# My 224



## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

All cleaned and ready to go.










I did paint the steam chest and the trailing truck.





















The before lower left.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

T, I'm really glad you posted those pics (great job, by the way!). I've been looking for one to post to ask a question. In your first photo, What are all those extra linkages on the connecting rods? Do they operate the valves in the steam chest, are they part of the reversing mechanism? In real life, what do they do?


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

From what I gathered from your post.The steamchest has two cylinders. The top small one is reverse. The large bottom is the main drive to the center wheel. The crosshead is a support for the main drive. In the Lionel case the rods are connected opposite from your link. They are drive rods to the center wheel and the connecting rods power the other two.

After workimg on a Mantua Pacific I did learn about the 90 degree offset between sides.

Why do people assume I know a lot about real trains?


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

I don't assume that you do---I just thought it was a great pic of what I was looking to learn about and figured someone would jump in with the answer. Most trains have the standard set of connecting rods, but a few have an unusual arrangement with small, additional connecting rods and linkages from the front drivewheel back to the steam chest. I was curious as to what those are and the purpose they serve. Most steamers don't seem to have them.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

The Scouts just have the main forward rods.

This HO is a more accurate. Actually I have not seen that many operating steam engines in person.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

Great pic! I'm not trying to put you on the spot---I'm just trying to see if anyone can tell me how the mechanism works. I'm referring to the silver rod that is on a 60-degree angle and connects the front drivewheel to the steam chest. I'm guessing it controls the timing of the valves to allow a blast of new steam to enter the cylinder and force the piston forward and vent the old steam out ahead of it. I'd have posted it as a new thread, but couldn't find a decent pic to show what I meant. Sorry to have hijacked your thread! By the way, that Pere Marquette is absolutely beautiful.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Hi Reckers,

I think you're basically on the right track. Try these links:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_locomotive_nomenclature

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valve_gear

Coincidentally, I've just been reading (and learning for the first time) about steam TURBINE locos ... turbines driving gears driving wheels ... no pistons. I didn't know there was such a thing! Wiki says that only a few developed in the US ... they had great efficiency at high loco speed, but had their death-call if tasked to operate at low speeds.

The reason I bring this up is that I was wondering how one would engage "reverse" on a turbine loco? I'm assuming that the turbine itself would always spin in the same direction (the impellers were designed to be uni-directionally efficient, like airplane wings), and that a gearing mechanism would shift the torque direction from fwd to reverse. But that's just a guess on my part.

Any thoughts? I'll do a little digging ...

TJ


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ohh (and, most importantly) ... T-Man ... GREAT restoration job on this little guy. Sweeeeeet!!!

TJ


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

As normal great work "Epoxy Man!

I think your not done yet T, are you missing some things (< plural is a hint) on the front of the engine.

Do you know what it is?


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

big ed said:


> As normal great work "Epoxy Man!
> 
> I think your not done yet T, are you missing some things (< plural is a hint) on the front of the engine.
> 
> Do you know what it is?


Purty lil lights in those fixtures?


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

TJ, thanks for the leads! I'll follow up on them.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

big ed said:


> As normal great work "Epoxy Man!
> 
> I think your not done yet T, are you missing some things (< plural is a hint) on the front of the engine.
> 
> Do you know what it is?


I have the jewels but what to glue??? Super, epoxy, or Elemers?










Now I have to do the other steam chest. All too often the chest seems to fade so here is a good example of a before and after. The new paint works with the old on the boiler.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Hey T-Man,

What type of black paint are you using?

I've been under the (false and naive) impression that old black cast (i.e., Bakelite) Lionel locos were simply the raw plastic-like material. But I've now read that most of these were factory-painted black.

So what are you using to match up pretty closely?
And are you air-brushing?

Thanks,
TJ


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

And with apologies for more of my off-thread topic babble ...

I had been talking about the mechanics of REAL steam turbine locos and said:

"I was wondering how one would engage 'reverse' on a turbine loco? I'm assuming that the turbine itself would always spin in the same direction (the impellers were designed to be uni-directionally efficient, like airplane wings), and that a gearing mechanism would shift the torque direction from fwd to reverse. But that's just a guess on my part."

I was SO WRONG!

A quick read tells me that the Penn. RR's 1944 venture into steam turbine locos via the #6200 6-8-6 had a dedicated large turbine for forward propulsion, and a smaller / separate turbine for reverse. I.e., redirect the steam to the smaller (opposite rotation) turbine to back ol' Nellie down the track.

Incidentally, the (real) Penn 6-8-6 was the prototype for Lionel's 671 O-gage and 2020 O27 gage locos (produced during the late '40's).

And with that, I'll turn the conversation back over the T-Man's brilliant fixer-up handiwork!

TJ


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

tjcruiser said:


> Hey T-Man,
> 
> What type of black paint are you using?
> 
> ...


Walmart flat black spray.
The camera can be deceiving but it works.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Elmers won out. The top is worn on the left and gives a cross eyed look at this angle.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Shoot T man that engine only used red markers.:laugh:

Just kidding looks nice. What did you use plain old white Elmers?

I though for sure you would use epoxy.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

I went with yellow. It would be easier to clean out if I go to red.

I have more to do also. I just was never shamed into doing it.

DID you see the repair kits for the markers on ebay?
I guess you cut a section off the front and glue or solder a replacement.


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

tjcruiser said:


> Hi Reckers,
> 
> I think you're basically on the right track. Try these links:
> 
> ...



TJ,

Excellent reference material! With your permission assumed, I'll cut and paste your references into my earlier thread about steamers.

Thanks,


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

T-Man said:


> I went with yellow. It would be easier to clean out if I go to red.
> 
> I have more to do also. I just was never shamed into doing it.
> 
> ...



How much were they? 
Looks like they would fit right on with glue. (or epoxy)


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Alright ... this is so coincidental, it's eerie ...

I justed opened up the ebay box with the beat-up Lionel 249 loco and 1590 quasi-set that I grabbed. I was curious to see how chewed up the boiler/body was on the loco. Not too bad, I'm happy to say. Except that one (of the pair) of little "thingies" that sticks up on top of the boiler front (sorry, uneducated lingo) is partially broken off.

So, I say to myself, "Hmmm ... what is that, and how might I fix it?"

Then, a little while later, a sit down at the computer and poke around MTF a bit. AND WHAT TO MY WONDERING EYES DO I SEE, BUT ...

There's T-Man with a picture / ebay-hit to the very same "thingies" ... forevermore known as "markers"! And people are selling these things on ebay! How cool is that?!?

I'm all happy about this, of course ... but you've all given me the jitters. Are there cameras planted all around my house, with you guys watching me, sitting there saying, "I wonder what train stuff TJ is getting himself into now?!?"

Seriously ... thanks for the unintentional tip ... much appreciated!


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

tjcruiser said:


> Alright ... this is so coincidental, it's eerie ...
> 
> I justed opened up the ebay box with the beat-up Lionel 249 loco and 1590 quasi-set that I grabbed. I was curious to see how chewed up the boiler/body was on the loco. Not too bad, I'm happy to say. Except that one (of the pair) of little "thingies" that sticks up on top of the boiler front (sorry, uneducated lingo) is partially broken off.
> 
> ...





Those little thingies are marker lights.:laugh:


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

TJ, don't mention the cameras in the house around Tankist. He gets testy. *L*


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Ahhh ... "marker lights" ... got it! I guess having those puppies break off is a pretty common thing with Lionel steamers, huh?

As for the "secret cameras" ... I guess I'll have to smile more often ... that, and making sure that I'm fully dressed!


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

I have it on good authority that The Committee would greatly appreciate that latter change. Not that we're watching anybody. Especially Ukranians.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

big ed said:


> How much were they?
> Looks like they would fit right on with glue. (or epoxy)


The total was six bucks with shipping from Olsen's. The make a larger set for the big 700's.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Hey T-Man,

You're a 224 guy ... this eBay auction caught my eye ... a complete 463W set from 1945 with 224 loco, cars, etc.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280468881667&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

The auction is still live (as of Sun night) ... I wonder what this will all go for?

I'm new to this Lionel collecting thing, but isn't it quite rare to find a set like this essentially fully complete ???


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

379 looks safe. Remember to get a quality set today 400 is average. SO to get one 70 years old with original boxes is a deal. I have 2.5, 224,s now. It all goes back to my roots in the 80's I lost a 224 set for 350 to a gold master card guy. It took me another 20 before I got one.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Re: 224 and the 463W set listed on eBay above.

I guess it was the hot little item. Bidding went from $374 up to $676 in the last 15 minutes! Great find for someone.

Much too steep for my pockets, of course, but I'm enjoying "looking over the shoulder" of some Lionel collectors, and beginning to learn a bit about the value/rarity/demand of certain locos, sets, etc.


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