# Is this a good engine to buy?



## Dream (Jan 5, 2009)

Its a #83902 class J 4-8-4 HO Bachmann DCC sound on board for $149? Sound on board mean its already installed with sound decoders right?


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## Massey (Apr 16, 2011)

It is a really nice engine but it does not like bumps in the track. The way the drawbar is designed it keeps the tender really nice and close to the cab like it is supposed to be and allows the tender to move away as the train goes around a corner (it can handle 18" with no issues) and not to bind with the cab. THe only problem is if the engine goes over a bump there is no up and down movement with the tender and it will lift the tender off the rails. Great runner and good puller but not very forgiving on poorly laid track.

Massey


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## Massey (Apr 16, 2011)

OH and I paid the same for mine with out DCC. So if you can get it with DCC at that price it is not a bad deal at all.

Massey


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## Dream (Jan 5, 2009)

Massey said:


> OH and I paid the same for mine with out DCC. So if you can get it with DCC at that price it is not a bad deal at all.
> 
> Massey


What about the sound part... if it says Sound on board does it mean its already installed with sound decoders?


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Yes it already has sound if it states "Sound on board".


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## Dream (Jan 5, 2009)

Thank you, if I decide to get this engine, can I control it from my Bachmann Trains E-Z Command Digital Command Controller? Or do I need a different controller


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## Artieiii (Apr 25, 2011)

You should have no trouble using your EZ command with that engine. I suggest you buy it. Steam with DCC and sound usually runs over $200 new.
-Art


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

There has been some talk in the past that EZ DCC by Bachmann will not run sound engines, or at least not run them very well. I don't have one so I can't test it out. Sound units just require more amps to run than non sound units and they all vary a little.


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## Massey (Apr 16, 2011)

It does not say what type of sound decoder is installed so I cant comment on the quality of the sound. QSI for the most part has great sound and the timing for the chuffs are right on the money for the 2 QSI steamers I have. Both my QSI steamers are from different makes but they are both good sounding. My Class J #611 is a BLI model and my 2-8-8-2 is a Proto 2000 Heritage. The 2-8-8-2 is a Y6B class used by N&W as well as a couple other roads. Of all the sound engines I have I think they all have the QSI decoders in them. I have a few diesel sound engines and the 2 steam engines and if memory serves me they are all QSI. I have used tsunami, and digitrax sound equipped engines and they have good quality as well. I dont know whos decoder is in this model but considering the competition out there for sound quality it should sound pretty good. 

On a side note I was looking for info on this engine and I could not find one cheaper than $179, most were well over $200 so if you can snatch one for $149 I would jump on it and fast.

Massey


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## Massey (Apr 16, 2011)

Dream said:


> What about the sound part... if it says Sound on board does it mean its already installed with sound decoders?


Mine was just a DC model of the 610, in the spectrum line. No sound no nothing.

Massey


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Yes indeed a very good price, The DCC and Sound decoder alone is worth that price!:thumbsup:


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## gc53dfgc (Apr 13, 2010)

Dream said:


> Thank you, if I decide to get this engine, can I control it from my Bachmann Trains E-Z Command Digital Command Controller? Or do I need a different controller


You need to get something with more then the sortof 1 amp that Bachmanns starter system offers. The engine will either not run with the sound or will only be able to run slowly with the sound on. The engine has a Tsunami decoder installed and is roughly the same as QSI but the problem with the Bachmanns is that the chuff mechanism that you get if you buy just a tsunami sound decoder comes with is not used on the bachmanns so the syncing of the chuff to wheel movement can take a lot of CV programming.


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## Dream (Jan 5, 2009)

gc53dfgc said:


> You need to get something with more then the sortof 1 amp that Bachmanns starter system offers. The engine will either not run with the sound or will only be able to run slowly with the sound on. The engine has a Tsunami decoder installed and is roughly the same as QSI but the problem with the Bachmanns is that the chuff mechanism that you get if you buy just a tsunami sound decoder comes with is not used on the bachmanns so the syncing of the chuff to wheel movement can take a lot of CV programming.


Yes, its equipped with Tsunami sound technology. Do I have to do the CV programming? I don't know anything about it and don't want to take in more than I can handle. 

Can you recommend a more powerful controller than the Bachmann EZ controller?

Thank you.


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## Artieiii (Apr 25, 2011)

That's a bargain....just get it and we will tell you how to change the CV's if needed!
-Art


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

A very good and effective controller with room to expand would be Zephyr Xtra by Digitrax.
Link *Zephyr Xtra Digitrax * 
I've been running the Super Chief 8 amp for years and I love it. The best part about digitrax is that there are a lot of expansion possibilitys and I think ease of use.


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## Artieiii (Apr 25, 2011)

Digital controller choice is like discussing religion. You will get very strong opinions from those involved. I bought an NCE Power cab and am very happy. User friendly and expandable. Do your research before you buy. Go to the LHS and try them on for size then decide.
-Art


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## NIMT (Jan 6, 2011)

Now Art them feuding words!!! Lets head out to the alley and duke it out!
MY controller can still beat up YOUR controller!
:laugh::laugh::laugh:
Yea what Art said!
It's really a lot of personal choice!
But I will say and I'm sure anyone that's upgraded will say this too, The difference between EZ DCC and most of the rest of the controllers is Night and Day differences!:thumbsup:


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## gc53dfgc (Apr 13, 2010)

I would say that get a nice NCE starter system or get the step up from the digitrax zephyer but that is personal choice as i don't like the DC type controller style that the basic Zephyer offers and prefer wireless. When you get the engine up to full speed or high the engine sounds more like a car engine then a steam engine. This has to do with the prototype never supposed to be going that fast and also that the decoders "sound curve" is not setup to be running at the fastest speed by the factory without the cam so it does not sound quite like it should but for the price of what you are getting that is a small thing and should be ignored till you have the engine and find the noise to your disliking.


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## Massey (Apr 16, 2011)

I let my son play with my DT400R throttle and he was having trouble understanding about the little throttle knobs. He is just learning his numbers and can turn the TV on and put it on PBS to watch his morning cartoons but beyond that he needs some help. Now with a Zephyr set I had him try out at a local hobby shop he knew exactly what to do to run trains (aside from addressing the locos but like I said before we are working on that). The switch for forward/reverse and the dial for thottle were easy to use and easy for a young kid to handle. Has any one ever noticed the 8 "notches" on the Zephyr's thottle? Just like a real engine!

I believe that the Zephyr set was designed with young folk and old DC users in mind. It has features that are easy to understand for the young and also controls that are similar in feel to the old DC packs that DC railroaders are used to. This enables 2 groups to be framiliar with one piece of equipment. Adding to your Zephyr system also does not make the old unit obsolete, it simply changes it's function depending on what is added. 

The NCE system is good, dont get me wrong but I found that the universal remote like control was not layed out as good as it could have been. It felt clumsy in my hand and I didnt find that system as user friendly, even though the instructions said it was. The learning curve is about the same for either set. 

Early Digitrax sets like the Big Boy starter set liked to use hexidecimal numeration in the CV programing. This is great for those who understand it, but can be confusing to others. Digitrax now uses decimal or hex depending on what method you perfer, NCE is decimal only.
I will admit that when you see the number 10 you think it worth Ten not 16. and 16 should = sixteen not 22. Ya all can understand why hex can get confusing! and we have not even talked about a-f 

Either way both systems will perform many times better than the Bachmann EZ-DCC they developed. The new system is a big step up from the older system but they both lack many of the abilities of the NCE or Digitrax systems.

Massey


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## gc53dfgc (Apr 13, 2010)

Dynamis is the way to go in terms of remote control feel and ease of use but you suffer in the fact that it can not be upgraded to run off of a computer and the problem of not being able to use the engine shut down sequence on tsunamis decoders but if you can live without that then that the way to go, just as expandable and thankfully since ESU made Dynamis ESU has come out with a newer version that does allow PC control but you still have the shut down sequence issue which is no issue to some but to others like me I want to be able to run the engine shutdown sequence. If it were not for the Tsunami shut down problem I would have long since moved from my Dynamis to the ESu computer able system but am still trying to decide if I want an NCE or a Digitrax or waiting till ESu updates a firmware so the system runs the required two press ermergency stop to make the engine run the prime mover shutdown sequence.


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## Dream (Jan 5, 2009)

Just wanted to update.... I was at the store over the weekend, while they had this particular engine at $149 they didn't have any of the cars and I really wanted a passenger train. 

So I ended up buying a Proto2000 F7A-B New York Central with sound so I can use my passengers cars with it. Paid $239 for it. A quick google search said Proto2000 are good engines, hope I made the right choice.


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## Massey (Apr 16, 2011)

P2K engines are IMO better than the spectrum line. You made a good choice

Massey


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## sstlaure (Oct 12, 2010)

I've got a Proto2000 GP38 and it's a great runner. My father has literally dozens of them and he loves em. $239 for DCC/Sound for A & B unit is a great price.


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