# folded dogbone or around wall style



## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

My layout is roughly 10x10, its a u shape as i speak i was going to finish making it into a square/doughnut.

But then i started thinking i could just extend the west side thats against the wall for a turn back loop then i would have a open walk pit and i woildnt have to deal with a duckunder. My layout height is 50inches. 

Whats the pros of going with a folded dogbone? The cons would probably be having 2 tracks run thru each scene. But then i wouldnt have to duck to get i side the pit.

The around walls style only has 2 walls that the layout would be against. Layout is in a open basement with no rooms or other obsticles to deal with.

I can go either design with my layout. But now is the time i need to choose which one would better suit me.

Sorry guys for all the questions. You guys are a big help with my decision making.


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## Brakeman Jake (Mar 8, 2009)

As aging takes its toll,a duckunder can become a major deterrent to your modelling enjoyment,so my opinion is to try to avoid it at nearly all cost.However,your layout being at 50 in. height makes it less of an effort to lean under...it's your call in the end.

Since you have free areas (no wall,etc)that you can access from both sides,you could choose to have the layout slightly wider there so that you could have more action concentrated in these areas and be more restrictive where room is less.BTW,the deepest one can usually work on a layout with a relative comfort is about thirty insches,so you could take this into account while designing.Take your time designing,a track plan is what makes or break a layout,and discovered flaws are much easier to correct during planning.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

Absolutely. Thats why im trying to get the bench design right the first time. Its hard to acheive perfecion the first time around designing a layout, im trying to make that a must. Yes mistakes will be made,lessons will be learned but if i can minimize that as much as possible then it will make me happy. 
It will also make the wife happy because then i dont need to hear what she has to say about my mistakes and money down the drain

My bench work has been up for probably a year now and i havent finished this stage yet because i want everything to work without flaws


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Joe...I agree with what Jake said. I have not one, but TWO duckunders on my layout. I agree that it does get harder all the time to duck under the darn thing...especially as I age! I don't know why I went with that design. Maybe I figured it would keep me somoewhat fit to keep ducking under all the time. In any case, I am not sure I would go with it again. My layout is also close to 50 inches off the ground, so it isn't too hard to duck under, but if I were to do it again, I think I would opt for the dogbone-style!

Chad


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

Wow thats good to hear i guess. Glad i had second thoughts and startes thinking about the design before i got to far into it


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## Brakeman Jake (Mar 8, 2009)

There's another solution to your dilemma...having a piece of both options...a doughnut design without any duckunder.But then you'll have to call upon your engineering and building skills.What I'm thinking of is a section that opens to let you in,like a door.Now,there are more than one way to do this but either has to be carefully designed and built to be practical.

First you need a very stable layout,at least both sides of the opening,so that it closes firmly all the time.Since there are tracks on the moveable section that have to match with a certain degree of precision with tracks at both ends,being a firm fit is a must.BTW,if you have high humidity and temperature changes,specially with a wooden structure,you might as well forget the idea...wood is highly reactive to humidity changes and moves all the time so an openable section will be a pain in the ...........

As I said,there are different ways to do this and if you decide that it may be an option to you,say so and we'll discuss it further.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

My basement temp changes often, its never cold but i know the temp changes down there all the time so i might have a problem with a tight fit...

How do you get the rail joiners on the 2 tracks that seperate at that hinge point everytime? Is there a method to this


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

You shouldn't need rail joiners there, joe. Just bring power to both sides of the hinge and it should be fine. My turntable is like that. Each section coming off the tuntable has its own power going to it, where it can be turned off when not in use.

Chad


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## mr_x_ite_ment (Jun 22, 2009)

Oh, make sure you keep the polarity the same on both sides of the hinge.

Chad


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

Chad- sounds easy enuf


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

for those that might care or wonder.

Im going with the around walls setup. I can get more scenes on each different section of my layout.

Like i stated before, west side is 2feet deep by 10 feet long, north side is 2feet deep by 9.6 long. east side is open and not against wall, that is 4.5deep by 10 feet long and im going to make a left out section on the south side connecting east to west.

I was almost thinking on my west side section thats wide, i could always brake that in half with a scenic divider so i could get 2 scenes on both sides of divider??

so i have a square of 10x9.6, i could always add to the 9.6 to make a full 10 feet, but why

My layout allows for nice curves, ive made cardboard cutout curve sections and i can get anywhere from 22 is smaller to say 28-30 radius curves if need be. so that gives me alot of flex ability. i dont think i would go any smaller then 20-22 on my layout, no need to really unless its a spur, but i dont forsee having to go that small.

Thanks guys for the input on alot of my silly questions. I have about 6-7 different track ideas for my layout. once i get it narrowed down i will post up for you guys to rip apart and help me do it right. 

practice makes perfect


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

Maybe I missed it, I went back but could not find any reference to the scale your going to use.

Unless it is a different post?

22, I guess N.

What are you going with, N?

How dry is your basement?


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

I might have missed it also.

Im going ho scale.

Yes n scale would gain me a ton.

But i have a open basement, no rooms except the corner wall that the west and north side is against. so that allows me lots of room for expansion or going bigger anytime i need be, still trying to set my track work the right way so if/when i go bigger i just change it a tiny bit and move on.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

wooops.

My basement is very dry. no seapage or one drop of water anywhere. i better go knock on wood now

My house was built in 2004


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

joed2323 said:


> wooops.
> 
> My basement is very dry. no seapage or one drop of water anywhere. i better go knock on wood now
> 
> My house was built in 2004


Mine was built in 1950....collectable.

Mine is too is dry, for the most part. I just have to worry about the real big drencher storms as the water can seep in from under the slab of the floor.

Just keep all boxes off the floor, just in case.
I got mine up on pallets I find during my travels.
Just in case.

If you have a washer down there install water shutoff valves and use them. You would be surprised how quickly a basement will fill up if one bursts when your not home.
Anything on the floor will be ruined.

Mine stays cool in the summer and I have some portable heaters to take the chill off in the winter.

I run a big fan on the weekends too, it helps to keep the air circulating.


Edit, If anyone uses pallets the spiders love them. I spray mine with a good dose of spider killer before I use them. You won't kill them all but it will get a lot.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

Quick question. I like what massey did with his layout and the use of his wye.

I want a way to turn my trains around like he did with his wye.

I would hate to run my trains one direction so is the use of a wye a good idea. I see in modern day they have wye to turn trains around.

A wye has to be a better idea then a reverse loop correct?
Does it depend on the situation??


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

Also- im going are around wall style west section is 2 feet deep by 9.5 north is 2 feet deep by 10 and the east section is almost 5 feet deep by 9 feet l. 

If i was to putva wye in it would be north section into the east section, i was going to make that big section a oval that connects to the south with a lift out section from the east to west in the south.

So basically it would be a square track run around the outside of layout and on the bigger section i would have a loop/oval with a wye.

But i was thinking maybe i should make it one big loop and i would have no wye or oval on east section, id have less track this way and i wouldnt be able to turn trains around. Cant decide whats better

I want to beable to run continuess and have amble room for switching


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## Brakeman Jake (Mar 8, 2009)

A lift out section....I've seen this tested....while it can be fairly easily designed and built,you'll likely get to hate it in no time.Picture this...you pull it up to open the entry to the layout,hold it in your hands and go in,then turn around 180 degress then turn the lift out in your hands another 180 degrees then finally pinpoint it back to its place with high care so you don't damage the track ends and make sure this darn thing aligns properly...after a while it gets pretty annoying.

I'd consider a hinged section if I were you.A little more work but since you say your basement is quite dry,you probably can achieve a reliable design provided you have a sturdy benchwork so the entrance width and height remain stable.Well built,it aligns all the time.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

To be honest. Ive made a fake section where the liftout/hinge section is and ive been ducking under it. Its narrorw probably no more then 6 inches wide so im ducking under a 5inch section thats 50 inches high and im a 6foot2 guy. 

Im almost home thinking of keeping it fixed. I am 29 years old btw


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

What do you guys think about running the trains either direction with the use of a wye?

It would get bland running trains one direction?


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## waltr (Aug 15, 2011)

I've been running a 2x6 foot switching layout (temp with sectional track) and it doesn't get bland. A Wye would be a nice addition to at least turn an engine around.

I'm starting a real layout that will be 2 x 16 foot as a point to point with switching at each end. This type of layout can be very interesting to run. I do have an optional add-on piece with a Wye to turn an engine and/or a short string of cars around.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

I like switching but have to have continuous run for my kids to play


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## Big Ed (Jun 16, 2009)

joed2323 said:


> What do you guys think about running the trains either direction with the use of a wye?
> 
> It would get bland running trains one direction?



If you have the room I would go for continuous running, reverse loop.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

ok guys. ive been trying to copy the url picture from photobucket, and im new at this and cant figure out how to copy pictures from there to here, help


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Get the Photobucket thumbnail display for your album up.
Hover over the picture in question, click on the bottom selection in the drop-down, see example below.
Paste that here in a message.


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

Thanks john


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## joed2323 (Oct 17, 2010)

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/joed2323/photobucket-8441-1328978078247.jpg
my wye area, where it feeds yard, and exits yard

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/joed2323/photobucket-8456-1328978097769.jpg
overall view, ugly cheap cardboard track templates  just ideas im using 

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/joed2323/photobucket-3538-1328978088870.jpg
south end of yard, yeah those yard tracks are short, just ideas for me to see it

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/joed2323/photobucket-3521-1328978039370.jpg
west section, where yard will go i hope

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/joed2323/photobucket-8294-1328978055802.jpg
pit area, south end will have lift up section, not lift out

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/joed2323/photobucket-3530-1328978067273.jpg
east section














G]


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