hobby for me, right now anyway.


----------



## CaveGimp (Sep 13, 2013)

Thanks for the idea Hutch I like the idea of getting a really solid connection all the way through.


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

First time trying to add a video. Let's see how it goes.




I think it worked!


----------



## apoc444 (Jan 28, 2013)

very cool nice job


----------



## CaveGimp (Sep 13, 2013)

OK, fair warning, I made an idiot mistake. After I cleaned the trucks on the tender and the oiled the wheels on the engine, I thought it would be a good idea to pull the last two screws and take a look at the motor. I cleaned the commutator up and got it nice and shinny. Put everything back together and the motor wouldn't turn, heck the light no longer came on. Took it apart again and got out my multi-meter. I don't have too much experience with brushed DC motors, but I found it odd that I measured zero resistance between the two brushes. Did I screw something up or what could be the issue?


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Have you tried spinning the motor while measuring the resistance. Could be the brushes need to conform to the new diameter. 
Are you clipping on to the brushes? Could be you;re pulling the brushes away while measuring or maybe the brushes are locked up and need a little freeing up?
I would hook 12V to the power leads, not the brushes and try to get it spinning by hand. Once it starts, let it spin for a while.


----------



## Smokinapankake (Sep 8, 2011)

No resistance between the two brushes would indicate a dead short. In other words, the juice is bypassing the commutator and going straight back into the opposing brush. Electricity will always follow the path of least resistance, so in order for it to spin the motor, there can be no other possible route for the electricity to take other than through one brush, "through" the commutator ( forcing it to spin), then out the opposing brush to return to the other rail. Recheck your wiring and also be sure that the electrical pickups are isolated from each other. At least, that's how I understand it to work.....


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Smokinapankake said:


> No resistance between the two brushes would indicate a dead short. In other words, the juice is bypassing the commutator and going straight back into the opposing brush. Electricity will always follow the path of least resistance, so in order for it to spin the motor, there can be no other possible route for the electricity to take other than through one brush, "through" the commutator ( forcing it to spin), then out the opposing brush to return to the other rail. Recheck your wiring and also be sure that the electrical pickups are isolated from each other. At least, that's how I understand it to work.....


If the reading is zero you are correct but if the reading is open/no reading then it's just the opposite. That's what I got from his description. Which one is it?


----------



## CaveGimp (Sep 13, 2013)

Sorry for the confusion, the reading is 0 ohms, so short, not open. I also get a zero ohm reading when I put leads on different pads of the commutator, not sure that is normal. When testing the commutator pads I had the brushes removed. I'll go back and check for any stray wires or the like. Would oil in the coil cause the short?

Thanks again to everyone for their help and suggestions.


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Whaqt did you clean the commutator with? Sounds like you got some metal in there.


----------



## wingnut163 (Jan 3, 2013)

all so, if the spaces between the segments are full of your cleaning they need to be cleaned out. this will give you separate electric so the motor will spin.


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

wingnut163 said:


> all so, if the spaces between the segments are full of your cleaning they need to be cleaned out. this will give you separate electric so the motor will spin.


That's what I meant to say. If a file was used there could be chips in there shorting the poles giving you a 0 resistance reading. Worse yet if you used steel wool, you didn't did you, you better do a real thorough cleaning.


----------



## CaveGimp (Sep 13, 2013)

Q-tips, and wooden toothpics with rubbing alcohol, but I will check the spaces again to make sure everything is cleaned out.


----------



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Did that get it shiny? When I cleaned mine, I took the stator out of the housing and spun it with a dremel and held fine sandpaper with a backer up to it. It came out like new and it runs great. With your method, I don't see how you could have created a short unless something fell into the housing. I hope cleaning fixes it.


----------



## wingnut163 (Jan 3, 2013)

i am a machinist and have cut many armatures. the space between the segments get junk in them and need to be cleaned out.
the point of a x-acto knife will do it nicely.


----------



## marx1 (Dec 11, 2009)

Mark, Dont forget to checK the wheels, maybe u put it back together with one wheel turned in the wrong direction. On the axle, one wheel is insulated the other is not. Flipping one wheel will cause a direct short. One wheel should have a small insulation around the axle very small, check with ohm meter. Same goes for the tender, engine is hot to one side and tender is hot to the other. Also if the engine is tightend to much it will bind with the gears,not too tight not too loose-its tricky. good luck


----------

