# IMO - Diesel Rank... Detail vs Performance



## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

_In my opinion_, based on personal experience and good/bad luck, here's how I rank North American distributed HO scale DCC diesel locomotives (in order, best-first):

*Best overall detail:*
InterMountain _(recent - e.g., Tier4)._ *
ScaleTrains Rivet Counter
Athearn Genesis
Walthers Proto
Atlas Gold
MTH _(with Kadees)._
BLI
InterMountain _(pre-Tier4)._
Athearn RTR
Walthers Mainline
Bowser
Bachmann **

* Superb detail on InterMountain's GEVo is as good as (if not better than) _Rivet Counter's_, and is generally priced lower.

** Although Bachmann rolling stock is often maligned for poor detail, their diesels (albeit underpowered) are fairly decent.
________________________

*Best runners:*
InterMountain _(recent)._
Walthers Proto
Walthers Mainline
ScaleTrains
InterMountain _(pre-Tier4)_
Atlas Gold
Athearn RTR
Bowser
Bachmann _(underpowered)._
MTH *
BLI **
Athearn Genesis ***

* I've had very bad luck with MTH (DCS-related).

** Two of my BLI SD7's and one SD9 are replacements for bad runners.

*** Although all five Genesis diesels I own are now superb runners, all (except for a lucky GP9) are replacements for units that failed and were returned... in some cases twice or more.

_Your luck & mileage may vary._


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## SPfan4ever (Mar 25, 2019)

Great information from real world experience. I like how you distinguished performance and detail. As I am just getting back to HO, does anybody have a good on line hobby store they want to suggest. Thanks.


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## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

*Snake-bit*_
My stubborn brand-loyalty._

Genesis locomotives are accurately detailed, with great sound, and are exquisite examples of 'scale modeling'.
I have five on my roster, and they all run great... but not without some headaches.
As much as I really like them, I've come to the conclusion that one will either be a superb runner, or a _terrible_ one... there's been no middle-of-the-road for me.
In my experience decoder issues are more than common, so (if possible) a purchase should be predicated on LHS track-testing.
Otherwise, be prepared to mail it back for replacement.

Also, FWIW, a Genesis SD70 I had was a constant 'derailer' due to warped trucks... which I've heard is a common malady with that model.


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## tankist (Jun 11, 2009)

I can only add that experiences can vary as at a times Individual engines we get can be gems or lemons. 

While to low on detail part for me the dash-8 from bachman I had was a superb runner, smooth and quiet. Of the two Genesis m15s one is amazingly smooth and another has really growling gears. 
My intermountain GEVO (I got the very first run ) growls a little bit, but requires absolutely perfect trackwork - had to work on point rails of new walthers turnouts (and those are excellent turnouts) to prevent the GEVO climbing over the rail.

YMMV

Good luck


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## Gramps (Feb 28, 2016)

SPfan4ever said:


> Great information from real world experience. I like how you distinguished performance and detail. As I am just getting back to HO, does anybody have a good on line hobby store they want to suggest. Thanks.


I have done well with Model Train Stuff and Trainworld.


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## ggnlars (Aug 6, 2013)

For performance, I would drop Walthers several slots as well as the Intermountain. This is based on my testing that I have documented on my web page.
Larry
llxlocomotives.com


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## tommy24a (Mar 4, 2016)

Ditto on Model train stuff

Sent from my LGL84VL using Tapatalk


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## Cab1 (Jul 26, 2009)

I think it's the luck of the draw. Two people can buy the same loco from the same manufacture, one will run sweet the other will run like a dog - if it runs at all. I think it has more to do with production and quality control, not with any particular company, model, or design. More than likely the parts that go into the loco, if not the whole loco, is made in China or some other cheep labor mill. We also have to take into account the layout the loco is being run on. Some locos are fussy about track work and how power is being delivered.


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## MichaelE (Mar 7, 2018)

I have found Roco and ACME to be two of the best detailed and running locomotives I've ever had. They are rivet counter quality detailed with separately applied parts and motors that run so smooth you can't hardly hear them pass by you with the sound turned off.


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## Chet (Aug 15, 2014)

*Choices*

I model the transition era so I have no input for modern locomotives. 

My home layout id DC but I do have some DCC locomotives that I run at my club. 

I had an Atlas Gold RS-1 which was a very smooth running locomotive, but it's performance on the two and a half percent grades at the club wasn't very good. It could only manage 9 cars, 10 if I was lucky. My DC Atlas RS units could easily handle 16 due to having more weight that the DCC unit sacrificed to had a decoder and speaker. I swapped it for a BLI SD-9. It had the sound decoder changed to the proper one for the prime mover and with a little added weight could handle a few more cars. Excellent running unit. I also had a BLI EMD switcher but it also couldn't pull many cars.sold it to a club member who already had one and wanted another so he could do switching and move decent size trains. Also have a BLI heave Mike which is a smooth running steamer but I have seen better. 

I also had a couple of Bachmann units, a 2-6-0 and an Alco S-4. The 2-6-0 was a gift but the sound doesn't sync properly with the speeds and is a complete wimp on grades. The S-4 has excellent detail and is a decent pulling locomotive for it's size. 

I needed something that could handle a decent size train on the grades at the club and picked up a Walthers Mainline F7 A&B and was really quite happy with them. They are excellent running units and I have pulled 38 cars up the grades being that they are both powered. The sound is good and I do plan to add a few minor details. 

I like the Walthers units.


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## BigGRacing (Sep 25, 2020)

I have recently seen some new Bowser releases, anyone on the forum run bowser trains by chance? If so, how do you find them?


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

Oddly missing from the list (in this old thread) is Rapido…..


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

Hilarious that Bowser is listed below Walthers MainLine in the "detail" list on the original post...

Not that poster is around anymore to follow up with anything.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

cv_acr said:


> Hilarious that Bowser is listed below Walthers MainLine in the "detail" list on the original post...
> 
> Not that poster is around anymore to follow up with anything.


LateStarter was never one to discuss his choices. He was all about pontificating.


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## Gramps (Feb 28, 2016)

Based on what we know now, that was probably someone else's listing.


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## Gramps (Feb 28, 2016)

It has just hit me that in light of the fishing thread on Union Station, could he also be a fisherman?


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## Oomowmow (10 mo ago)

SPfan4ever said:


> Great information from real world experience. I like how you distinguished performance and detail. As I am just getting back to HO, does anybody have a good on line hobby store they want to suggest. Thanks.


I've had really good luck with trainz. They sell both new and used locomotives at very reasonable prices. I've also bought rolling stock from them. Although I run N scale, I know they also carry a really good selection of HO.


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## Old_Hobo (Feb 20, 2014)

That’s great, but this thread is old, and talked about detail vs performance, not which retailer has the best deals and service….


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## Oomowmow (10 mo ago)

Old_Hobo said:


> That’s great, but this thread is old, and talked about detail vs performance, not which retailer has the best deals and service….


Actually, the post I replied to, did pose that question at the end if you read it. 
But it's true I didn't realize that particular entry was from 2019.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Oomowmow said:


> Actually, the post I replied to, did pose that question at the end if you read it.
> But it's true I didn't realize that particular entry was from 2019.


You're correct that the post you replied to did, in fact, mention hobby retailers... but that was actually an off-topic post, not the original intent of the thread (which was only to allow its creator to pontificate about his unscientific observations.


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## Oomowmow (10 mo ago)

CTValleyRR said:


> You're correct that the post you replied to did, in fact, mention hobby retailers... but that was actually an off-topic post, not the original intent of the thread (which was only to allow its creator to pontificate about his unscientific observations.


Yeah, ponticific, um, what you said...


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