# Looking for some Interesting layout ideas



## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

Hello

I finally have the time, space and the funds to pursue a model railroad. Looking at HO scale and I have a 15 x 20 foot space set aside in the shop. I do like a railroad that you can just let a few trains run but I would like and decent side yard as well. Any pointers or advice would be appreciated.


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

With a generous space like that you will have the ability to
build a larger layout than most of us have.

I would suggest that you design the benchwork to use a
movable 'bridge' that gives access to a center control
center, but permits the mains to run basically following
the outside edge.

You would have the freedom to create sweeping large
radius curves that would permit you to use the largest
steam and diesel locomotives and passenger cars,
mountains with tunnels,
streams with bridges, yards and spurs for switching, even more than
one interchanging railroad, the Norfolk Southern and the
CSX, for example, each with it's own mainline for continuous
running.

A layout that size screams for the DCC system. You'll want more
than one train running at the same time, and with DCC you can
do that without complex wiring and multiple blocks controlled
by panel switches.

Keep us posted on how your thinking goes.

Don


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## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

paul1970 said:


> Hello
> 
> I finally have the time, space and the funds to pursue a model railroad...


Is this is your first rodeo?


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

Thanks for the info DonR

I have been looking at some layouts like you mentioned where you operate from the center. It seems like a great idea. They layouts I had as a kid where all the 4 x 8 variety and its hard to break the habit of what you are used to seeing.

Alot of the layouts I have been looking at have a yard that is hidden underneath the layout. Not sure if this is because of space or it is just storage for rolling stock. I think I would rather be able to see what I have.


I bought a book about DCC wiring and it is hands down the way to go. I have a pretty strong electrical background and it will be a fun challlenge to incorporate all the lighting and automation into the layout.


Can't wait to get started


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

The New Guy

No but is has been over 20 years. I built a layout from an Atlas book when I was a kid. Plywood Summit Lines. A few things have changed over the years and I dont want to get started on this and realize I missed something. I joined this group to talk to the experts that have been doing this.


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## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

paul1970 said:


> The New Guy
> 
> No but is has been over 20 years...


That's a fair amount of space - I didn't want you to be overwhelmed by it's scope. Biting more than one can chew often leads to choking.

Something to consider, neither right or wrong: A central table maybe 5' x 9 or 10' to start.
Large enough in HO to keep one busy for some time, work out what you like and don't, construction technique and what not. You'll be up and running quicker, it'll be simpler to modify and re-modify the track plan, and you'll get a better sense of what you like.


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## The New Guy (Mar 11, 2012)

paul1970 said:


> The New Guy
> 
> ...I joined this group to talk to the experts...


I'll need to stay clear then. I'm just a hack, figuring this stuff out too.


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

Thats how you learn. Butch and Hack till you figure it out.


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

That has crossed my mind. I would want to be able to expand as I go. I just toured a layout that took up an entire pole building. Lots of track, trains, and such but not very realistic looking.


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## Magic (Jan 28, 2014)

paul I'd start by looking through the layout design forum, the HO forum and the My layout forum. All on the opening page.

You'll see what others are doing here and might get some good ideas.

Magic


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## DonR (Oct 18, 2012)

paul1970 said:


> Thanks for the info DonR
> 
> 
> Alot of the layouts I have been looking at have a yard that is hidden underneath the layout. Not sure if this is because of space or it is just storage for rolling stock. I think I would rather be able to see what I have.
> ...


The yards hidden under a layout are often known as Staging...where possibly made
up trains are parked. Then there is the operating yard that is very visible. Some
have loco services areas for fueling, sand, and services. Other yard tracks might
be for car storage, caboose track, maintenance of way or even a Turntable.
These usually have a ladder track 
that the various spur tracks lead from.

You can't have too many yard tracks. It's surprising how quickly you can fill
them up with new cars you buy at train shows or even on-line. I have 2 yards
each with 7 tracks and both are just
about maxed out.

Don


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

Don

Understood. I would want to be able to see all the equipment. Half of the fun is showing off what you have collected

Paul


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## king0735 (Dec 24, 2015)

hey i just started a model train website wondering if it might be something you are interested in looking at? You might get some ideas go here


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

King0735 -- I really hope you joined this forum to do more than plug your own website. I did poke around on it, and I really don't see that it has much new to offer. In fact, it seems to offer a very parochial view of the hobby, seeming to direct everyone toward train sets when they are just starting out. Sure that's one way to do it, but not the only way, and for many it isn't the best option. Your article on scales might be useful, but it isn't anything that can't already be found in 50 other places. Also, HO and OO are very similar, but not identical, as you suggest.

Finally, you don't do yourself any favors by recommending Alaistair Lee's "Model Railroads for Beginners" as "the best" source of information. I'm sure it does have good information, but it is overpriced and overhyped. See our local reviews of his product here: http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=60250


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

CTValleyRR said:


> King0735 -- I really hope you joined this forum to do more than plug your own website. I did poke around on it, and I really don't see that it has much new to offer. In fact, it seems to offer a very parochial view of the hobby, seeming to direct everyone toward train sets when they are just starting out. Sure that's one way to do it, but not the only way, and for many it isn't the best option. Your article on scales might be useful, but it isn't anything that can't already be found in 50 other places. Also, HO and OO are very similar, but not identical, as you suggest.
> 
> Finally, you don't do yourself any favors by recommending Alaistair Lee's "Model Railroads for Beginners" as "the best" source of information. I'm sure it does have good information, but it is overpriced and overhyped. See our local reviews of his product here: http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=60250


Agreed. I'm sure we all know how to do a google search. Its an affiliate site to sell items on amazon.


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## king0735 (Dec 24, 2015)

CTValleyRR said:


> King0735 -- I really hope you joined this forum to do more than plug your own website. I did poke around on it, and I really don't see that it has much new to offer. In fact, it seems to offer a very parochial view of the hobby, seeming to direct everyone toward train sets when they are just starting out. Sure that's one way to do it, but not the only way, and for many it isn't the best option. Your article on scales might be useful, but it isn't anything that can't already be found in 50 other places. Also, HO and OO are very similar, but not identical, as you suggest.
> 
> Finally, you don't do yourself any favors by recommending Alaistair Lee's "Model Railroads for Beginners" as "the best" source of information. I'm sure it does have good information, but it is overpriced and overhyped. See our local reviews of his product here: http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=60250


yeah i joined for more than that. and the whole thing about stuff being new to offer honestly there is nothing new under the sun or online for that matter that's like telling cnn or fox news there are other news stories covering this so why are you. Or pizza hut telling domino's or little caesar's oh we already have pizza covered. I'm saying that to say yes you can find the information elsewhere I'm not saying that the site is the end all be all of model trains or it has new information nowhere is that stated on the site it's created to be that. Also i said i started one it's nowhere near finish to where i want it to be at. And if you have any positive criticism or negative criticism pm me and we can talk about it.


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## king0735 (Dec 24, 2015)

paul1970 said:


> Agreed. I'm sure we all know how to do a google search. Its an affiliate site to sell items on amazon.


see the funny thing about that is my site is about to rank in google on the first page. It's only a page away from the first page :appl:


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

I really thought that I did provide some criticism already. Why ask for a PM, except to avoid hijacking the thread? Do you really not want to have the discussion in public?

A careful reading of my post will show you why I have some issues with it. And your comparison with news outlest is way off the mark. News outlets aren't selling anything. While you don't appear to be selling anything directly, you sure are pushing people to a limited range of products. Although the comparison is apt in at least one way: your site has a very parochial view. Shunting people away from a free forum, where they can get a wide range of opinions, into your very narrow view, doesn't strike me as particularly helpful, either.

Google sorts its results by relevence, then by level of activity. So you provide a link to your website on a public forum, and your google status rises. Yeah, nice tactic.

Perhaps you could share with us your reasons for creating that website, and disclose any financial interest you gain from it. In the meantime, your opinions are more than welcome here. But please post them here, not direct others to your website.


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## king0735 (Dec 24, 2015)

CTValleyRR said:


> I really thought that I did provide some criticism already. Why ask for a PM, except to avoid hijacking the thread? Do you really not want to have the discussion in public?
> 
> A careful reading of my post will show you why I have some issues with it. And your comparison with news outlest is way off the mark. News outlets aren't selling anything. While you don't appear to be selling anything directly, you sure are pushing people to a limited range of products. Although the comparison is apt in at least one way: your site has a very parochial view. Shunting people away from a free forum, where they can get a wide range of opinions, into your very narrow view, doesn't strike me as particularly helpful, either.
> 
> ...


LOL if that's how you think Google works your definitely on the wrong forum drop a link in a forum and my stat rise i wonder where you pulled that from? Hahaha that's not how Google works please don't embarrass yourself maybe you should talk to Matt Cuts. I created the site because I wanted to create it I don't owe anybody an explanation it's not that serious no where is it stated that I have to explain myself once I join this forum yeah I've read the rules. My comparison isn't wrong at all but you are entitled to your own opinion I'm not gonna repeat myself. I'm glad you know so much about Google though maybe you could make a website and show me something. And it's fine you have issues with it Google doesn't. Also I told you I'm not done with the site yet regardless of what you think or feel I'm not here to please you. We can have this openly but I preferred us to talk in private like adults but I see I'm the only one here out of us two. Maybe you should do some careful reading of what I say. If you want to argue by all means go find someone else you argue with your trying to drag out something that doesn't need to be in this thread you want to hijack or whatever your aiming at but that's only going to take you so far. Also I'm done arguing with you whatever you say I tried being nice and respectful to talk in private come to an understanding but that's obviously not what you want and I'm not gonna drag this out I'm just gonna be the bigger person.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Nice! Throw out insults and innuendos and then claim to be the grown up in the room. That's ok. I shouldn't have taken the bait the first time. I'm done, too.


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## Cycleops (Dec 6, 2014)

King, you're going to raise hackles if you wade into a thread and recommend your own site promoting Bachmann train sets which has no relevance to the questions people are raising on this thread. Very strange, you even modestly give yourself a round of applause.


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

King

In other words don't go away mad, just go away


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## cv_acr (Oct 28, 2011)

DonR said:


> The yards hidden under a layout are often known as Staging...where possibly made
> up trains are parked. Then there is the operating yard that is very visible.


Back on topic...

Staging is used on a operating layout to represent connections with the rest of the world. Back in the 1970s when the concept was being properly developed the term "beyond the basement" was used to promote the concepts.

Because staging is basically just a storage spot for trains "in the wings" waiting to come "on stage" on the layout, we often bury it on a lower level so that there is more space above for the visible layout proper.

Staging is not a "working" yard with active yard switchers.

I'm not sure if you're actually planning a realistic "operating" layout, or just something to watch some trains run with a few extra storage tracks to display equipment (not really the true function of a real yard). In the former case, staging is a desired consideration. In the latter, it's probably not necessary.

Check out also the operations thread currently active in this forum, kind of related.
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=61002


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

cv_acr said:


> Back on topic...
> 
> Staging is used on a operating layout to represent connections with the rest of the world. Back in the 1970s when the concept was being properly developed the term "beyond the basement" was used to promote the concepts.
> 
> ...


cv
Thanks so much for the info. Alot of usefull information in your link. I do want to build a realistic operating layout. I think the yard is the most interesting and challenging part. I do still want to be able to run trains of course but I am have trouble deciding what to model after. I know I do like the mountains and plains more than the cities. Also would like to run diesels more than stem. Thanks again


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## flyboy2610 (Jan 20, 2010)

paul1970 said:


> cv
> I think the yard is the most interesting and challenging part.


The late Andy Sperandeo of Model Railroader would agree wholeheartedly. 
For those that don't know, he passed away Oct. 2, 2015. He shall be missed.


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

Its only temporary.... Unless it works


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

*SCARM*

I was doing some research on SCARM – Model Train Layouts & Track Plans and was wondering if anyone had any experience with this system. I swore another member had posted these pictures and I have a few questions for him

Thanks again for all the input.

Paul


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## MtRR75 (Nov 27, 2013)

That would be Wvgca's Squirrel Creek layout.

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=26243


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

Nothing particularly wrong with SCARM. It's a hobby project whose author posts here from time to time, screenname Mixy.

Personally, I prefer a commercial product without all the 3D bells and whistles, but that's just a matter of personal preference.


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## CTValleyRR (Jul 26, 2014)

cv_acr said:


> Back on topic...
> 
> Staging is used on a operating layout to represent connections with the rest of the world. Back in the 1970s when the concept was being properly developed the term "beyond the basement" was used to promote the concepts.
> 
> ...


I use a bastardized approach to this. I have a visible yard at the rear of my layout which serves the dual purpose of staging (most trains originating and terminating there -- they can leave from either end) and simulating the New Haven's Cedar Hill yard, if I want to do some sorting / classification.


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

MtRR75

Thanks a bunch!


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## paul1970 (Dec 24, 2015)

CTValleyRR said:


> I use a bastardized approach to this. I have a visible yard at the rear of my layout which serves the dual purpose of staging (most trains originating and terminating there -- they can leave from either end) and simulating the New Haven's Cedar Hill yard, if I want to do some sorting / classification.


Qt

Thanks for your input. What is the program you recommend?


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## king0735 (Dec 24, 2015)

hahaha ok


paul1970 said:


> King
> 
> In other words don't go away mad, just go away


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## king0735 (Dec 24, 2015)

ok :appl:


Cycleops said:


> King, you're going to raise hackles if you wade into a thread and recommend your own site promoting Bachmann train sets which has no relevance to the questions people are raising on this thread. Very strange, you even modestly give yourself a round of applause.


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