# Wiring help



## zechariahthist (Jan 5, 2015)

Hey guys, so in terms of the hobby I'm not new, I've done this hobby for over 12 years now, but only recently have I gotten into the more difficult track layouts (difficult for me) and the wiring is killing me. I recently switched over to kato unitrack for N scale and now that these turnouts have electric frogs it is throwing me for a loop. my question to you is: my current layout has a yard and two basic oval shaped main lines connected by a double crossover. The inner line also has a circle track attached to allow engines to change direction (all of this is shown in the drawing I have included) 
So my question is: How do i wire this thing to get it working correctly? I currently have four feeder tracks, two packages of insulated joiners, and a digitrax zephyr for the power pack. Any help would be greatly appreciated!


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

First, you have a reverse loop (the circle of track middle lower.) You must
isolate both rails North of all turnouts. It will have to be powered through
a reverse loop controller since you are DCC. The reverse controller is
fed by the buss, the circle is fed by the controller.

I assume from what you say that your turnouts are 'electrofrog' That
means the turnout itself or a tortoise motor with switches determines
which 'phase' (polarity) the frog is fed. Which does the switching?

If the rails connected to the frog are powered by it you would have to
use an insulated joiner in the frog rails to avoid shorts.

All that being said, the wiring for your layout if there are no 'blocks'
would be simple. Just drops from the track to a buss every few
feet for every track. One line
of it running north and South, the other East and west, connected
where they cross. Do not make a circle of your buss. It should be
fed at one point near the center by your DCC controller.

Be aware of 'phasing' (polarity). 

Let us know if that gets you going.

Don


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

First, you have a reverse loop (the circle of track middle lower.) You must
isolate both rails North of all turnouts. It will have to be powered through
a reverse loop controller since you are DCC. The reverse controller is
fed by the buss, the circle is fed by the controller.

I assume from what you say that your turnouts are 'electrofrog' That
means the turnout itself or a tortoise motor with switches determines
which 'phase' (polarity) the frog is fed. Which does the switching?

If the rails connected to the frog are powered by it you would have to
use an insulated joiner in the frog rails to avoid shorts.

All that being said, the wiring for your layout if there are no 'blocks'
would be simple. Just drops from the track to a buss every few
feet for every track. One line
of it running north and South, the other East and west, connected
where they cross. Do not make a circle of your buss. It should be
fed at one point near the center by your DCC controller.

Be aware of 'phasing' (polarity). 

Let us know if that gets you going.

Don


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## zechariahthist (Jan 5, 2015)

Okay some clarifications:

-By north of all turnouts, do you mean specifically to the picture of my layout?
-I'm not familiar with what a reverse loop controller is...how does that work and is it an additional piece of equipment I must buy or is it something I could control with the digitrax?
-Well maybe I'm confused as to what you're saying but by electric frogs I meant that when i used code 55 Atlas track the center piece where the rails cross in the turnout were black and not made of metal. With unitrack they are made of metal. When I used code 55 track I didn't have these issues with wiring, but basically If I had the train running over the main outer line and had it go into one of the yard sidings and then flipped the switch so that another train could pass through on the outer main line then the train on the outer yard siding would lose power until the switch was flipped back. When I mentioned this to another modeler, they said it was because the frog was metal, also known as an electric frog. 
-by 'blocks' you mean?
-I'm not familiar with what a Buss is.. and I do understand matching the polarity on the rails to prevent shorts, but are you saying to make a cross with the buss? (I am assume by context that the bus is a big wire that is the only actual wire to be fed into my Digitrax, and all feeder wires branch off the buss wire to the track) And in doing so, I essentially need a main wire that extends in the shape of a cross, not a circle, with each of the four branched facing in one of the cardinal directions?, the epicenter of which is connected to the Digitrax?

again, thank you for the reply, I am sorry to say I'm still very unfamiliar with terminology. So thank you so much for the help!


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## KrupickaB (Dec 22, 2014)

You need two (2) Digitrax AR1 Automatic Reverse Controllers. One for each reverse loop noted on the attached diagram. The black lines represent the locations of insolated rail joiners. Insolated rail joiners need to be placed in both rails.
Brian


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

To understand my reference to North, read your drawing as if it were a map.
North is UP, South is down, East is right and West is left.

First let me explain the Reverse loop that you have. It is the oval
just above the double crossover. Anytime you can turn a loco around
to go the opposite direction on the same track you have a reverse loop. 
The reason this becomes a problem is that, for example, the outer rail of
yours goes all the way around and then thru the turnouts touches the opposite
rail and becomes a short circuit. To avoid this you must use insulated joiners
to create an isolated track section. On your drawing the best place for these is
where the upper part of that oval joins the turnouts on either side North
of your East-West double mains. 

To make your loop work without shorting you use a device that is
called a reverse loop controller. The input to it is from the main buss.
It's output feeds only the isolated track. When a loco crosses the insulated
joiners the reverse controller senses a short and quickly reverses the
polarity of the isolated section and the loco continues on without pause.
You will need to buy one of these. They cost around 50.00 or less.
It goes under the table and is
fully automatic. You do not do anything with it after installation.

Apparently from your explanation you actually have Insulfrog turnouts
with 'power routing'. The turnout turns OFF power to the diverting
frog rail when the points are set for straight through, for example. To
overcome that in some cases, you add a drop from the frog rails
to the buss.

The Buss is simply a pair of wires fed by the output of your DCC controller.
In your case it would form a rough + in the middle. You would have drop
wires from your tracks that would connect to this pair of wires. But since
you have several tracks in the North section and several in the South
section you would need a buss to connect these tracks. Another would
connect the drops to the East and West tracks. The 2 busses would
be connected together in the middle of the layout. The number of
drops would then give you a fairly even distribution of your power so that
locos don't slow in any section due to electrical 'line loss'.

Keep the questions coming. We'll get you up and running in no time.

Don


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Brian

I'm not sure I see your thinking. When I first saw the drawing I thought
TWO WYES. But, as I trace it out it still looks to me that one
controller and one isolated section would be sufficient. I'm not
yet ready to say we need two reverse controllers. It's a tricky one.
I usually have an epiphany after thinking a while.

Don


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## zechariahthist (Jan 5, 2015)

Thanks Don, that cleared up a ton of confusing parts for me! That being said, I'll likely have to remove the reverse loop, as I currently do not have the money to dish out on one of those guys just yet. Also, by drop I assume that is the term for a feeder wire coming from the buss to the tracks? If so, you mention adding a drop to the frog in the turnouts to stop the power routing that is taking place, how would I manage to do that? I should also note that I am only a Junior in undergrad working towards a M.D. so I will be in small apartments for at least another 8 years. That being said, I'm not building a permanent layout, these are actually temp layouts on my floor. The reason I mention this is because if soldering is the only option here, then I'm gonna need a different idea. Also, is there not any special wiring required for the double crossover? Another question is how do I connect the drops to the buss? I assume the buss is insulated wire, as I cannot see any intelligence behind having a completely bare wire sitting around. So would I just have to carefully use wire cutters on two close points and then rip that insulated covering off, giving a few millimeter exposed section to wrap the drop wire around? Or what would be a better alternative if I'm not thinking of it? So I assume my next investment is 20 or 30 drop wires and a buss, any recommendations on the type of wire or gauge used for the buss? I use the Kato quick plug wires for the drops, which attach to specific feeder tracks underneath. Thanks again!


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## zechariahthist (Jan 5, 2015)

Also Don, what are your recommendations on a reverse loop controller? I've found a few but they are from atlas and they have multiple switches on them and it doesn't seem automatic. Then there is the Rokuhan Z COO3 reverse loop controller but its only 15$, which is much cheaper than what you mentioned, so i'm just making sure that these are the same thing you were mentioning.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Yes, when I say drop, I am referring to a wire feeder from
the track to the buss wires. You can use the Kato track
section with the plug in for your mains and not need to
make any solder connections but, in fact, soldering might
be less costly since you would need several Katos.

Any make of DCC reverse loop controller would work with your
system. However, it is always best to stay with the the make
of your controller. I use the Bachmann controller on my layout.
It works fine and is likely less than other brands. It is wise to
shop around on Amazon. The prices vary widely on DCC 
equipment. Be sure that the product states that it is DCC
and automatic, as all Digitrax, NCE, and Bachmann, for
example, are. Also you might find a used one if you post
a free WANTED ad in our For sale or trade section.

The Atlas controller you referred to is not automatic. I would
not recommend that to you.

The Rokuhan is also a manual controller. If you watched their
video you see the loco go around the loop then you had to
stop it before it crossed the 2nd insulated joint. At that
point you threw the red switch (to match polarity) so you
could continue. It seems to be an attachment to that
company's DC controller.

In the event you won't be buying a reverse controller,
you would want to remove the track from that inner
oval where the loop is created else you would have
a short circuit. It can always be added back.

The connections to the Kato plug in track drops would connect
to your buss is with a 'suitcase' connector available from 
Home Deport or Lowes. No soldering. Here is the one you want
being offered by Micro Mark.

http://www.micromark.com/suitcase-connectors-idc-558-pink-pkg-of-25,8998.html

Note that they also suggest the wire gauge for your buss and your
drops. Radio shack does have some wire, but if there is a good
electrical supply store in your area you may have a better
selection. You would want Red and Black for your tracks.
If you will have remote powered turnouts you would want
Red, Green and black. Sometimes it's more economical
to buy the multi conductor cables made for intercoms
or heating/A/C thermostats for your turnout controls.

There really is no way to get away from soldering at
various times on a model railroad. Go to a Harbor
freight and get one of their cheap 20 or 25 watt irons, some
resin flux and resin solder. Practice on some scrap
materials and you'll find it easy and convenient.
You could use the 'plug' in track sections you mention
but you would need several and best economy is
to solder.

Look at your turnout Frog. You'll notice a short rail
leaving it to the edge of the turnout base. You will
use a joiner to connect it to the track. It is that 
track rail that you will want to add the drop to the
buss so that the track will not be turned off by the
turnout. This is where you'd need to solder the drop
wire to the track rail, but not to the turnout rail.

I note you said you will set up on the floor. I would urge
you to do so on some sort of a hard surface, not the carpet
or floor itself. Especially, not carpet. First the tracks will
be unstable on carpet or tile and actually separate. In addition,
carpet lint gets into the loco trucks and you don't want that.

There is no special wiring for the double crossover. Just connect
the turnout motors per the instructions with the crossover.

Don


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