# First HO Layout



## patrick.b

Hello,

As some of you have probably seen, I have been asking some questions in other parts of this website regarding layout design and planning. I think I have finally come up with a solid plan and I am going to try and start construction on the table this weekend.

My layout will be a 5x9 ft. HO layout set sometime between 1950 and 1955 (I enjoy steam and early diesels). I really enjoy switching, so that is a major focus of my layout. After some feedback from some members here, I upped my minimum radius from 18 in. to 22 inches.

Please feel free to give me feedback as I go through this process. This will be the first true model railroad I have ever built, which is part of the reason I am starting with a 5x9. As you can see in the picture below, the room I have available will support a much larger layout, but I want to start with this initially to see how committed I am.

A few other notes I have already decided, I am planning to use the NCE PowerCab with one additional Cab that can be unplugged and moved around the layout. I plan to make the layout as "scale" as possible while still making it usable. I am planning on using atlas switches with atlas flextrack to construct everything to allow for smoother transitions into and out of curves.

I don't have any equipment for HO yet, but I am very interested in the Bowser PRR RS-3 and the Broadway Limited PRR H10.

There is a train shown in mid-April near me, so I might be able to get some deals of things I will be needing.

Here is my room:










Here is a close up of the layout plan:










Here is a drawing of the framing for my top deck, the primary framing will be 1x4 lumber while the supports will be 2x4s:










This is the framing for a shelf (just storage, no railroad):










This is a side view of the table without any plywood shown. I plan to use 1/2 in. plywood with 2 in. of extruded foam on top to allow for easy terrain modifications.










Like I said before, please feel free to comment or provide feedback, especially if you see me making a mistake that could be avoided!


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## prrfan

Patrick: I will leave the layout critique etc. for the more technically advanced members to comment on. Just a word about making mistakes. You will make them. No amount of research, planning or advice is going to prevent them. It’s how we learn, and it’s a steep curve in this hobby. 
You seem very organized and capable and it looks like you have done a good job of thinking things out. Do you have all the bases covered? Probably not. Which ones aren’t? You will find that out when you start building! It’s a process we all go through. You have a great resource here at the Forum, but the adage “Experience is the Best Teacher” holds true for as long as we live. So jump in and keep us posted. Good luck. 
Dan


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## MikeL

Very nice - lots of yard and sidings.

At 5', will you be able to easily reach everything? I kept it to a maximum of 2'

Mike


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## Cycleops

Looking good Patrick. You’ve got plenty of scope for scenery and industry plus you’ll have the opportunity to do a lot of switching which should make operating very enjoyable and absorbing.

Good choice of the PowerCab too, it’s an excellent system particularly if you’re starting out, initially programming a loco is very simple as it relies mainly on answering questions rather than having to input numbers. I used to have one until it got destroyed by a household wiring fault but I do miss it.

You get one power panel in the kit so you’ll just need to add one other to the other side so you can move your controller From side to side.

As prrfan says you might want to change aspects of ithe plan as you go and you discover things don’t quite work the way you expected but that always happens. Before you start laying track you might want to put down paper templates of the turnouts so you can spot anything that might need changing. Peco offer these which are downloadable: https://www.peco-uk.com/page.asp?id=pointplans
I’d recommend using their track and turnouts as they are very dependable and have been proven over a number of years. They offer a code83 line which is US Railroad specific with turnouts in insulated or live fog versions, you’ll get into the question of which later but for most situations insulated is easiest

Have fun.


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## patrick.b

Thanks everyone!

prrfan:

The advantage I have is that while I personally have never built a model railroad, my dad has a large double deck scale S layout. So I already have a major resource many others did not for their first layout.

MikeL:

I don't think reaching 2.5' will be difficult, especially since most of the switching is not at that furthest edge. If it is a problem, I can always lower the railroad by cutting the legs after the fact to allow for more reach.

Cycleops:

I am hoping the use of flextrack will help eliminate any minor errors in track laying versus what was planned on the software. I plan to purchase most, if not all of the track at one time, and start laying track from the yard where I will have carefully measured the exact placement of the switches. I suppose only time will tell if this is a good strategy or not.


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## Cycleops

Ok, I can see you’re using sectional track for the planning. Which make is it? If you’re using a make that also offer flex track you’ll be fine but if you change the brand of turnouts they probably won’t match the geometry of the one you used to plan the layout so adjustments will have to made. I’m sure your dad will help you out.


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## patrick.b

I used Atlas code 83 sectional track with atlast code 83 #4 switches for the layout. I like to use the sectional track because it is way easier in the program than using flextrack. It also helps ensure I keep consistent curve radius and I don't try and sneak in a tighter curve. However in actual construction the flextrack will provide a better result I think, especially if something is slightly off from the drawing.


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## DonR

If I read your benchwork plan correctly you plan to use
4 2X4s as supports, these attached to frame cross members.

I would recommend, instead, L legs made from two
1X4s screwed together. These then would be bolted in frame corners, a bolt or two in each side
of the leg. This will provide much more stable support.

Don


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## 89Suburban

I like that track plan.


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## patrick.b

DonR said:


> If I read your benchwork plan correctly you plan to use
> 4 2X4s as supports, these attached to frame cross members.
> 
> I would recommend, instead, L legs made from two
> 1X4s screwed together. These then would be bolted in frame corners, a bolt or two in each side
> of the leg. This will provide much more stable support.
> 
> Don


Don, my original design actually had 2x4s in an L shape at the edges, but then I realized it would be best to inset them a bit to reduce the maximum span (thereby increasing strength near the center) and they will also be out of the way so your feet don't run into them.

Also, because the legs are braced at the bottom by the shelf supports, that effectively eliminates the need for the L shape since the braces will support the legs in their weak axis.

However, if for some reason the table feels wobbly or unstable once it is built, another 2x4 could be easily added to each support.


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## patrick.b

Whelp, 7 hours of work later I have a finished table.

The open room after taking some of the wood down:




























The frame for the table is completed:










Table frame is completed (built upside down):










Table is flipped right side up and plywood attached:










Finally, the 2 in. of foam is glued to the top:


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## deedub35

Looks very robust. A good start to the layout.


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## 89Suburban

Nice work there.


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## patrick.b

Not an update on my layout specifically, but while I wait for the train show, I decided I am going to need a nice workbench for my basement to work on models. This is my design:


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## deedub35

Do it. Having a separate place to work that is close by is great.


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## patrick.b

Well, not train related, but the work bench is coming along. Still need to add the upper shelf.



















Added a hardboard surface to make working on it a little better:


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## flyboy2610

A good workbench is a very nice thing to have! You might consider adding some shelves underneath. On my bench, I made two 'L's from 2x4's, with a short diagonal brace between the two legs, inverted them, and fastened them to the back of the bench 48" apart. I installed a 48" 2x4 between the short legs, and mounted a 48" dual light shop light to it. I fastened peg board to the front of the long legs, giving me lots of storage. I have good light, and my tools are always handy. 
The bench itself is a kit from Menard's.
Here's a pic showing the completed benchYou can just see the diagonal braces at the top)


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## patrick.b

flyboy2610, thanks for the ideas. My workbench in the garage has a pegboard backing which I opted not to do for this one. If however I feel like I want it later down the road, it will be an easy addition.

I also agree that shelf space underneath the bench may be warranted at some point, but I didn't want to overthink this to much. Figured I would build a basic bench and add to it as needed.

Anyway, I have officially completed the bench:


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## flyboy2610

Nice! You'll love having that overhead light!


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## patrick.b

Got two coats of brown paint on the foam to provide a base and also seal the foam so that I don't risk melting it with a solvent based product (although I will probably still try an avoid those)


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## patrick.b

Well, today was the train show and I came home with the one thing I thought for sure I wouldn't find... I now have a steam engine with no track to run it on!

I was also able to pick up the NCE Prower Cab and some Shinohara code 83 switches (four of each right and left hand). No one had any Shinohara flextrack, so I will just need to buy that online.

Even without any real track down, I still wanted to see my locomotive out of the box. I also bought a gon:










Once I actually had something on the table, I realize the recessed lighting in the room just wasn't going to cut it. So I decided to convert the recessed lights into surface mount spotlights:


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## patrick.b

Whelp, got almost all of the track I need, only need a 30° crossover which should be back in-stock next week.

I really wanted to hear and run my new (and first) locomotive, so I rigged up a quick section of DCC track and it worked great.










Also started laying out the first track that will be laid. However, my tools have not come in yet so I really can't start working on anything just yet.


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## MichaelE

You won't be using roadbed?


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## patrick.b

MichaelE said:


> You won't be using roadbed?


No, I am modeling a branch line in an industrial area, so I feel that roadbed would make it looks too much like a mainline.


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## MichaelE

That's understandable. Good luck with your switching railroad.


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## jackpresley

Really top-notch work. Very jealous of your space. Very neat and roomy. The workbench with overhead lighting and plenty of power outlets is going to be super nice.

Those coats of paint on the foam make it almost look like a laminate top. Was there anything special about the paint, and is it really durable? I've never worked with anything other than wood surfaces.


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## 89Suburban

Looks good.


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## patrick.b

jackpresley said:


> Really top-notch work. Very jealous of your space. Very neat and roomy. The workbench with overhead lighting and plenty of power outlets is going to be super nice.
> 
> Those coats of paint on the foam make it almost look like a laminate top. Was there anything special about the paint, and is it really durable? I've never worked with anything other than wood surfaces.


Nothing special about the paint, just regular interior house paint with a flat finish. I wouldn't say it is durable, the foam dents if you put much weight on it, but it is plenty strong for models and such.


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## patrick.b

Trying to take things slow so that I don't mess anything up by trying to work on something else when the glue hasn't dried. But progress has been made!

Main yard ladder being glued down:










Gluing down the first curve and also a few more switches:










Getting the first ground throws installed:










Essentially my goal at this point is to get the mainline installed, wired up and fully functioning before adding on any of the sidings or yard tracks. This way I can troubleshoot any issues as I go.


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## MichaelE

Thanks for sharing your progress. Looking good. I think threads like this help motivate those sitting on the fence, or maybe feeling overwhelmed by the whole building process and just don't know where to begin.

Good job.


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## patrick.b

Made a lot of progress today and a milestone. The mainline track is complete.




























Had to work out how best to get power to the layout and give it a clean look, fairly happy with the results:



















Finally, got the main bus wires cut to length and partially hung. Also got them connected to the NCE panel and installed one set of feeder wires:










Got to run my single locomotive and car around the track for the first time with no issues. Not a single hiccup or short, so all of my solder joints must be good considering this was all being fed from one set of feeder wires.


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## WIrailfan

Looking good so far!! Your benchwork is outstanding. I really wish I'd have painted my foam before I started with my trackwork...that looks good. May have affected my roadbeds bond with the foam though. Looking forward to seeing your progress :thumbsup:

Dan


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## 89Suburban

Looks really nice good job. 🙂


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## jackpresley

Nice! Congrats on the first successful op -- sure many hours more will follow.


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## patrick.b

Thanks for all the compliments, I am happy with the progress and that I haven't run into any problems *yet*.


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## patrick.b

It has been a little while since I last posted an update. Not a lot has happened but here is the progress.

Got the rest of the bus wire and main feeder wires installed and mounted:



















I also realized that to ensure proper placement of sidings, I was going to need the exact footprint of the buildings. So I went ahead and ordered all of the industries I will need:










Finally, I finished laying the three yard tracks, the smallest of which will likely be used for cabooses:


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## patrick.b

Wow, it has almost been a full year since I made any progress on the layout. Part of the reason was waiting for a Walthers code 83 crossing that I realized may never come. I decided to just get an Atlas code 83 crossing and live with it.

With that in mind, I have laid the most complex part of the layout:



















I also picked up a new locomotive while it was still available, a Bowser VO-1000, along with two cabooses and a tank car:


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## PoppetFlatsRR

I really wished I had done the rails that way. Way more work than the snap together stuff I use, but yours looks so real. Thank you for sharing.


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## Magic

That's going to be some interesting track work.
Some strange hand rails on that PRR caboose.

Magic


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## patrick.b

Magic said:


> That's going to be some interesting track work.
> Some strange hand rails on that PRR caboose.
> 
> Magic


The "hand rails" are actually the train phone antenna. You see similar things on some PRR diesels.


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## 89Suburban

Thanks for the update and pics, nice track work there.


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## patrick.b

Got the first of the industries set and track laid. I am very glad I purchased the models to help with exact placement:










The building base on the upper right of the above picture is going to be a power plant. The kit came with a coal dump area, so I needed to assemble this to complete the yard track. Here it is mostly assembled and painted:










Carving out the space for the dump:










Test fit:










Final fit and placement:










I realized I wanted to make some changes to my original track plan. Here is an updated plan that shows most of the changes. Of note, I made the industry spur closest to the yard straight instead of curved. This allows me a more realistic layout and the addition of another building. I also added another siding near the orange building. Finally, I have redesigned the interchange track in the lower right. To make it seem more realistic, the track has been extended to the other end of the layout as an abandoned mainline. So it gives me another runaround track and yard space. 










In order to get the placement correct, I needed to get the road marked and work on the industry at the other side of the layout. Things are a tight fit and I want to be sure I don't mess up and run out of space for something. I have made the road wide enough for two 10 ft. lanes with two 5 ft. sidewalks. I am not sure on the exact size of lanes or sidewalks yet, but wanted to give myself plenty of room depending on what I decide.


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## Magic

Good progress, looking very nice.
The coal dump looks great.

Magic


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## PoppetFlatsRR

What are all those straigth lines for, You mean you're supposed to have plan, my track just moves around until it is happy. 

Looking good sir, have fun, the trains will be flying around the track soon.


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## Stumpy

Magic said:


> The coal dump looks great.


Grate, even. 

Looking good, Patrick.


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## Andreash

Well done, looking forward to your continued progress, cheers


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## patrick.b

Made some more progress!

Got the last three sidings set on the far side of the layout. This is the closest siding to the camera, the siding with the box car on it and the one leading up to the building.










Got the S-curves installed for the industry. Got one last siding to lay which will go in between the two buildings.










Got the switch ladder set for the engine servicing area. This was a little complex to get the track exactly where I wanted it to ensure there is the correct spacing between tracks depending on what I need to put between them.


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## Magic

Some pretty complex track work there in pic #3.
Nice track work.

A small fortune in Caboose ground throws.
Did you glue them down or just the nails.
Just nails will work loose after a time, I found some from Walthers Scene Master
that work pretty good as they are 3/4" long but will fit the holes in the ground throws.
Walthers #433-1411. I still added a little glue to the throws as well. 
I put the nails in at a slight angle to hold better.
Also I used Silicone sealant as glue and put some on the nails as well.
They hold pretty good in foam.

Magic


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## patrick.b

Magic said:


> Some pretty complex track work there in pic #3.
> Nice track work.
> 
> A small fortune in Caboose ground throws.
> Did you glue them down or just the nails.
> Just nails will work loose after a time, I found some from Walthers Scene Master
> that work pretty good as they are 3/4" long but will fit the holes in the ground throws.
> Walthers #433-1411. I still added a little glue to the throws as well.
> I put the nails in at a slight angle to hold better.
> Also I used Silicone sealant as glue and put some on the nails as well.
> They hold pretty good in foam.
> 
> Magic


All of the ground throws are glued and nailed. The nails are really just to keep them in position until the glue sets.


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## blucrsr

Thanks for the detailed pictures of your entire project so far. It's great to follow along with the progress!


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## patrick.b

More work done since my last post, tried to keep the number of photos to a minimum...

Got the last of the industrial sidings down:










Unfortunately, a slight addition to the railroad for functionality has resulted in me needing to add about 2 inches to the table (you can see the switches closest to the camera are hanging off of the table):










Adding the 2x4 spacers:










Adding the board, plywood and foam:










Got the ash pit installed in the engine yard:



















Got the engine yard complete:










New foam is painted and ready for the last bit of track to lay.

I am debating about using roadbed for the last bit of track. This track will run from one edge of the table to the other as if it was the mainline.


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## 89Suburban

Looks nice!


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## Stumpy

Looking good!


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## Robb

Choo Choo !!!!!!


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## Rob Hayes

This looks like it will be a really fun layout to enjoy. Love the choice of industries too. 

Cheers Rob


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## jlc41

Very nice organized and neat work. Thanks for sharing.

Joe


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## MichaelE

Very nice work. I like how you used the engine house foundation to space out the tracks for the facility.

That looks like it will be a smooth running railroad.


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## patrick.b

Thanks for all the kind comments!


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## PoppetFlatsRR

Looking very good sir.


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## blucrsr

Any updates on this layout??


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## patrick.b

blucrsr said:


> Any updates on this layout??


No updates as of yet, I typically don't work on it much during the summer. I will post updates once I start working on it again. 

Thanks for the interest!


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## patrick.b

Well, now that the weather is getting cooler, my other house projects are finishing up and I recent went to our fall train show - I have been making some progress on the railroad.

All of the track has been installed along with all of the ground throws:




























This also means I was able to finally finish all of the feeder wires. I have feeder wires every 6 ft. on the mainline (so no single section is further than 3 ft. from a feeder). I also have feeders on every dead end siding. This is a total of 25 feeders I think. The other huge benefit of this is that I was able to cleanup under the table and finally put all of my boxes under the table instead of throughout the room.



















I am not sure on my next steps, I think I am going to run it for a while to ensure the track is working and doesn't need any modifications prior to painting and ballasting.

I am currently using JMRI Operations to provide train orders, so all of the cars you see on the railroad have been put in those places based on orders and not just randomly set.


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## Stumpy

Nice, clean work.


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## patrick.b

It has been a while since my last post. I have been working on putting ties under all the rail joints. Amazing what an affect this has on the look of the track. Other than four places that will need ballast to hold up the ties, they are all in place.





































I was also able to finally track down a Walthers Shinohara 30 degree crossing to replace the Atlas one which has been giving me nothing but problems.


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## Magic

Yep, getting all the missing ties in is a big improvement.
Some nice looking track work there, going to be a nice RR.
Keep the pics coming.

Magic


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## gardena_shortline

I totally agree with you on the Atlas crossing! I got a 19# of theirs and it's so clunky. I finally just handbuilt one using a fasttracks template.


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## patrick.b

It took me quite a while to find the Walthers crossing. They stopped making them a little over 2 years ago, right before I started buying track. I called every hobby shop listed as a dealer in a 3 state radius, checked websites, never could find it. It wasn't until late last year I thought to put an alert on ebay anytime something with that name came up. Sure enough a month later one went up. Paid more than I wanted, but it is so much better.

I had cars nearly derail on that atlas one. I think the gauge was off.


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## patrick.b

I have finally built my first kit. I really wanted to think about things before just throwing it together, which obviously took some time, but I think the end result is worth it.

I started with this Walthers kit: https://www.walthers.com/prr-block-...-7-16-x-3-1-8-x-4-7-8-quot-6-1-x-7-9-x-12-3cm

After looking at some photos of real towers, I decided I wanted to have the windows in red and then green accent trim.

Spray Painting the windows:










Spray painting the back of the walls black to prevent light penetration. Unfortunately, this did not work. I decided to buy some black liquid masking tape which you paint on the back of the walls. Waiting for it to be delivered...










More black:










Painting the mortar joints with a 50/50 mixture of water and grey acrylic paint:










I decided to hand paint the green accent areas. I thought about masking it and spray painting but the thought of masking all those intricate areas was painful. Although it did take 4 coats of green, I might consider doing this differently in the future if I ever do:










I bought the Woodland Scenics window kit to diffuse the windows so you cant see inside. I will be lighting the building but wont have an interior:










Getting it square:










And the mostly finished building:




























I am waiting on the black liquid masking tape so I can prevent light bleeding through the walls. Once I have done that I will install the light. The last thing will be to do a light weathering job. I will be going to a train show in two weeks where I plan to pick up some weather chalks. I need to do some weathering on the roof to make it not so shiny and on the concrete base and stairs.

All in all I am pretty happy with the end result.


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## CTValleyRR

patrick.b said:


> I have finally built my first kit. I really wanted to think about things before just throwing it together, which obviously took some time, but I think the end result is worth it.
> 
> I started with this Walthers kit: https://www.walthers.com/prr-block-...-7-16-x-3-1-8-x-4-7-8-quot-6-1-x-7-9-x-12-3cm
> 
> After looking at some photos of real towers, I decided I wanted to have the windows in red and then green accent trim.
> 
> Spray Painting the windows:
> 
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> 
> I decided to hand paint the green accent areas. I thought about masking it and spray painting but the thought of masking all those intricate areas was painful. Although it did take 4 coats of green, I might consider doing this differently in the future if I ever do:
> 
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> I am waiting on the black liquid masking tape so I can prevent light bleeding through the walls. Once I have done that I will install the light. The last thing will be to do a light weathering job. I will be going to a train show in two weeks where I plan to pick up some weather chalks. I need to do some weathering on the roof to make it not so shiny and on the concrete base and stairs.
> 
> All in all I am pretty happy with the end result.


Liquid masking tape will be a very expensive way to prevent light bleed through. Not sure why just using black paint didn't work for you. It always has for me. Perhaps you didn't put it on thickly enough (I use a brush and lay down a good, thick coat.

If that doesn't work, apply construction paper and / or real masking tape. Neither of those needs to fit perfectly -- it's inside where no one will see it.


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## patrick.b

Well, I have been quite busy on the railroad and have been slacking on posting updates.

I finished my second kit (minus the weathering):










Had to "pour" concrete for the first time (plastic of paris):










Got the light going






























Next I wanted to work on my water crane. This turned out to be a much more difficult kit than I anticipated! Definitely the most finely detailed model I have worked on...





































Finally, I replaced all of the couplers of my rolling stock and locomotives with Kadee #158s (also adjusted coupler heights and trip pins)


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## Mark VerMurlen

Hi Patrick, I’ve read through your whole thread today. You’ve got a very nice railroad there. I’m very impressed that this is your first railroad. Keep up the good work and I look forward to following your build.

- Mark


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## flyboy2610

Hang onto those Kadee couplers. Someone here might give you a few bucks for them.


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## patrick.b

It has been a while since my last post and I have done a decent bit of work, so this is going to be a bigger post.

Finished the crane for my RIP track:










Mocking up my next building:










Finished Building (minus weathering):






























































Bought some nice holders for my NCE cabs and also bought a second cab so I can walk around the layout with it:











Getting ready for my first go at ballast:











Painting a small section of track to test everything out:












Even with pre-wetting with isopropyl alcohol and watering down the Elmer's, the small ballast still floated (the ties were cleared off completely prior to gluing). 










End result isn't too bad though:


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## patrick.b

Wow, I have not been good about updating this post. I do like to track my progress as much for myself as anyone else. I have made quite a bit of progress over the last seven months (by my standards).

I am adding these pictures in order of their completion. I have done a lot of ballast work as well as added two new buildings. I even added a smoke unit to the smokestack of one building. I plan to have working smoke stacks in two more buildings.


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## MikeL

Very nice - great progress!

How wide is your layout? It seems like it would be quite a stretch t reach the middle?

Mike


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## patrick.b

MikeL said:


> Very nice - great progress!
> 
> How wide is your layout? It seems like it would be quite a stretch t reach the middle?
> 
> Mike


The layout is roughly 9'x5'. It is a bit of a reach to the middle, but you don't need to do that to often.


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