# MDC Shay HO to HOn3 conversion?



## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Stripping down my old Roundhouse 2-truck Shay to put in the NWSL parts. 

While I am in there, would it be possible to convert it from standard gauge to HOn3? I am guessing both kits were the same, except for the trucks, and those could be swapped out. But, unless I find a donor kit, or the parts on line somewhere, I don't think that's a viable option.

So the question is, is there another way?


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## Jscullans (Jul 8, 2019)

If you end up replacing the trucks I’ll buy yours. My shay has a really worn out truck and I think both are on their way out


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Jscullans said:


> If you end up replacing the trucks I’ll buy yours. My shay has a really worn out truck and I think both are on their way out


I just found/bought an unbuilt, HOn3, 2 truck kit on eBay, so I am going to deal with that first. But I will keep it in mind.

EDIT: Just to clarify, I wasn't planning on just swapping trucks. I was hoping someone had figured a way to shorten the axles, and associated parts, to convert the trucks. Now that I have an HOn3 kit, I should be able to figure it out myself. Or not...LOL...


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

@Jscullans Did you see this? LOT OF 2 HO SHAY GEARED TRUCK ASSEMBLIES Roundhouse Model Die Casting MDC NOS | eBay


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## Jscullans (Jul 8, 2019)

I figured the hon3 trucks were the only difference. I just started watching them. There is a set of what appears to be 3D printed truck housings which would be nice to have and would be more solid for sure but I’m not real happy that the housings are all you get for the same money as a set of unbuilt trucks


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Well six months later, and I am back on this project. And in case anyone ends up here via search, here is what I know.

No need to change complete trucks, as the only difference between the HO and the HOn3 versions, is the truck housing and the wheelset axle length.
The HOn3 housing are still available, from Wiseman Model, and other places. There are also "improved" version available, which I am going to try.
Couldn't find the MDC narrow gauge wheelsets or axles available anywhere, but figure I can just shorten the axles I have.
Everything else is the same, housing cover, sideframes, pickup wipers, worm gears, etc.

You can see the bolsters on the standard gauge, and none on the narrow gauge here.


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## Jscullans (Jul 8, 2019)

So basically the gauge of the wheels changes and there isn’t any bolsters on the gear housing is all that changes?


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Jscullans said:


> So basically the gauge of the wheels changes and there isn’t any bolsters on the gear housing is all that changes?


As far as can tell, that is correct. You could probably cut the bolsters off, but I am not sure if the sideframes would mount cleanly.


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## Jscullans (Jul 8, 2019)

That’s good to know. I’m not modeling any hon3 but that could come in handy at some point. Thanks for the update


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

What about the loco itself? Is the body also exactly the same, or did they make it smaller to match the typical size of other narrow gauge locos? I've looked at the MDC 2-8-0 loco kits in both gauges and everything is different between them.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Shdwdrgn said:


> What about the loco itself? Is the body also exactly the same, or did they make it smaller to match the typical size of other narrow gauge locos? I've looked at the MDC 2-8-0 loco kits in both gauges and everything is different between them.


Everything else is the same according to the parts lists. 
I am rebuilding my original one, and the kit I just got, at the same time.


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

Thanks, that's really good to know. I always avoid the really cheap ones I see at the train shows because they're the standard gauge version and I'm specifically looking for narrow gauge. From what I've read, it sounds like it is worthwhile to get the upgraded trucks anyway, and I can likely pick up the narrow axles from ebay. Guess I'll have to look closer.

Bachmann has a nice 3-truck shay, it always bummed me out they didn't make one in standard gauge. Now knowing they are likely the same bodies anyway, it makes me wonder how much trouble it would be to swap out the axles on the Bachmann loco. I might have to do some searching to see if anyone else has done this. I'm betting it wouldn't bee too difficult to convert it to a 2-truck version from there.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Continuing....

Using the HOn3 truck housing and wheel sets, I reassembled the trucks, and they do work as anticipated, except for the contact wipers.
With narrow gauge wheel spacing there is no room for the wipers behind the wheels. The instructions show the wipers on the tread of the wheels. As below.

Anyway, I am going to see if I can come up with something better.

As for the aftermarket truck housing, they are nice. I shortened the standard gauge wheel sets, assembled the trucks, and operation seems very smooth.
But I will have to paint them somehow. Blue isn't going to work.


Regards,


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Back again. 
The new truck housing and wheel sets, on my first Shay, have caused a little shimmy during forward movement, but we'll get that worked out.
In the meantime, I manage to cobble up some wipers from a few no. 5 coupler springs. 
Looks like it will work OK, once I get the wire routing figured out.








OK...hope to be back soon.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

So it runs, and pretty darn good....
Ended up using the NWSL gears and u-joints, with the stock HOn3 truck housing. 
This was the smoothest and slowest running setup. The aftermarket housing had some issues, really didn't run well.

Wiring the wipers/motor...






Test drive...


Next, I need to figure out the final wire routing, and put in the DCC card.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Still here, getting near the end. In case anyone reads this far, I figured I owed them an ending.
Took me a bit to figure a way to keep the wires routed correctly.
This is just a few layers of plastic sheet, which keeps the wires tight to the frame.


Everything still runs well on DC....Just need to finish up the body details, add couplers, and a DCC card.


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## Shdwdrgn (Dec 23, 2014)

Have you figured out which DCC decoder you're going to use yet? Do any of the sound boards match what a shay would sound like?


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

Your wiper solution looks very good. I try to put a good bit of tension on the wipers on my locomotives. It not only provides better contact, but helps to keep them cleaner.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Shdwdrgn said:


> Have you figured out which DCC decoder you're going to use yet? Do any of the sound boards match what a shay would sound like?


I already have a basic Lok Sound Pilot 5 on the bench. One of the small ones, but no sound.
That's a cost I am not willing to add to this project yet. Want to see how she runs, first.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

If it has no sound that would be a LokPilot decoder. Loksound is not a brand name but a decoder model like Lokpilot. Brand is ESU. Electronic Solutions Ulm.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

MichaelE said:


> If it has no sound that would be a LokPilot decoder. Loksound is not a brand name but a decoder model like Lokpilot. Brand is ESU. Electronic Solutions Ulm.


Thank you. 
Yes, Pilot...Too lazy to go look at it...LOL...


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

S'right. I'm up on all that German stuff...


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Put the LokiPilot DCC card in yesterday....

First test runs, with the wires twisted together...


Solder and heat shrink. Plenty of room inside the tender.


Assembled and testing. Runs fairly well. No lights yet. Going to figure out wire routing on my other kit, before I tackle this one.


Still need some final detailing, paint, and a final matte coat. But I am quite pleased.

A quick video...


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## Davepaulstanley (12 mo ago)

Thank you for posting all this. Really helpful. How did you shorten the axles of the wheel sets? I don't think you mentioned exactly how you did that?


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Davepaulstanley said:


> Thank you for posting all this. Really helpful. How did you shorten the axles of the wheel sets? I don't think you mentioned exactly how you did that?


Thanks for bringing this up. I didn't take any photos, and I did leave that part out, but yes, I did just shorten the axles.
I used the MicroMark wheel and gear remover to pull one of the wheels. Using the length from the HOn3 kit axles, I cut the axle down with my Dremel and a cut off wheel. Before putting the wheel back on, I used the MM tool to center the gear on the axle. Then I put the wheel back on, checking the gauge, of course. 

Let me know if you need more info. And thanks for reading my thread. Hopefully it provided some useful information.


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## Joss (5 mo ago)

Very interesting. Thank you for sharing.
One question, what were the issues you found with the aftermarket truck housings? I have a set but haven´t installed them yet.
Thanks


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Joss said:


> Very interesting. Thank you for sharing.
> One question, what were the issues you found with the aftermarket truck housings? I have a set but haven´t installed them yet.
> Thanks


They probably would work fine, but they really didn't improve anything. 
The stock part has a snap on gear cover, while the 3D printed one used small screws. The snap on cover just made the work a little easier.


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## BobT (Mar 27, 2021)

Since this thread came back up, I can add a small update.
I've been working on the second Shay, and decided to replace the "tubing" drive, with a U-joint from NWSL.


It worked out well enough I went back and added one to the first Shay.


Not much else to report at this time.
Railroading projects are mostly on hold, whilst our daughter and spouse and dog, are living with us.
They are between apartments, and are having a dickens of a time finding a new one.
But I digress...


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