# Looking for my next steamer.



## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

My best steamer right now is my Bachmann ALCO 2-6-0 with sound value decoder in it. It runs and sounds great but for my next one I'd like something a little heavier, 8 or 10 wheel drive with full sound set and smoke. I like the steamers that have a smoke stack, bigger the better. I'd appreciate any ideas and reviews from anyone one the forum that owns something similar. Tax return is coming and I need a new engine.


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## THE TYCO MAN (Aug 23, 2011)

All the new Bachmann's are great. Try the 2-10-0, it has a tall stack.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Thanks TYCO MAN. I'll take a look.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Hmm. Can't find it on Model Train Stuff.


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## GN.2-6-8-0 (Jan 10, 2013)

Try ebay.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Seems the only ones with a nice stack are the smaller engines.


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## Rusty (Jun 23, 2011)

It will show up most 2-10-0 by name "Spectrum by Bachmann "


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

The ones I see on ebay are used. I want new as I had really good luck with my other one. On the bachmann site they don't even list anything tlike I want. Something DCC ready would be okay. I don't mind doing the install if I have to but I'd rather find something ready to go with a nice sound decoder in it. BLI seems like a good one with the paragon2 decoder. I don't have any experience with it though.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Here's what I'm looking for. All the bells and whistle built in. I might just get this.







2198 ATSF 3800 Class 2-10-2, #3890, Modernized Version w/ road pilot and tender, Paragon2 Sound/DC/DCC,HO




*Differentiating a Modernized **ATSF 2-10-2:**Industry-Leading Features**:**Product Information:*


[*]Modified Cab with alternate window configuration, hand rails and walls
[*]Raised running boards
[*]Drifting valve gear
[*]LFM disc main driver
[*]Modified smoke stack/deflector
[*]Modern marker lights
[*]Modified piping & conduits
[*]Large rear headlight on tender with support platform
[*]Rear safety light on tender deck
[*]New miscellaneous details on tender

ALL-NEW Paragon2 Sound & Control System 
Synchronized PUFFING SMOKE with Chuff Sound
Variable Puffing Smoke Intensity and timing
Integral DCC Decoder with Back EMF for Industry Best Slow Speed Operation in DC and DCC 
Precision Drive Mechanism engineered for continuous heavy load towing and smooth slow speed operation 
5-Pole Can Motor with Skew Wound Armature 
Premium Caliber Painting with Authentic Paint Schemes 
Prototypical Light Operation with Golden White LED Headlight, Rear Light
Factory Installed Engineer and Fireman Figures 
Near-Brass Caliber Detail at a Plastic Price

ABS Plastic Locomotive Body with Die Cast chassis
ABS Plastic Tender body with Die Cast chassis
Metal Kadee-compatible Couplers (2)
All-Driver Drive and All-Wheel Electrical Pick-up except for pilot trucks/trailing trucks
Separately Applied Handrails, Ladders, Whistle, and Brass Bell
Operating Cab Roof Vents
Will Operate on Code 70, 83, and 100 rail
Recommended Minimum Radius: 22 inches
Accurate prototypical sounds for the ATSF Modernized 2-10-2
*Industry-Leading SOUND Features:*

*Operates in DC & DCC *(use DCMaster for DC Sound) 
*Record & Play Operation* - Records and plays back sounds and movements once or repeatedly for automatic operation 
*16-bit Sample Rate* for exceptional high frequency sound clarity 
*Playback Whistle* for multiple whistle lengths and patterns 
Choice of *3 selectable Horns*
*Alternate Whistle / Horn* where applicable for locomotive with air horn and steam whistle - both the main whistle and alternate can be easily played 
*Adjustable bell ringing interval* for faster or slower bell 
*Numerous user-mappable* functions with available keys 
*Johnson Bar Sound* at Direction Change
*Passenger Station Ambient Sounds *- Controlled with Function Key 
*Freight Yard Ambient Sounds* - Controlled with Function Key 
*Lumber Yard Ambient Sounds *- Controlled with Function Key 
*Farm Ambient Sounds* - Controlled with Function Key 
*Crew Radio Communications* - Controlled with Function Key 
*Maintenance Yard Ambient Sounds* - Controlled with Function Key 
*Demo Mode* for display and demonstrations 
*Grade Crossing Automatic Signal*
*Simple Programming* with Integral DCC Decoder 
*Automatic Forward / Reverse Signal *- When activated, stopping triggers and stop whistle toot. When moving forward from a stopped position, toots twice. When moving in reverse. toots three times. 
*Chuff sound intensity varies with load*
*Individually adjustable sound volumes* for each effect 
*EZ Reset Button* for quick return to factory default settings


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## Rusty (Jun 23, 2011)

There is steam locomotives on walthers website but they are back orders.

http://www.walthers.com/exec/search...ale=H&instock=Q&keywords=DCC Sound&start=1200


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Stuff on back order would not interest me but thanks for you're input. I wonder if I'll be able to get those anywhere if Walthers can't get them.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

GN.2-6-8-0 said:


> Try ebay.


Found plenty on Ebay. Someone must have bought them all and put them on Ebay.:laugh:


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## ZebraCakez (Mar 26, 2011)

Hutch, you were able to find the Paragon2 ATSF 2-10-2 on ebay?

All the info I can find has it listed as a pre-order item with a still undetermined release date.


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## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

Hutch, I have the BLI PRR K4s with the Paragon2. It's awesome! And, it can be programmed using a Diigitrax controller with out the need for a programming booster.

I ordered through modeltrainstuff.com


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

No but I found Broadway Limited 2221 PRR J1 2-10-4, #6173, Paragon2 Sound/DC/DCC, HO and a few others.
This BROADWAY LIMITED 2221 HO PRR J1 2-10-4 #6173 Paragon2 Sound/DC/DCC SMOKE



ZebraCakez said:


> Hutch, you were able to find the Paragon2 ATSF 2-10-2 on ebay?
> 
> All the info I can find has it listed as a pre-order item with a still undetermined release date.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Just watched a video of that one. Awesome!


rrgrassi said:


> Hutch, I have the BLI PRR K4s with the Paragon2. It's awesome! And, it can be programmed using a Diigitrax controller with out the need for a programming booster.
> 
> I ordered through modeltrainstuff.com


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## Flynn_lives (Jul 6, 2013)

I am partial to my MTH 4-8-4 J-class. But.... 


After the trade show I went to, a few stood out since I saw them actually running. MTH and Broadway Limited get my votes because they have smoke units installed and have synchronized chuffing smoke. Protosound 3.0 on MTH sounds really good as well as BLI's Paragon2 sound. 

MTH 
*H-8 class 2-6-6-6
*2-8-8-8-2 Triplex

Broadway Limited
* ATSF 2-10-2 
* Brass Hybrid Series UP 4-12-2
* J3a 4-6-4 Hudson(a little better detailed than the current MTH offering)


If you want a Challenger or Big Boy I'd go with the MTH models instead of Athearn(due to the protosmoke system).


EDIT: Pics of my MTH 4-8-4 J Class(previously posted on reddit.com)
http://imgur.com/a/BnVwF


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I really like the MTH offerings but they're a little to pricey for me. I'm OK with plastic boilers. I'm pretty sure it's going to be BLI. Maybe  This one unlettered. Or this . Quite a price difference.

I need to save some for Tortoises. I need at least 10 of those and my LHS can't get them right now. What's up with that?


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I think this is the one. I'm a long way from Ohio but I like the sound of Chesapeak & Ohio. This thing is gorgeous. Come on tax return.


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## Gansett (Apr 8, 2011)

What is this tax return of which you speak?hwell:


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I let the gummint take out extree taxes every year so I can get some to play with at tax time. I don't get bonuses or any other gratuity from my company so this almost feels like one.:laugh:


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## morrjr (Dec 20, 2012)

Hutch said:


> I think this is the one. I'm a long way from Ohio but I like the sound of Chesapeak & Ohio. This thing is gorgeous. Come on tax return.
> View attachment 34014


This loco has caught my eye as well: I model both C&O and B&O, and this loco is just the thing to round out my small C&O steam collection.


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## SRV1 (Nov 14, 2010)

Lucky you. Mines going towards a new roof on my house. This year sucks.

I have a IHC 2-10-2 off ebay that I put sound in and am in the process of modifying right now. I love the thing, but takes alot of modding to look anywhere near the prototype. It runs great. You can add smoke to anything.

Sent from my SCH-R950 using Tapatalk 2


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Where can I get a smoke thingy to put in my 2-8-0?


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## rrgrassi (May 3, 2012)

Sleuth make a smoke unit, but IDK if they are DCC friendly.


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## jjb727 (Apr 13, 2012)

They dont have many of those yet. I think they should definitely re-release their 4-8-4's under the sound value line.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

SRV1 said:


> You can add smoke to anything.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-R950 using Tapatalk 2


I suppose that depends on where you want the smoke to come out. My loco has a screw in the bottom of the stack.


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## SRV1 (Nov 14, 2010)

Hutch said:


> I suppose that depends on where you want the smoke to come out. My loco has a screw in the bottom of the stack.


 I havent looked into them really. Just saw you could hook aftermarket units up to some sound decoders.

Sent from my SCH-R950 using Tapatalk 2


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

This is what happens when I have time to think. I've changed my mind about purchasing a new loco and decided I need better train and layout control. So here's the new plan.
I love the way the Mini Panel and Switch8s work together for easy switch and routing and the possibility of some automation. I could use that in my amusement park section where there will be a train ride constantly going round the park and stopping at the station.

Device	Qty	Price Each	Total
Switch-8	2	$48.00	$96.00
NCE-USB*	1	$50.00	$50.00
12 Pack Tortoise	1	$180.00	$180.00
Mini-Panel	1	$40.00	$40.00
5 pack track	3	$25.00	$75.00
SDH166D	2	$55.00	$110.00

Final Total	$551.00
Maybe a new loco next year.


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## Gansett (Apr 8, 2011)

Steamers? You said steamers? What time, I'll be over.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Does'nt look like I have enough to share.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Well, I pulled the trigger on this one.  Finally some smoke and some seriously cool sounds.



hutch said:


> i think this is the one. I'm a long way from ohio but i like the sound of chesapeak & ohio. This thing is gorgeous. Come on tax return.
> quote]


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

Tax Return??? What is that?


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I've gotten one for every year I've worked so far. That's about 44 years worth. I go out of my way to make sure I get one.


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## rhfil (Feb 3, 2014)

What is the tightest curve that thing will go around?


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

22" I think I have 24 or better but I do have #4 turnout that is questionable. I don't have to drive this train over that if I don't want so it's OK.


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## morrjr (Dec 20, 2012)

I'm considering buying one of these myself - please let me know how it works on 24" radius curves.


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## ftauss (Sep 18, 2012)

http://mthtrains.com/content/80-3249-1

Their "O" stuff is awesome. Proto 3.0 Rocks!


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

morrjr said:


> I'm considering buying one of these myself - please let me know how it works on 24" radius curves.


Looks like I better recheck my curves. Though I had a plan for 30"R on my outside track, it's possible that I didn't take enough care in following my plan. I ran the train for the first time yesterday. Two things happened. First it came to an Atlas #6 turnout and the front wheels popped off and the train stopped. I got it going again and when it got to one of these "30" " curves, it slammed to a stop and nothing I did would bring it back. I could get it to move with some help but it would clunk at regular intervals indicating maybe a broken tooth on the drive gear. I'm sending it back for repair. While it's gone I'm going to triple check all my curves. I really loved this engine as I fooled with the sounds and motion on a 3' test track before bringing it out to my layout. 

This is not the first time I've had troubles with steamers and I'm growing a little tired of the fussiness. I may switch to diesels.


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## morrjr (Dec 20, 2012)

Sorry to hear about your experience with the 2-10-4. I own a Broadway Limited 4-6-2 USRA Light Pacific, and it has been great. I also own six Bachmann steamers - two regular locos with Tsunami sound added, and four Spectrum locos that came factory equipped with Tsunami sound. The Bachmann steamers are all smooth runners with great sound and detail. 

Good luck on getting your loco running right.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

My Bachmann 2-6-0 with Soundvalue decoder runs great also. I did have a problem with it when I first got it a year ago. The coupling post hit something on my layout and broke. I got the engine replaced and fixed the track problem and no more issues with that one. These things hate anything less that perfect track work. A little bump on a turnout at speed and it's likely the front truck will pop off. Diesels do not have these issues. But I don't like diesels.


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## rhfil (Feb 3, 2014)

After receiving my MTH Light Mikado I jammed it up and it quit running. Fortunately their service walked me through a resetting and that fixed it. So now I run every diesel through my layout in every possible direction looking for any slight problems and then run the Mikado through very slowly again in every possible direction before running it at normal speed. Have not crunched it again.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I wish a reset fixed mine. I tried that and everything else. When I spoke to the technician, he said I had tried everything he would have. Send it back. Not what I wanted to hear. I could probably take it apart and fix it myself faster than the 6 to 8 weeks they told me to expect. 2 years down the road when the warranty is up, that's what I'll do if it breaks again.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I made some radius templates on the bandsaw and checked the layout in the spot where it died. It's a 28" radius but there was a little kink at a joint. I usually solder the joints on curves before bending them but I didn't on this one. Go figure. It and all other curves will be perfect before the train comes back.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

BTW, I found out that smoke left my room real stinky in just the short time I had it running. Ventilation is a must.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I did a lot of track repair over the weekend. Got the north end really smooth using my templates. 28" and 30". I've got to make some route changes on the south end to have the same minimum curves. I still plan on a 24" reverse loop and hopefully the train will work on it, at least at slow speed.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Well, 24" reverse loop went out the window. I decided I needed a little more space so I went with the minimum requirement of 22" for the loop. I have large easements going in and out so I'll be curious to see how this 2-10-4 runs on it when I get it back.

I may never buy another BLI loco after this. I won't get it back for 6 to 7 weeks because they're so busy repairing other broken trains. What does that say about their quality?

What mfg. should I start looking at if I want better quality?



Hutch said:


> I did a lot of track repair over the weekend. Got the north end really smooth using my templates. 28" and 30". I've got to make some route changes on the south end to have the same minimum curves. I still plan on a 24" reverse loop and hopefully the train will work on it, at least at slow speed.


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

The super pretzel is a tight layout with 18" main and 15" turnouts. Has 2 30 degree crossings. My 060 has very hard time on crossings. The coal tender derails all the time over the crossings. My little 040 and EMD800 run quite well.

Now having trouble with programming my NCE, seems I get "cannot read CV", called support but have heard nothing.

DT


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I'm sure you had no intentions of running any larger trains on that. Maybe you're coal tender needs some weight or different wheels with smaller flanges.

A little more info would be nice on the NCE problem.

I'm not sure what any of this has to do with my thread, not that I care.


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## mopac (Feb 24, 2011)

I don't know what is going to be better quality than BLI. I was in the same boat as you just a few months ago. I bought a BLI N&W Y6B and right out of the box it was giving me fits. I was not happy with BLI at that moment. It would run maybe 6 to 8 inches and stop but the chugging and sounds continued. The smoke poured out from under the sides
not through the stack. I called BLI and it was decided it needed to be sent in for service.
6 to 8 weeks (and it took that or maybe a little more) does suck. So $15 to ship and 8 or 9 weeks later I found out it was an owner/operator problem. I was the goof not BLI. I had not seated the plug all the way in. It has worked fine since. I have 1 BLI steamer and 1 BLI diesel. I don't think I would trade either for another brand. Things do happen though. Take the most reliable auto company out there and they still have service centers.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

This was caused by a little derail on a switch followed by stopping in a curve. If they can't handle that, I need to find some different trains. I can take the blame for not having super perfect tracks, but this was a very mild incident which any one of my other trains could handle and come back running. I _hope_ they tell me it was a mfg defect. At least then I won't worry about running it and I may buy more from them.


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*Large Steamers*

Hey banjo picker, model train guy. Do you have a recommendation of steam engines, they sure sound problematic?
Regards,
tr1


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

:laugh: When I started out I was told by the guy that runs the LHS to stay clear of them. They're nothing but trouble. I disregarded this and went went about buying nothing but steam engines. Turns out he was right. Do I want to switch to diesels? Not yet:laugh: 

Most of my problems have been due to poor track work so my suggestion for buying steamers is, get what you want but make sure your track has minimum or better radius for the trains you buy. Make sure there are no clippings lying in the tracks when you run them. The engine can pick these up and cause a short that's hard to find. finally, don't expect to run fast over turnouts unless you've done the work to make them ultra smooth.

I believe any train should be able to survive these issues. The truth is, they can't.
Good luck finding a higher quality steam engine.


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

Very we'll put, I did not study enough. Bought some track and built some bench work in lieu of thought process.. Last week came close to starting over, but decided to fix the bumps and gaps. It is not the steamers, it is the track and operator.

Last night I removed the front wheels and it makes the turnouts on curves but still stops on the 30 degreecrossings. Love the steam and wil keep it. Going to "Plan an addition" and run the steamer on that portion?

Really appreciate the input

DT


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

They're shipping back to me tomorrow. I can't wait. I'm going to be really careful with it.


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## rhfil (Feb 3, 2014)

Has anyone tried the European steamers with the high wheels? I am wondering if they are a bit more forgiving with switches?


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## txdyna65 (Aug 17, 2012)

Hutch, I have a BLI 2-10-4 and I love it, its probably my best running steamer. My curves are 24" and I have 2 reverse loops at 22" it runs over all them fine. I dont have any #4 turnouts on the mainlines, just in the yard, but it has handled these fine at slow speeds. My first steamer was a 2-8-2 and it showed me where all my flawed trackwork was, after I got all that worked out I havent had problems with my steamers.

Took me a bit to read your thread, look forward to hearing how it does whe you get it back  Pics on your layout would be nice. hint hint lol


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Thanks Kenny. That's encouraging and I needed to hear it.

My layout is still pink and blue foam and I still have 7 tortoises to install. Shelf layouts are difficult to photograph also. Best I can do is sections.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Got my new BLI C&O 2-10-4 back and I'm loving it but it's very susceptible to any little bumps in the track. I can see I still need to do some work on my gate and some of the turnouts. I hate Atlas turnouts and gates. How can I fix these turnouts to smooth them out. I adjusted the gate and it's smoother now but I might just put in some rail joiners and duck under to enter the room.


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

My latest addition, used Peco insulfrog. Better than Atlas but requires more wiring. 

DT


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I'm considering building my own. It sounds like fun and I hear nothing but wonderful things about Fast track products.


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

Dirtytom said:


> My latest addition, used Peco insulfrog. Better than Atlas but requires more wiring.
> 
> DT


Better in what way? If it's an insulfrog, I don't understand why there's more wiring.


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

They have a positive switch system. The Atlas is loose vs Pe o that snaps in place. It's pouring down rain on the bayou, but later today will scan the wiring diagram and post. You will be able to see what it requires.

DT


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

OK, I use Tortoise machines so they're never loose. I don't think that's my problem. They seem fairly smooth at slow speed but higher speeds bump the front truck right off the track. This makes it hard to fix the problem. What I haven't done yet is to just run a truck over it with my finger to locate the problem. This should be another thread so I'm going to start a new called How to fix Atlas turnouts.


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

*PECO Turnouts*

Hutch, here is the wiring for PECO turnout(switch) hope you can see it. I use DCC so lots of wiring?


DT


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*BIG STEAM OOOOOo\*

ATSF,up above,very nice bigger steam engine. Is it engineered to handle slightly tighter
radius curves? Regards,
tr1


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

What is this ATSF you speak of?



tr1 said:


> ATSF,up above,very nice bigger steam engine. Is it engineered to handle slightly tighter
> radius curves? Regards,
> tr1


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## Hutch (Dec 19, 2012)

I have some more information you folks may be interested in. BLI Proto Sound blows my Soundtraxx decoder sound out of the water. I believe there may be 2 speakers in this thing helping the sound. It's very loud and has lot's of bass and just makes everything else I have sound like a toy. The chuff sound starts out very loud and then quiets down as the engine gets up to speed. In spite of the initial problem I had, these engines are tops on my list for any future purchases.


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## mopac (Feb 24, 2011)

I agree, BLI is at the top for sound and operation. Their slow speed running is un- believable. I like the sync smoke puffing also. I have over 130 engines (some are dummies) but only 2 BLI engines, one steam (N&W Y-6-B and one diesel (SD40-2).
It took me awhile to spend what they cost but they are worth it. It will be hard for
me to buy anything else in the future. Next on the list will be a BLI N&W class A #1218.
I like big steam. I got 2 Rivarossi BigBoys and a couple Bachmann Spectrum articulated steams. BLI are the top.


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## Dirtytom (Jan 13, 2014)

Monaco, how about pictures.

DT


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