# And so it begins... My 1956 PRR mainline HO build thread...



## afboundguy

My dad dropped off out old layout that we never fully finished today... I'm officially screwed now!!!


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## gunrunnerjohn

Yep, I'd say that one isn't quite finished!


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## Lee Willis

A lot of fun to be had here!! Good for you!!


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## Andy57

Might could use a tweak here and there.

(and I thought my truck was dirty)


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## cfurnari

Granite Gorge?


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## MichaelE

That's what I was thinking.


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## afboundguy

gunrunnerjohn said:


> Yep, I'd say that one isn't quite finished!


Come on it's almost there!!! My brother was big into those little model fighting chess like things and ended up doing something to the other half I'll have to take pictures it looks like a 14 year old did it which was about how old he was when he did whatever he did to it!!!!



Lee Willis said:


> A lot of fun to be had here!! Good for you!!


Can't wait!!!



Andy57 said:


> Might could use a tweak here and there.
> 
> (and I thought my truck was dirty)


I can't take credit it's my dad's truck 



cfurnari said:


> Granite Gorge?





MichaelE said:


> That's what I was thinking.


Are you talking about what the layout is? This is from 20+ years ago and we couldn't find the original plans we tried modeling it after no matter how hard we looked...


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## cfurnari

I think its atlas plan 28 granite gorge and northern. Unfortunately you have to pay for atlas 7 plans book in order to look


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## afboundguy

cfurnari said:


> I think its atlas plan 28 granite gorge and northern. Unfortunately you have to pay for atlas 7 plans book in order to look


Thanks for the info. I was planning on redoing it all over again anyways but also wanted to see the plans to try and adjust to my PRR plans as easily as possible.


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## afboundguy

Here's a shot of what my brother did to the other half of the layout


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## afboundguy

And today instead of clean up that or make some trips to a local train store while its raining and wife is at her part time weekend job guess what I decided to do instead?


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## afboundguy

My co-engineers aren't much help either...


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## afboundguy

After doing a ton of research I've decided I wanted to scrap the 4x8'ish plans and try and do a longer L shaped layout. A friend of mine has a nice B&M layout in his basement and I feel the long narrow plan with a few switch and coal yards in the middle would be better with large loops at the ends. I haven't run these new plans by the wife but she did approve of the modified 4x8 plan that was marked out with the painters tape... Plan was to cover up the cat boxes and the two bins that hold the dog food...


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## afboundguy

As you can tell we have a few bins crammed into shelving units that were already in the basement when we bought the house so we just threw the bins in there... I would plan on putting all the bins under the layout and I can fit 2 bins easily under the 42" height...


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## afboundguy

I plan to try and do a PRR themed layout with 3 main lines with the center one being a reverse loop so I could run 2 trains on the main lines constantly... I did a quick plan on SCARM with quick measurements from the area...

I plan to add a switch yard and maybe even a coal yard and wasn't sure if it would look better in the front or if I put the mainlines towards the front and have the yards in the back?


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## afboundguy

Everything about has a minimum 22" radius and I would make the bump outs more rounded it was just easier to do the outline like that. Layout would be 42" high which would fit in right under the stairs... My only issue is I only have 40-42" on the top right of the diagram due to the chimney vent stack and the hot water heater. So I could either shorten the turns for the loops (will be out of view really anyways and thought about putting a mountain over that area anyways and reduce the curves to 18" radius of shorten that section from 10 feet to only 7 feet and bump it out to 48" to accomidate the 22" radius... Thoughts?


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## afboundguy

Dogs again were zero help at all!!!


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## Stumpy

In the first pic... usually when you see 2x4s stacked like that they're load bearing, but I can't really tell and they seem to be at an odd angle.

Second pic, behind the shelving unit in the foreground... on the layout diagram it looks like you're planning on going extending back in that alcove, but I see plumbing back there.

Dogs are doing their job.


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> In the first pic... usually when you see 2x4s stacked like that they're load bearing, but I can't really tell and they seem to be at an odd angle.


Yeah that was from the previous owner they had a "closet" to hang stuff from there... It's just lightly screwed to the center beam of the house... 



Stumpy said:


> Second pic, behind the shelving unit in the foreground... on the layout diagram it looks like you're planning on going extending back in that alcove, but I see plumbing back there.


Yes that's the main sewer line. I have 10 feet from the corner to there but only 40-42" in width mainly due to the chimney stack. I can either make it a much tighter that I'd like to turn or only go out 7 feet and allow the 48" or more for a 22 inch curve... I'm torn...



Stumpy said:


> Dogs are doing their job.


Yep they are super helpful!!!


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Yes that's the main sewer line. I have 10 feet from the corner to there but only 40-42" in width mainly due to the chimney stack. I can either make it a much tighter that I'd like to turn or only go out 7 feet and allow the 48" or more for a 22 inch curve... I'm torn...


Move the WH back there? I see it's gas and I see copper plumbing, so it wouldn't be a no-brainer...

Just spitballing...


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Move the WH back there? I see it's gas and I see copper plumbing, so it wouldn't be a no-brainer...
> 
> Just spitballing...


Mind blown... Didn't even think of that and I've hated it always being there... I did get a whole house water softener installed a few months ago and if and hopefully when I get to finish that half of the basement I'd need to move it and my plumber said it would be easy to move so this hot water heater would be even easier...

Or I could be proactive and just get a new hot water tank before it goes seeing how its 10+ years old and it's been subject to horribly hard water lol...

I'll be texting my plumber friend tomorrow to inquire...


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## afboundguy

So I found out through researching today that the PRR mainline from Philly to Pittsburgh goes right through the town my parents lived in when I was first born before we moved to New England shortly after my 1st birthday! So guess what town will definitely be in the layout? That one!!! (Malvern/Chester)


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## Bonz85

One thing to keep in mind with a basement layout is future service of things like the water heater/ furnace. Part of my layout will have to be semi removable for the inevitable replacement of said items.


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## afboundguy

Bonz85 said:


> One thing to keep in mind with a basement layout is future service of things like the water heater/ furnace. Part of my layout will have to be semi removable for the inevitable replacement of said items.


Yes I plan to make the section(s) near the lines semi-removable but they can also be accessed on the other side by moving some shelving as well...


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Or I could be proactive and just get a new hot water tank before it goes seeing how its 10+ years old and it's been subject to horribly hard water lol...


At that age and what it's been subject to, it's due to be replaced... model RR or not. Replacing an aged WH is one of the first/best/easiest things you can do to improve the energy efficiency of a home, because it's one appliance that is "always on".

A "tall" style WH will have a smaller footprint and, from what I can see from the one pic, should fit back there.


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## Bonz85

Stumpy said:


> At that age and what
> 
> A "tall" style WH will have a smaller footprint and, from what I can see from the one pic, should fit back there.


The thing with going from a short to tall water heater is you will have to redo the plumbing and might have issues with the exhaust vent. I went to a tall and was barely able to get enough angle on the exhaust vent to not have issues.


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> At that age and what it's been subject to, it's due to be replaced... model RR or not. Replacing an aged WH is one of the first/best/easiest things you can do to improve the energy efficiency of a home, because it's one appliance that is "always on".
> 
> A "tall" style WH will have a smaller footprint and, from what I can see from the one pic, should fit back there.


I already called the plumber and discussed options. I want to go with a stainless steal direct model which is 3 times the price of replacing the indirect one but has a lifetime warranty...



Bonz85 said:


> The thing with going from a short to tall water heater is you will have to redo the plumbing and might have issues with the exhaust vent. I went to a tall and was barely able to get enough angle on the exhaust vent to not have issues.


Moving it isn't the issue my plumber barely charges for simple pipe stuff and if he's putting in something large like that he always asks me if I want it moved since he's already hacking up the pipes!!!


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## 65steam

I would not suggest going to 18" radius if you can help it. For reasons of space, I built my layout with 20" radius, and I have had to be very careful about even the smallest imperfection in the track on those curves derailing my longer box cars and locomotives.


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## Gramps

I replaced my water heater last month after 17+ years, it had a little rust on an intake pipe. They asked if I wanted stainless steel with a 10 year warranty or fiberglass with a lifetime warranty for almost double the price. I went with steel because at my age there is very little difference between 10 years and lifetime.


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## afboundguy

65steam said:


> I would not suggest going to 18" radius if you can help it. For reasons of space, I built my layout with 20" radius, and I have had to be very careful about even the smallest imperfection in the track on those curves derailing my longer box cars and locomotives.


If the water heater gets moved I can easily do the 22 or more radius turn... How fast it gets replaced depends on how much the bathroom remodel ends up costing 🤪



Gramps said:


> I replaced my water heater last month after 17+ years, it had a little rust on an intake pipe. They asked if I wanted stainless steel with a 10 year warranty or fiberglass with a lifetime warranty for almost double the price. I went with steel because at my age there is very little difference between 10 years and lifetime.


I almost want to push it but I convinced the wife the lifetime warranty one is worth it... We have a direct HW heater and we'd be switching to an in-direct HW heater which our plumber says saves money (boiler is more efficient than a HW heater) and it makes the boiler fire up at least once a day so it's not just sitting there all summer...


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## afboundguy

So I had planned on painting the whole basement with a gray drylock paint this past week while we've had contractors over redoing our upstairs bathroom but they've used the basement to store their tools so that plan went out the door. I did flatten out one half of the two layouts my dad and I built when I was a kid and put a small oval layout to test out some of the way too many items I've already purchased and it's been fun just doing that! Brought back so many memories!


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## afboundguy

Even after I told myself numerous times I needed to stop buying stuff and wait to buy the layout I have been unsuccessful... I luckily added up all my purchases and had a slight bit of sticker shock so I think I'm really done for now... The 2nd to last purchase I made was for a brand new in the box PRR K4 4-6-2 Bachman Spectrum engine that I couldn't resist for the price! I set it up yesterday and ran it around and it was awesome!


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## afboundguy




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## flyboy2610

afboundguy said:


> Even after I told myself numerous times I needed to stop buying stuff and wait to buy the layout I have been unsuccessful


I think most of us have been there a time or two!


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## afboundguy

"Layout" hasn't changed much except it is a little more cluttered!!! Contractors are done with the bathroom remodel so all their tools are out of the basement so now it's time to start painting the basement with drylock!

Love my new BLI GG1 though!!!


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## MacDaddy55

Tidy Cat creates a lot of dust soooo gotta move that away from the Layout if that's a problem! We had our original layout in our basement and ever so often there would be a CAT-tastrophe so we moved it out to the garage!! 🤣 🤣 How dry is your basement as well...like the plan utilizing space available!! What's in the Tank by the way??


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## afboundguy

MacDaddy55 said:


> Tidy Cat creates a lot of dust soooo gotta move that away from the Layout if that's a problem! We had our original layout in our basement and ever so often there would be a CAT-tastrophe so we moved it out to the garage!! 🤣 🤣


The cat boxes will be underneath the layout so that should help some with the dust but even with the out in the open it doesn't get too dusty in the basement...



MacDaddy55 said:


> How dry is your basement as well...like the plan utilizing space available!!


It stays pretty dry never had water on the floor except for when my RO/DI system's tube falls onto the floor... When we first moved in it was slightly musty but ever since we purchased a dehumidifier it stays around 50-55% humidity...



MacDaddy55 said:


> What's in the Tank by the way??


The tank in the middle is a copepod culture, which are tiny tiny "bugs" that I grow for my saltwater tank for a specific fish... The tank to the right is sort of like an emulsion setup for culturing phytoplankton, which is the basic building blocks for everything in the ocean. I feel the phytoplankton to the copepods and also dose my reef tank everyday with some...

The fridge is for storing the phytoplankton and the wine cooler above the fridge is for storing worms I culture to feed the tank... Here's a recent photo of my reef tank which is my other hobby that sucks money from my wallet!


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## Stumpy

Good looking tank!

Plenty of coralline algae so I'd say your Ca is great. And I see an SPS, so you're a better reef-keeper than I was. 

What's your lighting setup?



afboundguy said:


> The tank in the middle is a copepod culture, which are tiny tiny "bugs" that I grow for my saltwater tank for a specific fish


Mandarin?


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Good looking tank!
> 
> Plenty of coralline algae so I'd say your Ca is great. And I see an SPS, so you're a better reef-keeper than I was.
> 
> What's your lighting setup?


Yes I dose 2 part and just have a HOB refugium... Right around 400 calcium and 8 dkh for alk... Was doing natural sea water for changes but too cold to go on a boat 2 miles out to where I used to collect so it used to look even better in the summer...



Stumpy said:


> Mandarin?


Yep... My tank is only 25'ish gallons and a 3'ish gallon HOB refugium and normal rationale is a mandarin should never be in such a small tank but I've had she/he since it was a tiny baby and it was captive bred and the thing is as fat an happy as can be due to all my hard work culturing live food...

@Stumpy if you or anyone else is bored and wants to read my build thread from when I downsized from a 55 gallon back in 2011 here's my build thread on my local reef forum - afboundguy's downsizing 25 gallon cube build | Boston Reefers Society


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> normal rationale is a mandarin should never be in such a small tank but I've had she/he since it was a tiny baby and it was captive bred and the thing is as fat an happy as can be due to all my hard work culturing live food...


That's f'n awesome! They are beautiful fish! We managed to keep one for two years. We got it before we knew it's dietary requirements. 😕 We really tried, but alas...


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## afboundguy

Finally got off my *** and started to paint the basement with gray drylock paint. I removed and reorganized all the bins on the wooden shelving unit where I (not wife) wants to place the layout. Ended up getting rid of 3 or 4 bins between moving some upstairs in my crawlspaces in an upstairs bedroom and from combining/throwing out unnecessary stuff...

Before re-organization...


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## afboundguy

Mid organization...


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## afboundguy

Just some extra tank stuff left on the shelves...


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## afboundguy

Since I have to move the shelving unit anyways to paint the floor and the walls behind it I plan on moving it to the right of where the fish tank and chimney stuff is. I removed the metal shelving units from that area and started to paint the walls. It was taking forever since my walls are so damn porous so I just gave up about halfway down the wall and painted the floor so I can move the wooden shelving unit tomorrow to see if the wife approves it in the new location since it needs to move anyways...


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## afboundguy

I'll have to take a picture of the updated "layout" tomorrow. Several people said it was a mess but it was super clean compared to what it looks like now


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> since my walls are so damn porous


We used a roller with 3/4" nap. You have to move slow or it'll sling the DL everywhere (does anyway), but it covers good. Still have to do two coats though.


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## afboundguy

I just picked up an electric textured spray gun after someone on my saltwater reef forums recommended renting one from Home Depot. It was $160 to rent one for a week or pick up the one I did for $100 so I'm going to give that a shot tomorrow should make things go much faster on the walls fingers crossed!!!


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## afboundguy

And everybody thought my yard/layout was a mess before...


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## afboundguy

I didn't get around to trying out the new spray gun plan to try tomorrow if it's not too cold but here is the small amount I did by hand the other day...


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## BigGRacing

Your yard looks exactly like mine currently.....lol


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## x_doug_x

afboundguy said:


> My co-engineers aren't much help either...
> 
> View attachment 552792





Your second dog looks A LOT like mine.


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## afboundguy

BigGRacing said:


> Your yard looks exactly like mine currently.....lol


Makes me feel a bit better!



x_doug_x said:


> Your second dog looks A LOT like mine.


The black spotted one? She's a deaf dog and I've noticed a ton of deaf white dogs look awfully similar as I joined a deaf dogs FB page when we adopted her...


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## Chops124

afboundguy said:


> And everybody thought my yard/layout was a mess before...
> 
> View attachment 556561


I feel so much better now. I’ll make a copy of this and paste it in the wall so I won’t feel so bad.


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## Chaostrain

It's not a mess, the space is well utilized.


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## afboundguy

Chops124 said:


> I feel so much better now. I’ll make a copy of this and paste it in the wall so I won’t feel so bad.


Glad I could be of assistance!!! 



Chaostrain said:


> It's not a mess, the space is well utilized.


If you say so!!!


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## afboundguy

Busted out the spray gun today and all I can say is it was well worth the $100 bucks!!! I finished that rest of the wall in maybe 30 minutes vs the 3-4 hours I did by hand and used less paint as well!!! It'll still take me forever to paint the whole basement but not nearly as long as it would have by hand!


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## afboundguy

Wife and I are still defcon 4 for WWIII about what my overall vision is with the basement but I have hope a peace treaty will happen sooner rather than later... I have at least 2 weeks of work moving stuff and painting fingers crossed!!! 

I also miss running the trains on just that small oval it's been about a week and I'm already having withdrawals...


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## x_doug_x

x_doug_x said:


> Your second dog looks A LOT like mine.


The one that looks full blooded american pitbull terrier, white and brown.


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## Chops

Stuff I never knew about. Very cool.


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## afboundguy

Chops said:


> Stuff I never knew about. Very cool.


His littermate sister's parents paid for the testing and he's part American Staffordshire Terrier, Bull Terrier, hound and lab...


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## afboundguy

Chops said:


> Stuff I never knew about. Very cool.


You talking about the drylok paint or something else? If you're talking about the drylok prepare to use more than they say you'll need if you have an older porous foundation like mine... I'm about to open up my 3rd gallon when according to the square footage that a gallon should cover should have been my last gallon but I'll need at least 3-4 more gallons...


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## afboundguy

Another wall almost done!


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## afboundguy

Today is operation take care of dog day... She's had an upset stomach for a few days and the probiotics haven't been working and today it was coming out of both ends so I'll be bringing her to the vet so that will take precedence today!!!


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## afboundguy

Progress was stalled several days due to puppy's upset stomach. Got to love white dogs! They did more extensive bloodwork than in the past with these intestinal flare ups and figured it was allergies. She's been on a limited ingredient diet as her big brother has bad food allergies and now has to have bi-monthly allergy shots but she's still allergic to the limited ingredient food so now we're trying a prescription hydrolyzed protein food. Sounds expensive doesn't it?


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## afboundguy

Wife was home yesterday on her last Wed Zoom from home teaching her 5th graders as she goes back to school 5 days a week in person now so I tried doing a little work but puppy wasn't feeling to well so I couldn't accomplish much  I was able to break down my "layout" and started to clean up the workbench area in preparation for moving it to paint but never got it all done...


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## afboundguy

It's like a constant puzzle of where to put things and where to paint next


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## afboundguy

But the puzzle has given me some good ideas. For example I think I may run the end loops around the chimney stack above the sewer pipe to avoid the big bump out at the end of the L that I was originally thinking of doing which would make it seem like it's not an end loop since my plan is to do the PRR mainline from Philly to Harrisburg and I didn't know where to start on the Philly end as I wanted continuous operation and with hiding the end like this it could leave me open to having it "start" at the Philly station giving me more options... It would all depend on where I decide to put the new hot water heater...


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Progress was stalled several days due to puppy's upset stomach.


We had a puppy that had the occasional bout of upset stomach (which became less frequent as he got older). We always fed boiled chicken (white meat) and rice until he came around.


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## MichaelE

That food _is_ expensive. A 25 Lbs. bag will run you about $100. On-line.


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> We had a puppy that had the occasional bout of upset stomach (which became less frequent as he got older). We always fed boiled chicken (white meat) and rice until he came around.


White dogs = problems...



MichaelE said:


> That food _is_ expensive. A 25 Lbs. bag will run you about $100. On-line.


Oh you don't have to tell me I know all about expensive dog food


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> White dogs = problems


He was white. Samoyed. 

Man I miss that guy.


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## afboundguy

Had some rolling stock delivered yesterday from ebay. Got two of them for $3 to lump in with another larger order but so all in all it was $33 shipped for these items. I know they will need some work with new couplers and a few new reefer cover panels but I liked the look of them so I did it. I could have saved the $9 in shipping as the seller was about 25 minutes away from where I live but I was being super lazy


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## afboundguy

The real reason I bid on this lot was for this PRR gondola with a load in it. I really wanted this and was very happy when my under $20 bid won the lot of 8...


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## afboundguy

The other scores were some brand new PRR MoW Pullman cars... One went for $8 and the other went for $32 and I was happy with the average of $20 for each of them since I haven't really seen too many lately on ebay especially brand new. This was the lot I added 2 of those $3 cars to since shipping was basically free.


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## Chaostrain

Awww, poor girl! I hope the new food helps.

Looks like you're making good progress.


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## afboundguy

Chaostrain said:


> Awww, poor girl! I hope the new food helps


So far the new food has worked fine so far and she's acting like her crazy self already!



Chaostrain said:


> Looks like you're making good progress.


Thanks! Since she's feeling better I got a little work done today and painted three of the window sills and moved the work bench out and painted the floors. Going to hit the walls on Monday!


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## afboundguy

It's amazing how much more I can paint when I don't have to move huge shelving units around! was able to paint pretty much the entire front side of the house wall and the corner in the last picture of the previous post in under an hour! I still need to hand paint behind the water softner set up and around the fuse box but tomorrow hope to put back the big tool/work bench and crank out more of the floor and hand paint the rest of the wall.


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## afboundguy

I forgot to post a picture before of the work bench area...


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## afboundguy

Before and after of the rest of the painting from this morning...


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## afboundguy

First off happy to report the puppy is doing much better on her super expensive prescription diet food... She's back to her normal super crazy self ...

...Which lets me continue to work on the basement. I think I'm on the home stretch as yesterday after I had a co-worker swing by to help me move the tool bench back all I had to do was move a small tv stand and I was able to crank out the whole front of the house portion (well minus the small part above the water softener set up that I totally forgot to paint).

I'm taking the day off from painting today as I have some plans which include a nice chiropractic cracking to try and fix the back from all this painting, do some fish tank maintenance and more importantly heading over to a friend's house to try out my BLI GG1 on his DCC layout 😎

Here are some before and after shots from yesterday's work...


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## afboundguy




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## afboundguy




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## afboundguy




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## afboundguy

It was funny I asked the wife last night when I was home for dinner break what she thought and it was hilarious as her response was "if you're happy I'm happy"  She thinks it's too gray and bright and I was like yep that's the main reason I did it to brighten up the basement 🤪


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## Magic

It's looking pretty good, much better.
Nothing worse than a dark dank basement.

Magic


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## afboundguy

Probably only one of two more days left! Was able to get the rest of the floor done besides the 2 or 3 shelves I need to move to paint behind!


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## afboundguy




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## afboundguy




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## Stumpy

Getting there!

I guess now's not the time to mention that the DryLok is cheaper by the 5 gal. bucket.


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Getting there!
> 
> I guess now's not the time to mention that the DryLok is cheaper by the 5 gal. bucket.


It's not super cheap but it is cheaper... If I could find it!!! The gallons are only $25.88 and the 5 gallon buckets are like $120 but I can't find any gray ones anywhere close to me... So I just have been buying 1 gallon buckets since it's only $10-$15 more and I can return the unused ones. I know I could have gotten a 5 gallon bucket and tinted it but I realized that too late in the game and I'm already too deep in!!!


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## afboundguy

Getting down to the end of painting (finally)... I have all day tomorrow free minus a short online appointment at 1 tomorrow so I plan on painting the rest of the corner and few touch up spots... Moved the large shelving unit this morning and found the two bottom 2x4's were over 50% rotted out which probably explained why is smelt funny in that corner! I used some hydraulic cement to fill in some of the small holes and cracks to further keep out spiders this am...

Need to have a nice talk with the wife about fixing it up before I put it in it's final resting spot!


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## afboundguy

Done with 99.9% of the painting minus one small spot behind the water softener that I couldn't get to right now with everything moved around....


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## afboundguy

Also wife got a new bathing suit the other day and one of my helpers tried it on before she got a chance to...


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## Lemonhawk

The sad face is because the other dog is making fun of her


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## afboundguy

Lemonhawk said:


> The sad face is because the other dog is making fun of her


No the other dog is probably way more jealous that he didn't get to wear it!!!


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## afboundguy

Had 2 weeks of training, another 1-2 weeks off and throw in an overnight ER visit for kidney stones and I haven't been on here in about 2 weeks... Basement painting it all done minus a second coat on the floor... I ended up winning the war with the wife she ended up caving and saying I could do whatever I want and if she didn't like how it looked she'd just send me downstairs to get stuff!!!

I ended up just disassembling the wooden shelving unit and I'm glad I did as the 2x4's on the bottom were rotted out and half of the posts were rotted at the bottom as well...


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## afboundguy

Ended up fitting almost perfectly in the new spot. I think I had to take 1 inch off one of the sides...


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## afboundguy

Also ended up replacing the stair treads and painting them along with the basement entry way...


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## afboundguy

Now I just need to move all these boxes back to the relocated new and improved wooden shelving unit...


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## afboundguy

And since the wife gave me cartblanche to do whatever I want down there my next course of action is to throw down some plywood and luxury vinyl boards and also frame out the wall and replace and relocate the hot water heater. I had always wanted to finish half the basement and throw a much larger reef tank down stairs and I don't really want to do the benchwork only to have to take it apart when I finally do the floors and the walls so I figured I'd just do the spot where the benchwork will go to save some money as it's about 1/3 of the total area I want to finish in the basement.


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## afboundguy

Well it's been a little bit of time since I've been on super busy with work and wife finishing up the school year (she's a teacher). Moved everything around...


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## afboundguy

Ended up getting a few pallets for free and tore them down for lumber...


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## afboundguy

Well wife's cartblanche did not include letting me finish the basement  so I sort of slacked it... Got tired of not having anything so I reset up the small oval to get my fix in...


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## afboundguy

Decided to not work any overtime today on my actual day off and finally really got started on the benchwork. I am going to be doing an L girder set up... Put up some 2x4's to the ceiling and put the vertical boards on and painted them. I'm going to put masonite to the ceiling which will give it the semi appearance of a finished wall...


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## afboundguy

Painted them all the same color as the floor and walls so they'll blend in just in case...


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## Bonz85

Looking good.


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## afboundguy

Bonz85 said:


> Looking good.


Thanks... Hoping to work on it some more if wife heads out to help out her parents with various appointments since we're about to get hit with the brunt of TS Elsa...


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## afboundguy

Threw up most of the L girder supports today... Hope to pick up plywood early next week...


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## afboundguy




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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> View attachment 562645
> View attachment 562646
> View attachment 562647


I don't see any L-girders in your photos. The supports are simple 2 x 4s. They can, and in a possibly occasionally damp basement may well , warp. That's the main advantage of actual L-girder, it is absolutely rigid and very warp resistant. The photos below show real L-girder. These were made from a 1 x 3 and a 1 x 2, screwed & glued to form the 'L' shape.

Traction Fan


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## afboundguy

@traction fan I finished up the L girders by placing a board on top of the vertical 2x4's. It's an L girder except where the horizontal supports are for the plywood are sticking out. I plan to do L girders on the outside edge once I figure out the shape of the plywood...


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## afboundguy




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## afboundguy

Borrowed a co-worker's truck today and made trip the Home Depot and picked up some plywood foam and Masonite


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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> @traction fan I finished up the L girders by placing a board on top of the vertical 2x4's. It's an L girder except where the horizontal supports are for the plywood are sticking out. I plan to do L girders on the outside edge once I figure out the shape of the plywood...
> View attachment 562805
> View attachment 562806
> View attachment 562807


Yup! Those are now L-girders alright. L-girders on steroids, 😄 but L-girders just the same. Your benchwork will be super strong, but also heavy and it looks like, immoveable. That's your choice, since its your railroad, but many times years of work, and large chunks of money, have been lost when a model railroader has to move, and his model railroad can't.

Good Luck & have Fun;

Traction Fan 🙂


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## afboundguy

traction fan said:


> Yup! Those are now L-girders alright. L-girders on steroids, 😄 but L-girders just the same. Your benchwork will be super strong, but also heavy and it looks like, immoveable. That's your choice, since its your railroad, but many times years of work, and large chunks of money, have been lost when a model railroader has to move, and his model railroad can't.
> 
> Good Luck & have Fun;
> 
> Traction Fan 🙂


They won't need to be moved except to upgrade as I wouldn't mind moving but wife is dead set against ever leaving our house and I'm more than happy in the house we're in (would rather have a garage but that's a loosing battle with the wife). I'm a first responder in the town I live in so I really don't have any need to move and since the wife doesn't want to move we're staying put probably forever so the immoveable aspect isn't too big of a concern! 

Even if it needs to be moved it will be on plywood that will have the pink insulation foam on the top and I had planned on screwing the plywood to the 2x4s from the underside so removal would be easy if needed vs screwing the plywood from the top into the 2x4s and then gluing the insulation foam to it which would require major destruction to remove...

Our plumber (ex-neighbor and friend) had the same line of questioning when I asked him about replacing our hot water heater. He said since we plan on staying we should spend the money on a stainless steel hot water heater that is about 3 times the money as the typical Home Depot one but it will have a lifetime warranty vs the Home Depot cheaper ones that last 8-12 years... He said he'd be long dead before the stainless steel one would need to be replaced and said it would be worth it since we (wife) has no plans on moving...


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## afboundguy

Did some scale drawings of what I have to work with with the hot water heater in it's current location... Bottom space is 5 feet wide so gives me plenty of options and I probably plan to have a turntable are there but not 100% sure. On the top right side where the hot water heater is once that's gone I'll extend it out and I also might do the turnaround wrapping around my chimney and maybe even do a helix for a second level down the road as I could easily fit a 20+ inch helix around it once the hot water heater is relocated...


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Even if it needs to be moved it will be on plywood that will have the pink insulation foam on the top and I had planned on screwing the plywood to the 2x4s from the underside so removal would be easy if needed


I did plywood deck with 2" pink foam board on top on the layout I started in 2018. I have concluded that you don't need the plywood deck, so the next layout won't have one. If I need to screw something to the bottom such as a turnout motor I'll glue a piece of 1/4" plywood or some other scrap to the bottom where needed. And stick-on wire keepers.


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## 65446

Maybe for a little extra drama, cut in a single spur that goes up and over somewhere to a mine or logging camp up in them thar eastern hills...No loop. Just go up one direction and s l o w back it down to the yard/interchange...


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## 65446

deleted/double posted


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> I did plywood deck with 2" pink foam board on top on the layout I started in 2018. I have concluded that you don't need the plywood deck, so the next layout won't have one. If I need to screw something to the bottom such as a turnout motor I'll glue a piece of 1/4" plywood or some other scrap to the bottom where needed. And stick-on wire keepers.


I had thought of that and it's not off the table yet as there are many pros in my mind to not having plywood. I did see that option for securing items to the underside. It would save me $40-$45 for the plywood I'd just have to reborrow my buddy's truck to return it. 



telltale said:


> Maybe for a little extra drama, cut in a single spur that goes up and over somewhere to a mine or logging camp up in them thar eastern hills...No loop. Just go up one direction and s l o w back it down to the yard/interchange...


Oh I haven't even decided where to put the 1-3 yards I want to put in the layout. I have a ton of old brass track that I plan to use to lay it out and try and get a design I like before finally installing the NP track...

I also have a few ideas for single spurs going off as there are a ton of old branch lines off the PRR mainline that I want to emulate...


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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> Did some scale drawings of what I have to work with with the hot water heater in it's current location... Bottom space is 5 feet wide so gives me plenty of options and I probably plan to have a turntable are there but not 100% sure. On the top right side where the hot water heater is once that's gone I'll extend it out and I also might do the turnaround wrapping around my chimney and maybe even do a helix for a second level down the road as I could easily fit a 20+ inch helix around it once the hot water heater is relocated...
> 
> View attachment 562936
> View attachment 562937


A hot water heater can even be sort of incorporated into a model railroad's storyline. Master track planner John Armstrong, who was heavily into bad puns, christened the model station near his water heater, "Agua Caliente!"

Traction Fan


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## 65446

I take it you mean you're only using the brass stuff to get the footprint of the trackage, and not planning to employ the brass. Correct ? Hope so, because the brass is a bummer as it oxidizes non-conductive green mold causing stall outs and too much track-cleaning scenes and engine nudging..
Not sure what you mean by NP track.. But try to go all code 83 nickle silver..possibly code 70 (un-shouldered) in yards for a nice visual touch...


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## afboundguy

traction fan said:


> A hot water heater can even be sort of incorporated into a model railroad's storyline. Master track planner John Armstrong, who was heavily into bad puns, christened the model station near his water heater, "Agua Caliente!"
> 
> Traction Fan


That's too funny but I've already picked out another spot in the basement for it to get relocated anyways!



telltale said:


> I take it you mean you're only using the brass stuff to get the footprint of the trackage, and not planning to employ the brass. Correct ? Hope so, because the brass is a bummer as it oxidizes non-conductive green mold causing stall outs and too much track-cleaning scenes and engine nudging..
> Not sure what you mean by NP track.. But try to go all code 83 nickle silver..possibly code 70 (un-shouldered) in yards for a nice visual touch...


Yeah brass track just for planning to figure out what I'd need. And NP=nickle plated that's what I've always called it. The plan is to go with code 83 for the mainline and paint/weather it...


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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> That's too funny but I've already picked out another spot in the basement for it to get relocated anyways!
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah brass track just for planning to figure out what I'd need. And NP=nickle plated that's what I've always called it. The plan is to go with code 83 for the mainline and paint/weather it...


afboundguy;

Just re-examined some of your photos and I noticed you have something in your basement configuration that a lot of modelers would love to have. I don't know if you've already considered it but I'll make the suggestion, and let you decide if you want it.
Your basement walls have a sort of "shelf" built into the stonework/concrete about 4' off the floor. This shelf continues behind the stairway, which gives you the feature that many of us would love to have, a potential "center" entrance to the "layout room." "Center" as in not blocking any part of the wall, like a door, or stairs mounted to the wall, would. 
I don't know if this "shelf" extends all the way around your basement, or not. If it does, you have a golden opportunity to have a layout that circles the entire basement, without blocking access, or taking up the entire basement area. A shelf-style layout, of whatever reasonable depth you want,* 
could go around all the walls, and still leave most of the center area open for other needs. (hot water heater, furnace, laundry, etc.)

* Obviously, the short segment that goes behind the stairs will have to be narrow, but the rest doesn't.

Just a happy thought; 😊

Traction Fan


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## afboundguy

traction fan said:


> afboundguy;
> 
> Just re-examined some of your photos and I noticed you have something in your basement configuration that a lot of modelers would love to have. I don't know if you've already considered it but I'll make the suggestion, and let you decide if you want it.
> Your basement walls have a sort of "shelf" built into the stonework/concrete about 4' off the floor. This shelf continues behind the stairway, which gives you the feature that many of us would love to have, a potential "center" entrance to the "layout room." "Center" as in not blocking any part of the wall, like a door, or stairs mounted to the wall, would.
> I don't know if this "shelf" extends all the way around your basement, or not. If it does, you have a golden opportunity to have a layout that circles the entire basement, without blocking access, or taking up the entire basement area. A shelf-style layout, of whatever reasonable depth you want,*
> could go around all the walls, and still leave most of the center area open for other needs. (hot water heater, furnace, laundry, etc.)
> 
> * Obviously, the short segment that goes behind the stairs will have to be narrow, but the rest doesn't.
> 
> Just a happy thought; 😊
> 
> Traction Fan


I do have that pretty much around the whole basement minus the bulkhead area but that would be easy to get around. The main issue right now is I have two cats currently and while the older cat doesn't walk on that area as she's 15+ years old the younger cat walks on that area all the time. I do have the breaker box against the wall and I'm not sure I could fit 2 tracks behind it but I could more than likely get a single track behind it with maybe a turnout behind it to give the illusion of there being 2 tracks behind there. 

I would love to use that shelf area for a configuration like you mentioned to go along with the possible helix around the chimney and it definitely peaked my interest and has been in my mind but for now I'm starting slow and I have plans to expand and if it were up to me I'd turn the whole basement into a train room but happy wife equals happy'ish life


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## Stumpy

This isn't the video I was looking for, but you'll get the idea.


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> This isn't the video I was looking for, but you'll get the idea.


That's awesome... I def want to do a second layer but I don't know if I'd have enough space to do a turn around loop by the stairs so I was thinking of making it more of a large switching yard so I could keep it narrow but the wrap around the whole basement idea could possibly alleviate that requirement we'll see... I'll start with the main level first and go from there... 

Plan to start laying down the foam Monday morning. I still might do plywood in one area as I'd like to have a slide out flat drawer so I can have a work area... Not sure if I want to just do a simple slide out or something with a hinge...


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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> I do have that pretty much around the whole basement minus the bulkhead area but that would be easy to get around. The main issue right now is I have two cats currently and while the older cat doesn't walk on that area as she's 15+ years old the younger cat walks on that area all the time. I do have the breaker box against the wall and I'm not sure I could fit 2 tracks behind it but I could more than likely get a single track behind it with maybe a turnout behind it to give the illusion of there being 2 tracks behind there.
> 
> I would love to use that shelf area for a configuration like you mentioned to go along with the possible helix around the chimney and it definitely peaked my interest and has been in my mind but for now I'm starting slow and I have plans to expand and if it were up to me I'd turn the whole basement into a train room but happy wife equals happy'ish life


Well, if you have cats, any model railroad is going to take a beating, no matter what shape or size, it is. If you did decide to do the shelf thing you could enclose it. My own layout is a bookshelf one, based on an old Model Railroader Magazine article. I am a dog lover, and thus feel the only good use for cats is to take tire tread impressions! However, I do plan to add plexiglass front panels to enclose the layout.

Traction Fan 🙂


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## afboundguy

I ended up deciding to lay the plywood down first instead of just using only the pink foam. Was able to squeeze in some work yesterday as my old man drinking softball league was rained out... 

I decided to mount the TV on the stair risers and I'll keep the DVD player mounted under the benchwork which lets me get rid of the stand it was on freeing up even more room in the basement...

I also don't plan to secure the section by the HW heater so it'll be easier for the plumber to move that and the washing machine hookups that currently feed my RO/DI system for making water for my saltwater reed tank...


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## afboundguy

Worked on putting up some masonite for the "walls" yesterday and cut out the last small piece of plywood in the corner. I ended up "framing" out the sections by the window to keep the cats from being able to get behind it as they can fint between the foundation and the joists of the main floor. I plan to add some plexiglass so I can still get the natural light but add another preventative layer to keep them off the layout.

It's going to end up being about 44" high when I put on the pink foam so the older cat will have no chance of jumping up that high and I'm not even sure the younger cat could jump that high. I do have years of experience in deterring cats from jumping on things so I'm confident I can keep them off pretty easily...

Tonight I plan on painting the masonite "walls" in some leftover white primer before I mud the seams as a layer of paint should make the mud stick better... I also may try and cut out some of the back wall's masonite but that will depend on what time I get back from a doctor's appointment I have at 2 where they will be doing some stupid stress test for asthma or something


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## afboundguy

Did two coats of white primer and started "wiring" the outlets... By wiring I mean just running them and stapling them not actually hooking them up I'll have my buddy who's an electrician actually do the wiring. Wife for some reason doesn't trust me which is funny as I replaced all the electrical outlets and various other things when we renovated the house


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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> Did two coats of white primer and started "wiring" the outlets... By wiring I mean just running them and stapling them not actually hooking them up I'll have my buddy who's an electrician actually do the wiring. Wife for some reason doesn't trust me which is funny as I replaced all the electrical outlets and various other things when we renovated the house
> 
> View attachment 563289
> View attachment 563290
> View attachment 563291



Its looking better each time. Good progress.  
One thing you might consider is moving those electrical outlets up front. With an electrical outlet mounted in, or just below, the fascia board you can simply plug in your soldering iron, temporary work light, or other tool. With the outlets on the wall, way at the back of your layout, you have to crawl under to plug any tool in. 

Traction Fan 🙂


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## MichaelE

I agree. That's going to be a PITA every time you want to plug something in. An option would be to run power strips with CB's to the underside of the layout or attached to a leg so you have access without crawling to the back wall.


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## afboundguy

traction fan said:


> Its looking better each time. Good progress.
> One thing you might consider is moving those electrical outlets up front. With an electrical outlet mounted in, or just below, the fascia board you can simply plug in your soldering iron, temporary work light, or other tool. With the outlets on the wall, way at the back of your layout, you have to crawl under to plug any tool in.
> 
> Traction Fan 🙂





MichaelE said:


> I agree. That's going to be a PITA every time you want to plug something in. An option would be to run power strips with CB's to the underside of the layout or attached to a leg so you have access without crawling to the back wall.


Thanks it's been fun working on it... I do plan on running some power strips under the benchwork and probably attach it to the pull out work shelf/bench I plan to incorporate under the layout. The outlets are mainly going to be there to plug some of my fish supplies in and the other outlet in the double gang box will have a constant power which will have the power strips and the other one will be controlled by a switch and will have the power to the train hooked up to it...


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## afboundguy

Been quite a while since I've been able to work on the layout. Had a ton of training for work and tons of overtime. I was able to knock out a quick water change on my reef tank that was very badly overdue and needed and then I decided to work on the layout. I moved some more boxes and items under the layout and broke down one of the metal shelving units that I had put up temporarily to hold some stuff. Everything underneath is nowhere near their final resting area as half of it is boxes of train stuff that will disappear when I actually lay track and scenery....

I also ended up having a free "home energy assessment" today that's offered by my natural gas company so I can get rebates and use their 7 year 0% financing for gas related projects. My buddy who is my plumber suggested doing a new boiler as well when I do the HW heater and move everything to a different wall to create more room and open up the possibility to remove the chimney... No heating system in the area would open up a lot more room and if I got rid of the chimney (which would be a long ways away) that's even more room!

Plan is to try and paint the insulation with some mistake big hardware box store paint that's brown and only cost me about $5 so I don't have to look at that pepto pink!


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## afboundguy

Threw a quick coat of brown paint to get rid of pepto pink first thing this morning...


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## afboundguy

For reference I want to move the whole boiler, HW heater and water softener system behind the work bench in the back right of this picture which would allow a huge increase in available space for me to take over!!! Please excuse the mess it's still a work in process to move around boxes


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## afboundguy

On a seeking advice point I was thinking of maybe doing a small yard off of the big loop that goes under the stairs for maybe a programing yard but not sure how a few lines off a big loop would look? Would only be 1-2 feet wide and 3-4 feet long and go to the left if you're looking at the first picture... I'm interested to hear everybody's thoughts? If the boiler and HW heater get relocated I should have plenty more room for yards and such but feel it could be a different add on and maybe I could make it one of the forgotten branch lines or something but just don't know if it would look out of place coming off a big 30"+ loop...


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## afboundguy

For reference here is a scale diagram of the layout so far... If and when HW heater and furnace moves I'll extend that side out quite a bit and aim to do a large yard there otherwise I'd plan on doing a yard on the right side of the diagram within the turn around loop by the HW heater...


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Threw a quick coat of brown paint to get rid of pepto pink first thing this morning


Much better! 



afboundguy said:


> For reference I want to move the whole boiler, HW heater and water softener system behind the work bench in the back right of this picture


Right now the WH & boiler are venting out the chimney. Where/how will you vent them if you move them way over there?

Looks like you have hot water heat?


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> On a seeking advice point I was thinking of maybe doing a small yard off of the big loop that goes under the stairs for maybe a programing yard but not sure how a few lines off a big loop would look?


It'll be fine. Somewhere "below" the pole (in your drawing) put a curved turnout in your outside track. Then you would curve the diverging leg back the other way and head down the spur/yard. Yep, that would make an S-curve and some people poo-poo those - I am not one. You'll just have to play around with the positioning of the turnout off the main so that the radii in the S aren't too tight. Once the main leg is figured out, add turnouts and... small yard.

PECO has turnout templates (plans) that you can download and print actual size. Along with a few pieces of flex track and some T-pins, they're great for transferring plans from paper to baseboard to see how things are _really_ going to fit... before buying.









Turn out & crossing plans







peco-uk.com


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Much better!


I know right?



Stumpy said:


> Right now the WH & boiler are venting out the chimney. Where/how will you vent them if you move them way over there?
> 
> Looks like you have hot water heat?


So the new boiler would be a condesning unit that from what I've read and can comprehend reuses the exhaust heat to keep heating the water so it's much more efficient and the exhaust isn't as hot and can be vented from a small PVC pipe out the side of the house and can even be plumbed with PVC somewhere else. I would either want to have it right out the side of the house or I may opt to run it along that wall and through the bulkhead wall with the final hole being drilled in the metal bulkhead.

And yes we have a baseboard heat system and it's all on natural gas. We have natural gas for the stove and dryer and we pay about $1,000-$1,200 a year for gas. I'm hopeful the greatly increased efficiency from just the boiler alone (current one is around 80% new one would be 95%) and the even better efficiency upgrade from a direct HW tank to an in-direct (95% efficient since the boiler would be doing the work) should save a ton of money in the long run but who are we kidding it's mainly for the extra space for the layout!!!


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## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> It'll be fine. Somewhere "below" the pole (in your drawing) put a curved turnout in your outside track. Then you would curve the diverging leg back the other way and head down the spur/yard. Yep, that would make an S-curve and some people poo-poo those - I am not one. You'll just have to play around with the positioning of the turnout off the main so that the radii in the S aren't too tight. Once the main leg is figured out, add turnouts and... small yard.
> 
> PECO has turnout templates (plans) that you can download and print actual size. Along with a few pieces of flex track and some T-pins, they're great for transferring plans from paper to baseboard to see how things are _really_ going to fit... before buying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turn out & crossing plans
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peco-uk.com


Thanks for the input and bigger thanks for that link that will def help a ton! I'll print a bunch out at work tonight!


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## afboundguy

Think I'm done for the day... I ended up using a pretty rugged work table I made for my reef tank duties with 4x4 legs and insanely overbuilt for the small section I wanted to add at the end. I don't plan to secure it to the rest of the layout so I can move it if needed...


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## afboundguy

It is about 4-5" too short but slides right under perfectly and with 2 layers of the pink insulation foam it is pretty much level. I can push it further in and adjust how far it sticks out to get the optimal wife approved look... The height is close enough that I can shave them level and the big loop is a little high and uneven on that side anyways... Just need to paint the workbench gray to match everything else now...


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## afboundguy

Placed the dorm fridge and wine cooler that I use for my reef tank live food under the table. I had made a simple 20"x20" rolling dolly so I can roll them in and out. I want to do a work desk that either hinges out or pulls out and by using this work bench it is more than strong enough to accommodate a pull out desk... I will be relocating the cat liter boxes to where the work bench used to be slowly over the next few days...


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## afboundguy

Nice wide open space where it used to be that could make for a nice spot if the boiler gets repositioned


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## afboundguy

With the workbench moved and with a simple lowering of the dehumidifier I could run the mainline around the chimney as lets face it removal of the chimney would be a long ways away


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## afboundguy

Best part about the height I picked is that it can easily accommodate the height of my wife's wrapping paper obsession that we never really had a place that it would fit!


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## traction fan

afboundguy said:


> On a seeking advice point I was thinking of maybe doing a small yard off of the big loop that goes under the stairs for maybe a programing yard but not sure how a few lines off a big loop would look? Would only be 1-2 feet wide and 3-4 feet long and go to the left if you're looking at the first picture... I'm interested to hear everybody's thoughts? If the boiler and HW heater get relocated I should have plenty more room for yards and such but feel it could be a different add on and maybe I could make it one of the forgotten branch lines or something but just don't know if it would look out of place coming off a big 30"+ loop...
> 
> View attachment 566316
> 
> 
> View attachment 566317


afboundguy;

My old club, and several home layouts, use the concentric loops yard idea you're contemplating. They use it as a double-ended "staging yard."
A staging yard is a place where entire trains can be parked out of sight. Think of part of your model railroad's main line as a place where you go to watch real trains. A train will come by headed west, and later another train may come by headed east, etc. Each train makes its appearance, possibly does some switching, and then heads off out of your sight. You can do the same thing on a model railroad by using the staging yard as "the rest of the world, that I can't see from my vantage point." 

It gets more interesting if two, or more, railroad companies trains are involved. Junctions between railroads are good spots for train watching, and for modeling. Such junctions were common in the steam era, when there were dozens of independent rail companies operating in the U.S. (Now, most of them have been absorbed by one of the four remaining "super railroads.") At junctions, "back in the day," it was common practice for one railroad to "forward" freight cars that were destined for somewhere served by the other rail company. A junction often had a wye connecting the tracks of the two railroads. This made it easy for trains approaching from either direction to get from one railroad to the other. There would also be a shared siding, or a small yard, depending on traffic levels, where cars could be spotted to later be picked up by the other railroad's local train. 

I have a six-track staging yard on my own N-scale shelf layout. It happens to be straight tracks, rather than curved loops, but it serves the same function. My railroad is set in Seattle, Washington, in the 1920s. The city was then served by four major transcontinental rail lines. The Union Pacific, Milwaukee Road, Northern Pacific, and the Great Northern. I concentrate on the passenger operations of those four companies. All four, plus some regional lines, passed through a tiny village called "Black River Junction. My hidden staging yard is under the streets of Seattle, (entrance in photo # 3) and it represents the Northern Pacific, & Great Northern coming out of King St. station.(photo # 1) There is a visible yard at Seattle Union station,(photo # 2) which served the Union Pacific, and the Milwaukee Road. Trains from either station pass eastbound through the wye junction at Black River. (photos # 4 & 5) After they have made their runs, they return to one of the two stations as the westbound equivalent trains.

I don't know if you're at the point of thinking about, or planning for, prototype operations yet, but I do think a staging yard would help with both your initial running of trains, and later with realistic operation.

Good Luck & Have Fun;

Traction Fan 🙂


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## afboundguy

@traction fan I am at the point of planning and appreciate your input as I want the loops to be less of a turn around loop for ease of operation and more of the realistic point to point operations of real railroads with the continuous running "needed" in model railroading so it's a fine ballance. I do like the wye idea and had wanted to incorporate other railroads specifcally the PA Power and Light as a small off shoot of the main line so maybe I can make that area for it...


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## afboundguy

As a matter of fact I was using old flex track to mark out some rough plans last night... Of course the part by the HW heater and chimney will drastically change... I just used small nails to hold down the track nothing fancy...


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## afboundguy

As of right now the curve by the HW heater is 18"-20" on the outside track so the inside curve may not work (3rd picture)... Even more reason to move the HW heater!!!


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## afboundguy

In regard to having a switching yard I was curious if it would be better to have it towards the front of the benchwork with the mailines beind it or mainline in front of the benchwork with the yard in the back by the wall? I'm leaning towards having the yard in the front to make the mainline...

So basically in this picture yard to right of mainline or relocate mainline to right with the yard to the left...


----------



## afboundguy

I've been in a work training all week and I'm finishing the projects earlier than a lot of my fellow trainees so I've been doing train research and planning to pass the time and I think I've come up with what will be the final layout plan... It'll afford me ample opportunities to have interchanges with Reading, Erie, B&O, Lehigh Valley and Western Maryland Railroads if needed and gives me 3 switching yard options... I plan to put up a divider wall on the right side with Philadelphia being at the tip so I can have some of the splits from Philadelphia... I won't have a huge totally accurate Philadelphia models by any means but I'll do my best...

For the 3 yards I'll Frazer yard, Lancaster yard and then a scaled down Altoona Yard. I'll be able to have the Susquehanna River in there and a scalled down Harrisburg. At the little part by the steps I would make that the straight mainline after Altoona on it's way to Pittsburg while still having it loop around Altoona for continuous operations...

With the wall at the top right I'll make the line from Philadelphia to Pottsville line go through the wall and make the line coming out on the other side of the wall the real line that branches onto the mainline in that area from Honeybrook area so I can still have continuous operations while keeping it as close to how it was in real life...

Drawings are not to scale by anymeans I just did a more final rough draft after several ideas and like this one the best...


----------



## afboundguy

Just to clarify the single lines are just to delineate the path of the mainlines and I plan to run 2, 3 or 4 line mainlines throughout and try to replicate as best I can how many mainlines were at each specific spot as it changes from 2-4 depending on locatio... The loops would be double mainlines looping back to make the second half of the 2-4 line mainline...


----------



## afboundguy

Laid out some track to get general ideas and I ended up doing a loop to test out my newly acquired track cutting skills... I do need to oil up the new Spectrum cars so excuse the squeaking


----------



## SantaFeJim

Congratulations, you have come a long way in the last 9 months. It is good that you can run trains for now while you contemplate your next steps.


----------



## afboundguy

SantaFeJim said:


> Congratulations, you have come a long way in the last 9 months. It is good that you can run trains for now while you contemplate your next steps.


Thanks it's been fun. As I've mentioned before one of the best things I like about this hobby is that if I don't do anything nothing dies like with my saltwater reef tank!


----------



## afboundguy

Today I had my electrician hook up the separate breaker for just the trains. His kids and another buddy and his family were over for a corn maze we do every year together. I probably look like a weirdo because we don't have kids but my two buddies do! I know it probably doesn't need one but since there were new outlets placed and it's in the basement near the panel I figured it was worth the little bit of extra work. 

I also purchased the MRC Prodigy Advanced 2 DCC controller that will be here in a few days and hope to take full advantage of that with some of the new DCC engines!

A few days ago I ended up going my first DCC upgrade on one of the Proto 2K FA units and both the engine and myself survived. So I ended up ordering a TCS wow sound set up for one of the Spectrum K4's to try and tackle next week.

While my buddy was over I had to keep his two kids busy so I showed them the layout and ended up making a video of my BLI SD7 pulling some coal cars with a few boxcars...


----------



## afboundguy

Just purchased a real DCC setup 😎 I also attempted to swap out/install a TCS wow decoder and speaker in my Spectrum K4 but didn't have time so that's next on my to do list.

I also ordered some background. Once I get that up I'll start to really secure the layout and really laying track!


----------



## afboundguy

Hoping to tackle this project today


----------



## Stumpy

Looking forward to the results.

Take your vitamins.


----------



## afboundguy

Moved around my RO/DI water filter for my fish tank water under the layout and threw up another sheet of masonite...


----------



## afboundguy

Quick couple of coats of kilz primer/sealer... Had to cut a small whole through the masonite for the valve for the RO/DI hookup...


----------



## afboundguy

Finally threw up some PRR wooden signs as well... One at the bottom of the stairs and one to the left of the layout...


----------



## afboundguy

Not the best background but for 1/5-1/6 the price it'll do and I do like it a lot! Hopefully tomorrow I can start laying the roadbed and track but I should really clean up the yard and go to the dump after the northeastern storm we got a few days ago... 

I will at least try and get some better close ups of the backdrop tomorrow as well...


----------



## afboundguy

Purchased some lumbar for the pull out workbench but didn't have time to install it had to clean up post storm yard and squeeze 8 yard bags full of crap into my car to take to the dump so that killed up a lot of time today...

Took a close up'ish video of the backdrop...


----------



## afboundguy

Purchased a 2'x4'x3/4" piece of plywood and some 2x6 to install the pull out work bench from under the left side table that doesn't have anything except junk on it but I feel like I should clean my tank today since I'm picking up a new one today!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Upgrading from a 25 gallon to a 35 gallon... I had a local store drill the holes for the plumbing...


----------



## afboundguy

Finally had the heating system talk with the wife this weekend. Took me forever to have it between our hectic work schedules were we barely see each other and life just getting in the way. She was receptive but mentioned she wouldn't agree to anything until I cleaned/organized the basement... 

I did agree with her as it was a total mess...


----------



## afboundguy

Tad bit better... Well at least I think so we'll see what she says


----------



## afboundguy

I did install the pull out desk to make a work area... Just a 2'x4'x3/4" piece of plywood... All I need to do to finish it up is put some small strips along the back and sides to prevent stuff from falling off and either poly it or paint it...


----------



## afboundguy

I was also asked to move the "to the trains" sign I put at the bottom of the steps as she could see if from the kitchen if she opened the basement door...

Happy wife = happy'ish wife as I always say


----------



## afboundguy

Buddy of mine who models 1950's-1960's B&M found a PRR lantern at a train swap. He sent me a picture and I texted him back asking him to buy it for me. He said he bought it for himself and I even offered him double what he paid for it ($70). I think he bought it just to tease me for weeks as he finally caved and let me buy it off him for what he paid ($35). I ended up giving him $40 since I was going to the ATM and didn't feel like making change... I told him it was a finders fee 

It didn't have the kerosene can in the bottom which I was fine with... I ended up buying a rechargeable LED flickering remote controlled "candle" that I'm happy with... It's not as cool as real flame but it doesn't smell and I don't have to worry about CO poisoning/death when I turn it on in the basement!!! 

I just need to find a nice spot to hang it in the basement now


----------



## afboundguy

Finally got the go ahead from the wife for the new boiler and hot water heater which will be relocated to free up plenty of room for the layout!!! Just applied for the free 0% loan and rebates from the gas company...


----------



## afboundguy

Started the new boiler project... Built a wall for the new boiled to mount to and it should get mounted tomorrow if I'm lucky (my plumber wants it out of his van ) and with any luck next Tues or Wed it'll all be hooked up!!!

Had to rearrange whole basement so it's a mess again


----------



## afboundguy

It worked for the Egyptians building pyramids and the concept still works!!! Could barely move the work bench out of the way for the new wall without it!


----------



## afboundguy

Few 2x4's, some plywood and paint makes it look spiffy!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Going to build a cement pad to level out where a huge fieldstone rock sticks up through the floor. It's always driven me nuts as I can't put anything on it. I'll be able to relocate the water softner on the pad and add some shelving to create even more room in the basement


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> It worked for the Egyptians building pyramids and the concept still works!!!




I moved a 500 lb. gun safe with the same modern technology.


----------



## Lemonhawk

Another consideration. Open ceiling joyce means that as people are walki8ng on the floor above, it will knock dirt and debris down on your layout.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> I moved a 500 lb. gun safe with the same modern technology.


I've never really used it as I've always relied on brute force from numerous friends but man I will be using it again!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Lemonhawk said:


> Another consideration. Open ceiling joyce means that as people are walki8ng on the floor above, it will knock dirt and debris down on your layout.


Someone else brought up this concern but it's never really been an issue as the basement stays very clean and I vacuum and clean the joists several times a year. There hasn't been any noticeable dust or dirt on the rigid insulation foam that I painted. I also may paint the joists white to make the basement ceiling seem higher than it really is but I'm also assuming the wife wouldn't be a fan of that!


----------



## afboundguy

Boiler was dropped off and hung up... Nothing connected though...


----------



## afboundguy

11 bags of 80 lb cement mix down into the basement sucked... I'm sure I'll be way more sore than I am right now tomorrow...


----------



## afboundguy

Framed out the concrete slab...


----------



## afboundguy

Poured about half of it before I was dragged to our favorite Indian restaurant for lunch... Figured it would also possibly cure faster plus I broke the tub I was mixing the concrete in


----------



## afboundguy

Side note after all these non-layout related pictures of the basement progress (which I think are layout related as it's all part of my master basement plan aimed at maximizing the allowable size of said layout) is that I should be getting back to actual layout work as the boiler should hopefully be plumbed on Tuesday and the swap out should either happen Tuesday or Wednesday... After tomorrow night I'm off from work until next Thursday with no plans to actually go anywhere plus the wife will be back teaching after Turkey Day weekend so I'll have nothing to do except work on the layout!!! Work email will be set to auto reply, I'll be shutting off the work cell phone and taking a much needed break from work!!! 

Besides getting back to actual layout work I also plan to work on the new fishtank upgrade/swap... Wife "suggested" I not start the upgrade/swap until after Turkey Day and since she was fine with me shelling out 5 figures for a new boiler I figured I better take that "suggestion" to heart!


----------



## afboundguy

Poured rest of slab on Monday so the plumbers could start today...


----------



## afboundguy

The big debacle with the wife was that they needed to cut through her prescious cement board siding 

Was worried she'd come home all upset about everything but she could barely notice it once it was painted...


----------



## afboundguy

Boiler is finally in... Been a stressful PITA with the wife as she's a total PITA and can hear the "noise" from the new boiler but that's another story for another day and probably best saved for a professional 

Water softener was moved yesterday and I was able to move the work bench to the what I'm sure will be a spot that the wife won't approve of even though I can "do whatever I want in the basement" and she agreed to that spot 

It actually works out well that she's mad at me as she took the day off from work as she had parent teacher conferences until 8pm last night and she has them tomorrow as well so I'll just be in the basement trying to organize and clean it up!


----------



## afboundguy

New location of the work bench... Plan to put a shelving unit there today...


----------



## afboundguy

And the nice before the clean up comparison picture. I should have taken one before I moved the workbench as that was even worse!!!


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> ...can hear the "noise" from the new boiler


Get some insulation between those joists. Or, acoustic drop-in ceiling tiles.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Get some insulation between those joists. Or, acoustic drop-in ceiling tiles.


It's on my list of things to do when I have time


----------



## afboundguy

@Stumpy I told her I would start this morning and squeeze some in before someone comes to buy the old boiler and work at 4pm but then she wanted to get this done this morning 🥴


----------



## afboundguy

Sold the old boiler yesterday on Craigslist too bad wife knew about it those funds could have been laundered wonderfully towards the layout!!!

Took several hours (probably 4-5) putting in the insulation on the basement ceiling. The soundproof/fireproof ones were too thin and didn't stay up in the rafters so I got the thinnest rolled insulation to staple it in place... Ended up stuffing a ton behind the wall I created for the boiler so hopefully it'll "quiet" it down to wife approved levels. I texted her when I was installing it and she suggested I go upstairs to see if it quieted it down and I responded I'll wait for you as I don't really hear it when I'm upstairs  

Definitely was a long day of wearing a respirator and forgetting about wearing long sleeves when doing insulation for the first half of the installation!!!

Few before pictures...


----------



## afboundguy

And after...


----------



## afboundguy

Took old cat boxes that didn't have a place to live...








...with the goal of putting them here on the new concrete pad I laid by the boiler...


----------



## afboundguy

Build a custom wood enclosure "box" with 12" side walls so all the car liter would stay in one spot. Did 3 coats of kilz primer/sealer and 2 coats of gray paint...


----------



## afboundguy

Also put a wheel set up on the table saw that my plumber friend had kicking around his house that he was sick of moving the box around so he gave it to me for free so it will be easy to slide in and out from under the layout extention... Plan on building a similar setup with 2x4's for my grandmother's table that has all the "yard sale" stuff that wife won't let me get rid of (table not yard sale stuff)


----------



## afboundguy

Yesterday I pulled out all the boxes of train stuff and put them in the new bins I got from Target. Since it will all be on the actual layout I made room to put the "yard sale" stuff under and to better organize...


----------



## afboundguy

Have a busy week of 2 doubles, a doctors appointment and then training on my day off on Friday but fingers crossed I'll get some time to finally attach the plywood to the benchwork and then to the pink insulation and then start the expansion!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Started back on the layout again today... Moved my grandmother's table the wife won't let me get rid of under the old right side loop/turnaround...


----------



## afboundguy

Also redid said loop/turnaround and trimmed it down and added to the right and behind the chimney to complete the new loop...


----------



## afboundguy

Back side of behind the chimney... Had to move the dehumidifier out from behind the chimney...


----------



## afboundguy

Not overly happy with how this setup ended up as I had to finish up and head to work. Want to mount the TV to block the old boiler vent. Probably going to put the 2x6 inbetween the two vertical 2x4's and then use mason screws to secure it better to the chimney...


----------



## afboundguy

Redid the TV mount area... Ended up moving the left 2x4 over a little and put the 2x6 between them and screwed in eight 6" screws! I also used 3 mason screws for the horizontal 2x4 up against the chimney... Think they'll be the last thing standing in the house


----------



## afboundguy

I also removed the plywood and the insulation boards to start nailing and gluing them down...


----------



## afboundguy

Wisely I decided to hang up my train memoribelia first!!! I still have more to hang on the back wall I just need to find some frames for some old black and white photos I have...

I ended up gluing and nailing down 2 of the boards and then ran out of time before I had to go to work... Have training tomorrow but wife is going to the music theater Saturday so fingers crossed I can tackle the rest then and glue the insulation boards down as well...


----------



## afboundguy

Wife just told me she's going to her parents earlier than I thought today! They're going to the Christmas Carol and I didn't want to go for a variety of reasons and her sister drove up last night from the sticks of NY (we're in MA) for the show and I guess she's leaving right after the show is done so my wife is going early to hang out with her sister so that means more time for me to work on the layout today!!!

I am being semi-stupid and discussing with her how big the additional right side loop area should be. Even though she said do whatever I want I know she doesn't mean it and figured it may divert what I think would be WW4 (WW3 was the whole basement renovation project I think and I termed the boiler project boilergate 2021 even though that could have been WW4 )

Hopefully I'll have some nice updated pictures after working when she leaves soon! I thought she was leaving around noon but she'll be gone by 930/945 which is an extra 2 hours!!!


----------



## jackpresley

Wowser. Just read all 11 pages of this thread. 11 pages, 11 months, but 11 years worth of progress... if I was doing all that work. Very nice. Look forward to following along.


----------



## Gramps

afboundguy said:


> Wife just told me she's going to her parents earlier than I thought today! They're going to the Christmas Carol and I didn't want to go for a variety of reasons and her sister drove up last night from the sticks of NY (we're in MA) for the show and I guess she's leaving right after the show is done so my wife is going early to hang out with her sister so that means more time for me to work on the layout today!!!
> 
> I am being semi-stupid and discussing with her how big the additional right side loop area should be. Even though she said do whatever I want I know she doesn't mean it and figured it may divert what I think would be WW4 (WW3 was the whole basement renovation project I think and I termed the boiler project boilergate 2021 even though that could have been WW4 )
> 
> Hopefully I'll have some nice updated pictures after working when she leaves soon! I thought she was leaving around noon but she'll be gone by 930/945 which is an extra 2 hours!!!


Just go for it on the theory that it's easier to get forgiveness than permission.


----------



## afboundguy

jackpresley said:


> Wowser. Just read all 11 pages of this thread. 11 pages, 11 months, but 11 years worth of progress... if I was doing all that work. Very nice. Look forward to following along.


Thanks... That's sort of freaky with all the 11's...



Gramps said:


> Just go for it on the theory that it's easier to get forgiveness than permission.


Oh I know but it ended up working out... She was first pissed then once she got to her parents she texted me an appology and said to do whatever I wanted to...


----------



## afboundguy

Taped out a rough outline...


----------



## afboundguy

Put in a center piece. I plan to add a 15'ish inch wall to separate it down the middle. Origionally I was going to go all the way to the top but I think that would close off the basement too much...


----------



## afboundguy

Not the best carpentry job but it's as level as I can make it with my totally not level flooring!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Decided against putting the TV by the chimney to block the old vent it was too low so it went to the left and I like it there... There's also a small spot under where I'll be doing a drawer for the dvd player...


----------



## afboundguy

Put on the plywood...


----------



## afboundguy

I also got two PRR dvds today that will be played on the tv while I'm down there... Can't wait to watch them!


----------



## afboundguy

Not sure if I have enough pink insulation but I'll find out over the next few days... My nephew will be coming by in a few days to do the final wirint touch ups!


----------



## afboundguy

Ended up being short on the insulation board and I will say a 4x8 sheet fits much better in the bed of a truck compared to a sedan. Ended up cutting it down to fit in the back seat... It was easier to bring down into the basement in smaller pieces!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Put in the 6 disc DVD player (mainly used for workout videos) on it's own drawer with some inexpensive drawer slides...


----------



## afboundguy

Filled in the new section with the insulation foam...


----------



## afboundguy

Also did the yard extention table with the foam. It's not 100% level so I'll have to do a small amount of shaving to level it out...


----------



## afboundguy

Painted it all to get rid of the hideous pepto-pink...


----------



## afboundguy

Plenty of extra storage next to the table saw on wheels for the new train storage bins...
*














*


----------



## JeffHurl

Looking great!!! I look forward to following your build.


----------



## vette-kid

afboundguy said:


> Ended up being short on the insulation board and I will say a 4x8 sheet fits much better in the bed of a truck compared to a sedan. Ended up cutting it down to fit in the back seat... It was easier to bring down into the basement in smaller pieces!!!
> 
> View attachment 573358


Ha, I had to do this with my highlander as well! I was in the Lowes parking lot with a straight edge and a box cutter! People thought I was nuts, haha!!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Ha, I had to do this with my highlander as well! I was in the Lowes parking lot with a straight edge and a box cutter! People thought I was nuts, haha!!


I used a cordless sawzall which actually works really well at cutting the insulation. I used it to make all the cuts today and it worked out way better than the hand cutting I did the first time on the previous sections...


----------



## afboundguy

Took tonight off from work because why the hell not? I figured since I got semi-screwed out of getting Christmas off even though it was on my bided week of vacation I opted to take an extra day off so I'm off until Dec 31st minus working Christmas 

I started off work plugging in the TV and DVD player and watched the two new PRR videos and it was like train porn... It added another layer of fun to my build and I really enjoyed watching them as I was working!


----------



## afboundguy

I had purchased some landscape fabric (stuff you can put down in gardens and planting beds to help keep weeds out) at a big box store as it was only $20-$25 for a 4'x50' roll and I figured that would be much cheaper and easier than getting that much fabric... I wasn't sure if black would look nice with the gray basement but I figured it was cheap enough and if I hated it I could use it this spring!


----------



## afboundguy

I ended up just taping it with some painters tape and I have to say it made the layout look amazing!!! I can't wait to put up the facia boards and permanently mount the fabric... I will probably get another roll just to darken it up a little bit more but for $50 plus I think another $20 for some velcro and a few curtain rods for around the squared work bench/yard extension I think it was pretty cheap...


----------



## afboundguy

I then did a little planning on the new area. I had originally wanted to do Philadelphia at the end of the loop and I was able to fit in easily the 4 line mainline from 22"-28" and I probably could squeeze that out to 30" if needed... With the curve of the track I didn't think the passenger overhang of the 30th St Station in Philadelphia would quite look right. I decided on the 30th St Station because it's straight and it's not a dead end like the Broadway Station was (plus the Broadway Station was closed several years prior to 1956)










For reference here's two areal pictures I dug up online of the 30th St Station...


----------



## Chaostrain

afboundguy said:


> I ended up just taping it with some painters tape and I have to say it made the layout look amazing!!! I can't wait to put up the facia boards and permanently mount the fabric... I will probably get another roll just to darken it up a little bit more but for $50 plus I think another $20 for some velcro and a few curtain rods for around the squared work bench/yard extension I think it was pretty cheap...
> 
> View attachment 573388
> View attachment 573389


That's a great idea! I just might steal it. 😁


----------



## afboundguy

Since the curve at the end of the loop would have been tricky I actually found a nice spot by the chimney that is straight and long enough to fit my "rescaled" (smaller) version of the station that I will build... The passenger overhang area (long straight area to the right of the actual station in 2nd picture above) would have been around 7 feet if I was doing real HO scale and the station building would have been a little under 6 feet long. I ended up getting roughly 3 feet long for the passenger overhang area and the station building will be about 2 feet long and it will be about 10 inches wide... I did some simple math to make sure I got the ratios correct on my "rescaling" and the only thing that will actually be true HO scale will be the width of the passenger overhang area, which was about 1 foot wide, since I will be trying to do all 6 lines... 

I am going to try and do the full 6 tracks that go into the station and it may be hard to tell from the picture but I did a rough outline...


----------



## afboundguy

Chaostrain said:


> That's a great idea! I just might steal it. 😁


I can't take credit someone else suggested that in either this thread or in another thread I started... It looks really nice and I showed a buddy who has a large B&M layout a picture and he might swap out. He said he uses cheap dollar tree black curtains that are always ripping!


----------



## afboundguy

Couldn't resist snapping a picture of the TV when the 2nd video started playing!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Next I tackled securing the plywood and insulation foam on the new addition... I used finish nails (a lot of them) over screws as the finish nails still make it easy to remove if I need to and the screws made it not as even... I still haven't fully secured half of the original layout as my nephew who's an electrician is coming over next Tuesday night to do the final wiring and I figured I'd be nice and not make him totally crawl under the layout and I'll just remove that area for him...


----------



## afboundguy

Then with the help of liquid nails I glued down the insulation foam to the plywood and put some light weight on some of the creases between the insulation foam so it would stay "level'ish"


----------



## afboundguy

Lastly I did a little organizing of the work bench and finally opened my new miter saw and belt sander combo... Once I hang up the rest of the masonite and get rid of the remainder it will really open up the basement... In fact it looks so open I feel like I should have made the addition bigger!!!


----------



## afboundguy

I will say this journey has been a blast... It was filled with a ton of headaches, such as moving everything around in basement to paint it, boilergate 2021 and wife just being herself (she has no forward thinking vision... She still thanks me to this day for "making" her buy our house as I saw what it could look like and she couldn't) but it is really starting to be a ton of fun now that I'm getting closer and closer to completing the benchwork...

It's been fun sharing the long adventure with everybody on here and I hope you've enjoyed it as well. I know it was full of a lot of non-train basement pictures but it should really start being train heavy picture build thread now!!!


----------



## vette-kid

Looking great! I've been following along, I just don't have anything useful to add. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## JeffHurl

Me too. I've been following, but I'm a newbie with little to add. All that work you did to prepare was well worth it. What you have going looks great!


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Looking great! I've been following along, I just don't have anything useful to add.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


No worries from 25+ years of doing saltwater tank build threads I know it's mainly people reading the posts!!!



JeffHurl said:


> Me too. I've been following, but I'm a newbie with little to add. All that work you did to prepare was well worth it. What you have going looks great!


Thanks it's been a blast... I plan to repaint the floor once I start laying track as well to get a nice cleaner look since the floor has taken a beating with all the constant moving of all the heavy stuff!


----------



## afboundguy

Today started off by taking an inventory of all the rolling stock and engines I have so I can stop buying stuff online!!! I was about to buy a few PRR reefers but I probably don't need as many as I first thought since I have quite a variety of different reefers and a few PRR ones already... I'll still probably buy them who am I kidding!


----------



## afboundguy

During my inventory I found a white PRR boxcar in with a bunch of rolling stock a co-worker gave me when her father passed and I'm curious if this color and scheme every actually really existed... I can't really find much online but I put the question out on a few FB PRR specific groups I belong to... Still a nice car and I'd probably run it even if it's a fantasy scheme...


----------



## afboundguy

After roughly an hour of doing the inventory I was going to call it quits but I couldn't... I saw the strips of masonite on the ground and had to try and at least try and see what they'd look like... They were 13" thick and I cut down a smaller piece to that dimension and held it up temporarily and it just looked too thick and just didn't look right...


----------



## afboundguy

So I ended up cutting the strips almost in half and settled on 8 inches...


----------



## afboundguy

I then cut some small pieces of wood to secure to the radii of some of the curves so I could have something better and more secure to attach the masonite to... I used larger ones for where two pieces will meet up or for a really tight curve that I wanted to secure a little bit extra...


----------



## afboundguy

I tried using finish nails at first and that didn't work so I used some screws... The first screws I used were a little too thick and stuck out a bit too much so I cut a new 8" piece and used smaller screws and while I still don't like the look of the screws they sit in better...

Thicker screws...









Thinner screws...


----------



## afboundguy

"Final" product... I plan on painting it once it's all up... I did find out that I need to lower the drawer for the DVD player as it's too high with the masonite facia up I can't access the DVD player... I was going to put up the black landscape fabric but in true me fashion I couldn't find the velcro I bought anywhere 😡


----------



## afboundguy

Found out the gray/white car is a PRR battery service car... Pretty cool and sweet little score!



https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=51511.0


----------



## afboundguy

Wife is home all next week (she's a 5th grade teacher) so progress may stall for a week. She is working her part time job Tuesday and Thursday next week so maybe I'll have a little bit of time to work on layout...

I was sick of not having a clock downstairs and sick of always looking at my cell phone for the time so I got a clock... I wanted a backlit or neon lighted one but those were $160 and well north of that so I found a simple one that was $30 shipped and it tells time just as well as the $160+ ones would have!


----------



## vette-kid

Nice!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## afboundguy

Got a new addition today from the inlaws for Christmas


----------



## afboundguy

Also got this awesome original add from my B&M friend. He dropped it off on his way to work at 11pm before I finish up at midnight 

Can't wait to hang this up... Might be a frame'able level item...


----------



## afboundguy

Went and got a nice $13 frame at homegoods (easy to get wife to agree to go there today she loves that store )

Looks great all framed up!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Also decided to move the new clock to hide that ugly cover for the old boiler exhaust tube. Was a perfect fit!


----------



## afboundguy

Now I just need to find frames for these beauties... Theyre 16x16 and I can't for the life of me find inexpensive frames for them


----------



## Murv2

Nice! I actually have the first one:


----------



## MichaelE

I hate be a pessimist, but those 2x4's are likely going to sag over time in that orientation, and the plywood along with them.

But that new plumbing sure does look purdy!


----------



## afboundguy

Murv2 said:


> Nice! I actually have the first one:
> View attachment 573645


Nice! I plan to try and get all the ones in those pictures eventually...



MichaelE said:


> I hate be a pessimist, but those 2x4's are likely going to sag over time in that orientation, and the plywood along with them.
> 
> But that new plumbing sure does look purdy!


Are you talking about the 2x4s in the layout or the 2x4s for the plumbing wall?


----------



## MichaelE

The 2x4's with the layout sub-roadbed out in front of the chimney.


----------



## afboundguy

MichaelE said:


> The 2x4's with the layout sub-roadbed out in front of the chimney.


I have been actually thinking of adding a few more vertical supports anyways so your post might put me over the edge to actually do that thanks!


----------



## afboundguy

Started to mount the landscaping fabric. I ended up doubling it up and stapled the top together. I added a strip of velcro pm the backside of the facia then the other half to the doubled up fabric and stapled that as well just for extra support... I did have to trim the facia board on the right side about 2 inches as it was too low to drag out the table saw


----------



## afboundguy

I still need to cut the bottom and adjust the top so it looks a little better but I'm happy with it. I also will probably get rid of the way right as thats where the dehumidifier is and I'd like to keep that open and unblocked...


----------



## afboundguy

I also lowered the dvd player as that was too high as well once a facia would be installed. I ended up scrapping the drawer slides so I can use them somewhere else and they're probably not really needed...


----------



## afboundguy

Also hooked up a space heater to a smart plug since it's getting cold down there!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Prepwork for nephew coming tonight...


----------



## afboundguy

Also couldn't help myself bring a few coal cars to do a little running session on my buddy's B&M layout...


----------



## afboundguy

Ended up not having good luck with running my BLI I1sa as it had a mini derailment on my friend's layout and two of the wires on the connecting pin broke off  Pretty annoyed at the quality for the price so I ended up running my NW2 switcher for a bit...


----------



## afboundguy

My nephew came over and wired in the GFCI and the switch and wiring for the lighting. While I had that side taken up I really thought it would be wise to put in track lighting before I secured that area for good so I ended up ordering 4 sets of THESE LIGHTS on amazon. I bought 2 of the 5000K and 2 of the 2700K so I can mix and match and worse case scenario I can buy new bulbs which I had originally planned on doing anyways but this way I'll at least have some bulbs and light short term...

I should get the lights by next Mon/Tues so I guess I'll have to just focus on maybe laying track bed on the side that is secured down and with any luck I can do that tonight as the wife has some zoom meeting she wants to go to tonight...


----------



## vette-kid

If you want to make some cool scenery, use RGB LEDs. My scenery isn't very realistic (kid friendly) but the LED allows for some pretty cool effects and can be useful to replicate nighttime, dusk, dawn, sunset etc. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> If you want to make some cool scenery, use RGB LEDs. My scenery isn't very realistic (kid friendly) but the LED allows for some pretty cool effects and can be useful to replicate nighttime, dusk, dawn, sunset etc.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


I definately had thought about that option as I have done that with a strip behind a fish tank at the bottom for cool lighting effects... For now I'll stick with the lights it comes with and slowly upgrade lights down the road as I have plenty of other things I need to do and I'm pretty sure I'm a long ways off from serious scenery where lighting would enhance it!


----------



## afboundguy

Who's idea was it to do a 4 rail mainline? I can't decide if I was the wall (two lines with z's) to curve (left one) or go straight at an angle (right one). Thoughts? Philly will be on the right with the 30th St Station...

Curves wall lets me do a little more of Philly while straight angled one opens up possibility for another yard coming off the mainline or making that town bigger (not sure if I want to do the town or a yard)


----------



## afboundguy

Put up some masonite to frame up the rest of the expansion yesterday... First one was a PITA with the TV had to do several cut and test fits...


----------



## afboundguy

Then it wa off to the races...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

I was going to leave the space behind the chimney open but realized the curve would be to sharp so I'll end up doing a cut through "tunnel"


----------



## afboundguy

I realized I couldn't get the masonite to curve like one of my options above was so I cut out a piece if scrap plywood... Think I'll be going with the wall to separate Philly from the other side as it doesn't look like it would make the rooom feel smaller which is what I was worried about if I did do a wall...


----------



## afboundguy

Got half of the track lighting installed today (other half will arrive Tuesday) and as I was snapping picutures to share I got a lovely phone call from work saying I was getting held over for the midnight shift  Love me a nice 16 hour 4pm-8am shift!!!

Totally stinks as I was going to work on the layout tomorrow and mail out some items I sold to members and those plans are out the door now 

At least the lights look amazing!!! I have 2 more 6 light setups coming and I think I may put in a 4 light set up on the back wall to the right of where the 2nd light stops. A 6 light setup probably wouldn't work with the TV there and adding that would allow me to better light the new expansion area...


----------



## afboundguy

Between my forced lovely 16+ hour overnight shift and some less than fulfilling sleep before work again tonight I had to go look at the lighting again. I left the rest of the basement lighting off and just had the track lighting on an man did it pop! The pictures don't really do it any justice... I'll have to bust out the DSLR and take some better pictures once the rest of the trak lighting goes up over the next few days...


----------



## OilValleyRy

That looks really good. A light blocking material tacked up to the joists to obscure the bulbs and focus the illumination downward only will make things pop even more… for very little cost & effort. 
Even temporarily using black plastic garbage bags just to see would be a good proof of concept test for your eyes.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That looks really good. A light blocking material tacked up to the joists to obscure the bulbs and focus the illumination downward only will make things pop even more… for very little cost & effort.
> Even temporarily using black plastic garbage bags just to see would be a good proof of concept test for your eyes.


I had thought about doing something similar and even having them mounted inside the joists more but the way they bend made it not totally practical. I may experiment with that with the other lights but they won't line up parallel to the joints as nicely as those two so I figured mounting them like that would be better so they would all match but I could easily put something to block it out and I appreciate the suggestion of using garbage bags as a test! The lights should arrive today and my work got cancelled for tomorrow so once I head to the Post Office to mail out some items I will be tackling the rest of the light install and I'll try the garbage bag test!


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy I didn't end up trying the light blocking idea just yet but I did re-arrange the lights and shoved them up in the rafters as high as I could and it makes a big difference! The end where I had to go across the rafters but I think that will be very easy to put something in front of them to block it. I will probably still do it for the ones I jammed up in the rafters just for a little extra hiding... 

Before....


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## afboundguy

After... Digging it a lot! I bought two 6 bulb setups with 5,000K bulbs, two 6 bulb setups with 2,700K bulbs and I added a 4 bulb set up with 5,000K lights and I mixed the 5,000K and 2,700K bulbs evenly and really like the look...


----------



## afboundguy

My only real issue I have is the new addition where I have lights on both sides. I had originally thought about doing the separation wall all the way to the top but felt like that would make the basement feel smaller but I may have to revisit wanting to do the separation wall all the way up as from either side you can see the lights from the other side. I will try and do a temporary wall up to the ceiling and see how that looks and also I will try and use some masonite to try and shield the lights from the other side to see how that works as well...

I'm sort of excited about the wall going to the top as that would mean I could fill it with more train memorabilia or maybe even do a 2nd layer like I wanted to...

I'd be eager to hear everybody's input on wall to top or half wall like in post 282... The lights on the right side of the below picture I couldn't get any higher due to the weird funky framing in the rafters


----------



## afboundguy

Tomorrow's plan is to actually pick up some paint and paint all the wires that are in the rafters as I feel like they are distracting and draw your eyes upwards even more now that the track lighting is up. I picked up some paint sample cars from the local paint store on my way home from grocery shopping and I narrowed it down to two colors to try and match the rafters as close as possible. I also plan to try and tackle @OilValleyRy idea and use some garbage bags or even some of the landscaping fabric to see how much a difference hiding the track lighting does.

If I can manage I'll nail down and glue the original area now that the lights and wiring are done and then hopefully install more of the landscape fabric to hide all the junk under the layout. The velcro didn't stay and it ended up falling off so I picked up a small craft glue gun that I will use to help it stay better...


----------



## OilValleyRy

*Don’t paint those wires*. 
That’d be a code violation. Modern romex has color coded insulation. White = 14, yellow = 12, orange = 10. 
If you absolutely can’t stand the sight of them, and a valance/curtain will not hide them, then put blue painters tape over the wires and paint the tape, *not* the wires.

Also, are thkse “bulbs” LED or halogen? If the latter, they get seriously hot. Being tucked up between joists could be deemed a fire hazard. If they’re LEDs it’d be of no concern. Even a 60W incandescent mounted sideways between joists is a fire hazard & code violation.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> *Don’t paint those wires*.
> That’d be a code violation. Modern romex has color coded insulation. White = 14, yellow = 12, orange = 10.
> If you absolutely can’t stand the sight of them, and a valance/curtain will not hide them, then put blue painters tape over the wires and paint the tape, *not* the wires.


Thanks for the information I'll check in with my electrician nephew to see if for some reason it's allowed in my state...



OilValleyRy said:


> Also, are thkse “bulbs” LED or halogen? If the latter, they get seriously hot. Being tucked up between joists could be deemed a fire hazard. If they’re LEDs it’d be of no concern. Even a 60W incandescent mounted sideways between joists is a fire hazard & code violation.


They're LED bulbs. I wanted LED for the cost savings, longer life span and especially for the heat aspect!


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy I talked to my friend who's an electrician and he said there's nothing against code to paint the wires but he did advise against painting them. I tried holding up some masonite to box in the lights and I think that will do the trick enough...


----------



## afboundguy

Finally finally tackled securing down the rest of the layout today...


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## afboundguy

I also used the glue gun to resecure the velcro hopefully it stays better... I'm about to get a haircut for work tonight and hope to be able to put together some more of the landscaping fabric around the rest of the layout if I have time...


----------



## JeffHurl

Ya gotta love making progress!

I'm starting to see my layout come together... been planning and gathering for about a year now, but the build has really just begun over the past month or so.


----------



## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> @OilValleyRy I talked to my friend who's an electrician and he said there's nothing against code to paint the wires but he did advise against painting them. I tried holding up some masonite to box in the lights and I think that will do the trick enough...


Could’ve sworn it is as that would negate the built in safety feature of color coding them. If they’re all the same color Mr Knucklehead Esq. III some 35 years from now might DIY a 120v receptacle off a painted over #10 30A circuit… because they cant tell the difference. Anyway, preventing things like that is the why-for of the color coding. Call it an Anti Natural Selection feature. Misidentifying wires or failing to identify repurposed wires is a violation, and I’d expect many inspectors would see romex jackets fall under that. 
That was the basis of my concern though, along with halogens; fire hazard. 
All good though.

Incidentally, a few days earlier I was looking at how all that wire was run along what looks like plywood near that post. That’s pretty crazy looking, though I’ve seen sheer insanity before lol I was trying to figure out why it was done that way. Not important to know really. I’m guessing cold air return(s) not seen in the photo. Screwball way of doing it but sometimes you have no choice.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Ya gotta love making progress!
> 
> I'm starting to see my layout come together... been planning and gathering for about a year now, but the build has really just begun over the past month or so.


Yep it's about damn time too lol... Great feeling for sure...



OilValleyRy said:


> Could’ve sworn it is as that would negate the built in safety feature of color coding them. If they’re all the same color Mr Knucklehead Esq. III some 35 years from now might DIY a 120v receptacle off a painted over #10 30A circuit… because they cant tell the difference. Anyway, preventing things like that is the why-for of the color coding. Call it an Anti Natural Selection feature. Misidentifying wires or failing to identify repurposed wires is a violation, and I’d expect many inspectors would see romex jackets fall under that.
> That was the basis of my concern though, along with halogens; fire hazard.
> All good though.
> 
> Incidentally, a few days earlier I was looking at how all that wire was run along what looks like plywood near that post. That’s pretty crazy looking, though I’ve seen sheer insanity before lol I was trying to figure out why it was done that way. Not important to know really. I’m guessing cold air return(s) not seen in the photo. Screwball way of doing it but sometimes you have no choice.


It's how the wiring was when we bought the house. I've added maybe 1 extra line for the lights. My buddy also said while it's not against code to paint the wires he said he advised against it as technically it could cause the wiring to heat up and cause issues...


----------



## afboundguy

Today I finally secured and glued down the rest of the layout!!!









Weighed it down...


----------



## afboundguy

Finally bought me some of my favorite winter beer and had to have with lunch before I organized the shed.... Figured it was about time I put the lawnmower in the back since we're supposed to get around 8 inches of snow...


----------



## afboundguy

After the shed and Sam Winter I finished the facia board for the rest of the layout and glued the velcro behind it. Shed took too much time so I couldn't do the landscape fabric... Wife got a snow day tomorrow so that will cramp my style as she'll probably want to hang out with me for some weird reason


----------



## afboundguy

Rest of the layout...


----------



## afboundguy

Overall shot and a quick walk around video I took... 1956 PRR layout facia board


----------



## afboundguy

The raised facia board will be for this scene I plan on trying to model from the PRR mainline


----------



## vette-kid

That's looking fantastic! Went from a dark basement to a proper man cave! Awesome work!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## vette-kid

afboundguy said:


> Finally bought me some of my favorite winter beer and had to have with lunch before I organized the shed.... Figured it was about time I put the lawnmower in the back since we're supposed to get around 8 inches of snow...
> View attachment 574471


I've had to mow the lawn in January, wearing sweatpants and a sweatshirt. Florida be crazy like that!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> That's looking fantastic! Went from a dark basement to a proper man cave! Awesome work!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk





vette-kid said:


> I've had to mow the lawn in January, wearing sweatpants and a sweatshirt. Florida be crazy like that!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


Interesting I went from being thankful and happy to upset and mad lol (activly snowing as I woke up)


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> Interesting I went from being thankful and happy to upset and mad lol (activly snowing as I woke up)
> View attachment 574486
> View attachment 574487



Yup coming down like crazy here got 4" expecting another 3 or so more inches. Just got home from work and had to drive in it. With surprisingly being our first real snowfall ( which is very rare by this time of winter since I live in Ohio in what is considered the snow belt due to lake Erie) but like always you have those that seemingly forgot how to drive in the snow and go all over the road......


----------



## JeffHurl

I'm in the Columbus Ohio area. We got maybe 1/2" but it hit hardest right during the evening rush hour. Lots of people on the road who apparently need to learn how to drive.

Regarding layouts... I had one of those minor setbacks last night. I was all set to secure tunnel portals and retaining walls (I have 4 tunnels with 6 portals) when my wife said "you sould paint those first." I hate it when she's right...😣


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> Yup coming down like crazy here got 4" expecting another 3 or so more inches. Just got home from work and had to drive in it. With surprisingly being our first real snowfall ( which is very rare by this time of winter since I live in Ohio in what is considered the snow belt due to lake Erie) but like always you have those that seemingly forgot how to drive in the snow and go all over the road......





JeffHurl said:


> I'm in the Columbus Ohio area. We got maybe 1/2" but it hit hardest right during the evening rush hour. Lots of people on the road who apparently need to learn how to drive.
> 
> Regarding layouts... I had one of those minor setbacks last night. I was all set to secure tunnel portals and retaining walls (I have 4 tunnels with 6 portals) when my wife said "you sould paint those first." I hate it when she's right...😣


We went from 1-3 inches expected to now 8-12 inches and it's already well past 6 inches and it's supposed to keep going another 4-5 hours!


----------



## afboundguy

But with all that snow I was able to get a little hung up... Only one more piece... If only I didn't have to shovel and do another stupid online doctor's appoimtment in a few minutes!


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> We went from 1-3 inches expected to now 8-12 inches and it's already well past 6 inches and it's supposed to keep going another 4-5 hours!



Same here except the snow I'm getting is not a system moving thru its pure lake effect and will continue until either the wind shifts another direction or the lake freezes over lol.


----------



## afboundguy

About to go head out to snowblow before work but I finished the last piece after work and it looks much better! I do want to cut the bottoms so they are just barely hanging and then use the glue gun to glue the bottoms together...


----------



## afboundguy

Little before and after overall shot... Definately cleans up the whole look!


----------



## afboundguy

47 nice mix of used atlas and peco turnouts arrived for about $5 a turnout shipped... Couldn't pass up that deal when I saw it! I'm sure to put them to good use hopefully this upcoming week!


----------



## afboundguy

Who gets two gallons of elmers glue? Model railroaders thats who! My wife was even blown away and she's a 5th grade teacher 🤣


----------



## Gramps

I wonder how well the school glue compares to Elmer's Glue All. I would think for school kids it would be more for use on bonding paper.


----------



## Stumpy

I wondered the same thing, Gramps.









Elmer's Glue All vs School Glue


They look alike but they aren't exactly the same, even if Wikipedia says they are. Let's look at Elmer's Glue All vs School Glue, and when to use each.




dfarq.homeip.net


----------



## OilValleyRy

That skirting really kicked it up a notch! 
Did you decide if you’re going to have an identical valance curtain along the joists?


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> I wonder how well the school glue compares to Elmer's Glue All. I would think for school kids it would be more for use on bonding paper.





Stumpy said:


> I wondered the same thing, Gramps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Elmer's Glue All vs School Glue
> 
> 
> They look alike but they aren't exactly the same, even if Wikipedia says they are. Let's look at Elmer's Glue All vs School Glue, and when to use each.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dfarq.homeip.net


You guys had me worried I got the wrong type of glue but it will be mainly for ballasting so looks like it'll work after reading that link!


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That skirting really kicked it up a notch!


Yes it does and I love it! It will look even better once I trim the bottoms so it hangs better...



OilValleyRy said:


> Did you decide if you’re going to have an identical valance curtain along the joists?


Sorry I've been up for 16+ hours and still at work for another 1+ hours and I'm not 100% sure what you're referring to here 😟


----------



## afboundguy

So I picked up some "tuscan red" paint at the paint store. I brought a rolling stock that had the color I liked and matched it pretty closely to a paint sample card... Funny the name of the paint is covered bridge!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Tested it out on the back side first to see how I liked it...


----------



## afboundguy

Liked it so much I finished the rest of it!!! It looks even better with a 2nd coat on and it dry. It's exactly the look, shade, dullness I was looking for!!!

Before...









After!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Still not certain if I want to do a yellow line like I discussed in THIS THREAD POST #16 to mimic a GG1 paint scheme but I think I may be painting those two poles the same color red from the top of the facia board to the ground and them from the top of the facia board to the top a flat black... 

I also got a few goodies today in the mail!!!
















I will be getting a blue globe for this lantern in the future to compliment the red one I already have...


----------



## Gramps

I wouldn't do the stripe unless you can get the PENNSYLVANIA lettering in with it. But then the question becomes is it too much distraction from the layout. I think keep this idea on hold. Just saying.


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> I wouldn't do the stripe unless you can get the PENNSYLVANIA lettering in with it. But then the question becomes is it too much distraction from the layout. I think keep this idea on hold. Just saying.


That's how I think I'm going to play it I feel it maybe too much. I have the PRR stickers on order and I may not even want to use those...


----------



## afboundguy

Got the top mostly cleaned off today


----------



## Raege

the fascia and skirting look great. I’m enjoying following your progress thanks for sharing


----------



## afboundguy

@Raege thanks I'm glad you're enjoying the ride!


----------



## afboundguy

I messed around with SCARM today very briefly to try and get the rough track planning better... For the new loop it will have 4 lines and when it goes around the chimney into 6 lines to mimic the 30th St Station and then back to 2 lines once it goes behind the chimney and meets up with the 4 lines... The way I had the 2 lines meet back up with the 4 lines behind the chimney seems like it will work without having to wire for a reverse loop...


----------



## afboundguy

With this track layout I can have continuous running on the outside loop (green line) and continuous running on the 2nd most outside line (yellow line). This also leaves the 2 inner lines to be able to incorporate some yards and other things as well. I do plan to add a ton more turnouts so that trains can access and switch between lines I just the mainlines...


----------



## Stumpy

Yep. You have a reverse loop in there... at least one.

Follow the red arrows.


----------



## afboundguy

@Stumpy would it still be a reverse loop if your top arrow going left to right is reversed? I had planned on running trains for that track the opposite direction so they would always loop back around and come back on the second to bottom line of the 4 line main at top left?


----------



## Stumpy

As I understand it, if the possibility exists for a train to run both directions on any given track, then you have aa reverse loop.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> As I understand it, if the possibility exists for a train to run both directions on any given track, then you have aa reverse loop.


Ok thanks for the clarification and it makes sense to me I've just never wired a DCC layout but I was just at my friend's house and he showed me how it's done with his layout... I'm much more of a visual hands on learner so after seeing what he did (and how easy it appears) I should be able to handle it pretty easily...


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> I should be able to handle it pretty easily...


Agree. Products like the Digitrax AS1 make it a snap.






AutoReversing


Listing of all current Digitrax products.




www.digitrax.com


----------



## afboundguy

Yesterday I got a replica glass sign I bought on Ebay. My buddy bought a B&M one so we got a little discount plus we split shipping... He wasn't working last night so I resisted the urge to open it and had some training near his house so I swung by before going home and we opened it and were pretty impressed... Here's his...


----------



## afboundguy

And mine... My buddy was also kind enough to give me the PRR stock sheet and matting he had because wanted "that PRR crap" out of his house to make room for more B&M stuff! 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Decided to hang the sign from the rafter and make it do double duty by blocking the track lighting... I had planned on changing the light in the left (just the lightbulb) that turns on when you flip the switch at the top of the steps and now this makes me want to move it even more as it casts a glare on part of the sign. I also might try and hang some small leds to illimunate it...

Before...


----------



## afboundguy

With a 2x4 and lag bolts...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

I bought some glass mirror hanging stuff but it was ugly so I just used 4 black screws to hold it in place...


----------



## afboundguy

I also got some other goodies delevered today!


----------



## afboundguy

Since the sign's 2nd job of blocking the track lighting looked so nice I started to hang some masonite to block the rest of the lights... Only did about half the layout and I need to do a few small adjustments. I had to adjust the masonite as it needed to hang down at different heights so I tried to blend it in...

Before...


----------



## afboundguy

After... I was able to do a curved peice from the sign to the part where I put a straight peice...


----------



## afboundguy

Looks really sharp with just the track lighting turned on!


----------



## Chops

Hey AF, opened that SW1500 today, finally. Itsa beauty, looks to be nearly NOS. Definitely out of place though for the PRR. 

My great grandfather was a fifty year man on the PRR. Started when it was link and pin as a brake man when brake men actually were brake men. Somehow kept all his fingers, but nearly got his head squashed like a melon between two old link and pin cars. Before that he was a mule drover on the Susquehannah canal.


----------



## Chops

Had no idea the PRR dabbled in the Aerotrain!


----------



## afboundguy

Chops said:


> Had no idea the PRR dabbled in the Aerotrain!


Yep not for very long and only in 1956 I believe... I picked the year 1956 and found out after they had the PRR in that year so I've purchased some Bowser/Varney PRR stock to have it on the layout!


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Looks really sharp with just the track lighting turned on!


It does.

I gotta admit, I thought track lighting looked fine before and thought, "Why is he doing that?" But it does look mo betta now.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> I gotta admit, I thought track lighting looked fine before and thought, "Why is he doing that?" But it does look mo betta now.


I can't take full credit someone posted I should raise the track lighting when I first posted pictures and/add something so they're blocked. After seeing how nice it looked with the sign I hele up some scrap masonite and jump started it and I'm glad I did! Fingers crossed I can finish the rest tomorrow!


----------



## afboundguy

Had big plans today that were cut short by only 3-4 hours of sleep... I tried doing a little bit in the basement to see if I'd be a semi-functioning adult to decide if I could survive work at 4pm... Added a few small masonite pieces around what I did yesterday...


----------



## afboundguy

Put a small piece from the corner of the stairs to where two pieces met. Cut down on some glare...


----------



## afboundguy

That piece also helped cut down seeing the lights further down a bit...


----------



## afboundguy

I also relocated the far right set of track lighting as I didn't like how it would have looked if I put masonite up to block it... 

Before...


----------



## afboundguy

After...


----------



## afboundguy

After doing those small projects I determined I wouldn't survive work so I took a sick day and axed working anymore on the layout today from a physical standpoint... I'll be regulating myself to couch duties with my two dogs and going through some of my PRR books to do some more track planning...


----------



## afboundguy

Was able to finally found some decently priced frames for several pictures I have to hang. I found 6 frames for around $50 on sale at HomeGoods. Best price I could find was $60 for 3 frames on amazon. 16"x16" frames are far and few between. These frames are 18"x18" and I think I like the white background better than the brown...


----------



## afboundguy

Got the extra 4 bulb track lighting arrived a few days ago so this morning I moved some of the track lighting further up so it's more hidden...

Before...


----------



## afboundguy

After...


----------



## afboundguy

New 4 bulb one for behind the chimney...


----------



## afboundguy

Got another lantern to hang as well!


----------



## afboundguy

Also got the stickers for the facia board... I ordered yellow tape in various widths to see what would look best for the facia if I even do the stripe...


----------



## afboundguy

Tomorrow I'm making a trip to a model train shop that's about an hour away with my friend who models the B&M to spend the money I made freezing to death this past Saturday when I played the bagpipes for a funeral... I have several wye turnouts I ordered already on ebay that I should get by Sat and I plan to buy some curves turnouts, some ballasting and hopefully the Walthers Union Station kit to kitbash as well as some other scratchbuilding materials to do the bridges around the 30th St Station!


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## NorthwestPennsyGuy

afboundguy said:


> Dogs again were zero help at all!!!
> View attachment 553465
> View attachment 553466


only help they is looking VERY CUTE!


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## OilValleyRy

Looking good! Saw that lantern and wondered if you were gonna convert it…. But that’s a good idea using a battery candle.
I’ve been meaning to ask if you have any Bowser steamers in your fleet? BLI has made them mostly undesirable I suppose. But I doubt BLI locos are as easy to modify to get different classes (H-7, H-8, H-9, etc). Or maybe don’t answer that and surprise us all with triple head end L-1s when track is installed.


----------



## afboundguy

Today while waiting for my buddy to get to my house I decided to try and rewire the track light switch into the dual switch so I would only have a single box there for both sets of lights and I did something and it kept tripping the gfci so I put the old dimmer back on and it still tripped  Luckily it looks like my nephew can swing by tomorrow night to hopefully fix my stupid mistake... Sort of ruined the trip to the train store as I wanted to show off the lighting to my buddy 

And to top it off I need to go back and get some right curved turnouts as I thought I only needed left ones opps!!! But fun trip and bought some needed items!!!


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Looking good! Saw that lantern and wondered if you were gonna convert it…. But that’s a good idea using a battery candle.


Yeah all three lanterns I have don't have the wick/kerosene can so I bought a few of those flickering lights and kept the one that looked the best...



OilValleyRy said:


> I’ve been meaning to ask if you have any Bowser steamers in your fleet? BLI has made them mostly undesirable I suppose. But I doubt BLI locos are as easy to modify to get different classes (H-7, H-8, H-9, etc). Or maybe don’t answer that and surprise us all with triple head end L-1s when track is installed.


No bowser steamers in my fleet just BLI and Spectrums so far... Only bowser engine I have so far will be the Aerotrain. I have been looking at other steamer manufacturers but I pumped the brakes on the rolling stock and engine spending to "try" and focus on getting the layout actually up and running... If I hadn't have messed up and gotten both side curved turnouts I could have started tomorrow but instead I will use my free time tomorrow to try and swing back up to the train store...


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy I am so close to buying a "new" partially built H9 for under $80 shipped but I really shouldn't as I have too many projects already buy I'm blaming you for this new project I want to do now!!!


----------



## vette-kid

afboundguy said:


> @OilValleyRy I am so close to buying a "new" partially built H9 for under $80 shipped but I really shouldn't as I have too many projects already buy I'm blaming you for this new project I want to do now!!!


Haha, too many projects!? It never ends go ahead and throw another on the pile!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> @OilValleyRy I am so close to buying a "new" partially built H9 for under $80 shipped but I really shouldn't as I have too many projects already buy I'm blaming you for this new project I want to do now!!!


Lol well I know that feeling. My big budget crushing projects are not train related, and blocking progress on trains, so that’s my Spring priority to get fewer irons in the fire. New furnace, AC, WH, drain line, outdoor spigot supply lines, drywall the train room, & erect 70 ft of privacy fence too. Hence I’ve only built one template section of benchwork, saving pennies & living off lollipops.
I assume you have seen Bowser steamers or photos of them. And you mentioned partially built. The only part I’d say isn’t for the faint of heart is quartering the drivers and tuning the rods. But the rest of it seems to be incredible fun. My brother did two of them, I had wanted to do their later 0-6-0 but never tracked one down. In kit form they’re hard to find now.


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Lol well I know that feeling. My big budget crushing projects are not train related, and blocking progress on trains, so that’s my Spring priority to get fewer irons in the fire. New furnace, AC, WH, drain line, outdoor spigot supply lines, drywall the train room, & erect 70 ft of privacy fence too. Hence I’ve only built one template section of benchwork, saving pennies & living off lollipops.
> I assume you have seen Bowser steamers or photos of them. And you mentioned partially built. The only part I’d say isn’t for the faint of heart is quartering the drivers and tuning the rods. But the rest of it seems to be incredible fun. My brother did two of them, I had wanted to do their later 0-6-0 but never tracked one down. In kit form they’re hard to find now.


Yes I've seen them and always try and look out for a deal especially the T1s but most of the Bowser steam kits seem to go for a ton of money. I love to try and build and tinker so those kits definitely appeal to me and I will build at least one if not more!


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## afboundguy

Figured out I messed up a bit and needed half and half left and right curved turnouts and not all left curved turnouts 🙃

So today since I had to return several of my wife's amazon purchases at the UPS store and since it happened to be 15 minutes on the exact route that I would take to get to the train store that's normally an hour away I just had to go right?

Well I did (shocking I know right?) and I ended up getting 4 right curved turnouts. I got 2 Atlas and 2 Peco. I ended up getting the Peco ones as they're a little shorter and think they may work better behind the chimney and the $10-$15 more for the 2 over 2 Atlas turnouts was worth it for the flexibility...


----------



## afboundguy

Also got a nice package today!!! A 110-130 scale foot (forget exactly) motorized turnout for super cheap on ebay. I threw in the roadbed as I figured I'll neee more than I have already and it was a combined shipping deal I couldn't pass up!


----------



## afboundguy

Right before work I prepped the outlet for my nephew...


----------



## afboundguy

And it was good news... Nephew said it was mainly a bad GFCI outlet. He did say I might have fries it when I swapped the wires in the switch as I thought he had told me to swap the wires but he said it was mainly the bad GFCI... 

While he was wiring the light switch properly and the wife was cooking dinner I ran down the road and grabbed a new outlet and everything is back working!!!


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Nephew said it was mainly a bad GFCI outlet.


Finishing the basement bathroom I got two bad GFCI outlets.


----------



## afboundguy

Wait what's happening???


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Finishing the basement bathroom I got two bad GFCI outlets.


I was just glad it was a simple fix... Gave him $20 for gas money and we fed him dinner!!! Took him 15 mins and that included quickly rewiring the dual pole switch...


----------



## afboundguy

Ended up doing a few hours of work while wife did some class she has to do for teaching to get more money or something...

I wanted to connect the loop but my fear came through and I'll need a topside creeper (which I thought I would need when I built the benchwork) for under the steps... Just too much of a reach and I'm too much of a pansy to sit on the layout even though I'm sure it would hold me just doesn't feel right!

I ended up using an exacto knife and cut a 2.5" long piece of masonite to keep the turns the proper length away...


----------



## afboundguy

Like I said I was hoping I could have connected the loop but oh well... I ended up only securing the track bed with nails for now while I get it laid out where I want it and then I'll glue it down...

I went with a not so perfectly straight by the back wall as I think/hope it'll look better than a pure straight run...


----------



## afboundguy

Plan on just going the other way tomorrow when the wife picks back up her class for an hour or two so stay tuned!!!


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> I went with a not so perfectly straight by the back wall as I think/hope it'll look better than a pure straight run...


It will.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> It will.


I believe I read that in one of the many books I've read for research and seeing it down looks really good but it's good to get some positive feedback I did the corrext thing! 

Chances are I'll never actually see it running directly at me since one end has the stairs and the other is at the corner ao I figured the "curviness" would help with making it look more realistic since it will only really be viewed from perpendicular and I would think from a perpendicular view a straight straight track wouldn't look as nice as some "curviness."


----------



## OilValleyRy

It’s actually unfortunate that won’t be easily seen. A layout that I op’d long ago had a long straight section, 15-20 foot, with a slight S curve about mid way. About what you’d see in a cross over. Anyway, watching trains snake through there stuck with me all these years. I plan on doing something similar. 
Might be a neat video spot… an actual worthwhile use for those stupid self stick things. Or a cheap CC cam resting under that step down yonder.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> It’s actually unfortunate that won’t be easily seen. A layout that I op’d long ago had a long straight section, 15-20 foot, with a slight S curve about mid way. About what you’d see in a cross over. Anyway, watching trains snake through there stuck with me all these years. I plan on doing something similar.
> Might be a neat video spot… an actual worthwhile use for those stupid self stick things. Or a cheap CC cam resting under that step down yonder.


I have thought about doing videos of varying angles with one from the cab ride so who knows!


----------



## afboundguy

Got most of the rest of the trackbed down today. I'll still need to adjust it slightly once I lay down track but this laying track down process is much faster and much better instant gratification!!!

Did this section before lunch...


----------



## afboundguy

Wife had more school work to do after lunch so I started back up! Last pictures are of where the bridge for the 30th St Station will be where it splits from 4 to 6 lines... Not sure if I'll use the curved turnouts or wye turnouts... The wye turnouts were supposed to be delivered yesterday but shockingly they're delayed...

As of right now the first picture has an 18" radius. It wouldn't be bad the two inside tracks won't be the continuous running tracks and they'll be more for switching and other things. I'm sure I can make it better if I re-adjust the curve on the other end which is part of the still needing to tweek things ongoing plans...


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## afboundguy

As far as behind the chimney I'm not sold on keeping the dividing wall up and doing a tunnel as there was a connecting line in the area I'm modeling that branches off so I may ditch the wall...


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## JeffHurl

Looking good!

I would get rid of the tunnel divider unless you need it for scenery block.


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## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Looking good!
> 
> I would get rid of the tunnel divider unless you need it for scenery block.


To the left if that area will be Lancaster PA and on the map there is a line that connects from Leola and New Holland so I may try and model that split without the wall there...


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## afboundguy




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## afboundguy

afboundguy said:


> I've been in a work training all week and I'm finishing the projects earlier than a lot of my fellow trainees so I've been doing train research and planning to pass the time and I think I've come up with what will be the final layout plan... It'll afford me ample opportunities to have interchanges with Reading, Erie, B&O, Lehigh Valley and Western Maryland Railroads if needed and gives me 3 switching yard options... I plan to put up a divider wall on the right side with Philadelphia being at the tip so I can have some of the splits from Philadelphia... I won't have a huge totally accurate Philadelphia models by any means but I'll do my best...
> 
> For the 3 yards I'll Frazer yard, Lancaster yard and then a scaled down Altoona Yard. I'll be able to have the Susquehanna River in there and a scalled down Harrisburg. At the little part by the steps I would make that the straight mainline after Altoona on it's way to Pittsburg while still having it loop around Altoona for continuous operations...
> 
> With the wall at the top right I'll make the line from Philadelphia to Pottsville line go through the wall and make the line coming out on the other side of the wall the real line that branches onto the mainline in that area from Honeybrook area so I can still have continuous operations while keeping it as close to how it was in real life...
> 
> Drawings are not to scale by anymeans I just did a more final rough draft after several ideas and like this one the best...


Looking back at this post I thought someone on here commented on how I was trying to cram too much into one layout and the scaling would look silly if I did it as drawn up below and I remember thinking to myself I would have no problem getting all that in... Boy was I wrong!!! I tried seeing who posted to give them credit and vindication but I couldn't find the post in my build thread so it must have been in another thread!

It was fun to look back through this thread and see how far I've come and to chuckle about the plans below and see how much they've changed... Philadelphia will be on the right side of the chimney and that's it! Paoli will be at the bottom of the new addition (where Philadelphia is in the drawing) and only really the station and the interlocking tower. Continuing on around that loop to the left will be Malvern and then the truss bridge and the Whitford PA station with the truss bridge over it. Lancaster will still be where it is but Harrisburg will be more pronounced to the left of Lancaster and I will be doing Enola Yard instead of Altoona since parts of the Enola Yard had electrification and Altoona didn't since electronification basically stopped at Harrisburg. I wish I could do the hump yards of Enola but think that may be a bit too much!


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## OilValleyRy

Yeah plans translated to sq footage can be a real biscuit. I was measuring out my rough yard area, under official ops the mainlines being inbound/outbound at 12ft maximum. I found that 3 locos, 15 40 footers, plus buffer cars and caboose puts me real close to 12 ft. So I’ve got to either use two locos on most trains, or shorter trains. 
Or start my ladder farther back into a curve, or add a cross over mid-curve… or combo of all that.
This is what I get for going from HO to dorking around with N for ten years only to go back to HO. This is why I no longer draw out plans to precisely follow, but don’t lay track aimlessly. I stay fluid & adaptable.


----------



## afboundguy

I decided to open up behind the chimney and I'm glad I did... It makes it brighter. The masonite sheet isn't secured it's held in with friction by the left piece of masonite (painted white) and by the 2x4 of the shelving unit as I don't want to secure it in case a plumber needs to get into the main sewer drain!

I either plan on cutting a higher piece of masonite to hide the plumbing or hang some pictures to hide the plumbing...


----------



## afboundguy

I also made up some quick radius templates... I did 18", 19", 20", 22", 24", 26", 28" and 30" on some scrap cardboard I had...


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## afboundguy

Also improvised and got a small ladder and put some of the 1/4" plywood down and used it sort of like a topside creeper to lay down the rest of the roadbed. I will be able to lay track down this way but I still plan to get a real topside creeper for when I do the detail work...


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Yeah plans translated to sq footage can be a real biscuit. I was measuring out my rough yard area, under official ops the mainlines being inbound/outbound at 12ft maximum. I found that 3 locos, 15 40 footers, plus buffer cars and caboose puts me real close to 12 ft. So I’ve got to either use two locos on most trains, or shorter trains.
> Or start my ladder farther back into a curve, or add a cross over mid-curve… or combo of all that.
> This is what I get for going from HO to dorking around with N for ten years only to go back to HO. This is why I no longer draw out plans to precisely follow, but don’t lay track aimlessly. I stay fluid & adaptable.


Funny you should mention this. I started to try and figure out the loop behind the chimney today and my plans have to change. I was going to use a 19 degree crossover but it won't work correctly (well I'm sure it would work it just won't work properly) so I had to order a 12.5 degree crossover and the local stores didn't have any so I had to get it online so that's sort of a drag. But it was fun to actually put down some track again though even if it was sonly for a few minutes!


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## afboundguy

Seeing how I didn't get much sleep tonight I think I'm done for the day. I have to work at 4pm and I'm also training a new guy so I think I'll try (and more than likely fail) at taking a nap for the rest of the day! 

I did see that my Walther's Union Station kit and the wyes I ordered should be delivered today so I'm sure that will wake me back up when they get delivered!


----------



## OilValleyRy

As per that drain line, you may find inspiration from how I intend to incorporate mine into my layout (1 drain & 2 I beam supports in all here).

If some sort of factory was represented there, you could paint some of that drain line below the T to represent a large dia smoke stack. Where the T is, using a plain white or black section of old tee shirt, make a wrap/scarf to fit around it, secured to the drain with velcro at the back. This allows it to be removed. After test fitting, lay it flat on wax paper etc and glue on bits of cotton balls, teased out like that big 1980s hair that we all miss. Ok most of us miss. Fine, just me. 
Anyway…. Hit it from a distance with a couple different gray spray paints from different directions just to give it varying sooty colors. Wrap it on to hide the drain. Mine will get wireless red LEDs as aviation warning lights too, but that is probably too modern for the 1950s.


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## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy I just woke up and had no idea what you were talking about with the drains but after a few minutes of waking up a little more I realized what you were saying!!! I like that idea and maybe I'll look into that... I had an epiphany yesterday and depending on how the below project goes and how big it is I may be totally switching everything around backwards for the better on the layout so stand by!


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## afboundguy

This may also start WWV with WWIV being boilergate 2021, which coincidentally I have empirical evidence the new boiler is saving us money as our gas company always sends us with "efficient neighbors" "you" and "average neighbors"... We've always been around of above the "average neighbors" which has always been good considering we have a gas stove and gas for the dryer. The past few months we've been much closer to the "efficient neighbors" so take that!!! I doubt we'll ever be "the efficient neighbors" due to having the gas stove and gas dryer as I doubt they take into account how many gas items a home has just the usage!

And WWV will be due to me doing this on the kitchen table. Her dad (with our help) made it from scratch which is why I have the multi layered approach to protecting it but it's still never enough


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## afboundguy

So I think my new plans will work out pretty prototypical and make for an even better set up! The spot next to the stairs that is rectangular will hold 30th St station and the end part will be the Schuykill River with the bridge and I will make the yard behind the 30th St Station... I can still have the 6 tracks going into the passenger overhang and I can just use simple crossings to model the complex turnouts and wyes the bridge has instead of having to get slip switches as I would have needed since the trains would have run straight through. I also feel like this set could let me encorporate a more realistic passenger car service where as before I would have had lots of freight trains running through the passenger overhangs...


----------



## afboundguy

I did a quick rough sketch of the plans... Yellow is underground and green is the high line... In the back of the 30th St Station 2 lines really go underground so I will make part of the continuous loop be underground and it will come out and meet with the yard I'll be doing. This will also help with the illusion of reall point to point service as the freight cars will go out of site...

That and with the High Line (where frieght trains actually ran to bypass the area of the 30th St station) I can provide a more realistic prototypical continuous freight train running as I will bring it back down to grade back into the mainlines... 

It'll be much more work but I think better in the long run...


----------



## afboundguy

For the other side with the extention I will model Harrisburg's yard and possibly not have a wall to split the views but that will have to be fine tuned... I want to focus on getting the continuous loop going first and then plan accordingly!


----------



## OilValleyRy

Kind of off topic, but I’d never trade up my NG stove or furnace unless I move to Mexico. I didn’t buy a farmhouse in the boonies because propane costs way too much. I considered maybe conversion to electric, but turns out thats almost as expensive. About 4 times more costly that NG. Saw a place with a horse barn, a tractor barn… could’ve done G scale. 
Half the battle of efficiency, often not mentioned, is air leakage. The better things are sealed up, the less heat loss, the less a furnace/boiler runs. Good attic insulation & weather stripping. Can’t do much about plumbing vents. Keep bathroom doors closed & close any heat registers… but who wants icy cold toilet seats? Similarly a 95% efficient state of the art furnace and/or 59 solar panels won’t do much if your house leaks like a sieve.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Kind of off topic, but I’d never trade up my NG stove or furnace unless I move to Mexico. I didn’t buy a farmhouse in the boonies because propane costs way too much. I considered maybe conversion to electric, but turns out thats almost as expensive. About 4 times more costly that NG. Saw a place with a horse barn, a tractor barn… could’ve done G scale.
> Half the battle of efficiency, often not mentioned, is air leakage. The better things are sealed up, the less heat loss, the less a furnace/boiler runs. Good attic insulation & weather stripping. Can’t do much about plumbing vents. Keep bathroom doors closed & close any heat registers… but who wants icy cold toilet seats? Similarly a 95% efficient state of the art furnace and/or 59 solar panels won’t do much if your house leaks like a sieve.


The rebates and the fact that I wanted/needed to be proactive with the hot water heater made it very cost effective (and made much more room for the layout to be expanded ) so we went with it. It'll pay for itself in a about 5 years... We had already done a complete renovation of the exterior with new windows and fully insulated the house. With the new boiler I'm also (against my will) not having the boiler shut down at night or during the day. I used to have it set for 68 degrees at night and on weekends and shut down to 64 degrees at night and during day and it would drive my wife crazy (she's always cold). Now with the new boiler we've been keeping the house at 68 degrees 24/7 and keeping the upstairs at 66 degrees (used to keep upstairs at 64 degrees 24/7). So we're keeping the house warmer 24/7 (wife is happy) and we'll save money.

Only down side is the basement is much colder as the old boiler warmed up the basement. Basically the plumber said the old boiler was like a muscle car with a V8 and when it was signaled by the thermostat to turn on it would drive at 100% throttle. The new boiler is like a hybrid and only throttles on based on the outside air and some fancy calculations and constantly circulates the less warmer water in the baseboard heaters...

I do plan on adding a few fin kits like this and use some quite fans blowing on them hooked up to a plug in thermostat to heat the basement up a bit more. I like to be cold but it's about 52-54 degrees in the basement and now that I'm in the basement more it's a little too cold for my taste and the fin add on would be a cheap way to try and warm it up especially since there's already piping near the basement ceiling that I can put these on to utilize the warm water already traveling through the pipes.


----------



## afboundguy

I really should get back downstairs and get back on actual layout stuff like laying track but today has been the first day I have the morning mainly free and I'm having too much fun trying to do this project!


----------



## Raege

Awesome preserving past/present in miniature. Looking good so far.


----------



## afboundguy

Raege said:


> Awesome preserving past/present in miniature. Looking good so far.


Thanks! It's not going to be 100% accurate obviously but even some of the windows and doors will be pretty off as I can't really see what they look like up close as that's the only picture of the power plant I can find but it will still look pretty darn close and nobody will probably even be able to see the personal doors anyways as they'll be so small


----------



## vette-kid

Saw these in ebay and thought of your layout. Something like this might look cool on your facia board of you havn't gotten something designed already. 









Pennsylvania Railroad Logo (Red Wood Plaque-Sign /Man Cave/ Train & Kids Room | eBay


This material is NOT CARDBOARD. It is a man made hardwood. THIS ITEM IS NOT MADE FOR OUTDOOR USE. …don’t be left standing on the platform waiting. • Each sign has a pre-cut hole at the top center for easy hanging in that special location in the room.



www.ebay.com







Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Saw these in ebay and thought of your layout. Something like this might look cool on your facia board of you havn't gotten something designed already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pennsylvania Railroad Logo (Red Wood Plaque-Sign /Man Cave/ Train & Kids Room | eBay
> 
> 
> This material is NOT CARDBOARD. It is a man made hardwood. THIS ITEM IS NOT MADE FOR OUTDOOR USE. …don’t be left standing on the platform waiting. • Each sign has a pre-cut hole at the top center for easy hanging in that special location in the room.
> 
> 
> 
> www.ebay.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


I think that's the same seller I bought my two PRR wooden signs from. Looks like they may sell on ebay and Etsy. I definitely want one eventually and almost bought one when I bought the other two signs but I figured I could wait lol


----------



## afboundguy

Wow looks like it's been since the last week in January I was working on the layout! I went back down today and mainly just tidied up a bit as it was getting to be a mess! I also messed around with the funky crossover behind the chimney and think I may do a double slip switch as I have one and won't be using it anymore since I moved where I want to so the 30th St Station and I can just use cheap normal crossovers since I'll never be running trains there!

Found some nice curved truss bridge 3D printing files and I printed one yesterday and I'm printing another one today (they take about 8 hours) and I'm still trying to fine tune my lackluster printing skills  It's a good thing they'll be all weathered and painted!!!


----------



## afboundguy

I also printed up a mount for a new wyze camera for the 3D printer so I can check to see if it's still running or if it's done so I can then turn off the printer that's hooked up to a wyze smart plug. I also have it set up if the smoke or CO alarm goes off the 3D printer shuts off as I guess the wyzr camera can recognize the sounds of the smoke and CO alarm for an added level of protection!


----------



## OilValleyRy

I hate to add to further distraction. If you find & decide to print dr6-4-2000 shells that fit P2K E unit chassis… I’d probably cave & buy a pair. Probably the most coveted Baldwin for PRR modelers (and former ones).

(I’d never get much done if I had a 3D printer! I’d just print new dinner plates instead of washing the dishes lol)


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I hate to add to further distraction. If you find & decide to print dr6-4-2000 shells that fit P2K E unit chassis… I’d probably cave & buy a pair. Probably the most coveted Baldwin for PRR modelers (and former ones).
> 
> (I’d never get much done if I had a 3D printer! I’d just print new dinner plates instead of washing the dishes lol)


I'm a loooonnnnngggggg way away from being able to print something like that but I'll keep it in mind! Just to clarify you're talking about this model right?


----------



## OilValleyRy

Nay. The passenger shark.








same Baldwin designation as the Jersey Central oddities though.


----------



## Stumpy

OilValleyRy said:


> Nay. The passenger shark.


A&B units, both non-powered... Model Power 751 and 731 HO Scale PRR Pennsylvania Baldwin Shark Nose Diesel NPWR | eBay


----------



## OilValleyRy

Stumpy said:


> A&B units, both non-powered... Model Power 751 and 731 HO Scale PRR Pennsylvania Baldwin Shark Nose Diesel NPWR | eBay


That’s the common freight version. The passenger version was only ever available from 1 or 2 brass companies. The dr6-4-2000 shark never had any B units afaik, they ran A or A-A.


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy I'll see what I can do!


----------



## afboundguy

Finally did some actual work on the layout today! Started with putting the PRR stickers and then the yellow line on the facia board. I was worried it would detract from the top of the layout but even with just a bunch of junk and misc supplies on the layout it doesn't detract from the top and I really like it! A few spots the yellow tape is bubbled up because of the screws under it but from a distance it's not really noticeable and I'll probably be the only one to actually ever see it!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## JeffHurl

That looks really nice!


----------



## afboundguy

Also finally started laying down some track albeit just temporary as I knew more than likely I'd need to adjust where I laid out the trackbed and I already have a spot where I need to adjust in the corner...

I started out with the 30th St Station side. I originally was going to have it nice and high so that the 2 lines (the two lines in the middle just dangling there) that go underground in real life were level with the rest of the layout but decided that's way too much work and it would be a crazy inline for the High Line I plan on doing so I brought it down to level and the 6 tracks that go through/under the side will still be elevated and on a bridge and I'll just have the two lines that go underneath dummied underground running to nowhere...

I know the inclines will be unrealistically steep, but I don't actually plan on running anything up there as it will be dead ended on the other side of the bridge so that's not much of an issue...


----------



## afboundguy

This will be how I tie in the 30th St Station and still have the ability to have continuous running... Gotta love curved turnouts!!!


----------



## afboundguy

As you can see in the old picture the High Line ran behind the 30th St station. I plan to have it turn off down the way and I'll be using the curved double track truss bridges to have it run up and over the yard and the back side of the 30th St Station...


----------



## afboundguy

I am also tempted to have the High Line go around the outside of the pole... I think it would look super unique and also allow me to have a more gradual grade as I do plan on making the High Line actually usable. I originally was going to have it just for aesthetics but think it would look awesome with trains actually running on it!!!


----------



## afboundguy

I laid down a decent amount of track as well... I was using rolling stock to see how smooth it ran and it was pretty good for a first attempt. I was messing around with track crossovers so the trains could switch to another mainline. I wish I could make it so they could switch between all 4 mainlines but I just don't have enough space that's straight enough to accomplish that... As you can see that corner is the one I have to adjust the trackbed as was a little too tight with I think around an 18-19 inch radius but not it's 20+ inches...


----------



## afboundguy

I took a quick little video and uploaded it to my YouTube channel. Don't mind the loud noise in the background I had the 3D printer running and it's a little loud  Of course I just realized I spelled Harrisburg wrong!!! Damn cell phone!!!

1956 PRR Philadelphia to Harrieburg finally laying some track - YouTube


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> That looks really nice!


Thanks! I was worried it would be too much but I think it's very tastefully done and I really like it and since it's my railroad it's my rules!!!


----------



## vette-kid

JeffHurl said:


> That looks really nice!


Agreed, looks awesome!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## OilValleyRy

That’s sharp!! 
I always preferred DGLE 5 stripe but the tuscan stands out from the curtain without distracting.
Speaking of, don’t let my “dear santa” list get in your way lol I’m more or less just day dreaming out loud about Baldwins.


----------



## Gramps

JeffHurl said:


> That looks really nice!


Yes, it turned out great.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That’s sharp!!
> I always preferred DGLE 5 stripe but the tuscan stands out from the curtain without distracting.
> Speaking of, don’t let my “dear santa” list get in your way lol I’m more or less just day dreaming out loud about Baldwins.


I had thought about the red with the 5 stripe but figured that would be too much a PITA to get all 5 straight enough for my borderline OCD and 1 thicker stripe would be easier to just level one stripe vs 5!


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Agreed, looks awesome!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk





Gramps said:


> Yes, it turned out great.


Thanks I happen to agree!!!!


----------



## BigGRacing

AF,
I saw you yard stick with the 2” track centres and your passenger cars, in the below pic, may I ask what your radiuses are, based on recent experience, I would have recommended about a 2.5” centre to centre. My passenger cars scraped on 22 and 24 c to c.


----------



## afboundguy

BigGRacing said:


> AF,
> I saw you yard stick with the 2” track centres and your passenger cars, in the below pic, may I ask what your radiuses are, based on recent experience, I would have recommended about a 2.5” centre to centre. My passenger cars scraped on 22 and 24 c to c.
> 
> View attachment 577641


They are 2.5" or larger. I used a hobby knife and went in the center of one of the track beds and used a slightly larger than 2.5" long small piece of masonite and then centered the 2nd track bed off of that and did that several times around the corners... It does look a little tight on that picture as I was trying to focus on my hand with the bridge and pulling back as far as I could to get a better perspective and looking back at that picture it seems really close together...


----------



## afboundguy

Started a little project today with my father in law... Scaled down a PRR sign and started to construct the sign...


----------



## afboundguy

Made a template for the hole covers and actually used an old garbage can for the material!


----------



## afboundguy

Used a heat gun and wrapped them up to keep their form... Hope to finish at least the construction aspect on Tuesday... Then I'll paint it black and weather it to make it semi-rusty and then I will try and get the lens', led and figure out a way to program the lights for the various PRR lighting combinations...


----------



## afboundguy

Then when I got home I decided since the wife is away I had full reign of the house!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Tackled the TCS WOW decoder install on my Spectrum #1361 K4 and it sounds pretty damn good!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Didn't have anything to compare it to before since it was just DCC no sound but man it sounds pretty nice!!!





" title=


----------



## OilValleyRy

Ha! Cool! At first it sorta sounded like a Ford Granada tellin the wife to hurry up.


----------



## SF Gal

Really nice. Curious what are we paying for decoders now days? Haven't bought a decoder in 10 years. I usually try to find those what I can install myself like you did with the TCS Wow...I am guessing $120+ for sound?


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> Really nice. Curious what are we paying for decoders now days? Haven't bought a decoder in 10 years. I usually try to find those what I can install myself like you did with the TCS Wow...I am guessing $120+ for sound?


I got this TCS Wow kit for a little over $100 on sale. Cheapest I found the same kit (which has the motherboard, speaker and decoder) is around $120 now...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

After an almost 70 degree day two days ago having fun with 8+ inches of snow  

But got to work on the layout a bit today. Laid a little bit of track but redid the extention. Before the inner radius was 17"-18" now it's 22"-23" with the outer one being 30"+ so good day today..


----------



## afboundguy

I've also made 4 of the dual curved truss bridged and taped them together to see how they'd look. I think I may go down to a single track as it needs to be a single track at several points and I think it just looks too big and ia distracting...


----------



## Big Ed

afboundguy said:


> I've also made 4 of the dual curved truss bridged and taped them together to see how they'd look. I think I may go down to a single track as it needs to be a single track at several points and I think it just looks too big and ia distracting...
> View attachment 578129
> View attachment 578130
> View attachment 578131



Nice, Would you paint them?


----------



## JeffHurl

I don't know.. I really liek double track sections, especially with a train running in either direction.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Love the look of that mini horseshoe curve.


----------



## afboundguy

Big Ed said:


> Nice, Would you paint them?


Yes I would paint them black and weather them. I just started with the red filament and I've been too lazy to swap them over to the white/gray....



JeffHurl said:


> I don't know.. I really liek double track sections, especially with a train running in either direction.


I do too but the green is where the High Line would be and I plan to run it elevated all the way to the back side of the chimney where it will go back down to level. On the back side of the wall (top of the below picture) and it would look even weirder with the dual track running along the walls (both the left side of below picture and against the back wall). Once I bring it back down to level on the right side on the new extension and I wouldn't be able to fit the 2 tracks coming back to level....












OilValleyRy said:


> Love the look of that mini horseshoe curve.


As of right now my plan is to do a rendition of Harrisburg with a turntable and roundhouse and having the High Line come back down on the right side of that picture... Never really thought about doing Horseshoe curve there and that's not a bad idea. I had thought about doing horseshoe curve on the left side under the stairs...


----------



## afboundguy

@JeffHurl I also plan on running the High Line to the side of the basement support pole to add a really neat look as well as give me the extra room to do a more gradual grade increase and a single tracked bridge there would give more room when walking by so less chance of it getting bumped as well. I have plenty of room to get by if it was a double track but keeping it a single track also alleviates going from 2 tracks to 1 track or 1 track to 2 track back to 1 track issue. That and I don't think I'd be running two trains up there anyways..

That and 3D printing single track bridges is waaaaaay faster compared to 3D printing that the double track


----------



## OilValleyRy

It just reminds me of horseshoe curve. I wasn’t suggesting plan changes.

Extending on @JeffHurl logic… Well I often think “this pair of cars look great… a third would look even better!”
Yeah, two trains passing always looks good. It’ll be something to see 3 trains at 3 speeds rounding that curved area. It’s that American drive that led to the Double/Triple Whopper. Why do 2 passing trains when you can do 6? LOL


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> It just reminds me of horseshoe curve. I wasn’t suggesting plan changes.


It does and I didn't even really think about that. It looks much more like it after I redid the curves too...



OilValleyRy said:


> Extending on @JeffHurl logic… Well I often think “this pair of cars look great… a third would look even better!”
> Yeah, two trains passing always looks good. It’ll be something to see 3 trains at 3 speeds rounding that curved area. It’s that American drive that led to the Double/Triple Whopper. Why do 2 passing trains when you can do 6? LOL


Not sure I'll be able to have 3 trains running at the same time in that area as they cross back over each other behind the chimney but it may be possible I still have a lot of tinkering to do!


----------



## OilValleyRy

A short local “doing the Harvey”


As in Weinstein, aka a creeper.


----------



## afboundguy

Been slacking on updates as I have a lovely sinus infection that I had to suffer through for about a week before I could get antibiotics so the doctor's could feel all warm and fuzzy that it wasn't just a viral infection (which it never is for me )

Did a lot of work on the PRR Signal sign with the father-in-law and it's at home now getting in the way of track laying!


----------



## afboundguy

More than halfway done the outer loop!!! Hoping tomorrow if I'm feeling well enough I can connect it to the left side...


----------



## afboundguy

On the back wall I'm trying to do as many turnouts as I can to allow the trains to switch from all 4 tracks as I can't really have cross overs too many other spots on the layout as most of the track is curved... I'm using a double slip switch instead of a crossover to allow for more flexibility...


----------



## afboundguy

If coming from the right side of the layout behind the chimney the rightmost track in the below picture I will be able to get to every track except the inside-most track (on left) and coming from the left side the inside track won't be able to get to the two back tracks but I think I did pretty good with the turnouts for the limited amount of space...


----------



## afboundguy

Will be putting 2 turnouts on the two tracks behind the chimney to allow for crossovers... Don't think I'll do more than two as the majority of the continuous running will be on the picture's left side track, which is the outer track on the whole layout...


----------



## Stumpy

Just gonna leave this here.


----------



## afboundguy

@Stumpy is that Harrisburg? That is wicked cool if it is and a great picture to help me model it if it is!


----------



## Stumpy

NC Transportation Museum.

NS has a First Responder/911 GP-something also. Not the best picture.


----------



## MichaelE

afboundguy said:


> On the back wall I'm trying to do as many turnouts as I can to allow the trains to switch from all 4 tracks as I can't really have cross overs too many other spots on the layout as most of the track is curved... I'm using a double slip switch instead of a crossover to allow for more flexibility...
> 
> View attachment 578492
> View attachment 578493


Double slips are a good space saver and allow multiple routes in a short space, but they ae generally used during low speed operations. Hopefully it is well engineered and manufactured so trains will pass through at speed for you.


----------



## afboundguy

MichaelE said:


> Double slips are a good space saver and allow multiple routes in a short space, but they ae generally used during low speed operations. Hopefully it is well engineered and manufactured so trains will pass through at speed for you.


I have taken that in mind and may not really keep it. In theory it wouldn't really be used that much as a way to utilize it as anything except for straight operations as a normal crossover in the directions in the detached picture with it mainly being the yellow arrow path...


----------



## afboundguy

Also picked up this Fairbanks-Morse H24-66. The PRR only had 9 of them. Seems like I am partial and fond of the rarities of the PRR. I'll have the PRR Aerotrain, 1 of the 2 SD7's the PRR had (hope to get the 2nd one) and now one of the few H24-66's. I also want to try and get a model of either the Baldwin RT-624 or T2500 which only 45 were made and 44 of the 45 were purchased and used by the PRR (Lima-Hamilton 2500HP Transfer Locomotive - Wikipedia) with the other one going to the Minneapolis, Northfield and Southern Railway...

I know the SD7 wasn't a "rare" engine but it is rare to the PRR with only 2 and I would love to have a double headed SD7 freight train!!!

As far as the RT-624/T2500 I know there is a seller of the shell in N scale on shapeways that sells a 3d model shell and I'm trying to see if they will make an HO version for me...


----------



## Lemonhawk

Puts a bad kink in the track, so it would take a lot of rearrangement of the track to get it to fit.


----------



## afboundguy

Lemonhawk said:


> Puts a bad kink in the track, so it would take a lot of rearrangement of the track to get it to fit.


Are you talking about the double slip switch or another area?


----------



## Lemonhawk

The switch just before the double slip turnout.


----------



## afboundguy

Lemonhawk said:


> The switch just before the double slip turnout.


The one top left yellow arrow? It's not fully secured and set up and that picture does look like it has a bad kink but it's not like that now...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Looks like a mean S curve from bottom right to top right, and severe radius bottom left to top left. But put in a speed restriction and should be navigable except for passenger cars and long wheelbase locos.

The transfer units are gargantuan. Before the days of 3D printing I had day dreamed about making a fairly precise carving of one from a 2x4, to bend/hammer sheet brass onto. A form if you will. Always thought scratch building a brass loco would be fun. I prefer the old hands on fabrication approach, but do acknowledge 3D printing is the future.
Someday we’ll figure out how to utilize star dust, which like the stem cell of the universe. Everything is made out of it. Water, titanium, even fruit roll ups and egg rolls. Once we can use that and drop a 3D printer in orbit, we’ll start cranking out Constitution class starships. Then we’ll be getting somewhere. But that’s a discussion for another thread.


----------



## prrfan

afboundguy said:


> Also picked up this Fairbanks-Morse H24-66. The PRR only had 9 of them. Seems like I am partial and fond of the rarities of the PRR. I'll have the PRR Aerotrain, 1 of the 2 SD7's the PRR had (hope to get the 2nd one) and now one of the few H24-66's. I also want to try and get a model of either the Baldwin RT-624 or T2500 which only 45 were made and 44 of the 45 were purchased and used by the PRR (Lima-Hamilton 2500HP Transfer Locomotive - Wikipedia) with the other one going to the Minneapolis, Northfield and Southern Railway...
> 
> I know the SD7 wasn't a "rare" engine but it is rare to the PRR with only 2 and I would love to have a double headed SD7 freight train!!!
> 
> As far as the RT-624/T2500 I know there is a seller of the shell in N scale on shapeways that sells a 3d model shell and I'm trying to see if they will make an HO version for me...
> 
> View attachment 578736


If you like rare PRR locos you may want an Alco C 424. They only had one of those. My Pennsy layout has two, repainted AHM units. You’d probably want something better than that but would probably have to paint it. I don’t think anyone made that in PRR, but could be wrong. 
I realize this is a long running thread and haven’t read all of it so apologies if you or someone else has already mentioned it. 
Nice project!


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Looks like a mean S curve from bottom right to top right, and severe radius bottom left to top left. But put in a speed restriction and should be navigable except for passenger cars and long wheelbase locos.


Are you talking about this marked S curve? I'm assuming that's what you're talking about and based on the S curve and the double slip switch combination it would be severely speed restricted...












prrfan said:


> If you like rare PRR locos you may want an Alco C 424. They only had one of those. My Pennsy layout has two, repainted AHM units. You’d probably want something better than that but would probably have to paint it. I don’t think anyone made that in PRR, but could be wrong.
> I realize this is a long running thread and haven’t read all of it so apologies if you or someone else has already mentioned it.
> Nice project!


Unfortunately the C 424 was built in 64/65 which is passed the year I'm modeling otherwise that would be a perfect addition!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Started my PRR aerotrain project today as well as picked up some nice additions to include a Proto 2000 FA/FB unit...


----------



## afboundguy

Also got the H24-66 Trainmaster Athearn blue box engine. Looks BNIB... Hope to eventually upgrade the motor and add DCC...


----------



## Raege

Nice additions


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

afboundguy said:


> Also got the H24-66 Trainmaster Athearn blue box engine. Looks BNIB... Hope to eventually upgrade the motor and add DCC...
> 
> View attachment 578960


H24-66?


----------



## Stumpy

NorthwestPennsyGuy said:


> H24-66?


One of the last loco models Fairbanks-Morse built.









FM H-24-66 - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org


----------



## JeffHurl

NorthwestPennsyGuy said:


> H24-66?


Here


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

JeffHurl said:


> Here


ah


----------



## afboundguy

NorthwestPennsyGuy said:


> H24-66?











FM H-24-66 - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org







Raege said:


> Nice additions


Thanks! I also stupidly ordered some Erie-Builts and C-Liners to add to the collection... The cost for decoders is going to put me in the poor house!


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

afboundguy said:


> FM H-24-66 - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! I also stupidly ordered some Erie-Builts and C-Liners to add to the collection... The cost for decoders is going to put me in the poor house!


so what exactly do have on your roster so far


----------



## afboundguy

NorthwestPennsyGuy said:


> so what exactly do have on your roster so far


Not sure I really want to look I may have a mild heart attack... If I have time tomorrow I'll try and take a look


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

afboundguy said:


> Not sure I really want to look I may have a mild heart attack... If I have time tomorrow I'll try and take a look


did you have that mild heart attack


----------



## Gramps

Maybe it's just me, but "mild heart attack" sounds like an oxymoron.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Gramps said:


> Maybe it's just me, but "mild heart attack" sounds like an oxymoron.


May sound like it, but I’ve had three in an 18 month span. It’s the #1 reason I moved to “up north” which in Michigan is like permanent vacation. There’s different types, only about 50% are actually painful like in the movies. My blood pressure would sometimes spike to 200+. All stress related. It’s amazing how some so seemingly trivial can knock you down, and even keep you there.


----------



## afboundguy

NorthwestPennsyGuy said:


> did you have that mild heart attack





Gramps said:


> Maybe it's just me, but "mild heart attack" sounds like an oxymoron.


Mild heart attack from seeing how much I've purchased and realizing how much I probably have spent...



OilValleyRy said:


> May sound like it, but I’ve had three in an 18 month span. It’s the #1 reason I moved to “up north” which in Michigan is like permanent vacation. There’s different types, only about 50% are actually painful like in the movies. My blood pressure would sometimes spike to 200+. All stress related. It’s amazing how some so seemingly trivial can knock you down, and even keep you there.


In my career field (1st Responder) we are prone to heart attacks due to all the up and down stress of the job... Glad you're taking steps to alleviate stress. Hopefully you're doing well...


----------



## afboundguy

@NorthwestPennsyGuy sorry for the delay been super busy with work, trainings and then teaching at various academies and today is my first "day off" even though my LT "voluntold" me I'm teaching CPR to a few new members of my town's emergency management team and I forgot I committed to moving my saltwater reef's club's storage unit that I'm on the Board of Directors for (www.bostonreefers.org) to another storage unit...

But I found the list I already made about all the engines I have and just added the last few I got so here goes...

*Diesels:*
4238 – GE 44-ton Spectrum (DC)
4644 – doodlebug Spectrum (needs work) (DCC Ready)
5753 – PA Proto 2000 (DCC Ready)
5755 – PA Proto 200 (DCC Ready)
5804 – E8 Proto 2000 (DCC)
8589 – SD7 BLI P3 (DCC)
8623 – RS-11 Rapido (DCC)
8703 – FM H24-66 (DC)
8810 – FM H16-44 Spectrum (DC)
9161 – NW2 switcher BLI P2 (DCC)
9450 & 9450b – C-liners A & B units Proto 1000 (DC)
9472, 9472a & 9473 – Erie Build ABA units Proto 1000 (DC)
9593 – RF-16 (sharknose) AB (DC) (needs work)
9620 – FA2 Proto 2000 (DC)
9640 & 9640b – FA2 & FAB proto 2000 “red baron collection) (DC)
Aerotrain – (DCC)
BLI Plymouth switcher – DCC

*Steamers:*
1361 – K4 Spectrum (DCC)
3233 – 0-6-0 Bachman (DC)
3750 – K4 Spectrum (DCC Ready)
4258 – I1sa BLI P4
5475 K4 – needs repair (has replacement shell and tender) Spectrum
6170 – J1 BLI QSI (needs work)
6762 – M1b BLI QSI (needs work)

*Electrics:*
4774 – P5a BLI P3 (DCC)
4857 – GG1 BLI P3 (DCC)


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

afboundguy said:


> @NorthwestPennsyGuy sorry for the delay been super busy with work, trainings and then teaching at various academies and today is my first "day off" even though my LT "voluntold" me I'm teaching CPR to a few new members of my town's emergency management team and I forgot I committed to moving my saltwater reef's club's storage unit that I'm on the Board of Directors for (www.bostonreefers.org) to another storage unit...
> 
> But I found the list I already made about all the engines I have and just added the last few I got so here goes...
> 
> *Diesels:*
> 4238 – GE 44-ton Spectrum (DC)
> 4644 – doodlebug Spectrum (needs work) (DCC Ready)
> 5753 – PA Proto 2000 (DCC Ready)
> 5755 – PA Proto 200 (DCC Ready)
> 5804 – E8 Proto 2000 (DCC)
> 8589 – SD7 BLI P3 (DCC)
> 8623 – RS-11 Rapido (DCC)
> 8703 – FM H24-66 (DC)
> 8810 – FM H16-44 Spectrum (DC)
> 9161 – NW2 switcher BLI P2 (DCC)
> 9450 & 9450b – C-liners A & B units Proto 1000 (DC)
> 9472, 9472a & 9473 – Erie Build ABA units Proto 1000 (DC)
> 9593 – RF-16 (sharknose) AB (DC) (needs work)
> 9620 – FA2 Proto 2000 (DC)
> 9640 & 9640b – FA2 & FAB proto 2000 “red baron collection) (DC)
> Aerotrain – (DCC)
> BLI Plymouth switcher – DCC
> 
> *Steamers:*
> 1361 – K4 Spectrum (DCC)
> 3233 – 0-6-0 Bachman (DC)
> 3750 – K4 Spectrum (DCC Ready)
> 4258 – I1sa BLI P4
> 5475 K4 – needs repair (has replacement shell and tender) Spectrum
> 6170 – J1 BLI QSI (needs work)
> 6762 – M1b BLI QSI (needs work)
> 
> *Electrics:*
> 4774 – P5a BLI P3 (DCC)
> 4857 – GG1 BLI P3 (DCC)


wow thats a lotta K4s for just that layout


----------



## afboundguy

Got off my *** and did a little work in the basement cleaning up a bit so hopefully I'll be more motivated next week to work on the actual top of the layout 🤣 

Before...


----------



## afboundguy

After...


----------



## afboundguy

Also picked up an already made and weathered Ice house with platform...


----------



## JeffHurl

That platform is very cool!


----------



## MichaelE

Yes, it is. I like that.

Cleaning up after the last work session makes it much easier to start again. You won't have to deal with the chaos, clutter, and unorganized mess of the last session.

You will find it much easier to start again if every thing is put away, hung up, and stowed where it is supposed to be.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> That platform is very cool!


I got it off Ebay for basically the price of an unassembled kit shipped so it was a no brainer especially since I have so many reefer cars!!!



MichaelE said:


> Yes, it is. I like that.
> 
> Cleaning up after the last work session makes it much easier to start again. You won't have to deal with the chaos, clutter, and unorganized mess of the last session.
> 
> You will find it much easier to start again if every thing is put away, hung up, and stowed where it is supposed to be.


Totally. "Cleaning" up the basement has been on my to do list for a while and it was really annoying me and I finally just did it. As of right I have every day except Wed free to hopefully work on the layout 🤞


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

afboundguy said:


> Also picked up an already made and weathered Ice house with platform...
> 
> View attachment 580443
> View attachment 580444


looks amazing


----------



## afboundguy

Had a little bit of free time today to try and figure out the large yard by the Philly 30th St Station end... 

Before....


----------



## afboundguy

First try I tried getting a little too fancy adding an 18" radius loop at the end of the spurs but after I put it down I realized there's really no benefit to it... I did use two curved turnouts to allow me to connect to the mainline at more than just one spot...


----------



## afboundguy

This was the quick mock up I did with the darker lines being the mainlines...


----------



## afboundguy

Then I ditched the inside pointless loop and added an extra spur. It'll be 13 total spurs and I'll tweak the design around more when I'm ready to secure the yard but I wanted to do some planning and leave it flexible for if anyone had any ideas to improve the design...


----------



## afboundguy

This is the quick rendering again with the darker lines being the mainline. Next step will be to lay down the mainlines permanently and glue and ballast them as I'll never be able to reach there with the yard put down.....

Again if anyone has any tips for improving the design please let me know!


----------



## afboundguy

I also realize there's not enough room to have my longest train turn around or link up but in theory I can pull it out onto the inside mainlines if needed as the outside mainlines will be mainly the continuously running track...


----------



## SF Gal

I would suggest when laying your yard track is to be vigilant in making sure your easements between tracks is wide enough for the longest passenger car to transition turnouts without hitting a car on the next track. 
We all want as much siding storage track as we can get but.....
You might also consider if you want to add detail to the yard as they can be desert like areas. 
A fuel depot, a wash plant, coaling tower or maybe a diesel shop?















Consider add interest to your yard area even if it means loosing some track storage for rail cars. Working on detailing my own yard, I am finding it is uninteresting and void of scenery. So I am adding these things to make it more interesting to me and my audience. Just a suggestion and my 2cents on modeling railroad yards.


----------



## OilValleyRy

As you mentioned possibly using the secondary (inner) mainline as an arrival/departure track, I think you could fit a dedicated one in. Looking at the right hand ladder (left hand turnouts), if you nudged that to toward the center 2-3 inches, and stub end it at the loop, then the track that is presently the right side ladder would be a decent length straight away once a loco cuts off. 
But I guess that wouldn’t free up your secondary really, as it also serves as your yard lead on the approach. Kind of an operational bottle neck if/when operating both mainlines… Prototype roads have bottle necks too though. Sometimes such a problem is frustrating, and sometimes it’s an enjoyable challenge.

That said; I agree there really is isn’t much point in connecting the far ends of the ladder. 
One interesting possibility if you removed those connections to the secondary main, you could SurFoam the yard area (a messy task) to have a slight downward slope, which creates a “sort of” hump yard, without an above 0” hump.


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> I would suggest when laying your yard track is to be vigilant in making sure your easements between tracks is wide enough for the longest passenger car to transition turnouts without hitting a car on the next track.
> We all want as much siding storage track as we can get but.....
> You might also consider if you want to add detail to the yard as they can be desert like areas.
> A fuel depot, a wash plant, coaling tower or maybe a diesel shop?
> 
> Consider add interest to your yard area even if it means loosing some track storage for rail cars. Working on detailing my own yard, I am finding it is uninteresting and void of scenery. So I am adding these things to make it more interesting to me and my audience. Just a suggestion and my 2cents on modeling railroad yards.


Thanks for the information. This was a severely rough laid plan. I do have plans to possibly add a fuel depot and sand pit but the coaling tower will be somewhere else. I'm on the fence about a diesel shop as the other yard is where I thought of placing it...



OilValleyRy said:


> As you mentioned possibly using the secondary (inner) mainline as an arrival/departure track, I think you could fit a dedicated one in. Looking at the right hand ladder (left hand turnouts), if you nudged that to toward the center 2-3 inches, and stub end it at the loop, then the track that is presently the right side ladder would be a decent length straight away once a loco cuts off.
> But I guess that wouldn’t free up your secondary really, as it also serves as your yard lead on the approach. Kind of an operational bottle neck if/when operating both mainlines… Prototype roads have bottle necks too though. Sometimes such a problem is frustrating, and sometimes it’s an enjoyable challenge.
> 
> That said; I agree there really is isn’t much point in connecting the far ends of the ladder.
> One interesting possibility if you removed those connections to the secondary main, you could SurFoam the yard area (a messy task) to have a slight downward slope, which creates a “sort of” hump yard, without an above 0” hump.


I had thought about making it into a hump yard but the yard behind the 30th St Station wasn't a hump yard. I know it's not really close to what the yard at the 30th St Station is but I'm trying (and probably failing) at trying to make it as prototypical as possible...


----------



## afboundguy

Started gluing down the roadbed!!! Dismantled the "yard" that wasn't connected in order to put down some plywood so I could lay on the layout...


----------



## afboundguy

Focused on the part that is hard to reach that I have to put plywood down to reach it... Hopefully I'll lay down the track next week but I'm going to try and go glue down some more roadbed while the wife is at some appointment tonight! I used nails to hold the roadbed in place until the glue dries...


----------



## afboundguy

Got a bit more done. Redid the turn at the end of the "U" to make the smallest radius turn on the inside 24". Might screw up my initial ideas of doing a small yard there but might just do a small town or industry there instead it was a PITA trying to get a yard there with the curved turnouts anyways...


----------



## SF Gal

Moving right along, looking good...but plenty to do.


----------



## afboundguy

Finished up the turn and actually got the minimum radius to be a 28"!


----------



## afboundguy

Just ordered a case of Peco flex track this morning. The Atlas flex track I have is "new" from a co-worker who's dad passed and had a layout and from what I can tell most of the Atlas flex track hadn't been used but there are still imperfections and I figured in the long run track that I 100% know is brand new will be better for the trains...

I'm also tossing around the idea of doing the left curve area by the chimney stack as Horseshoe Curve instead of Harrisburg. I feel it might add a better overall look as two full yards and cities might get boring. I'm tossing around the idea of using forced perspective by using N scale items in the lower gorge/water area and up towards the top of the mountains since I don't have a ton of space both up and down and side to side. I can't really go down into the layout as much as needed to get the perspective and same for going up with the mountains so forced perspective could help create the illusion to make it seem closer to being prototypical...


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Just ordered a case of Peco flex track this morning ... I figured in the long run track that I 100% know is brand new will be better


Wise move, IMO.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Wise move, IMO.


I thought so! Especially for the areas that will be borderline impossible to reach once everything is all laid out!


----------



## Gramps

afboundguy said:


> I thought so! Especially for the areas that will be borderline impossible to reach once everything is all laid out!


Unless that's an exaggeration, you might want to rethink that area before proceeding.


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> Unless that's an exaggeration, you might want to rethink that area before proceeding.


It is a slight exaggeration. The area will be difficult to access standing from the side but I can reach any derailments and until I get/make a stepper creeper grabbing derailments will be about the only easy thing I can do in the area which is why I want to use brand new track and spend extra time making sure the track laid in the area will be as close to perfection as humanly possible


----------



## OilValleyRy

Anyone else antsy to see afbound running double-headed steam on a mail train or other priority?


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Anyone else antsy to see afbound running double-headed steam on a mail train or other priority?


I sure as hell am antsy for such thing!!!


----------



## JeffHurl

I have been enjoying this build thread. It's a good lesson in how you can evolve and improve your layout during the process. I was a "plan it all out ahead of time" person. And in hind sight, I wish I would have taken more liberties to put a few slight curves and undulations rather than laser straight main lines.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I have been enjoying this build thread. It's a good lesson in how you can evolve and improve your layout during the process. I was a "plan it all out ahead of time" person. And in hind sight, I wish I would have taken more liberties to put a few slight curves and undulations rather than laser straight main lines.


Glad you're enjoying the ride it definitely makes it more fun to share the progress!!! I remember posting about if I was crazy or not for always wanting to change and redesign my layout and luckily it was an overwhelming that I wasn't crazy (at least not for that reason!)

I just hope I can be happy with the overall layout once it's more up and running! I really want to add on an attached garage to the side of my house and I just have visions of expanding the basement foundation as well to make the layout even larger but pretty sure I'd be divorced!!!

But on that note about changing all the time....


----------



## afboundguy

...I bit the bullet and decided I'm going to do Horseshoe Curve on the right side. I figured if I did another yard/city it would be boring having the same thing on both sections! I plan to do a 1.8-2% grade (Horseshoe Curve was 1.8-something% grade) and this morning I cut out some rough pieces for the grade elevation! I have a smart level at work I need to snag tonight to get it more exact but I used a 3/8" block to get a very very rough grade level as 3/8" over 24" is a 1.56% grade. 
Hopefully tomorrow or Thursday when I have the smart level I can get the grade more refined but it was fun cutting out the pieces! Made me miss the construction part of the benchwork! I left the pieces large and I plan to trim them down more once I get the roadbed laid down.

I started by moving the outer track inwards more so I can do the mountains on the outside. Outer curve is 28" radius at the tightest part but it's mainly 30"-32" radius which will leave the inner most radius 20'ish" radius which is fine as it won't be traveled on that much as I still plan to bring the 2 mainlines down to one behind the chimney...

Before...


----------



## afboundguy

.


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## afboundguy

.


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## afboundguy

After... The part on the right side of the chimney will be where I start to bring the grade back down just need to do more calculations on the grades over the next few days... I plan on keeping the mountains on the left out completely so it can be viewed and gradually make them more prominent with them peaking at the bottom right of the picture where there's the most room. Just enough to let you know where it is. It won't be perfect but I think it'll be pretty good for now!


----------



## afboundguy

I also noticed my older cat seemed to like to be on the layout more since I had the left side cleared up more so I also installed some clear plexiglass to prevent her from future visits! I also plan to add some on the steps so she can't sneak in that way as well by the 30th St Station side!


----------



## afboundguy

Just took a 2'x2' piece and cut a small angle out of it and used a few screws to secure it to the stairs...


----------



## afboundguy

Can barely tell it's there... I don't plan on securing the other side for now but I'll see how much ingenuity my cat has trying to move it out of the way but she's old and she gives up on things very quickly in her old age so I'm not too worried about it and I'd rather not secure it on the other side since it's barely noticeable.


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## JeffHurl

Looks like great progress!

We have found that cats hate walking on aluminum foil. Perhaps something like that would also deter her.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Looks like great progress!
> 
> We have found that cats hate walking on aluminum foil. Perhaps something like that would also deter her.


She's too old to jump up so once I block the side by the stairs it won't be an issue but I've used the aluminum foil trick many times in the past for the kitchen table!


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## JeffHurl

We often times have a foil tent on the top of our couch to keep the cat off it. After a while they just give up and don't even try once the foil is gone, lol


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## afboundguy

For anyone that doesn't use a digital level for grades man is it great!!! I have one for work and I used it and man the thing was great! Cost me under $60 on amazon and I found a smaller 1 foot sized one for $35'ish that I might buy so I can have it in the train tools...

I kept it around the 1.8-1.9% grade that Horseshoe Curve in the main direction the trains will be traveling into Horseshoe Curve...


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## afboundguy

I then leveled it off and made the grade less gradual so that on the reverse side it won't be as big of a downgrade back to level... On the last picture the 0.5% downgrade made the downgrade behind the chimney too steep (think it was 3-4%) so I changed it closer to 1.5% downgrade which made the section behind the chimney around the same grade...


----------



## afboundguy

At first stepping back I thought it was a little too high to be able to do mountains on the side but after sitting in it for a little while I think it's just right. I had thought about making it a constant 1% grade up and down which would have lowered the section at the top of the loop but to allow for higher mountains but then the flip side is the gorge in the center wouldn't be as deep so I think it's pretty good the way it was. I had thought about bumping out the right side of this section to allow for more mountains but that might be a bit too much work but never say never!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Still able to get a mainly 30" outside radius. There is a spot on the right side where it goes down to 28" to make the turn but for the most part the inner radius will be 24" with the minimum being around 21" which should be fine considering the outside two tracks will handle most of the trains anyways...


----------



## afboundguy

Hoping to really secure the plywood tomorrow or Friday as I just used wood and shims to get a rough idea of what grades would look good and work for both sides. Once I secure the plywood I'll start gluing down the roadbed! Luckily my work appointment on my day off this Friday got cancelled! Would have been nice to get the few hours of overtime but it'll also be nice to have a whole day to myself!


----------



## JeffHurl

I think having a grade, even if just a relatively short up, then down, adds a lot of interest to the layout. I'm really looking forward to seeing the terrain and scenery come to life here!


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## afboundguy

Glued down the grades but didn't snap a picture dooh!!! Everybody will just have to wait in agony until tomorrow!!!

I did get a few Horseshoe Curve books today! Love in my hand physical information. Few more will be coming the next few days. Got a ton of good pictures to use!


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## afboundguy

This layout makes me wish I had 16'×23' for a layout or that I went N scale would have only been 8.7'x12.5'


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## OilValleyRy

I’ve been quietly watching, and asking myself “what have you done? Ya see what happens when ya blab?!”


----------



## afboundguy

Post glued down pictures a day late...


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## afboundguy

Glued down the outer mainline's roadbed... I under appreciated how nice it was to use nails to keep it in place until the glue dried. Couldn't do that on the plywood and I didn't want to risk using a hammer so I went with painters tape...

Not much of a horseshoe but the best I could do. Moving the tape around while I got the best curvature I wanted before I used a sharpie to do the outlines before gluing and re-taping...


----------



## afboundguy

And the glue...


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## afboundguy

Full loop shot...


----------



## afboundguy

Also got some more physical Horseshoe Curve research tools delivered. Got a dvd and a Dec 2002 MR magazine that has an HO scale Horseshoe Curve layout. Also ordered a few 1950's magazines with Horseshoe Curve articles from ebay for about $5 a whack...


----------



## afboundguy

Slow progress but progress none the less... Almost onto the rest of the Horseshoe Curve!


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## afboundguy

Last night while trying to sleep last night unsuccessfully I had a great idea to try and see if I could add a third track behind the chimney where I was going to go from 4 to 2 and have that third track loop back onto the two inner tracks of the Horseshoe Curve so those two lines would be empty.

I can get an 18'ish inch radius curve if I go from the 2nd line from the inside and have it cross over the inside line. I know 18" is far from ideal but I could just keep 4 axle PA or FA units on that loop. I'll try and run some track next week to see how that would work...


----------



## afboundguy

Came home for dinner to the track being delivered!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Opened up the Peco flex track really like it compared to the Atlas... Also big fan of the fact it stays flexed...


----------



## afboundguy

Also messed around with my idea of trying to loop around the back side of the chimney for continuous running on the inside tracks... Tried a few different things and think I'll have to try it with a 16" radius as the 18" radius puts it too much into the other two tracks... I did get it closer to the inside track but it's still a work in progress. I ordered a 25 and 30 degree crossing to see how those work as I only had a 4.5, 14 and 45 degree crossing and they didn't work...


----------



## afboundguy

I like the prospect of using the double slip switch which would allow me to run the two inside tracks (right side of picture) around back only using one track on the back side of the chimney. I still need to work it a bit and I'm not sure if it's too S curvy of a set up...


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## OilValleyRy

Ready-made diamonds are all straight crossing straight AFAIK. It looks like from the photos that you’ll need a curved crossing a straight… if not a curved crossing a curved.


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## Conductorkev

OilValleyRy said:


> Ready-made diamonds are all straight crossing straight AFAIK. It looks like from the photos that you’ll need a curved crossing a straight… if not a curved crossing a curved.



Never seen one being sold but would it be possible to even make with how weird the point of crossing would be so as you don't get shorts.


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Ready-made diamonds are all straight crossing straight AFAIK. It looks like from the photos that you’ll need a curved crossing a straight… if not a curved crossing a curved.


The last photo I took I was just trying to see what works. When I had it in the previous positions a straight crossing would work. Just need to wait for the other two sides to be delivered...


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## afboundguy

Think I'm going to rework the start of Horseshoe Curve to make it more curvy and also allow for the 15-16" radius turn behind the chimney. I messed around with it the other day and just showed it to my buddy who has a large B&M layout and said it looked doable... Sort of stinks as I'll have to reglue some of the roadbed but I still have ample amounts of white glue!


----------



## afboundguy

But that project will probably have to wait... Did a double at work yesterday after only getting maybe 5-6 hours of sleep so I'm a zombie today so I'm playing catchup on 6 month's worth of reading! I have Thursday off all day with nothing scheduled (more of a miracle than when I'll actually finish the layout) so it'll be full steam ahead on layout work then!


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## OilValleyRy

As Conductorkev pointed out, I’m not sure how a curved diamond would work in terms of maintaining isolation. But it’d sure as heck look awesome. Probably more work than it’s worth. But then, might be the only one that exists anywhere on Earth, so, there’s that.


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## Conductorkev

OilValleyRy said:


> As Conductorkev pointed out, I’m not sure how a curved diamond would work in terms of maintaining isolation. But it’d sure as heck look awesome. Probably more work than it’s worth. But then, might be the only one that exists anywhere on Earth, so, there’s that.



Probably by just making a dead zone and using keep alive in locos. If you were to try I believe a short would happen everytime as the train would rub on the crossing section everytime on the turn.


----------



## afboundguy

Sure used up a lot of glue today... Well it probably wasn't that much of a dent in the overall amount of glue I have from the original 2 gallons of white glue but I did use a lot of glue!!! Almost finished it before lunch but my stomach forced me to come upstairs before I finished the last two small parts... I made it more "horseshoe'y" on the left side of the chimney to facilitate the loop behind the chimney...


----------



## afboundguy

Behind the chimney on the right it will go down from 4 lines to 3 with the leftmost one being the loop around the chimney to allow for continuous running on the inside two tracks of Horseshoe Curve...


----------



## afboundguy

The curve around the chimney will be around 15"-16" which isn't ideal but I only plan to keep 4 axle engines running on the inside two loops pretty slowly so it hopefully won't be an issue... I did end up tightening up the inside track of the Horseshoe curve where it's 18"-20" at it's tightest but I figured that would be a walk in the park compared to 15"-16" and the curve looks better that way...


----------



## afboundguy

With the double slip switch and the turnout I have it set up pretty decently so it's almost straight for the 2nd inside track to go onto the back side of the chimney with the other main lines being straight. I'm not 100% sold on this set up and I might just do a #4 turnout but that would limit the 2nd inside mainline from being able to loop around the chimney... I will obviously tweak it even more once I start laying track which should hopefully be maybe tomorrow on the other loop under the stairs since that side has been dry for weeks but fingers crossed I'll get to lay track tomorrow on the Horseshoe Curve section as well!


----------



## afboundguy

Laid down some track for the turn and ran some rolling stock and an unpowered F3 B unit around the turn and it worked...









1956 PRR 16" curve







youtube.com


----------



## afboundguy

Then tried using the powered A unit with an old DC pack since it's still only a DC unit and it kept dying after it went through the double slip switch which makes sense so I finished the loop and got the first signs of life on Horseshoe Turn!!!









1956 HO PRR Horseshoe Curve test run







www.youtube.com


----------



## afboundguy

If I have time today I found another way to do the turn with 3 turnouts instead of the above single turnout with the double slip switch as I want to see if that runs any better. I still may have some wiggle room to make the turn wider but I'm not 100% sure as I just quickly laid down that section with a spare piece of atlas flex track that was a little too short... Hopefully I'll have time but I need to eat lunch and mow the lawn before work tonight as it's long enough that my older dog who is a big pansy is having trouble going the bathroom because he doesn't like the high grass!!!


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## JeffHurl

Sure looks like this is coming together really well. I hope your radii


afboundguy said:


> Then tried using the powered A unit with an old DC pack since it's still only a DC unit and it kept dying after it went through the double slip switch which makes sense so I finished the loop and got the first signs of life on Horseshoe Turn!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1956 HO PRR Horseshoe Curve test run
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.youtube.com


----------



## afboundguy

Looks much better without the tape!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Also believe I'll be using this set up instead of the double slip switch as it seemed to run smoother but Monday-Wednesday I'll focus on putting down that part first to make sure everything runs smooth before laying track down elsewhere... I did swap them out for peco TOs...


----------



## afboundguy

Looks better without the tape!


----------



## afboundguy

Also got another replica tin sign


----------



## afboundguy

Busy day yesterday. First I cut off the part where I was planning on having a dummy bridge to emulate the Whitford flyover bridge. I still will do it just not in that location and it was starting to get in the way of laying track so I cut it off...


----------



## afboundguy

Then started soldering some flex track together. I decided to use the best pieces of the Atlas flex track as I don't think I'll have enough Peco flex track to do everything and I wanted to make sure I used that on the main tracks... I soldered the double slip switch and turnout so that it will hopefully have better running since it will already be a tricky section...


----------



## afboundguy

Only bad thing about the Atlas flex track is it doesn't stay bent like the Peco so I had to tape it to get the curves and layout correct...


----------



## afboundguy

Put in the feeders on the two tracks...


----------



## afboundguy

Then started gluing down the two inside tracks! Laid a bead of caulking and used a puddy knife to smooth it out... Currently there's a bunch of items on the track to keep it down... Doubt I'll get to laying more tonight but who knows!


----------



## JeffHurl

Not sure about HO, but Atlas N gauge flex track Stays put with just straight pins pushed through the pre-drilled holes.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Not sure about HO, but Atlas N gauge flex track Stays put with just straight pins pushed through the pre-drilled holes.


Atlas flex does as well but I didn't want to hammer the nails in. I might now that it's dey but I'm hoping I don't even see the holes when I ballast the track...


----------



## afboundguy

Just went downstairs and tested out the track!!! I was a bit short by the curved turnout so I couldn't test out both tracks but got her pulling a few cars with ease!


----------



## JeffHurl

Ah... I used foam board and just pressed in straight pins. I forgot you were on plywood


----------



## OilValleyRy

That caboose looks better on film. 
Weren’t all 24 FA-2s actually DGLE?


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Ah... I used foam board and just pressed in straight pins. I forgot you were on plywood


Everything is on foam board except the grade of Horseshoe Curve. I thought of doing foamboard but then realized it would be much easier just using plywood!



OilValleyRy said:


> That caboose looks better on film.
> Weren’t all 24 FA-2s actually DGLE?


I haven't put the decals on yet so it'll get even better!!! I almost busted out another locomotive you may remember but I'm headed out soon... And I am not sure of the FA-2's being all DGLE I'd have to look at all the literature and pictures I have kicking around...


----------



## afboundguy

Hooked up the second inside track and busted out a FM H10-44 switcher courtesy of @OilValleyRy and took her for a spin. Tested out switching between two tracks then decided to see how much rolling stock I could add on and she ran pretty good. Of course the one time I had a semi-derailment was when I was filming (can hear one of the coal cars come off) but then it popped right back on going through the turnout...


----------



## JeffHurl

I imagine it felt great to run a good size train through that curve!


----------



## OilValleyRy

It may sound silly but those ballast silos at the Woodland Scenics factory look pretty realistic. I like those storage tanks at the Elmer’s glue plant too! Looks like the real deal!


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I imagine it felt great to run a good size train through that curve!


Yes it certainly did. I still have to tweak a small part near the turnout behind the chimney to straighten it out a bit more. I had a spot on the 2nd inside curve that didn't stay as smooth as I wanted it to so I just heated up the solder in the railjoint and used a flathead screw driver to hold it straighter/smoother until it cooled down on both joiners and it's straight/smooth now and I think I'm going to do that same process on the area by the turnout...



OilValleyRy said:


> It may sound silly but those ballast silos at the Woodland Scenics factory look pretty realistic. I like those storage tanks at the Elmer’s glue plant too! Looks like the real deal!


I have thought about leaving the glue containers there full time as they seem part of the layout since they've been there so long!


----------



## JeffHurl

They have a good logo on them, lol


----------



## Gramps

afboundguy said:


> Everything is on foam board except the grade of Horseshoe Curve. I thought of doing foamboard but then realized it would be much easier just using plywood!
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't put the decals on yet so it'll get even better!!! I almost busted out another locomotive you may remember but I'm headed out soon... And I am not sure of the FA-2's being all DGLE I'd have to look at all the literature and pictures I have kicking around...


I thought DGLE (Dark Green Locomotive Enamel) was just the formal name for Brunswick Green.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Gramps said:


> I thought DGLE (Dark Green Locomotive Enamel) was just the formal name for Brunswick Green.


DGLE was the actual name according to DuPont. The name Brunswick Green was created by model railroad manufacturers(?) much later. The latter term is more common among hobbyists. DGLE is shorter to type, besides being correct (although everyone knows what Brunswick Green is… probably).


----------



## Gramps

OilValleyRy said:


> DGLE was the actual name according to DuPont. The name Brunswick Green was created by model railroad manufacturers(?) much later. The latter term is more common among hobbyists. DGLE is shorter to type, besides being correct (although everyone knows what Brunswick Green is… probably).


I'm not aware of it but is there also a formal term for their Tuscan locomotives, something like SRLE aka (Sorta Red Locomotive Enamel)?


----------



## OilValleyRy

Gramps said:


> I'm not aware of it but is there also a formal term for their Tuscan locomotives, something like SRLE aka (Sorta Red Locomotive Enamel)?


DuPont made a few reds for the PRR. Their names were Tuscan (# 5505) which was a red enamel for most later passenger equipment. The color changed in the 1960s but kept the same name. They also had one called Permanent which was used on their marine equipment (tugs, barges, etc). It was more oxide-y red. A third was called Toluidine (#6282) but I don’t know what it was used on. Vehicles maybe? Or tender decks possibly? And there was a purple color called Royal (#3408M) used by PRR (and also by ACL) as their number board background.
Good question tho. I had to look up the official red names.

Axalta makes both DGLE & Tuscan currently.


----------



## afboundguy

Started laying down the 3rd track yesterday....


----------



## afboundguy

I also cleaned up the top of the layout a bit and organized it as it was even starting to drive me nuts!


----------



## SF Gal

Your layout is coming along nicely.
I REALLY like what you done with the custom skirting around the layout.
It is a nice touch and makes a layout look pretty.
I see a lot of layouts without skirting and it just looks unfinished so good job on having hindsight to inciude that feature.
It looks like that horseshoe curve is going to be a main feature of the layout as it is pretty prominent in the space.
Thanks for sharing your pictorial progress, I know it ain't easy documenting the progression.


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## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> Your layout is coming along nicely.
> I REALLY like what you done with the custom skirting around the layout.
> It is a nice touch and makes a layout look pretty.
> I see a lot of layouts without skirting and it just looks unfinished so good job on having hindsight to inciude that feature.
> It looks like that horseshoe curve is going to be a main feature of the layout as it is pretty prominent in the space.
> Thanks for sharing your pictorial progress, I know it ain't easy documenting the progression.


Thanks! It's been fun to share! I've done many build threads on my saltwater fish tanks so I enjoy sharing progress. As far as the skirting it's only going to look better once I actually trim the bottoms! Right now they're about 6-12 inches too long at the bottom I just haven't gotten around to trimming them... Well scratch that I did trim one side but cut it too short so I stopped that venture


----------



## afboundguy

Here we go.... Starting to look better and better... Messed around with the area the tracks will loop back around on each other from the inside two tracks of Horseshoe Curve. I originally was going to use a double slip switch but I can get the same results using the turnouts/wyes in this configuration.


----------



## afboundguy

And....


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## afboundguy

Can't wait until I can take the weight holding the caulking down to dry!!!


----------



## JeffHurl

I'm really enjoying your build. I've learned a lot watching how you have made changes while laying the track. I'm way too anal, and had to have it all on paper before laying any track. In hind sight, there is nothing like laying out the track to actually visualize the result. I thought I'd be smart and print a 1:1 version of my layout and set it out so I could see it. That was great, and helped me make changes before laying the first piece. But now that I have had time to run the trains, there are a few areas I would have done a little differently. Subtle things I didn't think of like having access roads to loading docks... You know... Things that make a layout realistic, LOL!


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## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I'm really enjoying your build. I've learned a lot watching how you have made changes while laying the track. I'm way too anal, and had to have it all on paper before laying any track. In hind sight, there is nothing like laying out the track to actually visualize the result. I thought I'd be smart and print a 1:1 version of my layout and set it out so I could see it. That was great, and helped me make changes before laying the first piece. But now that I have had time to run the trains, there are a few areas I would have done a little differently. Subtle things I didn't think of like having access roads to loading docks... You know... Things that make a layout realistic, LOL!


I am usually this way as well and I did it a bunch of times on SCARM and hand drawings but it's totally different actually laying it down! 

That being said I just wont the free 5 days off from work Rona prize so I'll be able to get a ton done!!!


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## OilValleyRy

JeffHurl said:


> I'm really enjoying your build. I've learned a lot watching how you have made changes while laying the track. I'm way too anal, and had to have it all on paper before laying any track. In hind sight, there is nothing like laying out the track to actually visualize the result. I thought I'd be smart and print a 1:1 version of my layout and set it out so I could see it. That was great, and helped me make changes before laying the first piece. But now that I have had time to run the trains, there are a few areas I would have done a little differently. Subtle things I didn't think of like having access roads to loading docks... You know... Things that make a layout realistic, LOL!


You’ve got a great layout, despite the rectangular mainlines, don’t sell yourself short. And, I have a hunch that layout won’t be the last one you ever build.


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## OilValleyRy

As to @afboundguy I’ve been surprised on a couple fronts. I didn’t think that <18” radius was going to work, but it did. And I didn’t think you’d fit a decent yard inside that loop, but you did. 
One of the things I really like is how your horseshoe curve is “reversed.” By the I mean most often it’s modeled from the park side, with aisle inside the curve. I’ve seen postcards etc from the vantage point yours is oriented, but I can’t say I’ve seen it modeled that way. It’s certain to be a distinctive feature of your layout that folks will not confuse with other layouts.


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> As to @afboundguy I’ve been surprised on a couple fronts. I didn’t think that <18” radius was going to work, but it did. And I didn’t think you’d fit a decent yard inside that loop, but you did.
> One of the things I really like is how your horseshoe curve is “reversed.” By the I mean most often it’s modeled from the park side, with aisle inside the curve. I’ve seen postcards etc from the vantage point yours is oriented, but I can’t say I’ve seen it modeled that way. It’s certain to be a distinctive feature of your layout that folks will not confuse with other layouts.


I've had similar thoughts about the Horseshoe Curve being viewed from the "back" and how I can still make it look right and how unique it's going to end up... Still long ways away from scenery but almost done with track laying just need to figure out where to put the insulated joiners for the complex reverse loop I've created...


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## afboundguy

Day 2 of Rona watch and I feel fine... Just a little tired but I also haven't slept over 6 hours in 4 nights due to hectic work schedule BUT I'm in the basement in a wife certified mask free zone (don't ask) and I took off the things weighing down the tracks I glued down the other day and man does it look sexy!!! I had to heat up on eof the rail joiners as it wasn't 100% in line and was knocking a gondola that I have that I use for test car because a stiff breeze two towns away im the wrong direction derails it so if it stays on I know the track is set up well 🤣


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## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> I've had similar thoughts about the Horseshoe Curve being viewed from the "back" and how I can still make it look right and how unique it's going to end up... Still long ways away from scenery but almost done with track laying just need to figure out where to put the insulated joiners for the complex reverse loop I've created...


I had thought up a hands on method to help you determine, but it’s a bit complex.
How about starting on the outside loops, where the layout narrows near the wall… and mark the roadbed RH side with a marker or tab of masking tape. Go all the way around that side of the layout, keeping the marks in RH side only.
Then on a boxcar roof, add a tape tab on the RH side.
Push it along by hand. When the roadbed tape marks jump to the opposite side as the car roof tab, that’s where you insulate.

It’s involved, but less confusing than chicken scratching it on paper.

EDIT: I say start on the outside loops because those should not need to be insulated, giving you a verified “control” reference for the tracks that do.


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## Longvallon

This part of the Horseshoe seems very dangerous, Isn't it ?


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I had thought up a hands on method to help you determine, but it’s a bit complex.
> How about starting on the outside loops, where the layout narrows near the wall… and mark the roadbed RH side with a marker or tab of masking tape. Go all the way around that side of the layout, keeping the marks in RH side only.
> Then on a boxcar roof, add a tape tab on the RH side.
> Push it along by hand. When the roadbed tape marks jump to the opposite side as the car roof tab, that’s where you insulate.
> 
> It’s involved, but less confusing than chicken scratching it on paper.
> 
> EDIT: I say start on the outside loops because those should not need to be insulated, giving you a verified “control” reference for the tracks that do.


I like that it's simple enough my small brain should be able to figure that out thanks!!!



Old Bandit said:


> This part of the Horseshoe seems very dangerous, Isn't it ?
> 
> View attachment 583233


I will be modeling the mountains from the edge of the facia board to the track so there shouldn't be any issues but it does look a little nuts like that!


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## afboundguy

Could have kept going but now that I'm in my 40s I'm smarter and wiser so I stopped while I still had gas in my tank. Honostly I feel totaly fine and haven't even needed to take and OTC pain/cold meds since this morning... Monday and Tuesday when the wifes at work I'm going to kill it on the layout if I don't run our of the Peco flextrack which I'm thinking I'll need a few more pieces but we'll see...

Put in some more feeder wires and what I had thought were spots for the AR1 but I now need to do the trick @OilValleyRy suggested to get better idea...


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## afboundguy

Laid down the outer track further down towards the left of the layout and just had to put more trains on to see how it looks with 3 trains and it got me super excited!!!


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## afboundguy

On a build related note what's the best way to go back in and place ties where I joined the flex track? Just snip off the parts that hook to the bottom of the rail and slide them under? I'm guessing with ballast glued down you won't be able to tell but this is technically the first time I've ever used flex track like this as last layout I was maybe 12 years old


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## afboundguy

Did some quick test runs with the DC power pack and everything ran smooth forwards and backwards on the two new mainlines!!!


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## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> Just snip off the parts that hook to the bottom of the rail and slide them under?


That’s how I always did it. Harder to do on cork (fyi for other readers).


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## Stumpy

OilValleyRy said:


> That’s how I always did it.


Yep.


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That’s how I always did it. Harder to do on cork (fyi for other readers).





Stumpy said:


> Yep.


Thanks guys I figured that was how it was done!!!


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## afboundguy

Day 2 of minorcoldwatch 2022 feeling even better than yesterday... Spent about 3 hours in the basement this morning and laid the outside line almost to the bottom of the stairs! Stopped for lunch to enjoy the 75 degree sunny weather with my co-engineers before it hits almost 90 in a few hours!


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## afboundguy

Started where I left off last night. I threw in 2 curved turnouts as the on towards the bottom of the picture will be where it splits off to go to the High Line I still plan on modeling. The other one top right and barely visible on 2nd picture will just be a small industry spur with as of now an unknown industry!


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## afboundguy

Up to where I stopped before lunch... After lunch in a few hours I'll tackle the back portion as I'll need to lay on the layout to properly install the track. Totally wish I had a step creeper would make life much easier but I'll be getting one probably in the fall once wife starts back up teaching (she opts to not spread pay out over summer) 

I did ask if she was fine with me getting three AR1's and I got the "let's slow down on this buying stuff for the hobby since it's only a hobby" speech that tied into the wait until she is back in the fall to buy much more but she did say yes to the AR1s... Unfortunately it's looking like the case of Peco code 100 flex track might come up a bit short so I'll have to figure something out maybe work a few overtime shifts over the next few weeks...


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## Longvallon

afboundguy said:


> I did ask if she was fine with me getting three AR1's and I got the _*"let's slow down on this buying stuff for the hobby since it's only a hobby"*_


You're not alone. Welcome to the Club !


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## afboundguy

Didn't really do too much after lunch... Hung out with the dogs as wife is making them be in Rona isolation as well  and we watched some tv and then I headed back down to the basement around 3ish and spent a little bit of time doing more planning than anything...

Was looking to find best spot to allow the outside two tracks to switch back and forth so I can have a "passing" track even though I have the 2 lines going the same way around the whole layout but needed to be able to go back and forth so I could still get the trains in the inner 2 tracks of Horseshoe Curve into the yard...

I also thought this setup would add flexibility so I can have three ways in and out of the yard. It's probably big time overkill and it'll require me to get a few more AR1's (which the wife will love to hear) but I'd rather have the flexibility... I spent a good 45 minutes thinking of every possible route to and from route to the 2 inside tracks of Horseshoe Curve and think I've got it all figured out and don't need any more turnouts on the mainlines but I'm sure something else will pop into my brain tonight or tomorrow!


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## afboundguy

Forgot to mention the turnout bottom right will be for the High Line that will loop over the yard and connect to the curved turnout on the left side...

Also took a quick video testing out the track. The first box truck was having trouble derailing a lot but then I realized it hadn't been properly weighted and it was super light so I put it in the rear and it ran well forwards and backward... Hope to complete the loop tomorrow!!!


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## afboundguy

Made the turn this morning!!!


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## afboundguy

Last section of the outer loop!!!


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## afboundguy

Bird's eye view of outer loop...


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## afboundguy

And the real IT'S ALIVE!!!


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## afboundguy

I don't want to stop running trains to glue down the track I laid! I ran one of my DC K4's at full speed with the same set of rolling stock as well! I tried going full speed with 4 passenger trains but had a few minor problems in a few areas that aren't glued down yet plus the passenger cars haven't been properly weighted yet as well...


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## afboundguy

Few pictures as well... I only need 5 or 6 more flex track to finish with 3 Peco sections left. I could finish it up with the best pieces of the Atlas flex track I have left since I can't go out and buy more at a local store until Wed... See how I feel after lunch but my Ron medication has been helping!!! Not normally a fan of IPAs but this local one is pretty good!!!


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## afboundguy

Enjoy!


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## afboundguy

Few more...


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## OilValleyRy

Got a question.
What is that UFO… I mean weather balloon… in the sky?
Next to the PRR embossed sign.


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Got a question.
> What is that UFO… I mean weather balloon… in the sky?
> Next to the PRR embossed sign.


Whahahahaha... That's the on/off switch to the old laundry hookup that I still use to make RO/DI water for my fish tank!!! Still needed access to it to make water. I have two shut offs under the layout for the tubing but no way I'd trust them 100% which is why I left access to the main valve open and accessible!


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## afboundguy

Had a few local 16oz liquid medications before lunch and I don't usually drink that much and they were IPA's on an empty stomach so I just ended up gluing the newly laid track after lunch


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## afboundguy

But about to start more research since I'm still able to handle that!!!


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## afboundguy

Got a ton of awesome footage to help when I get to scenery!!! Here's just a few...


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## afboundguy

Had to give it another run before bedtime! Think I need to give the PA unit a nice lubing as she's starting to get a bit noisy!


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## afboundguy

Few more still shots... Got it up to 12 rolling stock cars!


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## afboundguy

Looks really cool when it's wrapped around Horseshoe Curve!


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## afboundguy

Haven't done too much this morning more planning than anything. I get to hopefully go back into the real world tomorrow so I can get some more flex track to finish the rest! 

I did use some old Atlas flex track cut up spare pieces to tinker with the connection behind the chimney...


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## afboundguy

Also tinkered and planned the inside loop by the stairs as I wanted to use some of my curved turnouts with the yard design. I think I'm going to add a passing loop which will add a 3rd track on the inside of the loop indicated by the tape on the left side with the turnouts...


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## afboundguy

Since I spoiled the beans already I also used painters tape to mark out rough plans for the yard... It was much easier than doing it with the turnouts and the flex track... The second picture has a better view of this passing track...


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## afboundguy

Last night when I was running the test trains I thought how my layout will much more be a continuous running layout than switching layout. As I was starting to plan the yard in my head and where to put those curved turnouts by the steps to make the yard someone more realistic instead of just a snub nosed yard that goes to nowhere I went down the turntable rabbit hole thought process. 

I have a used large motorized turntable that would fit any of my steamers and I've been wondering if I could fit that and the roundhouse. I figured with my steamers if I wasn't using them on the continuous loop I'd never be able to turn them around realistically and easily for operations without one...

So since I had the ingenious idea of using tape to mark out the yard I busted out the turntable and the frames of one of the roundhouses kits I haven't made and can fit a 6 stall roundhouse and the turntable with room to spare! I feel like this would be way more visually interseting since my layout will be far from a switching layout. I'll still have some small switching in the yard but having the turntable and roundhouse with the High Line going up and over will just look awesome!!!


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## OilValleyRy

Lol passenger loco on a coal drag. It all looks good tho.


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## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Lol passenger loco on a coal drag. It all looks good tho.


The PRR classified the PA units as AFP20s A for Alco and FP for freight/passenger combo duty so techincally it's not that wrong but I agree that they were mainly passenger engines but it was the first engine I had available with knuckle couplers to test so I went with it!


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## afboundguy

Ended up using some Atlas flex track to fill in the inside loop and get a count of how many more Peco flex track pieces I'll need... I'm sure it would not be very noticeable once it's weathered and ballasted but the ties are very different in size when they're right next to each other so I ordered 15 more pieces. I'm sure I'll need a few more once I do the High Line but that will be a while...


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## afboundguy

Ran the PA and a K4 around the layout and kept swapping between the two tracks and as long as I remembered which turnouts to turn which way it all worked out well... That is minus the K4 not being able to make it up the whole Horseshoe Curve with the 12 cars without a little nudge from my hands but K4's weren't made for lugging freight! Sure looks nice with all 4 tracks down though!


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## afboundguy

Also re-tested myself as the wife asked me to and I still popped for Rona so I get the whole 10 days off which is why I ordered more Peco track online since I can't go out still... Still feel fine in fact I mowed the lawn today without any issues. Due to the fact that I more than likely won't get the flex track until Friday if I'm lucky (only took 2 days last time since it's only going from VT to MA) I made a to-do list of things I should do that I'll try and tackle over the next few days to include painting and weathering the tracks, ballasting the tracks, starting to build the mountains on the outside of Horseshoe Curve (which I'll need to do to ballast the outside track as well since there's not much room on the outside of the track at the moment!), make some railguards, run the bus wire and maybe even start cutting out the water reservoir for Horseshoe Curve so I'll have plenty to do!


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## SF Gal

Looks like you hit a great milestone this past weekend by running your first train in a continious loop track.
May I suggest you document this on the layout somewhere so in the future you can remenise about the moment....
"Track layed and first consist run 5/22/2022"


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## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> Looks like you hit a great milestone this past weekend by running your first train in a continious loop track.
> May I suggest you document this on the layout somewhere so in the future you can remenise about the moment....
> "Track layed and first consist run 5/22/2022"


I'm marking them by the YT videos for that purpose but that's a better idea to write them down! I have a notebook I've been taking notes in I'll write it in that tomorrow!!!


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## afboundguy

But @SF Gal speaking of milestones... 3 at once on a single DC powerpack tonight before bed! It'll look better with them going opposite in the curve but can't so that yet...


----------



## JeffHurl

I love seeing all the trains running at the same time! You're going to have a great time with terrain and scenery! 

Love all the updates. Thanks for taking the time to chronicle your journey.


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## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I love seeing all the trains running at the same time! You're going to have a great time with terrain and scenery!


It's been a blast and can't wait until DCC is set up and I can run even more trains... I thought last night even though it'll be more of a continuous running layout I can still create enough to do and act more like a dispatcher on the main line as I'll have the passing tracks and such to make it fun still. Plan to add a 1-2 passenger stations and have the train stop and maybe get passed. I have a few options to still make it fun and interactive! 



JeffHurl said:


> Love all the updates. Thanks for taking the time to chronicle your journey.


Thanks it's fun to wake up to all the likes and the comments! From doing years and years of build threads on my reef tanks on my other forum I know build threads can be a little of a bummer for the OP as people usually just view the posts without commenting but I will say everyone on this forum has been awesome and much more interactive and I appreciate the positive feedback and all the likes!


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## afboundguy

I was told by my B&M buddy that I need to join 2022 and shoot videos in landscape mode! I'll try and do better today with my videos!!!

Also here's a live action feed of the UFO @OilValleyRy I needed to make water for the auto top off for the reef tank today! K4 #3750 is supervising the activity! Only takes me 30 mins to get 5 gallons of 100% pure RODI H20 with this setup...


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## afboundguy

Might be hard to do layout things today with these two co-engineers!!! The deaf crazy one is currently crammed up against my left side while I'm on the laptop posting these and she's nice and warm and cuddly!


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## afboundguy

Day 6... After giving up on the couch activities I decided to head down to the basement... I also decided to focus on beautification today! Finally trimmed the landscape fabric and man does it make a huge difference!!! I took my time and trimmed it super slow after I messed up and cut the first section by the stairs too short. I already purchased extra landscape fabric a l intend to replace it especially after how nice the rest looks!!!

Some before and afters...


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## afboundguy

Kept on with the beautification process as I tried very hard to like this large piece by the stairs but it's just too big and lower right of it would get blocked by the 30th St Station... It just looked too akward... Might have to try and find two smaller frames to mount them seperatly elsewhere...


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## afboundguy

Swapped out a tin sign for one of the 6 framed pictures I have on the wall that already had stuff mounted and then finally mounted stuff on the rear wall... Still have 3 more of those frames but I think I have a spot for one of them once I finish up hanging outside with the dogs!


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## afboundguy

Busted out the BLI GG1 today to test her out... Still just the DC powerpack but went well... Made another video the correct orientation (guess landscape is way to do it) this time and also tried hard to be super steady on movements...


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## afboundguy

Man just found out I still took the video wrong as my camera settings were wrong! My buddy who does a bunch of youtube videos gave me some pointers so I'll try and shoot another one tonight after dinner!


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## SF Gal

I am wondering how you are hanging your landscape fabric? I hot glued clothes pins to the back of my facia board and am not very happy with the way you have to clip the fabric into the clothes pins. I almost have to double up the fabric in some areas to give the clothes pins something to hold. I am hoping to find a just as cheap, easier solution to hanging the skirts. I currently have all my landscape fabric off while I work on the lighting wiring underneath the layout.....


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## Conductorkev

SF Gal said:


> I am wondering how you are hanging your landscape fabric? I hot glued clothes pins to the back of my facia board and am not very happy with the way you have to clip the fabric into the clothes pins. I almost have to double up the fabric in some areas to give the clothes pins something to hold. I am hoping to find a just as cheap, easier solution to hanging the skirts. I currently have all my landscape fabric off while I work on the lighting wiring underneath the layout.....


Why not just staple them on unless you want them to slide in which case you have to have a sliding bar and hooks like a shower curtain. 

If u use staples do like every 3rd ruffle that way it hides tge staple.


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## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> I am wondering how you are hanging your landscape fabric? I hot glued clothes pins to the back of my facia board and am not very happy with the way you have to clip the fabric into the clothes pins. I almost have to double up the fabric in some areas to give the clothes pins something to hold. I am hoping to find a just as cheap, easier solution to hanging the skirts. I currently have all my landscape fabric off while I work on the lighting wiring underneath the layout.....


You should go back and check older posts!!! Just kidding I'll save you the time (I went through whole thread a few days ago and forgot how long it is!) All I did was use this hook and loop velcro tape (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B097TWHBTG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1 ) I hot glue gunned and stapled the "furry" side to the front side of the top of the fabric and then hot glue gunned and used CA superglue for the "stiff" side and glued/stuck that to the inside of the facia board. My plan doing it this way was to have it be removable but even with the CA, hot glue and the stickiness of the backside of the velcro it's not as secure as I envisioned so I can't really pull the velcro apart like my initial plans but I simply just fold the bottom up over the layout if I need to get anywhere.

The only part that doesn't really stick stick is the far right side of the layout by the dehumidifier as it's blowing warm air on it so it comes loose every few days. It is on my list of things to try and fix but I just manually stick it back up when I notice it came undone...


----------



## afboundguy

@SF Gal when I cut it I cut the folded over piece in the back first slightly higher than and then slowly trimmed the front one which made it nice and flush with my super not level basement! I have contemplated also putting a strip of electrical tape on the bottom to sort of almost weigh it down so it hangs even better but that might be a future project as well...


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## Longvallon

I know you posted your track plan somewhere but I can't find it.  Where is it? Thank you very much in advance.


----------



## afboundguy

Started day 7 of Rona watch adding the foam roadbed on the inside passing loop by the stairs and stupidly forgot to take an after picture...

Then I started filling in under the turnout/crossovers and for some reason I thought that would take me hours but there really was only 3 or 4 spots. Guess I thought there were a ton more!


----------



## afboundguy

Then the real fun started! Making the yard! I will say with almost 100% certainly I will not be soldering all the rail joiners in the yard I'd be doing that for months!!!

I just need a 3-way turnout at spot #2 and a curved turnout at spot 1 for the bottom left of the first picture. I have some extra larger curved turnouts that I didn't need that I will be returning and I'll just use that money to buy those two pieces. 

Please feel free to comment and make suggestions for how to improve it as it's just nailed down to the foam board. There will be a 6 stall roundhouse between the turntable and wall/stairs. The few uncovered spurs off the roundhouse will need to be adjusted once the turntable goes in as I'm sure they're not 100% at the correct angle...


----------



## afboundguy

CPL57 said:


> I know you posted your track plan somewhere but I can't find it.  Where is it? Thank you very much in advance.


I can dig up the photo but in the afternoon I can re-do it as my hand drawn plans didn't really account for all the turnouts so now that it's basically laid out I was planning on trying to do a more accurate drawing. 
It won't be to scale though!


----------



## afboundguy

CPL57 said:


> I know you posted your track plan somewhere but I can't find it.  Where is it? Thank you very much in advance.


@CPL57 sorry for the delay but here's a rough drawing of my layout plans and yard plans...


----------



## Longvallon

Thanks a lot ! I found this plan at the very beginning of your thread :


----------



## afboundguy

CPL57 said:


> Thanks a lot ! I found this plan at the very beginning of your thread :
> 
> View attachment 583595


It's changed a bunch since then... That was before the boiler got moved allowing me to add the Horseshoe curve area and that one had 2 reverse loops for the inside track. I actually started redoing it in SCARM again but only made it about halfway before the urge to head down in the basement took over! I'll post the new SCARM model when I finish it!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Today didn't do much except run a variety of trains to see where any problem areas are with the track. I want every single trouble train like the long steamers and the GG1 to run everywhere except the inside loop ot Horseshoe Curve flawlessly before I weather and ballast the track... I already located a few trouble areas and need to replace a problem turnout that one of the rivets sticks up so much several trains derailed and visibily jumped around!

I ran a Rapido RS-11 and a BLI SD7 on opposite tracks then decided to throw in the GG1 with passenger service on the same track as the SD7. I facilitated one over taking which was fun! I think even with it being mainly a continuous loop layout if I run 4 trains at once it'll make it interesting as I'll have to do passing and over takings acting like a dispatcher! 

Anyways enjoy the video of the testing I did!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Hooked up the inside Horseshoe Curve tracks to power and ran a small BLI NW2 switcher reverse the other two tracks and it made for some prettt sweet looking action!

Had to stage K4 #1361 on the inside tracks as well for a photo op!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Also took out some rolling stock from some bins to fill up the yard a bit and placed the DC engines in the yard as well to clean up the top a bit...


----------



## afboundguy

Video of a busy Horseshoe Curve in 1956!


----------



## SF Gal

Looking good! Aren't you done yet?!?!
I know that's where you want to be...running trains and being a dispatch to all your locations...and moving cars in the yard...same with me and my layout ... _*giggle_*


----------



## Gramps

Looks good, lots of action.


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> Looking good! Aren't you done yet?!?!
> I know that's where you want to be...running trains and being a dispatch to all your locations...and moving cars in the yard...same with me and my layout ... _giggle_


No not anywhere near done! New flex track is supposed to get here tomorrow if USPS can keep up their end of the deal (which I don't have much faith in) so if they do I'll get to soldering and finishing up the trackwork. Seeing how it's been running pretty well on my temporarily laid Atlas flex track I'm hoping it'll run even better on the Peco soldered and glued down flex track! 



Gramps said:


> Looks good, lots of action.


Thanks wish I had more action going!


----------



## afboundguy

I didn't do too much tonight just made what I'm sure is a super unrealistic stupidly laid out mini industrial plan... Before all nice and clean and simple...


----------



## afboundguy

After being all fancy and waaaaay over the top. I'll sleep on it in and see how I feel tomorrow...


----------



## afboundguy

Those plans would require me adding a curved turnout (which I had originally wanted to do anyways) and then add a track right off that for staging any helper trains for Horseshoe Curve, which they used in real world... This would also allow traffic in the industrial area to connect back onto the mainline...


----------



## afboundguy

Slept on it and didn't like how busy it was so I simplified it this morning and like it much better...


----------



## afboundguy

Decided to throw in a small spot for the Horseshoe Curve helper staging... Plan on cutting open the back of the Icehouse as it sticks out and then modeling the interior for a little something extra...


----------



## afboundguy

Also decided to rough lay the track by the 30th St Station. The two tracks with the blue tape at the end would be going down to a dummy tunnel to nowhere in an attempt to get close to the real thing. I plan on shaving down the pink styrofoam so the grade isn't as drastic but I don't really plan to run much of anything up there and it will be used mainly for passenger train storage...


----------



## SF Gal

afboundguy said:


> ....Plan on cutting open the back of the Icehouse as it sticks out and then modeling the interior...


Hmmmm, modeling the interior of a ice house has me wondering what the inside of a post WWII war icehouse looks like?!?!




































It might be interesting if you could have a crane lifting molds and having ice block slide into a conveyor into a cooler or something....that will make for an interesting display in itself!
I like the way you think! Neato! 😎


----------



## afboundguy

@SF Gal you saved me a bit of research thanks for sharing those pictures! Automation of it would be pretty sweet and I already have a few ideas that are starting to churn in my head!


----------



## afboundguy

Liked the small little industry that was the simpler version that I made it official and soldered the setup... I ended up running some trains and I took the SD7 with the 2 reefer cars that were in front into the industry and then had the GG1 take the rest of the train...

Then ran the K4 helper ahead of the GG1 to see how it ran on the curve and the rest of the track pulled the SD7 out onto the main track and backed the K4 helper back into it's spot and backed the SD7 back into the industry before the GG1 came back. It's not heavy duty switching but still fun and think it'll add a nice aspect to my mainline track operations especially when I install the 3rd passing line by the stairs! Should make the layout pretty interactive for just a continuous running layout! The new track showed up today so hopefully I'll get a little done tomorrow and then start back up on Tuesday!


----------



## afboundguy

Also ordered a custom backdrop for the chimney (Fall Mountains) The owner is going to custom blend of N scale for the front of the chimney part for my forced perspective plan and blend it back into HO scale for the other 3 sides... I asked for the valley part to be in N scale for the look I'm going for...


----------



## afboundguy

Started laying down the rest of the Peco flex track today. I almost finished it just have 2 more pieces I've already soldered together just needed to take a break as my back was starting to hurt!


----------



## afboundguy

Got everything minus the High Line and the 30th St Station soldered in! Just need to hook up the AR1s and then tie in the yard to the main track!

Last soldered rail joiner!!!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

Really liking the third line I made by the yard... Glad I pulled the trigger on that! After the AR1s go in I'll glue the remaining track to the roadbed and then back to tons of testing with all my engines to get the track as problem free as I can!


----------



## JeffHurl

Have fun!


----------



## afboundguy

Put together the Walthers Interlocking kit I bought. Thing needs some serious weathering!


----------



## OilValleyRy

Wow. That has promise. I’m a little taken aback though. Maybe I never seen your methodology before. I always paint walls, trim, grout, and start weathering before assembly. 
Looks like a nice kit though.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Wow. That has promise. I’m a little taken aback though. Maybe I never seen your methodology before. I always paint walls, trim, grout, and start weathering before assembly.
> Looks like a nice kit though.


I haven't really built a model kit in forever... I should have done the touch up painting before finally completing it. For example in the picture on the box the window trim is painted red and the roof is more brown with the gray part being painted green and I wish I would have done that little touch up details before I put it all together but life and learn... I have a few other things I need to build so I'll adjust my plans accordingly and feel like I'll ultimately do it much closer to the order you mentioned! I will say I wish I knew about that Tamiya extra thin glue as a kid! I always used the testor's glue in that red metal tube and I made a mess no matter how careful I was. This Tamiya stuff is awesome and so clean and easy to work with!

I've also never weathered anything technically. I've tried a few different techniques on some POS crappy rolling stock I'll never ever use on my layout to practice on. I think I've tried doing it with 2-3 total cars so I'm a 100% noobie weatherer...


----------



## OilValleyRy

I’d have to double check but I think PRR structures had green trim? 
Not that you are necessarily accused of being a rivet counter.


----------



## afboundguy

I think they were either the green trim but from what I just dug up during the steam to diesel transition era they were mainly "buff with brown trim and the red window frames and mullions" but I do like the green trimmed look especially since there will be a lot of red on the layout anyways I think the green trim will make it pop a little more since it's red brick already! Glad you mentioned this color @OilValleyRy as I really like that scheme better than the color scheme in the picture on the box...


----------



## Stumpy

That green does look better.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Yeah apparently most were buff colored walls, brown trim, dark red window frames. That was, FWIW, the “standard.” Some were green instead of buff. Some were more yellowish than buff. 
I’m not sure if there was an official reason for the color variation, if it was an older/newer “standard,” or if as with yellow cupolas they used what they had on hand (referring to white cupolas).
Seems you can get away with either.


----------



## Gramps

With that GG1 and Boxcab on the layout, will we see catenary showing up down the road?


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> With that GG1 and Boxcab on the layout, will we see catenary showing up down the road?


Yes... I originally had the layout going from Philly to Harrisburg, which is all electrified but now that I'm doing Horseshoe Curve I'll stop the overhead catenary somewhere on the back wall. I had thought about just doing catenary on the curve but feel like that would be sacrilegious. I know running an electric engine without a catenary is out of place but I feel that out of place aspect is better than throwing up catenary on the curve if that makes sense? 

I actually bought my 3d printer for the main purpose of doing the catenarys with it as I figured it would be cheaper to 3d print them all versus buying them all plus it would allow me to print a ton of other things for the layout...


----------



## afboundguy

Swapped out a bad turnout today that was causing a short even when nothing was connected to it and then ran some steam around to test... Did a double heading of 2 K4s (have TCS wow sound but I'm waiting on new speaker so no sound 😕) and then a BLI J1! Found a few spots that meed some tweaking as those steamers sure find the non perfect spots!


----------



## Longvallon

Nice video ! Short question: What do you do with that ?


----------



## OilValleyRy

The J1 sounds great. Those twin K4s look great!


----------



## Lemonhawk

Looks like a wrench to remove sewer clean out plugs .. its square.


----------



## OilValleyRy

I’d guess a track weight. Or… for maintenance of those side rods.


----------



## afboundguy

@CPL57y buddy with the big B&M layout gave it to me as it was for bolts for trackwork for my birthday a few weeks ago and I plan to mount it somewhere...


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> The J1 sounds great. Those twin K4s look great!


Yes it does. I'm bummed the K4 sound didn't work as it sounded amazing with the TCS wow kit I put in it! Would have sounded great even with only 1 of the 2 having sound but just have to wait for the new speaker to get here that's all...


----------



## Longvallon

afboundguy said:


> @CPL57y buddy with the big B&M layout gave it to me as it was for bolts for trackwork for my birthday a few weeks ago and I plan to mount it somewhere...


So you can use it on your layout ?


----------



## afboundguy

CPL57 said:


> So you can use it on your layout ?


I have used it to hold down track as the glue dries so technically I am using it on my layout!


----------



## afboundguy

Now that I'm back at work and can venture out into the world again it's harder to fit in time for the layout. Luckily (well not really but for layout) on my way to a Jiu Jitsu heard a nice thump thump thump on the highway. Pulled over a few times couldn't figure it out. Eventually went away but I limped home and the mechanic had no clue how I didn't have a blowout on the highway or how the tire was still holding air! 3 out of the 4 tires you could see the metal core with the 4th one pretty much there. Lovely dealership that "checked" my tires last oil change 6k miles ago didn't do so hot of a job... But I can't go anywhere today or tomorrow on my days off soooooo what else do I have to do around the house!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Glued down almost all of the rest of the track this morning... @CPL57 see how useful the wrench is!


----------



## afboundguy

Added some throw switches as well. Did all the big atlas curved TOs as they were a little free flowing so hopefully with them more "snapped" in the steamers will run smoother through them we'll see...


----------



## afboundguy

Now about to tackle some coupler upgrades!


----------



## Longvallon

afboundguy said:


> @CPL57 see how useful the wrench is!


----------



## afboundguy

Had 26 cars I was going to put new couplers on and got 24 of the 26. 2 of them were crap cars and looked harder to swap out couplers so I put them back in the bin...


----------



## afboundguy

Also checked the weights of them all got most of them properly weighed. A few I need to use buckshot underneath. I tagged them as well indicating if they need metal wheels and/or weight so I don't have to check every time!


----------



## Magic

Doing weights, couplers and wheels is a pain in the neck but well worth it in the long run.
Model railroading is no fun if things don't run right. Good Job and the layout is coming along nicely.

Magic


----------



## afboundguy

Magic said:


> Doing weights, couplers and wheels is a pain in the neck but well worth it in the long run.
> Model railroading is no fun if things don't run right. Good Job and the layout is coming along nicely.
> 
> Magic


I can attest to that as I've been doing my testing with a mix of metal and plastic wheels and properly weighed and underweighted cars. Been putting the underweight cars towards the rear but I was limited in what I had for rolling stock that had kadee couplers... Just got 50-60 metal wheels delivered today while I was out and about so looking like Monday or Tuesday I'll tackle that project!


----------



## afboundguy

Swapped out a bunch of plastic wheels for metal wheels and did some more track testing with a double headed steam freight train... Still to tweek a few more spots but it's getting there...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Yikes on those tires! 
I always…well, no I cheat and skip it sometimes, but 2-3 times per week I do a lazy walk around inspection, mainly looking for low tire pressure or total flats. Once per week I do a thorough visual walk around; checking for low pressure, unusual wear, an under carriage visual for anything obvious, etc. I also keep the radio off at start up and listen for any problems with ignition, at idle, or brake issues after a roll back out of the garage.
I used to forget about doing it, so I got a Remove Before Flight sensor streamer that I hang from my rear view to remind me to do it. Last thing on the check list is close the garage door & confirm it went all the way down.


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy  less than 20k on the tires... Top one is the one that had the piece fall off and make noise on the highway... Have no idea how I didn't have a blowout! But on a good note the new tires are finally in and they are a much nicer and quieter drive!


----------



## afboundguy

On an even more positive note today I decided not to work overtime so I've been tackling the layout... The outside line of Horseshoe Curve has been giving me tons of trouble with the track I laid. It would pop off the lead wheal of the rear set of 6 on my GG1 and it was popping off albeit not as much as the GG1, the lead main driver wheel on my J1. I've repaired the track several times and adjusted the soldering with not much luck... Finally decided to incorporate an NMRA gauge into the track repairs. Got one of the two sections fixed a few days ago but this morning I installed a pretty much full 3' section of flex track starting at the top of the curve and using offset rails and I think I got it! Was running the GG1 and J1 for almost an hour trouble free!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Also found a cool piece of memorabilia... I plan to do a custom PRR Police caboose that probably never existed as I haven't been able to find any pictures of PRR Police cars/cabooses but I think it will be a cool addition!


----------



## afboundguy

As far as the bad news goes my BLI P3 GG1 that I purchased in March 2021 that I barely ran for the first year as I didn't have a layout is out of warranty now and one of the gears is totally shot... I can hear grinding and it can't even pull 4 or 5 cars up the curve anymore and I can spin the driver wheels by hand... My BLI P3 P5a is also starting to make the same gear noise but luckily that is under warranty still. I emailed BLI tech and I'm hoping their customer service is as good as everybody says online and they'll work with me on the GG1 seeing how my P4 I1sa is already in for warranty repair (damn wiring from tender to cab broke off) and now 2 more BLI engines are down making 3 of the 4 new BLI engine purchases I've made... Fingers crossed they can help me out with the GG1 as I really like the engines but along with the praise of their companies support I've also heard the nightmare problems from their newer items and I'm starting to see that first hand now...

Anyways here's another video of the test running I did this morning...


----------



## OilValleyRy

From the recent trend, I’m steering clear of BLI. 
As to out of warranty repairs; I’d see if NWSL has a matching gear in brass. Slightly more difficult to break brass gears.


----------



## JeffHurl

Yeah, BLI seems to have a business model that accepts poor QA from a Chinese Mfr, and compensates with a hefty repair facility in the States.

I deduced the above based on all the chatter on the interwebs about poor QA, and good my experience with results from their repair center, but the repair center has quite the backlog. It took them about 4-5 weeks to turnaround a repair of a brand new item that was DOA.

I only bought BLI because at the time, they were the only game in town for the locomotive I wanted. I also didn't care too much for their sound decoder... cumbersome to tweak volumes.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> From the recent trend, I’m steering clear of BLI.
> As to out of warranty repairs; I’d see if NWSL has a matching gear in brass. Slightly more difficult to break brass gears.


I'll have to look into that thanks!!! I would hazard the same assumption that a brass gear would be harder to break than what I'm sure is a plastic gear!!!



JeffHurl said:


> Yeah, BLI seems to have a business model that accepts poor QA from a Chinese Mfr, and compensates with a hefty repair facility in the States.
> 
> I deduced the above based on all the chatter on the interwebs about poor QA, and good my experience with results from their repair center, but the repair center has quite the backlog. It took them about 4-5 weeks to turnaround a repair of a brand new item that was DOA.
> 
> I only bought BLI because at the time, they were the only game in town for the locomotive I wanted. I also didn't care too much for their sound decoder... cumbersome to tweak volumes.


I've heard nightmares about the paragon 3 engines and the GG1 and P5a are both paragon 3... The paragon 4 one was just the wiring harness that snapped off. I asked for a replacement one as I figured it would be much faster to swap that out myself but once I swapped it out it still didn't work so I sent it back... They received my I1sa on 5/5 and they said 2-3 weeks and I just checked today and it says the same thing and it's been almost 6 weeks... 

I did preorder the E6 they're coming out with as it looks really nice looking and when my BLI models run they do run well... I don't really want to dabble in brass just yet and that's all there really is out there for the PRR E6's at the moment... I was going to get a BLI F3/F7 but I think I might try another reputable manufacturer...


----------



## afboundguy

Did some tedious monotonous work for a a bit tonight... Will say it does looks much better when it's done though!


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Did some tedious monotonous work for a a bit tonight... Will say it does looks much better when it's done though!


 It does.

You're doing right getting your track solid before moving on.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> It does.
> 
> You're doing right getting your track solid before moving on.


I keep telling myself that but it's a royal pain in the you-know-what!


----------



## Lemonhawk

That is a nasty set of tires!


----------



## afboundguy

Lemonhawk said:


> That is a nasty set of tires!


Yes they were... Was a tad BS at the dealership but oh well... Do plan on sending that nice email sooner rather than later!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Had a Jiu Jitsu class this morning and then a quick doctor's appointment right after but managed to get in some more tie replacement before lunch... Might try and head back down there a little before work tonight to try and finish up the rest!


----------



## afboundguy

Was able to finish up all the ties before heading off to work in a few minutes not counting the yard that's not finished think I may tackle that next before starting major work on Horseshoe Curve... Vacuumed the entire layout and floors and the top of the layout is pretty clean but the work bench is another issue 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Little bit better cleaned up and semi-organized...


----------



## afboundguy

Been almost 2 weeks since I've been able to work on the layout... Schedule change at work and adulting keeps getting in the way... Reworked the yard a bit today just need to install the curved turnout...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

Right now I have the wye turnout and then another turnout that leads into the yard. I think I will either remove the turnout after the wye so I can eliminate the double slip switch or move the diesel building a little left and maybe do a small stagging track. With the turnout gone I can just use a normal turnout instead of the double slip switch and I think it would look much better ..


----------



## OilValleyRy

Looking at adjacent turnouts, the double slip isn’t needed. Looks cool & congested like a service facility would(?) but totally redundant. There is one viable reason to keep it as is though. A single sanding tower on one side dead center of the double slip, versus sandwiched between two narrow spaced tracks.

Unrelated question:
Are you going to weather & detail the TT pit before installing it?


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Looking at adjacent turnouts, the double slip isn’t needed. Looks cool & congested like a service facility would(?) but totally redundant. There is one viable reason to keep it as is though. A single sanding tower on one side dead center of the double slip, versus sandwiched between two narrow spaced tracks.


I had thought of keeping it with another turnout either curved or normal to make it a track for a purpose. If I add a passing track I would move the diesel shed over and then the sanding tower for the tracks to the turntable and the diesel service facilities...



OilValleyRy said:


> Unrelated question:
> Are you going to weather & detail the TT pit before installing it?


Yes I will be doing it before  Learned my lesson on the tower project lol... I plan to actually test it and see how it works on a DC pack to see if I can use that to turn it and then I'll swap out the track to NP track then start cutting the hole!


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy essentially put the sanding station here...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Yeah that’s where I was thinking, precisely at the bottom edge of that X, practically next to the frogs. 
But, if you want to swap the double slip for two straight sections, a sanding tower would maybe need to be between them.
It is redundant kinda, as far as access to the diesel shed. Technically you could probably relocate the turnout that leads to the RH bay to the double slip location and make it work. 
But redundancies aside, it makes the yard tracks look busy and maze-like, and personally I think *large* yards being a spaghetti bowl both look more “serious” or traffic intensive and add to the navigating fun. But’s possibly controversial, and personal preference.


----------



## afboundguy

I forgot to snap a new picture with the removed double slip switch but I think I like it better without it... But I did test out the turntable with a DC power pack and it worked! I need to lube it up as it's a little loud. Also hooked up power to the track wires and tested a DC engine on it and it moved! 








1956 HO scale Philly to Horseshoe Curve turntable test...







youtube.com


----------



## OilValleyRy

A little loud? Does that thing make decaf?


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> A little loud? Does that thing make decaf?


It was under $15 shipped so for that price I'll take the noise... Thing looks a tad old and I'm hoping with a proper cleaning and lubrication it'll quiet down significantly...


----------



## afboundguy

Used one of my cardboard curved turnout templates to determine if I got just *one* more peco turnout I could make another passing line... Just need to find time to swing by the train store only worked 39 hours of overtime this week 🙃


----------



## afboundguy

Tidied up the work bench and floor area as it was even starting to annoy me...


----------



## afboundguy

Today I swapped out the old brass track from the turntable to nice new NP track!


----------



## afboundguy

Purchased a bunch of Dollar Tree thick poster board to put under the yards to level them out... Should ba caller dollar and a quarter store now though...


----------



## afboundguy

Put in the foam board in the yard... Don't think I needed to buy 13 of them seeing how I only used 4 but oh well!


----------



## afboundguy

Going to try and glue them down tomorrow... Has to mow the lawn as it was turning into a hat field and the dogs were protesting!


----------



## OilValleyRy

The spares will work great for lighting blocks inside structures. 
Why elevate the yard though?


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> The spares will work great for lighting blocks inside structures.
> Why elevate the yard though?


There was too much of a slope from the mainline to the yard and my buddy does it this way in his big B&M layout and you can't tell they're close to the same height at all...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Ah ok. 
I’ve always set my yards a bit lower, or added a slight hump.


----------



## afboundguy

Started trimming the extra plywood around the curve today...


----------



## afboundguy

Wife said I was making too much noise so I couldn't finish the other side!


----------



## afboundguy

On a related note the construction adhesive I used to glue down the foam to the plywood was lots of fun to try and remove! Ended up using a crowbar!


----------



## afboundguy

Looks awesome and it's not done yet!


----------



## afboundguy

I had thought about lowering that section of the plywood thinking I may get 4-5 extra inches but when I double checked it would have been maybe 2 inches at most and it wouldn't be worth the work especially since I have a nice 2×4 in the center for support...


----------



## afboundguy

Finished taking out the rest of the foam and trimming the inside wood. I then used a scraper to clean the glue still left on the plywood...


----------



## afboundguy

Then I temorarily hung the background up just to get a look!


----------



## JeffHurl

Rollin up your sleeves!!! Looks great! Well worth the effort!


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Rollin up your sleeves!!! Looks great! Well worth the effort!


Thanks it's an up and down ride... Layout looks like crap now that I've put a ton of stuff on top of it to start working on the curve!


----------



## afboundguy

Put up the background this morning and trimmed it up...


----------



## afboundguy

Kept myself up last night thinking about the layout and if I should or shouldn't lower the plywood... After putting up the background up I sketched out the inside of the curve on the plywood and made up my mind it won't be worth it to lower it. It doesn't have to be perfect and it'll never be perfectly to scale anyways just have to keep reminding myself that! Now on to making the inside hills, roads and reservoir







!


----------



## OilValleyRy

I had an idea for some of those coal hoppers, as a work train. I don’t think you’re using many drywall screws at this stage of the game, but it would cast the term “work train” in a slightly different light. 
Might be a good place to store extra ties to fill joiner gaps, switch stands, signal masts etc.


----------



## Raege

I missed a bunch alerts stopped but caught up now. Really looking good excited to see the curve completed will be awesome scene.


----------



## Stumpy




----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I had an idea for some of those coal hoppers, as a work train. I don’t think you’re using many drywall screws at this stage of the game, but it would cast the term “work train” in a slightly different light.
> Might be a good place to store extra ties to fill joiner gaps, switch stands, signal masts etc.


Funny you mention this... I have 2 or 3 gondolas that serve that very purpose. I have a bunch of the cut off rail and busted ties that I threw in there!



Raege said:


> I missed a bunch alerts stopped but caught up now. Really looking good excited to see the curve completed will be awesome scene.


I am excited as well!


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


>


NICE!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Increased my ore car fleet to over 10!


----------



## afboundguy

I also found an HO scale diagram of the 46th St Staion rounhouse. Used some of the extra thick posterboard to do a quick mockup... This would have been 16 stalls...


----------



## afboundguy

Would have been was the key word in that previous post... Doesn't quite fit 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Started tackling the reef tank upgrade to clear up some room in the basement... Yes it's in thay pile somewhere!


----------



## afboundguy

Built a quick stand with the same dimensions as the stand upstairs...


----------



## afboundguy

Was hard not to touch the layout as it's a bit of a mess... Getting the tank out of there has alterior motives... Eventually I'd love to convince the wife to let me expand the layout where the shelves are in the tank pile mess! Once she sees how open it would look and I actually start finishing work on the layout I think it'll be an east sell I think!


----------



## afboundguy

Just for this delivered!!! Should help out doing the mountains a tad!


----------



## OilValleyRy

When I had aquariums I’d put a piece of styrofoam between the tank & stand to auto-level it. Do you do this as well? Just curious. 
That’s where I got the idea for auto-leveling free standing layouts.


----------



## SF Gal

afboundguy said:


> Just for this delivered!!! Should help out doing the mountains a tad!


I have the woodlands scenics bow cutter and It is a game changer, for sure.
Spent $10 for it in 2007 and it still works great today. 








I love the no mess of static pellets flying all over when cutting with a knife...no way!
You are going to love it, for sure...though, you might wish you had the bow for a longer clearance cuts.


----------



## LongvaIIon

Beware of toxic fumes...


----------



## Conductorkev

SF Gal said:


> I have the woodlands scenics bow cutter and It is a game changer, for sure.
> Spent $10 for it in 2007 and it still works great today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love the no mess of static pellets flying all over when cutting with a knife...no way!
> You are going to love it, for sure...though, you might wish you had the bow for a longer clearance cuts.


I much prefer cutting with the below tool. The ws cutter I found that the wire just broke too easily or stretched out so it would start to sag making a uneven line.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> When I had aquariums I’d put a piece of styrofoam between the tank & stand to auto-level it. Do you do this as well? Just curious.
> That’s where I got the idea for auto-leveling free standing layouts.


Sort of... They have a matt for cheap money that does the same thing that is all water proof and made for aquariums...


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> I have the woodlands scenics bow cutter and It is a game changer, for sure.
> Spent $10 for it in 2007 and it still works great today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love the no mess of static pellets flying all over when cutting with a knife...no way!
> You are going to love it, for sure...though, you might wish you had the bow for a longer clearance cuts.


I was going to snag this but the one I found on etsy had this for much cheaper...



Conductorkev said:


> I much prefer cutting with the below tool. The ws cutter I found that the wire just broke too easily or stretched out so it would start to sag making a uneven line.
> View attachment 586097


The kit I bought has that option as well...


----------



## afboundguy

LongvaIIon said:


> Beware of toxic fumes...


I have a painters mask and plan to open at least 2 basement windows with a fan for extra circulation!


----------



## JeffHurl

I found a sharp utility knife was much better than the heat cutting tools.


----------



## LongvaIIon

afboundguy said:


> I have a painters mask and plan to open at least 2 basement windows with a fan for extra circulation!


Very good ideas !


----------



## afboundguy

Tidied up the layout and ran some trains while I worked on the tank a bit. Showed it to the wife and she asked what my thoughts were about keeping it down stairs and I had to contain myself. I left it that if she'd let me put flooring down I'd do it... Little does she know what I'd plan to do!

Anyways took some quick videos of the RS-11 and the newly repaired I1sa Hippo...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Spectacular.
Question about that whistle. Can that be modified at all? I forget the terminology but Engineers often have their own sort of unique way of sounding or “riding the brake” so to speak. That’s how you end up with a whistle/horn having that sort of gradient as opposed to a more on/off morse code series of “toots.” Anyway, I recall reading long ago that sound decoders (I think it was Tsunami1) had the ability to do that, or tailor that? 
But I’ve not heard anything about it since then, nor seen an example of it. Err, heard an example rather. Until now.
Could you share what brand decoder that is? Is it modified in CVs or Equalizer or something? One of a handful of preset choices? I’d like to achieve 3 variations of M5 so I can differentiate my GE lashup from the Alcos from the EMDs just by ear alone.


----------



## SF Gal

That is a huge tender on that steamer! Looking good! Thanks for sharing your video.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Spectacular.
> Question about that whistle. Can that be modified at all? I forget the terminology but Engineers often have their own sort of unique way of sounding or “riding the brake” so to speak. That’s how you end up with a whistle/horn having that sort of gradient as opposed to a more on/off morse code series of “toots.” Anyway, I recall reading long ago that sound decoders (I think it was Tsunami1) had the ability to do that, or tailor that?
> But I’ve not heard anything about it since then, nor seen an example of it. Err, heard an example rather. Until now.
> Could you share what brand decoder that is? Is it modified in CVs or Equalizer or something? One of a handful of preset choices? I’d like to achieve 3 variations of M5 so I can differentiate my GE lashup from the Alcos from the EMDs just by ear alone.


It's a BLI Paragon 4 engine... Not sure off the top of my head but I think there may be a different whistle but I'd have to check the manual as I just got it back from a BLI warranty repair...


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> That is a huge tender on that steamer! Looking good! Thanks for sharing your video.


Yeah I went withe the larger tender option and glad I did as it looks awesome!


----------



## afboundguy

Started the process of building back the inside of Horseshoe Curve and a little for the mountains but stopped with the mountains until I get the inside of the curve done so it doesn't get in the way. In retrospect should have maybe left the insulation and cut it down but oh well!


----------



## afboundguy

Not a big accomplishment but finally drilled holes for the feeders on the curve which now doesn't give me an excuse to procrastinate running a bus wire under the layout anymore 😕


----------



## OilValleyRy

Looking good. Just needs some wadded up newspaper, masking tape, and plaster cloth to slope it out. 
I don’t get newspapers anymore. But I bet old magazines would work. Hmmmm.


----------



## LongvaIIon

OilValleyRy said:


> But I bet old magazines would work.


It's probably not the same type of paper. Then you probably won't be able to stick it properly. Just my two cents.


----------



## JeffHurl

We still get advertisement packs that are printed on a newspaper-like material. it comes about once a month... considerably less material than the old days' newspapers, but I keep them... they make good drop clothes for ad-hoc spray painting, pumpkin carving, scenery building, etc.


----------



## OilValleyRy

LongvaIIon said:


> It's probably not the same type of paper. Then you probably won't be able to stick it properly. Just my two cents.


It’s just fill. Balled up, with a lattice of masking tape to hold it in place. Plaster cloth draped over top.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Looking good. Just needs some wadded up newspaper, masking tape, and plaster cloth to slope it out.
> I don’t get newspapers anymore. But I bet old magazines would work. Hmmmm.


I plan to sculpt the foam first into a rough contour with a combo of a hot wire foam cutter and the good old foam board saw and then use some DIY sculptamold made from old egg cartons to texture it up...


----------



## afboundguy

Got to work on the curve for a little while the wife was walking on the treadmill this morning. Just need to glue down the pieces and start sculpting!


----------



## afboundguy

Also did a little on the backside... Not sure how high I'll do those mountains but probably not too much. The area by the pole will be the highest in an attempt to block out said pole and I need one spot really high!


----------



## LongvaIIon

Is it Casper the Friendly Ghost ?


----------



## Raege

I like the ghost add. Instead of horse shoe curve Dead Mans curve  Can play the old song


----------



## afboundguy

LongvaIIon said:


> Is it Casper the Friendly Ghost ?
> 
> View attachment 586698


Whahahahahahahaha... My father in law loves making things like that... He's made us that, a turkey, a snowman and a few other things we put out front for decorations. The ghost hasn't found it's final resting place quite yet 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Wow almost a full month since I've been on! Summer is busy and I've been working extra and my schedule changed so the layout has been stagnant... Worked on it a little today... The monthlong stagnant chaos...


----------



## afboundguy

Finished the second layer and got one piece of the third layer of the mountains. I will more than likely need to buy another 4x8 sheet of pink foam which will probably make it easier to build up compared to adding and cutting small pieces.


----------



## Gramps

Based on the bottom photo, I guess with the work schedule change it put a wrench in your plans.


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> Based on the bottom photo, I guess with the work schedule change it put a wrench in your plans.


That's funny (insert foul language) right there! One of my friends gave that to me for my 40th bday. Real B&M wrench!


----------



## afboundguy

Measured out to see if the 50 feet of bus line wiring would fit and it was prettt much the perfect amount. I was a few inches short but I can make that up easily! Next step hopefully will be to actually wire it underneath the layout and slowly hook up each drop line one at a time and test the track after each new connection! Under 2 weeks until back to my normal schedule!


----------



## afboundguy

Ummmm laying bus wire sucks!!! Total PITA but I have to keep telling myself it will be worth it in the long run right? Got about half of it secured the other day. Today was my first day off in what seems like the whole summer and I had planned on working on the layout a little bit but I played catch up with my growing list of things to do so that hopefully next week when I'm back to my normal schedule I can focus more time on the layout!!!

Connected where I was "starting" the bus wire to the two drop feeder lines...


----------



## afboundguy

Then ran wire around Horseshoe Curve and gave up as I was having a royal PITA hard time trying to nail the wiring into the thin plywood with everything under the layout  I ended up using some painters tape temporarily for the time being which is also sort of a smart'ish idea in case I need to move and adjust the wire...


----------



## JeffHurl

I really liked using short terminal blocks to split off the feeders. It seemed easier to deal with than a bunch of wire nuts. For example, I used a terminal strip for each bus (pos and neg). So for your horseshoe curve, I would run 4 feeders from one bus (positive) and another 4 feeders from the other bus (negative). 2 terminal strips... one for each bus wire.

My layout was similar to yours, in that I could run a few feeders to different sections of track off of one splice that happened to be near all 3-4 tracks.


----------



## OilValleyRy

I agree with Jeff. I used suitcase connectors on my old N. Never again. Can’t recall what I used on my HO Michigan & Elsewhere. 
This time each section of benchwork (6ft ea) gets a T Strip for track bus & 1 for lighting bus. That way my bus lines just daisy chain in about 7ft increments.

I also designed it so they are at my front L girder, right behind the fascia.

And this time using single screw galvanized pipe straps to hold them up, which are smaller than double screw pvc straps.


----------



## Lemonhawk

My preference is 4 a circuit terminal barrier strip with the bus going in and out on the 2 inner terminals with jumpers to the 2 outside terminals for going to feeders. I do have WAGO Luminare connectors which are designed for exactly what we do here, bus A and B go in and out on one side and a real connector plugs into this for the feeder - its used for running a bus for lighting and then having several drops for the lights! The WAGO connector would make disconnecting a feeder a lot easier than unscrewing terminal barrier screws.


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> Ummmm laying bus wire sucks!!! Total PITA but I have to keep telling myself it will be worth it in the long run right? Got about half of it secured the other day. Today was my first day off in what seems like the whole summer and I had planned on working on the layout a little bit but I played catch up with my growing list of things to do so that hopefully next week when I'm back to my normal schedule I can focus more time on the layout!!!
> 
> Connected where I was "starting" the bus wire to the two drop feeder lines...
> View attachment 588917



While it sucks being under tge table I still think it's way better than ballasting.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I really liked using short terminal blocks to split off the feeders. It seemed easier to deal with than a bunch of wire nuts. For example, I used a terminal strip for each bus (pos and neg). So for your horseshoe curve, I would run 4 feeders from one bus (positive) and another 4 feeders from the other bus (negative). 2 terminal strips... one for each bus wire.
> 
> My layout was similar to yours, in that I could run a few feeders to different sections of track off of one splice that happened to be near all 3-4 tracks.


Are you talking about connecting the 4 feeder wires together and then connecting them to the bus wiring? I have 4 feeders on both sides of the curve where they will be wired in...


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> While it sucks being under tge table I still think it's way better than ballasting.


I haven't started ballasting but I'm sort of looking forward to that as it will mark significant progress in my eyes but to you point I have no way to compare just yet!


----------



## OilValleyRy

I _think_ Jeff meant a pair of T strips somewhere center of Horseshoe Curve, one for each wire of the bus. Then have all feeders connect to the T(erminal) strips.

There are different types though. Some have clamp type set screws with no Stay-Cons needed, which are nice. Some require jumpers (sometimes handy but not in this case), some have an integrated bus bar so every contact is energized the same. Some have split bars, so one T strip can do both +/-.
For track bus I think the last type, with set screws, is the primo choice. They provide a nice clean termination point for the very end of the bus line too.

For feeders that are longer than desired/suggested; you can use the same AWG as the bus, and then use a crimp connector to reduce wire size for the last few inches. This way you can have 16” long feeders (12” of 14awg + 4” of 20awg crimped) if necessary without the inherent problems of having 16” long 20AWG feeders.


----------



## JeffHurl

Yes, I would run lengths of bus wire between terminal strips. Place the terminal strips at strategic spots where you can split off feeders to multiple tracks from the same terminal strip.

Here is a draft of how I ran feeders. You can see that there are several spots where I can have a "hub" (terminal strip) tha splits into seperate feeders for 2-to-6 tracks that happen to be in the vicinity of the hub.

I chose to run feeders to all sides of a turnout and also made sure I had a feeder about every 6-8 feet or so.


----------



## JeffHurl

Here is a picture i stole from teh internet showing the thick bus wires, jumpers so teh whole strip is interconnected, and all the feeders coming off the terminal strips


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Here is a picture i stole from teh internet showing the thick bus wires, jumpers so teh whole strip is interconnected, and all the feeders coming off the terminal strips
> View attachment 588977


Thanks for the clarification and picture makes much more sense now!


----------



## Chops

Wow, this an opus! 31,000 views and climbing, keep up the great work! My great grandfather was a life long brakeman on the PRR. He started out at age of nine as a mule boy on the Susquehanna canals.


----------



## afboundguy

Chops said:


> Wow, this an opus! 31,000 views and climbing, keep up the great work! My great grandfather was a life long brakeman on the PRR. He started out at age of nine as a mule boy on the Susquehanna canals.


I've been severely slacking it so hopefully I'll bump up those views once I start cranking on the layout again! Appreciate the kind words!


----------



## afboundguy

Only had a limited amount of time today and I didn't want to get frustrated with wiring again so I decided to start tackling another quick project!


----------



## afboundguy

Cut out the poster board first...


----------



## afboundguy

At first I was going to try and just cut down as far as the thickness of the turntable but decided that probably wasn't the smartest way to go about it...


----------



## afboundguy

Ended up cutting all the way down to the plywood and using a crowbar to pop up the two halves. I figure I can cut it to the correct height and let the turntable rest on it. Had to cut a hole in the bottom so the mechanics would fit plus I needed a hole anyways for wiring!


----------



## afboundguy

I didn't totally finish it as I need to level it but it fits pretty darn good for the first rough cut!


----------



## afboundguy

Opps just realized I posted the wrong picture for the last post


----------



## OilValleyRy

Who made the camp cars for the MOW?


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Who made the camp cars for the MOW?


The three directly right of the turntable I bought used for super cheap. The other ones to the right of those I made from a Walthers kit and I still need to modify them a lot to make them look better but those first three were sort of weathered when I got them but eventually I'll dirty them up a lot more...


----------



## afboundguy

@OilValleyRy I also plan on having what will probably be a very disproportional amount of MOW cars on the layout compared to the rest of the rolling stock. As of right now they fill up most of the spurs in the yard. Granted I plan on having them out on the layout "repairing" sections of the track often and once the layout starts coming to life more I plan to have an almost permanent MoW crew working on one of the two inside tracks of Horseshoe Curve until I automate the turnouts that go from 2 tracks to 1 track that goes behind the chimney. Figure keeping a MoW train on one of the tracks will add to the visual interest of what will be an empty track at the beginning


----------



## afboundguy

Just finally placed my order as it finally arrived stateside!!! Way too much money but oh well! Had to get is since I saw it in person at the museum!


----------



## OilValleyRy

Weigh it when you get it. The Bowser ones were close to 16 ounces. 
Looks sharp. Hope it doesn’t have that company curse.

Fun fact; I once coupled a Bowser H9 and Walthers FM H10-44 in a tug of war. Both weighed about one pound. The Bowser won.


----------



## afboundguy

Picked up some more insulation. Cut it down into 4 pieces to fit in the back of my car again 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Wanted to get rid of all the super small pieces for the mountain so I cut out a few pieces and started glueing them down


----------



## afboundguy

Picked up the new BLI PRR E6 #460 glossy as appears today and gave it it's inaugural run a little while ago. Not a bad runner but one of these days I need to turn down the volume of the BLI engines they're just too loud for my liking and totally overpower some of my other quieter engines...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Pretty cool.
It got me wondering if you’ve ever seen vids on youtube of Sweet Home Chicago by Jon Grant? He had some excellent steam vids with some wonderful mood. I look forward to seeng that sort of stuff from you some day.


----------



## SF Gal

The layout is sure moving right along. It is nice to see you running some pricy locomotives, with sound too...whoowee!
Curious about you car interior, love the color of the seats, pretty color.


----------



## JeffHurl

Enjoy running trains!

I can visualize the scenery already!


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Pretty cool.
> It got me wondering if you’ve ever seen vids on youtube of Sweet Home Chicago by Jon Grant? He had some excellent steam vids with some wonderful mood. I look forward to seeng that sort of stuff from you some day.


I haven't seen those videos exactly but I've seen many similar ones and I also look forward to being able to make videos with that kind of scenery!


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> The layout is sure moving right along. It is nice to see you running some pricy locomotives, with sound too...whoowee!
> Curious about you car interior, love the color of the seats, pretty color.


Yes too much money spent but oh well! I just worked extra shifts for them! Those interiors are the stock Bachmann Spectrum coaches. I plan to make them even better with passengers and better interior lighting in the far future once the layout gets up to par...


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Enjoy running trains!
> 
> I can visualize the scenery already!


That makes one of us! I just want to get the mountains carved and painted brown and I'm sure once I get to that point it'll get me really motivated!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Hmmmm what's happening today???


----------



## afboundguy

So glad I went and got another full sheet of insulation. Much easier to work with (and more stable) than using a bunch of scrap pieces!


----------



## afboundguy

Cleaned up all the scraps hope to get to carving this weekend!!!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## JeffHurl

afboundguy said:


> Hmmmm what's happening today???
> View attachment 590315
> View attachment 590316


Looks like you are building stadium seating around horseshoe curve, LOL!


----------



## SF Gal

If I were you, I would take my longest car and run it round the outside track. You are going to find you need a bigger relief between the rails and styrafoam. Don't forget any signal or wire poles you want to add around the curve too!


----------



## JeffHurl

I'm starting to see it more and more


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Looks like you are building stadium seating around horseshoe curve, LOL!


It does lol!!!



SF Gal said:


> If I were you, I would take my longest car and run it round the outside track. You are going to find you need a bigger relief between the rails and styrafoam. Don't forget any signal or wire poles you want to add around the curve too!


There is a lot more clearance than what shows in the pictures but I'll double check. Since it's the outside part the overhang shouldn't really be an issue...


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I'm starting to see it more and more
> 
> View attachment 590326


Getting there slowly but surely! Might not has AS much greenery as the real thing as I may need to more rock/ledge just due to the thinness of the mountains...


----------



## afboundguy

Silly me I didn't wait until tomorrow to start doing the fun stuff!


----------



## afboundguy

I picked up this foam cutter on etsy for under $20 and it paid for itself already. Waaaaayyyyy less messy than hand carving! I will still need to do some hand carving but clean up was easy!


----------



## afboundguy

And here we go!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Was extremely happy with the first rough attempt! I still have some carving and tweeks to do but ran out of time before I had to get ready for work. Had a fan in the window and anouther fan blowing behind me towards the window with a painters mask on for the fumes...


----------



## afboundguy

Had to use some painters tape to hold down a few spots where the glue hadn't dried since I couldn't keep a paint can up there anymore 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Tomorrow I should still get plenty of time to work on the layout. I plan to do final carving of the mountain and then tackle carving the inside of the curve and then paint the mountains and the inside so there's no more pepto color! I haven't made up my mind if I should paint the mountain part the same brown or go with gray since it's a mountain! Leaning towards brown as I can layer grays to create rocks and I plan to use sculptamould to make ledge so color doesn't totally matter!


----------



## OilValleyRy

What if you extend the fascia height along the hill side, with tuscan on the outside & probably enough room for stuff mounted (ie historical blurb regarding the curve or something else), and on the inside of the fascia a photo backdrop. Just do that area though, so the curve can be viewed from the lower terrain areas on either side. That support post is there anyway, so it’d block that in photos and eliminate it as a viewing obstruction from aisle side.
Just a thought to consider.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> What if you extend the fascia height along the hill side, with tuscan on the outside & probably enough room for stuff mounted (ie historical blurb regarding the curve or something else), and on the inside of the fascia a photo backdrop. Just do that area though, so the curve can be viewed from the lower terrain areas on either side. That support post is there anyway, so it’d block that in photos and eliminate it as a viewing obstruction from aisle side.
> Just a thought to consider.


I had thought of extending the fascia board but wouldn't want to just add on top of it the seam would bug me so I'd have to cut a new bigger piece


----------



## afboundguy

After letting it sit overnight and re-examining my carving from yesterday I am going to try and make it more angled for better tree application... See how that goes!!! Few befores...


----------



## JeffHurl

I'm envious. I really enjoyed building my layout, and am considering a second one, lol


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I'm envious. I really enjoyed building my layout, and am considering a second one, lol


I worry once it's "done" I won't enjoy it as much either  but.... Once it's done I plan to start working on the wife to let me expand it


----------



## afboundguy

Super glad I took the time to recarve the mountains! They're much more at and angle and look much more like the actual curve and it'll make putting trees on way easier!!! Just about to sit down for lunch and want to paint it real quick then I need to tackle cleaning the tank!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Filled a trashbag worth of carvings!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

Looks a tad better painted


----------



## afboundguy

Need advice... I want to do the facia board up the back of the mountain but I'm wondering what everyone's thoughts would be if I painted the facia a different color? That may alleviate my OCD about the seams and could possible keep the stripe and PRR logo front and center. Thoughts?


----------



## JeffHurl

You could paint the upper portion of the facia something like what Disney uses to make buildings "harder to see" I think they have a blue and/or green they use on buildings they want to blend into the surroundings.


----------



## Berrychon

afboundguy said:


> Once it's done I plan to start working on the wife to let me expand it


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> You could paint the upper portion of the facia something like what Disney uses to make buildings "harder to see" I think they have a blue and/or green they use on buildings they want to blend into the surroundings.


I'll have to look into that coloring thanks...


----------



## afboundguy

Berrychon said:


>


Hey I was able to "convince" her to let me do the layout this big already  And of course by convince I just drove her nuts to the point where she said "do whatever you want" which meant don't do anything I wanted but I still did it anyways! To my credit when it's been clean and organized she actually has said she likes it way more than she thought she ever would! 😆


----------



## afboundguy

Before of the inside of the curve!


----------



## afboundguy

Had to bust out the hand insultation knife the wire cutter wasn't working on some of the super steep spots I needed to make...


----------



## afboundguy

If you've been along for the crazy ride you may have remembered my plan to do reverse perspective to make the inside of the curve look bigger and to make the mountains look bigger. The blue tape is roughly N scale roadways and I might slowly go down to Z scale into the tunnel as you won't really see it from the other side of the layout. Square tapes are the parking lots...


----------



## afboundguy

On the opposite side of the resevoir I may go N scale trees to Z scale trees by the edge of the track since this will be the main viewing side. I plan on buying a ton of Z, N and HO scale trees and experiment with what looks best!


----------



## SF Gal

afboundguy said:


> Need advice... I want to do the facia board up the back of the mountain but I'm wondering what everyone's thoughts would be if I painted the facia a different color? ..... Thoughts?


Yes, do a facia black as a waybill wall...and put up advertisment from the PRR all along the sides!!!!!
You can find a lot of cool Waybill posters if you search the internet!!!!!
I had some bare areas on a PRR Control tower I build for my American flyer Christmas Layout and that idea to post advertisment came in handy....


----------



## OilValleyRy

I wouldn’t worry much about ops getting boring on this layout. 
There is at least one mainline train.
Yard work.
I believe you’ll have at least one local.
And passenger ops.

I think the key to fighting boredom is having enough to occupy 5 operators, but also the ability to operate alone. My layout will have mainline running option (or auto-pilot), at least one local, yard work, and two refinery locals, plus each refinery has a yard and switcher and is a 5x8 switching layout (40 sq ft ea x 2). And I may have the scenic tourist OC&T excursion trains. Oh, and MOW work. So I’ll have a good variety of tasks to fight boredom.


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> Yes, do a facia black as a waybill wall...and put up advertisment from the PRR all along the sides!!!!!
> You can find a lot of cool Waybill posters if you search the internet!!!!!
> I had some bare areas on a PRR Control tower I build for my American flyer Christmas Layout and that idea to post advertisment came in handy....


I have tons of stuff hung already but have a growing Horseshoe Curve collection going. I think I'll just bite the bullet and do a single new facia piece... Just need to figure out if I can do both sides with what I have left or if I need another full 4'×8' sheet...


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I wouldn’t worry much about ops getting boring on this layout.
> There is at least one mainline train.
> Yard work.
> I believe you’ll have at least one local.
> And passenger ops.
> 
> I think the key to fighting boredom is having enough to occupy 5 operators, but also the ability to operate alone. My layout will have mainline running option (or auto-pilot), at least one local, yard work, and two refinery locals, plus each refinery has a yard and switcher and is a 5x8 switching layout (40 sq ft ea x 2). And I may have the scenic tourist OC&T excursion trains. Oh, and MOW work. So I’ll have a good variety of tasks to fight boredom.


I haven't been bored so far with operating I was more talking about being bored with the building aspect as I really enjoy that! Tonight I busted out 3 trains at once and placed some static trains on the inside of the curve as it's not powered just yet (really need to finish up the final wiring!)

I plan to have lots of MOW work as I seem to have a disproportionate amount of MOW cars to everything else!


----------



## afboundguy

Painted the inside after dinner!!! I painted over the tape so I can just pull it up and still have a reference point for what I marked out...


----------



## afboundguy

Tank also is clearing up nicely!!! Still messy and will need another water change in a few days!


----------



## afboundguy

And couldn't resist running some more trains! I did have 3 going at once but didn't film it. Also cleaned up the top and put all the cars in a spot and staged 2 MOW crews with one on the curve and another static K4 passenger setup as well for visual interest!


----------



## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> I have tons of stuff hung already but have a growing Horseshoe Curve collection going. I think I'll just bite the bullet and do a single new facia piece... Just need to figure out if I can do both sides with what I have left or if I need another full 4'×8' sheet...


Are you using 1/8th masonite as fascia? Sometimes called handy panel. 
You can get it in 4x4 sheets.


----------



## Berrychon

afboundguy said:


> Hey I was able to "convince" her to let me do the layout this big already  And of course by convince I just drove her nuts to the point where she said "do whatever you want" which meant don't do anything I wanted but I still did it anyways! To my credit when it's been clean and organized she actually has said she likes it way more than she thought she ever would! 😆


You are a smart guy ! And apparently your method works very well. I absolutely have to try this with the Love of my life. Without any guarantee of result...


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Are you using 1/8th masonite as fascia? Sometimes called handy panel.
> You can get it in 4x4 sheets.


Didn't realize this I'll have to measure and see if that size would work thanks!


----------



## afboundguy

Berrychon said:


> You are a smart guy ! And apparently your method works very well. I absolutely have to try this with the Love of my life. Without any guarantee of result...


Use my method at your own risk. I am not liable for any damages caused with using my wreckless and potentially dangerous methods! 🤣


----------



## Gramps

My suggestion about the scale trees you get is that any trees that will be up against the photo of the mountains be the same size and color as the trees that appear in the foreground of the photo.


----------



## OilValleyRy

This may help with the wife part.


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> My suggestion about the scale trees you get is that any trees that will be up against the photo of the mountains be the same size and color as the trees that appear in the foreground of the photo.


I'm not opposed to that but I really want to try the reverse perspective. I should have plenty of trees to mess around and make it look as best as possible...


----------



## afboundguy

Didn't do much on the layout today froze my butt off playing softball today and after I ate lunch I just ran some trains around. Did a little switching and maneuvering trains around and snapped another video with some tripple train action. Also finally took out the BLI GG1 and P5a that were sent back several weeks ago from their warranty repair. I will say the P5a can't pull much up the curve and may be relegated to an aesthetic role on the layout


----------



## afboundguy

Added another curved turnout for another passing track that doubles as a way into the yard tonight...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

Just dropped about $150 on trees and various shrubbery items to be able to put down some trees! I also purchased some Mod Podge to do the reservoir on the inside of the curve... I am super busy this week but might be able to try and at least start the reservoir. Trees will have to wait until next week when they get delivered!


----------



## OilValleyRy

I can’t help but think of the Knights of Ni (or is it Nee?).


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I can’t help but think of the Knights of Ni (or is it Nee?).


----------



## OilValleyRy

You’re going to be even busier next week than this, with that herring snd all. Lol


----------



## afboundguy

Question for everybody who's along for the ride... Looking for advice on what to do for the base color of the mountains? Going for fall colors and not sure what color to change (if at all) the mountains before I start adding trees next week???


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> Question for everybody who's along for the ride... Looking for advice on what to do for the base color of the mountains? Going for fall colors and not sure what color to change (if at all) the mountains before I start adding trees next week???
> View attachment 590969



I would just use the ws earth undercoat or a light brown. Most of it won't show thru since it is pretty heavily forested going up that back hill.


----------



## Stumpy

Dark brown.


----------



## Conductorkev

Stumpy said:


> Dark brown.


I would have said dark brown but the only part that will show thru at all is tge edge where the clearence is around the curve and it looks lighter in color.


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## OilValleyRy

Looks like late Winter at Horseshoe Curve for scenery reference. Good view without the leaves in the way and no snow. Just add a little color.

Amtrak 357 Altoona, PA 3-13-1981 on The CRHS's Conrail Photo Archive


----------



## Conductorkev

OilValleyRy said:


> Looks like late Winter at Horseshoe Curve for scenery reference. Good view without the leaves in the way and no snow. Just add a little color.
> 
> Amtrak 357 Altoona, PA 3-13-1981 on The CRHS's Conrail Photo Archive



Why I was saying like a light brown. Dark would show thru. And where it gets darker is all woods and the trees and folage covers the ground


----------



## Raege

Reddish brown I would think from the organic material decaying. I’m kinda stoked to watch this come together!


----------



## Chris At FilmWorks

The base color for all my scenery except bare rock is the color of dirt in the area I am modeling. Go to any home improvement store and look at the color chips. Buy a gallon of the cheapest FLAT latex you can find. One caveat: Get a color just a bit lighter than the color of dirt under daylight. Your lighting on the MR is never as bright as daylight so everything will appear darker. I also paint the roadbed before laying the track. Very often I will put on a very heavy coat of this "Dirt Paint" and then sprinkle other scenery materials into it.
One note... It looks like you are doing the 4 track main on the PRR back in the day. There are lots of photos on line of that curve.


----------



## Gramps

OilValleyRy said:


> Looks like late Winter at Horseshoe Curve for scenery reference. Good view without the leaves in the way and no snow. Just add a little color.
> 
> Amtrak 357 Altoona, PA 3-13-1981 on The CRHS's Conrail Photo Archive


That's an interesting photo with three baggage cars and a combine which Amtrak called a baggage-coach. I wonder if that was Amtrak's Broadway Limited.


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> I would just use the ws earth undercoat or a light brown. Most of it won't show thru since it is pretty heavily forested going up that back hill.


Thanks!



Stumpy said:


> Dark brown.





Conductorkev said:


> I would have said dark brown but the only part that will show thru at all is tge edge where the clearence is around the curve and it looks lighter in color.


Thanks... I plan on airbrushing/painting the part by the track so I don't plan on painting it until around ballasting time anyways... I'll have to experiment with colors and trees when they come in a few days...


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> Why I was saying like a light brown. Dark would show thru. And where it gets darker is all woods and the trees and folage covers the ground





Raege said:


> Reddish brown I would think from the organic material decaying. I’m kinda stoked to watch this come together!


I had thought of this option as well thanks! I'll add it to the list of test colors! @Raege I'm a tad stoked as well!


----------



## afboundguy

Chris At FilmWorks said:


> The base color for all my scenery except bare rock is the color of dirt in the area I am modeling. Go to any home improvement store and look at the color chips. Buy a gallon of the cheapest FLAT latex you can find. One caveat: Get a color just a bit lighter than the color of dirt under daylight. Your lighting on the MR is never as bright as daylight so everything will appear darker. I also paint the roadbed before laying the track. Very often I will put on a very heavy coat of this "Dirt Paint" and then sprinkle other scenery materials into it.


Too late to paint the roadbed but I may try and paint it the gray of the roadbed thanks for the tip! 



Chris At FilmWorks said:


> One note... It looks like you are doing the 4 track main on the PRR back in the day. There are lots of photos on line of that curve.


Yes there is but the coloring is hard to pick up in a lot of the photos. While I had ideas similar to the suggestions I appreciate all the different advice! 

It's funny I posted the question on a few of the PRR FB groups I belong to and didn't get nearly this good of advice and even boarderline got shunned since a true to scale Horseshoe Curve would require 12 feet. I wanted to reply no kidding but I don't the space and my railroad = my rules but behaved and didn't reply


----------



## Chris At FilmWorks

About looking at photos.... They will give you a good idea about rock outcrops and density and types of vegetation. Since you are modeling a real and very iconic place in railroad history there will be many photos online. Most of them will be Black and White. That isn't really a problem. They will tell you, for example, where the rock outcrops are in the cuts. Beware of color photos! Most landscape photography and all calendar art are heavily color corrected to make them "pretty". The colors have too much saturation. In real life, for example, trees aren't bright green... they are more of an olive green. (I spent 35 years as a landscape photographer and became totally disgusted with what passes now for serious landscape.) 

One thing to keep in mind about the internet is "Those that can't do... teach." Ignore the naysayers. Model Railroading in anything but 12 inch to the Foot scale is filled with compromises. The art of it is in deciding what is an acceptable compromise. 

One suggestion about modeling heavily wooded hills. You don't have to model ALL the trees. Plant trees along the visible front edge, add low brush and ground cover. Behind those trees just model the treetops raised to the level of the trees in front. I have seen chicken wire raised about ground level with lichen attached to it.


----------



## JeffHurl

I've found that tans and grays make the best ground colors as opposed to dark brown... unless you're modeling mud, most ground is tannish gray.

To me, the most important part is a black wash. Black washing adds a lot of "relief" as the black settles into all the little nooks and crannies as it dries.


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## Chris At FilmWorks

I use a spray of water base flat black primer on my plaster rock before the color wash.... BUT I always spray the rock heavily with water. If the plaster is dry, the black wash will just make the plaster black.


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## afboundguy

I have some planned time tomorrow from my busy work schedule and I plan on experimenting with trees. I took a trip up to NH for my niece's baptism and paid attention to the foliage and how the trees looked and honestly I don't really think it matters what color the mountain base will be as I shouldn't even see it with all the tree color but we'll see! 

Appreciate all the tips on the rocks though as I plan on having lots of rockwork and there is that one spot of ledge that is on the curve that I want to model. Won't be in the exact prototypical spot but the whole curve isn't to scale just trying to do my best! Going to also try and paint the water area and then use modge podge to make the reservoir!


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> I have some planned time tomorrow from my busy work schedule and I plan on experimenting with trees. I took a trip up to NH for my niece's baptism and paid attention to the foliage and how the trees looked and honestly I don't really think it matters what color the mountain base will be as I shouldn't even see it with all the tree color but we'll see!
> 
> Appreciate all the tips on the rocks though as I plan on having lots of rockwork and there is that one spot of ledge that is on the curve that I want to model. Won't be in the exact prototypical spot but the whole curve isn't to scale just trying to do my best! Going to also try and paint the water area and then use modge podge to make the reservoir!



Ya usually you don't see the undercoat in heavily wooded areas. You have soil then brush I also usually fine crush up dead leaves and use that then you have trees with all that it doesn't show thru.


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## JeffHurl

Woodland Scenics has a few how-to videos that demonstrate how to use their liquid dyes to color rock faces made from plaster of paris. 

I found this one to be really useful!


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## OilValleyRy

Blender-ized autumn leaves. Just maybe avoid going for total coverage like I should have done. The hardest part was getting them blended small enough as they don’t have enough weight to sink to the blades. LOTS of stopping and shaking & blender-izing again. I was going more for unkempt tree line/property line, but an interesting method either way.









Fun tip: I save empty parmesan cheese shakers and cooking seasoning shakers for things like blender-ized leaves, different types of sand (clean, dirty), custom ground foam mixtures, and if you know anyone who smokes cigars, the ashes work great for an ash pit.


----------



## Conductorkev

OilValleyRy said:


> Blender-ized autumn leaves. Just maybe avoid going for total coverage like I should have done. The hardest part was getting them blended small enough as they don’t have enough weight to sink to the blades. LOTS of stopping and shaking & blender-izing again. I was going more for unkempt tree line/property line, but an interesting method either way.
> View attachment 591190
> 
> 
> Fun tip: I save empty parmesan cheese shakers and cooking seasoning shakers for things like blender-ized leaves, different types of sand (clean, dirty), custom ground foam mixtures, and if you know anyone who smokes cigars, the ashes work great for an ash pit.



Ya I start by taking out the branch part of the leaves out (which I usually use foe fallen trees and branches) I break up by hand at first. I do put them for a very short time in the microwave to dry them out more. Then I use one of those choppers. 
I think they are magic chef in sone such. Used to chomp tomatoes and onions into bits. It's round with blades. I just put leaves on cutting board and go wild.


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## JeffHurl

Pampered Chef?









I can't believe we still have one of these, lol!


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## Stumpy

I used sawdust for forest floor litter. Walnut with a little lighter mixed in.


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## BigGRacing

OilValleyRy said:


> Blender-ized autumn leaves. Just maybe avoid going for total coverage like I should have done. The hardest part was getting them blended small enough as they don’t have enough weight to sink to the blades. LOTS of stopping and shaking & blender-izing again. I was going more for unkempt tree line/property line, but an interesting method either way.
> View attachment 591190
> 
> 
> Fun tip: I save empty parmesan cheese shakers and cooking seasoning shakers for things like blender-ized leaves, different types of sand (clean, dirty), custom ground foam mixtures, and if you know anyone who smokes cigars, the ashes work great for an ash pit.


Great tips! Thank you !


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## Conductorkev

JeffHurl said:


> Pampered Chef?
> View attachment 591192
> 
> 
> I can't believe we still have one of these, lol!



That's what I use and it does its job on dried leaves


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## afboundguy

Well I cracked open the trees I got that were "HO" scale 1.5-3 inches and they definately weren't HO scale  Just a bit short!


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## afboundguy

I purchased 10 packs of these trees that have about 60 trees per pack. I got about 7 fall colored ones and 3 greens. Put in essentially a full pack plus a few green ones. That little spot looks awesome but man will this take a while! I yelled at my buddy for not talking me out of doing all these trees!!! Just need to spend a bunch of time putting more in and then need to find more actual HO scale ones for closer to the tracks. The 1.5-3 inch ones will work for the forced perspective at the top of the mountains...


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## afboundguy

On a building/modeling note do people usually spray a mix of water and elmers glue on the tree "leaves" to keep them lasting longer?


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## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> On a building/modeling note do people usually spray a mix of water and elmers glue on the tree "leaves" to keep them lasting longer?


I’ve only done that with supertree leaves. The Noch leaves still end up falling off regardless. Which looks fine for autumn. But the ground foam type trees probably do not need any additional glue IMO. It might turn the fluffy look into a hard candy or rock-like texture.


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> I purchased 10 packs of these trees that have about 60 trees per pack.


Looks like the MP scenery trees. When I first started back in 2018 I found a bulk pack of those on ebay. They came in a ~ 7" cube box and there was as many as you could possibly cram in there. All sizes up to 3". I think the price was $20. Was a no-name brand in a plain brown box, but it was the same product as the MP.

I have scoured ebay this morning and I can't find any such listing, and purchase history only goes back to 2020.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I’ve only done that with supertree leaves. The Noch leaves still end up falling off regardless. Which looks fine for autumn. But the ground foam type trees probably do not need any additional glue IMO. It might turn the fluffy look into a hard candy or rock-like texture.


Thanks for the info... I may try and experiment and spray one or two of these and see what happens. They were a mess and there was several "leaves" that fell down on the tracks!



Stumpy said:


> Looks like the MP scenery trees. When I first started back in 2018 I found a bulk pack of those on ebay. They came in a ~ 7" cube box and there was as many as you could possibly cram in there. All sizes up to 3". I think the price was $20. Was a no-name brand in a plain brown box, but it was the same product as the MP.
> 
> I have scoured ebay this morning and I can't find any such listing, and purchase history only goes back to 2020.


Did they look like these? I did a google search and they look like the same product... I got 10 packages for about $8-$9 each...


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## afboundguy

Just purchased several of the Woodland Scenic Canopy kits in mainly the Autumn mix with 1 or 2 greens mixed in. I'm hoping they're a little taller than the 2-3 inch tree but even if they're the same smaller size I'll still need them!!!


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## OilValleyRy

Maybe try spraying just one tree with rustoleum matte clear, to see what happens? I think it’s enamel (might be lacquer) so in theory it would likely not play well with ground foam type trees. On the other hand, being aerosolized may make all the difference?
While you’re at it, a spritz of pale green or pale yellow on some autumn colors might yield cool results? But the same effect could be achieved with chalk dusting too (FYI if you buy chalk sets and figured yellow & green 

There is of course super hold hairspray. The super ultra mega hold 1980s punk mohawk stuff. Can’t provide a specific brand though. Never had a mohawk.

You’ve got plenty of trees and space enough to hide failed attempts in there. Good time & place to try a variety of ideas, zany or mainstream.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Maybe try spraying just one tree with rustoleum matte clear, to see what happens? I think it’s enamel (might be lacquer) so in theory it would likely not play well with ground foam type trees. On the other hand, being aerosolized may make all the difference?
> While you’re at it, a spritz of pale green or pale yellow on some autumn colors might yield cool results? But the same effect could be achieved with chalk dusting too (FYI if you buy chalk sets and figured yellow & green
> 
> There is of course super hold hairspray. The super ultra mega hold 1980s punk mohawk stuff. Can’t provide a specific brand though. Never had a mohawk.
> 
> You’ve got plenty of trees and space enough to hide failed attempts in there. Good time & place to try a variety of ideas, zany or mainstream.


I had planned on doing something similar to the chaulking or similar way to add slight variations to the trees so they're not the same color... Probably should start experimenting with that before I put them in first!


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## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Did they look like these?


Aye. I'm pretty sure JTT & MP are the same thing. At least that particular type of tree is.


----------



## MichaelE

Large, mature trees all started as saplings. There's really no measure for what's 'in-scale' as far as trees go until you start getting into the really larger O scale trees.


----------



## NorthwestPennsyGuy

MichaelE said:


> Large, mature trees all started as saplings. There's really no measure for what's 'in-scale' as far as trees go until you start getting into the really larger O scale trees.


yeah tree scales are rather interisting i happen to also model G scale outside and alberta spruce are in scale


----------



## afboundguy

Started putting in another 1-2 boxes of trees and I realized I was putting them way to close together so I couldn't see the base from the top. Halfway through I realized I just needed to step back and see how it looked standing back opps!!! Doesn't really look that different to me and I won't need as many trees!!!

Top down super close...


----------



## afboundguy

Top down spread out more...


----------



## afboundguy

Which is which???


----------



## JeffHurl

Yeah, you may as well spread them out a bit. Looks fine that way. Maybe put down some fall leaf color on the ground first? Kind of like that black spray stuff people with dark hair use to make them look less bald, lol.

Have you tried Woodland Scenic's "Fine Leaf Foliage"? It comes in a package like that... it usually has a couple handfuls of tree size pieces and a LOT of smaller "briar patch" like stuff that would also look good mixed in there. It also has a lot of "shake" that would make great tree litter.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Lookin great


----------



## Raege

Looking very nice!


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Lookin great





Raege said:


> Looking very nice!


Thanks one day it'll actually look good!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Today had some down time but didn't want to do too much heavy lifting so I started on some smaller easier projects...


----------



## afboundguy

Finished the sanding tower and started one of the 4 track PRR signals... Found out I'll need a 4th one to kitbash a custom signal tower as I need to make them a bit wider to properly fit over my 4 track mainline on the curves...

Going to paint the sand kit at a later time


----------



## OilValleyRy

I never did that type of sand tower. Might do a single sided one. 
Is it top heavy at all? A couple steel nails tamped into the foam, sort of counter-sunk and small “hockey puck” magnets glued to the kit footings would solve that problem; if it exists.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I never did that type of sand tower. Might do a single sided one.
> Is it top heavy at all? A couple steel nails tamped into the foam, sort of counter-sunk and small “hockey puck” magnets glued to the kit footings would solve that problem; if it exists.


Not too top heavy. It's standing on it's own but it will probably just get some elmers glue on the bottom after paint for the install...


----------



## afboundguy

Finished one of the 4 track PRR signal bridges! Also ordered another full kit to salvage parts so I can extend it to correct length for the 2 spots I will be placing the rest!


----------



## afboundguy

Eventually I'll paint and install lights but that will be a ways off (at least the lights aspect) but looks good so far in it's future home!


----------



## afboundguy

Did a few coats of flat black spray paint on the one I finished yesterday and also started the kitbashing one that needed to be longer...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

Tad better looking painted...


----------



## afboundguy

Also finally got around to painting this bad boy today!


----------



## afboundguy

Kitbashed PRR signal bridge is done! Just need to paint her!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## Christiaη

Well done ! Are you going to put some bulbs inside ?


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> Kitbashed PRR signal bridge is done! Just need to paint her!


Can't tell it's bashed from here.


----------



## JeffHurl

The signal bridge looks fantastic!!! Well done! That will add some depth to the scene.


----------



## Raege

Nice bash looks seamless. So cool seeing your layout coming to life. Thanks for sharing it


----------



## REdington

Both of them will look nice when there lit.


----------



## afboundguy

Christiaη said:


> Well done ! Are you going to put some bulbs inside ?


Sort of. I purchased some of these LED recessed lights:








and some .118" thick "non-transparent" yellow acrylic that will go over them. I had experimented with a few different lighting options but the recessed lighting option appears to be the best. I will have them set up to a 3 way switch to cycle between the different signals...


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Can't tell it's bashed from here.






JeffHurl said:


> The signal bridge looks fantastic!!! Well done! That will add some depth to the scene.


Thanks!



Raege said:


> Nice bash looks seamless. So cool seeing your layout coming to life. Thanks for sharing it


Thanks! It's fun sharing! I just wish I had more time to do things on the layout just super busy "adulting" The kitbashing is pretty hard to tell in person and once I paint it I'm sure it will be even harder to tell the difference! I unfortunately ran out of the spray paint I used on the first signal bridge that was actually flat black and purchased another brand of spray paint that said it was flat black but after spraying it was definitely was more of a satin which was sort of annoying. So now I need to find another can of what I used or gamble that the next flat black can will be actually flat black!

I still have one more to do and the 4th kit should arrive on Friday. The third spot I want to use will be slightly smaller than the one I just finished. I may add another dual track one but I'm not really sure...


----------



## afboundguy

REdington said:


> Both of them will look nice when there lit.


The signal bridges will be a long time before they are probably actually lit so don't hold your breath! I had thought about just making them stay stuck on the signals and not have them be adjustable to make things easier...


----------



## afboundguy

Been super busy but have some time off this week and tested out the led bulbs I purchased for the signal! Drilled out some holes first!


----------



## afboundguy

The lamp 3way switch works ok'ish but I need a 4 way switch as only 2 of them work plus turning them all on... Will be picking up a 3 inch hole saw to start cutting the yellow plastic soon!


----------



## Raege

That’s such a cool project. Loving the layout and the decor surrounding it.


----------



## afboundguy

Raege said:


> That’s such a cool project. Loving the layout and the decor surrounding it.


Thanks!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Looking for some advice from the group... I'm in the process of planning to replace the cheapo ebay backdrop I got as it looks super cheap compared to the much better one I purchased for the chimney and based on the below attached picture (the blank masonite in the back) I'm debating between doing the same backdrop (Fall Mountains) or a different fall one (Blue Ridge Fall). I'm leaning towards the second one to be slightly different but wasn't sure if I chose the same backdrop if it would hide the corner a bit more? Thoughts?


----------



## Steve on Cattail Creek

afboundguy said:


> Looking for some advice from the group... I'm in the process of planning to replace the cheapo ebay backdrop I got as it looks super cheap compared to the much better one I purchased for the chimney and based on the below attached picture (the blank masonite in the back) I'm debating between doing the same backdrop (Fall Mountains) or a different fall one (Blue Ridge Fall). I'm leaning towards the second one to be slightly different but wasn't sure if I chose the same backdrop if it would hide the corner a bit more? Thoughts?


Well, the difference in the foliage mix in the two candidate scenes is moderately obvious to me, even on my cellphone screen, so depending on the foreground the two might not visually blend very well. I noticed that they can print the graphic reversed left to right, so perhaps you can reverse the print and butt the 'matching' ends together?


----------



## Stumpy

Whatever you do there's going to be a visual "break" between the chimney BG and the BG on the masonite - at least from the angle the pic was taken. The mountains in the Blue Ridge BG are farther away. The masonite is farther away. So I'd take advantage of that and go with the Blue Ridge to "fool the eye", ifyaknowwhatImean. I would probably have it reversed from what's shown on the web site so you would have fall colors against fall colors at the the visual break


----------



## Stumpy

Maybe?


----------



## OilValleyRy

I would use Fall Mountains, and depending on the length needed, ask them to print x feet length, with the left edge and a reverse image being mated, located according to where that area visually lands on the overall backdrop length. The linked pages indicates they will do exactly that for you. 

That would blend the view of the two separate backdrops from as many vantage points as possible, but not every vantage point.


----------



## Gramps

Stumpy said:


> Maybe?
> 
> View attachment 593404


Based on this photo it would seem to me that you have to use the same background for both. It's just way too obvious that the backgrounds don't flow together. Even with the same backgrounds the distance between them doesn't allow for a smooth transition. Is there a way to use another piece of masonite to connect the foreground piece to the background piece using the same photo background for both without losing the horseshoe curve effect?


----------



## Magic

I agree with OVR and Gramps, should blend in much nicer.

Magic


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Whatever you do there's going to be a visual "break" between the chimney BG and the BG on the masonite - at least from the angle the pic was taken. The mountains in the Blue Ridge BG are farther away. The masonite is farther away. So I'd take advantage of that and go with the Blue Ridge to "fool the eye", ifyaknowwhatImean. I would probably have it reversed from what's shown on the web site so you would have fall colors against fall colors at the the visual break
> Maybe?
> 
> View attachment 593404


I like the reversed idea I didn't utilize that when I tried doing similar to what you did... (see below)


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I would use Fall Mountains, and depending on the length needed, ask them to print x feet length, with the left edge and a reverse image being mated, located according to where that area visually lands on the overall backdrop length. The linked pages indicates they will do exactly that for you.
> 
> That would blend the view of the two separate backdrops from as many vantage points as possible, but not every vantage point.





Gramps said:


> Based on this photo it would seem to me that you have to use the same background for both. It's just way too obvious that the backgrounds don't flow together. Even with the same backgrounds the distance between them doesn't allow for a smooth transition. Is there a way to use another piece of masonite to connect the foreground piece to the background piece using the same photo background for both without losing the horseshoe curve effect?





Magic said:


> I agree with OVR and Gramps, should blend in much nicer.
> 
> Magic


This seems to be the consensus as well... While I would never get it to truly "match" up I'm merely looking for whatever will "trick" the eyes as much as possible and as much as I like the blue ridge fall version I think the same one might be the better option. The vantage point I took the picture from will more than likely be the spot most viewed so I would have to take some measurements and adjust the other background as best as possible to make it line up...

I did do two quick mock ups like what @Stumpy did (minus reversing the blue ridge fall) and I think the fall mountains match might be the best bet... I may see about having them blend the two so that the blue ridge fall would be on the left but we'll see still waiting to hear back from the vendor about the possibility of adding a few select Philadelphia specific buildings into his "Big City Dallas 1950s" (Big City Dallas 1950s) which I would use for behind the large yard under the stairwells as that's the best one I can find anywhere online to represent 1956 Philadelphia and if he can add 1-3 Philadelphia specific buildings I could live with that!


Blue Ridge Fall









Fall Mountains (same as on chimney)


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> I did do two quick mock ups like what @Stumpy did (minus reversing the blue ridge fall) and I think the fall mountains match might be the best bet


Yeah, agree.


----------



## OilValleyRy

That looks pretty good. Flipping the “mock up” or “stand in” and visually mating the end to be a mirror of the chimney slope would be about as illusionary as you’ll get.

I did consider suggesting a masonite divider, but with curves and TOs it’d have to be a flat divider, and the lack of tunnels given the viewing angle would… I suspect yield dismal results. I didn’t think of vertical dividers to imply tunnel walls… but regardless, seen from the other side would look screwy.


----------



## Gramps

That looks much better but are viewers able to look from an angle where they can see down between the two backdrops? If the only viewing angle at that spot the one in the photos you should be OK but if not the open area between the two backdrops will be exposed.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That looks pretty good. Flipping the “mock up” or “stand in” and visually mating the end to be a mirror of the chimney slope would be about as illusionary as you’ll get.
> 
> I did consider suggesting a masonite divider, but with curves and TOs it’d have to be a flat divider, and the lack of tunnels given the viewing angle would… I suspect yield dismal results. I didn’t think of vertical dividers to imply tunnel walls… but regardless, seen from the other side would look screwy.


My original plans included a divider with a tunnel for a definitive separation but ultimately I opted not to use one... I thought having one made it feel smaller...


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> That looks much better but are viewers able to look from an angle where they can see down between the two backdrops? If the only viewing angle at that spot the one in the photos you should be OK but if not the open area between the two backdrops will be exposed.


There arw several different viewing angles but not too mucb different from that main one. I'll try and take a video or a bunch more pictures from the other angles for a better representation of the views tomorrow while I'm cooking the turkey


----------



## afboundguy

Not related to my layout directly but was helping my buddy with a layout tour today of his B&M set in late fall of 1957 and snapped a video...


----------



## OilValleyRy

That minute man scheme was always Top 5 in my book.
Did you ask what the box on the RS3 (2?) walkway is? The striped “box” with handrail offset I mean. It’s an unusual location and _very_ eye catching. 
Some really neat stuff there. The bricked up caboose smoke jack for one. Snow is a lovely change.


----------



## Stumpy

OilValleyRy said:


> Snow is a lovely change.


Indeed.

Nice layout. Nice video. Good to see prototypical speeds and that RS-3 running LHF as most did in '57.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That minute man scheme was always Top 5 in my book.
> Did you ask what the box on the RS3 (2?) walkway is? The striped “box” with handrail offset I mean. It’s an unusual location and _very_ eye catching.
> Some really neat stuff there. The bricked up caboose smoke jack for one.


I'll have to ask him as I'm sure he'll know he's an actual engineer and knows way too much train info...



Stumpy said:


> Nice layout. Nice video. Good to see prototypical speeds and that RS-3 running LHF as most did in '57.


I agree... I enjoy the speeds. I'm hoping when I put the bullfrog snot on my engines it'll let me run prototypical speeds. Currently I need to run them sort of fast to make the grade of the curve...



OilValleyRy said:


> Snow is a lovely change.





Stumpy said:


> Indeed.


He did it very tastefully. It's supposed to be late November and the first snowfal of the year. Almost everyone that visited mentioned nobody does snow as well...


----------



## Gramps

Great scenery idea. We have seen many layouts with winter snow and others with fall colors but the late fall snow dusting is unique. Thanks for posting.


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> I'm hoping when I put the bullfrog snot on my engines it'll let me run prototypical speeds. Currently I need to run them sort of fast to make the grade of the curve...


On my layout the 2-2.5% grade from the coal company to the truss bridge gets to be a chore for a single locomotive pulling more than 9-10 cars (depends on the loco). If I add more cars to the consist I gotta add another loco - pretty much like the 1:1 world. If it's steam I like to add a helper loco in the middle. If it's diesel I double-head (disclaimer: I double head all diesels because I just think it looks good).

ETA: Yes, if I run into that grade WFO with a longer consist behind a single loco I can make it to the top... usually.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Did you ask what the box on the RS3 (2?) walkway is? The striped “box” with handrail offset I mean. It’s an unusual location and _very_ eye catching.
> Some really neat stuff there. The bricked up caboose smoke jack for one. Snow is a lovely change.


We both work crazy schedules but I was finally able to ask him and he said it is the train lighting box...


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> On my layout the 2-2.5% grade from the coal company to the truss bridge gets to be a chore for a single locomotive pulling more than 9-10 cars (depends on the loco). If I add more cars to the consist I gotta add another loco - pretty much like the 1:1 world. If it's steam I like to add a helper loco in the middle. If it's diesel I double-head (disclaimer: I double head all diesels because I just think it looks good).
> 
> ETA: Yes, if I run into that grade WFO with a longer consist behind a single loco I can make it to the top... usually.


Makes me feel good then because that's about what I can do with properly NRMA weighted cars +/- a car or two depending on the engine... I do plan to do double heading and even helpers at the end as that was very common by the PRR around the Curve and with K4s doing passenger service in the end years...


----------



## afboundguy

So funny little story that begins with my wife's addiction to shoes... We've been doing sort of a quid-pro-quo when she wants expensive shoes lately  I've purchased a few engines and sound decoders after her past few expensive shoe purchases...

Well this past weekend she wanted some really obnoxious (well in my opinion) expensive shoes and I said sure but that I'd bank the funds which prompted her to ask what I wanted and I said backdrop. Naturally she asked why I needed/wanted one since I had one up and I proceeded to say I cheaped out on it and didn't get what I wanted...

Anyways she got them a few daya ago and she liked them so much she wanted them in another color so I said go for it since it would cover the backdrop but she said no...

Well she's a 5th grade teacher and wore them to work today and I guess they were such a hit with the kids she bought the other color and at dinner she mentioned I could now get the backdrop and I laughed!

Prompted me to take some photographs of the transition to get opinions. There's one from the bottom of the stairs and from the furtherst point you'd be able to see it and think that's where I'd probably do the transition... Thoughts and opinions on if it would still look good with the new angles?


----------



## Stumpy

I'd stick with the plan. I think the angle in the original pics will be the "worst" as far as noticing the transition. 

I say "worst", but what you settled on isn't going to be bad at all. As my late dad would say when working on a project and we cut a board a little short, "You and me are the only ones that'll ever know. And I ain't telling nobody."


----------



## OilValleyRy

I’d be more “worried” about the first photo view. The 2nd photo, folks are probably going to be more focused on the approaching train than the background. Plus once all the clutter is out and it’s backdrop, structures etc, I suspect it’ll all blend so nicely even you won’t notice after a while. Keep in mind that right now, all eyes are on that. Once it loses emphasis though, should be a non issue.


----------



## afboundguy

@Stumpy and @OilValleyRy looking at it more I don't think the extreme angle will be an issue as well. I'll aim for the first angle as a transition spot!


----------



## Gramps

I can't reach to a conclusion based on these photos. In your earlier post #971 you had both backdrops in place and in these photos only the first backdrop is visible. I think you should put the second backdrop in before making a final decision.


----------



## Steve on Cattail Creek

Well, the problem is that the consensus seemed to be that he should use the same scene, only inverted side to side to overlap the same edge. Unless he has the ability to do a full size reversed print, there's no way to test the "consensus view" (literally!). 

OTOH, when I was contemplating adding a backdrop to my layout, I blew up and printed out a version of the backdrop candidate -- the blown-up print spanned 40 sheets of letter-sized paper and was a bear to tape together, but once assembled, it enabled me to confirm that the selected photo would do just fine. I see no reason why the OP couldn't invert the selected graphic, scale it up appropriately, print it out on multiple sheets, and tape it together like I did. Then, he could test it from all possible viewing angles, even scale it up or down, before committing to a commercial print.


----------



## afboundguy

Finished up final measurements and design for new backdrop just waiting to hear back from the website! In the meantime I used my spare time before work to install a TCS WOWsound and a non-sound decoder in a NIB Proto 1000 F3 AB unit. The light doesn't work yet and TCS's website just got reworked so I'm having trouble getting more detailed instructions but I tries a new LED bulb as well as the old bulb a few different ways unsuccessfully. Just had enough time to snap a video before work. I have to mess with the CV values of the B unit so they accelerate the same but that will be a future project...


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> I can't reach to a conclusion based on these photos. In your earlier post #971 you had both backdrops in place and in these photos only the first backdrop is visible. I think you should put the second backdrop in before making a final decision.





Steve on Cattail Creek said:


> Well, the problem is that the consensus seemed to be that he should use the same scene, only inverted side to side to overlap the same edge. Unless he has the ability to do a full size reversed print, there's no way to test the "consensus view" (literally!).
> 
> OTOH, when I was contemplating adding a backdrop to my layout, I blew up and printed out a version of the backdrop candidate -- the blown-up print spanned 40 sheets of letter-sized paper and was a bear to tape together, but once assembled, it enabled me to confirm that the selected photo would do just fine. I see no reason why the OP couldn't invert the selected graphic, scale it up appropriately, print it out on multiple sheets, and tape it together like I did. Then, he could test it from all possible viewing angles, even scale it up or down, before committing to a commercial print.


After looking at the whole layout over the past few days I've decided to extend the same Fall Mountains backdrop a lot further back than what I had originally thought about doing when I posed the initial question. I have decided to extend the Fall Mountains backdrop about 2' further left to the yellow line in the picture... I will have the heights try and "match" up as close as possible at the viewing angle that seems to be agreed upon as the best transition spot to the right of the yellow line...


----------



## afboundguy

Here is a quick rendering of the proposed custom backdrop!!!


----------



## JeffHurl

This is going to be sweet!


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> This is going to be sweet!


I agree!!! Hopefully the place still is willing to do the custom backdrop after my page long email!!!


----------



## Gramps

Looking forward to seeing the results.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Just a thought, and entirely personal preference;
I think two 45 angles is less eye grabbing than a single 90 corner. I wonder if you could squeeze a 45 degree corner span backdrop pane back there? It’d make the scenery more rounded with less harsh corners. It’s a to each their own thing. Worth it IMO.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Just a thought, and entirely personal preference;
> I think two 45 angles is less eye grabbing than a single 90 corner. I wonder if you could squeeze a 45 degree corner span backdrop pane back there? It’d make the scenery more rounded with less harsh corners. It’s a to each their own thing. Worth it IMO.


@OilValleyRy are you talking about the 90s under the stairs and the one by the "heartland farms?" I had already planned on curving under the stairs as there's nothing there now and it's way out of practical arms reach. In the other corner by the Heartland Farms was going to curve it a little bit but not as harsh as two 45s probably but it definitely won't be a 90. I did a slight rounding on the current cheapo backdrop that's installed now but plan to make it more pronounced...


----------



## afboundguy

Got 4 engines going today... Had the new Proto 1000 F3 AB units hauling a lot of cars and man can they pull! I kept backing it up into the yard to pick up more cars and I should have kept going! It definitely looks awesome when all you see is one continuous string of cars on both sides of the Curve!!! Was doing some passenger service with #460 and then decided to add some extra freight trains with the J1 and the I1sa. Had the E6 and the AB running on the outside and I kept having the E6 pass the AB unit and it was pretty fun!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Just realized the last post with the video was post #1,000!!! Super cool and appreciate everybody coming along for the long journey! There's still plenty to come!!! I just got an email back from the backdrop guy and he'll be sending me an invoice to start the process!!!


----------



## OilValleyRy

afboundguy said:


> @OilValleyRy are you talking about the 90s under the stairs and the one by the "heartland farms?" I had already planned on curving under the stairs as there's nothing there now and it's way out of practical arms reach. In the other corner by the Heartland Farms was going to curve it a little bit but not as harsh as two 45s probably but it definitely won't be a 90. I did a slight rounding on the current cheapo backdrop that's installed now but plan to make it more pronounced...


The one under the PVC pipe. I realize from the schematic it is already a 45 though. Looks like a 90 in the photo taken from the bottom of the stairs? I guess it’ll not look as harsh once the backdrop is in.
Been analyzing how I’m going to do mine exactly last week so, my head is deep in it.


----------



## Raege

Nice 1k !


----------



## afboundguy

Can't get over how cool it looks with the train all the way around the loop!


----------



## afboundguy

Also was messing around with the CV values and made a little programming track on the living room table! The B unit was way faster than the A unit and I tried messing around with a few other settings...


----------



## afboundguy

Picked up some spray paint as well going to spray this mix on the mountains so I can spread out the trees much more sparingly! Should spray paint tomorrow before work and I'll leave a small fan in the window to circulate the smell since it'll be in the 50s in December up here in MA!!!


----------



## Raege

didn’t realize you were a fellow ma resident. Western here near Springfield and one of the few drivers that doesn’t think they are in a fast and furious movie  Got to enjoy the 50’s every minute as it seems we always pay for it eventually.


----------



## afboundguy

Raege said:


> didn’t realize you were a fellow ma resident. Western here near Springfield and one of the few drivers that doesn’t think they are in a fast and furious movie  Got to enjoy the 50’s every minute as it seems we always pay for it eventually.


Must be a quick ride to the West Springfield train show! I'm jealous it's a bit of a hike from the North Shore


----------



## JeffHurl

afboundguy said:


> Can't get over how cool it looks with the train all the way around the loop!
> View attachment 594232


Just think how great it will look with the backdrop in place and three more trains on the curve 😍


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Just think how great it will look with the backdrop in place and three more trains on the curve 😍


Don't you know it! I really should focus on finishing up the wiring under the layout but it's hard to try and focus on that when my super ghetto rigged way of doing it runs everything I can throw at it right now!


----------



## afboundguy

Had a few minutes before work today to spray paint the mountains and I have to say I got pretty excited as it looks way better with just the spray paint base! Hopefully my extra work duties on my day off wrap up quickly so I can "plant" some more trees!!!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## Steve on Cattail Creek

afboundguy said:


> View attachment 594288
> View attachment 594289


Love the camo base coat!


----------



## shortwrench

Raege said:


> didn’t realize you were a fellow ma resident. Western here near Springfield and one of the few drivers that doesn’t think they are in a fast and furious movie  Got to enjoy the 50’s every minute as it seems we always pay for it eventually.


I too live in Western Mass near Springfield.


----------



## afboundguy

shortwrench said:


> I too live in Western Mass near Springfield.


Oh man another person to be jealous of for a short ride to the show!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Steve on Cattail Creek said:


> Love the camo base coat!


Made a big difference! Almost better than when I painted it all brown from the Pink Panther pink it was before!!! Here's it in action!!!


----------



## Christiaη

Planting all those trees is really a full-time job ! Very nice work.


----------



## afboundguy

Daddy doggie daycare issues kept me out of the basement so I didn't get to play landscaper. Instead I started to build the modern coal tower. Didn't finish it but oh well!

Also cleaned up an old laptop to try another projext!


----------



## afboundguy

I upgraded the RAM but upgrading the hard drive to an SSD is proving to be annoying using acronis cloaning software so I decided to tidy up the layout a bit...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## Christiaη

Looks better !


----------



## Lemonhawk

I've had little success with Acronis. It never has completely worked right whether for back up or cloning. Its likely better to a new build. Now I can't remember what I recently did when I moved from a 512 m2 to a 1TB m2, but I know I did not do a new build. I have Acronis but I don't think I used it. Interestingly the MS win 10 and win 11 upgrades went with out a hitch, never had that work on prior windows upgrades. I think its possible that I used something mentioned by the disk manufacture!


----------



## afboundguy

Lemonhawk said:


> I've had little success with Acronis. It never has completely worked right whether for back up or cloning. Its likely better to a new build. Now I can't remember what I recently did when I moved from a 512 m2 to a 1TB m2, but I know I did not do a new build. I have Acronis but I don't think I used it. Interestingly the MS win 10 and win 11 upgrades went with out a hitch, never had that work on prior windows upgrades. I think its possible that I used something mentioned by the disk manufacture!


I'm going to try a few tricks I found but if it still doesn't work I'm going to try a different hard drive cloaning method! Glad to know it's not just me!


----------



## afboundguy

Got the F3 AB units to pull 20 cars up the 2% grade without any issues or hesitation! I have the speed around 3 or 4 with the max being 14 I believe. Barely flinches! I have kept adding a few cars every few days to see how many I can pull and with today's run I totally fill the Curve with one train and it looks awesome!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Also looks pretty awesome around where the 46th St Station area will be but not quite as impressive as on the Curve but still worth photographing!!!


----------



## afboundguy

I also got a proof back from the backdrop guy from trainjunkies and I can't wait to see it in person! Can't remember if I shared this but I found some hi-res pictures of 1950s/60s Philadelphia skyline and purchased them and he did a custom workout that will be 10 feet long... It looks insane on my cell when I look at the mockup! I can't decide if I should share the mockup or wait to post the whole thing when I get it???


----------



## JeffHurl

I say wait. Do a big reveal


----------



## Raege




----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I say wait. Do a big reveal





Raege said:


> View attachment 594622


After a decent night sleep I think I have decided to wait... I looked at the picture on my laptop this morning and I still don't think it would do it justice!

I also purchased a 3 axle gimbal cell phone holder to take better videos so who knows maybe I'll give it it's maiden run video'ing the new backdrop!


----------



## OilValleyRy

I concur on waiting. We can enjoy fizzy lifting drinks in the meantime. 
Though I best those make folks gassy from both ends.


----------



## afboundguy

Did some quick spray painting early in the morning before work on the curve!


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## afboundguy

I plan to do lots of static grass and other bushes and scenery but figured a greener base would make it easier along the same line of thinking I had for the mountains...


----------



## JeffHurl

Looks like you have chosen colors wisely! Your vision of this area is starting to become more apparent, and it is fun to watch. Thanks for chronicling your build!


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Looks like you have chosen colors wisely! Your vision of this area is starting to become more apparent, and it is fun to watch. Thanks for chronicling your build!


I'm glad you're enjoying the ride it's fun to share it and appreciate all the feedback! I've done many builds for my reef tank and it's sort of a drag when nobody responds or participates! Tons of people are engaged in this thread which motivates me even more! Now if I can just schedule some down time from working so much I can do even more!


----------



## OilValleyRy

I’m struggling to recall what you were originally going to put there.


----------



## Raege

OilValleyRy said:


> I’m struggling to recall what you were originally going to put there.


Was it the funicular tram scenic area perhaps? Would be pretty sweet to pull off


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> I’m struggling to recall what you were originally going to put there.





Raege said:


> Was it the funicular tram scenic area perhaps? Would be pretty sweet to pull off


Which part are you guys referring too?


----------



## Raege

I was thinking inside step where steps and tram to train observation area is


----------



## afboundguy

Raege said:


> I was thinking inside step where steps and tram to train observation area is


Gotcha... I'm possibly planning on doing that but I haven't researched at all what year it was installed but if it's pre-1956 that will be my goal.

I'm not sure if @OilValleyRy was referring to what I was planning on putting there before I decided on Horseshoe Curve but if that's the case it was supposed to be Philadelphia with the 30th St Station to the right of the chimney...


----------



## Raege

The tram and such I think were Built in 1990’s when became National park /museum.


----------



## afboundguy

Raege said:


> The tram and such I think were Built in 1990’s when became National park /museum.


I sort of figured it would be much later than 1956 but never looked into it... Oh well it'll stil look awesome when I get off my butt and finish it!


----------



## Steve on Cattail Creek

afboundguy said:


> I sort of figured it would be much later than 1956 but never looked into it... Oh well it'll stil look awesome when I get off my butt and finish it!


Yep -- you're building _your_ model railroad, after all, not a museum-grade historical recreation. If you fudge some of the chronological details, a) few if any will ever notice, and b) it's YOUR railroad, so if it makes you happy, who cares what the chronological rivet counters think? 😜


----------



## Raege

afboundguy said:


> I sort of figured it would be much later than 1956 but never looked into it... Oh well it'll stil look awesome when I get off my butt and finish it!


It would be a neat scene for sure but the real wow factor I think is the horseshoe itself and the beautiful fall mountain framing it. I think your making great progress and really enjoy the updates and vids.


----------



## afboundguy

Steve on Cattail Creek said:


> Yep -- you're building _your_ model railroad, after all, not a museum-grade historical recreation. If you fudge some of the chronological details, a) few if any will ever notice, and b) it's YOUR railroad, so if it makes you happy, who cares what the chronological rivet counters think? 😜


I am following this mantra but trying to stick with as close to 1956 as possible so the tram would just be too far in the future. For example I'm planning on adding a PRR T1 and there are a few that were "scrapped in 1/56" and a few other steam engines that were scrapped in 54/55 that will probably make it on the layout...



Raege said:


> It would be a neat scene for sure but the real wow factor I think is the horseshoe itself and the beautiful fall mountain framing it. I think your making great progress and really enjoy the updates and vids.


I might actually have a day off this coming week so hope to keep at it appreciate hearing you enjoy the ride!


----------



## afboundguy

Bring on vacation!!! Off until Jan 1st and hoping I can get a lot of time down working on the layout! I started putting together the Walthers modern coal tower a few weeks ago and today I got out of some training early so I ended up getting the 4 walls glued on the main portion!


----------



## afboundguy

My helper wasn't too impressed... Just glad he hasn't ratted me out for doing it on the kitchen table!


----------



## OilValleyRy

Will that tower get LEDs underneath? Would make one heckuva night shot for rail fanning.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Will that tower get LEDs underneath? Would make one heckuva night shot for rail fanning.


More than likely it will... I have a ton of extra LEDs I purchased in a variety if colors!


----------



## afboundguy

Dusted of the electrics for a quick run! Still haven't figured out the cell phone gimbal...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Very distinctive horn.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Very distinctive horn.


Yep! Probably my favorite one too!


----------



## afboundguy

Got a Christmas present from my parents yesterday that was really cool. I will probably never run it on the layout but it'll look nice displayed above the layout or on the wall with the POW train set up I have...


----------



## vette-kid

afboundguy said:


> Got a Christmas present from my parents yesterday that was really cool. I will probably never run it on the layout but it'll look nice displayed above the layout or on the wall with the POW train set up I have...
> View attachment 595277
> View attachment 595278


I've airways found it interesting how the cars on these sets are way out of scale. It's the same with my corvette trains. The cars are massive! They do make fun display prices though. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## Christiaη

afboundguy said:


> Got a Christmas present from my parents yesterday that was really cool. I will probably never run it on the layout but it'll look nice displayed above the layout or on the wall with the POW train set up I have...
> View attachment 595277
> View attachment 595278


Please, don't burn it !


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> I've airways found it interesting how the cars on these sets are way out of scale. It's the same with my corvette trains. The cars are massive! They do make fun display prices though.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


I thought this was weird as well but it is what it is... I also discovered it'll never run on my layout as the engine isn't powered


----------



## afboundguy

Christiaη said:


> Please, don't burn it !


Funny you say that we used to have to put the kid safe covers on the nozzles as the dogs would jump up and turn the nozzles... But rest assured the box is already in the basement!


----------



## afboundguy

Used some cheap gray acrylic paint from WallyWorld to paint between the lines in preperation for the eventual ballasting and man it made it look a lot better!


----------



## afboundguy

Also experimented weathering a spare piece of track with a few different browns... I like the lighter brown on the near side... Also experimented with some black and gray down the center on the ties as well...


----------



## afboundguy




----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> I thought this was weird as well but it is what it is... I also discovered it'll never run on my layout as the engine isn't powered



So let me get thus straight they sell a train set that can't run out the box????


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> So let me get thus straight they sell a train set that can't run out the box????


I guess so! I took it out and looked at it and was like man this is metal and heavy... Then today I took it out see if it was DC or not and then realized it wasn't powered at all!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Wifey had some hourlong zoom thing so I was back working on the layout! Caulked the cracks on the Curve...


----------



## afboundguy

Then started weathering some of the track!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Well the rails at least lol...


----------



## OilValleyRy

Conductorkev said:


> So let me get thus straight they sell a train set that can't run out the box????


Made by Revell. It appears to be a shelf display type thing where you can add additional Nascars of your choice on their own flat cars.


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> I guess so! I took it out and looked at it and was like man this is metal and heavy... Then today I took it out see if it was DC or not and then realized it wasn't powered at all!!!



Imagine giving that to a little kid the temper tantrum that would follow when he realizes his present doesn't work.......


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Made by Revell. It appears to be a shelf display type thing where you can add additional Nascars of your choice on their own flat cars.


I already purchased two additional 3 piece add ons to include the one from 1956 as I had to!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> Imagine giving that to a little kid the temper tantrum that would follow when he realizes his present doesn't work.......


No kidding!!! I'm just glad I don't have to upset my dad by not running it! He did say he knew it didn't fit the era I was going for so I think he had an idea!


----------



## OilValleyRy

Conductorkev said:


> Imagine giving that to a little kid the temper tantrum that would follow when he realizes his present doesn't work.......


Yeah that would cause quite the fit!
Good life lesson though. Packaging & advertising isn’t always honest.


----------



## Gramps

afboundguy said:


> I guess so! I took it out and looked at it and was like man this is metal and heavy... Then today I took it out see if it was DC or not and then realized it wasn't powered at all!!!


Could this have been a locomotive that slipped through Quality Control? It seems to me that if it was produced as non-powered there should be an indication of that on the box. I think it's worth following up with the manufacturer.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Gramps said:


> Could this have been a locomotive that slipped through Quality Control? It seems to me that if it was produced as non-powered there should be an indication of that on the box. I think it's worth following up with the manufacturer.


It appears to me to be plastic model for static display. They make a UP Big Boy as well.


----------



## Gramps

OilValleyRy said:


> It appears to me to be plastic model for static display. They make a UP Big Boy as well.


Then it should state that on the box. Without that information it appears to be a commemorative operating model train set.


----------



## afboundguy

Made it more than halfway through the Horseshoe Curve weathering the rails and I will say my upper shoulders are starting to get a little sore!


----------



## afboundguy

Also came home from a few errands and saw this on the deck!!! I opened it up real quick and took a look at the first few feet and I can't wait to unroll the whole thing and put it up!!!


----------



## JeffHurl

Pics or it didn't happen


----------



## Raege

_AHEM_ it seems the backdrop arrived two hours ago and still no pics of it installed???
lol joking of course but can’t wait to see what it looks like 😀


----------



## Stumpy

Track is looking good.

Question: Google maps is only showing three tracks in the curve. When was the 4th one removed?


----------



## JeffHurl

Conrail removed one of the tracks in 1981


----------



## Stumpy

Thanks Jeff. My google-fu was failing.

Didn't need it? Didn't want to maintain/repair it?


----------



## JeffHurl

I found a blurb on wikipedia about Conrail removing one of the tracks in 1981, but it didn't say why. The 3rd and 4th tracks were added right around the turn of the century.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Pics or it didn't happen





Raege said:


> _AHEM_ it seems the backdrop arrived two hours ago and still no pics of it installed???
> lol joking of course but can’t wait to see what it looks like 😀


It didn't happen so the pictures don't exist! I'll try and tackle that project eventually but they just keep adding up!


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Track is looking good.
> 
> Question: Google maps is only showing three tracks in the curve. When was the 4th one removed?





JeffHurl said:


> Conrail removed one of the tracks in 1981


What @JeffHurl said 



Stumpy said:


> Thanks Jeff. My google-fu was failing.
> 
> Didn't need it? Didn't want to maintain/repair it?





JeffHurl said:


> I found a blurb on wikipedia about Conrail removing one of the tracks in 1981, but it didn't say why. The 3rd and 4th tracks were added right around the turn of the century.


From all the research I've done when ATS came out they removed the 4th line as well as remove 1-2 lines from the old PRR mainline from Philly to Harrisburg to save money. With the new technology it was safer to run the same amount of trains on fewer tracks and it's obviously cheaper to maintain fewer tracks so they were removed...


----------



## afboundguy

Oh boy what's happening today???


----------



## afboundguy

Used several cheapo $0.50 acrylic paints in 4-5 shades of green/blue to make a mix and then messed around until it was pretty close to the colors of the resevoir water from pictures...


----------



## afboundguy

Then stunk up the basement and a bit of the rest of the house with some modpodge glossy... I had to open up a few windows in the basement and a small window fan plus a candle and some febreeze so wife won't flip her lid when she gets home!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Then figured I'd start getting my green thumb grove back on!!! Brought the work upstairs on the dining room table yet again! Don't tell the wife!!!


----------



## afboundguy

I believe I have 4 or 5 of the autumn ones and 1 dark green and 1 light green to mix in... I did the autumn mix first and then used the left over autumn mix "leaves" with the light green and loved how it came out!


----------



## afboundguy

After doing 2 full kits I think I maaaayyyy still need some more tree kits


----------



## JeffHurl

Yeah... It's easy to underestimate the number of trees you'll want.


----------



## Stumpy

I think you'll want to make the lake bed quite a bit darker.












My river bed before I poured the water

The parts I wanted to appear deeper were black.


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> I think you'll want to make the lake bed quite a bit darker.
> 
> View attachment 595474
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My river bed before I poured the water
> 
> The parts I wanted to appear deeper were black.


The majority of the pictures I have seen are more like this color...


----------



## vette-kid

afboundguy said:


> Then figured I'd start getting my green thumb grove back on!!! Brought the work upstairs on the dining room table yet again! Don't tell the wife!!!
> View attachment 595461
> View attachment 595462


What material does this kit use for armatures, and how many does it make?

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## afboundguy

@vette-kid it uses small twiglike sticks that have small "leaves" on the end and each kit made about 50-60 trees. It was one kit per sheet of insulation foamboard in the pictures...

Here's a good video showing what the branch stuff looks like...


----------



## vette-kid

Sounds like sedum?? I have to get a few. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Sounds like sedum?? I have to get a few.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


They worked well and were actually almost fun to make. I checked on them today and the "leaves" were much more secure after the glue dried overnight. I was worried when I was making them how they'd do since a bunch was falling off right after I stuck them in the foam...

Today I'll be off to a local fabric store to get some seat cushion foam to try and make my own clump foliage and experiment with that for the forest on the mountains and inside of the curve... I'd still use the trees elsewhere on the layout...

Also going to attempt to fit some masonite board in the back of my car to redo that area behind the mountains!


----------



## afboundguy

Also might need to pick up some more modpodge for the reservoir went to check it this morning and need a lot more to give it some depth!


----------



## afboundguy

Ended up picking up more Modpodge and added the small bridge/divider/damn against the chimney and painted a little more where the water will meet the land...


----------



## afboundguy

Then used the rest to create a 1'ish inch reservoir... Hope it looks good when it dries!!!


----------



## afboundguy

Also experimented making my own clump foliage as an option... Might need to try several different varieties but today I wanted to mainly see how mixing the colors would look... It should look a lot different when it dries...


----------



## afboundguy

Trip to Home Depot for the masonite and I had them cut it in half so it could fit in the back of my car since it's nice and flexible


----------



## afboundguy

Last action tackled today was making two more boxes of trees! 4 boxes down 3 more to go! Since it was in the 50s way up here in New England I was outside enjoying the weather!


----------



## afboundguy

....and to top off a productive day had some goodies delivered!!! Two more Dale Earnhardt sets (including the 1956 one ) and a nice new ballast applicator... I know it's probably overkill but oh well!


----------



## Conductorkev

At least your made trees look a lot better than my attempt. I almost brought out a bowl to smoke them If that gives you any indication of how thry turned out lol.


----------



## afboundguy

@vette-kid if you or anyone else gets those canopy kits I'd suggest trying to get more green "leaves" as they're doesn't seem to be as much green compared to the amount included in the autumn mix...


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> At least your made trees look a lot better than my attempt. I almost brought out a bowl to smoke them If that gives you any indication of how thry turned out lol.


Did you use the same kits?


----------



## JeffHurl

I'll be interested to see how the Mod Podge works! Not sure if you saw any of the issues I was having with Acrylic Gloss Medium, but I ended up with cracks that formed in the skin of the product as it dried.

Hopefully Mod Podge doesn't do that.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I'll be interested to see how the Mod Podge works! Not sure if you saw any of the issues I was having with Acrylic Gloss Medium, but I ended up with cracks that formed in the skin of the product as it dried.
> 
> Hopefully Mod Podge doesn't do that.


Fingers crossed! I was told by a few people I know and trust who have way better layouts than I do that Modpodge works really well for water and I should know by tomorrow!


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> Did you use the same kits?



It actually was/is the learning kit one. Still have it lol after making what appeared to be a big bud I put away my tree making skillz.


----------



## vette-kid

afboundguy said:


> @vette-kid if you or anyone else gets those canopy kits I'd suggest trying to get more green "leaves" as they're doesn't seem to be as much green compared to the amount included in the autumn mix...


Where did you get your kits? Looks like around $25/ea. Can you get the leaves separate? I'm not sure what it uses, so not sure what to look for there. I'm going to buy them as soon as I can find a good deal. I might steal the mod podge idea as well. I need about 3/4" depth of water. Resin is expensive!

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## vette-kid

BTW, I might have some Dale E stuff I'd be willing to pay with if your collecting. I'll check when I get back, can't recall if I got rid of it already. I had some of the bachmann stuff, including a powered F7.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## Conductorkev

vette-kid said:


> Where did you get your kits? Looks like around $25/ea. Can you get the leaves separate? I'm not sure what it uses, so not sure what to look for there. I'm going to buy them as soon as I can find a good deal. I might steal the mod podge idea as well. I need about 3/4" depth of water. Resin is expensive!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk



I've hear taking the inside of a air furnace filter works for the canopy also. I've never tried but could see how it would work probably be cheaper route also.


----------



## Stumpy

There are a couple of videos and other good info in this thread.









Modeling a forest canopy


OK, a quick question for all you modelers out there! I'm going to have a few areas in my N scale layout that will be a forested. Looking to add a forest without it being a hundred (or more) individual trees. So I was thinking about how to make a forest canopy. The idea is to build a fairly...




www.modeltrainforum.com


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> It actually was/is the learning kit one. Still have it lol after making what appeared to be a big bud I put away my tree making skillz.


The first few trees didn't look that good but by the end of kit 4 they were looking pretty good especially once I realized that halfway through the "leaves" start to get a little soggy making sprinkling them harder I got even better...


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Where did you get your kits? Looks like around $25/ea. Can you get the leaves separate? I'm not sure what it uses, so not sure what to look for there. I'm going to buy them as soon as I can find a good deal. I might steal the mod podge idea as well. I need about 3/4" depth of water. Resin is expensive!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


Not sure if you can get the leaves separately but I'm assuming they do since it's Woodland Scenic stuff... Hopefully the modpodge idea works I may have gone too thick too fast though...

Also got them on etsy and ebay for around $15-$20 shipped... I just found sellers that sold more than one for combined shipping discounts...



vette-kid said:


> BTW, I might have some Dale E stuff I'd be willing to pay with if your collecting. I'll check when I get back, can't recall if I got rid of it already. I had some of the bachmann stuff, including a powered F7.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


Shoot me a pm with what you got may be interested...


----------



## afboundguy

Snapped a quick video of the tree building results with a funny ending 🤣


----------



## afboundguy

Planted 4 or 5 of the new trees while wife was getting ready for the day and think I might need to do a little logging and uproot the mini forest so I can blend everything better but the few new trees look really good!


----------



## vette-kid

Looks great! How are you going to do grass with all those trees in anyway?

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> Planted 4 or 5 of the new trees while wife was getting ready for the day and think I might need to do a little logging and uproot the mini forest so I can blend everything better but the few new trees look really good!
> View attachment 595608
> View attachment 595609



Looks good. I wouldn't take them out that would probably cause a mess. Sometimes certain trees take longer to turn. Or if your really bent on changing a fw carefully do it without taking them out..


----------



## Stumpy

Looks great!

Blend?


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> Looks great! How are you going to do grass with all those trees in anyway?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


Not much grass anywhere on the Horseshoe Curve just around the parking lot area rest will be trees!


----------



## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> Looks good. I wouldn't take them out that would probably cause a mess. Sometimes certain trees take longer to turn. Or if your really bent on changing a fw carefully do it without taking them out..


I meant blending as in sizes of the trees. I probably have a 3:1 ratio of autumn to green trees so there will be plenty of green ones in there! I think it'll just look silly with the tiny trees I already "planted" and then the bigger trees I just made. I'd want to start from the bottom.of the track and work my way up to smaller trees towards the top for the forced perspective with a smoother transition...


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Looks great!
> 
> Blend?
> 
> View attachment 595612


I'll be going for probably not as many green trees but there should be plenty! That is a great picture but not enough red ones!


----------



## OilValleyRy

That’s going to look exquisite.
I like that photo @Stumpy posted too. In particular I noticed the bare trees mixed in.


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> That’s going to look exquisite.
> I like that photo @Stumpy posted too. In particular I noticed the bare trees mixed in.


Don't worry I have bare trees saved up and I mixed them in sporadically the first time and I saved some of the canopy kit ones that didn't have any "leaves" I actually may have some time off this week before work and my main goal is to plant trees on the mountain after I add some ledge/rock in a few spots close to the track


----------



## afboundguy

Sucked it up and finished the last 3 boxes of the WS Canopy kits... Glad that's over now and I finished before my day off on Thursday so I can get to planting!!!


----------



## afboundguy

My completed tree making skills


----------



## afboundguy

Took out my Paragon2 BLI silver GG1 that I basically stole off a seller from ebay that appeared brand spanking new. Didn't get a chance to test run it but even if she doesn't move for the price I got her it would still be worth it even if she'd just be a static display in a yard!


----------



## afboundguy

Also attempted ballasting some of the track I had already weathered... Wasn't a huge fan of how it turned out as I felt I was being super anal about how smooth it should be. It's not glued down yet...


----------



## afboundguy

I think I'm not overly happy with the ballast since it's fine ballast. I want to try and get some medium ballast and do a 4:1 ratio of medium to fine ballast to get a better look...


----------



## Magic

Might try a little bit different color as well?????

Magic


----------



## afboundguy

Magic said:


> Might try a little bit different color as well?????
> 
> Magic


I'm going with that color as from everything I've read it most closely matches the coloring of the PRRs mainline ballasting. I 100% plan on adding different coloring to weather it so it's not as pristine as that though


----------



## JeffHurl

I agree about adding some larger size ballast. But other than that, I'd say it's just about perfect... just needs weathered a bit. OK, maybe a lot, lol. The horseshoe curve is a busy place, correct?


----------



## Stumpy

I'm with Magic. I think if you mix in a small amount of light brown, dark brown, and black (cinders) you'll find that achieves the "weathering" effect.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> I agree about adding some larger size ballast. But other than that, I'd say it's just about perfect... just needs weathered a bit. OK, maybe a lot, lol. The horseshoe curve is a busy place, correct?


Tad busy yes 😎 My day off tomorrow I will be making a run to the store to get some medium ballast...



Stumpy said:


> I'm with Magic. I think if you mix in a small amount of light brown, dark brown, and black (cinders) you'll find that achieves the "weathering" effect.


I do have some black already and I'll look at getting some browns but I planned on doing a seperate test track on a small piece of spare insulation and my idea is to paint the track then ballast and then use dry brushing with browns and blacks to weather it and see how that ends up...


----------



## JeffHurl

Honestly, I would consider a black wash or brown and black washes rather than just mixing different color aggregates. I'd be worries it would look too much like salt & pepper rather than grime.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> Honestly, I would consider a black wash or brown and black washes rather than just mixing different color aggregates. I'd be worries it would look too much like salt & pepper rather than grime.


That is the line of thinking I was going with and what I plan to test tomorrow and Friday with extra tracks...


----------



## vette-kid

How is the mod podge lake going? I am experimenting with pigment in mod podge. Of that works out I'll pour the whole thing this weekend. But curious how yours is turning out. 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


----------



## SF Gal

Horseshoe curve is really looking like a fun project! I like where it is going.
Are you having fun with it? All those trees can get monotonous while making them but the end result is usually awesome!
I see that ballast with rust and grease and grime...past rockside reminants, and garbage near the edges...oh, dead tree branchs pushed to the sides too. If you get too overwhelmed, move on to something else and come back to it later. "Tweeking" a scene later on is part of the fun of a finished layout....save things to do for a future restructure!
Thanks for sharing your layout.
I don't have much to add but I am watching and getting ideas and insite.


----------



## afboundguy

vette-kid said:


> How is the mod podge lake going? I am experimenting with pigment in mod podge. Of that works out I'll pour the whole thing this weekend. But curious how yours is turning out.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


It's coming along so so... It hasn't cleared up totally but I can see some spots where it's clearing up but I also see some bubbles... I'm still hopeful and I think I may have poured too much at once and should have done a bunch more smaller layers...


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> Horseshoe curve is really looking like a fun project! I like where it is going.
> Are you having fun with it? All those trees can get monotonous while making them but the end result is usually awesome!


Yes they were monotonous as all heck but I'm glad it's done! I have plans to use some low loft batting and some matte modge podge to glue it to the mountains and then paint it brown and sprinkle some fine turf to give the ground/mountains a more realistic look.. I found this video which is probably one of the best I found


----------



## afboundguy

SF Gal said:


> I see that ballast with rust and grease and grime...past rockside reminants, and garbage near the edges...oh, dead tree branchs pushed to the sides too. If you get too overwhelmed, move on to something else and come back to it later. "Tweeking" a scene later on is part of the fun of a finished layout....save things to do for a future restructure!


The PRR was way too proud to have garbage and tree limbs near their mainlines how dare you suggest such a thing!!!


SF Gal said:


> Thanks for sharing your layout. I don't have much to add but I am watching and getting ideas and insite.


No problem thanks for sharing yours as well! It's nice to get such positive feedback and also the amount of participation in this build thread! I'm used to my reef tank build threads where zero people reply which looses motivation to post updates for me. Everybody's participation and discussion in this build thread has given me great ideas and great motivation and I hope it keeps up!!!


----------



## Gramps

afboundguy said:


> It's coming along so so... It hasn't cleared up totally but I can see some spots where it's clearing up but I also see some bubbles... I'm still hopeful and I think I may have poured too much at once and should have done a bunch more smaller layers...


I am very happy with the Mod Podge creek feature on my shelf layout but the secret is the layers. It is not a quick fix and needs some time and patience. I did not experience any bubble problems.


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> I am very happy with the Mod Podge creek feature on my shelf layout but the secret is the layers. It is not a quick fix and needs some time and patience. I did not experience any bubble problems.


If my pour too thick of a layer water doesnt work I'll rip it up and do the multi-layer approach for sure...


----------



## afboundguy

@Gramps can you share a picture? And I pre-aplolgize if you've already shared one in this thread but I've been up for 20 hours and I'm delirious🙃


----------



## Gramps

Sorry, can't help with a posting a photo but search the forum with the word "Schitz". There will be a thread for New England Model Railroad (NEMR) and post #247 on that will have a Youtube by Martin T of the toilet paper, white glue and gloss Mod Podge for modeling water. Martin does many model railroad tutorials on Youtube It appears in some other threads also.


----------



## Christiaη

Is it this video ?


----------



## OilValleyRy

I agree. On a landlocked lake that’s the way to go. His vid is excellent! I wish @martin t would interact more than posting vids. 
I did a small test on scrap plywood. I didn't do the gloss top coat finish portion but just wanted to try getting that beachy surf feel - the color gradient, white caps, etc. Worked beautifully. Took me maybe a day, possibly two foe the glue to dry.


----------



## afboundguy

I vacuumed up the ballast with stockings to filter it out and save that I laid and repainted the rails with spray paint and cleaned off the top of the rails immediately and it looks much much better... Got a much better spread and coverage with the spray paint...


----------



## afboundguy

I also deforested the mountain in preparation of applying the mod podge and then the low loft batting...


----------



## afboundguy

I then used some spray paint as I couldn't find the left over mess up paint I got from Home Depot... I'll do 1-2 more coats of real paint as the whole house stinks like spray paint and wife will probably be a tad upset when she gets home  If I can find the paint I'll then spread some of the turf...


----------



## Stumpy

afboundguy said:


> I'm used to my reef tank build threads where zero people reply which looses motivation to post updates for me.


Create a thread in Union Station. Being a former reefer I'd love to see pics and hear about it.

We had a reef tank (and a quarantine tank, and... and... and...) from '97 until about 2010, so we started before the ubiquity of internet forums. AOL groups and chat rooms were where you "mingled" with other marine tank keepers. They can be pretentious and condescending.

And now back to your regularly scheduled program. Broadcasting from the Logan Township just outside of Altoona, PA!


----------



## afboundguy

Stumpy said:


> Create a thread in Union Station. Being a former reefer I'd love to see pics and hear about it.
> 
> We had a reef tank (and a quarantine tank, and... and... and...) from '97 until about 2010, so we started before the ubiquity of internet forums. AOL groups and chat rooms were where you "mingled" with other marine tank keepers. They can be pretentious and condescending.
> 
> And now back to your regularly scheduled program. Broadcasting from the Logan Township just outside of Altoona, PA!


Might have to do that once I get off my rearend and start the tank upgrade/swap... New tank has only been in the basement for over a year waiting...


----------



## Gramps

Christiaη said:


> Is it this video ?


Yes that's it. To summarize, it's a procedure with the Mod Podge, you have to let it set before the next layer. Time consuming but worth it and because it's based on toilet paper I called it Schitz Creek.


----------



## afboundguy

So shockingly the wife was a tad PO'd with the house smelling like spray paint and I guess I'm not high on the fumes anymore thankfully 🤣 So today I found the old paint and went over the spray painted batting with it and I have to say I like the look and I'm glad I did the spray painting first as it adds a nice dimension to it!


----------



## afboundguy

I then busted out some of the turf while the paint was still wet!


----------



## afboundguy

Final layer...


----------



## afboundguy

It was a little harder on the sides of the mountains due to the grade but I was able to get a decent amount on it. I may overspray it with some of the spray paints I used to paint the sytrofoam just to get more color but it will also be covered with trees so it may not be worth it...


----------



## afboundguy

Also started making rockface molds! I have 3 done so far and I'll try and do a few more after lunch... I'd rather have too many than not enough!


----------



## MichaelE

Your scenery is coming along nicely. Looks really good. I hope those kinks I see in the rail joints won't give you problems down the line.


----------



## afboundguy

MichaelE said:


> Your scenery is coming along nicely. Looks really good. I hope those kinks I see in the rail joints won't give you problems down the line.


Thanks it's been fun. As far as the kinks the only ones that are really noticeable are on the two inside tracks as the outside two tracks closest to the mountains don't have any issues running any of my finicky engines. The two inside tracks will only have 4 axle engines due to the sharp radius of the curve behind the chimney so I didn't fuss with them as much as the two other tracks since all the engines I test ran on the inside tracks didn't have any issues running...


----------



## JeffHurl

WOW! That batting technique sure looks fantastic!!!!! It gives a lot of depth to the vegetation without being too much. Just PERFECT!!!


----------



## JeffHurl

I loved making rocks! They were second place in my "satisfaction" category. I got the most satisfaction from planting trees. Followed closely by building up rock faces on cliffs. If you haven't already, you should watch the tutorials on Woodland Scenics web site. They have great videos that demonstrate how they use their liquid dyes to color the plaster rocks.


----------



## Gramps

Well done, it's been great following this thread.


----------



## OilValleyRy

Interesting technique. How rigid is that batting after being spray painted? I’m curious if it could theoretically be painted outside before being cut & fit to location? I might be trying that.
Paint fumes are one reason I no longer paint in the house. Officially. I’ll dullcote but that’s all, and only when the furnace/WH are not cycling.


----------



## afboundguy

JeffHurl said:


> WOW! That batting technique sure looks fantastic!!!!! It gives a lot of depth to the vegetation without being too much. Just PERFECT!!!


It does. I'm much happier with how it looks in person than it looked in the YouTube videos I watched...



JeffHurl said:


> I loved making rocks! They were second place in my "satisfaction" category. I got the most satisfaction from planting trees. Followed closely by building up rock faces on cliffs. If you haven't already, you should watch the tutorials on Woodland Scenics web site. They have great videos that demonstrate how they use their liquid dyes to color the plaster rocks.


I'm very much looking forward to installing the rocks in the mountain! I will have to cut out some of the batting areas to make it more flush but that shouldn't be too much of a hard task... I also watched several of the WS YouTube videos and got a lot of inspiration from them and I added 3 or 4 different colors to the "grass" to give it depth!


----------



## afboundguy

Gramps said:


> Well done, it's been great following this thread.


Thanks! It looks even better today after it's fully dried!


----------



## afboundguy

OilValleyRy said:


> Interesting technique. How rigid is that batting after being spray painted? I’m curious if it could theoretically be painted outside before being cut & fit to location? I might be trying that.
> Paint fumes are one reason I no longer paint in the house. Officially. I’ll dullcote but that’s all, and only when the furnace/WH are not cycling.


The batting was more rigid than I thought it would have been after being spray painted. It was stiff enough it crinkled when I pushed it down. After the 2nd coat with latex paint, the various layers of "grass" and then spraying it with a glue/water mixture it's a lot harder. I would say if you spray painted it outside and then quickly put it down on the glue that would probably work if you have gloves and don't mind getting messy that is! You'd probably be fine if you spray painted it outside it's wasn't rigid enough where it couldn't be manipulated. 

If I had to do it again I would still spray paint it first, but possibly with a lot more window fans running, as all the YouTube videos said they needed to hand paint it 2 or 3+ times so no white shows. With the spray paint and then hand paint there already wasn't any white showing before I hand painted it...


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## afboundguy

Hard to tell from the pictures but man this batting technique looks even better after a few days all dried up! I tried taking a few close ups but the depth of coloring and texturs look flipping amazing!!! Should look even better when I add shrubs and trees!!!_




























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## afboundguy

On the other hand the modpodge resevoir was a failure as I clearly added too much at once as it's a tad full of small bubbles. I'll probably just paint on top of what I did and do a lot more smaller layers...


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## afboundguy

Also picked up this 1956 PRR Annual Report thats 30+ pages and appears brand new and in outstanding condition! I browsed through it quickly and the few sections I read were actually an interesting read!


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## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> On the other hand the modpodge resevoir was a failure as I clearly added too much at once as it's a tad full of small bubbles. I'll probably just paint on top of what I did and do a lot more smaller layers...
> View attachment 596284
> View attachment 596285
> View attachment 596286


Your reservoir is really a bubble bath lol.
I've haven't used modpodge for water yet but I probably am on this build.


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## afboundguy

Conductorkev said:


> Your reservoir is really a bubble bath lol.
> I've haven't used modpodge for water yet but I probably am on this build.


Just do a bunch of small thin layers!!!


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## afboundguy

Quick video of the new landscape...


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## Conductorkev

afboundguy said:


> Just do a bunch of small thin layers!!!


I may want a bubble bath!!!!!!


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## JeffHurl

Curious if you shook it up aggressively and agitated the air into it, or did the bubbles just form?

Were they there when you poured it, or did they appear as it cured?


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## JeffHurl

Dude, that batting texture is just perfect for dense field grass like vegetation


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## vette-kid

I'll get some pics up in my thread later this week probably, but my first layer of mod podge is looking pretty good. A little thick in a few areas, so far very few bubbles. Nothing like what your getting! 

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk


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