# rebuilding layout



## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

starting all over again after tearing down last layout because I moved. I need to know how a sound card works, have an EMD and will be getting a steam loco for my passenger line. it will be DCC of course. I understand steam can have bells, whistles and chugging sounds. How does it all work? if there is a link foward to me please, any help is appreciated.


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## SF Gal (11 mo ago)

How does it all work...hmmmmm.
Kind of a broad question. There is a circuit board inside the tender with a tiny cell phone type speaker. It uses a constand voltage on the tracks to supply varied voltage to the motor, LED.s and sound card. 
But the most basic Digital Command Control (DCC) system consists of several parts: a throttle, a command station, a booster, a decoder, and a power supply to run it all. Most systems also use a throttle network which allows multiple throttles to talk to the command station. 

You use a throttle as an input to tell the system what you want a locomotive to do.
The throttle sends your request over a throttle network to the Command Station.

The command station creates a digital packet and forwards it to the booster.
Some systems combine a command station and a booster into a single unit.

The booster amplifies the digital data packet from the command station and sends it your railroad layout using your track wiring to the rails to the decoder circuit board.
A DCC-equipped Locomotive has a multifunction decoder inside. Every multifunction decoder is programmed with a unique address. The decoder listens to each digital packet as it goes past. It checks if the packet is valid (i.e. not corrupt), and if the address of the packet matches that of the decoder. If the decoder finds a valid data packet addressed to itself, the decoder performs the requested action in milliseconds. If the addresses don't match, or if the packet isn't valid, the decoder ignores the packet and continues whatever it was doing.
The command station continuously repeats all current data packets in case a decoder did not receive it. This is one way that DCC is reliable - error checking and multiple packet transmissions. REFERENCE: Tutorial DCC Basics

Here is a video of sound decoder inside a steam locomotive...





The decoder, as with most steam Locomotives are housed in the coal tender, as seen in this link example parts breakdown.
Hope that is what you were inquiring about?


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## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

SF Gal said:


> How does it all work...hmmmmm.
> Kind of a broad question. There is a circuit board inside the tender with a tiny cell phone type speaker. It uses a constand voltage on the tracks to supply varied voltage to the motor, LED.s and sound card.
> But the most basic Digital Command Control (DCC) system consists of several parts: a throttle, a command station, a booster, a decoder, and a power supply to run it all. Most systems also use a throttle network which allows multiple throttles to talk to the command station.
> 
> ...


already used DCC in a previous layout, early version of Bachmann DCC, does not have 16 volt power outlet. That forced me to use power supplies for accessories. How does one control these sounds, that`s what i need to learn


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## OilValleyRy (Oct 3, 2021)

TNTWOLTEMD said:


> already used DCC in a previous layout, early version of Bachmann DCC, does not have 16 volt power outlet. That forced me to use power supplies for accessories. How does one control these sounds, that`s what i need to learn











Buttons. LOTS of buttons! See the 1-0 next to the Enter button? Those are Function buttons. I.e. F1 is whatever sound, bell let’s just say. F2 is i.e. short whistle, F3 is long whistle, F4 is steam blowdown i.e. So you just press Fwhichever button for the sound you desire. So if you stop at a water tower to take on water, press F8 or whichever for the “taking on water” sound. Aside from choosing & installing a sound decoder, there’s minimal rocket science involved. It’s just buttons. It’s reeeeal simple. Even a geico caveman can do it! And that 15% he saved goes a long way in this hob… Actually no it doesn’t.


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## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

OilValleyRy said:


> View attachment 586608
> 
> Buttons. LOTS of buttons! See the 1-0 next to the Enter button? Those are Function buttons. I.e. F1 is whatever sound, bell let’s just say. F2 is i.e. short whistle, F3 is long whistle, F4 is steam blowdown i.e. So you just press Fwhichever button for the sound you desire. So if you stop at a water tower to take on water, press F8 or whichever for the “taking on water” sound. Aside from choosing & installing a sound decoder, there’s minimal rocket science involved. It’s just buttons. It’s reeeeal simple. Even a geico caveman can do it! And that 15% he saved goes a long way in this hob… Actually no it doesn’t.


I will be buying a steam loco with sound card, how do I control it? does it come with a controler like this? have not found a modeler near me whose brain I can pick. So, I would have to scrap my Bachmann controler?


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## Mixed Freight (Aug 31, 2019)

TNTWOLTEMD said:


> I will be buying a steam loco with sound card, how do I control it? does it come with a controler like this? have not found a modeler near me whose brain I can pick. So, I would have to scrap my Bachmann controler?


In the good news/bad news department......................

First, the *BAD* news: Yes, you will have to buy a professional controller like that (or a similar ones by a some other manufacturers), if you want complete control over the sounds.

Now, the *GOOD* news: Once you have purchased said professional DCC controller, you should be able to control virtually anything and everything else in the DCC world for a long, long time.


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## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

Mixed Freight said:


> In the good news/bad news department......................
> 
> First, the *BAD* news: Yes, you will have to buy a professional controller like that (or a similar ones by a some other manufacturers), if you want complete control over the sounds.
> 
> Now, the *GOOD* news: Once you have purchased said professional DCC controller, you should be able to control virtually anything and everything else in the DCC world for a long, long time.


at $550?


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## Mixed Freight (Aug 31, 2019)

TNTWOLTEMD said:


> at $550?


I said "like that". I didn't say "EXACTLY like that".








Here's a good, complete, professional beginner's system sorta' "like that", from the same manufacturer..............

NCE #5240025 (Power Cab) DCC Starter Set Power Cab


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## OilValleyRy (Oct 3, 2021)

Full-feature starter systems, versus entry level (limited function) starter systems.
NCE PowerCab is popular, as is one from Digitrax, MRC, and some people have been building their own “open source” type DCC systems (I think it’s open source).

The thing to know (or learn) is that each system (NCE, Digitrax, Prodigy Advanced2) is expandable, but not necessarily in the same ways or to equal extent. I.e. Digitrax has the widest array of add-on equipment. NCE is very user-friendly as is MRC Prodigy Advanced2, but I think (might be wrong) the NCE system has more options in regards to daisy chaining boosters etc as you expand? MRC’s can expand too, but _might_ be more limited? If I’m mistaken I know one or two users of it will be giddy to correct me lol
I use NCE PowerCab as linked by @Mixed Freight, I bought it about 16 years ago and I haven’t had one single problem with it other than human error/ignorance. It comes with a manual. Who needs that? Ohhh, apparently I did (for advanced function mapping aka altering how functions actually function).

The Bachmann EZ DCC controller is not rubbish, it’s merely junk. Lol What I mean is don’t toss it out. You may find another use for it. But it’s below the baseline standard of DCC systems so to speak because it’s not full-featured in programming & F utilization. It’d be handy for a 6 ft shelf layout in the proverbial dining room, or a 4x8 kids layout etc. Might be useful as an isolated power supply for structure lighting or something?


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

OilValleyRy said:


> Full-feature starter systems, versus entry level (limited function) starter systems.
> NCE PowerCab is popular, as is one from Digitrax, MRC, and some people have been building their own “open source” type DCC systems (I think it’s open source).
> 
> The thing to know (or learn) is that each system (NCE, Digitrax, Prodigy Advanced2) is expandable, but not necessarily in the same ways or to equal extent. I.e. Digitrax has the widest array of add-on equipment. NCE is very user-friendly as is MRC Prodigy Advanced2, but I think (might be wrong) the NCE system has more options in regards to daisy chaining boosters etc as you expand? MRC’s can expand too, but _might_ be more limited? If I’m mistaken I know one or two users of it will be giddy to correct me lol
> ...


Yeah I'm kind of scratching my head here. Not really sure how the Prodigy is limited in it's ability to daisy-chain boosters. I mean, maybe if you're looking at a warehouse sized layout requiring 50+ amps, but for any reaonably sized home layout, this is not the case. Could you elaborate?


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## OilValleyRy (Oct 3, 2021)

CTValleyRR said:


> Yeah I'm kind of scratching my head here. Not really sure how the Prodigy is limited in it's ability to daisy-chain boosters. I mean, maybe if you're looking at a warehouse sized layout requiring 50+ amps, but for any reaonably sized home layout, this is not the case. Could you elaborate?


Well I said _might_ be more limited, and that I may be mistaken regarding MRC’s expansion limits. Hence someone as the OP looking into what to upgrade to, should research what limitations exist as part of the comparative analysis.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

There is no need to upgrade to another
DCC control system.
The OP wants to know how to control
the sound on his steam loco with a
Bachmann EZ controller. That is very simple.
You have a function key on the controller.
It is yellow I believe. Press it and then a
number key for the function, whistle,
or bell...See your EZ manual for the key
numbers. The choo choo sounds will
automatically come on and sync with
the loco speed when you select the
loco and raise the speed control. The
loco will also huff and rumble automatically
as does a real steam loco when
it is sitting idle.
(unless it is turned off
by the controller - see the manual).

Don


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

OilValleyRy said:


> Well I said _might_ be more limited, and that I may be mistaken regarding MRC’s expansion limits. Hence someone as the OP looking into what to upgrade to, should research what limitations exist as part of the comparative analysis.


If you are trying to provide a valid comparison, then don't speculate about things you don't know for certain, especially when they may prejudice the advisee against a system you're not recommending. It's just an underhanded way of trying to steer someone in the direction of your own preference rather than allowing him to make his own judgements.


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## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

OilValleyRy said:


> Full-feature starter systems, versus entry level (limited function) starter systems.
> NCE PowerCab is popular, as is one from Digitrax, MRC, and some people have been building their own “open source” type DCC systems (I think it’s open source).
> 
> The thing to know (or learn) is that each system (NCE, Digitrax, Prodigy Advanced2) is expandable, but not necessarily in the same ways or to equal extent. I.e. Digitrax has the widest array of add-on equipment. NCE is very user-friendly as is MRC Prodigy Advanced2, but I think (might be wrong) the NCE system has more options in regards to daisy chaining boosters etc as you expand? MRC’s can expand too, but _might_ be more limited? If I’m mistaken I know one or two users of it will be giddy to correct me lol
> ...


due to limited apartment space it is going to be 4`x4`. just want to hear the chugging of a steam loco. also have a EMD, DCC ready, would like to hear that running also.I saw that Bachmann has a steam with Sound, trying to find out how that works.


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## OilValleyRy (Oct 3, 2021)

CTValleyRR said:


> If you are trying to provide a valid comparison, then don't speculate about things you don't know for certain, especially when they may prejudice the advisee against a system you're not recommending. It's just an underhanded way of trying to steer someone in the direction of your own preference rather than allowing him to make his own judgements.


I wasn’t trying to steer anyone in any direction other than they have to look at what differences exist and how those factor into their decision making process. I do not have first hand experience with every system on the market. I don’t need experience with every system to be able to say there are differences, which may or may not matter to any given individual. That is not speculation. It is fact. Wrong side of the bed today, huh?


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

OilValleyRy said:


> I wasn’t trying to steer anyone in any direction other than they have to look at what differences exist and how those factor into their decision making process. I do not have first hand experience with every system on the market. I don’t need experience with every system to be able to say there are differences, which may or may not matter to any given individual. That is not speculation. It is fact. Wrong side of the bed today, huh?


Same side of the bed as everyday. Just finally decided to say something. You're right that you don't have experience with every system on the market, or every product, or every model, or every whatever. So you should restrict your advice to things that you know. If you weren't trying to influence someone's opinion, then why did you say something that you had no information about? You say there are differences. You're right. Leave it there unless you have more concrete information to offer.

Your knowledge of the hobby and your skill is impressive. Be satisfied with being at the 90th percentile. You don't have to offer opinion and advice on every subject, especially when you don't know. When you stretch for that last 10%, you go off the rails.


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## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

DonR said:


> There is no need to upgrade to another
> DCC control system.
> The OP wants to know how to control
> the sound on his steam loco with a
> ...


my Bachmann controler is in storage right now, the manual was skechty as I remember. I also consider it to be obsolete, one of the first ones to come out, does`nt even have power outlet to work turnouts. so I`m prepared to upgrade to what`s great to use nowdays. And I`m thanking all for your inputs.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

You should be aware that NO DCC controller has
power output for turnouts or other accessories. You must
provide a suitable power supply for those. Many of us use an
old DC power pack, or old wall warts that
put out around 12 to 15 volts...DC preferably.

Don


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## TNTWOLTEMD (6 mo ago)

DonR said:


> You should be aware that NO DCC controller has
> power output for turnouts or other accessories. You must
> provide a suitable power supply for those. Many of us use an
> old DC power pack, or old wall warts that
> ...


that`s what I did for last time,.Bachmann turnouts need AC.
Plus a DC power supply for Leds then a battery for 1.5 volts street lights. It was a mess I want to avoid this time.
And in spite of what everybody says, I got the Bachmann turnouts working fine, just a little file work. Yeah, it`s all EZ track.


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## OilValleyRy (Oct 3, 2021)

CTValleyRR said:


> Same side of the bed as everyday. Just finally decided to say something. You're right that you don't have experience with every system on the market, or every product, or every model, or every whatever. So you should restrict your advice to things that you know. If you weren't trying to influence someone's opinion, then why did you say something that you had no information about? You say there are differences. You're right. Leave it there unless you have more concrete information to offer.
> 
> Your knowledge of the hobby and your skill is impressive. Be satisfied with being at the 90th percentile. You don't have to offer opinion and advice on every subject, especially when you don't know. When you stretch for that last 10%, you go off the rails.


Clearly you did not understand the point of my post, and are misconstruing quite a bit of what I said, did not, and implied. I stated I was not 100% sure on the specifics of the MRC system, that someone would correct me if I was incorrect on the given example. However, specifics is not the point. The point is that not all systems are the same in every way. Seeing as you agree on all that, why the pitchfork and torch? I just don’t see why anything I said would take the jelly out of someone’s donut.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

OilValleyRy said:


> Clearly you did not understand the point of my post, and are misconstruing quite a bit of what I said, did not, and implied. I stated I was not 100% sure on the specifics of the MRC system, that someone would correct me if I was incorrect on the given example. However, specifics is not the point. The point is that not all systems are the same in every way. Seeing as you agree on all that, why the pitchfork and torch? I just don’t see why anything I said would take the jelly out of someone’s donut.


]

Clearly, or you wouldn't do it so often.


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## sid (Mar 26, 2018)

Y'ALL are grumpy ... go get some coffee and take a WHOLE bunch of CHILL PILLS .


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## JeffHurl (Apr 22, 2021)




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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

GUYS, Cease with the bickering!


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