# lift out and stopping train.



## wc3026 (Aug 20, 2012)

So I have a lift out on my layout and have it set up so when I lift it up it shuts the tracks off a certain distance before it. It works great if it is only one loco but not so great if there is more then one. How can I wire it so that as the locos go across the gap they will stay running until the last loco goes over the gap? Could I stagger the track gap a little?


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

I'm not sure why this is a problem. Can't you tell when there's still a locomotive on the hot section? If the switched section isn't long enough, just make it longer?

For our modular club, I arranged the switching so that there was at least 4 foot of lead-in that was switched when the bridge is up. Although this is O-scale, the same technique applies to any scale.


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## wc3026 (Aug 20, 2012)

I have about 2-3 feet before the lift out that shuts off. the problem I have if it is more then one loco and there are enough cars the loco that is running dont have enough power to push the dead loco to make contact its self to power the dead track.


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## RT_Coker (Dec 6, 2012)

*** I have never head of following being done! ***

If you are using DCC, you could set it up so that your “shut-off” sections would have their DCC polarity reversed from the adjacent track sections when the lift-out was not in place. This would cause a short and shut the DCC power off when a powered-unit entered a “shut-off” section. If you did this, it would be good to have a common circuit-breaker on the “shut-off” section and its adjacent section (or on all four sections). This would also allow for much shorter “shut-off” sections.
Bob


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

When you lift the 'bridge' it would follow that you are,
in fact, leaving the layout area. You could rewire your
safety circuit to shut off all power to the entire layout?

That would avoid any and all collisions and at the same
time protect the trains and other gear from any
electrical damage when unattended.

Don


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

RT_Coker said:


> *** I have never head of following being done! ***
> 
> If you are using DCC, you could set it up so that your “shut-off” sections would have their DCC polarity reversed from the adjacent track sections when the lift-out was not in place. This would cause a short and shut the DCC power off when a powered-unit entered a “shut-off” section. If you did this, it would be good to have a common circuit-breaker on the “shut-off” section and its adjacent section (or on all four sections). This would also allow for much shorter “shut-off” sections.
> Bob


Intentionally shorting doesn't sound like a good idea.


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## Brakeman Jake (Mar 8, 2009)

On my relatively small layout,DCC goes from the command station through the NC terminals of a 10A relay then to the PM42,so when my drop-down section is opened,the relay also opens and cuts DCC to the whole layout.


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## RT_Coker (Dec 6, 2012)

cv_acr said:


> Intentionally shorting doesn't sound like a good idea.


I agree, just thought it was preferable to having a consisted with the front locomotive suddenly shut off and the remaining locomotives still powered. Is this better?

Use a normally-on snap-off relay with the relay-coil connected to the DC/DCC power from the short unpowered “shut-off” section, and with the relay-switch providing power to the adjacent “shut-down” entrance section (long enough for the consist). The lift out would have a switch that disconnects power to the relay-coil and powers the “shut-down” section when it is in place. When tripped the relay would need to be manually reset before normal operation. 
Bob


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

RT_Coker said:


> I agree, just thought it was preferable to having a consisted with the front locomotive suddenly shut off and the remaining locomotives still powered. Is this better?


No, I wouldn't consider that better.

Honestly just having the dead zone is fine. Spinning its wheels for a moment when the first locomotive loses power is really not going to harm the second locomotive.

It's not like you should be leaving the whole setup there running on its own for a couple of hours, the cut-out is just a safety precaution.

A short will shut down the entire system, unless you break the layout down into several smaller areas with their own dedicated short protection circuit breakers.


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## RT_Coker (Dec 6, 2012)

cv_acr said:


> No, I wouldn't consider that better.
> 
> Honestly just having the dead zone is fine. Spinning its wheels for a moment when the first locomotive loses power is really not going to harm the second locomotive.
> 
> ...


In case you missed it, the post you are quoting from does not short anything, and the post on the shorting technique, suggest that a circuit-break(s) be used. 
Bob


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Circuit breaker or not, I think shorting the track is a bad idea.


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## RT_Coker (Dec 6, 2012)

RT_Coker said:


> Use a normally-on snap-off relay with the relay-coil connected to the DC/DCC power from the short unpowered “shut-off” section, and with the relay-switch providing power to the adjacent “shut-down” entrance section (long enough for the consist). The lift out would have a switch that disconnects power to the relay-coil and powers the “shut-down” section when it is in place. When tripped the relay would need to be manually reset before normal operation.
> Bob


Corrected as follows (Not that it matters!):
Use a normally-on snap-off relay with the relay-coil connected to the DC/DCC power from the short unpowered “shut-off” section, and with the relay-switch providing power to the adjacent “shut-down” entrance section (long enough for the consist). The lift out would have a switch that disconnects power to the relay-coil and powers the “shut-off” section when it is in place. When tripped the relay would need to be manually reset before normal operation.
Bob


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