# NCE Wireless



## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

I have been researching the options of the NCE system. Leaning toward the power can starter system. However if I want Wireless I would need to go Power Pro R. So my question is for those of you that have used both, is the wireless worth the additional cost?

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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

I don't have the NCE wireless.

However, I do have a wired hand controller.

My center control sector is not roomy. I find that
the cord has wrapped around me, or my chair.

By all means, try to go wireless, preferably 
rf wireless (radio) rather than ultrared. 
The rf version is not limited to line of sight.

Don


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Yea that was the part that concerned me about a tethered cab. Going with the pro system would also give me more flexibility and 5 amps for anything I would be throwing at it. 



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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

You might be able to get the PowerCab and add the radio as a second throttle, but you will have to keep the PowerCab plugged in as it provides the track power. Will save you quite a bit.


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Well I opted for a working used wireless system off of ebay for $125.00 shipped. I figure I can not go wrong for the price for an entry level system. It is a power cab converted to wireless along with the 3 amp SB3a Smart Booster and Digitrax 3 amp power supply. Any one familiar with this system?


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Odyknuck said:


> Well I opted for a working used wireless system off of ebay for $125.00 shipped. I figure I can not go wrong for the price for an entry level system. It is a power cab converted to wireless along with the 3 amp SB3a Smart Booster and Digitrax 3 amp power supply. Any one familiar with this system?


Do you have the link to the auction you won? The pictures may help. There is an option to plug in a wireless throtal to the NCE system.


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Check what version you are getting. I just found this article on NCE's web site: https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/201621389-Step-2-Option-B-Wireless-operation


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Does the sale link allow others to access my ebay account?


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Ok, I figured out how to link the pic


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

I missed this when it was initially posted. I think you will be very happy with the wireless operations. I always found it annoying to have to unplug my cab, move to a different spot, and plug it back in. With wireless, I just follow my train... If someone gets in the way, I go around.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

At train shows with the big modular layouts and at big club installations which
are usually DCC, it's interesting to watch the members each with a wireless
hand held walking alongside their train, blowing the horn at crossings
and slowing to a stop at stations. He's actually 'being' an engineer.

Don


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Well it's gonna be awhile before I get to use it. Layout is still in design phase! 

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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Odyknuck said:


> Well it's gonna be awhile before I get to use it. Layout is still in design phase!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


You might want to just hook it to a 4 foot test track and make sure everything is OK. This will also give you a place to test any ideas for you layout in miniature per say. I had a DC layout and prior to converting it I hooked up a short test track just to verify everything I was about to do would be compatible.


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Well still need a DCC loco for testing. All I have are DC locos. Will probably convert some I have. I have around 20 to choose from .

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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Confirmed the unit functions. Now I need to install the 1.65 update I bought and start over . 

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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Convert the newest locos first. Those made in the last 15 years or
so will be fairly simple. Older locos sometimes have motors that
draw excessive amps and you need to select a decoder capable
of handling that load. Do a Stall Test on each. As long as the
current draw on the test is around .7 amp or so almost any
decoder will be OK. 

Don


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

I assume the higher current motors are open frame and not can?

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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Open frame was the case in two of mine conversions, however I don't know
about other type of motors. I replaced the motors, but a decoder
with 1.5 or 2. amp capability would have done just as well.

Don


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Odyknuck said:


> I assume the higher current motors are open frame and not can?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


This is not always the case. Some of the older can motors can draw more amps at stall than the open frame motors. I have changed the magnets to rare earth ones in old Pitman open frame motors and they will draw under 2 amps at stall and less than an amp running, same motor with the original magnets will draw to much at any time to even consider DCC for it.


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

Interesting. Where do you get the magnets from?


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Odyknuck said:


> Interesting. Where do you get the magnets from?


I found the magnets on EBay.


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## gregc (Apr 25, 2015)

MicroMark has replacement magnet, but if you know what your looking for you can find them on ebay.

I replaced magnets in the motor similar to that shown in the microMark page and had no problem using a TCS T1 rated for 1A. But i'm not convinced I needed to. I typically use an old brass engine (RDG B-8) with what I believe is a slot-car motor using the original magnets. Using the power-meter on the PowerCab, it seems to rarely draw more than 0.2 A.



The Pacific Southern Railway club had problems using wireless controllers. I develop RF firmware at work and was able to borrow a spectrum analyzer. We found that something was intermittently broadcasting on at 916 MHz that the NCE system uses for maybe 10s several minutes apart. That seemed to verify that there was a problem.

Wireless DCC systems typically operate in the Industrial, Scientific and Medical (ISM) band that can be used for many purposes. The problem is there is no guarantee that something else isn't operating on the same frequency as the DCC system. It's been reported that some alarm systems use the same frequency. Unlicensed National Information Infrastructure (U-NII) band is similar. It is also shared and used by Bluetooth and WIFI.

The way such systems work when the RF spectrum is shared is to use frequency hoping and re-transmission to handle the interference. Unfortunately, today's DCC wireless systems don't do this. This is unfortunate for the Pacific Southern which has 3 antenna and a handful of wireless cabs.


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

tkruger said:


> I found the magnets on EBay.


How well do the open frame motor locos run with new magnets. 


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

Odyknuck said:


> How well do the open frame motor locos run with new magnets.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


Notably better. I have done this in the older cast boiler Mantua steamers. The amp draw when running is well under 1 amp and the stall is around 1.5 amp. They are smooth. As far a slow speed running they are not as good as the Proto 2000 with their can motors. They are better than the Athearn Blue Box engines and most of the Riverossi steamers that I have from the same era. The top end I noticed was reduced slightly but the range that the power was supplied was even. 

Before changing the magnets the locomotive liked some speeds better than others. Now I can place it anywhere on the throtal and it goes. This part I cannot attribute to if it was the magnets or that when I made the change everything received a clean an lube.

This was my experience and it was all with Pitman motors in Mantua Steamers. Be careful as these are strong magnets. I have had them pull up metallic debris from some random spot and I find it stuck to the cab, boiler etc.


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## Odyknuck (Dec 31, 2015)

That's good. I have a few Bowsers that I am refurbishing and would prefer to not change out the motors. I have some lab hood detector magnets that I was playing with and just by sticking one to the motor along great with factory , I noticed a lower starting voltage. I also noticed a loss in top end speed as you did. 

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