# Super newbie purchase questions =)



## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

Hello! First, let me say that I've looked at some pics on this site, and you guys are INCREDIBLY talented! Absolutely beautiful landscapes!

So here's the thing. My fiancé wants a train set, but I don't know where to begin. (I'm getting him started on Christmas as a surprise.) He's never had one before but likes the idea of it, however I'm NOT sure if he is interested in the model building and intricate layouts. He may be content with setting up a circle and watching it go, but for how long does that entertain a 30-year-old man with ADD? I like building and painting models, though, so maybe I could partake in that end. 

Either way, I need to find a good starter set to see if he'll want to take his up as a hobby. (Lord knows we need a hobby to get us off the damned internet once in a while since we work from home on the computers.) I don't want to dole out $500, because if he doesn't end up liking and using it a lot, well that would be half my bank account out the window lol. Are there good quality starter sets that don't cost an arm and a leg? I looked at Lionel's sets, but I don't really want Harry Potter... =\

When I was a kid, my dad brought out his train set from his childhood once in a while. This was a set he got in the 1950s. High quality set, but it seems everything back then was better made. My favorite part was the smoke, so I am definitely looking for a smoking engine. Would it make sense to get JUST a high quality steam engine and then a few pieces of track and then add on the cars later? Or is a starter set the only real feasible way to do this?

Thanks all! =)


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## broox (Apr 13, 2012)

Hi and welcome 

First I'd decide on the scale you'd like. It all depends on how much room you can spare

HO is really common, and thus cheaper, both the new and second hand market is massive. Its a good size for kids or grandparents to use too.

N scale is half the size of HO, only a touch more expensive these days. But because its half the size you can put a lot more track in your space. and more track = more fun, right?! Might be a bit fiddly, depending on who's planning to use it.

There is also O scale, its twice the size of HO. Because its larger, you might get a more highly detailed train, but you'll have less track to run it on. Its probably only good for a basic loop or 2, unless you've got a heap of space use. (my opinion, dont hate me, O scalers!)

There are other scales, but they'd be the 3 main ones, and the ones you'll likely find at the local train store. 

There are good starter sets for all scales, its a good way to get a taster for the hobby and some rolling stock... You might get a hankering to upgrade the quality of the locos, and maybe even change to a digital control down the track though. 
Digital control (DCC) lets you run more than one train at once, on the same track, at different speeds, and potentially in different directions. I'm heading down that route very soon!


Personally, I'm already invested in HO, rolling stock and track wise... My kids and my dad regularly play with it, and visitors seem to be drawn to it too, so ultimately it can't be too fiddly... Although I could do so much more with N Scale...


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## Brakeman Jake (Mar 8, 2009)

I think your best option is to visit a hobby shop and have a friendly chat with the owner.He likely knows his stuff and will be able to offer you different options within the price range you've set.

Train sets usually come in two price brackets...bottom line sets and quite nice sets.Higher quality items don't usually come in sets.Bottom line sets...well...are hit or miss.You can strike lucky and have something that runs absolutely flawless,sometimes not so.But in the mid-range,you can find very interesting items at very good prices that generally run nicely too.Have the owner show you what he has to offer.He also can "build" a set for you too.If he doesn't have what you'd like in stock,he can usually get it for you within a week or so.


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## tkruger (Jan 18, 2009)

I would avoid the Life Like or Bachmann starter sets. The locomotives and transformers are of less than desirable quality.

Athearn and Atlas both make a starter set that is of decent quality and very expandable. Both range from $120 - $150. They include an oval, transformer, few cars and a decent locomotive. The locomotives in both these sets are all wheel pickup / drive and have flywheels.


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## hoscale37 (Nov 20, 2011)

*Newbie*

As Broox pointed out- There are a couple of different scale sizes that you could go with. 

What scale was the set that you remember from back in the day and has your fiance expressed an interest in a certain scale size? Prices will vary but as has been mentioned- Athearn and Atlas will be a good starting point.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

I think she is talking about O trains.
She did mention she doesn't want harry potter.

Welcome to the site.
We need to know what scale your thinking about.

If you do go to the hobby store keep in mind most of the time the prices will be a little higher then what you can get on the net.

But on the other hand if you do buy from one and have a problem it is easier to take care of that problem through the hobby store.

Also take in the price of shipping if you buy off the net. 
There are some good deals to be found at the hobby store. (all depends on the store). 
Mine sells stuff that people find in their attic and put them up for sale, some good deals to be had there.
But.......all hobby stores are not the same.
My #1 hobby store has been in the business since 1934 ish.
If you have any mom and pop type hobby stores who have been in business for a while I would check them out.

Stores like say hobby lobby, mainly just push trains at Christmas time. You might get a good deal but later on down the road you won't get the personalized service if you need it.

Those are just my thoughts, so...what size train and how much room do you have?


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

Thanks everyone! Unfortunately, I was about 10 when I last saw my dad's train, and I have NO idea what scale it was based on memory. It seemed pretty hefty, though, so I could certainly rule out N scale. The problem with the Harry Potter train, just to make sure we're all on the same page, was not the scale so much as the juvenile nature of it. All of the less expensive sets from Lionel seemed to be Hershey's Chocolate or Harry Potter lol That said, I don't think we have room for O scale anyway. 

I looked at a few pictures for the other scales, but I guess it would depend on the price at this point. If I'm interested in trying my hand at building and painting the things around it, it'd be easier with the larger HO, no? 

I grew up in a small town in Indiana that had, based on my own nostalgia, the world's best hobby shop. But I recently moved to CA. I'll need to get in to one of the stores to see these in person. Any other advice?

Thanks so much for all the help! =)

*ETA Oh, as for what scale he wanted, he is completely ignorant on pretty much everything about trains. lol To be honest, I think he got this itch when I took him to Chicago's Museum of Science & Industry where they have that gigantic train set. After that, he told me, "I've always wanted a train..." He probably doesn't even know there are scales. My main goal is to get him started with something so that if he likes it, he can turn it into a lifelong hobby where he can slowly build up his collection in whatever scale he likes in the future.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

SG,

Welcome to the forum ... it sounds like your guy has found a great girl!

Just tossin' something out ... if overall budget is a concern, do consider purchasing something used. Lots out there ... local train shows, ebay, craigslist, etc. I can tell you that old Lionel trains (1950's, 1960's) were built to last.

This link has a train show events search tool ...

http://trc.trains.com/events.aspx?page=list&type=1&cat=-1

You should also check out this southern ca model rr club/group ... a great group of guys who might show you locally some inspiring ideas ...

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Model_Railroads_Of_Southern_California/

Their moderator Bob Chaparro is a member here as thecitrusbelt

Good luck,

TJ


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## hoscale37 (Nov 20, 2011)

sggoren said:


> Thanks everyone! Unfortunately, I was about 10 when I last saw my dad's train, and I have NO idea what scale it was based on memory. It seemed pretty hefty, though, so I could certainly rule out N scale. The problem with the Harry Potter train, just to make sure we're all on the same page, was not the scale so much as the juvenile nature of it. All of the less expensive sets from Lionel seemed to be Hershey's Chocolate or Harry Potter lol That said, I don't think we have room for O scale anyway.
> 
> I looked at a few pictures for the other scales, but I guess it would depend on the price at this point. If I'm interested in trying my hand at building and painting the things around it, it'd be easier with the larger HO, no?
> 
> ...


Looks like from the descriptions on the Museum's website that they have a pretty hefty HO scale layout up there. I haven't been to the M of S & I since I was a kid; but I will say that- that Museum in Chicago and the Children's Museum in Indianapolis are two of the best Museums on this side of the country. 

May have to make a trip to Chicago now  Aside from them having killer pizza in the style of Gino's East- that Museum was always awesome to go to... it's been a long time since I have been there.


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

tjcruiser said:


> SG,
> 
> Welcome to the forum ... it sounds like your guy has found a great girl!
> 
> ...


Thanks for the links! I hadn't considered buying used, but that's a great idea.  I'm also pretty excited for the group. We're looking to get out and meet some people based on starting new hobbies, so that's going to be awesome!


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

hoscale37 said:


> Looks like from the descriptions on the Museum's website that they have a pretty hefty HO scale layout up there. I haven't been to the M of S & I since I was a kid; but I will say that- that Museum in Chicago and the Children's Museum in Indianapolis are two of the best Museums on this side of the country.
> 
> May have to make a trip to Chicago now  Aside from them having killer pizza in the style of Gino's East- that Museum was always awesome to go to... it's been a long time since I have been there.


Mmm. Now I'm craving some deep dish haha. Yeah, the MSI is close to my heart having been there several times as a kid and even as an adult now. Between the train, the coal mining ride, and the squee little baby chicks, I'm in heaven! Good to know that's HO, thanks for finding that out. That makes it a lot easier to visualize in my head.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Based on your initial description, I'm fairly certain your dad had O gauge Lionel trains. Yes, O gauge takes up quite a bit of space. If you're planning on setting it up on the floor all the time, then you might want to go that route. I've never found HO to work well in that application. On a tabletop layout, then HO would probably work just fine (I've been tempted to go that way myself). Don't go for the lowest price set, especially in HO. Usually it'll only lead to disappointment and a loss of interest in the hobby.

Good luck, I'm sure there will be more recommendations. I can't really add anything more since it sounds like you are considering HO anyway. I tend to push O gauge since that's what I use


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

santafe158 said:


> Based on your initial description, I'm fairly certain your dad had O gauge Lionel trains. Yes, O gauge takes up quite a bit of space. If you're planning on setting it up on the floor all the time, then you might want to go that route. I've never found HO to work well in that application. On a tabletop layout, then HO would probably work just fine (I've been tempted to go that way myself). Don't go for the lowest price set, especially in HO. Usually it'll only lead to disappointment and a loss of interest in the hobby.
> 
> Good luck, I'm sure there will be more recommendations. I can't really add anything more since it sounds like you are considering HO anyway. I tend to push O gauge since that's what I use


Oh no no, by all means convince me! I don't really know the pros and cons for each scale outside of what's been mentioned in this thread. I'm open-minded because I admit I'm completely ignorant on this topic lol I suppose we could use the spare guest room for the O gauge. Is that usually set up on tabletop or the floor? 

The biggest problem is not being able to _ask_ him if he'd want tabletop to build all the intricate details and such, not being able to ask what size he prefers, etc. Surprises are hard!


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

O gauge can pretty much go either way. I have always run mine on the floor. Yes you have to deal with dust, stray hairs and carpet fibers (if theres a carpeted floor under the track), but I've never found it to be too bad. A table would probably be easier to work on and look at if you don't think he'd want to be sitting on the floor to play with the trains. With O gauge it is pretty much personal preference.

HO is a little more sensitive to things like carpet fibers, so if you go that route, I'd recommend a table.

Most modern O gauge sets (and many HO and N scale sets) come with track with a molded plastic roadbed (the rocks underneath). That definitely helps keep fibers out of the trains gears.

I'd definitely recommend starting with a simple starter set to which you can expand later on as you/he desires.

Here's a link to the Lionel train sets page. Keep in mind, the prices are usually quite a bit higher than what they are actually priced at in stores. There are many train store websites online and you can usually find a deal at one of them.

http://www.lionel.com/Products/Finder/SearchResults.cfm?doAction=Browse&CategoryID=37


A couple videos of my O gauge stuff to get the gears turning.

Train sets


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

This is the set I started with 14 years ago. Still works great.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/LIONEL-NEW-...659634?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item19d6e73772


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Essentially the same set, but with a sound system. The set i have just has a whistle.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lionel-New-...188005?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item19d6e00525


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

Awesome work! Thanks! 

This may be a dumb question, but let's say we built a table. What size would it need to be to accommodate each scale? We'd be putting this in a kind of small guest room, maybe 11x11 or so. I suppose we could dedicate it entirely as a train room, no bed or furniture in there. Is that what most of you guys do? I'm assuming it'd be a pain in the rear to move it if, say, you had guests?


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Most people start with a 4 foot x 8 foot sheet of plywood (at least in O gauge and sometimes HO). A simple starter set should be able to fit in that space, and you can experiment with scenery and buildings. It's a manageable size for a beginner and doesn't fill the room. If you put rolling casters on the bottom of the legs, then it wouldn't be too difficult to roll it into a corner. You can also build a tabletop on wheels that sits low to the ground and can be stowed under a bed when not in use.

An N scale set would fit in a bit less space.

A good way to put it is, the smaller the scale, the more stuff you can fit in a smaller space. You can fit a lot more track onto a 4x8 table if you're in N scale, than if you are doing HO or O.

We have an N scale freight set made by Kato, and even though I'm an O gauge guy, I love that little set. It's a very good quality set that didn't break the bank (and it fits in my suitcase when we go on vacation ). If I didn't have so much money invested in my O gauge collection, I'd be very tempted to get more N scale stuff. Possibly HO as well.

When you get into the more expensive trains with command control and fancy sound systems, then O gauge is the best (in my opinion).

Here's the N scale set we have. You would have to purchase a power supply separately, but it comes with everything else you'd need to get started. The Unitrack system is great.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KATO-F7-SAN...846356?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a7bf65cd4


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

santafe158 said:


> Essentially the same set, but with a sound system. The set i have just has a whistle.
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lionel-New-...188005?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item19d6e00525


Oo thanks for the links. I had a hard time telling what's what on ebay. With the smoke unit, that requires smoke fluid, correct?


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

santafe158 said:


> Most people start with a 4 foot x 8 foot sheet of plywood (at least in O gauge and sometimes HO). A simple starter set should be able to fit in that space, and you can experiment with scenery and buildings. It's a manageable size for a beginner and doesn't fill the room. If you put rolling casters on the bottom of the legs, then it wouldn't be too difficult to roll it into a corner. You can also build a tabletop on wheels that sits low to the ground and can be stowed under a bed when not in use.


Yup, 4x8 sounds doable for me! See, you're already convincing me on the O gauge, because I just assumed it would take up way too much room. =)


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

sggoren said:


> Oo thanks for the links. I had a hard time telling what's what on ebay. With the smoke unit, that requires smoke fluid, correct?


Yes. Smoke units run on smoke fluid in the newer sets. Most sets with smoking locomotives come with a small bottle, but it can be found in any hobby shop that carries trains if you buy a used set.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Here's another good N scale set that comes with a power pack. Probably a more recognizable railroad company and train type.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kato-106-00...353526?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item564eed2bb6


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

Thanks again, santafe  That N scale is tempting... Looks like a great set and I'm loving me some free shipping.

What is your opinion of this set? http://www.hobbywarehouse.com/Bachmann-CHATTANOOGA-SET-HO?sc=82&category=829840


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

My cousin has that set, but it's been so long since I've seen it that I can't quite remember how well it runs. If I remember correctly though, it wasn't all that great. He has a diesel set that ran much better.

I only have one HO set myself from Walthers, so my experience with HO is limited 

The Kato stuff and many O gauge items I can give you information on, HO, not so much.


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## sggoren (Nov 19, 2012)

Appreciate your time  The only thing with the Kato one was it didn't appear to use steam. I think that's one of the coolest parts, and I think he'd get a kick out of it. I'll look around now that you've given me a good brand.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

sggoren said:


> Appreciate your time  The only thing with the Kato one was it didn't appear to use steam. I think that's one of the coolest parts, and I think he'd get a kick out of it. I'll look around now that you've given me a good brand.


I don't believe Kato makes any starter sets using steam locomotives, but I know they make a few separate sale steamers. They also make sets of their track system, which would allow you to build a decent set up on your own. Buy the track pack, a steamer a few cars and a power pack and you'd be off to a good start.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

Consider using a sheet of MDF for the table top ... standard size is 49" x 97" ... a precious inch bigger in both directions. Relatively inexpensive (Home Depot, Lowes), dead flat, dimensionally stable.

Downside ... don't spill water on it; hard to drive nails into it. But, if you're covering the base top with other topography (foam hills, etc.), it's a great sub-base.

TJ


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## N scale catastrophe (Nov 18, 2012)

You're going to have an easier time finding HO items if he gets serious about a layout. It seems to be the most common scale so there is just more out there and from all different time periods. I have to warn you, your story is exactly how I got into this hobby. My husband started buying N scale stuff, decided it was too small and now I'm building my own layout (he's redesigning our yard for a G scale layout). This is an addictive hobby, but it's fun and rewarding too, nothing like building your own world! Good luck, and have fun.


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