# New to DCC



## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

I am a member of our local MRR club and we have two different N scale layouts we want to go DCC. The first is a 4x8 double track with 3 switches off the mainline. The second layout is a 8x24 three-line modular layout with a 8 track yard - 3 main lines. So...

1. We leaning toward Digitrax due to our LHS recommendation...
2. We want cordless throttles...
3. We have a total of 23 DCC or DCC available power units...
4. We want the ability to move from one layout to the other with the same throttle - if possible...
5. Each member of out N scale group (5-6) will be responsible for buying his/her own throttle.

Looking for suggestions on vendor and model and any potential problems anyone sees...

Thanks in advance


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Dave

Digitrax is one of the most popular DCC systems.

Were you planning to have a controller for each layout,
on simply connect the tracks of both layouts to the
same controller?

You would need to make certain that each loco's DCC 'address' 
is unique. That way, no matter whether you are connecting
the layouts together or powering them separately, your hand held
wireless controllers would be able to run locos on either layout
assuming the wireless frequency is the same.

Don


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## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

Don...thanks for the reply. To answer your questions...we would NOT be running the layouts together. They would be completely seperate tables. We would possibly be running them at the same time. My question back to you is...can we "load" all 37+ addresses in each throttle with out messing up either layout??


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

You program the loco decoders not the Throttle, so you could
presumably have as many locos as you want.

You could power both layouts with the same Digitrax main
controller and receiver, the controller would think the 'other' layout
was just another isolated track section. It is not
necessary that the layout tracks connect. The only actual
connection between the 2 layouts is the power buss.
Doing that would
make your club operations easier since all you would need do
is punch up whatever loco you want to run on whichever
layout it is on and it will go. No switching or other fiddling
around needed. Only one controller and one receiver to buy.


But, if you power each layout with it's own Digitrax controller
and receiver the cost would double. If the 2 receivers were
on the same frequency you would still have the same flexibility
as you would if the 2 layouts were powered by the same
controller.

One point favoring separately powered layouts. You could
take one to a show or some such with it's own power, while
the other would continue operation where it is.

Don


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

Throttle addresses are stored in the command station. You can do this 2 different ways. 1 command station for both layouts with the rail power and (optional)loconet, hard wired, connecting them or 2 separate command stations completely isolated from each other. If the latter is chosen, the radio channels will have to be different which is user configurable with Digitrax. The low end Zephyr will not be suitable for either of your needs. You would probably want the SuperChief with an additional booster or very large bus wires to connect them or 2 SuperChiefs if separate. If you go the separate route , you will have to sync the throttle with the layout each time it is moved to the other layout.


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## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

Thanks again Don...NOW, if Digitrax is the way we go, which starter system do you suggest. We already have two Zephyr systems owned personally which could, in a pinch help out. How big amp., volt, wise should we look at??


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

The Zephyr's address capabilities and amperage output are the limiting factors in your requirements.


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## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

Jerry...thanks for the info. Regarding the Zephyr...that is my personal DCC unit. we are looking - as a club - for something upgraded. we have a $500 budget for command station and wireless throttles....


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

The Zephyr and Empire Builder are both limited to 20 loco addresses. Well under the 37 you stated. The SuperChief can handle 120 addresses. With the 2 Zephyrs, you might be able to handle 10+ locos on each layout as separate entries. If the locos are modern, non sound equipped and the track and wiring is excellent, the new Zephyrs might run 10-12 locos at one time on each layout. You would have to release and add the locos as they are put on the other layout. As far as the radio throttles, each layout would need a UR92 panel setup as different groups and channels. The duplex throttles would plug in the panel to re-sync it to the layout. A SuperChief is out of your budget. Using both DCS51s and adding 2 UR92s is the most likely solution with your budget even though it would require diligent setup and usage. A UR92 is around $130 and UT4D is around $110 so the 2 radio panels and 2 radio throttles is already at $480 utilizing the 2 existing Zephyrs.


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

The least hassle to set up and use solution, would be a SuperChief SCFXD8 $550, power supply PS2012 $145, booster DB200+ $160 for a total of around $900. The layouts would be hard wired together with a loconet cable (flat 6 conductor cable) and a power cable (12VDC 2-10 ga wires)from the power supply. You would get 1 DT402D throttle with the SuperChief. Additional UT4D throttles can be added as needed. This configuration will allow lots of locos, throttles, and simplicity of use moving locos and throttles from one layout to the other without thinking about it.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Jerry

This is a different and interestingly challenging proposition that
I haven't seen discussed here on the Forum, at least in recent
times.

Don't you think that the wired connection between the two
layouts is better than two complete wireless controller systems for
what they want to do. The way I understand it, they want
to be able to have 'Joe' use his wireless controller on layout
A, perhaps running loco 1, then walk over to layout B where
he would run loco 2 and without the need to do any
special controller fiddling other then the normal loco
address. In fact, Joe could, with his wireless
controller, be running loco 1 on layout A and loco 2 on
layout B at the same time, could he not?

They would want to treat each layout as a separate power
district so that a derail on A does not affect operations on B.

Don



Don


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## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

Jerry - Don...you guys are raising questions/ideas that I have never considered. Being fairly new to DCC these are great comments and will allow us (club members) to branch out in the use of DCC beyond our original thoughts. Thanks a bunch...and keep the comments coming...


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

Given the needs expressed, a single DCS with one radio interface is the best approach with regards to ease of use. The problem is the budget precludes that. They have stated a capacity of 37 addresses. If this was dramatically reduced, then they could use the 2 Zephyrs and 1 radio panel. One Zephyr would be the command station on one layout and the other would be a booster on the second. The 2 layouts would only have to have a loconet cable connecting them. They would then be limited to a total of 20 addresses for both layouts. They might be able to run as many as 6 locos at the same time on each layout depending on the track power draw. Given they only have 6 members, that may work. They just have to decide to lower the capacity or increase the budget.


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

One thing that you would have to verify with Digitrax is if a UR92 is good with a Zephyr if you went with that as a command station. I believe the UR91 is. A 91 is limited to 10 radio throttles whereas a 92 can accommodate 20. They cost almost the same. If they use a separate command station for each layout, I think 2 UR92s will work. There would be no interconnection at all between the 2 layouts.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Dave

You see the limit to the number of locos that the controllers
have.

Questions for the club to consider:

How many locos are actually on the tracks of EACH layout
at any one time?

Where are those not on the tracks?

How is it decided what locos are to be run in any
operating session?

Are any of the locos paired (or more) in a consist?
(I'm thinking these would have the same 'address') 

Would there be objection for the need to 'program'
the presence in the controller when a loco
that is not on either layout is to be place on it and
at the same time have one that has been running
removed from the controller so as to stay with
limits of the controller?

Jerry

Do you think of any other questions the answers
to which would be helpful in the recommendations?

Don


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## JerryH (Nov 18, 2012)

We probably need to know the physical relationship of the 2 layouts. Distance apart and if there are any barriers to connecting wires between them.


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## daveh219 (Sep 16, 2012)

OK...to answer your questions - 1. Big layout could handle up to 10 locos at one time, not all running - some sitting in the staging yard. Small layout only 3 max. 2. Others are stored in individual containers. 3. decision is up to the operators. They will probably run their own locos. 4. Consists are possible but limited to probably 4 consists. 5. Switching locos is a possibility and that is why we wondered about "storing" all 37 addresses in each throttle...

I have instructed the others in the club to access this thread to follow our conversations...so don't be surprised to see others post.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

And a welcome to the other club members. The more
cooks in the kitchen here makes a better pie.

What you report certainly makes what you want a lot more doable.
The fact that less than 20 locos will be on the tracks
at the same time fits within the system limitations.

I'm anxious to hear from Jerry and see his recommendations
for the specific Digitrax gear and how to set it up.

Don


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