# Starting Over due to my own fault



## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hello everyone.
I only managed to rip up half of the track on my layout, so I spent part of tonight desoldering & inspecting my HO atlas code 100 track. I'll work with what I have & make a list of what I need. I'll make a simple layout this time but leave turnouts for another day.
I'll keep you posted on my progress.


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## scaleddown (Mar 13, 2014)

Success to you in your efforts.

"Never look back, unless you are planning to go that way." Henry David Thoreau


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## wvgca (Jan 21, 2013)

i hope very thing turns out better for you this time .....


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

I don't know your story, but on the face of it, I applaud your courage, wisdom, sense of reality, and your determination to find a way to enjoy a working layout. :smilie_daumenpos:

Lesser characters would be well and truly dunned by your 'failure' and maybe leave the hobby or delay rectifying their errors for months or even years.

I didn't have to bust up a layout or tear up all my trackage, but I have had to do extensive repairs to substantial parts of it. Well, not so much repairs as relaying to correct problems. It was worth it, and became part of my own 'git 'er dun!' approach to the hobby. And my own history...now.


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## Fire21 (Mar 9, 2014)

Maybe I need to do what MrStucky did. I have track laid, but I have one curve that's too tight for my passenger cars. I became discouraged at a couple other track problems and haven't touched the layout in about a year. if I removed about 1/4 of my track, and changed some things, I might get things going again. I'll think about this... :sly:


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

I thought everyone rips up the railroad and starts over!


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MrStucky said:


> Hello everyone.
> I only managed to rip up half of the track on my layout, so I spent part of tonight desoldering & inspecting my HO atlas code 100 track. I'll work with what I have & make a list of what I need. I'll make a simple layout this time but leave turnouts for another day.
> I'll keep you posted on my progress.


Turnouts weren't what did you in before. It was not being careful enough to provide a smooth, firm subroadbed and to achieve smooth, kink-free track-laying.


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## spikedrivingblues (Dec 11, 2018)

I had a lot of problems keeping a train running when I started a few years ago too. My track work and electrical connections (both in quantity and quality) were poor. To make the first weeks of building my layout even more complicated, my first loco was defective.

My track is still not completed but what I have runs great!

My point is this; with patience and tenacity you will get past the problems I suspect many of us have faced in the incipient stages.

Good luck going forward!


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## Chaostrain (Jan 27, 2015)

When I built my first layout I did a lot of ripping out track and rebuilding. I love watching trains running so I didn't have much track down to find my first mistakes. I also took it as a lesson learned, build and test a small section at a time. I think of my original design and what I ended up with. If I had built the whole thing then tested I would have had to rip out at least 3/4 of it. It was a major design flaw. Or just gave up. I'll be doing the same with out HO layout, build a little and test.


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## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

I've rip up part of my layout just to try different track bed options! I've come to the conclusion that spending a lot of time getting the sub-road bed down right, is worth all the extra time. Makes track laying much easier (I now use CV ties and glue the rail down).


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## Panther (Oct 5, 2015)

No pictures, it didn't happen.

Dan


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

I noticed in my recent short "hurricane" of destruction, that I have some damaged track. The track has seperated at the ties. I know that I can fix the HO flex track that is bad, but with damaged sectional track I thought of just getting a new piece. I read a post this morning about fixing damaged sectional track using cutters, saws or a dremel. Can someone confirm this please.
Thanks


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## wvgca (Jan 21, 2013)

it's easier to replace damaged sectional code 100 track, as opposed to 'fixing' it .. 

might be a bit more money,, but usually worth it ..


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

MrStucky said:


> I noticed in my recent short "hurricane" of destruction, that I have some damaged track. The track has seperated at the ties. I know that I can fix the HO flex track that is bad, but with damaged sectional track I thought of just getting a new piece. I read a post this morning about fixing damaged sectional track using cutters, saws or a dremel. Can someone confirm this please.
> Thanks


You're already trying to take shortcuts on your second layout that you haven't even started yet. Throw that damaged track away and do it right.

You might get away with feeding the rails back onto the fishplates with flex track, but throw that sectional crap away.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MrStucky said:


> I noticed in my recent short "hurricane" of destruction, that I have some damaged track. The track has seperated at the ties. I know that I can fix the HO flex track that is bad, but with damaged sectional track I thought of just getting a new piece. I read a post this morning about fixing damaged sectional track using cutters, saws or a dremel. Can someone confirm this please.
> Thanks


Fixing damaged track is a piece of cake. Using a Dremel tool, razor / hacksaw, or rail nippers, cut out the damaged section of track. Throw it away. Replace with appropriate piece of undamaged track. Solder rail joiners. Done

Starting over isn't a bad idea (you may remember that I recommended it), but please, apply the lessons learned from your last go at it: take your time and do it right. Test it as you go, and fix it if it isn't perfect, BEFORE you make it worse by building on to it.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hello everyone.
I'll go buy new sectional track if I need it, as it makes alot more sense than fixing it. The hobby shop I go to sells it individually for around 2.50 or a 6PK for $15.00 or so. I've only been working with flex track at this time, & making sure I do a better job. I'll need to get new cork roadbed as what I bought is all glued down, & more glue now that I think about it.


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

I will only use flex track because it is so forgiving. Of course, it provide infinite variability in geometry, which is its chief selling feature.

However, I like it because I DON'T have to spend quite so much time refining the roadbed. I ballast my tracks, and make the flex track elements fall in natural vertical curves. I can tack it down where it meets the roadbed, but where it is suspended due to unevenness, I merely ballast a bit more deeply there. I use beach sand or washed play sand from big box stores, so I can pour cups of the stuff down through the ties and fashion 'fills' the way railroads do. Once the ballast is groomed and glued, my tracks look natural.


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## Chaostrain (Jan 27, 2015)

You can always use the damaged track as abandoned track someplace. Just a thought.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hi Chaos.
Thanks for the information. I hadn't thought of using damaged track on another part of my layout. I go to a hobby shop in Calgary when I visit my sister, & they sell used rolling stock, engines & shells.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

The one thing I haven't used very much on my HO layout is flux, but I plan on using it more since I'm in the rebuilding stage, as I was having power issues etc. Is it best to use flux before soldering the joint, or can I add flux to a joint that is already soldered. I'm guessing its the latter, but I welcome your comments.

Thanks


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## Stumpy (Mar 19, 2013)

Flux before. The purpose of flux is to remove the metal oxides and help the solder adhere to the metal. It helps it flow into the joint.

I highly recommend a Resistance Soldering Unit (RSU).

https://www.micromark.com/Resistance-Soldering-Unit


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## flyboy2610 (Jan 20, 2010)

Flux should be applied to the joint before soldering. It serves two purposes: it helps to clean the metal, and it helps the solder to flow into the joint better, much like isopropyl alcohol or dish soap helps water and glue to penetrate ballast better.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Thanks for the tips. I'll be going to the hobby shop this weekend for flex track & a few other things like a switch block perhaps. I notice the shop is out of Atlas LH turnouts, but I noticed they also carry curved turnouts by Atlas in code 100. I was also thinking of giving Peco turnouts a try too.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MrStucky said:


> Thanks for the tips. I'll be going to the hobby shop this weekend for flex track & a few other things like a switch block perhaps. I notice the shop is out of Atlas LH turnouts, but I noticed they also carry curved turnouts by Atlas in code 100. I was also thinking of giving Peco turnouts a try too.


No two manufacturer's turnouts have the same dimensions. Throwing a mishmash of turnouts together is not a recipe for good, clean track work. Decide what you need, and buy it. If it's temporarily out of stock, look elsewhere or wait until it comes in. In this day of the Internet, if you can't find something locally, there are usually a half a dozen on-line suppliers who can provide it.

Stop rushing: take the time to do it right this time.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hi Ct.
I figured when I noticed the Peco turnout was code 100 browsing the website of my hobby shop, that it would work on my layout. I hadn't thought about size discrepancies until you mentioned it. I noticed the turnout didn't work either when I was using the scarm software. Thanks


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

I decided this time that I'd like to elevate part of my track. I'm guessing if I want to have turnouts on my layout, it would be best to keep turnouts on a flat surface. I currently a have woodland scenics 4% incline/decline set of risers pinned to my layout, but I'm going to pick up another one tomorrow unless I change my mind.

Thanks


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## Fire21 (Mar 9, 2014)

Remember that a 4% incline is quite radical, even in model railroading. It will prevent you from running long trains unless you have a lot of power lashed together, or some pushers on the back. Even a 2% is quite steep.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Fire21 said:


> Remember that a 4% incline is quite radical, even in model railroading. It will prevent you from running long trains unless you have a lot of power lashed together, or some pushers on the back. Even a 2% is quite steep.


It's not just power, but length. With grades that steep, without a gradual transition on and off, your locos might dig in their noses when starting up, or pop a wheelie and derail when creating. Your rolling stock might uncoupled or snag trip pins. 4% grade is very tricky.

Create a grade of that steepness, including the bottom and to transitions, and test your equipment. You could be heading for many more issues by doing this.

Turnouts can be on a grade, so long as the entire turnout and all the track coming off of it are in the same plane.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hi CTValley.
I did think about the height of the incline when I pinned down risers yesterday, whether or not the engines & rolling stock that I own will have enough power from the beginning. I unpinned the last section after I read Fire21's reply, so now I've gone from 4" down to 3". I'm planning on running trains on a level surface too, but I thought having some elevated track would make things interesting too. I bought a package of woodland scenics 2" risers this afternoon, along with flex track, cork roadbed & rail joiners.
Thanks


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MrStucky said:


> Hi CTValley.
> I did think about the height of the incline when I pinned down risers yesterday, whether or not the engines & rolling stock that I own will have enough power from the beginning. I unpinned the last section after I read Fire21's reply, so now I've gone from 4" down to 3". I'm planning on running trains on a level surface too, but I thought having some elevated track would make things interesting too. I bought a package of woodland scenics 2" risers this afternoon, along with flex track, cork roadbed & rail joiners.
> Thanks


No question that multiple levels add interest to your layout. But if you must achieve those level transitions by using extreme track arrangements (like a 4% grade) then stand by to have trouble. I've been bitten by overly steep grades twice in my career; now everything is a nice, smooth 2% or less.

Also note that in HO scale, you will need about 3" of clearance for trains to pass over each other.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

There is a 5%+ grade on the ÖBB mountain line branch. I've not had any problems with that line, nor the locomotive pulling a six car consist.

That might be the exception, but it works flawlessly.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hi Michael.
I should've had a closer look at what I was buying while at the hobby shop, in terms of inclines/ declines. I can use the 2" risers I bought, yet I'll realized it didn't come with any inclines in order for trains to make an entrance or exit from different levels. I plan on trimming a large piece of foam from the incline set I purchased in the past for this purpose. I know that foam cutters are available, I didn't have one on my shopping list & I know using a serated knife will make more of a mess.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

You want inclines or incline starters, not risers. Risers are a fixed height.

PLEASE, MrStucky, do yourself a favor and just slow down. Think about what you're going to do before you do it. Rushing ahead is how you got into trouble the first time.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MichaelE said:


> There is a 5%+ grade on the ÖBB mountain line branch. I've not had any problems with that line, nor the locomotive pulling a six car consist.
> 
> That might be the exception, but it works flawlessly.


 But I bet you don't immediately transition from flat to 5%, do you?


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Heck no! It doesn't reach 5%+ for probably a few feet. But it does go up in a hurry to clear two lower levels.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

Hi everyone.
I changed my mind & decided not to use inclines/declines or risers on my current layout, & just make sure my track work is good then I'll go from there in regards to scenery etc.


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

I've got my track connected & I"m using rosin flux this time when soldering. I have added a set of power feed joiners, connecting the wires to a terminal block then to the transformer but I'm still having power issues. I've used a multimeter & checked a few spots for conductivity, & I"m getting 15 volts after I cranked up the power a little more. I'm leaning towards soldering every joint, replacing the terminal track, taking my entire layout apart properly this time, opening my transformer to see if anythings wrong inside. I wish skype was available here at the forum, then other members could view my layout then tell me to stop to "fix" something before moving onto the next part.

Thanks


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## MrStucky (Nov 28, 2015)

I've got my track connected & I"m using rosin flux this time when soldering. I have added a set of power feed joiners, connecting the wires to a terminal block then to the transformer but I'm still having power issues. I've used a multimeter & checked a few spots for conductivity, & I"m getting 15 volts after I cranked up the power a little more. I'm leaning towards soldering every joint, replacing the terminal track, taking my entire layout apart properly this time, opening my transformer to see if anythings wrong inside. I wish skype was available here at the forum, then other members could view my layout then tell me to stop to "fix" something before moving onto the next part.

Thanks


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