# A Nice Ending to my Disintegrating Lionel GG1 Saga...



## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

As many of you know, I recently purchased what was a new old-stock Lionel JLC GG1 on eBay. Upon arrival, the truck frames were disintegrating due to zinc rot and one had completely broken in half. After a few days spent looking, I managed to locate a pair of truck frames for this one, as well as a pair for the one I already had.

My closet is like a tetris game which makes it difficult to just dig out track to run trains. As a result, it's been sitting in my display case since I did the truck frame swap. This evening I lit a fire under my butt and dug out my track, ZW and Legacy set, as well as my MTH Congressional passenger car set. Needless to say, I'm a happy camper now... 

My other GG1 which is in the DLGE single stripe scheme, which was the standard at the time a few were painted silver, is currently with Mike Reagan for repairs to get it running properly again. Once it's back, I think it's going to be relegated to freight service as I love the look of the silver locomotive with the silver cars.


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## Spence (Oct 15, 2015)

I'm glad it worked out for you in the end. :thumbsup:


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## Magic (Jan 28, 2014)

Looks pretty sharp Jake.
Glad you got it running.

Magic


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## seayakbill (Jan 16, 2016)

I had not heard that the JLC GG-1 was a victim of zinc rot. Good info to be aware off.

Thankfully you were able to find replacement trucks to get it back into service.

Bill


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Thanks guys, I'm happy to have it operable.

Bill, I've heard of the issue previously but it took some time to catch up to my green GG1. In hindsight I wish I would have planned ahead and ordered frames from Lionel when I first heard of the problem. This one was bad out of the box though, and I think the bouncing around in shipping quickened the process.


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## Lee Willis (Jan 1, 2014)

Thanks, a happy story with a good ending brightened my day early. Silver with silver does sound mighty good!


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## PatKn (Jul 14, 2015)

Good to hear a happy ending. Enjoy the trains, Jake.


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## Guest (Sep 26, 2018)

Wonderful when it ll works out for you, Jake.


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## Guest (Sep 26, 2018)

Thanks for the video, Jake. I love a story with a happy ending. The loco looks, runs and sounds great. I agree with you, the silver engine and cars make a beautiful train.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Thanks guys. I'm looking forward to the next club event so it can stretch its legs a bit. I haven't run the congressional cars in quite some time after my other GG1 started acting up.

Hmmm... a GG1 with the Congressional or a N&W J class with the Pocahontas. Now I have to make choices about what will run first at the next club event :laugh:


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## Guest (Sep 26, 2018)

santafe158 said:


> Hmmm... a GG1 with the Congressional or a N&W J class with the Pocahontas. Now I have to make choices about what will run first at the next club event :laugh:


Jake, that is a really good problem to have.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

I certainly can't complain about it. It'll be a nice reward to run some of the new trains when I complete my display at the Redford Theatre at the end of November.


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## Dieseler (Jan 29, 2014)

Sounds like your having fun !


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Dieseler said:


> Sounds like your having fun !


I certainly am!


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## Stoshu (Jun 20, 2015)

_Will we see it running at the shows this year ? ( hint hint )

That Engine would also look good with those Amtrak cars
you just bought...
_


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Stoshu said:


> _Will we see it running at the shows this year ? ( hint hint )
> 
> That Engine would also look good with those Amtrak cars
> you just bought..._


Yes, definitely! Along with my N&W 611 and hopefully my other GG1 when it arrives back from Mike Reagan's care.

I may have sort of purchased a Williams Amtrak Genesis locomotive to go with those cars that may have arrived in the mail today...


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

The saga continues....

When I last posted in this thread, I had come across some solid die-cast side frames for the trucks on my two Lionel JLC GG1s to replace the zinc pest infected originals. Although that solved my immediate problem with unusable locomotives, I was still a bit apprehensive about the replacements since they were likely cast around the same time as the failed originals and will likely fall apart someday also. Henning's Trains took on the project of having replacement side frames made for the likely hundreds of these locomotives that have turned into useless, expensive, paper weights over the years with no help from Lionel. Initially they tried brass castings but couldn't get a good process for making them in a good quality. They finally settled on a molded plastic piece made one piece at a time by an acquaintance of theirs with successful results (from their own tests and recent customer reviews). I purchased two sets of these for a "just in case" scenario so I'm not left with two useless locomotives again. Although I'm not the biggest fan of a plastic replacement for a metal part, they're actually available for purchase and at least they'll do the job should I ever need to press them into service.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

FWIW, a lot of people have fitted these plastic sideframes and are running successfully with them, no problems reported. I actually took one of the early prototypes and fitted it to my JLC GG1 to test for fit, it worked well. Mine happens not to be one that has rotting sideframes, so I don't need the replacements, at least not yet.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Perhaps I was a bit too apprehensive in my thoughts on these new ones John. I've read the reviews and reports about the successful testing, so I don't doubt that they'll work just fine. There's just something impressive about an all metal locomotive, so putting plastic frames on seems sacrilegious. At least they won't likely disintegrate 😁


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

Well, we tried for the metal, but that wasn't happening. The shrinkage was just a bit too much. I have to admit the diecast set looked great, just didn't fit!


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## ennisdavis (Dec 9, 2018)

Which Lionel GG1s, years or model#s are subject to this rott? I need to bring mine in from the garage before it turns to powder.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

I totally understand the "why's" of the plastic frames. I don't doubt that casting something so thin and intricate in metal without a true oversized pattern to work off of would be difficult. I'm just happy Henning's picked up the project since Lionel left everyone in the dirt with these locomotives.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

ennisdavis said:


> Which Lionel GG1s, years or model#s are subject to this rott? I need to bring mine in from the garage before it turns to powder.



These were from the older JLC series of scale GG1s with TMCC from the earlier 2000s. Some seem to have it showing up more than others. I have the 6-18374 silver #4866 and 6-18372 green #4925. The silver one arrived a couple years ago brand new in the original sealed box from the original owner but the trucks were shattered just from sitting in the box. I looked at my green one shortly after I found the silver one destroyed and it was showing signs of zinc pest just sitting on the shelf. I believe John has one or two that aren't showing any signs at this point. Many others have also reported theirs having the failure, but some are still going strong so it seems to be a very hit and miss type of problem.


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## Millstonemike (Aug 9, 2018)

Zinc pest is due to impurities in the alloy used to cast the part. You'd think after 100+ years Lionel would get it right. Then again, China is starting from scratch and doesn't care about a problem that will show up years down the road.


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## santafe158 (Jul 14, 2010)

Millstonemike said:


> Zinc pest is due to impurities in the alloy used to cast the part. You'd think after 100+ years Lionel would get it right. Then again, China is starting from scratch and doesn't care about a problem that will show up years down the road.


Correct. Quite a few Prewar-Lionel pieces exhibit zinc pest issues due to die-casting technology being fairly new at the time. The most famous were the 1937 700E scale Hudson locomotives and tenders but chassis on some earlier locomotives also had the problem. Lionel mostly eradicated this problem for the remainder of USA production and then it resurfaced when things moved overseas (not limited to Lionel, many MTH, K-Line, Bachmann/Williams and likely other's products also have the issue). As you said, it's a problem that generally doesn't show up until some time down the road. My green GG1 was about 10 years old before Zinc Pest started showing its ugly face.


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## Millstonemike (Aug 9, 2018)

santafe158 said:


> ... The most famous were the 1937 700E scale Hudson locomotives and tenders but chassis on some earlier locomotives also had the problem. ...


Many of the early Lionel tinplate electric locos' wheels suffered from it. While some have held up for 100+ years. It depended on the particular batch of zinc alloy used to cast them. Fortunately, reproduction wheels are readily available (and a lot easier to cast than something like the GG1 truck frame.


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## Krieglok (Sep 7, 2013)

I have two JLC GG1s.

One, the PRR green five stripe version, has good trucks. No zinc pest as of yet. I purchased a set of Hennings frames and have them just in case that engine develops issues.

My second engine is the Silver “Congressional” version. It was new, but the frames had slight zinc rot and some of the smaller details were crumbling off. I bought another set of Hennings frames but have yet to install them.

Just have to get off my lazy *** and do the job...lol.

Tom


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## ennisdavis (Dec 9, 2018)

ok, guess I am good. Mine is not TMCC , its old school.


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## gunrunnerjohn (Nov 10, 2010)

It was the JLC scale GG1 versions that had the zinc rot of the side frames. Of course, there have been lots of other models from all makers with similar issues with various diecast parts.


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