# Brand New Tender Won't Whistle - Help



## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

Hello- Everyone. I'm new to the forum but, have been collecting Lionel, American Flyer, Ives and Marx trains since 1970. I just purchased a Lionel # 561 0-8-0 Pennsylvania Switcher from Ebay along with a Tender fitted with a whistle and a Pennsy Caboose (Non-Illuminated). This was a set break-up and I intended to give to my newly wed son so that he can start his own tradition of a train running under the Christmas tree. I tested the Engine and it cycled properly with headlight and tons of smoke. I then tested the Tender to check the whistle and nothing happened. I can see the unit through the sound opening so I know ones in there. I used a mint Post-War 1044 Transformer (90 watts) with alligator clips.Because I'm not familiar with the newer Lionel motorized products I'm at a loss as to why a brand new whistling Tender won't work. I was hoping to get an answer here before I attempt to take it apart or request a replacement from the seller (lol). Can anyone advise me out there? Thanks,bucky22750


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Does it have an air whistle or an electronic one?

I know my BSA 0-8-0 has an electronic one with an ON/OFF switch underneath. Check to make sure yours is turned on.


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## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

There is no switch on the Tender. There are two switches on the Engine, one for direction lock and the other for the smoke unit. Why would you want a switch on a whistling Tender anyway. Doesn't that defeat the purpose of having that feature on the Tender? Anyone else have suggestions or knowledge about the tender ?


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## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

I'm not sure but it has a gopple-goop relay (multiple wires,resistors etc) on top of the air chamber so I guess it would be Electronic. Do you suppose this will only work with a new Transformer i.e. PowerMax Plus, the one that was issued with the set originally


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Now that you bring the subject of the transformer up, that could be it. I know the sounds/whistles in my newer locomotives don't really work with my PW 1033 (which I really only use to power my grandpa's postwar set) transformer but it sounds the postwar whistle tenders just fine.

The electronic whistle in my locomotive is real annoying, I usually shut it off


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## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

Thanks for the info. I just purchased a new 80 Watt transformer. That should do the trick.You know, when I started out collecting nearly 40 years ago it was expensive but I knew what I was getting. I learned to repair most anything Pre-War or Post War Lionel. I suppose if I continue collecting it will be from those eras and my son can deal with the more modern era trains.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

It's still an expensive hobby, but with the economic downturn we've been having for awhile now, I've been finding a lot of decent deals.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Bucky,

I'm an old-school Lionel guy, not a new techie-gizmo Lionel guy. So I'm going out on a limb here a bit ...

Traditional whistles operate via imposing a DC signal on top of the normal AC track voltage. The DC "boost" voltage toggles the relay switch in the whistle to turn the whistle motor on. A DC of about +1.5V will trigger a whistle relay. A DC of about -1.5V will trigger a bell relay. (I'm saying that from memory ... I hope I have that right.)

Because a whistle relay needs positive DC to operate, you need to make sure that:

1. Your transformer (or whistle controller) is, in fact, outputting a +DC signal, and ...

2. That your power leads to the track are not inadvertently reversed. The +DC should be sent to the middle rail, not the outer rail.

Just for kicks, try flipping the power leads to your track, and see what happens.

Regards,

TJ


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## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

Hey - I tried as you suggested, nothing . I eveen hooked up a Tyco HO transformer (DC) out on one side- nothing. I'll have to wait and try it again when the new transformer comes in. I was using as mentioned before a Lionel # 1044 but, I never heard of DC votage coming out of a Lionel Transformer. Maybe I'm missing something but I've had enough trials for the day. Thanks for your suggestion, bucky22750


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

I still don't know if you have an electrical or mechanical tender whistle.
You need to read the manual. To find it, do you have the set number? 6-30089 The Lionel site should have one to view.


It does.

It appears to be a mechanical whistle.

The engine has been made for about 25 years. Some do have electronic tenders.
A year of manufacture would help find a parts diagram.


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## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

Hi- This item as mentioned before was a set break-up. The set # is 6-30096 mfg date is 2008-2009. The set name is Pennsylvania Keystone. I have the engine (#561), the Tender, and the Caboose. Which Lionel site has diagrams for newer train equipment you mentioned ? Thanks


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Your set runs off a larger cw80. Set

Lionel supplements contain the modern diagrams. The last one in 2006.
Go to this page Then click supplement number 47, down load it and click the page icon on the left and scroll down to page 35. 


Is that your tender??


If not, then you just search backwards till you find one.

It does take a battery. It needs to be on the track under power, or idle to juice up. Reverse polarity on the track may not work.



This is the old "go back and find a similiar item trick" If you confirm this print out all that good info on your engine.

This is a good example why manuals are at the top of the o gage thread.

Thanks for the question.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

I found the air whistle in a tender. It is not your style shell but I believe the inside parts are the same, the relay is electronic. Supplement 37 page 17.

If not keep looking.

All of the tneders from 28 to 47 are electronic so this is the last mechanical whistle listed in the supplements.


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## bucky22750 (Nov 8, 2011)

Yes, different shell but identical inner components. I still need the newer type transformer I believe and, it should arrive in the next couple of days. Thank you all for responding, its like having an old fashion Hobby Store or a real Lionel Service Station back in the day to get answers. bucky


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