# A question For The Knowledgable ones



## periiwrinkle (Sep 12, 2011)

I have an old Lionel train set, (mostly 1960's era), and various assorted cars and accessories, one of which is a brass coal car that has no markings and looks to be welded together. A friend has said that he thinks that there used to be kits, kind of like model sets, where you got a bunch of pieces and put them together...
Does this sound correct to you, and if it is such a car do you have any idea as to current value?
I have pictures of it, but don't know how to post them...
Thank you so much for your time and interest...


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## periiwrinkle (Sep 12, 2011)

*Pictures of Brass 'kit' coal car?*

I posted a question in the O section about this particular car, what it is, it's ballpark market value, etc...
Here are three pictures of it to perhaps help identify it...
Thanky you for your time and interest


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

periiwrinkle said:


> I have pictures of it, but don't know how to post them...


Click on "Go Advanced" down on the bottom. Once there, click on the little "Paper Clip" icon, which will launch a Manage Attachments window. There, Browse to your photo on your local computer, and then Upload them, which will put a clickable-icon in your post. (You can embed the pics, too, but that's tomorrow's lesson!)

Cheers,

TJ

EDIT --

Ahh ... I see you had two threads going ... one with your initial question, and the other with the pics. I've merged there here into one thread, for better continuty and response quality for you.

Your brass car is quite nice ... excellent quality. I wouldn't peg that as a coal tender, though. It's a hopper car ... for carrying any granular bulk material ... coal, gravel, grain, etc.

The car looks custom (or kit-custom) to me. Not Lionel, as far as I know.

TJ


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

While it could be a kit, I'm believing it's a brass import from the 60s or 70s, Max Gray or along those lines.


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## tjcruiser (Jan 10, 2010)

I would put much more faith in Shay's thought, above, over my own thinking.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

All the kits I have seen were plastic or wood for O gauge.
It could be a brass kit?

Homemade, Maybe? 
The trucks are screwed on with a nut?

Nice car what are you going to do with it?


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

I can safely say it was originally for two rail operation with the scale knuckle. It had to be changed out to use with Lionel. I have no idea how many companies there are. Just check out ebay O scale Brass. One was close but had only two bays. It will turn up.

Without the original trucks the value has diminished. It looks beat up too.


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## periiwrinkle (Sep 12, 2011)

*no identifying marks*



shaygetz said:


> While it could be a kit, I'm believing it's a brass import from the 60s or 70s, Max Gray or along those lines.


If it is a Max Gray or some other manufacterer's product, wouldn't there be a brand name, or stock number, or some such other 'identifier'?
(there are absolutely no such identifying marks)...
Thank you for your expertise...


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## periiwrinkle (Sep 12, 2011)

*A 'two rail operation'?*



T-Man said:


> I can safely say it was originally for two rail operation with the scale knuckle. It had to be changed out to use with Lionel. I have no idea how many companies there are. Just check out ebay O scale Brass. One was close but had only two bays. It will turn up.
> 
> Without the original trucks the value has diminished. It looks beat up too.



Interesting -- what is a 'two rail operation'?... and do you have any idea as to it's worth?

Thank you for your information and knowledge...


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## periiwrinkle (Sep 12, 2011)

big ed said:


> All the kits I have seen were plastic or wood for O gauge.
> It could be a brass kit?
> 
> Homemade, Maybe?
> ...



Thank you for your reply
Yes, the trucks are fastened with nut and bolt, (T-man replied that it might have originally been made for a different system?)...
I am looking to sell it if I can ever figure out how much to ask for it...


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

periiwrinkle said:


> If it is a Max Gray or some other manufacterer's product, wouldn't there be a brand name, or stock number, or some such other 'identifier'?
> (there are absolutely no such identifying marks)...
> Thank you for your expertise...


You're welcome... As fior markers, not necessarily...the mark may have been as simple as a sticker or medallion easily removed for painting. The cleanness of the joints leads me to believe an assembly line model, as well as the straightness of the detail, like something assembled in a jig.


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## T-Man (May 16, 2008)

Value? The top hopper in excellent condition on e bay was 300.
I would watch ebay and see what people are paying. I would guess around 80 It has nice detail and the three bays were rare most of them were two. Two rail is true scale three is the Lionel version with larger couplers. You may want to look at coupler and truck costs. Brass is a field unto itself. I don't know anyone into O scale brass.
Good Luck


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## Reckers (Oct 11, 2009)

"A two-rail operation" means the track has two rails instead of three, like a conventional cross-country train. Electrically-powered subways often have 3 rails, with the center rail "hot". In like manner, some electric trains have two rails, and others, notably O gauge Lionel, have 3.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Reckers said:


> "A two-rail operation" means the track has two rails instead of three, like a conventional cross-country train. Electrically-powered subways often have 3 rails, with the center rail "hot". In like manner, some electric trains have two rails, and others, notably O gauge Lionel, have 3.


G Len your being nice today.

Your last sentence would normally be something like this.


In like manner, some electric trains have two rails, and others,:smilie_daumenneg: notably cough, cough, gag, gag,:hah: O gauge Lionel:SELLIT:, have 3.


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

Many brass cars in O scale were left to the buyer to install their own trucks and couplers, specifically because of the two different camps--scale vs. tinplate--, both of which made up about equal percentages of the market at the time.


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

shaygetz said:


> Many brass cars in O scale were left to the buyer to install their own trucks and couplers, specifically because of the two different camps--scale vs. tinplate--, both of which made up about equal percentages of the market at the time.



Yes, but didn't they make brass trucks too?
I have, in my part box, brass O gauge sides to the trucks.
I got them in a lot of parts.:thumbsup:
I don't have any brass wheels, they must of made them for the purist?


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## shaygetz (Sep 23, 2007)

big ed said:


> Yes, but didn't they make brass trucks too?
> I have, in my part box, brass O gauge sides to the trucks.
> I got them in a lot of parts.:thumbsup:
> I don't have any brass wheels, they must of made them for the purist?


Yes...there were several different brands in the day, everything from rough castings to finished. It wouldn't have been at all unusual to use another makers wheelsets, again going back to the two camps in O at the time. We folks in the wee gauges referred to O scalers as "blacksmiths" because of all the hand work they had to do.


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