# My questions thread...



## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Hey guys, I figured I would just make an overall questions thread for myself, instead of posting 3 threads a week.

This way be the dumbest question I have asked in a long time...

Where can water come from that it does not look out of place AND is big enough to accumulate to a larger water fall. 

My initial idea was a pond for the saw mill, but im not doing a saw mill for this layout anymore and it would not end at a bigger water fall.

This being said of course a river would be prefect, but 90% of my layout is mountains... so Im almost thinking I will need some sort of water fall coming down one of the back mountains coming to the 'main' front water fall under the bridge. 

BTW; as a small layout update, trackwork is being reworked again  I didnt like it so im changing it while i still can


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## mesenteria (Oct 29, 2015)

A cirque lying at the foot of a smallish glacier could empty itself via a waterfall. Many of them do.


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## wvgca (Jan 21, 2013)

sometimes in nature a large amount of water is released from cracks / faults in a rock face, however a lower exit is more common than a high exi for the water


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

Siloam Springs, Arkansas, big waterfall that is spring fed coming out of the rocks. Sat at the base of it several times. You cant even see it from ground level.


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

Since water always flows downhill, put your incoming river in one of the higher mountains at the edge of your layout. Then let it fall out of the mountains and flow across your layout to one of the lower parts, and then off of the layout.

The volume of water in a river depends on the amount of land area drains into that river (called the drainage basin) and how much rain falls (or snow melts) in that drainage basin.

Since your drainage basin will be off layout, you can imagine it to be as large as you want.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Great idea! Now i just have to figure out where the best place to start the river will be.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I have another one....

As some of you know, I have 95% of my track plan done, but I still have 2 spurs to fill with a decent amount of room to fill. 

To this area will be the river I was talking about in my first post. My question is; is there an industry that is mostly commonly found near a river? 

keep in mind my layout is modern, so a water wheel is not really going to fit. 

Also, if there really isn't anything special for by the river, that's fine too. I'll just make the river its own scene without buildings in addition to it. 

thanks


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

Is it a big enough river for barge traffic?


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I thought about that, but no. It is going to be about 3 or 4 inches wide.


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

Power plants often use river water for cooling. But there would not be much interaction to model in this case.

P.S. You could model a sewage treatment plant -- that cleans up the water and returns it to the river. Again, not much interaction, but it would be unique -- never seen one before on a layout.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I like the sewage plant idea, would fill space that would be harder for me to get track to


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

All I can really think of is maybe a dredging operation where the silt is being stockpiled and then loaded into Hoppers to be hauled out by rail.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I think it might be best for me to just make it a river with the needed number of bridges going across it. 

I like the dredging idea, but I already have a bunch of construction scenes (coal, gravel, forestry, possibly bridge demolition. 

Ill save the water treatment and dredging ideas for the next BIGGER and BETTER layout

But i did find this...


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

3 possibilities have come to mind. These industries would all need cooling or process water that could come from your river; 
Commercial Heat treating plant, boxcars in, boxcars out. 
Animal fat processing plant, large drug companies use processed animal fat in some products.Tankers in, boxcars out
Get an old AHM molasses mine kit, non descript tanks and cooling tower on this one, easily could handle tanks and boxcars.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

MtRR75 said:


> Power plants often use river water for cooling. But there would not be much interaction to model in this case.
> 
> P.S. You could model a sewage treatment plant -- that cleans up the water and returns it to the river. Again, not much interaction, but it would be unique -- never seen one before on a layout.


Part of the treatment process involves removing non-biodegradable solids from the waste water stream. If you're modeling a big enough plant, shipment of this waste by rail would not be unrealistic. Or you could just do it, because it would be a little out of the ordinary and maybe really cool.


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

Are we allowed to use the term non-biodegradable solid here?


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*Water flows down hill on a path of least resistance!*



Aminnich said:


> Great idea! Now i just have to figure out where the best place to start the river will be.


 It sounds as though you will have to incorporate a
form of some sort of back drop scenery into your mountainous
scenery.The snow melt,or mountain wells of water would be seeking the path of least resistance.In my instance, I have yet 
incorporated a back drop into the mix.That is one item on the "to do list"My river is sort of in a gorge. The back drop will be 
added at a later time.Regards,tr1


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## jlc41 (Feb 16, 2016)

How about a boat/yacht building plant????


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

time warp said:


> Are we allowed to use the term non-biodegradable solid here?


It's better tthan describing what the most common items are...


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

time warp said:


> Are we allowed to use the term non-biodegradable solid here?


Those who work in these facilities refer to this as "sludge".


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

OR


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

Just picking at you a little bit! Actually I think you have a very good idea there.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I have another one, 

So i'm trying to figure out what the diameter of my oil tanks should be another industry. There is a large liquid petetroleum company near my house that has distribution. 

So I went on google earth, measured the tanks diameter and divided by 87... to scale the tank would be 1 foot in diameter... too big. 

My question is, am i doing something wrong? is that the right size?

If it is the right method of doing that, i'll just pick a different (smaller) tank to measure. 

The link to a google map of the area is below if you are interested. 

https://www.google.com/maps/search/buckeye+oil/@40.5177779,-75.5312832,1398m/data=!3m1!1e3


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## higgsbosonman (Nov 17, 2014)

You got it right. those storage tanks would be about 1 foot across (give or take an inch). For HO, length is 1/87, as you did. Area would be 1/(87^2), or 1/7569. For volume (or mass, since it relies on volume), you have 1/(87^3), or 1/658500. This is why an HO locomotive doesn't weigh 1/87th the weight of a real one, it weighs 1/87^3, or about a pound.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Ok thanks for that!

My next question would be, what would be a reasonable size for this? My plan is to fit 1 or 2 of the big tall fat tanks. Then maybe two smaller in diameter, same height, then 3 or 4 of of the long skinnier tanks. 

I am going to make these out of PVC and see how they look. Ill hopefully be going to the hardware store tomorrow for some pipe. Since my hobby store did not have anything I was looking for. I dont have anything to build for the next couple days while the amazon box gets on my front porch. 

If anyone has any thoughts, that would be great. I like to feed off of everyone's ideas. 

Thanks!


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## redman88 (Nov 25, 2015)

Maybe use just a sliver and place it against the back drop.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Hey guys

You have not heard from me in 3 days because I have been trying to work on a little project. Today I realized it totally failed  

So tomorrow im going out, getting new supplies, and trying again. 

My question for you guys:

What is the best way to cut 6 in PVC NICELY. I figured out the way to cut it nice and not straight. I read online pipe cutter for anything under an inch, but 6 inches should use a sawzall, which I dont have at this moment. 

Thanks for any comments!


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## higgsbosonman (Nov 17, 2014)

Do you have a miter saw? That would give you a clean, square cut. I don't know of you could fit a 6" tube in a normal one, though.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I do, but it is very old and does not work very well. I could try it, but I feel like it wont work very well.


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## higgsbosonman (Nov 17, 2014)

I guess the question is what tools do you have available to you? I can think of tons of ways to do it, but most of them probably wouldn't be helpful to you if you don't have the tool. What was the way you cut it originally?


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I probably have every tool you could think of to use, I might actually have a sawzall, but i dont know where it is. 

My original cut was with a hack saw and a drew a line around and tried to follow it. Turns out I can cut a 2x6 straight, but not a piece of pipe.


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## Lemonhawk (Sep 24, 2013)

I even have problems with a 2x6 and a hand saw, but I think using the hack saw was the problem. Following the line around the outside I think using a regular hand saw would allow you to use part of the cut to make it straight would would work. At least that is how I would tackle a large diameter PVC pipe.


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## higgsbosonman (Nov 17, 2014)

Do you have a bandsaw? with the flat table, you should have enough control to follow the line reasonably well, and to get the last bit of unevenness out of it you could put sandpaper on a flat surface and rub the end of the PVC. You could try using a lathe, which I heartily recommend, since there is no kill like overkill. I assume you don't have a 6" pipe cutter, since those cost around a car payment, but hey, go for it if you have it. I don't recommend trying to use a table saw to cut PVC (that is taking it far away from its intended use, and would require a skilled operator).

For hand tools, I think a hacksaw or carpenters wood saw is a good way to go about it. You just need more of a guide than a line and steady hands. If you make a jig you could get it very straight rather easily. It would just take some 2x4s, some plywood, a few screws, and a few minutes to pop out a usable jig. You would simply need to make a sheet of plywood perpendicular to the pipe (with a hole in it so the pipe pokes through) so that a saw could ride along the plywood and make your cut perfectly straight. If you can't visualize it but want to go this route, I can post a picture or something for you.

Lastly, a quick google search for things I couldn't think of lead to this neat idea. You use two hose clamps to guide your saw. link: http://www.evanstips.com/handyman/cut-pvc-pipe-straight-hacksaw/


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Lemonhawk said:


> I even have problems with a 2x6 and a hand saw, but I think using the hack saw was the problem. Following the line around the outside I think using a regular hand saw would allow you to use part of the cut to make it straight would would work. At least that is how I would tackle a large diameter PVC pipe.


My experience is that you need to start cutting on one side and continue through. Any time you have to turn it, you risk an uneven cut.

My tool of choice would be a miter saw, followed by a table saw. Whatever you use, the pipe needs to be securely held, and you need some kind of a straight edge to keep you from wandering (the aforementioned power tools have it built in).


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I picked up some new pipe today. Im going to try the hose clamp idea with a hand saw later today. It seems like it would work since the saw would follow the "path" of the hose clamps.


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

Aminnich said:


> I picked up some new pipe today. Im going to try the hose clamp idea with a hand saw later today. It seems like it would work since the saw would follow the "path" of the hose clamps.


The problem is likely the hacksaw. The mechanism that holds the blade is most hacksaws has some play in it. So the saw blade is often crooked in relation to the saw itself. It is difficult to get the blade perfectly vertical.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

figured I would bring this thread back instead of keep posting new questions

I have been working on the roadbed for my layout slowly this week. I almost have the mainline done, here is my question;

What do I do for the spurs? I dont want to ballast them the same as the mainline and I want them lower than the mainline. I have read that people sand down corkbed is a ramp down to nothing, well I have foam roadbed and I tried sanding it and it didnt really work. 

Any thoughts?


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## santafealltheway (Nov 27, 2012)

Aminnich said:


> figured I would bring this thread back instead of keep posting new questions
> 
> I have been working on the roadbed for my layout slowly this week. I almost have the mainline done, here is my question;
> 
> ...


I've had good luck using those wooden door shims from home depot, they are already a ramp shape, and just about the same height as cork at one end.


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

The transition is what can get you a lot of times, not necessarily the ramp or slope. If you have a sharp grade change problems will crop up. Many years ago the trend was toward cookie cutter tablework of plywood, the grade changes were gradual because of the flexibility of the ply, no sharp changes.Good thinking on the shims, by the way.


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## mjrfd99 (Jan 5, 2016)

Aminnich said:


> figured I would bring this thread back instead of keep posting new questions
> 
> I have been working on the roadbed for my layout slowly this week. I almost have the mainline done, here is my question;
> 
> ...


 For going up or going down with track I use a cheap pack of shimming shingles/wood from Home Despot


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I think I will try those, thanks for the idea


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

You can also use a scrap of insulating foamboard and shape it with a rasp or sanding block.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I am going to try that for the spurs that come off the main at a curve. 

I am going to try both and see what would best. The problem I see with the door shim is that it is a rigid material and cannot be shaped easily.


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## Tom17 (Jan 14, 2016)

Try this http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=17022&highlight=making+incline


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Aminnich said:


> The problem I see with the door shim is that it is a rigid material and cannot be shaped easily.


Sandpaper has been around for a lot of years now. And it's even better today than in the past.

Yes, wood takes a little more effort than foam, but it's also easier to avoid that "oops" moment when you realize you've removed too much material.

It's really about personal preference.


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## Mr.Buchholz (Dec 30, 2011)

Aminnich said:


> I have another one,
> 
> So i'm trying to figure out what the diameter of my oil tanks should be.


I have oil tanks and structures relating to the petroleum industry on my layout. I actually went and visited a site near where I live that has tanks, and scratch-built something similar on my layout. I noted the height of the tanks in real life, and used 1-1/4" wood dowel to make them, marking the height as close as possible to what the real ones are, using an HO car to gauge it.

-J.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

CTValleyRR said:


> Sandpaper has been around for a lot of years now. And it's even better today than in the past.
> 
> Yes, wood takes a little more effort than foam, but it's also easier to avoid that "oops" moment when you realize you've removed too much material.
> 
> It's really about personal preference.


Alright alright, I know that, I took woodshop in high school. 

Im just accustom to foam now, I literally have piles of it in my basement. 

Im also thinking foam because of the noise difference, im sure it wont be much different, but idk. 

Im going to try both and tell you guys what I find out which is easier (with the tools I have available to me) If I had a disc sander, using the door shims would be much easier and faster.

EDIT:

Buchholz, I actually used google earth to be an estimated diameter for the oil tank size I was looking for. There is an oil company near my house that is supplied by train. I am not modeling the company, maybe on the next layout (not enough room on this one)


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

*Making a layout easy to move*

As I have mentioned in the past, I move a lot, So I have been building this layout so that it can be moved easily in sections that arent too heavy and will fit through doorways without haveing to take anything apart. 

So far, I have terminal blocks in between the table sections to making the wiring easier. I'll probably be cutting the track and buildings will not be attached to the layout. Right now the 4 sections are bolted together, the main 2 tables are on saw horses and the other sections have legs built on. 

The plan was to have the bench work and 2'' foam as 2 separate pieces to move (lighter and is less awkward to move). I was going to have fascia board around the benchwork to keep the foam in place (not gluing it down) 

Here is my problem... all my feeder/switch machine wires are going from the top of the foam to the bottom of the bench work. I wont be able to separate the 2 to move them with those wires there. 

I can only think of one solution. To have connectors between the foam and benchwork. A picture of what im talking about is below. 










If you have any other ideas or comments, please feel free to comment. 

Thanks


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

I would not separate the foam from the benchwork. Divide your layout into modules and move them as a unit: benchwork, foam,scenery, track, etc. all together


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## redman88 (Nov 25, 2015)

You could make the legs easy to separate from the bench top. That would make it easy enough to move around.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

redman88 said:


> You could make the legs easy to separate from the bench top. That would make it easy enough to move around.


Yes definitely. I purposely did not include legs in my list of stuff to move as one piece.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

quick question; 

when wiring a single crossover (using 2 turnouts) can I wire them together as one?


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## Magic (Jan 28, 2014)

Yes, and recommended.

Magic


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## time warp (Apr 28, 2016)

I'll second that, I've got 3 set up that way myself.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

*what size ballast*

Hey guys, 

I hope everyone had a very Merry Christmas and that santa brought you what you wanted 

I am going to the hobby shop some time this week to use my Christmas money (im spender not a saver) on some stuff I need to move on with the layout. I need some more roadbed to finish that up, then wire everything up, then ballast! 

So the question, what size ballast for mainlines and spurs? 

I have read that medium is good for mainline and the fine is good for spurs. Other people say fine all throughout, other say fine all throughout. 

For the mainline, im gonna do the mix of grey ballast, but for the coal area, im just gonna mix in a little bit more black into the mix (maybe a quick spray of black spray paint) 

Im just looking for opinions here, if anyone wants to post of picture of their ballast for an example of the different sizes, awesome. 

Thanks guys!


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

My very strong opinion is that in HO scale, anything larger than Fine ballast is too big. Real ballast is stones up to about 3" in diameter. The medium stuff is more like 6-8" (scale) in diameter. I am unfortunately not at home and don't have a picture, but you can really tell the difference. Fine looks much better.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Thanks for your opinion, I was thinking to go with the fine. I think it will look a lot nicer and more to scale.


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## Magic (Jan 28, 2014)

CTValley is right about medium ballast being too big but I chose to use it on my mainlines 
because I liked the look better when viewed from a distance. 
Many trade offs in model railroading.

Here is how I laid ballast, came out pretty good 
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showpost.php?p=1309514&postcount=283

Here is more and doing the yard and sidings.
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showpost.php?p=1384097&postcount=290

The technique will work with fine or medium ballast.

Magic


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

To me, the fine ballast looks closer to scale, but I think the medium might actually look better. I think the fine looks like it packs too much not giving the finished project a rocky look, instead more like sand. 

Also, if I do not go nuts using the stuff, roughly how much track like one woodland scenics container cover? I have one container of the medium, but Im not sure if im going with the medium or the fine yet. Ill see what the store has and go from there.


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## Magic (Jan 28, 2014)

That's the reason I went with medium, the fine looked more like paint to me, no variation in colors.

I did over 100 feet of mainline but really can't say how much I used as I used four different colors and 
several different mixes and have a ton of stuff leftover. 
But as a guess I think I used about two of the big containers for the 100 feet. 

A little goes a long way.

Magic


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

*homemade bridges made from styrene*

Hey guys, 

I was at the hobby shop today, was going to get a bunch of stuff including what I needed to make a custom bridge. I probably stood in front of the rank of styrene for 15 mins deciding what to get, comparing parts to kit bridges and I just was not sure what to get. So I got enough roadbed to finish that up and all the ballast I should need. 

Anyway, has anyone here made a homemade curved bridge? 

What I was hoping to make was an arch bridge, 2 double track, curved but not symmetrically. 

If you have any thoughts or websites I should check out for ideas. That would be great. 

Thanks


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

So, I think what you're asking is how to make a curved stone viaduct type bridge. Steel and wood bridges that appear curved are actually a series of short, straight segments.

First of all, you don't want to rely on the styrene structure alone to support your track. Use a solid roadbed, and wooden piers. Next I would get some patterned stone sheets, which I don't think plastruct or evergreen sells (JTT Trees makes nice ones, as do some of the european manufacturers). Cut your profile out of these and curve them around, bracing it both vertically and horizontally with strip styrene. For best appearance, try to line up the individual stones at seams as best you can.

An alternative is to use regular sheet styrene (about .030) to make the structure and glue patterned paper wall cards or printed stone / brick textures to it.


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## J.C. (Dec 24, 2016)

CTValleyRR said:


> So, I think what you're asking is how to make a curved stone viaduct type bridge. Steel and wood bridges that appear curved are actually a series of short, straight segments.
> 
> First of all, you don't want to rely on the styrene structure alone to support your track. Use a solid roadbed, and wooden piers. Next I would get some patterned stone sheets, which I don't think plastruct or evergreen sells (JTT Trees makes nice ones, as do some of the european manufacturers). Cut your profile out of these and curve them around, bracing it both vertically and horizontally with strip styrene. For best appearance, try to line up the individual stones at seams as best you can.
> 
> An alternative is to use regular sheet styrene (about .030) to make the structure and glue patterned paper wall cards or printed stone / brick textures to it.


 your correct about evergreen but plastruct has several stone pattern sheets. curious why you say that plastic alone is insufficient for a bridge do you mean just the pattern sheet's or styrene in general have several all styrene bridges never had any problems with them ?


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

Seems to me the first thing you want to do is
decide what type of bridge you want to build.

There are truss bridges, trestle bridges, steel
spans and many others. Check out some of the
designs in the various posts on Google.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=HO+bridtges&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-001

Some offer kits for you to build.

Don


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

I had made a thread awhile ago talking about making a bridge. Here is the link to that discussion;

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=78898

In this topic, I talked about wanting to bridge an under arch bridge. I dont want an above arch or truss because the bridge is in the front of the layout and I do not want it to block anyone from seeing something. 

I understand what CTV is saying that the styrene will not be strong enough alone. I will have to make the decking of something stronger and make that look like a bridge using styrene. 

I am not going for the stone look either, I am hoping for more of a steel structure. 

I am finding some homemade bridges online, but a lot of them were built first and the trackwork was done to fit the bridge, but I did not do that. So now I have to make a custom bridge to fit the existing trackwork.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

J.C. said:


> your correct about evergreen but plastruct has several stone pattern sheets. curious why you say that plastic alone is insufficient for a bridge do you mean just the pattern sheet's or styrene in general have several all styrene bridges never had any problems with them ?


Yes, i checked out the plastruct website, and i do see patterned sheets listed, but i have never seen anyone actually stock them.

I was not actually referring to ALL styrene bridges, but to a scratch built stone arch bridge simulated with styrene. It's too easy to underengineer it, with bad results. This is especially true for the OP, who is building his first structure like this. The advice was applicable to THIS situation, not intended as a generic indictment of styrene as a building material.

With that said, looking at the type of bridge the OP intends to build, 1 would think styrene strip in about a 0.060 thickness would work pretty well for that. Mock it up with cardstock first and see if the proportions look right.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Is there a good way to paint mortar for plastic brick buildings? 

I have seen videos of people making brick walls from foam, painting the whole thing brick color, letting dry, the painting mortar color on top and wiping away the mortar color from the brick. 

I do not think I could do that for the plastic building. 

BTW, im building the sanding tower and dry house walthers kit


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*logs will float in a river to next destination?*

I may be somewhat late with this.The logging industry using the said river to help transport some logs down stream to a processing facility of some type,maybe?
Regards,tr1


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## tr1 (Mar 9, 2013)

*Motor on brick building technique.*



Aminnich said:


> Is there a good way to paint mortar for plastic brick buildings?
> 
> I have seen videos of people making brick walls from foam, painting the whole thing brick color, letting dry, the painting mortar color on top and wiping away the mortar color from the brick.
> 
> ...


A diluted wash of hydrolcal casting plaster will fill in the mortar
areas.A slight buffing/polishing should remove unwanted areas of
coverage.while the mortar lines are filled with the diluted mixture.
This technique (on plastic worked good) for me. Regards,tr1>try a dry or wet buffing/polishing technique(trial and error) white motar lines and red brick really looks cool!


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

A key factor when 'filling in' the mortar is that
your 'brick' paint be well set. I was anxious to
get it done and didn't wait. The result is when
you wipe the bricks to remove the excess mortar
the brick color comes off. 

What I did was paint the bricks then sprayed them
with clear dull cote. Applied the mortar after that and
everything came out fine.

Don


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

There are a lot of ways to do mortar lines, but none of them are inherently better. Some folks have less trouble with some methods than others.

The key is that your plastic structure has to have actual relief to the brick structure -- the mortar lines have to be recessed below the level of the bricks.

I personally use acrylic washes. This method is easier if you do it before assembly.

Paint the bricks a base color, somewhat darker than you want the final color. As Don said, let this dry COMPLETELY -- at least 24 hours, but 72 is better.

Mix a wash (about 1 part paint to 15 parts thinner) of cream, light tan, or light gray. I use Vallejo's Ivory or Stencil colors. Making sure your piece is level, apply the wash over the brick detail. Blot up any large pools, but allow the wash to settle into the mortar lines. Let it dry for a few hours, and repeat as necessary until the lines are dark enough for you. The traces of wash on the brick surfaces will both lighten the color and simulate effloresence and weathering.

Note that you do not need perfect coverage (that is, your finished product will NOT resemble cleanly painted lines in the cracks). For me, that looks too neat and model-like. Rather, the wash will suggest the lines to the naked eye, which is the effect you want.


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## J.C. (Dec 24, 2016)

the one thing I would add is not to paint bricks in a monotone color the public sides of a lot of old boom town buildings would use bricks that were close(with minor differences) to the same color, but on the sides that weren't in public view they would use seconds or bricks that didn't come out the right hue/color and some times they would be used bricks, on the other side many businesses would paint the front of store/building for appearance sake, as for motor lines I use a wash on Vollmer and Plastruct as they have wide joint lines for cornerstone/DPM I use shrink free spackling from Sherwin Williams as they have finer joint lines, the same applies to stone . its best to play around with different methods till you find the one you like.


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## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

CTValleyRR said:


> An alternative is to use regular sheet styrene (about .030) to make the structure and glue patterned paper wall cards or printed stone / brick textures to it.


That's the method I've used.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Figured I could just bring back my question thread for this instead of making a new thread. 

My biggest engine I have is the Kato SD80MAC and the longest rolling stock is probably the lumber cars. What minimum radius can I get away with on the mainline? 22"?


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## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

Aminnich said:


> My biggest engine I have is the Kato SD80MAC and the longest rolling stock is probably the lumber cars. What minimum radius can I get away with on the mainline? 22"?


That Kato model is an awesome locomotive! And a legitimate brute. In dual consist they'll easily pull 150 cars.
Plus, it's one of the smoothest slow movers I've ever seen out-of-the-box.

To answer your question about minimum radius:
While that model will negotiate a 22" radius, its overhang will make it difficult to keep anything coupled to it. Larger curves (24" and up) are recommended.


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## Dennis461 (Jan 5, 2018)

Isn't this a 6 year old thread?


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## LateStarter (Mar 12, 2016)

Close...
4 years.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

LateStarter: thanks for the reply I will try to stick with a 24" or higher radius.

Dennis: Would you rather me bring back an old thread or start a new one for a quick simple Q & A?


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## mustangcobra94 (Apr 28, 2014)

whats the difference the thread goes to the top when something new is posted


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

The issue with resurrecting an old thread is that usually, either the original issue was resolved and the thread dies, or the OP disappears and the discussion peter's out. In this case, the OP revived his own thread of collected questions. I see nothing wrong with doing that.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Here is another question, 

I am hoping to start building the lumber mill this weekend, but I want to paint it first. I will be building the Mountain Lumber Company Sawmill and Outbuildings. I already have Walton and Son Lumber Co painted and made for a long time now. These structures are going in the same area. 

My question, do you think the mill should match the Walton storage buildings? I have been looking for ideas online, but I haven't see any pictures of anyone keeping these buildings in the same area.

The Walton buildings are a tan color, very similar to how they are on the website, but the trim is forest green. I think they look great, but i am not sure that would look right on a lumber mill.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

When you say "match'", I assume you mean color scheme. It goes both ways, really. There was often no uniformity in color among buildings, even in the same complex. However, if you're going to paint more than one building, it's usually more cost effective to paint them all the same.

Do what looks and feels right to you. There are no right and wrong answers. Your layout, your rules.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Ya, matching color

I think I am going to paint the mill a different color. I am afraid having all those buildings the same color will look weird. 

Thanks for the input


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

It is raining today and will be cold this weekend, so painting the lumber buildings is on hold. Instead I am working on coming up with a design for my liftout section. 

I have been looking at other designs and coming with with ideas, but I have some questions. 

1. When people talk about isolating the track, do they mean not giving the track power within "X" amount of feet from the liftout area? So in my case I would add a feeder maybe 4 feet away from the liftout area so a train looses power well before the liftout, just incase the liftout isn't in place. 

2. I see a lot of designs using a micro switch, but those are on swing bridges. I am 99% sure that these are used to isolate the track because the wiring still continues into the swing bridge area. Because the swing area still has power, the micro switch is used to cut power to this area. In my case, I do no think I need one, is that correct?

Other than that, I think I have my design good to go, now I just need to wait on my order of parts to get here.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

No expensive relays needed to protect your
locos if bridge is 'open'.

I had a 'raise up' bridge to afford access to my DCC controller
and panels. To prevent a possible run away loco from
plunging onto the floor if the bridge was up, I created
a 3 foot isolated section on the 'open' end of the bridge
by gapping the 'bus' feed rail.
I used a small copper strip on the bridge. 
There was a matching strip on
the benchwork frame. Bus wire was soldered to the bridge
strip. A track drop was soldered to the benchwork strip. 
Thus, when bridge was up, isolated section loses power
and stops the loco. When bridge was down, the copper
strips contact and pass the bus power to the iso. section
There was no need for the hinge
section to be isolated since a runaway loco would simply
run into the bridge and stop.

If you have a 'swing' bridge you would need an isolated
section on both ends of the bridge. Run a flexible bus
wire to the bridge and use the above to protect the
loco from either end of the bridge. You would also
need a second flexible wire so your bridge rails
would be powered.

Don


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

Can you describe what you mean by an isolated section? Maybe I am thinking of it differently. I am thinking an isolated section is a section of track that simply does not have feeder wire going to the track. Eventually the train won't have the required power to continue


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Well, you're correct. That's your safety feature. A train will stop as soon as it hits that isolated section, rather than continuing on to take the death plunge through the open bridge...

So you need some way to power that section when the bridge is closed, preferably one that will automatically remove power when the bridge is opened. DonR is suggesting using simple contact strips to provide power, so that when the bridge opens, it breaks the circuit. What he did was to ALSO gap the bus wire, and have a permanent feeder to the bridge rails, so that the bridge had to be in place for the bus in that section to have power, which would be more reliable than using the rails to make the connection.


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## Aminnich (Nov 17, 2014)

My idea to continue power to the lift out is with copper strips. No plugs or anything. Basically copper contacts, just like what Don was suggesting


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