# Help with 718 mail car



## chrisallen21 (Sep 1, 2016)

I have been away from the forum far too long and it feels good to get back to it. I am working on a 718 mail car and had to replace the truck on one end which has the pickup lever in it. I did so but think somethen went awry. When I have the car on the track and apply power to the track, the mechanism to sweep the mail out activates even though the car isn't going anywhere. The replaced truck has a fiber washer on the bottom of the chassis and the truck to insulate it (which appears to be the same as the front truck) but I don't know if it should be there or not. 

I included a picture (without the cover) but am not sure it adds much value. The pickup lever is attached to the truck on the right hand side of the picture (I guess I should have taken a picture showing the side with the pickup lever :lol_hitting I am guessing it is something simple that I messed up so your help would be appreciated!


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## cramden (Oct 13, 2015)

Sounds like one of the trucks isn't insulated from the chassis. I have a 918 which should have the same set up as the 718. On mine looking at the car with the arm facing me the left truck has the activating arm facing me and there is no insulator washer on that truck. The right side truck has a fiber washer between the chassis and the truck. There should be a fiber bushing that goes between the chassis and the rivet on that truck from the top of the chassis down thru the hole. Also the truck with the arm should have no metal wheels on it. The truck on the right has the metal wheels on the same side as the activating arm on the left truck. You can switch the metal wheels the other way round if your mail pick up arm is on the opposite side of your track as long as the metal wheels are on the base post rail. Hope this helps.


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## cramden (Oct 13, 2015)

I checked my books and on line but couldn't come up with a parts diagram on the mail cars, but the truck set up should be the same for any of the other action cars that use the activating arm in the truck.


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## chrisallen21 (Sep 1, 2016)

Thanks for the reply. I actually don't have any other action cars so I was a bit lost on the truck assembly. I also searched for the 718 mail car and couldn't locate a diagram. I will add the fiber bushing to the truck (doesn't have one now) and remove the fiber washer as you indicate to see if that does the trick.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

Sorry, I can't add anything to the conversation..


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## chrisallen21 (Sep 1, 2016)

Now I remember why I didn't put the fiber bushing in the the chassis hole (fiber bushing part number PA10209). It was too big to fit in the hole!  I have a previous post on this topic (http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=124361&highlight=718) where I detailed the parts I had with the hopes that someone has the actual part number for the correct fiber bushing. I am not at home presently to measure the exact diameter but if I did provide the diameter, would someone be able to tell me the correct fiber bushing part number to order?


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

chrisallen21 said:


> Now I remember why I didn't put the fiber bushing in the the chassis hole (fiber bushing part number PA10209). It was too big to fit in the hole!  I have a previous post on this topic (http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=124361&highlight=718) where I detailed the parts I had with the hopes that someone has the actual part number for the correct fiber bushing. I am not at home presently to measure the exact diameter but if I did provide the diameter, would someone be able to tell me the correct fiber bushing part number to order?


We should be able to help with the proper id/od.


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## chrisallen21 (Sep 1, 2016)

Ok, I took a couple pics. It looks like the inside diameter (ID) of the chassis hole is 3/16". The fiber washer that I have has a 5/16" ID.

So I guess I am looking for a fiber washer that has an outside diameter (OD) of 3/16" so that it fits in the chassis hole. The top part of the fiber washer is fine to be larger. Note that I have the fiber washer upside-down in the picture for measurement purposes.

I have included a couple pics to show the measurements


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

There are so many darn insulating bushings that I'm lost. I believe you need the bushing for "action" cars, and it could be PA10209 or PA8715-B..With that being said, there are more listed.. Here's what you do... Call Jeff Kane at "The Train Tender". He has just about everything ever made for Lionel and AF. Tell him you need the insulating bushing for the 718 mail car. He'll have it, at a great price.. You don't pay him until you get the part, he's that trusting and a great guy. His phone # is 1-585-229-2050.


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## cramden (Oct 13, 2015)

chrisallen21 said:


> Ok, I took a couple pics. It looks like the inside diameter (ID) of the chassis hole is 3/16". The fiber washer that I have has a 5/16" ID.
> 
> So I guess I am looking for a fiber washer that has an outside diameter (OD) of 3/16" so that it fits in the chassis hole. The top part of the fiber washer is fine to be larger. Note that I have the fiber washer upside-down in the picture for measurement purposes.
> 
> I have included a couple pics to show the measurements


Sorry I couldn't get back until now. Silly question, are both holes in the chassis the same diameter? I came up with the same #PA10209 bushing, PA10235 rivet, and PA8715-BX. Maybe the truck that came mounted is in the wrong hole. I agree with flyernut on this, without a diagram we are just guessing. I would make that call and explain your problem, chances are Jeff has the right part or call Doug at Portlines. One of them I'm sure can straighten it out.


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## cramden (Oct 13, 2015)

flyernut said:


> Sorry, I can't add anything to the conversation..


Flyernut, you have helped more on this forum than most.:thumbsup: I try to be helpful when possible. Sometimes it takes a joint effort but to me that is part of the fun of this hobby. All of us working to a common goal, fun with Flyer trains.


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## chrisallen21 (Sep 1, 2016)

Yup, I ordered several times from Jeff Kane and he has never steered me wrong. I will give him a call and see if we can't figure this mystery out!

cramden,
It is hard to tell if the chassis hole at the other end is bigger as the other truck is attached but the rivet head does look bigger suggesting, perhaps, that it might be. Either way, I am sure Jeff or Doug can fix me up.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

chrisallen21 said:


> Yup, I ordered several times from Jeff Kane and he has never steered me wrong. I will give him a call and see if we can't figure this mystery out!
> 
> cramden,
> It is hard to tell if the chassis hole at the other end is bigger as the other truck is attached but the rivet head does look bigger suggesting, perhaps, that it might be. Either way, I am sure Jeff or Doug can fix me up.


It might be that someone before you has changed out the rivet and bushing. I know this could be true as some new after-market rivets have bigger heads, but the same diameter shafts/shanks/bodies that go through the hole in the chassis. This is especially true for the rivets in the tender, they are easier to solder wires to with the larger-type head.


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

cramden said:


> Flyernut, you have helped more on this forum than most.:thumbsup: I try to be helpful when possible. Sometimes it takes a joint effort but to me that is part of the fun of this hobby. All of us working to a common goal, fun with Flyer trains.


Thank you for the kind words!! You have been here just for a short while, but the info you share is full of knowledge!! Many times I don't respond to a thread you're on because you have given a great and IMHO a absolutely correct response that I can't add anything positive to it.. And a big "thank you" for that from me..I belong to only 2 forums, and this one is wonderful. I've only met 1 jerk here, and my response to him was to not respond to him,lol. Thanks for your wisdom.....:smilie_daumenpos:


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## cramden (Oct 13, 2015)

flyernut said:


> Thank you for the kind words!! You have been here just for a short while, but the info you share is full of knowledge!! Many times I don't respond to a thread you're on because you have given a great and IMHO a absolutely correct response that I can't add anything positive to it.. And a big "thank you" for that from me..I belong to only 2 forums, and this one is wonderful. I've only met 1 jerk here, and my response to him was to not respond to him,lol. Thanks for your wisdom.....:smilie_daumenpos:


I only belong to this forum, but I have been looking at it for a long time. Also read OGR and the various "S" forums on Yahoo. I don't do any social media and hardly know how to use my " smartphone," a hand me down from my stepson. I have bought many books about Flyer over the last 30 odd years. There are others that know a whole lot more than I do about repairs. Props to you and others on here that share your knowledge freely. Please feel free to add info on my sometimes long winded posts as I try to help others with their questions.


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## chrisallen21 (Sep 1, 2016)

718 Mail Car mystery has been solved!

In addition to the great help that flyernut and cramden have provided, Jeff Kane came through with some additional information. He found a parts diagram (although the actual part numbers associated with the diagram is not available) that helped solve this mystery.

According to Jeff:
Here is my thought-- If you remove the other truck on the 718 car, you will probably find that the hole in the frame for that truck is larger and it will accept the fiber washer you are showing me in your photo. I believe the S gauge Gilbert design of this truck used one fully insulated truck and the other truck just grounds to the frame so the smaller hole in your photo does not use a shouldered fiber washer, it probably just uses a PA9381 shoulder rivet with no washer on the top or the bottom. In this case, the entire frame conducts one side of the circuit to operate the car.


So I did what he suggested along with a couple other modifications:
1. Use of two sets of plastic wheels on the truck with the pickup lever
2. Use of sintered wheels on the other truck on the same side of the pickup lever

Here is the parts diagram that Jeff sent me:








I ordered the parts for the 718 mail car last November and just didn't get around to it until recently. I HAD to take a video just to document my success! I put it up on my dropbox at https://www.dropbox.com/s/h6xfsoheqoy05qg/mail_car_in_action.MOV?dl=0. I had to add another small transformer (I only run a 4B for my test track so I added a 1 1/2 just to power the mail accessory; I REALLY need to get a larger transformer hwell

Finally, here are a few pics of the 718 chassis so that if someone else runs into a similar problem with an action car, hopefully this will help.
























Thanks again flyernut and cramden with the advice and guidance. I couldn't have done it without you!


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## flyernut (Oct 31, 2010)

Glad we got this fixed!!!Jeff is a great guy!!!!.. And thanks for the kind words.


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## cramden (Oct 13, 2015)

Your more than welcome. Glad all's well that ends well. Enjoy.


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