# Hoscale37's Layout



## hoscale37

I've been struggling to figure out which way I want to go with my layout. I've been taking my sweet time to do research, etc. Thinking I could do something on a 3 X 5 old kitchen table, obviously that didn't happen. As someone else had pointed out, I could to a point to point switching yard, and actually did a fairly decent switching layout last night in the SCARM program. 

Now my mind is struggling on whether to do the 3 X 5 yard IN ADDITION to doing the 4 X 8 layout that I am wanting to do as well. I *may have* the room in the basement, as soon as I get stuffed reorganized. Just wondering if I should set the 4 X 8 setup on the 3 X 5 table and be done with it...

Sorry for being so wishy washy... I just feel like I am going back and forth on trying to make a decision. Oy Vey!


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## Big Ed

If you set it up on the table it will be kind of hard to wire it.

It is not that hard to build some legs for a table.


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## hoscale37

I had thought about drilling some holes in the table to run wiring through so that the wiring could be run completely underneath the table without any issues.


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## Timb

Just a thought..but, if you don't want to build legs for the 4x8 and willing to drill holes in the table, why don't you just take the legs of the table (if You can) and use them for the 4x8 table. I would think that by putting a larger piece over a smaller table it would tip easily if you put any pressure on the corners......JMHO. 

Tim


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## NIMT

hoscale37,
I've tried to do what you think you want to do years ago.
My Opinion: 
Take the kitchen table that you have and send it packing! The difference between a good layout table and a bad layout table is night and day...One will have you pulling your hair out trying to work with it as it was made to eat on not run trains!
The layout in a 4X8 will require minor material and will also serve as a solid base for future add ons.
Bolt ( so you can take them off if you need to move the table) 2X4 legs onto a 2x4 frame that is screwed together covered in a 1/2 plywood top and you are good to go now and on down the line!


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## 05Slowbalt

Yea I would forget the table. My first layout is what NIMT said. I used 2"X4" and built a frame for a 4'X8' bored with legs 3' high. Then put press bored on top of the frame to make my first train table.


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## hoscale37

*02/12/2012- Layout Plan Update*

After selling off some cars that I was not interested in, I have some money now to get materials and start building my layout table. 

Going out with my wife last night to our friend's house; I was telling her about some of the additional boxcars that will be showing up in the mail in the next couple of weeks. We started talking about me getting the materials when my wife mentioned to me about also using the ledge that we have in the basement as part of the layout! (Why didn't I think of that!!) 

Just to provide a little detail- We live in a Bi-Level house. The basement has a Ledge which runs around the entire length of the basement that is 7 inches out from the wall. The Ledge stands almost 38" in height from the floor. 

I have attached some photos, and I think I like the idea of setting up my rail yard on the ledge and having it run onto the 4 X 8 table that I am going to setup. So the table would be almost 38" in height. Is this a good height for a table? 

With the 7 inches from the wall, I could potentially have three rail lines that I could run easily up to 48" in length. 

Granted I would have to put down some material on the ledge along with a roadbed material, etc. I like the idea of having a rail yard like this feeding onto the table....

What are your thoughts? I have attached some photos.


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## NIMT

I like 38" to 40" easier on the back, kids are not very happy with it but you can get them a step stool!


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## mr_x_ite_ment

Bryan...I like the thought of a yard on the ledge you have. It frees up room on your benchwork for more scenery, structures, etc. You can run track along the ledge for as far as you like, with turnouts branching off wherever you like. In other words, you could have multiple yards on the ledge if you plan it right! I can't wait to see what you develop with your plans! Good luck!

Chad


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's Layout- Update*

Well, I laid down some track tonight to see what I had and if I could actually make it look halfway decent. Even though the yard is going to be built on the Ledge; for now I am naming it simply "Ledge Yard". Here are some photos of the "East End" of the Yard. 

I've left this set up. I didn't want to take it down because it took me so long to find the necessary track in my collection to get this set up. It's not tacked down, but does have the track joiners between each section. 

I do have quite a bit of room to extend this to the other side of the ledge if I wanted to, not sure if I want to do that or not, but it is definitely feasible and possible. There would be one feeder line that would go to the mainline on the table.


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## hoscale37

*Update*

Took some time yesterday to set up track going onto what I call, the "West End" of Ledge Yard.

I will have one feeder line that will be going onto the main line of the table setup. The line going to the left will be the feeder line to the mainline on the table.


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## hoscale37

*Update*

02/18/2012 Update

Tested the Model Power set that I just got in the mail (see the Get Anything New? Thread in the General Section). Complete set of Track with a Santa Fe engine. I had an old Tyco power pack to test the Santa Fe Engine. Worked like a charm  

I then tested the other engines that I have, all of them worked. So I have one working transformer that I have tested. I have about 6 transformers that I have received in the auction lots that I have won. So it will be one by one testing them to see if they work well. In all, I have 6 engines that work (YAY!!!  ) They need to be cleaned though. I thought I remember seeing a step by step somewhere on what to use to clean/lube the engines, as well as the track. I want to clean the track as well for maximum running ability. 

Can anyone point me to step by step cleaning engines and tracks?


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## hoscale37

*Update- 02/19/2012*

Update- Hoscale's Layout

02/19/2012

I tested all of the Transformers that I have received. I have an AHM, two Tyco transformers, a Bachmann, and a Model Power Transformer. 

*ALL* of them tested great with the track and engines.  

I set up a small "Test Bed" of Track for the engines. 

I now have:

6 working engines
5 working transformers

One of the engines that I have is the Tyco "Golden Eagle". I really want to change the engine, over to something else- would like to model it off of CSX or other railroad. Obviously would have to remove the shell and paint it, etc. 

1. The trucks on the Golden Eagle need to be oiled and cleaned as they are pretty noisy. 

2. The Canadian Pacific engine is a bit rough as well but runs. 

3. Santa Fe engine runs well.

4. Baltimore & Ohio engine runs well but needs cleaned.

5. The other two engines are the Santa Fe (Model Power) that I just bought. Runs great.

6. The other is a Walthers Trainline CSX that runs fantastic. 

Any thoughts on changing the Golden Eagle over to a different Road name?


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## THE TYCO MAN

hoscale37, check your posted forum in the HO section. I have replied with pointers concerning the Super 630/C630.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Nothing new to report, although I have picked up a few engines and boxcars since I last posted. Just have had a lot of stuff going on in my personal life. Health issues with my father (he had Quadruple bypass heart surgery on 02/20/2012) and dealing with some personal financial issues, along with moving to a new job- has put the building of the layout on semi-indefinite hold.

After doing some research off and on, literally since the beginning of the year- the design is in place. I have a blueprint for a table, and bought $8.00 worth of the hardware (literally the nuts and bolts) for the layout today at the hardware store. So that is one step down. Just need to get the lumber to actually build the table and go from there...  

Just thought I would post an update since the last time I posted on my layout was back in February.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

On my way home from work today, a neighbor in the neighborhood two streets over had built a new wooden fence. Out at the curb was a HUGE amount of unused Lumber!

After getting home and getting something to eat and taking the dog for a walk...I walked past his house. I walked up to his new fence, where his gate was opened...

Me: "Hi, I see you have a lot of wood out at the curb, are you doing anything with that wood."

"We built this new fence, it's got a unique design, but you can take as much of that wood as you would like."

Me: "That's great, I am building a model railroad table and just thought I would ask."

"Sure! I don't have any need for any of that wood, it's cut in various sizes, but yeah- take what you want and what you need."

Me: "Thank you."

I went home and got my car, went back to his house and loaded up my car with as much stuff as I could. He was going somewhere and I told him Thanks again. He said, come back and get more if you need it.

I now have a strong foundation of lumber. I really only need to cut some of the pieces to match the sizes I am looking for. Now all I need to do is go buy a sheet of plywood, and some sheets of Pink Foam and I will be in business! 

Yay for me!!!


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## sstlaure

Score!!!!!


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## joed2323

Its awesome when you can score a bunch of free lumber!!! Most if not all of my benchwork is built using free wood i had laying around the house or from people that had no use for it...

Now get building:thumbsup:


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## hoscale37

*Layout Mockup- Lego Format*

I grew up playing with Legos.

Here is a mockup of my layout. 

Keep in mind that I am still going to utilize the ledge I have in my basement (depicted in the picture as the longer section on the side in Yellow).

The Yellow will be Foam.
The Red will be Wood.

On the bottom part, the Yellow and the Grey represent layers of Wood and Plywood.


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## New Berlin RR

ok small prob here my friend....theres no pics of your small fleet!!! we want to see them! other then that sounds like great collection so far!


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*



New Berlin RR said:


> ok small prob here my friend....theres no pics of your small fleet!!! we want to see them! other then that sounds like great collection so far!


 I will have to snap some photos of all of the locos and rolling stock that I have. I can tell you that I have a few 

...these are older F7 units
B & O (2)
Canadian Pacific (1)
Santa Fe (1). 

Alco 630
Tyco Golden Eagle (don't laugh- it runs good!)

A few smaller switchers 

Newer modern diesel units
Santa Fe Units (2)- One is Blue/Yellow, the other is Red/Grey

CSX Unit

Norfolk/Southern Unit 

Family Lines System Unit

Seaboard Coast Line Unit 

I have a large collection of Rolling Stock.

Will post some pictures up of my stock over the next couple of days.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

As promised. Here are a few pictures of my engines and rolling stock. I still have more stuff that is still in a larger plastic storage tote, but the majority of what I have is in these pictures- Engine and Rolling Stock wise.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

More pictures of Engines...

The Family Lines System SCL 1402 is one of my favorites. I bought it at the big train show back in March off a guy for $20.00 The engine purrs on the track


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## zorba

that golden eagle is sweet


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## hoscale37

*hoscale's layout*



zorba said:


> that golden eagle is sweet


If you think it looks sweet... you should see it run on the track 

It runs pretty good, but could use a good cleaning.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Just a little news to report. I replaced the reciprocating saw that I had bought and sold last year. So I can cut some wood now  

So I will be cutting some lumber tomorrow on my day off- pending if the weather holds out. Rained pretty good here tonight with the remnants of Hurricane Issac blowing through...

I am going to cut the four posts that will serve as the supports for the table tomorrow, as well as some of the cross beams with the lumber that I got recently. 

*Side note*--- At the store tonight I saw some of the MinWax Spray Polyurethane. Has anyone used this at all? I have thought about using it to treat the wood just to protect it, even though the layout is going to be inside. 

What are your thoughts on using the spray polyurethane to spray on the wood frame before mounting the 4 X 8 sheet to the frame?


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Had some free time on Monday. I cut the posts down to the proper height, and have the cross members ready now as well.

Photos:


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## norgale

Hi Bryan. Sounds like your going through what we all went through when it came time to actually start building a layout. So I have to tell you,go ahead and build the table and at the same height as the ledge. 38" will be a perfect height for it. Once you get the table built then you start putting the layout together ON PAPER. By all means draw a plan to start with. A good way to do this is with paper covering the whole table and do it full size. This way you can see if what you want to build will fit on the table. Or draw it to scale on smaller paper and you'll still have the table to experiment with. I can tell you now that the 4x8 will take a max of 22"radius track. Inside that you'll need 18" track.
You can put track together and anything else you want to have on the layout and once you have the track where you want it you can start building.Main thing is to take your time and think about what your doing. More track is not necessarily better. Tables can get too crowded and hard to operate if there is too much track and too many turnouts. When you run a track make it go somewhere to deliver some cars and bring the empties back.
Good luck and keep us informed with lots of pictures. Now build the table and get going. pete


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Norgale, 

I have a track idea in mind. It is layout #8 in John Armstrong's HO scale Custom Line layouts book..dating back to 1957. I think I posted it at the beginning of this thread. EDIT: Just checked- it's not at the beginning of the thread, so I have attached it with this post. I also have a Turntable... I am thinking of placing it off of the track where the building is at the edge of the mountain, with the mountain not being as long as it is but shorter and modified. Too ambitious for a first layout? I am also going to have the alternative track section on the layout for future a future addition later on...

After going out to buy some additional lumber- I did a mockup of what the table would look like fully assembled last night. 

These photos are ones that I took in my driveway. 

A photo of the framework and the plywood base on top of the framework. 

Just making sure that I have everything where it needs to be before I start nailing and getting down to business. 

This table is going to be uber-sturdy... it won't be going anywhere once it is together, but I do have room in my basement to add on to this in the future if I decide to...


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## sstlaure

If you space that layout out to a 5x9 vs a 4x8 you'll fit a lot nicer curves and have more room for scenery/roads, etc.


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## hoscale37

sstlaure said:


> If you space that layout out to a 5x9 vs a 4x8 you'll fit a lot nicer curves and have more room for scenery/roads, etc.



The layout calls for 18 and 22 radius track. All of my wood for the table is already conformed to a 4 X 8 layout. While it would be nice to have the additional foot each way, at this point I am going to stick with this layout design. I have a few scenery pieces right now- but my whole intention from the beginning was to build an industrial layout.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Worked most of the day yesterday on the layout. Have a few pictures on my cell phone. Need to get these uploaded to post up here.

The framework and the tabletop are now together. Still have a few pieces of the table that need to be put in place.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Haven't been on for awhile. My new job that I got back in July (at the Hospital) has kept me busy. I have worked on getting the layout set up, but it has been a slow process. Mainly for the fact that I don't have all of the track that I need. 

I just had the opportunity to go to a local train show this weekend and was able to pick up a few good used Nickel Rail pieces of track, but still missing the size turnouts that I need. I have been marking where the track is going to go on my table. Don't want to rush anything. 

I will have to post some pictures up of the table, and the work in progress. Just didn't want anyone to think that I had fallen off the face of the earth, just been busy with work...


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## spoil9

The last picture you posted, Layout8.jpg, is the same track plan that my dad built for me when I was younger. Only difference is that he made it into a 5x9 and left the modeling up to me to finish. 
Wish I had pictures of it. I built a "highway" system using slot car track so my buddies and I could run trains and have slot car races at the same time. That was until the slot cars all broke from being driven off the track and falling onto a cement floor from 4ft up. 

Good memories.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*



spoil9 said:


> The last picture you posted, Layout8.jpg, is the same track plan that my dad built for me when I was younger. Only difference is that he made it into a 5x9 and left the modeling up to me to finish.
> Wish I had pictures of it. I built a "highway" system using slot car track so my buddies and I could run trains and have slot car races at the same time. That was until the slot cars all broke from being driven off the track and falling onto a cement floor from 4ft up.
> 
> Good memories.



Very Cool. Glad that I was able to bring up some good memories for you. I have so many old MR magazines, etc that will help me in getting this set up done. 

I have added an additional track section so there is an additional piece of track in the yard on this layout and further down the road may add an additional section to the track, as I have opted for the line that is currently a dead end on the lower end of the layout- so I can expand into the future.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

I haven't done a lot of work on the layout recently due to being busy at work. However, I thought I would post some pictures of what I have done so far. I decided to go with the white foam, as I got a good deal on it, and after seeing some of Shaygetz's work on his section piece using white foam as a base; that has given me some confidence. 

I am waiting on some wiring pieces (read Atlas Controllers and Atlas Switchers) to help me get started with the wiring block sections on the layout. 

In the meantime- here are a few photos of the layout as it currently stands. I have all of my track. Now just need to start in on the wiring. 

Obviously, the layout is not going to be completely flat as it stands right now. I will be adding a mountain on the side that has the three tracks on it, and may even consider having all three go through a tunnel. I just have not gotten to that point as of yet, as I want to get the wiring sections/blocks figured out first.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Update, 12/09/2012

I started laying down my cork roadbed... Finally. 

I have been thinking about this though- in regards to where my wiring is going to be connected to the track, I had specifically bought pieces of Track that have the terminal points like this:










With the cork Roadbed, I would have to do some serious ballasting to cover up the connection points :-/

I can solder the wiring to the rails, and had planned on doing this, but was just curious as to what others have done? 

I think I already know the answer, but what are your thoughts?


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## gunrunnerjohn

Solder to the rails, it won't come off and it's easy to hide with ballast.


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## manchesterjim

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Solder to the rails, it won't come off and it's easy to hide with ballast.



What he said!!:thumbsup:

I would recommend grabbing a couple of pieces of track you don't mind losing, and doing a little practice. It won't take long to find the balance between enough heat for the rail and melting the plastic ties!


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## gunrunnerjohn

For O-gauge Atlas track, I've had no issues melting the ties, and I'm soldering a lot larger wires, #16 drops. I use a 50W Weller iron, plenty hot. You can clamp onto the rails on either side of the soldering to limit the heat propagation if you like.


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## Essex

I use those little rail joiners that have wires crimped to them. They're pretty cheap and _very_ easy.


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## joed2323

Any updates on your layout?? No sweat if you dont


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## hoscale37

*Layout Update*

I actually had some time this weekend and the past couple of days to make some progress on the layout. In accordance with my other Thread in the HO scale section...some of the comments there really helped me think about the layout and starting to work on it again. 

Here are two photos. One is the two main lines, with the Wye that is in the upper left corner. The track is not secured to the cork roadbed as of yet. I have been working on getting the Cork Roadbed laid out where it needs to go. The blue painter's tape is my notes to myself when I first laid track down months ago to get an idea of where everything would go. The cork roadbed is being glued down to the white foam that I have underneath. Contrary to popular belief, so far working with the white foam has not been an issue. 

The second photo is the Western End of the Layout (True West). The way my train table is set up, the ends are pointing to True Compass East and West. (I know, I'm a dork.). The track is not secured to the Cork in this photo either, but casually laid down so I had an idea of where the cork roadbed needed to be placed. 

More updates to follow...


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## joed2323

There you go chipping away at your layout:thumbsup:

Alittle at a time! No rush. Remember all good things take time.

Good to see you back at your layout:thumbsup:


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## Big Ed

Get the main line done so you can run some trains around while you are building the rest.


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## joed2323

big ed said:


> Get the main line done so you can run some trains around while you are building the rest.


Absolutely... what big ed says


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Not much to report. Just been busy with the holidays and work. Since I had changed jobs over the summer, not a lot of time off built up yet. So what I have done recently is the most recent photos in the thread. We had some packaging at work that we were getting rid of. Mostly Cardboard boxes. I grabbed a few of the internal pieces of cardboard packaging. My idea and thought is this- My plan is to get a small and cheap $1.00 typefood grater from the dollar store. I plan to grind up the pieces of cardboard and use it as ground cover on the layout; maybe even dye it a different color. I have some sawdust already that is waiting to be dyed. So maybe I will do the same with this packaging cardboard and see what happens. 

Anyone else tried this at all? On a bit of a budget, as has been mentioned before. I am also planning to do some Zip Texturing around some portions of the layout as well. 

Thoughts?


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## joed2323

You can easily make ground foam out of sawdust, hopefully you have access to some, or start cutting up wood to make sawdust

When i get home from work i will post a video on a how-to of making ground foam from sawdust


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## hoscale37

joed2323 said:


> You can easily make ground foam out of sawdust, hopefully you have access to some, or start cutting up wood to make sawdust
> 
> When i get home from work i will post a video on a how-to of making ground foam from sawdust


I already have sawdust (3 bags worth) that I have designated for ground cover.

I was curious though- if anyone has used ground up Cardboard as Ground Cover, if one doesn't have access to Sawdust....I want to at least give it a try to see what I come up with....


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Update! 12/29/2012

With some Christmas money that I got from my family; I was able to score some Tempura Paint powder at Hobby Lobby last night. I picked up White, Black, Brown, Green, Yellow, and Red. I also picked up an 8 pound container of Plaster of Paris for $4.99. The bottles of Dry Powder Tempura Paint were about $6.00 each. They are all 1 pound bottles. This will allow me to do the Zip Texturing that I have been wanting to do on my layout now. 

I also worked on the layout yesterday getting some more cork roadbed down on the layout. I also did some "Road Tests" with one of my powerpacks and my test leads to make sure that power was getting to the tracks as it should. 

All in all, a good day and evening yesterday. If you have a Hobby Lobby near you and you are looking for Dry Tempura Paint, it is tucked away in the paint aisle, almost near the bottom shelves. The stuff that I bought is made by "Rich Art" and is Dust Free Powder Paint. I will post pics up later today or tonight.

Just an update as well- Tried the whole cheap cheese grater and Cardboard. What a disaster! Basically the cheese grater turns the Cardboard to dust.  So I will be on the hunt for an inexpensive Food processor that can chop the cardboard up so that I can use it for ground foam.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

Here are some aforementioned photos that I spoke about in my previous post. 

A pic of the East End of the Layout, along with the Yard and a pic of the Tempura Dry Powder Paint.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout*

FINALLY- I got all of my Cork Roadbed laid down where it needs to go. I don't have it glued down as of yet but I do have it where it needs to be and cut. 

The only places I don't have cork are in my yard, and my sidings. 

Question- Is it necessary to have Cork in a Yard and sidings at all, or can these forgo having any Cork and I can just glue the track down to my foam? Would like some input on this....

I went to a train show in Columbus Ohio yesterday and picked up a new used engine (Seaboard Coast Line) and a boxcar. The show was okay... not great. I guess because it was in the Lausche building of the Expo Center in Columbus which is one of the older buildings. I guess I just wasn't drawn in to this show as with some of the other shows I have been to in the past. The show was decent, but I guess I was expecting there to be more there then what there was. I guess there were only so many spots open for this program. I didn't want to go home without buying anything since it was a 2 hour drive for me. At least buying the Seaboard stuff was worth it.


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## Hold'ErNewt

hoscale37 said:


> Question- Is it necessary to have Cork in a Yard and sidings at all, or can these forgo having any Cork and I can just glue the track down to my foam? Would like some input on this....QUOTE]
> 
> I only use cork on my elevated mainlines and sidings. In my yards and spurs I just glue it to to my foam and then ground cover as normal. I probably would't do this if I didn't use the foam, laying track directly on plywood would be too noisy.


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## hoscale37

Long time no post. I know.

Just have been busy with work. Not much free time. However over the weekend, I finally put the tooth to the nail and got all of my cork roadbed glued down. 

I know I am taking my sweet time with this layout, but in the end- it will all be worth it, right? 

I have picked up some sweet deals on things over the past couple of months. Actually just got 3 pounds worth of lichen from Con-Cor yesterday in the mail for a sweet killer price of $14.99. Mixed colors of Green, Yellow, Gray, and Red. This will work nicely on the layout  

I also picked up two engines from Con-Cor as well that were closeout buys. They were just a bit over $20.00 each but hey- this is a DC layout so what the heck, right? One is an SD-39 and the other is a GP-40, both are undecorated as well- so I can do with them on color as I wish 

I have also picked up some brand new figures, unopened as well as other odds and ends from ebay over the past couple of months (ballast, colors, and other odds/ends) 

I guess I am turning into a train junkie.... I have all of the necessary tools to make the layout a success-it's just finding the time to WORK on the layout!


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout update*

I have started to tack down the track, as well as starting to separate the track into blocks. I am going to start running wiring as well... Finally.

I also am going to have parts of my layout that have something to do related to my favorite prog rock band Genesis. 

So on my layout I will have the following:

White Mountain (From Trespass, 1970)
Willow Farm (From Supper's Ready/Foxtrot, 1972)
Ravine (From The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, 1974)
Home by the Sea (From Genesis, 1983)

In essence, each one will be a visual reference, so I will have a Mountain named "White Mountain", a Farm that is named "Willow Farm", a Ravine with a creek, and a House on a Hill that is near a small lake- "Home by the Sea".

What a better way to combine my music likes with the model railroad....


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's layout update*

06/18/2013

Layout Update. 

Here is an update on the layout. I have been working on getting track tacked down with Rail Brads (I have a whole boatload of new ones that haven't been used yet.) I have also been working on practicing my soldering of wires together before committing anything to the layout. 

While I was thinking about it- I *had* an idea to get this city station (from the Walther's Cornerstone line) 

http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-2904

But after re-measuring where I want to place this station- I am not going to have enough room to place the station! :thumbsdown: 

The station measurements are: 17-5/8 x 5-7/8 x 4-3/8" So this would be 17-5/8 in length, by 5-7/8 in width, and 4-3/8 in height, correct? 

If this is so, then I will NOT be able to use this station  on my layout because the one main section of my yard which leads to my mainline and the Wye that goes to the other section of my mainline is directly where I had planned to put the station....See my diagram attached for further reference. 

Any ideas or suggestions? At this point, I am going to either have to put the station on a different part of the layout (Not my first choice), or pick a similar station that is considerably smaller. I only have 17 inches by 4 inches in width to work with.... UGH!!!

Major :thumbsdown:


----------



## DonR

Bryan

Shame that station doesn't fit...really nice.

I have one that measures 15" trackside and 4" front to back.
I see it often in videos and on line.

Here's 2 pics of mine:

1. Day view before any landscaping.
2. Night lighted view with landscaping.

Don


----------



## hoscale37

DonR said:


> Bryan
> 
> Shame that station doesn't fit...really nice.
> 
> I have one that measures 15" trackside and 4" front to back.
> I see it often in videos and on line.
> 
> Here's 2 pics of mine:
> 
> 1. Day view before any landscaping.
> 2. Night lighted view with landscaping.
> 
> Don


Don,

Nice pictures of your layout. Mine is far from that right now. 

The wiring on my layout is coming along slowly. I still need to run my feeder wires and the wires for my selectors. 

Slow progress- but I am getting itchy to run my trains!


----------



## hoscale37

*Success!*

I successfully connected Blocks 1 and 2 out of a total of 8; and I now have a partially operating layout!  I tested each of the Blocks after I wired them into the Selectors; with success each time. 

I will admit that I had a hard time soldering the feeder wires to the rail. It took me at least 3 times to solder the wire. I used the pencil solder iron that I bought and put flux and solder on the rail and wire. Initially it looked like it was in place, and then when I went to make sure it was attached to the rail it had came detached, until the third try when it held. 

Any ideas? Or have people seen this happen before when Soldering? 

Other then this- the wiring is coming along. I was able to move my test train on at least a good half portion of my track with two blocks hooked up.


----------



## hoscale37

*Success!! Woot!!! *

I literally just finished with wiring of a total of 6 out of the 8 blocks. The last two are for my yard and industrial siding. Wow- so flippin cool to see the trains running now! 

I was successful as well in getting the wires soldered to the rails!  Yeah!!! 

The one thing I need to do now is also run my additional feeder lines to help negate the electric current in the rails. Other then this; I have tested the blocks and all are working well!

Yay!!! A bit of a 4th of July Present.


----------



## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's Layout Update*

Update:

09/06/2013

Haven't been around for a few weeks. Vacation, work and family time have taken the front burner over the past couple of weeks. On the last couple of days of my vacation, I was able to get all of my remaining Soldering done! Good news to report  All of the blocks on the layout are now soldered and wired, everything works well! Just a word to the wise when you are setting up and running wire, because this happened to me: 

I had finished running all of the wires and soldered all the blocks in place. After each solder, I tested the track. After the final solder underneath the table (feeder wires to power bus), I went to test; and there was a 14 inch section of track on the back side of my layout that was completely dead. I was stumped. I knew that my wiring was all good, all of my blocks had worked previously. I cleaned the track, I even soldered some of the sections of track together to find out why I was having issues. As I was checking the one end of powerless section of track. What did I find? At that end of the powerless section of track, I forgot to put in a rail joiner!  How could I be so stupid! 

I almost thought I would have to put in additional track feeders to my power bus. 

Needless to say, I added a rail joiner after finding this issue. All of the wiring is now soldered below the layout and working well; and I have running trains with good working block sections! My next step is going to be giving the entire track layout a thorough track cleaning, and start in on building my mountains and scenery   

It's about time! I will add some photos of my wiring and some pictures of the scenery in building over the next couple of weeks.


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

Build the mountains, etc. before the major track cleaning, because it'll need it after you get done!


----------



## spoil9

Would you consider painting/ weathering your track before building sceneary?


----------



## sstlaure

spoil9 said:


> Would you consider painting/ weathering your track before building sceneary?


This is the order I would do it in.

Lay track
Weather track (spray paint method, clean tops of rails only)
Put in scenery
Lay down ballast between/around ties
Done.....


----------



## hoscale37

Update: 09/28/2013

Just have been reading stuff off and on over the past couple of weeks, formulating some ideas... about mountains and "shaping the terrain". 

I have been going over various other things as well, just been work and family busy and haven't had the time to devote to the layout recently. I have a feeling that when I go down to the layout that everything is going to come out like word vomit and I am going to be going at it like a crazy madman....


----------



## joed2323

:rippedhand: Where are the pictures at:dunno:

What are you waiting for get down to the basement and get working:smilie_daumenpos:


----------



## Big Ed

joed2323 said:


> :rippedhand: Where are the pictures at:dunno:
> 
> What are you waiting for get down to the basement and get working:smilie_daumenpos:



Wait till he wakes up.


----------



## hoscale37

joed2323 said:


> :rippedhand: Where are the pictures at:dunno:
> 
> What are you waiting for get down to the basement and get working:smilie_daumenpos:


You can see some previous work on my layout earlier in this thread 

Kind of hard to work on my layout when I am at work right now...


----------



## hoscale37

big ed said:


> Wait till he wakes up.
> 
> View attachment 30586


Only Ed would have the real life version Ichabod Crane posted in this thread... :laugh:


----------



## hoscale37

*Hoscale37's Layout Update*

Layout Update 10/13/2013

I went to buy a mistint of brown latex brown paint and painted the layout with it as a base. 

I also did some Zip Texturing initially, and then used the paint to go over the brown zip texture. I then also used a mix of Green, Soil, Yellow, and Earth Blend turf. 

I have before and after pictures. 

Thoughts and Comments welcomed....


----------



## golfermd

Maybe mask the rails with a decent tape prior to beginning scenery work. I've had great luck with Tamiya because I have had no issues with residue left on parts.


----------



## hoscale37

*First Weathering attempt*

I spent some time today for about an hour working on some weathering. This is my first attempt.

The first is the Boston & Maine #77711 Boxcar. I used a combination of some fine grit sandpaper to sand the sides of the car down, then I used some colored pencils to color in the areas that I wanted to be represented by rust. I used a fine round brush, and then took red, black, and brown acrylic paint and painted the sides of the car in the seams and elsewhere to represent rust on the car. I did some straight mix paint as well as a bit of a wash to get the effect that I did. 

I also did a Shipping Container as well. 

Overall, this took about 45 minutes to do. 

Thoughts?


----------



## Zippy4

very good . have you tried or experimented with weathering chalks yet ? another cool rust technique is to mix some acrylics to represent rust . dab it with a sponge or use a brush where you want it . mix your chalks to the color of rust you want and after the paint drys a little get your chalk powder and brush or dab it on the rusted areas .. has a great effect i think thats how i do it .. thought id shoot you an idea to help ya out .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hoscale37

hoscale37 said:


> I have started to tack down the track, as well as starting to separate the track into blocks. I am going to start running wiring as well... Finally.
> 
> I also am going to have parts of my layout that have something to do related to my favorite prog rock band Genesis.
> 
> So on my layout I will have the following:
> 
> White Mountain (From Trespass, 1970)
> Willow Farm (From Supper's Ready/Foxtrot, 1972)
> Ravine (From The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, 1974)
> Home by the Sea (From Genesis, 1983)
> 
> In essence, each one will be a visual reference, so I will have a Mountain named "White Mountain", a Farm that is named "Willow Farm", a Ravine with a creek, and a House on a Hill that is near a small lake- "Home by the Sea".
> 
> What a better way to combine my music likes with the model railroad....


Been busy with stuff, but here is an update for January 2014.

Been working on some scenery and laying down ground cover. I am doing the ballast last because as I have seen and read, that "The Earth was first, and the railroads were second." So Ballast will be the last thing that I will be doing. 

Since I wrote this post in regards to naming things on my layout, I had a heck of a time coming up with a name that I truly liked. Until this morning. 

The fictional town that will be represented on my layout will be named:

Ballinsford

On my layout, one of my tracks that leads off the layout will be going west to Vancouver (not British Columbia, but just a random town called Vancouver)

While traveling east will take you to Petevonilke (Pronounced Pet ev on ilk)

There will also be signage represented for Davis, Domino, Padgham, Hitchcock and possibly Gruggy Woof.

My "Downtown of Ballinsford" will be a recreation of 22nd Street and Broadway; including the Lyric Diner. 

Now I know that many of you may be scratching your head or saying "Ok Whatever"- but I wanted my layout to be tied in with my favorite band Genesis (as I have been an all era fan for over 35 years now.) So everything that I came up with is an additional direct reference to their music. The town name is a combination of letters from each of the band members names (from the classic 5 man lineup of the band)- Ballinsford and Petevonilke most notably. I may even throw a reference to Rielkett-on-Hilford in there somewhere 

For those not in the know:

Davis= Nick Davis, one of their album producers

Domino= A track written by Tony Banks from the Invisible Touch album (1986)

Padgham= Hugh Padgham, another music producer that worked with the band in the 1980s

Hitchcock= A reference to David Hitchcock- their producer of their 1972 album Foxtrot, and also a reference to the great Alfred Hitchcock

Gruggy Woof= David Hitchcock's production company

22nd Street & Broadway=A reference from the song "In the Cage" from 1974


So there it is... I FINALLY have a name for my town on my layout


----------



## norgale

Good show Bryan. Seems like everybody names their towns and junctions ect. after somebody they know. Some are tongue in cheek names that have double meanings and a lot are really clever. Mine are usually just made up some way or other. Looks like you have a sure fire way of coming up with names unlimited. Don't forget to post some pictures as you go along. Pete


----------



## hoscale37

Now that I have a town name. I have a GP-9 and 2 GP-40 units that are going to become the main locos for my shortline. 

The GP-9 that I have is a Cox shell, that is currently a Painted in this scheme (First Jpg attachment). Currently I ONLY have a shell and will be fitting it to an appropiate chassis with motor...


My plan is mask off the bottom portion of the unit and paint it in a different scheme so that is basically a two-tone or possibly three-tone engine. 

Here are some paint schemes that I think look halfway decent. 

What are your thoughts?

Taking a vote to see which colors everyone may like and then go from there.


----------



## norgale

The first one doesn't appeal to me at all. However the rest all look great except I would paint the frame sill the same as the top color,in this case yellow. Y,Black,Y;Y,red,y;Y,Blue,Y;Y, Orange, Y or Y,Brown,Y. All mine on the BGC are yellow,orange,yellow. You can see them on the Bonita Grand Central thread. Pete


----------



## spoil9

Where in the general U.S. is this town located? 
Since its a shortline, does it buy its locos new or used from another R.R.?
Time frame? Modern? 70's?

A lot of shortline RR's Ive seen will buy used locos and have based their paint scheme on that RR's scheme to save money when repainting.

On a side note, Ive started a thread with ideas about all the different industries that a RR can serve. Would you mind if I started a new thread about ideas on how to name towns on your RR and I posted your naming ideas.


----------



## norgale

Spoil9 starting a new thread is exactly what you should do. I tnink this would be an interesting thread but don't use other people's ideas unless you ask them first. Perhaps you could also post pictures of the industries your going to mention and the towns if they are real. I would also suggest that you picture railroad equipment that is used with different industries so modelers can see what they should be using. Mentioning kits that are available for an industrie is good and don't forget that lots of us build stuff from scratch so pictures are very useful there too. Good idea. 

As for painting locos I would encourage all modelers to create their own railroad and paint schemes. It takes planning and work to do this but after you paint a few locos or other railcars it gets easier. Lots of fun too.Pete


----------



## hoscale37

spoil9 said:


> Where in the general U.S. is this town located?
> Since its a shortline, does it buy its locos new or used from another R.R.?
> Time frame? Modern? 70's?
> 
> A lot of shortline RR's Ive seen will buy used locos and have based their paint scheme on that RR's scheme to save money when repainting.
> 
> On a side note, Ive started a thread with ideas about all the different industries that a RR can serve. Would you mind if I started a new thread about ideas on how to name towns on your RR and I posted your naming ideas.


The town of Ballinsford is your average midwest town. It's a made up name, so it doesn't really exist in real life- and the locos have all been bought from another Rail line and painted to the town's specs. The timeframe is modern era from the last 40 years- so we are talking mid 1970s to the present. 

All of the name ideas that I have posted in this thread were based off of my favorite band- where I used letters or references to the band's music to name things on my layout. Consequently, I already have ideas to spread my layout two ways onto two additional sections, since I also have spur lines that are currently dead ends, but would lead to additional towns that would connect to Ballinsford.


----------



## hoscale37

Update 03/29/2014:

Spent some time yesterday taking it to the limit with weathering, and I am not done with this boxcar yet. 

Just some history on this boxcar. The boxcar is ATSF 8700. When I had bought it from the previous owner, the previous owner had done a so-so weathering with a greyish/white wash that washed out some parts of the car. After looking at many different pictures of weathered cars over an extended amount of time- I really wanted to just, for lack of a better term; obliterate a boxcar with weathering. 

So, yesterday I took about an hour- with a sandpaper block, acrylic paint (Brown, Red, and Black), as well as colored pencils and some minor use of some colored sharpie markers and I am now at the midway point of having this boxcar weathered. The tags on the car are hand painted as well and are not from a kit. 

Since I wiped out the ATSF logo and the road number, I am curious about doing one of two things: 

1. Relabeling this to the local shortline on my layout....

2. Relabeling this to another rail line with stencil lettering and numbers.... 

Thoughts/comments are welcomed


----------



## Big Ed

:smilie_daumenpos:
Are you going to weather it up? 

I think the lower middle of the frame needs some on both sides?
That part looks too clean compared to the rest?

Edit,
Whoops, I see your only at the midway point on the weathering.


----------



## hoscale37

*JACKPOT!!! This is AWESOME!!!*

So on Monday of this week, I came across a local Craigslist ad that was advertising HO scale track that was already mounted to boards and pre-wired. I talked with the seller through email this whole week. 

Her advertised price was $70 for everything. Today, I went with my wife and son to look at the track and I picked everything up and fit it in the Van. 

Can you say- simply AWESOME!!!! WOW!!!! 

Apparently, the seller was an older woman in her mid to late 60s and these pieces were from her previous husband who had set everything up to run as a perimeter track around a room, but the project was never completed because they parted ways a number of years back. 

So I have a number of sections of flex track that is already pre-wired, mounted on boards with corkboard and soldered and everything, so now I am trying to figure out where on my current 4 X 8 layout I am going to fit everything. This just expands the layout infinitely now, in my own opinion. I now have a 4 track staging yard, and the ladder track that feeds into it... YIPPEE!!!! 

All I have to do now, is re-arrange my basement to accomodate these pieces as some of them are close to 6 and 7 feet in length by 1 foot in width. Track and Corkboard are glued down, soldered, and pre-wired. 

PLUS she also sold me extra flex track AND additional Corkboard. She was very happy that it was all going to someone that would appreciate it, rather the just throwing it all away. 

This is so AWESOME... My mind is just blown now about how I am going to get these pieces to all work with my current setup... plus I have to make more room in my basement to accomodate these extra pieces! 

I got all of this for UNDER $75 as well. 

Just excited and happy!


----------



## spoil9

Congrats. Maybe use it to add a long spur around the basement?


----------



## hoscale37

So now my mind has been spinning this weekend on how to expand the layout.... 

Some thoughts:

I am planning to shift my entire layout in my basement by almost 6 feet. Here is my reasoning...

If I can get everything realigned in my basement, I have a ledge that runs around a good portion of the basement. Utilizing the ledge will give the opportunity to expand even further and I can have the ledge yards added (mentioned at the beginning of this thread) to work in conjunction with what I have currently. The track pieces that I picked the other day will extend the 4 X 8 layout to an additional 116 inches (roughly 9.6 feet) and this 116 inches is a ladder tree yard that splits into 4 lines... so I could literally have ALL of the rail cars that I own, staged in that yard with tons of room to spare... 


I guess I am also going to be looking at some additional controllers as well? I have two MRC 1300 units that are controlling the 4 X 8 layout right now, so would I need to add additional controllers for the additional sections or will the two controllers be enough to handle an additional 17 feet of track wired into 4 X 8 setup? 

Also- since the track on these sections is flex track and is Code 83, the track on my layout is Nickel Silver Code 100... will I have any issues with getting them connected to one another or can standard rail joiners work properly?


----------



## wingnut163

go to:

www.walthers.com

they have (on back order) a code 83/100 nickel silver transition track.

this way you put these in at the place your new stuff starts and there should be no trouble.


----------



## DonR

Having once lived in a house with basement ledges, a suggestion:

Build your ledge layout so it is raised an inch or so over the
ledge top. Insurance against possible rain leakage. It will
get in at times.

Since you won't be able to crawl under the ledge layout you'll
want to prewire sections before you install them on the ledge.

The power systems you have now should be sufficient. Track
does not take power. Locos do. If what you have is
running your trains it will continue to do so with
the added track. You'll just need to run a buss with
more drops to make sure that all sections of new 
track get good juice.

Don


----------



## trains galore

Yes DonR is right, just install some more feeders to compensate for any dodgy rail joiners etc and you will be good to go
Sounds like you got a very good deal too


----------



## Magic

Model train stuff has 72 packages of 12 code 100 to 83 joiners in stock

Magic


----------



## spoil9

A cheap trick is to put a rail joiner on the code 100 track and a touch of solder to hold it. Flatten the end of the rail joiner and lay the code 83 rail right on top. The tops of the track should line up or at least be close. Then solder everything in place real well and use a fine file to level the tops of the tracks if needed.
Heres a couple pictures that show 2 different ideas of doing this.

http://0.tqn.com/d/modeltrains/1/0/N/5/-/-/transition-joiner.JPG

http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm44/Sooliner_2008/IMG_1286_zpsd058629b.jpg


----------



## hoscale37

*Update- Now a Bridge Trestle Project Too!*

Update 04/27/2014

Thanks for the ideas on joining the rails together. Late last week, one of my co-workers gave me some metal pieces that are 28" in length. I have 6 of these now... so my thought is that I will use 4 of these metal pieces to use as leg supports for the new additions for the table. The last two, I am going to re-purpose and create a Rail Bridge/Trestle... modern era. 

These metal pieces are wide enough to fit an HO scale track. So, I am going to lay down a piece of wood backing- followed by some Balsa wood on top of that, to create a bridge trestle. The metal pieces have screw holes in them, so I am going to match up the screw holes and screw the wood backing into place.

Balsa wood will be glued to the wood backing, and secured. Then I am going to build the trestle part with Balsa wood and paint it Black. 

Now since two these metal pieces together will be 54 1/2" in length... is that too long for a Trestle, or should I just go with a 28" trestle? 

So many good things happening right now with the expansion of the layout... I'm a kid in a candy store!


----------



## cosmos2002

Hi

One suggestion wnen laying track. Leave the weathering of the track till the very last. Firstly laying ballast is messy. You might damage the weathering when cleaning and secondly you will get a better effect with the rust from the rail seeping onto the ballast.


----------



## hoscale37

*Update August 2014*

I have taken a few months off from working on the layout until recently. Just have had a busy summer and work related things have kept my personal life busy. Over the past couple of weeks; I have started to work more on the layout again, doing some landscaping and such. I have bought a bunch of stuff over the past couple of months (an unopened bag of 36 Woodland Scenic Trees for $6.00 at the local hobby shop clearance bin- SCORE! ) 

So I have a dilemma now, that I have been fighting with off and on every time I look at the front part of the layout. My double track mainline has two 9 inch rerailers that are installed at the front. My plan was to build the City Station (which I have already but have not built it yet- Walthers City Station, Walthers Part # 933-2904. The kit measurements are the following: Kit - 17-5/8 x 5-7/8 x 4-3/8"

So I need some input. Since the kit is 17 5/8" in length and 5 7/8" Width, Should I take out the one track in my yard and move my Re-Railers over to the curves on the mainlines or ? 

The other option would be to kitbash the back side of the station, but don't really want to do that if I don't have to...

Picture attached. Need some input on this.


----------



## DonR

It's gonna be tough for any of us to give any
worthwhile input without seeing more of your
yard tracks and mains.

First thing I note, however, one corner of your station
is in the beginning of a main curve. The
station should be on a straight so the platform
can be close to the tracks. Cars overhang more
on a curve and likely would hit the platform if
it is typically raised.

Don


----------



## hoscale37

DonR said:


> It's gonna be tough for any of us to give any
> worthwhile input without seeing more of your
> yard tracks and mains.
> 
> First thing I note, however, one corner of your station
> is in the beginning of a main curve. The
> station should be on a straight so the platform
> can be close to the tracks. Cars overhang more
> on a curve and likely would hit the platform if
> it is typically raised.
> 
> Don


Don, 

Here is the layout plan that I followed. Layout plan 8 from a plan book by John Armstrong.


----------



## DonR

That size station is sure going to be a tight squeeze.
That's a very busy layout with a lot of trackage.

One idea: Is it at all possible to make an extension of
the layout table wide enough to hold the station facing
the outer track straight where
there is no curve to cause you trouble.

Another idea: Place the station on a dead end. My
central station is only 2 tracks but is a 'back' in as
was often done in larger cities; Grand Central Station
NYC, Union Station LA, Union Station St. Louis all
were/are back in terminals.

Don


----------



## hoscale37

DonR said:


> That size station is sure going to be a tight squeeze.
> That's a very busy layout with a lot of trackage.
> 
> One idea: Is it at all possible to make an extension of
> the layout table wide enough to hold the station facing
> the outer track straight where
> there is no curve to cause you trouble.
> 
> Another idea: Place the station on a dead end. My
> central station is only 2 tracks but is a 'back' in as
> was often done in larger cities; Grand Central Station
> NYC, Union Station LA, Union Station St. Louis all
> were/are back in terminals.
> 
> Don


Don, 

Thanks for the reply. Part of me is considering just taking out the one section of the small yard that runs directly behind where the back of the station would be located. While it wouldn't effect too much, it would still allow me to place the station where I would like it to go, and since I already have a hole drilled for the wiring for the one section of track, I could just use that drilled hole to place some lighting/etc. for the station itself. A very solid idea, so Thank you for giving some re-enforcement on that  

Any other thoughts at all from anyone?


----------



## hoscale37

*Update August 2014*

Well, I spent the weekend working on the layout. Did some changes and started working on creating a mountain and a small tunnel that runs through the mountain. Cardboard lattic and the whole shebang. I also took out the track section that was immediately behind where the placement for the station is located. I will be relocating the wire run for the track to the new section of track that will be the staging yard that I am adding (the 9.6 foot track section that has been mentioned in some previous posts.)

I have some pictures-will be posting those up later and through the week.


----------



## JasonLift

How was it working with the dust free powder paints? I bought those same brands from Hobby Lobby a few years back as they were the only powder paints I could find there. For the life of me I could not get them to properly mix. I even bought a coffee grinder but I still ended up with yellow and brown flecks all through the mixture.


----------



## hoscale37

*Long Overdue Layout Update- September 2015*

Hoscale's Layout- Update September 2015.... 

I know it has been a LONG time since I have been here... too Long! 

I have just been so busy with life and work that the layout took some time off... partially dating back to the end of 2014 when I had kidneystones and that landed me in the Hospital and getting back into work mode after missing almost a month of work last year. Along with that- I just got more and more "consumed" with taking care of daily life related things, work, etc. So the layout took an extreme back burner-- but the passion for my layout was still in my mind, but it was FINDING the time to work on it! 

So I have gradually gotten back into working on the layout and in the process bought an additional layout too... why do I torture myself!! Ha Ha... 

So a few weeks ago- I traveled 80 miles one way from house to buy an 11 Foot by 4 Foot layout from an elderly gent for a mere $25.00. 

You read that right. It is an old school layout that will need some work. It has Atlas TruScale switches on it and these type of "Metal Wings that are in the center of the track around the layout... I am guessing a type of old school re-railer. I worked yesterday on tearing out alot of the old wiring as none of it was labeled (with exception to various pencil letters and numbers).... 

This huge addition, is the last pieces of trackage that I am going to buy because I feel that I am at a stopping point for track as well as not having enough room in my basement for anything else. I also have a 6 foot staging yard that I haven't even added yet either that I bought in April 2014 for $70.00.... 

So overall- a 4 X 8 layout currently, add the 11 X 4 in with this... and the 6 Foot staging yard; now gives you the scope of how big the overall layout is now going to be... 



So NOW- this fall will be rearranging the basement to accomodate all of this trackage. The "new to me 11 X 4" will also have to have all of the old brass track torn up and relaid with new track.... Here are a few pictures of my new "beauty"... and yes- I did buy it for only $25.00....


----------



## hoscale37

*Hoscale's Layout Update 09/2015*

Update 09/2015... 

I have finished tearing up all of the old track from the "new to me" layout. I will be laying down new track soon. 

I also stopped by the local thrift shop and found some still in box, never opened HO structures that I bought... so these will come in handy for kitbashing on the new section of the layout. 

Still working on creating more Room to add this additional section of track/layout in the basement.


----------



## hoscale37

*Redoing the Layout*

Well- Seems I haven't been here in quite a while... 

I have been busy with work and life- still been working on the layout. 

A few weeks ago, in the middle of January 2017, I had a train epiphany. I discovered that it was time for a change. The 4 X 8 that I had set up back in 2012 and had posted pictures of in this very thread- needed to go. 

Last Night- I just finished tearing down the 4 X 8 layout- Ballinsford Layout #1: 2012-2017

The power to the layout had been disconnected for a few months, as I wanted to redo my control board (I'm old school DC... No DCC for me)....so the power had been gone from the layout since September or October of 2016. 

I have decided that it's time to do something different. Watching trains go around in an oval is kind of Meh. My layout was also based on a John Armstrong layout as well. 

I have now opted to do a 2 X 16 Shelf Layout, complete with a 6 foot staging yard, that will form a backwards L along the wall in our small basement (we live in a Bi-Level House). 

I may have some smaller middle Peninsulas, but also wanting to do a small Dogbone or variation that connects to the shelf layout. 

Does this make sense? 

So- anyone that has done a Shelf Layout... Let's hear the following:

Pros / Cons of a Shelf Layout ???


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## Gramps

Because of limited space I'm restricted to a shelf layout which I use for switching. If it were possible I would have the option of both just letting trains run and also include the switching.


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## DonR

A shelf layout is ideal for good switching sessions.

But a good switching session means you are likely
to 'break' an incoming train, or 'build an outgoing
train.

Perhaps you could add a 'bubble' to each end of your
shelf that could provide a 'loop' so that you could
run your train after building it.

Don


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## norgale

I've thought about the shelf idea too but I would rather have a loop somewhere so the train I put together in the yard has some place to go and then come back. Ya I do like to do yard switching but I like to take a break once in awhile and just watch the trains go around.


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## hoscale37

*Cleaning the Basement*

So I have been cleaning the basement and I have a rough track plan put together as well. Although I still have a ways to go... I wondered what your thoughts were in regards to going to a shelf layout. 

Currently I have an 8 inch ledge that runs the length of one side of my basement. I have wall brackets that will support the 20 Inch Brackets that I have purchased, since my shelf layout will be 2 X 16. 

Should I go with the shelf being supported on the wall brackets spaced every 2 feet... 

Or- do I go with a small amount of reinforcement and have the shelf "resting on the 8 inch ledge while it is supported by an L Bracket that is hung from the front of the ledge, as shown in the picture. 

Thoughts?


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## bewhole

I myself Would use the 20 Inch Brackets the L Brackets are way to easy to come off the wall ( Screws pulling out) no matter what sized Screws you put in. The 20" Brackets are stronger and if you need to move the layout you can just "Pop" them out of the rails on the wall and away you go.


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## Gramps

I built my shelf layout with the L brackets but I used a stud finder to make sure the screws were in a beam. So far no problems.


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## hoscale37

*Hoscale's Layout Update 02/2017*

As many of you may know- I tore down the Layout that originally started this thread. 

I am upgrading to a 2 X 16 Shelf Layout. 

Although I really want to have a mainline run as well connected to the shelf layout- will I be able to accomplish this? 

The reason why I ask is that I have roughly about 6 feet out from the wall and roughly about the full 16 feet on the opposite side of the wall, where I could utilize a full mainline run. Would it be possible to do a full loop on a 6 foot by 16 foot? 

I have some books coming to me for shelf layout design...and I have been scouring the internet for smaller loop designs, but I am coming up shorthanded.... 

Any thoughts or comments?


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## time warp

6'×16' in HO? Holy cow, I'd say so!


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## flyboy2610

With 72" of width, you could easily have 30" curves. There's not much that won't run on those!


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## hoscale37

*Update- 02/2017*

The layout plan- I think; for now, is a go. 

2 X 16 Foot Shelf Layout, with a 1 foot wide by 6 foot long run from the wall curving to a 2 foot wide by 12 foot long mainline run, with a connection on the other end of the shelf layout. 

So- essentially it will be a Shelf Layout that includes capabilities to switch, as well as having a mainline run loop. 

Sound like a good idea? 

The mainline run will also be at 42 inches from the floor. 

I am wondering though- I already have plenty of Constructions Screws to attach the wall brackets to the wall, where the 20" hangers will be attached to them. Will 1 1/2 inch construction screws be long enough to attach the wall bracket into the studs on the wall, or should I go with longer screws (2 inches in length)?


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## norgale

hoscale37 said:


> The layout plan- I think; for now, is a go.
> 
> 2 X 16 Foot Shelf Layout, with a 1 foot wide by 6 foot long run from the wall curving to a 2 foot wide by 12 foot long mainline run, with a connection on the other end of the shelf layout.
> 
> So- essentially it will be a Shelf Layout that includes capabilities to switch, as well as having a mainline run loop.
> 
> Sound like a good idea?
> 
> The mainline run will also be at 42 inches from the floor.
> 
> I am wondering though- I already have plenty of Constructions Screws to attach the wall brackets to the wall, where the 20" hangers will be attached to them. Will 1 1/2 inch construction screws be long enough to attach the wall bracket into the studs on the wall, or should I go with longer screws (2 inches in length)?


Inch and a half is plenty as long as your screwing into a wall stud. Don't know how thick your braces will be so it's hard to tell.


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## hoscale37

*Update- 05/01/2017- Ballinsford Rail Layout #2*

Hello all, 

Haven't posted in a few weeks- as I have been busy with some life related things and working on the layout. 

Although- things kind of dumped this weekend, so I have had to revise the plan for the "Shelf Layout". Over the course of the weekend, I was working to get an addition piece added to the current 8 foot section of the layout that I had secured to the wall via heavy duty shelf brackets. If you are reading that last sentence, you can see where this is going... 
Well, in the process of trying to move the addition piece around, it hit the corner of the mounted shelf- essentially ripping the top of the mounted bracket out of the wall. Mind you- I spent TWO MONTHS WITH A STUD FINDER- MARKING OFF WHERE THE STUDS WERE IN THE WALL!!!! Only to have the shelf bracket pull out of the wall. Essentially forcing me to now have- an again- standing table, rather then something mounted to the wall. 

I am still about this close to just giving up on this "Wonderful Hobby"... because, to me- it's been stupid crap after setback after setback. Part of me is wondering if I even should have a layout because it seems I can't make anything work. I just feel so defeated. :smilie_daumenneg:

So I had to get some "emergency legs" in place on the 8 foot table (former shelf). Those are in place and attached via some heavy duty screws. So essentially it is now going to be Modular setup rather then a shelf setup. I'm not fooling around trying to secure things to the wall. As I mentioned, I went over and over on my wall with my stud find and marked everything off of where my stud finder told me where the studs were. Did not anticipate that this would happen, but it's BS like this that just really makes me hate this hobby sometimes. I just feel like I am spinning my wheels and not getting anywhere. 

Sorry for the long winded post- and if you read this far, and have had issues in the past- am I wrong for feeling this way? I just feel so defeated and just wondering if I should even stay in the hobby now or just get out completely....I don't want to have to be starting from ground zero every 3-5 months because of something stupid. Just frustrated more then anything else.


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## markg11

hoscale37 said:


> Hello all,
> Well, in the process of trying to move the addition piece around, it hit the corner of the mounted shelf- essentially ripping the top of the mounted bracket out of the wall. Mind you- I spent TWO MONTHS WITH A STUD FINDER- MARKING OFF WHERE THE STUDS WERE IN THE WALL!!!! Only to have the shelf bracket pull out of the wall.


Give it a day or two and things will look better for you. We all have that feeling of wanting to toss things across the room now and then. (Maybe the stud finder?  )

I gave up on the stud finder a long time ago. What I do now grab a very strong magnet off the fridge and slide it around on the wall until it sticks to one of the drywall screws, there's your stud. Sometimes I double check by drilling a couple of small holes 3/4 inch deep into the drywall. Stick something into the hole and if it stops after 3/4, you're at a stud. If your house is relatively new, the next stud should be 16" over and the drywall screws usually line up horizontally as well.

There is one particular stucco wall on the outside of my house where I couldn't find a stud. I was perhaps feeling a bit frustrated on that day. Consequently, there are a series of about 20 3/8" holes drilled in the wall trying to find a stud. :laugh:

cheers - mark


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## mopac

I do understand the frustration level. Just keep thinking how cool it will be when all
the problems are worked out. I guess it is part of the hobby. Most layouts are not a
kit, so new problems will creep up.
I have dreamed of my dream layout for 25 years. I worked a lot and had no time. It
was something for retirement. I have been retired for 3 years now and have not started
the layout. All those years I collected stuff for the layout. Track, turnouts, many locos
and rolling stock. I bought my DCC system, a booster, reverse units, and now I am
starting to wonder if this dream will ever happen. I have a train room in the basement.
15' X 26'. Almost 80 feet around the walls. We had over 6" of rain this weekend and the
room had a lot of water coming in. I have lived here for 40 years and never seen water
like this. I was going to remodel the room and then start the layout. I live on the side of a hill and it is still seeping water. So I don't know. 
Hang in there and make it happen !!!


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## Magic

I know exactly where you're at, been there two times. 
The first time I ended up cleaning off the bench work and started over again.
Hard to do but I'm very glad I did it, much better layout the second time.

Just recently I hit the brick wall again, not any one thing but a series of smaller ones.
I even started an I'm about to give up thread.
I was very close to giving up but with the encouragement from the guys here I stuck with it. 
Just had to take some time off and than start with smaller projects.
I'm back at it again but at a slower pace. 

Mine is an around the walls shelf layout mounted on the wall studs.
I ended up doing much like markg11 did, drilled small holes to make sure I had a stud. 
Once you find the first one every 16" should get the next but to make sure 
I drilled more holes to make sure I was in the center of the stud. 
I didn't use brackets but screwed the frame work directly into the wall.
It's a modular design. 1X4 outside framework.
You can see some of the holes I drilled.
WARNING looking at the wiring mess can cause serious eye damage. 








Than I added legs to the outside of the bench work for added strength. 
I angled the legs inward so I wasn't tripping over them all the time. 








They are 24 inch wide shelves.








Nevada is earthquake country and if there ever is one I diving under the shelf layout, it's that strong.

Sure hope you'll take a few days off and gather your thoughts and stick with it 
You have the room etc. to build a nice layout and would hate to see you give it up.
Good luck and hope to see you here often making progress.

Magic


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## hoscale37

*UPDATE- 11/26/2018 HOscale37's Layout*

Hello everyone, 


I have not been here in a LONG TIME. But- I have been working on my layout; off and on- as time permits. So- if you have read about all of the previous posts in this thread, and where we left off...I had an idea for a layout setup that would essentially be a 2 foot wide layout- 16 feet in length. 

I have that setup right now, along with 2 additional 2 foot by 2 foot sections. Essentially the layout is a 16 X 2 X 2- Point to Point; with a concentration on switching on the main 8 foot section. 

I am now to the lovely point of finally getting to wiring. I have SPDT toggle switches that I am going to wire up to 2 MRC 1300 Cab Controllers (I'm still old school DC, here... I'm not interested in DCC at the current time- mainly because of cost).... 

As it looks, I think I will have a total of 6 Blocks- possibly 8. But I was wondering if anyone had any ideas or pointers for wiring the Cabs up to the SPDT Toggles. The Toggles are already mounted in a metal frame, which will be attached to a board where the controllers are going to be. 

I've been through a lot of life related stuff over the past couple of years- most of it with family members that have been sick and passed away.... so I'm trying to use my trains and layout as Therapy to get my mind off of those family related things. 

Any thoughts or ideas/comments are welcome.


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## PoppetFlatsRR

Life is short, and trains are fun. Have as much fun as as you possibly can sir. Looking forward to new pictures.

One of these guys will be able to answer your questions. I just look, not qualified to answer.

Again have fun.


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## Magic

Good to see you back Bryan.
Sorry to hear of family difficulties.
Trains can be a very good therapy.
Hope everything works out OK for you and we see some progress on the layout.

I'm a DCC guy so no help on the wiring, sorry.

Magic


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## DonR

Since you have SPDT switches in your panel you'll
be using the common rail electric system.

It is important that your common rail is always
the Inner rail (actually your choice inner or outer but
it must be the same thruout the layout)
and that your insulated joiners are in the opposite
rail. The common rail does not have insulated joiners.
It would be fed by one Side of the power pack track terminals.

You would connect the rail in each block with insulated joiners
to the MIDDLE terminal on the switch which will control it. Power pack A to the terminal on one end and Power pack B on the other terminal. Be consistent with your connections.

Connect the other terminal of each power pack together
to form a bus, to which the common rails are connected.

It is important to observe polarity for the bus.

Here is a discussion of common rail. Pay attention
to what poster Tomikawa has written.

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/147363.aspx

Don


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## hoscale37

DonR said:


> Since you have SPDT switches in your panel you'll
> be using the common rail electric system.
> 
> It is important that your common rail is always
> the Inner rail (actually your choice inner or outer but
> it must be the same thruout the layout)
> and that your insulated joiners are in the opposite
> rail. The common rail does not have insulated joiners.
> It would be fed by one Side of the power pack track terminals.
> 
> You would connect the rail in each block with insulated joiners
> to the MIDDLE terminal on the switch which will control it. Power pack A to the terminal on one end and Power pack B on the other terminal. Be consistent with your connections.
> 
> Connect the other terminal of each power pack together
> to form a bus, to which the common rails are connected.
> 
> It is important to observe polarity for the bus.
> 
> Here is a discussion of common rail. Pay attention
> to what poster Tomikawa has written.
> 
> http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/147363.aspx
> 
> Don


Don- Thank you for the info. I'm planning to be working on the wiring this weekend; as I still have some other things to work out in regards to ideas for the Lighting for some of the buildings as well. I have a feeling that everything is going to be happening fairly quickly once I get the wiring done.... almost like word vomit... if you get what I am saying. Meaning- that I hope I can keep up with everything... 

As an addition question- I have Railroad Signals that are "Red/Green Signals"... essentially I could wire this setup for basic Occupancy Detection, with Light Detectors as well, correct? Where would I place the Occupancy Detectors as well as the Signals in the Wire Schematic?


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