# Layout before actual laying



## bluenavigator (Aug 30, 2015)

Using Atlas Planning Software (Scarm, isn't what it is called?), I tried to stuff as much as I can in this little 4 x 6 table. Thoughts? Might have very little room for scenery..:goofball:


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

I'm assuming this is n scale or at least ho scale but back in the hay day not modern day??

Sorry, I do not know your limitations/room size


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## A&NRR (Aug 2, 2015)

I like the idea of being able to run three trains at once. Although my personal preference is less track and more scenery, but that's just me.


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## bluenavigator (Aug 30, 2015)

Yes, it is for the HO model. The table is 4' x 6' that I have. 

Just realized one minor problem. I could not get the loco back from inner loop to outer loop, unless I get the loco in reverse and vice versa. Also, the center loop will not go to either inner or outer loop. It will stay there forever. 

Back to drawing board.


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## broox (Apr 13, 2012)

do you have any ideas about how you might like to operate the layout?

do you want to run it in loops and watch it go round past the scenery, or would you like to have places for the train to stop and swap cars at industries, etc.

how many trains at a time?

HO Scale? edit. Nevermind I just re read your post about HO


Cheers


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## bluenavigator (Aug 30, 2015)

I would like to have train running in a loop or two, plus railyard as well, with housing to hold several locos. 

I am considering have a loop on "cliff", which might need a bit longer track than inside the said space. It would be at the one of the corners.

I might consider to add another 4 x 6, making it into 4 x 10 with 2 x 4 on side, in "L" shape. Have to figure out the space in one of the bedrooms. Adding 4 x 8 is a possible.

I saw somewhere about the idea to have a shed outside of the house, housing the whole railroad modeling. That would be cool but in Texas, I do not want to deal with the heat without any A/C. I do not think that heat agree with the railroad modeling.


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## A&NRR (Aug 2, 2015)

Having a train house in the backyard is my ultimate goal. Your right the Texas heat would be deadly to a model railroad. My plan is to insulate the walls, 5/8 sheetrock, ceiling fan with a window unit a/c. A 15x20 would be perfect, if I convince my wife.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

bluenavigator said:


> Yes, it is for the HO model. The table is 4' x 6' that I have.
> 
> Just realized one minor problem. I could not get the loco back from inner loop to outer loop, unless I get the loco in reverse and vice versa. Also, the center loop will not go to either inner or outer loop. It will stay there forever.
> 
> Back to drawing board.


You can use SLIP SWITCHES in the middle oval that would give
your trains the choice of going from outer oval to middle or

Here are pics of several used on real railroads.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=railroad+slip+switches&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-001


You can solve the track change direction problem by simply
changing, say, the bottom crossover so that it is opposite of
the top one...the two effectively form an X. That way your trains
can easily go FORWARD in and out of any oval again using
a SLIP SWITCH in the middle oval.

I do have a concern tho about that inner oval. It's radius
is going to severely limit what loco you can run on it.
Anything more than a very small steamer or 4 axle diesels
won't make it.

Don


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

A couple of thoughts here:

1) SCARM and the Atlas track planning program are not one and the same. SCARM is a fairly robust track planning tool created and supported by a hobbyist. If you really resist spending money on software, use SCARM. Or you can look at commercial programs. The Atlas program limits you to using their products. They're decent quality, moderately priced, and widely available, but there are other (even, dare I say better) options out there.

2) You have some fairly ambitious plans for what you want to put on there. At this point, my opinion is that you have too much track for your area which, as Don pointed out, is going to severely limit what you can run, train-wise. This will also be a problem if you aspire to realistic operations and / or scenery (if not, it's not such a big deal). Consider breaking out of the "standard plywood rectangle" paradigm -- around the walls with peninsulas or lobes is a much better use of space. Consider, a 4x6 layout with 2' wide aisles all around is 24 square ft of layout in 80 square feet of room; a 2' wide layout around that same 80 foot area, with a donut hole for access, is 48 square feet of layout in that same area, with the possibility for more.

3) Keep reach in mind as you plan. Most of us can't really reach more than 30" in from an aisle. Even that isn't comfortable, and you run the risk of damaging scenery details or disrupting trains when you do try to reach in that far.

4) I strongly advise against building a model railroad in a non-environmentally controlled outbuilding. Extremes of heat and cold are not kind to either operators or equipment.

Don't worry, though, there's lots of help here to back you up.


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## bluenavigator (Aug 30, 2015)

Enlarge the table is an option for me as it is possible. I had checked the height of the current table. It is only 28" high. I am able to reach back edge, which is 4 feet. without any problem. 

Considering "L" shape table, I could make it 9' long and 9' wide. Uh-oh, just realized in the corner area, it would be something like 5 2/3 to back of corner. Guess, the "manhole" has to be place in there, is this better solution?

I think that this one is the best solution that I think so far...


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Is a U shape with the open end toward the door possible in your
space? The two ends of the U could be 4 feet wide and accomodate
a radius suitable for most locomtives. That would leave what
appears to be about 3 feet of access space between the U ends
where you could have your controls.

With this design you could install a lot of yard and spur tracks. 

If you plan to use DCC, I would recommend a single track main basically
following the table edge with possibly 3 passing sidings where you
could locate passenger stations. I enjoy this kind of layout because
you must actually run the trains, one going clockwise, the other
counterclockwise. But, when you run only one train you can sit
back with a cool one and watch it go.

Don


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

You can use a lift-out or drop-down access port to reach far areas that you can't access from the front. Put a building or scenery on it and it looks like it belongs.


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## bluenavigator (Aug 30, 2015)

For what I have, they are all diesel locomotives.

Only two more locomotives that are not in photo below:

Bachmann DDA40X UP 6922
Athearn Hi-F Southern 6789 (trying to find out which model...)

I know DDA40X is too large to roll on 15" radius and I am not going overboard with that.


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## #HOGAUGEFORTHEWIN (Sep 2, 2015)

HELLO I AM NEW JUST GOT PERMISSION TO POST REPLY :appl::appl::appl::appl:


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## A&NRR (Aug 2, 2015)

#HOGAUGEFORTHEWIN said:


> HELLO I AM NEW JUST GOT PERMISSION TO POST REPLY :appl::appl::appl::appl:


Welcome aboard, this is a great forum with great guys.


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## #HOGAUGEFORTHEWIN (Sep 2, 2015)

A&NRR said:


> Welcome aboard, this is a great forum with great guys.


I know i have been reading :smilie_daumenpos:


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## bluenavigator (Aug 30, 2015)

"U" shape table..... hummm... That is doable with 2' x 6' for railyard....Humm....

Will keep that in mind and figure what would be placed in these area. Will start to work on 4'x6' first then expand from there.


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## broox (Apr 13, 2012)

Maybe look at something like the "Heart of Georgia" layout for inspirration - if you can use the room a little bit more permanently. 
It starts with a single 4x8 mdf sheet, you make a few cuts and turn it into an around the room style layout. much larger mainline run, more scenery options, you could even add an extra piece of mdf sheet to create a wider section to get a usable yard if you want.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

28" height is a fairly standard height for a table. Unless you have kids, it's lower than most of us build. We like our trains up where they're easier to reach. My legs are 52", putting the track level at 56". Puts the trains closer to eye level, but it also saves my back from constant bending while I work.

You say you can reach the back of the 4' sections. I can too, on my son's 36" high layout... but I can't do anything useful back there, save snag something with my fingertips and drag it closer. I also have to lean on the front of the layout, which would destroy any scenery or trains there. 

Might want to rethink that reach and height.


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