# When in doubt......



## JPIII

Grab a handful......from my dirtbiking days. I'm not sure how that translates to ones first model RRs but here we are.

First select a site......got it.
Make a sketch was the available space and let your imagination run free to come up with Plan A. (& B & C.....etc.). BTDT
Start making sawdust.....know how to do that also......I have some awesome tools.
Finger out how to get where you want to go & what you want to depict. Living in the PNW I know about trees.......trees is gud but the PNW landscape is all up & down....I gots no hills/mountains. With all this modern stuff available, I can make some tho. This brings us up to where I am now.

I've been working at this 13 X 19 foot U shaped layout for about 3 weeks.
Due to some poor planning, I'll need a sky hook to get at some of it.....I didn't have enough room to do the switchbacks so I made some.....eh.... what the hell.

I have a few pictures which don't show much but I'm sure more will come.
I've got about 9 inches of height gain of the required 13. Ill knock out that last bit within the next few days......God willin' & the creek don't rise.


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## JPIII

A few more pics for you to see what is going on in my fantasy world.

The straight shots are 4% grades while the curves (18" rad.) are 2%. I did some testing with the Climax and it can handle the limited (30" long trains) hauls up the 4% grades. Should I run into any unforeseen problems the Mallet ought to do it.


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## UPBigBoy

Looks good so far. Do you have a track plan you could post so we know where you're heading?

Jim


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## NIMT

Your design will keep you busy both building it and running it!
That's a lot of switchbacks to deal with. Wouldn't running around the mountain save on the mass of switchbacks? Makes for a lot more efficient operations too.


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## JPIII

Up hill, both ways
There is an elevated section over next to the wall on the right......19' X 30".
Gotta get up to that, besides, I've seen few switchbacks modeled......maybe it's because they are such a PITA.hwell:

I do have a sketch of what I initially planed but it has been modified so many times that it's incomprehensible....even to me. Basically, there is an oval down on the flat representing the mainline for the lumber mill......the mill is on hold pending recovery of my wallet. Switchbacks up the 15-16 deg slope then kinda freestyle up on top......the current logging will be up there......this is gonna be ugly for some time.


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## NIMT

It is definitely a process that does not happen overnight!
Look forward to seeing how this progresses!:thumbsup:


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## tjcruiser

JP,

Wow ... that's some primo real-estate you have in that shop. Lots of floor space, great lighting, easy walk-around setup, etc.

Lucky you!

Layout progress looks great!

TJ


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## JPIII

Thanks.
I built the shop (24 X 36) bout 12 years ago......one of my better plans.
Filled it up with stuff once, then emptied it, now refilling.....all according to plan.


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## Carl

Great work area with all the necessary tools. Good luck.


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## tjcruiser

JPIII said:


> Thanks.
> I built the shop (24 X 36) bout 12 years ago......one of my better plans.
> Filled it up with stuff once, then emptied it, now refilling.....all according to plan.


Isn't there a Law of Physics that says that we are predestined to collect just enough stuff to completely fill the space we have available?!?


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## JPIII

I do believe you're right but it's tough target to hit "full mark" right on.
God invented garage sales to help out we poor mortals.
We will have one next month.


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## JPIII

OK, I got up the grade. I've still plenty to do shaping all the switchback bits, installing a creek thu them, culverts, drainage ditches , laying road bed on the flat, plaster cloth on the slopes..... that will probably take a week or 3 at my present pace.

Now I have a large flat T shaped area up top with no good plan on what to do
The area is 19' X 3' with the leg of the T being about 10 X 4. I will need Double tracks for loading logs onto cars, spurs going out to each end of the T & for camp cars. 

Other than covering 3 wall outlets with some kinda removable hills, my mind is blank. Nothing is off the table (NPI), reverse loops, more elevation changes...oh, a creek needs to pass thru. There is already 2 inches of foam on part of it.....but I gots more to go higher which is about the extent of my planing........

I need ideas & I have time.

TIA,


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## joed2323

Good job so far. With what you have to work with sometimes less is more for now. Just keep your trackwork expandable. Remember this isnt a race, all good things take time. It gets very exciting seeing the benchwork up then all a person wants to do is be stuck in the train room and keep trucking away at the layout. 

Keep us posted with updates, we are glad to have you aboard.


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## Carl

tjcruiser: I think that lase exists......just talk to my wife.


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## JPIII

joed2323 said:


> Good job so far. With what you have to work with sometimes less is more for now. Just keep your trackwork expandable. Remember this isnt a race, all good things take time. It gets very exciting seeing the benchwork up then all a person wants to do is be stuck in the train room and keep trucking away at the layout.
> 
> Keep us posted with updates, we are glad to have you aboard.


My poor planing put me in "auto slow down" mode. If you saw the line about the "sky hook" in a prior post it has come to haunt me. I have to stop adding foam so I can get up on the layout to finish out the switchbacks (at least roughly)...including track laying before I can proceed.


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## JPIII

Plugging away at this thing. You must remember this is a first time deal for me. Read the book, saw the movie, & got the T-shirt...now it's time for me to find out what works for me in DIY mode. The foam thing works very well once you finger out the best tool to cut it. My Japanese pull saw works good for long cuts....anybody want a hot knife & hot wire cutter (bench type)? For carving an old filleting knife sharpened on my bench grinder to a serrated edge.....my good filleting knife goes back in my fishin' vest.....works OK but needs sharpening after 10 minutes of use.....which is a PITA. The grinder makes a better edge for cutting this stuff in 20 seconds.

Plaster cloth is no longer used......just shaped foam with light weight joint compound......tried 3 different makers and settled on the first one I bought.
Expanding foam (3 different types there also) & a knife make the needed shapes with 2 coats of spackling compound.

A couple pics. Trying to get the pics to pop up. Bear with me, please.
Well,that didn't work worth spit.


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## Evan

I really like the locomotive you got there!


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## JPIII

I really could use some help on this picture thing. I would like to make the pics come up with the post. I load the pics straight *from my computer*.
The software on all other forums I've been playing on accepts this as a matter of course with minimal jumping thru hoops but I can't figure out the drill here.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> I really could use some help on this picture thing. I would like to make the pics come up with the post. I load the pics straight *from my computer*.
> The software on all other forums I've been playing on accepts this as a matter of course with minimal jumping thru hoops but I can't figure out the drill here.


There is a thread for you but I can't find it.
It should be (might be) a sticky thread.

I found it read this and see if it helps you.
I do it a different way.


http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=2595


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## JPIII

I'll try this way.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> I'll try this way.



Nope, no cigar.

In the box where you type see the paper clip?
Click it it will open this,









Then click browse and find your picture in your computer click on it. It will be added to that box. After it is in that box click upload, wait you will see it come up. Some computers might take a while, mine comes up lighting fast. After it up loads minimize that box and go back to the box where you are posting/typing.

Up top click the paper clip again and click on the attachment that is there from your upload when you click on it it will attach into your post.


1, paper clip click
2 browse find picture and click
3 click upload wait to make sure it uploads
4 minimize that box
5 go back and click the paper clip
6 you will see the attachment click on it 

7 it should be in your post.


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## JPIII

Ah, the paper clip trick. .....








BTW, the yellow stuff (doors & windows) is a PITA to sand & overcoat with Spackle, too pliable.....but it's free of voids. The tan stuff sands nicely but is full of voids....which ya gotta go back & fill with yellow stuff or a butt load of plaster/Spackle. Pick your poison.


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## JPIII

It's good to find someone that knows their stuff.
Thanks.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> It's good to find someone that knows their stuff.
> Thanks.



I feel that way when you post pictures, if you want to view it you can't until you sign up to the site.
If you have a decent computer it will upload 5 pictures in seconds.

Brings in new members too?
(Though it seems some join just to bash big ed?)hwell:

Maybe dye wash, your choice of color, brushed onto the yellow stuff would work?


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## gunrunnerjohn

big ed said:


> Brings in new members too?
> (Though it seems some join just to bash big ed?)hwell:


Well, it's sooooo much fun to bash Big Ed!


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## joed2323

Pretty good size switchback you have there... I was debating about doing a simple switchback on my layout, but viewing yours makes me feel alittle better, no pun intended btw:thumbsup:


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## JPIII

They are 9 feet long. At that, I can only get 30 inches total length train up them. You gotta want em' I guess. Lots of room for scenery, tho.

Western Washington has very little exposed rock till you get over 4-5000 feet.
The glacial till soil does hold a pretty good slope tho......as long as you have drainage.


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## JPIII

Guaawlee, I am finally to the point where I can start layin' track. Gonna have me a real live fake RR rather than a pile of polyurethane & plaster. Paint looks a bit shiny cause it's not dry yet






.


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## JPIII

BTW: If you're curious about the dark stuff scattered about, thems are rocks.
I attacked a pea gravel bar up on the East Fork & gathered up a couple buckets full. Sifting it down left me with a bunch of different sizes & some of the finer stuff is there as an experiment. Got a tip from the fella at the LHS to wit:
Pass a magnet over anything you use near the road bed. Sure enough, about 10% of the stuff has enough iron content to be attracted.....that could'a been ugly.


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## brik-el

Good stuff, very interesting.
:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Do you have a pic of the entire thing?


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## JPIII

Yes, but there's not much to see yet. Only the lower flat & switchback sections are covered with foam.....with just a bit on the upper level. The upper level is 3 X 19 feet. If you look back in the thread you'll see why I'm forced to do it this way. I have to semi finish the center portion of the switchbacks as the access to them will become really iffy as I progress. My reference to a "sky hook" futher back is no joke.


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## Big Ed

I went back and looked quickly but couldn't find any reference as to what is the scale your building the layout for. HO? N?


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## JPIII

HO scale, sorry. It's good to know that up front.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> HO scale, sorry. It's good to know that up front.



No problem I thought I missed it.
Do the tunnels connect to each other after they go under the mountain?
If so do you have a way to get in under there, in case you need to?

Looking good.:thumbsup:


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## JPIII

The tunnel is continuous, in one way & out the other.....a 30 inch radius in there. The area below the hills is hollow with supports holding up the foam.
the resulting hollow will be from 10 to 12 inches high X 8ish feet wide X 4 feet deep. It will double as a car barn around the track & a workbench to the right.
Maybe put some Formica down for the WB area.......don't wanna get too cute but there it is, may as well put it to use. 

Laying track this weekend......got a bit done yesterday....it's a learn as ya go deal so no hurry. Maybe get it wired so I can play with trains.......

I go into the hospital Thursday to rebuild my guts. 5 days or so in there plus recovery (at an old man's pace) is gona put a real crimp in the build. If all goes well (been down this road twice before), I'll get up the river for salmon fishin' come 1 Sept.


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## JPIII

An update. I was feelin' kinda puny this weekend & didn't get as much done as I planned...nuthin' new there. This pic gives a better view of the whole works and an idea of the basic plan.....got up on a step ladder. The upper section is all along the back wall but mostly covered with crap.....er....supplies & tools. .....


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## NIMT

Excellent view of all the workings! It's looking great!:thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## JPIII

I have the rest of today & tomorrow to get that cliff (the yellow bit) shaped up & coated. I'll be all messed up for a couple-3 weeks (minimum) thereafter.
God willin' & the creek don't rise, I'll get back to ya.


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## brik-el

Trust me the creek won't rise here in Eastern Ontario for some time! 
So in the words of Blue Lantern Saint Walker: "All will be well!"

Love that layout!

The switch-back intrigues me.


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## JPIII

I'm back on my feet without the wobblies. Actually went out in the shop and cleaned up much of the gawd awful mess I had made. I'm down 20lbs and haven't much strength or endurance but this is an improvement.
Time to get back to work on the layout.


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## JPIII

Picked this up yesterday.


Mod edit: Embedded picture


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## gunrunnerjohn

Very cool, I keep looking for one of these in O-scale, but they're always out of reach.


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## NIMT

Does it have sound?
If it does it should also have the firebox flicker too!
The only real problem these units ever had is the truck drive gears and you can get them for fairly cheap.


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## zorba

look forward to seeing how it all runs. i am also intrigued by the switch back.


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## JPIII

NIMT said:


> Does it have sound?
> If it does it should also have the firebox flicker too!
> The only real problem these units ever had is the truck drive gears and you can get them for fairly cheap.


I've heard about the trucks/gears. You're right tho, the gears are available.

I still plan on sending you the Heisler for DCC conversion.

The Shay may already have DCC & sound. I saw a vid of it running and it was making regular spit noises. The fella selling it didn't know much ,....it was from his late grand father's collection....he says. You may end up with the Shay also.


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## JPIII

I don't know what this Shay is supposed to sound like.

Here is a video of it:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjQD6flbxeU

Any opinions?


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## gunrunnerjohn

That doesn't sound like functional sound to me!


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## NIMT

Nope no sound in that baby, Yet, it sounds like it needs a gear kit too, that heavy wine and thumping are usually caused by a bad gear.
But videos can be deceiving on the real sounds.
Like I said easy fix, You can also go with the Brass gears if you really want it to work over the long haul.


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## JPIII

Great!:smilie_daumenneg:
Got the loco today and 2 of 3 trucks are stripped.
Parts are ordered to fix. I hope the pencil neck enjoys the negative feedback.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> Great!:smilie_daumenneg:
> Got the loco today and 2 of 3 trucks are stripped.
> Parts are ordered to fix. I hope the pencil neck enjoys the negative feedback.


You did say it was from his late grandfathers collection?
And he did not know much?

How was it listed? I would guess that he stated that he did not know much about them.
Edit,
Before negative feedback,
Contact him and maybe you can get a little off from the selling price refunded? 
I have done this on damaged items as we both did not want to go through the hassle of returning it and I ended up with a fairly good deal.

Did you get a good price?
With a little repair you will have a nice locomotive.:thumbsup:


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## JPIII

Read the auction ad:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/120966748043?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

I'll fix it & move on. The price was decent and even with the repair parts cost (less than 40 bucks), I'll not get hurt too bad. The bad feedback stays.

Adding DCC is going to increase the cost but I knew that up front. Gotta find out what DCC controller fits.... sound & what not is needed/wanted, just speed control. Any suggestions there would help.


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## Big Ed

I never had one or seen/heard one run.

The sound it made in his video did not sound right.
Unless I am hearing something else?

Did you contact him after you got it, or just leave the feedback?
You can't take it back now anyway.

Still a nice Loco for your RR after you fix it.:thumbsup:


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## Southern

He listed it as condition, "New". 

*New*
A brand-new, unused, unopened, undamaged item (including handmade items). Please see the seller's listing for full details.

It was not a brand-new, unused, unopened, undamaged item. He needs the negative feedback.

I work hard to list thing correctly.


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## JPIII

I had never heard one run either. You tube attached links to similar units in this case......then I heard/saw one that ran right......after I bought. That was my fault for not being more thorough in my investigation. 

Just left the feedback....the first negative I've ever done. I've gotten stuff off evil bay that I consider less than stellar. I am most often willing to give a guy the benefit of the doubt, but not this time.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> I had never heard one run either. You tube attached links to similar units in this case......then I heard/saw one that ran right......after I bought. That was my fault for not being more thorough in my investigation.
> 
> Just left the feedback....the first negative I've ever done. I've gotten stuff off evil bay that I consider less than stellar. I am most often willing to give a guy the benefit of the doubt, but not this time.



It doesn't sound right in the video, but like I said I never had one or heard one run.
If he listed as new then he does deserve it.

I still would have tried to get the price reduced first, at least see what he had to say about it. 
Did you contact him before the red dot?
I doubt it but who knows, maybe you could have knocked $75 bucks off it.


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## JPIII

big ed said:


> It doesn't sound right in the video, but like I said I never had one or heard one run.
> If he listed as new then he does deserve it.
> 
> I still would have tried to get the price reduced first, at least see what he had to say about it.
> Did you contact him before the red dot?
> I doubt it but who knows, maybe you could have knocked $75 bucks off it.


That is probably good advice but at the time I was seeing the "red mist"......that complicates things.

Like Southern I take the time to make damn sure my F/S stuff is accurately listed. The best surprise is no surprise ....in these cases.


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## JPIII

I'm starting to lay up the scenery on the switchbacks......with mixed results.
Much experimentation left to go. Comments/advice are welcome.


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## JPIII

Larger view.









Humm.....need more trees & stuff in there. 
This is supposed to represent fairly recent construction (3-5 years old) & reforestation by the owners of the RR. The difficulity is that in the PNW something will grow in any cleared off area....consequently, I need more stuff in there.


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## JPIII

I found this stuff growing on my cherry tree. The price was just right. It needs to go on my RR.......these 2 are about the size of a quarter.
The lighter green is natural and the other is painted.


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## sstlaure

Is that stuff soft or hard? If you cut those things up into "branches" they would be pretty easy to glue to twigs to make full-size trees. Glue those to the twigs, paint brown, then stretch poly fiber over it, apply glue and sprinkle on ground foam.

I just made some this weekend that way.

In Michigan when they reforest, the trees go into very orderly rows. There are tons of stands up North of 50ft tall trees lined up like a military brigade.

If 3-5 years old, then smaller trees in rows with ground-brush growing in pretty thick around them (they'd grow in due to the higher amount of light they get with the absense of the recently removed trees.)

I like the tree stumps.


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## JPIII

The stuff is moderately stiff, flexible enough that one can deform it with finger pressure.....some kind of lichen, me thinks.

The stumps are the best I have found......installed right out of the box. I gotta get more of em. I just fed all my tree trimmings through the chipper last week so I have no raw materials to make more.


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## sstlaure

I've actually found that branches from small, bramble type of bushes (densely clustered stems) make great tree armatures.


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## JPIII

I'm using that lichen as a stand alone bush. It does a fair imitation of what is locally known as "elk's tooth".....some kind of willow, I think, gets pretty big.....12' X 12' is not uncommon.


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## JPIII

Makin' stumps.
These have to be part of the scenery of a logging RR, I figure, so I need a bunch of em'. Being a CSOB, I'll have to make some.




























Let's see if this works......ah.

First ya need some old branches. Then a saw or two. The Zona/Exacto works for 1/2" dia. or less. For larger dias., I use a Japanese pull saw.
This seems to work with a bit of experimentation.

All the real stumps in my yard have turned various shades of gray with exposure to the elements so a bit of painting/staining is needed.
Those pictured are not painted.


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## gunrunnerjohn

I'm into power tools, so I'd take them down and put them on my table saw or the bandsaw.


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## Gansett

Second guessing myself that I sold my bandsaw. Been think about looking on Craigs list for a good used bench top unit.


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## dablaze

I have one for sale in Ottawa, Canada, shipping might be a drag!

Craig


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## Mr.Buchholz

Amazing work so far! If only I had that kind of space to build a layout! Hope to see more pictures of your progress!

-J.


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## JPIII

A band saw would be the ticket. I have a table saw & a chop saw. Either one probably would eat you up making these cuts. I passed on trying them unless one piece happened to fit up squarely against a fence. I've been working wood for 40+ years & still have all my fingers.


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## joed2323

Those stumps look great!!! The saw marks are perfect if you ask me, looks like a real chain saw cut through those stumps:thumbsup:


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## Gansett

Never trust a woodworker with only 9 fingers....

I think a 10 or 12 incher would be plenty for what we'd use a bandsaw for. If need be there's several woodworkers around me but I hated it when others asked to use my stuff so I expect they feel the same way and would offer to make any cuts needed.


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## JPIII

joed2323 said:


> Those stumps look great!!! The saw marks are perfect if you ask me, looks like a real chain saw cut through those stumps:thumbsup:


Humm.....I'll have to work on that. In the era I'm modeling they didn't have chainsaws.....just widow makers & axes.

I used a crosscut back when I was young, strong, & stupid....not to mention that my dad tole me to go cut up this huge stump next door. He did give some Kerosene to lube the beast through the pitch pockets...... Now days I have Mr. Stihl to help.....it even has an auto olier.


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## tankist

looks like it is going to be nice logging layout.
keep the pics coming


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## JPIII

I try to post (& picture) the progress (or foibles) folks might find interesting.
Over-exposure is boooring.
I AM looking for a smallish band saw..... After 40 odd years of doing without.


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## JPIII

I've been plugging away at this thing. Now that the salmon run is about over I'll have more time to devote to it. In response to a diminishing number of requests, Here's a progress pic.

I ought to park a train in the middle of this & take a pic.......tomorrow. What'cha want for an engine: Mallet, Heisler, Climax,0-6-0,the Shay is indisposed


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## Davidfd85

Salmon run? SALMON RUN !!! Damm its been so long since I lived in NY for the salmon and Steelhead runs. I am so jealous!!!
The only salmon I get now is from Lake Grocery Store.


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## JPIII

Davidfd85 said:


> Salmon run? SALMON RUN !!! Damm its been so long since I lived in NY for the salmon and Steelhead runs. I am so jealous!!!
> The only salmon I get now is from Lake Grocery Store.


Not much of a run this year. I started out hot....3 trips, 3 fish, & lost a few more in August, then things went to hell.. lost a few but then it went dead. Basically over by Sept 10.....just taking up space since then. I ain't greedy, 6-10 will fill the fridge with smoked fish & provide more than enough roe for summer steelhead.


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## joed2323

Those switchbacks look amazing:thumbsup: That has to be fun running up those backs with a load of wood!


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## Big Ed

That one stump looks big?
Redwood?


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## JPIII

joed2323 said:


> Those switchbacks look amazing:thumbsup: That has to be fun running up those backs with a load of wood!


I'll bet it is. If I ever get around to adding juice to the track we'll know fer sure.

Other than some testing on a separate board ( to experience DCC & 4% grade climbing), I've run no trains. I've taken to many personal turn outs (and added more) to concentrate on anything.


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## JPIII

big ed said:


> That one stump looks big?
> Redwood?


That would be a 200+ footer.
I live in the land of big timber and am modeling as tho it still exists (outside of National parks). The largest Douglas Fir (officially measured) in WA. was 396 feet tall. In Olympic Natl' Park I saw a Western Red Cedar 18 feet in diameter....40 years ago.....and yes, a huge part of my challenge is to model these monster trees.....and stumps....and live long enough to carry it off.


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## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> That would be a 200+ footer.
> I live in the land of big timber and am modeling as tho it still exists (outside of National parks). The largest Douglas Fir (officially measured) in WA. was 396 feet tall. In Olympic Natl' Park I saw a Western Red Cedar 18 feet in diameter....40 years ago.....and yes, a huge part of my challenge is to model these monster trees.....and stumps....and live long enough to carry it off.


Being on the East coast I am not used to seeing trees that big.
Are you going to put a few live ones in also?

I like the pictures where the road goes through a tree.:thumbsup:









This one is 315' high age 2400 years old.

Must suck if one falls on your house.


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## JPIII

I planted this tree (and the one next to it) in my yard 35 years ago. Considering it might live for 200+ years you should get the idea bout tall timber. 
BTW, that ain't me up the tree....I hired it done for the both of em'. That tree & its buddy were sucking the life outta my front yard & dumping crap all over my roof. .....


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## JPIII

As I threatened to do, pics. .....


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## jaymack1

Its a Hard Days Work.. and I've been WORKING like a dog.

Love the logging train!


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## JPIII

jaymack1 said:


> Its a Hard Days Work.. and I've been WORKING like a dog.
> 
> Love the logging train!


Hay, I did that for 46 years. Now, every day is Saturday.


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## joed2323

Im not sure if i missed it earlier but whats the percentage of the grade on your switchback?


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## JPIII

4% on the straights & 2% on the curve.
As yet unbuilt sections will be 2% as required.
The Climax has no trouble hauling 5 log cars up the 4%.
Didn't test the 2% curved section.


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## zorba

i would love to see a video of this, im curious as to how it all works.


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## JPIII

Heh, me too....

We're a long way from videos, half the foam & track isn't laid yet...not to mention NO juice to the rails. Progress pics will be all I have to offer for many moons. 

I have a bucket list (at my age all lists are bucket lists) for the work bench that is continually growing, winter's coming and there are chores to do around the house, I ain't gettin' any younger...the hospital stay didn't help out here..and I have a RR to build.

Last winter I about went nuts from a lack of things to do. I don't forsee that being a problem this year.


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## JPIII

I've finally gotten past the "had to do" section of the switchbacks and can move along towards geting this RR done. I'm still in a quandry as to what I'm gonna do above the SBs. I'm thinking maybe another 4 inches of height then a large piece of bare rock......I've never done rocks either. This seems like a good time. Maybe a fire look-out station on top the rock.....never scratch built a building either.....

Any hew, here's a couple pics.


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## sstlaure

Looks great.


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## New Berlin RR

Very nice!


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## JPIII

I'm building the base for my rock work. I thought this might be of interest to some of you'z guys.
As you can see, I use foam. I cover it with light weight joint compound then paint with latex.

Some pics:
There's the stuff I use.










Then slop it on doing the neatest job I can do with a putty knife. The glop is thinned with water to the consistency of cookie dough.










Then I go over it with a cheepo (0.99C ) paint brush dipped in water to smooth it out. Sometimes it gets sanded with 100 grit & sometimes not.










2 more layers of foam then we build a bloody big rock up top. I was thinkin' bout using a real rock but they weigh 80-120 lbs. Foam gets the nod again.
Stay tuned.


----------



## joed2323

Your doing a really nice job with your layout. Those switchbacks look awesome, must be fun running up and down them??

Those switchbacks sure do eat up alot of land though... 

I cant wait to see more progress with your layout


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## JPIII

Thanks for the kind words but I'll get better, I hope.....I am and will always be (hopefully) in learning mode till I take the dirt nap.
I rate it OK for first time attempt. I used to do some "pretty damn good" (but not expert) modeling of airplanes back in the 80s. If I can reach that level on a model RR I'll be a happy camper. The SBs do take up a lot of land but the federal land grant covered them.

Now I need to find a picture of a Granite rock from the Cascades (a big SOB maybe 100L X 80H x 50W ish) to model. I got some small width (less than 1/4") chisels that my late sister used to use on ceramics. They look like the cat's *** to me.. If I can keep from gettin' bogged down on that, no one will be more surprised than me.

BTW, I sent the Shay back to Bachmann for repair. They called & said "we don't make em' no more & got no parts to fixem'. Would you like a brand new 3 truck Climax W/DCC instead?" I already have one but "OK". 

I really want a Bachmann Shay.
Gonna be some horse tradin' going on here, me thinks.


----------



## JPIII

Well, Granite is out....WA. is short on that but Basalt is in.
I found some pics to model on and it seems to be a byotch to model.....the slow cool down stuff looks doable. I'm into the monolithic look.


----------



## JPIII

That lump up top is the guts of my rock. None of it will be visible.
I sent a good part of the weekend making octagonal columns which will cover this substructure......the pic for perspective. I'll post a couple more snaps tomorrow.

It'll grow to about 12 inches in height and 3 inches per side....and may get a little brother. .....


----------



## broox

Hey mate, beautiful work, been following this since the beginning. Love the switchbacks, don't see enough of them about the place 

It might just be me and my tired eyes, but are the trees pointing straight upwards, or pointing outwards with the contour of the land?

Pics of imagined side view. Sorry for the dodgy MS Paint work 










Real life comparison.


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## JPIII

The trees have suffered some abuse lately. I pulled off the painter's plastic (on purpose this time rather than have my shop vac do it) and they aren't to shinny as to plumb any more.

I'll fix'em after the thrash.


----------



## broox

"shinny as to plumb"?
autocorrect madness?


----------



## JPIII

Some of the bits for the rock. Probably about half of what I'll need (SWAG). Pure drudgery.
......


----------



## JPIII

The guts up top. I plan to build the rock on the bench. ......


----------



## JPIII

The trees are a bit jacked up. ......but the color setting on my camera is seriously jacked up. Probably time to turn on the flash.


----------



## Ranger

That's going to be a nice layout when it's done and big too. keep up the good work!


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## broox

Oh yeah the trees look more 'right' from this angle. Nice work. keep on crackin!


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## JPIII

A few random photos.....progress....well, maybe.










Capped off with this? ......









Got the lower section of track laid & starting the electrics.


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## broox

That is going to be an epic monolith :thumbsup:

Still cant get enough of the switchbacks


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## tjcruiser

I have to say ...

That looks just like the Emerald City from the Wizard of Oz!

...

Auntie Em! AUNTIE EM!!! There's no place like home ... There's NO PLACE LIKE HOME!!!

 :thumbsup:

TJ


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## JPIII

broox said:


> That is going to be an epic monolith :thumbsup:
> 
> Still cant get enough of the switchbacks


I've had quite enough of them, thank you.

I'm now thinking of an incline....as if them SBs weren't enough of a PITA.
I've read of them being up to 78%.....yes, %. I've got the room if not the foam. I've never seen one done.....that has got to be the only *good* reason to do one.hwell:


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## JPIII

I'm about 3/4 done with wiring up the semi-layout. With a bit of luck, I will be playing with trains today.....If I can remember how to work my DCC....which, other than tests some months ago, has been on the shelf.
I can only hope the magic smoke stays where it belongs.


----------



## broox

JPIII said:


> I've had quite enough of them, thank you.
> 
> I'm now thinking of an incline....as if them SBs weren't enough of a PITA.
> I've read of them being up to 78%.....yes, %. I've got the room if not the foam. I've never seen one done.....that has got to be the only *good* reason to do one.hwell:


ooh, on inclines, i ran across this in the past.
scroll down to the last section, section titled "Tram to Serve an Island Industry" -> link

It uses a triangle shaped car, hoisted/winched up a near sheer cliff face! theres a Proto refernce too!


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## JPIII

Thanks for the link....interesting but, in keeping with logging the PNW, I've found what I was looking for.
I scammed a few photos in.....stole them from a book I have. Logging inclines were fairly common on the West coast back in the day. ....










.....another. .....


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## tjcruiser

Wow! That's some incline! Hope the cable holds tight!!!


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## broox

impressive, i knew you'd have something from the logging world up ypur sleeve. the link i posted before was just the first thing thst popped into my head when you mentioned an incline 

That first pic is pretty awesome though. would have been quite the sight IRL. The old blokes sure had some ingenuity about them, given the technological restrictions :thumbsup:
I doubt we'll ever see something as extreme in our lifetime again, what with all the OH&S gone crazy in this day and age.
Thanks for linking that up, It is way cool. If you got more I'd love to see it


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## JPIII

Sure I have more.....but that's not important now.

My trains run!!! I had some pickup problems with the 0-6-0 at a couple of turnouts but the Climax blow right thru em'.....end to end. It is a little shaky in spots......the track was filthy. I cleaned it but it needs more, apparently, either that or the new loco needs a little break-in time. Prolly should check voltage "since I'm there".

Now that I'm an ace DCC guyit's time to put a decoder in the 2-6-6-2 & get that thing moving up the mountain. Got a decoder coming for the Hiesler. I Came across a step by step instruction (with pics) on which decoder to use & how to do the deed......and now that I'm an ace......I need to be deflated some.

I do have more incline photos. Their all B&W and don't scan very well(operator error?) but if you can put up with em' so can I.

After running em' up the switch backs I realized that I need a cordless controller or maybe a cable pull method for flippin' switches. No excuses for the poor planing.....


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## JPIII

I promised someone here ( some time back) I'd post a picture when I got my scanner fingered out.....it was actually an ignorant operator problem.

2nd pic down. Then old time loggers were a gutsy bunch.....inventive too. No OSHA inspectors around, I assume . ......


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## tjcruiser

JP,

A quick primer lesson on posting images ...

1. Insert URL's for images between coded tags like this:

{IMG}URL address of image{/IMG}

except you'll need to use SQUARE brackets instead of the curly ones.

2. Never put images (via the code syntax above) on the same line as other text in your post. Doing so will push the image well to the right of normal margins, and make the thread very difficult to read. Always put images (via code) on their own line.

3. Youve often been attempting to use "double" image tags ... i.e., reduntant uses of the stuff in brackets. Use just one set (prefix, suffix) for each image.

Hope this helps, and keeps things a bit easier to read.

(I fixed several of your posts above.)

Regards,

TJ


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## JPIII

OK, I can take care of the margins.

Since this software is so unwieldy I store my pics in an on site album ( which has it's own litttle "hoops") rather than on my computer....which is where they are stored for use on any other site of my 13 years of internet experience ....*except model RR sites*. Each of them have different "jump thru hoops" requirements.....so I thrash around and come up with *something that works* using the tools available.

I have no control over what the software does to get the pics to come up in the post. All I know is the site get to use up storage space to post my pics twice....otherwise ya get this.


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## zorba

if you use photobucket, when you are viewing an album there is BB Code under each pictures that you can copy and paste into your posts.


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## tjcruiser

Again, to insert an image directly into a post, you'll need to have in your post this:

{IMG}URL address of image{/IMG}

except you'll need to use SQUARE brackets instead of the curly ones.


TJ


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## JPIII

That is what I have been doing. Using the BB code as copied from my album as shown below (with mods so it shows up but doesn't make a pic)

[XXX]http://www.modeltrainforum.com/picture.php?albumid=233&pictureid=2473[XXXX]


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## gunrunnerjohn

Works fine for me.


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## norgale

Great pictures. Never saw an engine being pulled up a hill with block and tackle before. That is some hill. Bet there was a big steam driven winch on the other end of that cable. Pete


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## JPIII

The incline section of the book (Logging Railroads of the West) that the other photos are from has nothing like that. They show mostly wide gauge track being used. This book(This Was Railroading) shows what appears to be standard gauge track.....making it more likely I'll model something like it....maybe an 8-10 foot spur.

I came up 8 columns short on the Basalt monolith. Since I gotta make more nohow & just happen to have a few steam donkeys/winches...bear with me as I talk myself into this.hwell:


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## JPIII

The rock is built but not yet attached....I dunno if I like it or not.....kinda large.
It's open to modification suggesstions.Too high? Too long? Cut the bottom on an angle....all of the above?










Laid some more track over the weekend for the lumber-mill-to-be.










I also need to come up with some right color/size/shape scree (talus).
Nothing I've seen F/S is gonna make the grade. I do have some shale & a BFH
to reduce it to the proper size.....the color is spot on.


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## tjcruiser

Re: "the rock" ...

Looks OK, I think ... needs a significant buildup of rubble/sloped boulders at its base, conducive to errosion, cliff-slides, etc. If you do a Google image search on "butte", I think you're base core is on the right track.

Cheers,

TJ


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## sstlaure

tjcruiser said:


> Re: "the rock" ...
> 
> Looks OK, I think ... needs a significant buildup of rubble/sloped boulders at its base, conducive to errosion, cliff-slides, etc. If you do a Google image search on "butte", I think you're base core is on the right track.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> TJ


Make sure you've got the spelling right on that google search or that kids aren't around - you'll get some GREAT pics I'm sure.:laugh:


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## JPIII

tjcruiser said:


> Re: "the rock" ...
> 
> Looks OK, I think ... needs a significant buildup of rubble/sloped boulders at its base, conducive to errosion, cliff-slides, etc. If you do a Google image search on "butte", I think you're base core is on the right track.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> TJ


Ayup, I have the color if not the talus......see shale in my last post.


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## raleets

I'm just about to finish up my river and start building a mountain on my layout and decided I wanted to get into the "rockie" look a little bit, but I wanted them to be as authentic as possible.
There's a small landscaping company near me that sells all types of rock materials so I took a visit last week and scored plenty of cool stuff for my layout for a grand total of (ready for this?) a whopping $3 bucks!
I got crushed limestone (all sizes) that I hand picked, real slate, lava stones in several shades, and other assorted rocks that will fit right in.
Now I have to cruise the internet for some good layout photos to use as inspiration. That's a high-class way of saying COPY! :laugh:
Anywho, there's bargains out there for great scenery materials.
Bob


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## JPIII

Good, I love to see guys using stuff that is readily available.....and cheep is even better.

I smashed up about a cup full of shale in 10 minutes today.....then went & put a decoder in my mallet....and it works. No one was more amazed than I. All the magic smoke is where it belongs....for now. Even I can finger out NCE controllers. Idot proof is gud.

Now it's time to do the Heisler.....(act 2)


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## raleets

Truth is, the guy at the stone yard was a little embarassed to ask for the $3 bucks. #2 truth is, it was close to lunch time and there's a Burger King on the corner!
Bob


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## JPIII

Took the Heisler apart to swap in the decoder......uh, oh. No circuit board.

So much for that good deal. Anybody want a "good deal" on a DC only, Rivarossi, two truck Heisler, with Kaydee couplers.... in great condition.....only disassembled once.

This DCC ace just got shot down in flames.hwell:


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## gunrunnerjohn

You should be able to stick DCC into that, why not do that?


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## JPIII

gunrunnerjohn said:


> You should be able to stick DCC into that, why not do that?



There is no circuit board in there, just a motor. One could buy the board, if he knew which one went in there, I think, but hooking it up????? I PMed Sean to see if he could help.


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## gunrunnerjohn

I'm sure Sean can fix you up, many people convert conventional locomotives to DCC.


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## JPIII

gunrunnerjohn said:


> I'm sure Sean can fix you up, many people convert conventional locomotives to DCC.


I hope so. I really like the loco and jumped thru all kinds of hoops to put knuckle type couplers on it. That shoulda been pretty straight forward, eh?....NOT. The coupler variations for that year (post 94, pre 94, 93, 95)... ad nauseum. I finally hit the combo. I would suspect that a circut board would be a similar trial....it is Italian, after all.. Nice lookin' sucker tho....it is Italian after all.


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## gunrunnerjohn

JPIII said:


> Nice lookin' sucker tho....it is Italian after all.


Hmm... If you say so.


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## JPIII

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Hmm... If you say so.


I'd bet she'da knocked your sox off 20-30 years back. 
There was this Italian redhead girl that I used to know.....drop dead beautiful.....she'da been the death of me.hwell:


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## lears2005

How much you want for the cheap loco


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## JPIII

lears2005 said:


> How much you want for the cheap loco


I'll get back to you after I hear from Sean, but it wouldn't bother me if he wants to double what I have into it. If I decide to sell it you'll see it in this thread first. Now days they are asking a bundle on the bay for DCC ready Heislers....$250 for the one I saw.


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## JPIII

Zee rock.....she is painted to match the color of the broken up shale.


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## JPIII

Sean says he can do the DCC conversion on the Heisler so I won't be selling it. I still have that Climax, tho & will entertain offers.


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## lears2005

You got any pic of it


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## JPIII

lears2005 said:


> You got any pic of it


On page #9 of this there's on one of the 2 I have. The other one is identical except all black/no markings. I'd sell either.


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## JPIII

Tough week in loco land.

First there was the Heisler.....that is semi-sorted, or will be when I send it to Sean.

Got the new 4-4-0 modern from Bachmann.....with DCC on board.
Set it on the track for programing the thing. "Cannot read CV" , the NCE tells me.....not gud, for starters. Try again same result. Put a running loco on the track.....humm, all up to snuff there.....so is the second loco....Humm, track is OK Try the new loco again. It reads the CV for a bit....then quits. A mild case of frustration is setting in. Checked all connections again. Programmed it again ignoring the non-readable CV.....nada....so, I'm fooling with the engine on the track & hit the headlight button...nada....more foolin'....and the light comes on....Tired to throttle up & the light goes out.....that got a colorful conversation going between me & me. Wiggled the loco & the light came back on and it moved! Then it quit...but now I know the programing took.
I'm wearing a hole in my hair scratching at my haid......but there signs of progress.
Finally found the cause. The pickups on the tender axles aren't touching evenly (or at all in some spots) giving me intermittent power. 
This sucker is brand new in a sealed box. The pickups were bent cause someone didn't put it together in the proper sequence, as I see it. 

Now what? I can prolly fix it but if I damage it while taking it apart I'm on the hook. The pickups can't be straightened in place. I'll talk at Bachmann tomorrow.


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## JPIII

I sorted out the 4-4-0's problems with 0 help from Bachmann. Now it runs fine but the headlight don't work....it did but it quit. 

Kinda jacks me up having to fix a brand new loco and getting no help from the manufacturer.I have 4 Bachmann locos. I'll think mighty hard about ever buying another. Their customer service was too busy to talk to me or return my calls......there is a clue there.


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## Mr.Buchholz

That rock looks totally evil 

-J.


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## JPIII

My RR is in tree eating mode. Most of the last couple weeks have been dedicated to feeding it and I made a small dent in its appetite.

Most of these are store bought. I'm making a few but it's a slow process.
The latest has foilage made of Caspia but that is not ready for prime time.. I have yet to flock it.....still sweet talking.


----------



## gunrunnerjohn

You must live in the Pacific Northwest, lots of pine trees.  Looks great, I think you've about satisfied it's appetite.


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## JPIII

gunrunnerjohn said:


> You must live in the Pacific Northwest, lots of pine trees.  Looks great, I think you've about satisfied it's appetite.


Sure, only a 2-300 more to go and bigger. Maybe 50 to 80 under 12 inchers for the hill and 200ish for the area along the wall ....I'm thinkin' 2+ footers there. This will may take a bit of time as I can't afford to buy them.


----------



## JPIII

A pic of my first Caspia tree. I have my own critique of it, let's hear yours......don't be shy, I have a thick hide.

In the second pic is the trunk of big'un but I think I'll do another shorty to get my proportions better.


----------



## joed2323

I think you did a hell of a job making your trees!!!! :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Details please, how did you make that nice looking tree

That looks better then store bought.

Be proud of that tree, because i want one 

I only know how to make bottle brush trees, so please give me some details

Your trees in the background, are these made with furnace filters?? those looks very nice


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## JPIII

I cheated.

The trunk is a "Super Trunk", I got the stump off the evilbay, Caspia From Michel's....a LCS (local craft store). 6 bucks for a big bouquet.

I mated the trunk to the stump with a cut off 2 inch T pin, drilled holes & glued em' together with the help of a #11 x acto blade to fair up the sides. On larger trees I use a cut off 16 penny nail. With either you can just "stick" the tree into the foam....I do that on the bench to hold the tree when drilling holes for the branches. I paint the branches & glue them in the holes. 

The tricky part is selecting the right size & fullness branch for the right spot on the tree.
That is where I think I screwed the pooch on this one. I thought the flock would make the branches fuller.....it did, but not as much as I thought.
The canopy is too wide and not full enough near the trunk, me thinks.
I can fix that ....next time.

It took me about 10-12 (or more) hours, spread out over several days, to get this first one done. I hope to get better & faster, but it still is gonna be a time killer. I'll get some super glue to speed up the process. I also need the "right" sized drill bit. The .054 is too large and the .030 , while right for the small branches, is too small for most of the rest..... .040-.045 would be good.

The tree on the left is a furnace filter tree. I only made one......it didn't cut the mustard.....tho it looks OK from 10 feet........but not at 10 inches.


----------



## JPIII

I built another tree. I learned some stuff the first time around and the one on the left is mo better......it took me only half the time for this one. One more little one, then a big un'


----------



## joed2323

Im jealous. great job


----------



## JPIII

A snap shot of some progress......trees, Basalt & static gass all in one shot.










Closer.


----------



## txdyna65

Wow, great job on it all, I may have to try a caspia tree, or at least see if I can find some, not a darn thing wrong with any of your trees imo


----------



## JPIII

I came across a mini evergreen bush at my mom's place last week......it was a "hummm" moment. The weather was a "winter mix" coming down like cats & dogs so it was a quick "Hummm". I harvested a shopping bag full thinkin' this has possibilities. It is drying out in the shop and may be some great fir/pine/cedar limbs ( or maybe just "good enough")with no flocking required....tho the green is much too bright (I have paint). I gotta fool with it some......


----------



## tjcruiser

JP,

I like the progress on your basalt ... the rubble/stones at the base looks nice (good coloring!), as does the bushes at the top. That said, the vertical rise looks to crystaline / perfect to me. Sharp edges, crisp inner corners. I don't think nature is quite that perfect, on a scale this size. I might suggest poking the face with a nail or an awl, or even a textured lava-stone from a BBQ grill. Something to ding up the surface a bit, and make it look a bit more weathered / fractured. Maybe a bead of caulk in some of those inner corners, too, to soften those up a bit?

Just talking / thinking out loud here ... you're call, of course!

TJ


----------



## JPIII

How many pictures do you want of real life formations? 

Basalt formations do indeed make these crystalline formations, sharp edges & all. Basalt lava flows form them as it cools from "liquid" to solid with far more symmetry than I can model. I chose a hexagonal shape but they form shapes from 5 to 12 sides with tight seams....up to 12 feet across the faces. Goggle is your friend...punch in Basalt formations ..I've been there a bunch.
I have yet to see anybody model them....probably because they are such a PITA. I have more coming.

You're right tho, it could use some more roughing up.

It took a large investment in time to get this far and I don't want to get too bogged down...I've got a RR/forest to build & a 19 X 3 foot area of benchwork that is naked. I have to get past the switch back area as access to it will be limited when I build the other side of the rock. I am badly bogged down even now but I will have access to the front for "refinement".


----------



## tjcruiser

JPIII said:


> You're right tho, it could use some more roughing up.


That's all I was getting at ... something to add age and errosion to Mother's Nature's handiwork.

TJ


----------



## JPIII

In the interest of science......tho I have no idea exactly what this stuff is, it's green and needs to be a tree.
Tain't perfect but.....close enuff so I'll use it & see how a big'un looks.
I painted it a darker green for the ready to go bin.


----------



## JPIII

A big'un. I'm not totally happy with it but I'm getting close.


----------



## Ranger

I like it!!


----------



## JPIII

BTW:

Any one in the Portland, OR /Vancouver, WA area is welcome to stop by my place......if only to swap lies. It'll get you a tour of my RR and the benefit of my 6 month's experience in model railroading.

A PM will get the info you need.


----------



## N scale catastrophe

Trees are looking good,much better than the ones I pulled out of the UPS box yesterday!


----------



## JPIII

N scale catastrophe said:


> Trees are looking good,much better than the ones I pulled out of the UPS box yesterday!


One word of advice: Architrees

The best store bought trees I've found. Available in sizes up to 14 inches.
He (treedad) was my semi-secret source but that cat didn't stay in the bag.

I'm done buying now.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Limited-Sto...305549?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item460b6b814d


----------



## joed2323

Agreed. Its too easy to make your own that look as good if not alot better then store bought...


----------



## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> Zee rock.....she is painted to match the color of the broken up shale.



When you first posted your rock I was going to say that they either look like organ tubes or anthill tubes.

I figured I would say nothing.

Now that you added to them I think they came out great.:thumbsup:
Are you done with them or just taking a break?
I do think a little more aging/weathering/cracking them a little would make them look all the more better.
Nice job I am not used to seeing that kind of rock formations in Jersey either.
After you yelled at TJ I went and did a Google of them and read up about them. Looked at pictures of them too.

Good job on your trees also.:thumbsup:

The railroad? 
Is there an railroad on the table?


----------



## tjcruiser

big ed said:


> After you yelled at TJ ...




Sometimes I deserve it!



TJ


----------



## JPIII

tjcruiser said:


> Sometimes I deserve it!
> 
> 
> 
> TJ


I didn't yell at TJ....THIS IS YELLING

Nope, not done. More trees, & rocks. Once in a great while my various projects come together....like the tree/static grass/rock picture. Till then it's scatter shot. Yeah, there is an RR here somewhere but I haven't run any trains for a week or so. I think of myself as primarily a modeler and trains are just part of the model. They run so there is no modeling to be done for now but their time will come....as will the dozen or so structures, spar poles, lifting gear...yada waiting on the shelf.

Got another tree semi-done....aren't you glad you asked?


----------



## JPIII

I luv steamers.


----------



## NIMT

JPIII said:


> BTW:
> 
> Any one in the Portland, OR /Vancouver, WA area is welcome to stop by my place......if only to swap lies. It'll get you a tour of my RR and the benefit of my 6 month's experience in model railroading.
> 
> A PM will get the info you need.


UMMMM Can I get a snow check!


----------



## BK R

I've just finished reading this thread, what a top read, great work too, I've had the idea of doing a zig-zag (Aussie talk) on my simple layout but decided against it.
Good to see another timber worker on here, I've pulled a crosscut saw a few times, much rather the chain saw.
If you're interested here's a bit about my great grandfather and his brothers, they ran 3 shays and a climax.

http://www.yourbrisbanepastandpresent.com/2011/05/laheys-timber-tramway-canungra.html


----------



## JPIII

NIMT said:


> UMMMM Can I get a snow check!


It was snowing lightly but has quit. Not much (1/2inch?) accumulation.
East of here is often a different story. The Gorge gets nasty this time of year...but you prolly know that.

It's below feeezing now (2030) so anything falling from the sky is gonna be a problem.


----------



## JPIII

BK R said:


> I've just finished reading this thread, what a top read, great work too, I've had the idea of doing a zig-zag (Aussie talk) on my simple layout but decided against it.
> Good to see another timber worker on here, I've pulled a crosscut saw a few times, much rather the chain saw.
> If you're interested here's a bit about my great grandfather and his brothers, they ran 3 shays and a climax.
> 
> http://www.yourbrisbanepastandpresent.com/2011/05/laheys-timber-tramway-canungra.html


Thanks for the kind words. When (if?) my talent catches up to my expectations, it'll get better.

Loved the term in that link...."free settlers". I thought all you Aussies were a bunch of ex-jail birds.....but good to have at your side in a dust-up.

Hay, got another pic.

BTW, all these trees are mobile....just stuck into the foam about an inch or 2


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## txdyna65

Luv the steamers too, and dang thats alot of trees already lol


----------



## JPIII

If I can build an average of 2 large trees a week (like those 2 in the background) for a couple of years, I should have enough.

Building trees for 2 hours a day is about all I can stand.


----------



## txdyna65

I havent started on trees yet, doesnt sound promising lol


----------



## JPIII

Hay, it's something we old retired guys have time for....if I live long enuff.

I haven't decided exactly what to use for foliage.....Caspia or the other stuff (someone told me it is maybe Asian or Oriental pine). Timewise it's a toss up.
Either way you gotta drill holes for the branches then glue them in place.
I use drill bits of .030, .045, & .054 then trim the ends for a tight fit if/as necessary. Ayup, it's a fiddly PITA....but not as bad as working for a living.


----------



## JPIII

Skid road construction on the North side of the rocks.


----------



## broox

Do you plan to step up the density of the current rows of trees?
We've got few pine plantations around here and they're as dense as heck. But they're not 'natural' trees like you're most likely modelling.


----------



## JPIII

I'm done tree farming.
To match the practices of local tree farms, I would have to triple the density of my plantings. That doesn't interest me much.

From here on I will be doing large trees, stumps, and pucker brush. I will have to go back and add a lot of slash to the tree farm areas. I can see 3-5 years of work to get this thing close to "done".


----------



## Big Ed

I see that you added more Rock.
The trees look good.:thumbsup:

Do you have track running under the mountain, in the next to the last picture of the side shot where you can see under the mountain shows a tunnel portal. 
Is that a dead end in there or does the track run under the whole mountain?

Looking good.:thumbsup:


----------



## JPIII

Yes, the track runs in & out of the mountain. Go to page 11 for a view of the underside. The track is in now with juice to the rails.....tho I haven't run a train for about 3 weeks. Too much construction (mayhem?)going on.. It would take me a couple hours to clean the rails.

Ayup, added rock. That is the nice thing about foam..... just get out the knife to fix it....even if It ain't broke.


----------



## JPIII

Got the skid road roughed in. Some salad & junk can come in later.


----------



## BK R

I like that, grease 'er up now and let 'em shoot.


----------



## tjcruiser

That's excellent, JP ... great use of the topography ... the skid almost comes to life.

TJ


----------



## broox

whoa, that is cool lookin!


----------



## JPIII

There are several ways of building a skid road.

Some have something similar to what I've done but have decking in the crotch for horses/oxen to do the pulling, some have both decking & iron rails as guides...some with/without decking and a steam donkey. Some with logs laid perpendicular to the direction of travel, horse Ox, Steam donkey....a corduroy road jobbie.....but you need pretty flat ground....and prolly a few I've missed. All need greasing.

Or you can just drag em' thru the mud. Sometimes they just dropped 5-10 logs between train rails & pushed them with a loco. Them old boys were nothing if not inventive. I still have to build & install a boom crane/spar pole and the donkey for operations.


----------



## TrainTex

Wow Great thread, great work.


----------



## JPIII

Thanks, glad you enjoyed my first layout. I have.

I've started on the upper section (19 X 3 feet), so more is to come. I need to build more real estate so I have room for the 200ish trees I gotta build.
Came across a new method of building big trees. They look better than those I've built so I'll have to give that a shot. There's an "end game" here somewhere......

Going to put an incline up there....just because I can (I think) and that will gain another 12-18 inches of height.


----------



## TrainTex

Well i subscribe to this thread so i am along for the jurney


----------



## JPIII

Had a case of ugly break out up in the NE corner of my layout. I'm not gonna panic...yet.


----------



## joed2323

lets see some more pics of your layout! I like what i see so far


----------



## brik-el

Yeah, lets see a pic of the whole thing. If you can and want to that is.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


----------



## TrainTex

joed2323 said:


> lets see some more pics of your layout! I like what i see so far





brik-el said:


> Yeah, lets see a pic of the whole thing. If you can and want to that is.
> 
> :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


Yea!!!! That would be cool!!!!! Good thought guys


----------



## JPIII

Not many changes since my last overall picture. I couldn't get the whole works in a pic where you can see the new stuff......you picture hogs are gonna have to put up with this minor inconvenience.hwell:

I ran out of foam and gotta wait for pay day to get more. One more 2 inch sheet ought to do it. I got to do a lot more hacking on what is there.....turning a mess into a gawd awful mess.


----------



## brik-el

Awesome.

Can't wait for a video to see this in operation.


----------



## JPIII

This is really gonna get messy. I'll be throwing away a can or so of expanding foam in the shaping process.


----------



## JPIII

Progress.


----------



## 05Slowbalt

Wow looks great. Keep up the hard work. Looking forword to more pictures.


----------



## JPIII

BTW, if anyone is following along with an eye towards land building.
In the upper right of that last pic is a piece of drop cut off from the EX foam.
Don't throw pieces of that ilk away. They make excellent undulations in otherwise flat panels......glued on, shaped, & coated. I've got a box full of them.....so many that I can be selective as to which ones I keep.

My boys discovered a rich seam of coal in the area just passed the sanding block in the pic. I have 3-4 coal fired locos....a spur line is warranted.


----------



## JPIII

Plugging away. The humidity is at 89%. It'll take 3 days for the spackle to dry.


----------



## sonofjp3

Looking good DOD


----------



## JPIII

Howdy, son. Stop by any time.


----------



## dannyrandomstate

The layout is really taking shape! No pun intended.


----------



## JPIII

I think I've found a method for making trees with a built in stump..the one on the left.


----------



## JPIII

The hill & creek are also coming along. Hogged out the creek bed with a tool I made.





















BTW, if anyone wants some freestone river bottom it's free for the price of shipping......USPS flat rate box of your choice.
I got at a pea gravel bar during low water last summer......more than I need.


----------



## JPIII

Plugging away at this section. Slow but not steady.
I do have a plan for the top. I'll get going on it after my afternoon nappy.


----------



## joed2323

Saaaaweeeeett:thumbsup::thumbsup:

That looks really good so far, impressive


----------



## brik-el

Awesome!
:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


----------



## JPIII

Thanks, fellas.


----------



## timbre

JPIII said:


> The hill & creek are also coming along. Hogged out the creek bed with a tool I made.


I'm guessing that this little contraption works along the same lines as a hot knife.... How well does it work? I have a few extra solder guns laying around that I could convert... What did you use for the tip? (what kind a metal)


----------



## JPIII

The tip is made out of an old coat hanger.......hi-tech, eh?

It doesn't hot enough for me without some help.....it'll cut, but sloooow.
I use a propane/butane gas hot plate (one of them Coleman jobbies) to help it out, then it's good for 6-8 inches of cutting fast.


----------



## Fighterpilot

Creek bed is coming right along. Anxious to see the finished product. Keep up the good work on the scenery. Just love your big trees. They look fantastic.


----------



## JPIII

Gotta make a couple of bridges in the best logger tradition.....rails & ties over trees.. Since I've never made one ( there's lots of stuff I've never made) it'll take some time.

The trestle up the incline was a "wing it" deal....I'da used tree trunks but I needed a curved slope....so it looks kinda stop-gap, which fits right in with logging RRs. As long as it doesn't look expensive, it fits.

Had to walk away from building trees. They're driving me to distraction. If I get happy with one, I'll get after em' with a vengence.


----------



## NIMT

I wanna see your river bed material!


----------



## arv79

>


Who makes that flexible styrofoam gradient you're using?


----------



## JPIII

NIMT said:


> I wanna see your river bed material!





arv79 said:


> Who makes that flexible styrofoam gradient you're using?


Sean: 
I have 3 sifted down and 1 raw grades.
Youre good for a freebie. The raw can be sifted down to various grades of sand.....if ya got the mesh.










arv79: I use this expanding foam.....doors & windows as it is the best at avoiding large voids.....tho it still has a few.


----------



## arv79

No no, I meant this thing marked in red. Thanks!


----------



## JPIII

OH......duh....
That is a Woodlands Scenic grade riser. That particular one is 4%, IIRC.
They are not cheep ( bout 20 bucks for a 4 foot lenght) but work slick.


----------



## JPIII

I came across a vid worth watching.....if you're interested in logging "in the day". About 45 minutes so get comfortable. You may have to scroll it to the start.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFoqbU5XKL4&feature=youtu.be


----------



## NIMT

I Love natural building materials!:thumbsup::thumbsup:
I will have to hit you up for some river material when I get a little closer to needing it!


----------



## Prospect193

NIMT said:


> I Love natural building materials!:thumbsup::thumbsup:
> I will have to hit you up for some river material when I get a little closer to needing it!


Nah!! I was gonna say something damn funny but it's just too easy!!!:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:


----------



## JPIII

NIMT said:


> I Love natural building materials!:thumbsup::thumbsup:
> I will have to hit you up for some river material when I get a little closer to needing it!


Whenever, I'm in no danger of running out and I have more than I need sifted already....just don't try using it for balast.

I hadn't been to that gravel bar on the East Fork for 10-12 years. Now here's a parking road & parking lot within 100 yards of it......which tells ya why I quit going there.


----------



## JPIII

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WHvofTZ6aM&feature=player_embedded>
Working on this.

This came out less than ideal.....dunno why.
You'll need to copy/paste to make it go.
No sound, unfortunately

fixed.

Just another logging vid.


----------



## BK R

Thanks for that first video, it's a ripper.


----------



## JPIII

I'm glad you enjoyed it.

On another subject, I got most of the track work for the incline & mine laid.


----------



## Fighterpilot

That's a pretty steep grade on that incline. What's going to pull up that grade?


----------



## JPIII

A steam donkey for both up & down.


----------



## Fighterpilot

Got a picture of that puppy, I have to admit, I have no idea what a steam donkey is. Down here in Louisiana, we just float the cypress tress down the bayou. I'd love to see what it looks like. When you get that in operation, you will have to post a video. I'm sure we'd all love to see it.


----------



## JPIII

It is a mobile steam powered winch.

I have yet to see one in HO that actually operates......so I'll have to fake it.

There are some in operation on those vids listed in this thread....all those hi-line & skidding operations are run by them. They were usually anchored to a handy big tree or stump.


----------



## wvgca

if you want to cut your foam a little faster with the soldering gun, you can use a piece of ordinary household copper wiring, like 14/3, i've been using that for solder guns tips for many years, it's not as stiff as coat hanger, and easier to bend into custom shapes, and the price is a lot less than 'factory' tips...


----------



## JPIII

I have more cuttin' to do and some 14/3 up on the shelf. I'll give it a shot, thanks.....I can always use the butane burner on that too.

Free is a very gud price.


----------



## wvgca

if you have the same type of soldering gun as i do, weller 100/140 watt, i dont think the burner will be needed, 

enjoy.....


----------



## JPIII

I do and the burner is need...oh, it will cut without it.......but I'm getting old and don't have the time to wait for it. Even using the burner, the element cools off within a 6-8" cut to the point where "times-a-wasting". 30 seconds or so over the burner gets it back in the game. I've probably done a couple-3 hundred yards of cutting using this method.


----------



## wvgca

what i meant was that with the bare 14/3 wire, you should not need the added heat that is required by using coat hanger...
if you have some 14/3 and a bit of time, try it, i think you will find that it works quite well, that method has worked quite well for me for several decades, and i do appreciate the low cost tips, i usually get about 2 to 3 hours of 'full on' time per tip at 100watt, about half of that when using full power 140 watt with my solder gun..it also has a built in 'low heat' feature, if it cools too much, the tip bends back, lol


----------



## JPIII

wvgca said:


> what i meant was that with the bare 14/3 wire, you should not need the added heat that is required by using coat hanger...
> if you have some 14/3 and a bit of time, try it, i think you will find that it works quite well, that method has worked quite well for me for several decades, and i do appreciate the low cost tips, i usually get about 2 to 3 hours of 'full on' time per tip at 100watt, about half of that when using full power 140 watt with my solder gun..it also has a built in 'low heat' feature, if it cools too much, the tip bends back, lol


First let me say I'm a cynical soul, but if I tell you I'm gonna try something, I do it.

My soldering guns are a D-550, max wattage 325 & an S-500, 250W.

I found the #14 was too small in diameter to make good contact at the gun mounting.....so I tried #12.
The copper started changing color in about 30 seconds.......hello, I says. 

Hookie smookie (the smoke part is literal), batman, that sucker cuts like mad and just keep going.....both guns.

No gettin' around it, that is a great tip! (said the cynic) The copper gets much hotter than the steel of the coat hanger.


----------



## wvgca

its a pretty good solution, got it from a cranky old fart that used to fix tv's, a few dollars saved meant another case of beer for him, lol ... it's easy to make a lot of 'special shape' tips, even for real small projects, and a $40 spool of wire should give around 1200 tips, at 3 cents each, it's real easy to justify a 'new shape'...and a bonus, you can even use them for soldering....

..enjoy..


----------



## JPIII

One thing I am going do is hammer/grind that #12 wire into a good shape for soldering drops & rail joiners. I've never liked those tips I got with the guns.


----------



## Fighterpilot

When I was building large scale radio control aircraft, many of the wings were foam core, so in order to cut out wheel wells, split flaps, and slots for spars and wires, I used the same method with the copper wire and a Weller Solder iron. Worked great.


----------



## JPIII

I'm in a bit of a holding pattern right now, My right hand is all swolt up & hurts like hell.....dunno what I did to it but it didn't like it and has been talking to me constantly for 3-4 days now.

I sent the Hiesler off to NIMT on Monday for a DCC decoder and he put it in the mail back to me on Saturday......damn, now that is a turnaround time to luv.
While we were at it I had him pick the bits to re-motor, DCC, & do lights on the Box Cab and send the whole works to me......all at a very reasonable price. I'm not "special", just normal customer service for Sean, me thinks.

Come Tuesday/Wednesday, I'll have something to do. The bum hand can do light work.

I'm down to the last 6-8 feet of real estate building for the layout.
The hand is hors de combat for that type of work. I tried some yesterday....NOT.


----------



## Raptorman83

Sorry to hear about the hand. I pulled a Hamstring last week, so I know how it feels.
Do you have any pics of your whole layout so far. It's hard to piece parts together from your photos.


----------



## JPIII

Raptorman83 said:


> Sorry to hear about the hand. I pulled a Hamstring last week, so I know how it feels.
> Do you have any pics of your whole layout so far. It's hard to piece parts together from your photos.


It's tough to get it all in one shot but as this as an overall is about the best I can do. The back right is the last bit of ground work to do. I know,.....I know, it's a mess.


----------



## Raptorman83

Love it!

I wish I had ceilings that high... 

Question: is there another mainline leading to the "back" of the layout from the switching yard? Or is the tunnel the only one? If that makes sense.

Also: you could take a picture standing on a ladder or stool to get the back of the layout in view.


----------



## JPIII

The other tunnel portal for the loop is behind the cardboard box.

The plan on the lower right "flats" is a lumber mill and the spurs are for that.
A train can go from way back up in the hollow to the yard without using the main line. A small town will be a step up & to the left of the lumber mill.
There is also a spur on the far side below the town to pick up lumber loads & passengers.

When it's all in one pic it's tough to show all trackage.


----------



## JPIII

Raptorman83 said:


> Also: you could take a picture standing on a ladder or stool to get the back of the layout in view.


Ya mean like this?
This pic didn't make the cut yesterday.


----------



## Raptorman83

Yea. I got the idea now.

Do you have storage for extra trains under the switchback?


----------



## JPIII

Ayup, look back through this thread.


----------



## Raptorman83

JPIII said:


> Ayup, look back through this thread.


I found it!! Page 11. Questions answered.

New question: how many hours a week do you spend on it?


----------



## JPIII

Most every day I do something of a few hours..... have a pellet stove in there and it takes a while to warm the place up. It's been cool/cold for bout 5 months now. Very seldom do I get 6 hours in there when it's cold. I can't (or won't) afford to keep it heated 24 hrs a day. Spring is gonna pop one of these days.......


----------



## Raptorman83

Right on. My basement is a bit on the chilly side too. So ill run the space heater when im down there.

I try to get in an hour or two a day if I can. More on the weekends. Basically however much I can get away with before the wife notices.


----------



## midlifekrisiz

Raptorman83 said:


> Right on. My basement is a bit on the chilly side too. So ill run the space heater when im down there.
> 
> I try to get in an hour or two a day if I can. More on the weekends. Basically however much I can get away with before the wife notices.


lol mine comes down and informs me what time it is :thumbsup:


----------



## JPIII

Had to go dig up this thread........I've been slackin' on the MRR front.......but I have some excuses..

My hands/wrists were/are all hosed up for about 6 weeks....dunno why but there ya go. Their back to bout 60-80% depending on the day of the week, it seems. The weather got nice (80s) here lately and my semi-healed hands got all the work they could deal with+. I'll stick with these.......

I did get a little work done on the RR. I'm down to the last few feet of realestate. One nice aspect of foam construction is that if you don't like your first run-thru, change it. I did & you get a pic. The creek bed wasn't wide enough for my "seldom seen" cribed trestle so I dug out my hot foam cutter
thingy.....made a hell of a mess......hay, it's what I do best.


----------



## JPIII

Ah figured I'd show youz' guys a pic of my latest loco.
I bought this months ago on the Bay. Rivarossi 1994 model year I think. Putting knuckle couplers on it led me to that date.....was a stinker.
No DCC but I know this guy......

It turns out to have a single axle electrical pickup, nor was it DDC ready.....more later. The first shot halted at all my insulfrog TOs. With more of Sean's help, a decoder with "keep alive" technology solved that problem. Now it's a sweet runnin' SOB.

I have a problem in the colder months keeping track (& wheels)spotlessly clean that DCC seems to demand. No full time heating in the shop apparently causes condensation on the rails. With the "keep alive" bit less that perfect cleanliness is acceptable. This a vote for TCS decoders. :thumbsup:

The pic also made the name choice of my RR for me. It was a toss between up 2 local features, Salmon Creek or Burnt Bridge Creek lumber co.


----------



## JPIII

In the limited amount of time I have today for the RR.....the first sunny day this week but all that rain don't slow down the grass none.....I'm layering in detail for scenery on the switchbacks. Just hope I have enough layers. All I have to guide me is a bunch of B&W photos of those gawd awful messes. As someone wrote, modeling chaos and making it look right is a bytch. If I get a big enough mess this weekend, I'll post a photo....no matter how bad it looks.


----------



## Big Ed

Same here, first sunny day in a while.
Besides the grass, it doesn't slow down the weeds any too. :thumbsdown:

It amazes me as you try to grow plants and they won't.
But I can pick a weed out and the next week it is back twice as high laughing at me.

Funny thing too is after the hurricanes roll through I have picked up new weeds that must have blown up from the storms. Weeds we never had before! More weeds!

I am still waiting for our Cicadas invasion to start.
For those who don't know,
http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/After-17-years-love-is-in-the-air-4422368.php
They say if you cook them right they are good, a delicacy in certain countries. 
Maybe I will barbeque some on skewers. 

Your mountains are coming along nicely I like the color.
The RR names? 
I like them both. :thumbsup:


----------



## JPIII

big ed said:


> I am still waiting for our Cicadas invasion to start.
> For those who don't know,
> http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/After-17-years-love-is-in-the-air-4422368.php
> They say if you cook them right they are good, a delicacy in certain countries.
> Maybe I will barbeque some on skewers.
> 
> :


Spoken like a true omnivore.....if it tases good,,,,, gulmph.
Never got off on insects tho.......


----------



## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> Spoken like a true omnivore.....if it tases good,,,,, gulmph.
> Never got off on insects tho.......


I had some chocolate covered ants and crickets once. 
Crispy critters, they chewed sort of like rice crispies, they snapped, crackled and popped when you chewed them.


----------



## JPIII

I drove up to Kingston, Sequim & back home over the last 3 days. Squim is on far the North end of the Olympic Peninsula for you living outside of Washington.
Saw a lot of trees.....
One spot clearcut approx 10 yrs ago (WAG) was left with some trees scattered about rather than cut with the rest. It gives a good look at the growth pattern of densely packed second growth (I assume 2nd).......lotta trunk with sparse, narrow foliage for the top third. 100'+ tall......much more sparse than what I have made.......but green at the top. Gonna fix that.

Also spotted just one "mushroom tree" (I'm told there were 10-12 of em'). A tree topped bout 40' up with a great freakin' rock balanced on top.......some loggers with a sense of humor & some spare time on their hands , I'm told......the rocks were BIG......8-10 feet across as a guesstimate from 500+ yards [email protected] 60mph. I gotta throw a couple of those into my model mix.

I'd never seen tall (80'ish) spindly Madronna Trees (an evergreen with leaves) like those. Those I grew up with were monster things, 6-8' at the base with a 100+' canopy......give or take. Yeah, it rains up that way.

Next week I'll take my camera.

My sis & I put mom in a nursing home, hopefully for a short time....mom is 93 (& 65lbs) and life is growing short now. I'll be making the trip pretty often, me thinks.......but I'll get to look at trees for 250 miles each way.

She has earned the right to die where she wants (that would be at home) and not in a nursing home.....but she needs some rehab. & help right now. What's a son to do?


----------



## sstlaure

JPIII said:


> She has earned the right to die where she wants (that would be at home) and not in a nursing home.....but she needs some rehab. & help right now. What's a son to do?


Have you considered hospice care? She'll get the help/support she needs for her remaining time and will also get to be home where she wants to be.


----------



## JPIII

sstlaure said:


> Have you considered hospice care? She'll get the help/support she needs for her remaining time and will also get to be home where she wants to be.


Yes, that is the eventual plan.....but we gotta get her somewhat mobile first.

The pros in the home won't let her just lay in her bed like her soft hearted children did......"they" led us to where we are now. Her vital signs are good but mom's getting tired of the whole gig. It's tough to watch her "life force" ebb away. The spirit is leaving but the body don't know when to quit. The medical profession apparently doesn't know how to deal with that it seems......but I'm new at this.


----------



## sstlaure

Went through that with my Grandmother. She was able to die in her own bed with her family rather than in a hospital. The hospice workers we had basically made her comfortable - we all knew what the end result would be and that there wasn't any hope for rehab. It was all about making the final days pleasant and comfortable. Her cancer had taken all of her strength and there wasn't any point in trying to force her to be mobile. 

Good luck JPIII


----------



## JPIII

Plugging away at this thing.
Here's about 3 sq ft of clutter....only 147 sq ft to go....not to happy with the first 3 either. ......


----------



## wingnut163

maybe because it is laying the same way. unless it was from a storm.


----------



## JPIII

Yeah, it's tough to get right....even tho it is chaotic.
Theoretically, stuff is pushed off the grade or fell off cars.....so I dropped (where possible) stuff from a few inches above and that's how it fetched up.

I welcome the observations tho.......how to make chaos look realistic is a stinker.
I haven't got the answer.


----------



## Big Ed

I think it looks good. :smilie_daumenpos:

In your picture maybe the top line needs a little more debris?
And down the bottom it looks too clean? No debris down there at all.

A couple of guys with axes might look good, along with some elk peeking through the trees up top? 

But I like it. :thumbsup:


----------



## JPIII

The only place that is close to done is between the two lower tracks......even that needs more junk, particularly at the top of the upper rail.....per the old photos I'm looking at.

The input is gud, keep it coming. This is a quest for the perfection of clear cut chaos.

When we get to untouched old growth chaos we'll do this again........


----------



## Big Ed

JPIII said:


> The only place that is close to done is between the two lower tracks



After I hit the submit button and went back and looked that is what I figured was the reason for the clean spots.

Some Elk, Mule deer, whitetail deer. maybe a bear or mountain lion, whatever you have out there would look good walking around too. 
BIGFOOT? :thumbsup: 

One thing that doesn't look natural to me is the size of the stumps.
But, I am not accustomed to seeing 1000' trees around here in the east. 
I do like the way you made them. 
Free trees stumps.:thumbsup:


----------



## JPIII

I was rootin' around in my old book with old pics. I came across this ruby which exemplifies my end game at the RR once we get passed the prelims.....the switchbacks.

This is the best pic I have (for now) showing some old growth in the PNW and the RR is just passing thru to get at the good stuff. 

I'm doing a photo-freelance RR and working off old B&W photos of this ilk.....that don't scan well. The lack of color doesn't help. Yeah, it's my bed and I made it so I can't complain. I'll have to open up the gap some to get my 1:1 hands in there.


----------



## Big Ed

I forgot what year your going after on your layout.
Some nice old pictures. 

It would have took me most of the year to chop this sucker down! 










From Washington State, 1900









From Idaho, 1911. Shows some debris.









Washington State 1919.










Snoqualmie Lumber Co. logging train, ca. 1890


----------



## JPIII

Great pics, Ed, thanks.

I've been freely spreading the request for info on the net. A few fellas question my selection of....tree stumps, for instance, as too large. Pics like these are educational......but when you gonna show some big ones? 

A friend was searching for firewood in OR several years ago and came across a Cedar tree cut down 100 + years ago (WAG).....and was apparently too big for them old timers to get out of the woods. The heart wood was perfect. Too large for him too....short of dynamite, to split it into smaller chunks......at that then too large for any chain saw at his disposal. It's still where it laid. I've seen a Red Cedar growing in Olympic National Park that was 18 feet in diameter 35 years ago. These monsters (among other varieties) were not uncommon from the pics I've seen.

Redwoods aren't the only trees that get huge. Scanning in pics is a PITA and choosing which ones to scan is also.

BTW, I'm doing 1920 +/- 20 years.


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## JPIII

A link worth having. Killer photos from a pro....and lots of em'.

https://www.google.com/search?q=dar...0BIv8iQKZ9IGoCA&ved=0CDAQsAQ&biw=1600&bih=799


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## tjcruiser

JP,

I think the fallen-tree / limb "chaos" looks great. It all adds a sense of time and action to the scene.

Best of luck to the family in dealing with your mother's journey. It's a chapter of life, of course, but never the easiest one.

TJ


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## JPIII

tjcruiser said:


> JP,
> 
> I think the fallen-tree / limb "chaos" looks great. It all adds a sense of time and action to the scene.
> 
> Best of luck to the family in dealing with your mother's journey. It's a chapter of life, of course, but never the easiest one.
> 
> TJ


Thanks.

It is getting filled in more better but it is painfully slow. I have probably 60-80 sq ft that need "the treatment" and am happy with 1 sq ft at present. I'm working on "tufts" for now, grass & bushes and learning as I go. 

We (my sis & I) are trying to make mom's final chapter as painless as possible ....for all.
An impossible quest, I think, but it doesn't mean one can't try. Her vital signs are good but the will to live is ebbing away.


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## JPIII

I finally have a small area on the switchbacks "done" (as in it'll dufur now) just big enough for a short train.

Anybody know the legend of Dufur Oregon? .....


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## JPIII

Normally this wouldn't wig me out but I'm down to the last 3 feet of layout and I ran out of foam. Now I need less than half a sheet to finish off what I had planned.....looks like the plans have changed. Some higher hills perhaps? An N scale layout? A Roman coliseum?
Grumble, grumble.......


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## Big Ed

Anybody know the legend of Dufur Oregon?

What is it? 

Did you spell Dulfur right?


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## ktcards

JPIII said:


> I finally have a small area on the switchbacks "done" (as in it'll dufur now) just big enough for a short train.
> 
> Anybody know the legend of Dufur Oregon? .....


Dulfur Oregon...

The Multnomah name for Mount Hood is Wy'east. In one version of the legend the two sons of the Great Spirit Sahale fell in love with the beautiful maiden Loowit who could not decide which to choose. The two braves, Wy'east and Klickitat, burned forests and villages in their battle over her. Sahale became enraged and smote the three lovers. Seeing what he had done he erected three mountain peaks to mark where each fell. He made beautiful Mount St. Helens for Loowit, proud and erect Mount Hood for Wy'east, and the somber Mount Adams for the mourning Klickitat

???


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## sonofjp3

Looking good DOD, can't wait to see it in person.


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## JPIII

Nope, Dufur, Or.

Settled by the Dufur brothers.

The legend I heard was: While they were on the trail to the Willamette valley, a wagon wheel broke which brought out the response "This'll dufur now." The wheel became a fence gate for the farm..


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## JPIII

Foam rocks.

Read the book, saw the movie, got the T shirt, now for making em'. I have a vauge idea of how.....










Then we have to paint em'. More uncharted territory. The thing is still mobile. Under that mess is the last bridge & bits of track work. Gonna be a cribbed bridge with a TO on it.


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## JPIII

I took a small vacation rom the RR bussiness to build a hot rod. Laying on a concrete floor for10-12 months is tough on anyone, it's worse on an old guy. The car is now road worthy and about as "done" as a model railroad. 

Winter is coming and this old guy is looking for something to do and I would like up a bit higher......where the heat is. Off comes the painter's plastic over the RR.....humm, not too many sipiders in here & certainaly enough to do for 6 months. I'll ease off the hot rod & power up the RR construction. Might even clean the track & see if the DCC still works.

I've looked at my stash & decided it have too many locos. 3-4 is plenty, don't need 6-8. Gotta thin the herd and attack it with*some* logic. I need structures not pulling power.


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## JPIII

I'm making some more trees. Probably have 6-8 hours in them now. All stumped, painted, & ready for limbs....that is the time killer.


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## JPIII

Time to move on to the next tree. This ones a dufer.


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## gator do 65

Why's the "stang" covered?


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## JPIII

Sanding a taper on those trunks makes a hell of a mess, the dust goes everywhere & the car's hood ain't on yet.....it's a dufer too.
It does make a good object for the auto-focus of the camera....the contrast is good also.


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## norgale

I use a belt sander with a dust collector bag on it. Lay the machine up side down and hold the trigger on with the button. Then take your time with the sanding. I make masts and yard arms like that for ship models. very little mess. Pete


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## JPIII

I have a sanding disc on my table saw (on the blade mount). The taper on the trees is about 12 inches long, the disc on the saw is about 10 inches which means 5 inches sand up & 5 inches down. The 5 inches up is the problem...but I didn't have my dust collector attached. That is a fair amount of wood turned to dust (X 6 trunks) and I didn't think it thru.
One thing I'm sure of....I ain't buying another tool .....but I will use those I have in a better fashion.


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## norgale

That's great JP. Should work just fine. Don't know why I never thought of that. What's the base or do you just use an old saw blade?


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## JPIII

norgale said:


> That's great JP. Should work just fine. Don't know why I never thought of that. What's the base or do you just use an old saw blade?


Aw, jeese. I got the disc rig back in my finish carpenter days.....bout 25-30 years back.
The sanding pad is a stick on widget, the backing plate is not an old blade but a purpose built steel disc.....and I can't remember where I got it....but it sure as hell wasn't at a big box....prolly some specialty store like Wood Crafters.

I still have all my fingers....the saw blade could work, but I do want to keep the fingers....even tho they don't work as well as they used to.

Sears maybe.


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## norgale

Shouldn't be hard to make a blank to stick the sand pad to. Still a great idea. Pete


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## JPIII

Sure, I have several old fine tooth carbide tipped blades.
A saw sharpener outfit ought to be to knock off the old tips.
IIRC, the stickey pad had a peel off back. .....and this one has lasted for 20 years at least.....


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## Model Train Structures

Excellent account of your layout. It's looking guuud, and I'll be following your progress.

D.A.


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## JPIII

It's about time to do some kit building. I think a fire lookout up on top of the basalt rocks would be cool. This seems to me to be no small chore....with all the access stairs and ladders, not to mention the trees (not installed yet) that will need to be topped.
I do have a kit for the lookout....but I never have done much in the way of assembly/painting/weathering/yada. Can't be rocket science, EH?

Hay, when in doubt, grab a handful.
A old pic of my foundation.


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## norgale

It's not rocket science and even I can do it. You just have to grab the kit and do it. It always helps to follow the directions. Ha!


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## JPIII

"directions"? What is that? Some of that stuff at the bottom of the box with all the fiddly widgets? Don't sound like guy stuff to me.


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## norgale

The directions are what you read after you screw up the model and don't know why.


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## Model Train Structures

norgale said:


> The directions are what you read after you screw up the model and don't know why.



Norgale, you took the words out of my mouth! LOL

D.A.


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## Greg903

Your layout is sharp. I really like shays and wouldn't mind doing a logging layout one day. Cool to come across another dirtbiker as well, see your from Washington, RV fan?


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## JPIII

Greg903 said:


> Your layout is sharp. I really like shays and wouldn't mind doing a logging layout one day. Cool to come across another dirtbiker as well, see your from Washington, RV fan?


MY dirt biking days are long over. I still thought I was indistructable back in those days. I was lucky getting away with no long term damage. Had some fun tho.

No RV for me, I'm still into Hot Rods.....tho I'm old enough to know better.


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## JPIII

I got the lower structure of the lookout pretty much done. It don't fit on the rocks worth spit. Ooops, lemme see them directions........


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## norgale

SPIT? Did you say "spit?" Ya I think that's what it said. Ha.


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## JPIII

Well, let's face it, "saliva" just doesn't roll off the tounge.....er...wait....


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## norgale

HA! Good one JP.


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