# Rivarossi 4-8-4 - Help identify the year



## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

Ok - so I posted earlier about my $50 score. Got it in the mail today. What year is it? I don't see the older style motor sticking out the back of the cab. Also, there's a round rubber piece hanging off the wheel in a pic - what is that and can I just cut it off?


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

And my other score - $3.75 plus shipping from ebay. Rivarossi w/ knuckle couplers, metal wheels, etc.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

sbeck80 said:


> And my other score - $3.75 plus shipping from ebay. Rivarossi w/ knuckle couplers, metal wheels, etc.
> View attachment 20539


 Just found out this little sucker already has lights in it!!


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

Can post more pics if it'd help too - I'm not finding any dates on this thing. Wheels are completely clean, nothing is missing - looks totally unused.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

The deep flanges tell me it is a late 70s offering...nice score.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

shaygetz said:


> The deep flanges tell me it is a late 70s offering...nice score.


I assume that rubber piece is a traction thing for the wheels? There's only 1 just hanging there - no other wheels have one. Can I cut it out? This train will just run on a circle w/ no grade to it at all. Any other ways to identify it? Is this one of those where the tender is glued shut and adding DCC/sound is a major pain?


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

Too small for a traction ring and a traction tired driver must be replaced with a regular one or the groove will have it slipping. The tender is a closed shell so you won't be able to put sound in it.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

You should try to take pictures in focus, helps a lot. Even if you have to move back a bit, it's better than the fuzzy ones you have.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

How about these? Better camera, altered image sizes:


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

MUCH BETTER! Nice and clear! 

You do appear to need to replace the traction tires, they're missing off one side. You should replace them in sets anyway, and once they peel off, they rarely work properly again.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

What's odd is that the wheels on the other side have no grooves for any traction tires. Only 2 wheels do and they both have the black rubber tires on them. Still thinking it's a late 70's?


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

that looks just like my old one i just sold on ebay LOL

it's a 1983 model it's the only year they did # 836


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

sbeck80 said:


> What's odd is that the wheels on the other side have no grooves for any traction tires. Only 2 wheels do and they both have the black rubber tires on them. Still thinking it's a late 70's?


That's more than a little odd I would imagine. On curves, I'd expect it to act differently depending on which side they were on. I've never seen a locomotive with them only on one side.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

sbeck80 said:


> What's odd is that the wheels on the other side have no grooves for any traction tires. Only 2 wheels do and they both have the black rubber tires on them. Still thinking it's a late 70's?


Yup...still do...the flanges are too deep for their later offerings, that they are .039" puts them right in the park, '83 would be about right.:thumbsup:

They used the engine to pick up power on one side. Since traction tires did not help electrical pick up, they only put the on the non-pickup side.


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## sawgunner (Mar 3, 2012)

here is a web site that has all the locos Rivarossi did to include years, model, product number and a little history

http://www.rivarossi-memory.it/ENGLISH_VERSION/Riva_American_Locos/Riva_American_Steam_Locos.htm


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

So here's another question for the experts: how do I replace the headlight? The current one has burned out. How do I open this puppy up? I'll replace it with an led and resistor which is easy enough. Anyone have pics on how to do this? Thanks for all the help and great answers! You guys rock.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

It won't be far off from their 2-8-4 Pere Marquette...one screw down thru the stack or nearby, one screw up under the cab...http://hoseeker.org/AHMRivarossiassembly/ahm284bershirepg1.jpg


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

shaygetz said:


> They used the engine to pick up power on one side. Since traction tires did not help electrical pick up, they only put the on the non-pickup side.


Learn something every day. Of course, my knowledge of things HO is so limited, that's not hard.  I'm confused though, I thought you had to pick up power from BOTH rails on HO, what am I missing?


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Learn something every day. Of course, my knowledge of things HO is so limited, that's not hard.  I'm confused though, I thought you had to pick up power from BOTH rails on HO, what am I missing?


The other leg is usually picked up in the tender...the standard is, engine right rail, tender left. Your high end stuff tends to use all wheels at all points as pickups though, with a more diligent use of insulation. It is not at all unusual for older Life-Like and Bachmann steam from the 70s and 80s to have it all in the engine with the tender just along for the ride.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

Think I got this puppy wired with a new light last night - interesting that they basically use the entire weight as the + conductor. I soldered a wire to the tab that touches the motor (that's connected to the weight), to a resistor, to the led, then the - to the metal tab that the bottom of the old light was touching that I removed. Everything with heat shrink tubing and electrical tapped-off to prevent shorts. Didn't get a chance to test it last night, but learned a lot taking this sucker apart last night. Wow - tons of small pieces, very detailed engine. I'd have no idea how to wire for dcc in this either - no room for anything they way they have it put together.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

shaygetz said:


> It won't be far off from their 2-8-4 Pere Marquette...one screw down thru the stack or nearby, one screw up under the cab...http://hoseeker.org/AHMRivarossiassembly/ahm284bershirepg1.jpg


Found out there are just 2 screws underneath it that will do the trick - there are no screws at all on top. Also found out that the front plate just comes off for easier access to the light bulb. Very clean design on this loco, I'm super impressed so far. My kid loves it too, which make it even cooler!


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

shaygetz said:


> The other leg is usually picked up in the tender...the standard is, engine right rail, tender left. Your high end stuff tends to use all wheels at all points as pickups though, with a more diligent use of insulation. It is not at all unusual for older Life-Like and Bachmann steam from the 70s and 80s to have it all in the engine with the tender just along for the ride.


Interesting... In O-scale we try to pick up power with every wheel we can.


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Interesting... In O-scale we try to pick up power with every wheel we can.


 
newer , and older high end HO will use all the wheels for power and traction but not the older, low end stuff.


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## Southern (Nov 17, 2008)

sbeck80 said:


> I'd have no idea how to wire for dcc in this either - no room for anything they way they have it put together.


 
easy, just put every thing in the tender.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

Southern said:


> easy, just put every thing in the tender.


I've read that in these models the tender is extremely well glued shut. Any ideas how to get it open? And what about wiring between the engine and tender?


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## petey (Aug 12, 2012)

Hello Sbeck80,
OK, you know the year of manufacture, 1983. Many times the road number is a good clue, as with these mass makers, some numbers were only produced during a limited time.
The little ring looks like an alloy washer that is seen on driver axles, or at the attachment points on the driver rods.
If the motor isn't at the rear of the tender, it's been changed out, maybe an upgrade.
For a take down, parts schematic, go to HO Seeker; look up literature-Rivarossi. I may have even sent some of this info to them.


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## flyboy2610 (Jan 20, 2010)

This may help you figure out how to get the tender open:
http://www.wiringfordcc.com/hropen.htm


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Soundtraxx makes a nice plug that fits in between the loco and the tender!


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## RUSTY Cuda (Aug 28, 2012)

Good score, I've been watching those on ebay going for around 150 bucks .
Don't wanna steal your post but if info is flowing I have a question on my pieces, any signifagance on the numbers on my 2 gray engines # on both is 836 & the 2 black ones are both 8444 I don't see the engines in back of cab either they have a detailed plate in there. Thanks ,Rich.


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## petey (Aug 12, 2012)

*4-8-4*

Deleted


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## RUSTY Cuda (Aug 28, 2012)

OK really confused, I see by some engines that rivarossi & ahm are the same, where does bachman fit into this ???


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## petey (Aug 12, 2012)

*Fef 4-8-4*

Cuda, 
Forget my recent post. If a Rivarossi UP 4-8-4 has a backhead, it is a more recent version.
AHM imported Rivarossi models. These are earliest versions.


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

Mine has that detailed back plate! Motor looks brand new as well. I am having problems getting the new led headlight to work now though- it just flickers and doesn't stay on constantly. I think the metal tab that touches the motor for power isn't staying touching the motor. Can I run a wire from the back of the motor directly to my + for the headlight, bypassing that tab?


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## sbeck80 (May 14, 2012)

NIMT - could you pm me for what you'd charge me to add sound and dcc to this thing?


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